Our toaster (a cheap 12 year old Philips model HL-5224) has died and I've been looking at taking it apart in case there's a simple repair possible such as fixing a loose connection.

However, when you turn it over to take the top cover off it appears to be fixed to the base using four fixings like this: https://photos.app.goo.gl/UVzMuB43adyfNWJ58

They look like push-on star nuts, so probably near-impossible to remove, and are also recessed by about 10mm, so even harder to access. I've tried a small flat blade screwdriver but don't think I can get the leverage I need as the fixings are recessed.

Can anyone suggest how to remove the cover without breaking it, or am I on to a loser?

TIA,

David.

On 18/08/2020 12:04, Dave N wrote:
Our toaster (a cheap 12 year old Philips model HL-5224) has died and I've been looking at taking it apart in case there's a simple repair possible such as fixing a loose connection.

However, when you turn it over to take the top cover off it appears to be fixed to the base using four fixings like this: https://photos.app.goo.gl/UVzMuB43adyfNWJ58

They look like push-on star nuts, so probably near-impossible to remove, and are also recessed by about 10mm, so even harder to access. I've tried a small flat blade screwdriver but don't think I can get the leverage I need as the fixings are recessed.

Can anyone suggest how to remove the cover without breaking it, or am I on to a loser?

TIA,

David.


Life's too short. Sling it.

Bill

On 18/08/2020 12:27, williamwright wrote:
On 18/08/2020 12:04, Dave N wrote:
Our toaster (a cheap 12 year old Philips model HL-5224) has died and
I've been looking at taking it apart in case there's a simple repair
possible such as fixing a loose connection.

However, when you turn it over to take the top cover off it appears to
be fixed to the base using four fixings like this:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/UVzMuB43adyfNWJ58

They look like push-on star nuts, so probably near-impossible to
remove, and are also recessed by about 10mm, so even harder to access.
I've tried a small flat blade screwdriver but don't think I can get
the leverage I need as the fixings are recessed.

Can anyone suggest how to remove the cover without breaking it, or am
I on to a loser?

TIA,

David.


Life's too short. Sling it.

Bill

Maybe someone fitted the 'wrong' fuse to make it safer :-)

Dave N wrote:

They look like push-on star nuts

Or are they in 'inverse' torx security bit?

Dave N wrote in
:

Our toaster (a cheap 12 year old Philips model HL-5224) has died and
I've been looking at taking it apart in case there's a simple repair
possible such as fixing a loose connection.

However, when you turn it over to take the top cover off it appears to
be fixed to the base using four fixings like this:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/UVzMuB43adyfNWJ58

They look like push-on star nuts, so probably near-impossible to
remove, and are also recessed by about 10mm, so even harder to access.
I've tried a small flat blade screwdriver but don't think I can get
the leverage I need as the fixings are recessed.

Can anyone suggest how to remove the cover without breaking it, or am
I on to a loser?

TIA,

David.

I had one where crumbs whould sometimes prevent the solenoid holding
down the toast holder and it switching on. A good thump fixed it.

Sadly - it is easier and cheaper for makers to say "no user servicable
parts" and make them hard to open to deter you from trying. They attempt
to reduce liabilities.

On Tue, 18 Aug 2020 04:04:20 -0700 (PDT), Dave N
wrote:

Our toaster (a cheap 12 year old Philips model HL-5224) has died and I've been looking at taking it apart in case there's a simple repair possible such as fixing a loose connection.

However, when you turn it over to take the top cover off it appears to be fixed to the base using four fixings like this: https://photos.app.goo.gl/UVzMuB43adyfNWJ58

They look like push-on star nuts, so probably near-impossible to remove, and are also recessed by about 10mm, so even harder to access. I've tried a small flat blade screwdriver but don't think I can get the leverage I need as the fixings are recessed.

Can anyone suggest how to remove the cover without breaking it, or am I on to a loser?


I just had a similar issue with an Aldi/Lidl battery charger that has
an intermitted pushbutton switch but they were just tri-wing type
screws and came out with a tri-wing bit and where they didn't, a flat
bladed bit with the gap in the middle (so one 'leg' was inside the
hole and the other on the outside).

So, if you have the right bit or can file a slot in an old flat bladed
screwdriver they may well come out easily. Once out you can replace
them (as I'm doing with this charger) or saw a slot across them?

Cheers, T i m

Maybe someone fitted the 'wrong' fuse to make it safer :-)

I did of course swap the fuse (with one from another appliance with a 13A fuse in the plug). The latter worked so the fuse was evidently fine.

On 18/08/2020 12:04, Dave N wrote:
Our toaster (a cheap 12 year old Philips model HL-5224) has died and
I've been looking at taking it apart in case there's a simple repair
possible such as fixing a loose connection.

Depends how it fails. The last one to go on me the magic smoke a huge
bang and shower of sparks came out after the element blew and the then
much shorter live loose end sub element touched earth.

Can anyone suggest how to remove the cover without breaking it, or am
I on to a loser?

You need to figure out exactly how they put it together and work back.

Chances are the right screwdriver head and sufficient torque will get it
or sheer off the head to allow you to get in. The chances of a
successful repair are slim and a cost effective one even slimmer.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On Tuesday, 18 August 2020 12:04:23 UTC+1, Dave N wrote:
Our toaster (a cheap 12 year old Philips model HL-5224) has died and I've been looking at taking it apart in case there's a simple repair possible such as fixing a loose connection.

However, when you turn it over to take the top cover off it appears to be fixed to the base using four fixings like this: https://photos.app.goo.gl/UVzMuB43adyfNWJ58

They look like push-on star nuts, so probably near-impossible to remove, and are also recessed by about 10mm, so even harder to access. I've tried a small flat blade screwdriver but don't think I can get the leverage I need as the fixings are recessed.

Can anyone suggest how to remove the cover without breaking it, or am I on to a loser?

TIA,

David.

I don't recognise the head recess type. If you don't have a bit you can always drill it out.


NT

On Tue, 18 Aug 2020 04:04:20 -0700 (PDT), Dave N wrote:

However, when you turn it over to take the top cover off it appears to
be fixed to the base using four fixings like this:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/UVzMuB43adyfNWJ58

They look like push-on star nuts, so probably near-impossible to remove,
and are also recessed by about 10mm, so even harder to access.

Presumably the 6 "legs" and ring are the same height as the central
dome, so you'd need something the profile of the dome to try and
rotate the fixing. But as you say it does look push on so that might
not help much unless it has "scrivit" sort of action, push on but the
barbs form a "thread" and the fixing can be unscrewed,

Can you push a pin down the central side of a "leg"? Thinking that if
they are sprung inwards onto a pin, 6 pins might release them
allowing the thing to lift away.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Tue, 18 Aug 2020 15:28:24 +0100 (BST), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

On Tue, 18 Aug 2020 04:04:20 -0700 (PDT), Dave N wrote:

However, when you turn it over to take the top cover off it appears to
be fixed to the base using four fixings like this:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/UVzMuB43adyfNWJ58

They look like push-on star nuts, so probably near-impossible to remove,
and are also recessed by about 10mm, so even harder to access.

Presumably the 6 "legs" and ring are the same height as the central
dome, so you'd need something the profile of the dome to try and
rotate the fixing. But as you say it does look push on so that might
not help much unless it has "scrivit" sort of action, push on but the
barbs form a "thread" and the fixing can be unscrewed,

Can you push a pin down the central side of a "leg"? Thinking that if
they are sprung inwards onto a pin, 6 pins might release them
allowing the thing to lift away.

Aren't they just a 'System Zero' (alike?) security screw?

You need to just imagine them as a dome with slots down the side, the
'driver' is a tube with splines on the inside?

Cheers, T i m

The thing is, is it worth the effort? Most of those I've had have had
limited serviceability, normally nothing at all and all riveted together,
some have a small panel that can allow changing of the flex or maybe even
the cleaning of the switch mechanism secured by some security screws with a
dire warning next to it. Most I've actually broken into use a simple module
made in china with elements kind of laced around some kind of high
temperature card and usually the element breaks somewhere at a bend and as
all the elements are in series the whole thing stops. Quite how the frost
button etc work, I've never looked but it sounds pretty mechanical.
Brian

--
--
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Dave N" wrote in message
...
Our toaster (a cheap 12 year old Philips model HL-5224) has died and I've
been looking at taking it apart in case there's a simple repair possible
such as fixing a loose connection.

However, when you turn it over to take the top cover off it appears to be
fixed to the base using four fixings like this:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/UVzMuB43adyfNWJ58

They look like push-on star nuts, so probably near-impossible to remove,
and are also recessed by about 10mm, so even harder to access. I've tried
a small flat blade screwdriver but don't think I can get the leverage I
need as the fixings are recessed.

Can anyone suggest how to remove the cover without breaking it, or am I on
to a loser?

TIA,

David.

On 18/08/2020 16:52, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:

The thing is, is it worth the effort? Most of those I've had have had
limited serviceability, normally nothing at all and all riveted together,
some have a small panel that can allow changing of the flex or maybe even
the cleaning of the switch mechanism secured by some security screws with a
dire warning next to it. Most I've actually broken into use a simple module
made in china with elements kind of laced around some kind of high
temperature card and usually the element breaks somewhere at a bend and as
all the elements are in series the whole thing stops. Quite how the frost
button etc work, I've never looked but it sounds pretty mechanical.

Non serviceable appliances are offensive, even if replacements only cost
£5. Whatever happened to "right to repair"?

--
Max Demian

On Tuesday, 18 August 2020 20:12:41 UTC+1, Max Demian wrote:


Non serviceable appliances are offensive, even if replacements only cost
£5. Whatever happened to "right to repair"?

I agree that it would be far better if repair were both possible and sensible.

Though sometimes I think we have forgotten how poor some things were. As a child we had Morphy Richards toasters. Which were repaired (new elements) and replaced quite regularly. Whereas my current toaster has been going for about ten years so far. (I have a spare of the exact same model - in case it now decides to give up its magic smoke.)

"Max Demian" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 18/08/2020 16:52, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:

The thing is, is it worth the effort? Most of those I've had have had
limited serviceability, normally nothing at all and all riveted together,
some have a small panel that can allow changing of the flex or maybe even
the cleaning of the switch mechanism secured by some security screws with a
dire warning next to it. Most I've actually broken into use a simple module
made in china with elements kind of laced around some kind of high
temperature card and usually the element breaks somewhere at a bend and as
all the elements are in series the whole thing stops. Quite how the frost
button etc work, I've never looked but it sounds pretty mechanical.

Non serviceable appliances are offensive, even if replacements only cost £5. Whatever
happened to "right to repair"?

The easier you make electrical items to repair by DIY'ers the easier it is
for the more incompetent to render them unsafe and possibly electrocute users
or burn their houses down. Obviously some DIY'ers are still going to do this
providing they can source spares, but this isn't something manufacturers want
to encourage. As this may be a source of unwelcome publicity if nothing
else.

While the labour cost of the time it would take a skilled repairer to dismantle
an item designed for machine assembly, would often be greater than the cost
of the item.

Whereas in the days when stuff was assembled by hand the difference might
not have been as great. And as hand assembled items cost more in the
first place, there would have been greater incentive to repair them.


michael adams

....

On Tue, 18 Aug 2020 21:59:27 +0100, "michael adams"
wrote:


"Max Demian" wrote in message
news:Qq6dnYEoNIC7taHCnZ2dnUU78YudnZ2d@brightview. co.uk...
On 18/08/2020 16:52, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:

The thing is, is it worth the effort? Most of those I've had have had
limited serviceability, normally nothing at all and all riveted together,
some have a small panel that can allow changing of the flex or maybe even
the cleaning of the switch mechanism secured by some security screws with a
dire warning next to it. Most I've actually broken into use a simple module
made in china with elements kind of laced around some kind of high
temperature card and usually the element breaks somewhere at a bend and as
all the elements are in series the whole thing stops. Quite how the frost
button etc work, I've never looked but it sounds pretty mechanical.

Non serviceable appliances are offensive, even if replacements only cost £5. Whatever
happened to "right to repair"?

The easier you make electrical items to repair by DIY'ers the easier it is
for the more incompetent to render them unsafe and possibly electrocute users
or burn their houses down. Obviously some DIY'ers are still going to do this
providing they can source spares, but this isn't something manufacturers want
to encourage. As this may be a source of unwelcome publicity if nothing
else.

While the labour cost of the time it would take a skilled repairer to dismantle
an item designed for machine assembly, would often be greater than the cost
of the item.

Whereas in the days when stuff was assembled by hand the difference might
not have been as great. And as hand assembled items cost more in the
first place, there would have been greater incentive to repair them.

I thought the EU was introducing 'Right to Repair' regulations to make
all goods user-servicable. I apprecate that the status of the UK has
changed but is this proceeding for the EU?

"Scott" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 18 Aug 2020 21:59:27 +0100, "michael adams"
wrote:


"Max Demian" wrote in message
news:Qq6dnYEoNIC7taHCnZ2dnUU78YudnZ2d@brightview .co.uk...
On 18/08/2020 16:52, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:

The thing is, is it worth the effort? Most of those I've had have had
limited serviceability, normally nothing at all and all riveted together,
some have a small panel that can allow changing of the flex or maybe even
the cleaning of the switch mechanism secured by some security screws with a
dire warning next to it. Most I've actually broken into use a simple module
made in china with elements kind of laced around some kind of high
temperature card and usually the element breaks somewhere at a bend and as
all the elements are in series the whole thing stops. Quite how the frost
button etc work, I've never looked but it sounds pretty mechanical.

Non serviceable appliances are offensive, even if replacements only cost £5. Whatever
happened to "right to repair"?

The easier you make electrical items to repair by DIY'ers the easier it is
for the more incompetent to render them unsafe and possibly electrocute users
or burn their houses down. Obviously some DIY'ers are still going to do this
providing they can source spares, but this isn't something manufacturers want
to encourage. As this may be a source of unwelcome publicity if nothing
else.

While the labour cost of the time it would take a skilled repairer to dismantle
an item designed for machine assembly, would often be greater than the cost
of the item.

Whereas in the days when stuff was assembled by hand the difference might
not have been as great. And as hand assembled items cost more in the
first place, there would have been greater incentive to repair them.

I thought the EU was introducing 'Right to Repair' regulations to make
all goods user-servicable. I apprecate that the status of the UK has
changed but is this proceeding for the EU?

The original idea which originated with motor manufacturers in the US
was to prevent manufacturers from monopolising repairs by forcing them,
and everyone else, to publish all the documentation covering their products
which would be required by independent repairers. Should they be repairable

There's nothing in the regulations forcing manufacturers of machine
assembled products, to redesign them so as to make them easier to dis-assemble
them by hand. All that would do is put costs up. Of course costs could
go up so much that it would then be economic to repair. But then manufacturers
would all go out of business as they wouldn't sell any new products.

Just more bull**** IOW


michael adams

....

On 18/08/2020 15:51:17, T i m wrote:
On Tue, 18 Aug 2020 15:28:24 +0100 (BST), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

On Tue, 18 Aug 2020 04:04:20 -0700 (PDT), Dave N wrote:

However, when you turn it over to take the top cover off it appears to
be fixed to the base using four fixings like this:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/UVzMuB43adyfNWJ58

They look like push-on star nuts, so probably near-impossible to remove,
and are also recessed by about 10mm, so even harder to access.

Presumably the 6 "legs" and ring are the same height as the central
dome, so you'd need something the profile of the dome to try and
rotate the fixing. But as you say it does look push on so that might
not help much unless it has "scrivit" sort of action, push on but the
barbs form a "thread" and the fixing can be unscrewed,

Can you push a pin down the central side of a "leg"? Thinking that if
they are sprung inwards onto a pin, 6 pins might release them
allowing the thing to lift away.

Aren't they just a 'System Zero' (alike?) security screw?

I'm pretty sure you are correct. I wasn't sure what they were called.

The OP will find the driver tool costs more than the toaster.

Fredxx wrote:
On 18/08/2020 15:51:17, T i m wrote:
On Tue, 18 Aug 2020 15:28:24 +0100 (BST), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

On Tue, 18 Aug 2020 04:04:20 -0700 (PDT), Dave N wrote:

However, when you turn it over to take the top cover off it appears to
be fixed to the base using four fixings like this:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/UVzMuB43adyfNWJ58

They look like push-on star nuts, so probably near-impossible to remove,
and are also recessed by about 10mm, so even harder to access.

Presumably the 6 "legs" and ring are the same height as the central
dome, so you'd need something the profile of the dome to try and
rotate the fixing. But as you say it does look push on so that might
not help much unless it has "scrivit" sort of action, push on but the
barbs form a "thread" and the fixing can be unscrewed,

Can you push a pin down the central side of a "leg"? Thinking that if
they are sprung inwards onto a pin, 6 pins might release them
allowing the thing to lift away.

Aren't they just a 'System Zero' (alike?) security screw?

I'm pretty sure you are correct. I wasn't sure what they were called.

The OP will find the driver tool costs more than the toaster.


I would just attack a suitable width screwdriver tip with a Dremel or
similar tool to produce a two pronged tip that fits.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

"michael adams" wrote in message
...

The original idea which originated with motor manufacturers in the US
was to prevent manufacturers from monopolising repairs by forcing them,
and everyone else, to publish all the documentation covering their products
which would be required by independent repairers. Should they be repairable

Strangely enough none of this seems to take account of the original
IBM PC and subsequebt clones which apart from proprietory ROMs
were deliberately designed so as to be easily assembled by anyone capable
of wielding a screwdriver, from parts from a variety of manufacturers
bought off the shelf. So "the right to build your own" then.

And then along came Apple.


michael adams

....

Brian Gaff (Sofa) pretended :
Quite how the frost button etc work, I've never looked but it sounds pretty
mechanical.
Brian

Judging entirely by the behaviour of mine, about 7 years old, it uses
electronic timing rather than mechanical.

On 19/08/2020 10:08, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
Brian Gaff (Sofa) pretended :
Quite how the frost button etc work, I've never looked but it sounds pretty
mechanical.
Brian

Judging entirely by the behaviour of mine, about 7 years old, it uses
electronic timing rather than mechanical.

Ours is a Russell-Hobbs "Seasons" toaster, about 25 or 30 years old
(inherited from my parents). A few years ago it stopped latching when
pushed down to start the toasting. I dismantled it and found a small
piece of plastic had broken off from the latching mechanism. I used some
epoxy resin to hold it back in place and the toaster has worked
perfectly ever since.

--

Jeff

On Tue, 18 Aug 2020 23:16:43 +0100, "michael adams"
wrote:


"michael adams" wrote in message
...

The original idea which originated with motor manufacturers in the US
was to prevent manufacturers from monopolising repairs by forcing them,
and everyone else, to publish all the documentation covering their products
which would be required by independent repairers. Should they be repairable

Strangely enough none of this seems to take account of the original
IBM PC and subsequebt clones which apart from proprietory ROMs
were deliberately designed so as to be easily assembled by anyone capable
of wielding a screwdriver, from parts from a variety of manufacturers
bought off the shelf. So "the right to build your own" then.

And then along came Apple.

I think real computers are the last bastion of user-servicable parts
(as opposed to 'no user servicable parts').

I changed a graphics card or USB card or something and told my brother
(who works in IT). His reaction was; 'Did you open up your computer?
I have worked in IT for 25 years and I have never opened a computer.'

On Wed, 19 Aug 2020 10:42:33 +0100, Scott wrote:

I changed a graphics card or USB card or something and told my brother
(who works in IT). His reaction was; 'Did you open up your computer?
I have worked in IT for 25 years and I have never opened a computer.'

My partner's sister is a big cheese in one of the banks, but as a
high-up in IT there has no password protection or encryption on her
laptop. What's that proverb about the cobblers children being poorly
shod?

"Scott" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 18 Aug 2020 23:16:43 +0100, "michael adams"
wrote:


"michael adams" wrote in message
...

The original idea which originated with motor manufacturers in the US
was to prevent manufacturers from monopolising repairs by forcing them,
and everyone else, to publish all the documentation covering their products
which would be required by independent repairers. Should they be repairable

Strangely enough none of this seems to take account of the original
IBM PC and subsequebt clones which apart from proprietory ROMs
were deliberately designed so as to be easily assembled by anyone capable
of wielding a screwdriver, from parts from a variety of manufacturers
bought off the shelf. So "the right to build your own" then.

And then along came Apple.

I think real computers are the last bastion of user-servicable parts
(as opposed to 'no user servicable parts').

I changed a graphics card or USB card or something and told my brother
(who works in IT). His reaction was; 'Did you open up your computer?
I have worked in IT for 25 years and I have never opened a computer.'

Apart from the case screws holding down the power supply, expansion cards
and hard disks and motherboards (and maybe other stuff) everything else
is just about a matter of joining up different sorts of connectors or
plugs. Its hard to think of any other product which has ever been made
which was deliberately designed so as to be so easy to assemble.

The same may still be true of Apple except unlike PC's you're limited
to fitting proprietary parts as a matter of policy.


michael adams

....

In article , Martin Brown
writes
On 18/08/2020 12:04, Dave N wrote:
Our toaster (a cheap 12 year old Philips model HL-5224) has died and
I've been looking at taking it apart in case there's a simple repair
possible such as fixing a loose connection.

Depends how it fails. The last one to go on me the magic smoke a huge
bang and shower of sparks came out after the element blew and the then
much shorter live loose end sub element touched earth.

Can anyone suggest how to remove the cover without breaking it, or am
I on to a loser?

You need to figure out exactly how they put it together and work back.

Did you write Haynes manuals in a former life?
Chances are the right screwdriver head and sufficient torque will get
it or sheer off the head to allow you to get in. The chances of a
successful repair are slim and a cost effective one even slimmer.


--
bert

On Wednesday, 19 August 2020 15:18:40 UTC+1, bert wrote:
In article , Martin Brown
writes

You need to figure out exactly how they put it together and work back.

Did you write Haynes manuals in a former life?

Lol

You need to figure out exactly how they put it together and work back.

Did you write Haynes manuals in a former life?
Lol

"Reassembly is the reverse ..." etc...

Anyway, looking as closely as I can at the fixing, it still looks like some kind of star washer arrangement rather than a security screw, so it seems to me that the only likely ways to get the cover off are to drill the fixing out or break the washer off somehow - both options pretty unappealing. I thing I'll just have to splash out £30 for a new toaster. Many thanks to everyone for the suggestions and comments - I managed to find our old toaster in the loft today (a Braun model, c. 1995) so at least have something usable (it doesn't do thick bread or crumpets, though, which is why we got a new one), and note that the bottom panel is metal and fixed using screws.. Clearly there are some ways in which technology has gone backwards...

On Wed, 19 Aug 2020 14:52:39 -0700 (PDT), Dave N wrote:

I managed to find our old toaster in the loft today (a Braun model, c.
1995) so at least have something usable (it doesn't do thick bread or
crumpets, though, which is why we got a new one), ...

Er isn't that what a grill is for? Ah I guess with a modern worktop
hob and a builtin oven you don't get a grill...

... and note that the bottom panel is metal and fixed using screws..
Clearly there are some ways in which technology has gone backwards...

In more ways than one.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Wednesday, August 19, 2020 at 11:09:42 PM UTC+1, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Wed, 19 Aug 2020 14:52:39 -0700 (PDT), Dave N wrote:

I managed to find our old toaster in the loft today (a Braun model, c.
1995) so at least have something usable (it doesn't do thick bread or
crumpets, though, which is why we got a new one), ...

Er isn't that what a grill is for? Ah I guess with a modern worktop
hob and a builtin oven you don't get a grill...


Well, we've got a built-in double oven; the top oven can be used as a grill but it's a horribly inefficient way of making toast, takes ages to get to temperature, only does one side at a time and will carbonise your toast in the blink of an eye if you're not watching it like a hawk.

--
Halmyre

On Wed, 19 Aug 2020 14:52:39 -0700 (PDT), Dave N
wrote:

snip

Anyway, looking as closely as I can at the fixing, it still looks like some kind of star washer arrangement rather than a security screw, so it seems to me that the only likely ways to get the cover off are to drill the fixing out or break the washer off somehow - both options pretty unappealing.

Or just undo the screws. ;-)

To fasten anything with any form of snap washer would first have to
insert some form of pin into the plastic and that's not as easy as
just having a hole and putting a(n anti-tamper) screw in there.

I thing I'll just have to splash out £30 for a new toaster. Many thanks to everyone for the suggestions and comments - I managed to find our old toaster in the loft today (a Braun model, c. 1995) so at least have something usable

;-)

(it doesn't do thick bread or crumpets, though, which is why we got a new one),

That's party how we winded up with what was probably the cheapest 4
slice toaster in the Argos catalogue, a white plastic 'Coolworks'
thing and it's probably 10 years now and used very regularly. Why on
earth would you want or anyone make a toaster that *doesn't* handle
something as basic as thick bread or crumpets!? ;-(

We also like the layout with all the controls at the end.

and note that the bottom panel is metal and fixed using screws. Clearly there are some ways in which technology has gone backwards...

But safety has gone forwards. It means 'most people' won't be able to
get it to bits, not without getting, making / adapting some tools
anyway. ;-)

Cheers, T i m

On Thu, 20 Aug 2020 00:40:35 -0700 (PDT), Halmyre wrote:

(it doesn't do thick bread or crumpets, though, which is why we
got a
new one), ...

Er isn't that what a grill is for? Ah I guess with a modern
worktop
hob and a builtin oven you don't get a grill...

Well, we've got a built-in double oven; the top oven can be used as a
grill but it's a horribly inefficient way of making toast, takes ages to
get to temperature, ...

Do you preheat your toaster? Or just bung the bread in it a press
"go".
Kitchen timer 6 mins for our grill.

... only does one side at a time ...

True enough but that doesn't bother me. B-)

... and will carbonise your toast in the blink of an eye if you're not
watching it like a hawk.

So would your toaster if it didn't have an automatic (but unreliable)
built in timer. "Unreliable" in that a second toasting straight after
the first "will carbonise your toast in the blink of an eye if you're
not
watching it like a hawk". B-)

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Wed, 19 Aug 2020 14:52:39 -0700 (PDT), Dave N
wrote:

You need to figure out exactly how they put it together and work back.

Did you write Haynes manuals in a former life?
Lol

"Reassembly is the reverse ..." etc...

Anyway, looking as closely as I can at the fixing, it still looks like some kind of star washer arrangement rather than a security screw, so it seems to me that the only likely ways to get the cover off are to drill the fixing out or break the washer off somehow - both options pretty unappealing. I thing I'll just have to splash out £30 for a new toaster. Many thanks to everyone for the suggestions and comments - I managed to find our old toaster in the loft today (a Braun model, c. 1995) so at least have something usable (it doesn't do thick bread or crumpets, though, which is why we got a new one), and note that the bottom panel is metal and fixed using screws. Clearly there are some ways in which technology has gone backwards...

Have you tried using an Allen key? As they are 6-sided perhaps one
would jam into the six gaps between the pins?
--
Dave W

On Sun, 30 Aug 2020 18:29:08 +0100, Dave W
wrote:

snip

Have you tried using an Allen key? As they are 6-sided perhaps one
would jam into the six gaps between the pins?

I think it's one of those optical illusion things Dave, where you can
see the head of the screw as a hole or a dome.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/UVzMuB43adyfNWJ58

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:B...ollow_Face.jpg

If you look at is as I believe it is, a dome, then the tool to turn it
wouldn't go in but 'over' the dome with inward facing 'splines' to
engage with the 'slots' in the screw head, like this:

https://www.i-sells.co.uk/images/100...IVER-BIT-1.jpg

A diy solution would be to find a fairly fine flat-bladed driver that
will fit in the recesses the screws are normally set in and grind a
slot out of the middle, the depth of the slot the height of the dome
and the width the distance between two opposing grooves. Then hope
it's strong enough to undo all the screws [1] without breaking. ;-)

Cheers, T i m

[1] There is normally at least *one* that won't budge. ;-)