I've got a small basement shop, roughly 18' X 12' and it's paneled off
from the rest of the basement with a closing door. I have a 10"
contractor table saw, a 4" jointer, a 1/2" drill press, a 10" disk
sander, the proverbial router, SCMS, and whatever. Sometimes when I'm
cutting the sawdust in the air is just too much, so I've decided that
I'll look into; (a) a small sawdust collector, or (b), a ceiling hung
filtration system. So what I'm wondering is whether the typical
ceiling hung filtration system would suffice... and whether my Rigid
wet/dry 9 gallon/3.5 HP vac can be rigged for sawdust collection
considering the open end of my table saw?

Or would a dust collector like the Jet DC 1100 or a Delta AP400 be a
better overall choice?

Thanks in advance... Mike

You really need both the dust collector and air filtration system.
The shop vac simply wont work for your larger machines and the ceiling hung
units are not designed to catch dust from machines specifically.

If you can only buy one, get the Jet DC 1100 for your larger machines and
use your shop vac to hook up to your hand held power tools.

If you can also get a ceiling hung air filtration unit, that will take care
of all the fine dust in the airborne air (which I do recommend you take care
of as well) but its always best to catch as much dust at the source first.

--
Regards,

Dean Bielanowski
Editor,
Online Tool Reviews
http://www.onlinetoolreviews.com
Over 70 woodworking product reviews online!
------------------------------------------------------------
Latest 6 Reviews:
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------------------------------------------------------------


wrote in message
...
I've got a small basement shop, roughly 18' X 12' and it's paneled off
from the rest of the basement with a closing door. I have a 10"
contractor table saw, a 4" jointer, a 1/2" drill press, a 10" disk
sander, the proverbial router, SCMS, and whatever. Sometimes when I'm
cutting the sawdust in the air is just too much, so I've decided that
I'll look into; (a) a small sawdust collector, or (b), a ceiling hung
filtration system. So what I'm wondering is whether the typical
ceiling hung filtration system would suffice... and whether my Rigid
wet/dry 9 gallon/3.5 HP vac can be rigged for sawdust collection
considering the open end of my table saw?

Or would a dust collector like the Jet DC 1100 or a Delta AP400 be a
better overall choice?

Thanks in advance... Mike

Everyone will disagree with me, but if it is a choice between a DC and an
air filter, I would go with the airfilter.

A DC will do little for your tablesaw, miter saw, disk sander, or drill
press; and a shop vac will work for the router and jointer (though not as
well as a DC). But neither will substitute for an airfilter.

I think a DC only comes into its own on a planer; but you don't have one.

Read http://billpentz.com//woodworking/cyclone/index.cfm. I doubt the ceiling
unit would be a good place to start...

JeffB

use the bill penz site

buy a 1.5hp dc or better, with 0.5 micron canister

build a filter system from a furnace blower and some 3m filtrete
filters (with a "rough" fiberglass filter ahead of them to get out the
big stuff)

plumb 6" lines to all machines, or move the DC around using 6" flex to
each machine when used

use 6"

use 6"

ok, don't use 6" -- make a 10" unit and use 10" ;-)

good luck

On Tue, 04 Jan 2005 04:00:59 GMT, wrote:

I've got a small basement shop, roughly 18' X 12' and it's paneled off
from the rest of the basement with a closing door. I have a 10"
contractor table saw, a 4" jointer, a 1/2" drill press, a 10" disk
sander, the proverbial router, SCMS, and whatever. Sometimes when I'm
cutting the sawdust in the air is just too much, so I've decided that
I'll look into; (a) a small sawdust collector, or (b), a ceiling hung
filtration system. So what I'm wondering is whether the typical
ceiling hung filtration system would suffice... and whether my Rigid
wet/dry 9 gallon/3.5 HP vac can be rigged for sawdust collection
considering the open end of my table saw?

Or would a dust collector like the Jet DC 1100 or a Delta AP400 be a
better overall choice?

Thanks in advance... Mike

wrote in news:dl2kt09sbbtc52lid0nuua3etagcienvje@
4ax.com:

I've got a small basement shop, roughly 18' X 12' and it's paneled off
from the rest of the basement with a closing door. I have a 10"
contractor table saw, a 4" jointer, a 1/2" drill press, a 10" disk
sander, the proverbial router, SCMS, and whatever. Sometimes when I'm
cutting the sawdust in the air is just too much, so I've decided that
I'll look into; (a) a small sawdust collector, or (b), a ceiling hung
filtration system. So what I'm wondering is whether the typical
ceiling hung filtration system would suffice... and whether my Rigid
wet/dry 9 gallon/3.5 HP vac can be rigged for sawdust collection
considering the open end of my table saw?

Or would a dust collector like the Jet DC 1100 or a Delta AP400 be a
better overall choice?

A dust collector is the place to start. Jet, Delta, Penn State, etc. You
want to catch most of the dust before it gets into the air where you're
breathing it. Get bags or canister units that filter the smallest possible
particle size (at least 5um or less). You will be amazed at how much
cleaner the air and the basement will be.

A shop vac won't be very effective for most applications ... it just
doesn't have enough airflow.

A ceiling mounted unit is helpful as a supplement to primary dust
collection.

Another excellent resource in addition to the Penz website is a book I
bought called "Controlling Dust in the Workshop" by Rick Peters.

Dick Snyder


wrote in message
...
I've got a small basement shop, roughly 18' X 12' and it's paneled off
from the rest of the basement with a closing door. I have a 10"
contractor table saw, a 4" jointer, a 1/2" drill press, a 10" disk
sander, the proverbial router, SCMS, and whatever. Sometimes when I'm
cutting the sawdust in the air is just too much, so I've decided that
I'll look into; (a) a small sawdust collector, or (b), a ceiling hung
filtration system. So what I'm wondering is whether the typical
ceiling hung filtration system would suffice... and whether my Rigid
wet/dry 9 gallon/3.5 HP vac can be rigged for sawdust collection
considering the open end of my table saw?

Or would a dust collector like the Jet DC 1100 or a Delta AP400 be a
better overall choice?

Thanks in advance... Mike

wrote in message
...
I've got a small basement shop, roughly 18' X 12' and it's paneled off
from the rest of the basement with a closing door. I have a 10"
contractor table saw, a 4" jointer, a 1/2" drill press, a 10" disk
sander, the proverbial router, SCMS, and whatever. Sometimes when I'm
cutting the sawdust in the air is just too much, so I've decided that
I'll look into; (a) a small sawdust collector, or (b), a ceiling hung
filtration system. So what I'm wondering is whether the typical
ceiling hung filtration system would suffice... and whether my Rigid
wet/dry 9 gallon/3.5 HP vac can be rigged for sawdust collection
considering the open end of my table saw?

Or would a dust collector like the Jet DC 1100 or a Delta AP400 be a
better overall choice?

In a shop your size it's tough to beat an outfit like the JET two-stage DC
at http://www.woodworkingshop.com/ .

In spite of the precipitator advocates, it's much more efficient to capture
at the source. Use standard HVAC pickups, available in greater variety to
suit your circumstances, and move the hose to the appropriate tool. You'll
be putting the entire volume of your shop through the collector every four
minutes anyway.

Easier to keep the floor clean, too.

Jeff...

I read thru Bill's page and also the guy that sells the clear
cyclones. That setup seems a bit much for my useage and shop size.
Its too bad they don't make a "junior" cyclone anymore.

I do have one question about all these larger dual bag systems... if I
had one and just ran it with an open gate, would it filter the air
when there are visible small particles of dust flying about? Or is
that specifically where the ceiling hung air filter has its strength?

Needless to say, I'd like to have both but with my budget, its
probably got to be one or the other. There are some dual-bag units on
eBay (new) for just under a hundred bucks. The pros on them is that
they are powerful, the cons... they take up a bit of precious floor
space. The overhead filters don't take up the floor space, but the
consensus here seems to be that it might be more important to run a 4"
hose to the table saw.

Still thinking...

On Tue, 04 Jan 2005 04:42:24 GMT, JeffB
wrote:

Read http://billpentz.com//woodworking/cyclone/index.cfm. I doubt the ceiling
unit would be a good place to start...

JeffB

In article , wrote:
I've got a small basement shop, roughly 18' X 12' and it's paneled off
from the rest of the basement with a closing door. I have a 10"
contractor table saw, a 4" jointer, a 1/2" drill press, a 10" disk
sander, the proverbial router, SCMS, and whatever. Sometimes when I'm
cutting the sawdust in the air is just too much, so I've decided that
I'll look into; (a) a small sawdust collector, or (b), a ceiling hung
filtration system.

The correct answer is (c) both of the above.

So what I'm wondering is whether the typical
ceiling hung filtration system would suffice

No. The more of it you can collect at the source, the better. It's easier to
prevent the dust from getting into the air in the first place, than to try to
remove it. And of course your jointer doesn't produce much airborne dust, just
a big pile of chips which never get into the air where a filter could catch
them. The same is true of the drill press, and to a lesser degree the saws as
well.

... and whether my Rigid
wet/dry 9 gallon/3.5 HP vac can be rigged for sawdust collection
considering the open end of my table saw?

Doubtful. It probably doesn't move enough air to do much good.

Or would a dust collector like the Jet DC 1100 or a Delta AP400 be a
better overall choice?

Definitely. If your budget allows it, get *both* a dust collector and a
filtration system of some sort. Otherwise, the dust collector should be the
first priority.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)

Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter
by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com
You must use your REAL email address to get a response.

In article , "toller" wrote:
Everyone will disagree with me, but if it is a choice between a DC and an
air filter, I would go with the airfilter.

Let me guess: you own an air filter, and not a dust collector. Right?

A DC will do little for your tablesaw, miter saw, disk sander, or drill
press;

Absolute nonsense. A dust collector picks up plenty from *all* of those tools,
whereas a filter will pick up next to nothing from *any* of them. Granted, you
may need to build or buy shrouds to confine the dust from some of these
(particularly the miter saw and drill press) so that the DC can catch it more
easily, but that's not exactly rocket science.

and a shop vac will work for the router and jointer (though not as
well as a DC). But neither will substitute for an airfilter.

Neither does an air filter substitute for a dust collector.

I think a DC only comes into its own on a planer; but you don't have one.

Apparently you don't have one either. A dust collector, that is, since you
seem to have no idea what they're capable of. A dust collector does just fine
with all of the tools that the OP named.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek-at-milmac-dot-com)

Get a copy of my NEW AND IMPROVED TrollFilter for NewsProxy/Nfilter
by sending email to autoresponder at filterinfo-at-milmac-dot-com
You must use your REAL email address to get a response.

wrote:
Sometimes when I'm
cutting the sawdust in the air is just too much, so I've decided that
I'll look into; (a) a small sawdust collector, or (b), a ceiling hung
filtration system. So what I'm wondering is whether the typical
ceiling hung filtration system would suffice... and whether my Rigid
wet/dry 9 gallon/3.5 HP vac can be rigged for sawdust collection
considering the open end of my table saw?

Or would a dust collector like the Jet DC 1100 or a Delta AP400 be a
better overall choice?



I went through this last summer with my garage shop; I was tired of vacuuming up
the mess, then having to dust the washer and drier a day or so later... and then
a day or so later again. What a PITA.

The first thing I did was buy a JDS air cleaner from Woodcraft that I hung from
the ceiling (by myself; that's another story). With retrospect, that was a
mistake. It improved things but not nearly as much as I had hoped. Hmmmmm.....

Then I did what I should have done to begin with... bought a 1.5HP dust
collector (from Penn State) complete with muffler and a cyclone chunk collector.
THAT cut down on the dust to the point I don't really need to run the cleaner
any more (though I do... I paid for it; I'm gonna use it). I've got it tucked
over in the corner of my garage next to the table saw and ran a Rube Goldberg
piping system to the RAS, floor sweep, and a temporary port for use with the
jointer or planer (or anything else I can think of). The table saw is attacked
from both top and bottom and the dust collection is superb. Noise is so minimal
that I can listen to music as I cut wood.

The shop vac still has its uses but dust collection isn't really its forte.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN

Doug Miller wrote:
I think a DC only comes into its own on a planer; but you don't have one.

Apparently you don't have one either. A dust collector, that is, since you
seem to have no idea what they're capable of. A dust collector does just fine
with all of the tools that the OP named.


You are absolutely correct. I own all of the above but if I could afford only
one cleaning type tool, it'd be the dust collector. The air filter is just
icing on the cake but it does nothing for piles of sawdust. The dust collector
does the heavy work.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN

On Tue, 04 Jan 2005 04:00:59 GMT, wrote:

I've got a small basement shop, roughly 18' X 12' and it's paneled off
from the rest of the basement with a closing door. I have a 10"
contractor table saw, a 4" jointer, a 1/2" drill press, a 10" disk
sander, the proverbial router, SCMS, and whatever. Sometimes when I'm
cutting the sawdust in the air is just too much, so I've decided that
I'll look into; (a) a small sawdust collector, or (b), a ceiling hung
filtration system. So what I'm wondering is whether the typical
ceiling hung filtration system would suffice... and whether my Rigid
wet/dry 9 gallon/3.5 HP vac can be rigged for sawdust collection
considering the open end of my table saw?

Or would a dust collector like the Jet DC 1100 or a Delta AP400 be a
better overall choice?

Thanks in advance... Mike

You need a DC, at least 1-1/2 HP or higher with a metal prop. Take a
look at PennState or Grizzly. An air filtration box will help clear
the air, but the DC should get most of it. (You can use a box fan
with a furnace filter bungeed to it until you can buy/make a better
filtration box.) A good-fitting dust mask is a must for protecting
your lungs.

"toller" wrote in message
...


Everyone will disagree with me, but if it is a choice between a DC and an
air filter, I would go with the airfilter.

Yep! I disagree!

I think the purchasing order should be:

1) High quality dust mask or respirator - protect those lungs.
2) Decent dust collector - keep wearing the respirator
3) Air filter - keep wearing the respirator

On Tue 04 Jan 2005 08:17:37a, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
wrote in
:

You are absolutely correct. I own all of the above but if I could
afford only one cleaning type tool, it'd be the dust collector. The
air filter is just icing on the cake but it does nothing for piles of
sawdust. The dust collector does the heavy work.


Yeah. I'm going to have an air cleaner one day but the major difference
between it and a DC (for me) is, the air cleaner works on the dust AFTER
it's been past your face, and the DC grabs it before. If you use an air
cleaner for your primary, you really really need that mask.

Toller, I can't believe you think a DC does "little" for a table saw. On my
saw, it's more like a LOT. Just a smidgeon of dust on top that doesn't get
through the insert.

Although I gotta say: my shop vac does better with the SCMS and the
bandsaw. Both of those have small openings for the hose. When I put an
adapter on the DC, it doesn't suck as much as the shop vac does. So until I
cut that four inch hole in the back of the bandsaw, it's the DC for the
tablesaw and the shopvac for the others.

"Dan" wrote in message
.. .

Toller, I can't believe you think a DC does "little" for a table saw. On
my
saw, it's more like a LOT. Just a smidgeon of dust on top that doesn't get
through the insert.

I just got a dust collector from the swmbo for xmas. I still can't get
myself to cut a hole in my 1950 unisaw for dust collection. I'm sure that
next time I have to empty it (hassle) I will move towards cutting the hole.
SH

You can put a plywood door, complete with hose, where the cleanout is.

"Slowhand" I'm@work wrote in message
...
I just got a dust collector from the swmbo for xmas. I still can't get
myself to cut a hole in my 1950 unisaw for dust collection. I'm sure that
next time I have to empty it (hassle) I will move towards cutting the
hole.
SH

On Wed, 5 Jan 2005 08:58:59 -0800, "Slowhand" I'm@work wrote:


"Dan" wrote in message
. ..

Toller, I can't believe you think a DC does "little" for a table saw. On
my
saw, it's more like a LOT. Just a smidgeon of dust on top that doesn't get
through the insert.

I just got a dust collector from the swmbo for xmas. I still can't get
myself to cut a hole in my 1950 unisaw for dust collection. I'm sure that
next time I have to empty it (hassle) I will move towards cutting the hole.
SH



take the door off and put it in a safe place. make a replacement with
an elbow and a fitting in it...

Anyone here have pros/cons on the
JET 708630 DC-TS650 Two Stage 1 HP Dust Collector?

After looking at numerous dust collectors over at my local
Woodcrafters store, the guy there showed me one of these that he
special ordered for a customer who also has a small shop. The
benefits are obviously that you don't have the huge _extra_ footprint
of one of the one-stage/two bag units. On the safety side, everything
goes to the barrel first where sawdust, chips, maybe a loose nail...
they supposedly fall into the barrel and only the dust goes through
the impeller and into the filter. Is the filter perfect? Probably
not, but there might be other filters that could easily be adapted.

For someone who basically runs one tool at a time, I thought this was
an interesting approach, albeit not a cheap one. It actually costs
more than the Jet 1½ HP dual-bag setup. Amazon sells it for $349.99
and offers free shipping, and is running a special right now for
another $25 off if you buy before Feb 14th. Woodcraft sells it for
$329.99 so it's basically a wash assuming Woodcraft doesn't charge you
for shipping.

Another alternative would be to buy something like the Jet 650SB and a
two-stage conveter lid. You run the intake into the lid on top of a
32 gallon barrel and then run a second hose to the impeller motor.
That setup would cost you around $200.00.

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 5 Jan 2005 08:58:59 -0800, "Slowhand" I'm@work wrote:


"Dan" wrote in message
...

Toller, I can't believe you think a DC does "little" for a table saw. On
my
saw, it's more like a LOT. Just a smidgeon of dust on top that doesn't
get
through the insert.

I just got a dust collector from the swmbo for xmas. I still can't get
myself to cut a hole in my 1950 unisaw for dust collection. I'm sure that
next time I have to empty it (hassle) I will move towards cutting the
hole.
SH



take the door off and put it in a safe place. make a replacement with
an elbow and a fitting in it...

Think I'll take you up on that.
SH

No you should get a dust collector first then air filtration.
You vac won't suck the tablesaw dust.
The DC won't do a great job, better than the vac. Close the TS back and
drill holes in your zero clearence plate to allow more suction from
above. Some stuff foam between the cast iron top and sides on the
contractor saw... Get some rare earth magnets to hold the rear damper
on. And only allow for the belt to go thru...

Get it at the source. BTW look for a DC with less than 2 micron
collection. This means forgo most bags.. and go for the hard poly filter
type... you won't regret it. A trash can cyclone helps,but a real
cyclone is tops...



wrote:
I've got a small basement shop, roughly 18' X 12' and it's paneled off
from the rest of the basement with a closing door. I have a 10"
contractor table saw, a 4" jointer, a 1/2" drill press, a 10" disk
sander, the proverbial router, SCMS, and whatever. Sometimes when I'm
cutting the sawdust in the air is just too much, so I've decided that
I'll look into; (a) a small sawdust collector, or (b), a ceiling hung
filtration system. So what I'm wondering is whether the typical
ceiling hung filtration system would suffice... and whether my Rigid
wet/dry 9 gallon/3.5 HP vac can be rigged for sawdust collection
considering the open end of my table saw?

Or would a dust collector like the Jet DC 1100 or a Delta AP400 be a
better overall choice?

Thanks in advance... Mike