https://photos.app.goo.gl/Rt6Ju7hN7rkF8ip29

Is it possible in this door?

I'm wondering about a reduced length window in the centre section
and if possible, a new crosspiece to enable secure glazing and
place to put a cat flap. Is this possible post-manufacture?

Tim
--

On 30/06/2018 12:19, Tim+ wrote:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Rt6Ju7hN7rkF8ip29

Is it possible in this door?

I'm wondering about a reduced length window in the centre section
and if possible, a new crosspiece to enable secure glazing and
place to put a cat flap. Is this possible post-manufacture?

You could probably get a custom replacement sealed unit made up with a
suitable hole for the flap in it. Then just swap out the whole pane.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

The only way I've seen this done is by replacing the lower glazing panel
with something else, looks like some kind of hard plastic on the one I
remember. Then a cat flap was fitted.
Brian

--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"John Rumm" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 30/06/2018 12:19, Tim+ wrote:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Rt6Ju7hN7rkF8ip29

Is it possible in this door?

I'm wondering about a reduced length window in the centre section
and if possible, a new crosspiece to enable secure glazing and
place to put a cat flap. Is this possible post-manufacture?

You could probably get a custom replacement sealed unit made up with a
suitable hole for the flap in it. Then just swap out the whole pane.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

Tim+ Wrote in message:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Rt6Ju7hN7rkF8ip29

Is it possible in this door?

I'm wondering about a reduced length window in the centre section
and if possible, a new crosspiece to enable secure glazing and
place to put a cat flap. Is this possible post-manufacture?

Tim

Technically I expect it's possible, given the correct uPVC profile
& associated window /door manufacturing equipment.

Practically I'd be surprised if anyone would take it on. Plus it
would most likely mean the door having to be removed & taken away
to do it "properly".

Can you find a catflap to suit the width anyway?

You might be able to fit one neatly in the lowest part of the
panel, then fit a shorter DG unit above it. The trickiest part
would, I think, be either transferring the weight of the DG unit
down to the bottom where the original DG unit now sits, or making
alternative arrangements...

If there is enough meat on the catflap bezels, you might be able
to hide a bit of ally? angle behind them, rivetted? to the sides
of the glazing rebate, & sit a suitably sized new DG unit in
that?
--
--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

On 30/06/2018 12:19, Tim+ wrote:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Rt6Ju7hN7rkF8ip29

Is it possible in this door?

I'm wondering about a reduced length window in the centre section
and if possible, a new crosspiece to enable secure glazing and
place to put a cat flap. Is this possible post-manufacture?


My limited practical experience suggests not all cats would cope with
such a difference in height between the flap and the step below. Do you
have a cat-flap sized bit of external wall where sod hasn't run gas
pipe, water pipe, incoming power, etc?


--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

On 30/06/2018 15:06, Brian Gaff wrote:
The only way I've seen this done is by replacing the lower glazing panel
with something else, looks like some kind of hard plastic on the one I
remember. Then a cat flap was fitted.

In this particular case that is not so easy as the photo shows a door
divided into three full height vertical glass panels. It would be tricky
to fit in a new cross member and not have it look a bit odd.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

In article ,
Tim+ wrote:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Rt6Ju7hN7rkF8ip29

Is it possible in this door?

I'm wondering about a reduced length window in the centre section
and if possible, a new crosspiece to enable secure glazing and
place to put a cat flap. Is this possible post-manufacture?

I'd say the easy way would be to replace that glass panel with something
equally as strong - say plywood of the same thickness as the glass.
Perhaps Formica covered to give a nice smooth surface.

--
*Don't worry; it only seems kinky the first time.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" Wrote in message:
In article ,
Tim+ wrote:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Rt6Ju7hN7rkF8ip29

Is it possible in this door?

I'm wondering about a reduced length window in the centre section
and if possible, a new crosspiece to enable secure glazing and
place to put a cat flap. Is this possible post-manufacture?

I'd say the easy way would be to replace that glass panel with something
equally as strong - say plywood of the same thickness as the glass.

Easiest no doubt. I'm not sure my daughter would find it
aesthetically pleasing though. It would also reduce the glass
area considerably.

Ideally I'd just like to know if it's possible to "glue" in a UPVC
crosspiece to reduce the size of the middle glazed part (and to
allow refitting of glazing bars etc.


tim


--

On Sat, 30 Jun 2018 13:19:31 +0200 (GMT+02:00), Tim+
wrote:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/Rt6Ju7hN7rkF8ip29

Is it possible in this door?

I'm wondering about a reduced length window in the centre section
and if possible, a new crosspiece to enable secure glazing and
place to put a cat flap. Is this possible post-manufacture?


No, unfortunately you will have to tell her it's impossible and the
cat will have to become an 'indoor cat'.

Either that she can take it out for walks on a lead, that way she can
ensure she's being responsible for her 'companion animal, that it
isn't cause car accidents as it runs in front of innocent motorists,
doesn't foul in other peoples gardens or kill their fish or wildlife.

I'm sure you would like to ensure she is being considerate to her
neighbours and responsible for *her* pet right? ;-)

Cheers, T i m

T i m Wrote in message:
On Sat, 30 Jun 2018 13:19:31 +0200 (GMT+02:00), Tim+
wrote:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/Rt6Ju7hN7rkF8ip29

Is it possible in this door?

I'm wondering about a reduced length window in the centre section
and if possible, a new crosspiece to enable secure glazing and
place to put a cat flap. Is this possible post-manufacture?


No, unfortunately you will have to tell her it's impossible and the
cat will have to become an 'indoor cat'.

Either that she can take it out for walks on a lead, that way she can
ensure she's being responsible for her 'companion animal, that it
isn't cause car accidents as it runs in front of innocent motorists,
doesn't foul in other peoples gardens or kill their fish or wildlife.

I'm sure you would like to ensure she is being considerate to her
neighbours and responsible for *her* pet right? ;-)

Cheers, T i m


Let me guess, you're not a cat person?

Tim
--

On Sat, 30 Jun 2018 22:22:59 +0100, Tim Streater
wrote:

In article , Tim+
wrote:

T i m Wrote in message:
On Sat, 30 Jun 2018 13:19:31 +0200 (GMT+02:00), Tim+
wrote:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/Rt6Ju7hN7rkF8ip29

Is it possible in this door?

I'm wondering about a reduced length window in the centre section
and if possible, a new crosspiece to enable secure glazing and
place to put a cat flap. Is this possible post-manufacture?

No, unfortunately you will have to tell her it's impossible and the
cat will have to become an 'indoor cat'.

Either that she can take it out for walks on a lead, that way she can
ensure she's being responsible for her 'companion animal, that it
isn't cause car accidents as it runs in front of innocent motorists,
doesn't foul in other peoples gardens or kill their fish or wildlife.

I'm sure you would like to ensure she is being considerate to her
neighbours and responsible for *her* pet right? ;-)

Cheers, goblin slayer

Let me guess, you're not a cat person?

He's being a smart-arse.

Goblin, is your EQ *SO* poor that you don't think Tim+ figured out
that I was just making a tongue-in-cheek point all on his own?

It really must be sad being you, traveling though this colourful world
only seeing black and white (and often getting them mixed up) and nor
fully understanding what 'other people' are all about. ;-(

Maybe you are just frustrated, realising just how useless your fine
arts degree really was and how you would have loved to have done
something in engineering.

Well, not designing iTPMS systems obviously ... maybe a fortune teller
.... predicting the outcome of gambles, like Brexit. ;-)

Cheers, T i m

On 30/06/2018 15:28, Tim Streater wrote:
In article , John
Rumm wrote:

On 30/06/2018 15:06, Brian Gaff wrote:
The only way I've seen this done is by replacing the lower glazing panel
with something else, looks like some kind of hard plastic on the one I
remember. Then a cat flap was fitted.

In this particular case that is not so easy as the photo shows a door
divided into three full height vertical glass panels. It would be
tricky to fit in a new cross member and not have it look a bit odd.

In our case we put the cat-flap through the wall next to the uPVC door.
The flap itself is on the inside, the other side of it there's a tunnel
to the outside. Cats seem to cope well with that.

+1 did the same here... just fitted the external bezel on the outer wall
and made up a WBP ply tunnel to link the flap and exterior bezel.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Sat, 30 Jun 2018 23:15:40 +0200 (GMT+02:00), Tim+
wrote:

snip

I'm sure you would like to ensure she is being considerate to her
neighbours and responsible for *her* pet right? ;-)


Let me guess, you're not a cat person?

My comment wasn't really anything to do with being 'a cat / dog
person' (unless being a 'cat person means you become less socially
responsible etc) but to do with what you are happy for your (outdoor?)
pet to be doing when it's not under your direct control?

We don't currently have any pets and so don't expect to find fouling
from any *pets* in our private / sealed back garden.

Therefore, I question the attitude / social responsibility of anyone
who knowingly allows their personal 'companion animal' to roam free
and potentially blight the lives of others, without them having any
real recourse?

I know the law allows this (within reason) but just because it's not
illegal doesn't mean it's right.

Your cat can come into my garden and kill the wild birds (27M a year?)
I feed [1] but if my lurcher gets into you back garden and kills your
cat (equally 'nature' doing it's thing), I'm guessing you would kick
up a big fuss? [2] I'm pretty sure your cat wouldn't differentiate
between a wild sparrow and my budgie that I let out for it's afternoon
fly around in my back garden?

https://www.theguardian.com/environm...rotection-tips

If you want a pet, *you* have one, the rest of us don't want it on our
property (thanks).

I guess this is what happens when you introduce a non-native species
to a country but don't let their natural predators have their way.

(Outdoor) cats seem to be the sort of things people get who don't
really want or want the responsibility that should (and does with most
others) typically be part of owning a pet? ;-(

Cheers, T i m

[1] And other animals and don't always eat them.

[2] Especially so if it just mamed it and then tormented it for a few
hours before leaving it injured somewhere to die a slow and lingering
death?

On Sunday, 1 July 2018 00:47:23 UTC+1, T i m wrote:
On Sat, 30 Jun 2018 23:15:40 +0200 (GMT+02:00), Tim+
wrote:

snip

I'm sure you would like to ensure she is being considerate to her
neighbours and responsible for *her* pet right? ;-)


Let me guess, you're not a cat person?

My comment wasn't really anything to do with being 'a cat / dog
person' (unless being a 'cat person means you become less socially
responsible etc) but to do with what you are happy for your (outdoor?)
pet to be doing when it's not under your direct control?

We don't currently have any pets and so don't expect to find fouling
from any *pets* in our private / sealed back garden.

Therefore, I question the attitude / social responsibility of anyone
who knowingly allows their personal 'companion animal' to roam free
and potentially blight the lives of others, without them having any
real recourse?

I know the law allows this (within reason) but just because it's not
illegal doesn't mean it's right.

Your cat can come into my garden and kill the wild birds (27M a year?)
I feed [1] but if my lurcher gets into you back garden and kills your
cat (equally 'nature' doing it's thing), I'm guessing you would kick
up a big fuss? [2] I'm pretty sure your cat wouldn't differentiate
between a wild sparrow and my budgie that I let out for it's afternoon
fly around in my back garden?

https://www.theguardian.com/environm...rotection-tips

If you want a pet, *you* have one, the rest of us don't want it on our
property (thanks).

I guess this is what happens when you introduce a non-native species
to a country but don't let their natural predators have their way.

(Outdoor) cats seem to be the sort of things people get who don't
really want or want the responsibility that should (and does with most
others) typically be part of owning a pet? ;-(

Cheers, T i m

[1] And other animals and don't always eat them.

[2] Especially so if it just mamed it and then tormented it for a few
hours before leaving it injured somewhere to die a slow and lingering
death?

people trying to impose their own version of reality on the world rarely works.


NT

On 01/07/18 00:47, T i m wrote:
On Sat, 30 Jun 2018 23:15:40 +0200 (GMT+02:00), Tim+
wrote:

snip

I'm sure you would like to ensure she is being considerate to her
neighbours and responsible for *her* pet right? ;-)


Let me guess, you're not a cat person?

My comment wasn't really anything to do with being 'a cat / dog
person' (unless being a 'cat person means you become less socially
responsible etc) but to do with what you are happy for your (outdoor?)
pet to be doing when it's not under your direct control?

We don't currently have any pets and so don't expect to find fouling
from any *pets* in our private / sealed back garden.

Therefore, I question the attitude / social responsibility of anyone
who knowingly allows their personal 'companion animal' to roam free
and potentially blight the lives of others, without them having any
real recourse?

I know the law allows this (within reason) but just because it's not
illegal doesn't mean it's right.

Your cat can come into my garden and kill the wild birds (27M a year?)

Effing ell! Your garden must be more than knee deep in bird****. Be
thankful for the cats doing them in.

I feed

and attract rats, thereby introducing diversity into the diet of the
marauding cats.

[1] but if my lurcher

But you don't have one - or you're telling porkies about not having a pet.

gets into you back garden and kills your
cat (equally 'nature' doing it's thing), I'm guessing you would kick
up a big fuss? [2] I'm pretty sure your cat wouldn't differentiate
between a wild sparrow and my budgie

You'd prefer that the cat had racist tendencies?

that I let out for it's afternoon
fly around in my back garden?
Another imaginary pet?
For someone so critical of others, you sure have a slapdash approach to
pet ownership. Perhaps you are one of those who should be legally barred
from owning pets.


https://www.theguardian.com/environm...rotection-tips

Oh, thank **** for the guardian.


If you want a pet, *you* have one, the rest of us don't want it on our
property (thanks).

Not sure about that. There are neighbours who like to have cats
visiting, but don't want the expense of owning one.


I guess this is what happens when you introduce a non-native species
to a country but don't let their natural predators have their way.

Ah! Thanks for the tip. I'll just get on the blower to Assad, the Saudis
and Bob Mugabe.


(Outdoor) cats seem to be the sort of things people get who don't
really want or want the responsibility that should (and does with most
others) typically be part of owning a pet? ;-(

My cat lives indoors and ventures out. The nature reserve still has
loads of birds. The foxes are abundant. Perhaps one day the foxes will
get my cat, but they probably find it easier to eat the treats put out
for the "I don't have a pet, but feed the wild beasties" brigade.


Cheers, T i m

[1] And other animals and don't always eat them.

[2] Especially so if it just mamed it and then tormented it for a few
hours before leaving it injured somewhere to die a slow and lingering
death?

maimed
YVW

"Richard" wrote in message
news
On 01/07/18 00:47, T i m wrote:
On Sat, 30 Jun 2018 23:15:40 +0200 (GMT+02:00), Tim+
wrote:

snip

I'm sure you would like to ensure she is being considerate to her
neighbours and responsible for *her* pet right? ;-)


Let me guess, you're not a cat person?

My comment wasn't really anything to do with being 'a cat / dog
person' (unless being a 'cat person means you become less socially
responsible etc) but to do with what you are happy for your (outdoor?)
pet to be doing when it's not under your direct control?

We don't currently have any pets and so don't expect to find fouling
from any *pets* in our private / sealed back garden.

Therefore, I question the attitude / social responsibility of anyone
who knowingly allows their personal 'companion animal' to roam free
and potentially blight the lives of others, without them having any
real recourse?

I know the law allows this (within reason) but just because it's not
illegal doesn't mean it's right.

Your cat can come into my garden and kill the wild birds (27M a year?)

Effing ell! Your garden must be more than knee deep in bird****. Be
thankful for the cats doing them in.

I feed

and attract rats, thereby introducing diversity into the diet of the
marauding cats.

[1] but if my lurcher

But you don't have one - or you're telling porkies about not having a pet.

gets into you back garden and kills your
cat (equally 'nature' doing it's thing), I'm guessing you would kick
up a big fuss? [2] I'm pretty sure your cat wouldn't differentiate
between a wild sparrow and my budgie

You'd prefer that the cat had racist tendencies?

that I let out for it's afternoon
fly around in my back garden?
Another imaginary pet?
For someone so critical of others, you sure have a slapdash approach to
pet ownership. Perhaps you are one of those who should be legally barred
from owning pets.


https://www.theguardian.com/environm...rotection-tips

Oh, thank **** for the guardian.


If you want a pet, *you* have one, the rest of us don't want it on our
property (thanks).

Not sure about that. There are neighbours who like to have cats visiting,

Yeah, I do, except for the one that tears up one of the trees, wanders down
one of the branches that overhangs the flat metal deck roof and then jumps
from that onto the roof. Fortunately the tree it zooms up is visible from
where I sit most of the time and so I know when its going to jump.

but don't want the expense of owning one.

I dont care about the expense, just welcome the neighbours
cats enjoying my jungle which is vastly better for a cat than
their place. And dont mind them basking on the concrete
slab in the sun in winter either.

I guess this is what happens when you introduce a non-native species
to a country but don't let their natural predators have their way.

Ah! Thanks for the tip. I'll just get on the blower to Assad, the Saudis
and Bob Mugabe.


(Outdoor) cats seem to be the sort of things people get who don't
really want or want the responsibility that should (and does with most
others) typically be part of owning a pet? ;-(

My cat lives indoors and ventures out. The nature reserve still has loads
of birds. The foxes are abundant. Perhaps one day the foxes will get my
cat, but they probably find it easier to eat the treats put out for the "I
don't have a pet, but feed the wild beasties" brigade.

[1] And other animals and don't always eat them.

[2] Especially so if it just mamed it and then tormented it for a few
hours before leaving it injured somewhere to die a slow and lingering
death?

maimed
YVW

On 01/07/2018 00:23, John Rumm wrote:
On 30/06/2018 15:28, Tim Streater wrote:
In article , John
Rumm wrote:

On 30/06/2018 15:06, Brian Gaff wrote:
The only way I've seen this done is by replacing the lower glazing
panel
with something else, looks like some kind of hard plastic on the one I
remember. Then a cat flap was fitted.

In this particular case that is not so easy as the photo shows a door
divided into three full height vertical glass panels. It would be
tricky to fit in a new cross member and not have it look a bit odd.

In our case we put the cat-flap through the wall next to the uPVC door.
The flap itself is on the inside, the other side of it there's a tunnel
to the outside. Cats seem to cope well with that.

+1 did the same here... just fitted the external bezel on the outer wall
and made up a WBP ply tunnel to link the flap and exterior bezel.



No need for a ply tunnel. You just needed one of those proper drills,
like they used on the Covent Garden safe deposit raid. A big Hilti IIRC.

On 01/07/2018 11:28, GB wrote:
On 01/07/2018 00:23, John Rumm wrote:
On 30/06/2018 15:28, Tim Streater wrote:
In article , John
Rumm wrote:

On 30/06/2018 15:06, Brian Gaff wrote:
The only way I've seen this done is by replacing the lower glazing
panel
with something else, looks like some kind of hard plastic on the one I
remember. Then a cat flap was fitted.

In this particular case that is not so easy as the photo shows a
door divided into three full height vertical glass panels. It would
be tricky to fit in a new cross member and not have it look a bit odd.

In our case we put the cat-flap through the wall next to the uPVC door.
The flap itself is on the inside, the other side of it there's a tunnel
to the outside. Cats seem to cope well with that.

+1 did the same here... just fitted the external bezel on the outer
wall and made up a WBP ply tunnel to link the flap and exterior bezel.



No need for a ply tunnel. You just needed one of those proper drills,
like they used on the Covent Garden safe deposit raid. A big Hilti IIRC.


In a cavity wall a "tunnel" stops the cat - and more importantly any
other animals - wandering off.


--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

GB Wrote in message:
On 01/07/2018 00:23, John Rumm wrote:
On 30/06/2018 15:28, Tim Streater wrote:
In article , John
Rumm wrote:

On 30/06/2018 15:06, Brian Gaff wrote:
The only way I've seen this done is by replacing the lower glazing
panel
with something else, looks like some kind of hard plastic on the one I
remember. Then a cat flap was fitted.

In this particular case that is not so easy as the photo shows a door
divided into three full height vertical glass panels. It would be
tricky to fit in a new cross member and not have it look a bit odd.

In our case we put the cat-flap through the wall next to the uPVC door.
The flap itself is on the inside, the other side of it there's a tunnel
to the outside. Cats seem to cope well with that.

+1 did the same here... just fitted the external bezel on the outer wall
and made up a WBP ply tunnel to link the flap and exterior bezel.



No need for a ply tunnel. You just needed one of those proper drills,
like they used on the Covent Garden safe deposit raid. A big Hilti IIRC.


Did that have a cavity then?
--
--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

On 01/07/2018 11:33, Jim K wrote:
GB Wrote in message:
On 01/07/2018 00:23, John Rumm wrote:
On 30/06/2018 15:28, Tim Streater wrote:
In article , John
Rumm wrote:

On 30/06/2018 15:06, Brian Gaff wrote:
The only way I've seen this done is by replacing the lower glazing
panel
with something else, looks like some kind of hard plastic on the one I
remember. Then a cat flap was fitted.

In this particular case that is not so easy as the photo shows a door
divided into three full height vertical glass panels. It would be
tricky to fit in a new cross member and not have it look a bit odd.

In our case we put the cat-flap through the wall next to the uPVC door.
The flap itself is on the inside, the other side of it there's a tunnel
to the outside. Cats seem to cope well with that.

+1 did the same here... just fitted the external bezel on the outer wall
and made up a WBP ply tunnel to link the flap and exterior bezel.



No need for a ply tunnel. You just needed one of those proper drills,
like they used on the Covent Garden safe deposit raid. A big Hilti IIRC.


Did that have a cavity then?



Solid brick walls here unfortunately, but I take your point. I hadn't
thought of the kitty going off into the cavity and getting lost, poor
thing. You can begin to see how we managed to go through 3 or 4 cats in
as many years.

I was just impressed by how smooth the hole bored by the Hilti was.
Nothing to snag the poor kitty's fur at all.

On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 07:14:56 +0100, Richard
wrote:

snip bs

For someone so critical of others,

BS. I am critical of what many would consider social irresponsibility,
be it feral kids, fouling cats, noisy dogs or loud exhausts and
vandalism etc. You can do what the fcuk you like, as long as it
doesn't interfere with the quality of life of anyone else.

you sure have a slapdash approach to
pet ownership.

As usual you are 100% incorrect.

Perhaps you are one of those who should be legally barred
from owning pets.

Oh the irony.


https://www.theguardian.com/environm...rotection-tips

Oh, thank
snip
for the guardian.

I could have posted hundreds of other links all pointing out that this
non native species is decimating the numbers of many native animals.

Are you denying it is an issue (for all of us)?


If you want a pet, *you* have one, the rest of us don't want it on our
property (thanks).

Not sure about that.

I know you aren't, no change there when it comes to what might be
generally considered socially acceptable.

There are neighbours who like to have cats
visiting, but don't want the expense of owning one.

I'm sure there are. Did you have a point?


I guess this is what happens when you introduce a non-native species
to a country but don't let their natural predators have their way.

Ah! Thanks for the tip.

I'm pretty sure you aren't. .

I'll just get on the blower to Assad, the Saudis
and Bob Mugabe.

Why, do they have a better policy on cats?


(Outdoor) cats seem to be the sort of things people get who don't
really want or want the responsibility that should (and does with most
others) typically be part of owning a pet? ;-(

My cat lives indoors and ventures out.

Ah. 'My cat' ... that means you will argue anything you think you can
in order to justify your (anti social) position.

The nature reserve still has
loads of birds.

Stupid ar$e.

The foxes are abundant.

And native to the UK.

Perhaps one day the foxes will
get my cat,

And that would be 'nature' that cat owners typically only accept if
it's one way round.

If my venomous pet snake got out, got into your back garden and killed
your cat, I wonder how quiet you would keep? How 'responsible' would
you consider me? Why is it acceptable for your 'pet' to do that and
not mine (or even just foul in someone else's private garden)?

Is your cat chipped OOI?

but they probably find it easier to eat the treats put out
for the "I don't have a pet, but feed the wild beasties" brigade.

Shrug?

snip

[2] Especially so if it just mamed it and then tormented it for a few
hours before leaving it injured somewhere to die a slow and lingering
death?

maimed

Thanks. I even looked it up on Google but it was late.

Cheers, T i m

p.s. Our daughter is also a part time animal warden and much of the
time she's collecting dogs that have got out and been held by a member
of the public or taken to the vets etc. If the animal isn't chipped
and the owner comes forward they are charged to have the dog chipped
and also charged for the collection (and fined if they are repeat
offenders). If the dog has done any damage along the way the owners
can also be reported to the Police and subsequently charged and
further action taken.

Cats and other wild animals she often has to collect with a shovel.
;-(

On 01/07/2018 11:28, GB wrote:
On 01/07/2018 00:23, John Rumm wrote:
On 30/06/2018 15:28, Tim Streater wrote:
In article , John
Rumm wrote:

On 30/06/2018 15:06, Brian Gaff wrote:
The only way I've seen this done is by replacing the lower glazing
panel
with something else, looks like some kind of hard plastic on the one I
remember. Then a cat flap was fitted.

In this particular case that is not so easy as the photo shows a
door divided into three full height vertical glass panels. It would
be tricky to fit in a new cross member and not have it look a bit odd.

In our case we put the cat-flap through the wall next to the uPVC door.
The flap itself is on the inside, the other side of it there's a tunnel
to the outside. Cats seem to cope well with that.

+1 did the same here... just fitted the external bezel on the outer
wall and made up a WBP ply tunnel to link the flap and exterior bezel.



No need for a ply tunnel. You just needed one of those proper drills,
like they used on the Covent Garden safe deposit raid. A big Hilti IIRC.

The flange on the cat flap requires a rectangular hole ideally...

In fact I started with a round hole that had been core bored with a 4"
core - it was originally a tumble drier vent. I had to SDS chisel it to
re-purpose for the cat.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 01/07/18 11:57, T i m wrote:
On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 07:14:56 +0100, Richard
wrote:

snip bs

For someone so critical of others,

BS. I am critical of what many would consider social irresponsibility,
be it feral kids, fouling cats, noisy dogs or loud exhausts and
vandalism etc. You can do what the fcuk you like, as long as it
doesn't interfere with the quality of life of anyone else.

you sure have a slapdash approach to
pet ownership.

As usual you are 100% incorrect.

Perhaps you are one of those who should be legally barred
from owning pets.

Oh the irony.


https://www.theguardian.com/environm...rotection-tips

Oh, thank
snip
for the guardian.

I could have posted hundreds of other links all pointing out that this
non native species is decimating the numbers of many native animals.

Are you denying it is an issue (for all of us)?


If you want a pet, *you* have one, the rest of us don't want it on our
property (thanks).

Not sure about that.

I know you aren't, no change there when it comes to what might be
generally considered socially acceptable.

There are neighbours who like to have cats
visiting, but don't want the expense of owning one.

I'm sure there are. Did you have a point?

Yep. I provide a free service to people who may want a visiting cat. It
is even there for those who don't yet know that they want a visiting cat.



I guess this is what happens when you introduce a non-native species
to a country but don't let their natural predators have their way.

Ah! Thanks for the tip.

I'm pretty sure you aren't. .

I'll just get on the blower to Assad, the Saudis
and Bob Mugabe.

Why, do they have a better policy on cats?

No, but they know what to do with the non-native species which have
entered the country.



(Outdoor) cats seem to be the sort of things people get who don't
really want or want the responsibility that should (and does with most
others) typically be part of owning a pet? ;-(

My cat lives indoors and ventures out.

Ah. 'My cat' ... that means you will argue anything you think you can
in order to justify your (anti social) position.

The nature reserve still has
loads of birds.

Stupid ar$e.

Erm... you put your sig in too soon.


The foxes are abundant.

And native to the UK.

Perhaps one day the foxes will
get my cat,

And that would be 'nature' that cat owners typically only accept if
it's one way round.

If my venomous pet snake got out, got into your back garden and killed
your cat, I wonder how quiet you would keep? How 'responsible' would
you consider me? Why is it acceptable for your 'pet' to do that and
not mine (or even just foul in someone else's private garden)?

Is your cat chipped OOI?

Yes, my cat is chipped. Is your venomous pet snake? Oh, it'd be another
one of your fantasies.


but they probably find it easier to eat the treats put out
for the "I don't have a pet, but feed the wild beasties" brigade.

Shrug?

snip

[2] Especially so if it just mamed it and then tormented it for a few
hours before leaving it injured somewhere to die a slow and lingering
death?

maimed

Thanks. I even looked it up on Google but it was late.

Some know how to spell, some don't. Please, don't be to scarred by your
shortcomings there. I'll try to be there to correct you.


Cheers, T i m

p.s. Our daughter is also a part time animal warden and much of the
time she's collecting dogs that have got out and been held by a member
of the public or taken to the vets etc. If the animal isn't chipped
and the owner comes forward they are charged to have the dog chipped
and also charged for the collection (and fined if they are repeat
offenders). If the dog has done any damage along the way the owners
can also be reported to the Police and subsequently charged and
further action taken.

Cats and other wild animals she often has to collect with a shovel.

Keeps her off the streets.

On Sun, 01 Jul 2018 15:46:41 +0100, Tim Streater wrote:


+1 did the same here... just fitted the external bezel on the outer
wall and made up a WBP ply tunnel to link the flap and exterior bezel.

No need for a ply tunnel. You just needed one of those proper drills,
like they used on the Covent Garden safe deposit raid. A big Hilti IIRC.


Yes there is. You can use one of those 6" diameter drill bits to get
through the outer brick and the inner breeze block, yes. But then you
have to line it otherwise the cat will be bringing brick dust and ****
indoors, or dropping a live mouse onto the wall insulation you've cut
through. Mousey will then vanish and be perfectly happy.

I've seen people repurpose one of those recesses for boot scrapers. Half
the job is done already!

There was an interesting approach near here. The house had a brick garage
built on the side. Presumably there were wheelie bins or some other
method for the cat to get onto the flat roof of the garage. From there
was a small wooden ramp leading to a cat flap fitted into a first floor
window.



--
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wish to copy them they can pay me £1 a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
*lightning surge protection* - a w_tom conductor

"GB" wrote in message
news
On 01/07/2018 00:23, John Rumm wrote:
On 30/06/2018 15:28, Tim Streater wrote:
In article , John
Rumm wrote:

On 30/06/2018 15:06, Brian Gaff wrote:
The only way I've seen this done is by replacing the lower glazing
panel
with something else, looks like some kind of hard plastic on the one I
remember. Then a cat flap was fitted.

In this particular case that is not so easy as the photo shows a door
divided into three full height vertical glass panels. It would be
tricky to fit in a new cross member and not have it look a bit odd.

In our case we put the cat-flap through the wall next to the uPVC door.
The flap itself is on the inside, the other side of it there's a tunnel
to the outside. Cats seem to cope well with that.

+1 did the same here... just fitted the external bezel on the outer wall
and made up a WBP ply tunnel to link the flap and exterior bezel.



No need for a ply tunnel. You just needed one of those proper drills, like
they used on the Covent Garden safe deposit raid. A big Hilti IIRC.

Depends on how the wall is done. The most stupid
cats would likely end up exploring the cavity and could
get a bit smelly when they can't work out how to get out.

On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 15:42:20 +0100, Richard
wrote:

snip

There are neighbours who like to have cats
visiting, but don't want the expense of owning one.

I'm sure there are. Did you have a point?

Yep. I provide a free service to people who may want a visiting cat.

And what of those who don't? What choice do *they* get?

It
is even there for those who don't yet know that they want a visiting cat.

And for those who know they don't, those trying to grow produce or
have children who like playing on the lawn and not in cat sh1t.

snip

Is your cat chipped OOI?

Yes, my cat is chipped.

Good to hear. We just need portable scanners that you can fit in your
garden and we can get you to come round and clear the sh1t up.

snip

p.s. Our daughter is also a part time animal warden and much of the
time she's collecting dogs that have got out and been held by a member
of the public or taken to the vets etc. If the animal isn't chipped
and the owner comes forward they are charged to have the dog chipped
and also charged for the collection (and fined if they are repeat
offenders). If the dog has done any damage along the way the owners
can also be reported to the Police and subsequently charged and
further action taken.

Cats and other wild animals she often has to collect with a shovel.

Keeps her off the streets.

Well, not quite ... as that's where the flattest of them are often
found.

I am an animal lover and if I'm somewhere where there is a cat it will
often end up on my lap. But because I'm not some old mad cat lady and
actually think a 'companion animal' should just be that, if I had a
pet again it would have to be a dog and would *never* be a cat (even
an indoor one).

Apart from all the negative things re cats, people rarely spend any
time with their 'companion animals' (cats) when away from the home and
for me, that would be very much part of the whole point.

Plus my social responsibility would mean I wouldn't want to inflict my
choice on others (different if it's an indoor cat, you live in the
middle of nowhere or it can't get out of your own grounds).

But this a lack of social responsibility and being 'happy' to
persevere with Brexit knowing 2/3rds of the electorate *didn't* vote
for it seem to go hand in hand. ;-)

Cheers, T i m

In article ,
says...

I'm pretty sure your cat wouldn't differentiate
between a wild sparrow and my budgie that I let out for it's afternoon
fly around in my back garden?


I guess this is what happens when you introduce a non-native species
to a country but don't let their natural predators have their way.


Wouldn't your 'non-native species' budgie be much happier
flying freely around in its own habitat rather than being
imprisoned in a cage in a foreign country for most of its
life?

--

Terry

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 17:06:20 +0100, Terry Casey
wrote:

In article ,
says...

I'm pretty sure your cat wouldn't differentiate
between a wild sparrow and my budgie that I let out for it's afternoon
fly around in my back garden?


I guess this is what happens when you introduce a non-native species
to a country but don't let their natural predators have their way.


Wouldn't your 'non-native species' budgie be much happier
flying freely around in its own habitat rather than being
imprisoned in a cage in a foreign country for most of its
life?

It would, but being caged, fed and watered is still 'better' than
being mauled to death by a cat over several hours?

FWIW, I don't support the keeping of things like birds in small cages
(especially indoors) either. Owning a bird of prey (working a lure or
deterring feral pigeons) or racing pigeon would at least mean they
could be allowed to do what they naturally do for some proportion of
their lives.

We don't currently have a dog (we did have 3 at one point, all rescue
animals) because I don't feel we could give one what it would need.

We could have a cat ... and just let it out to roam the neighbourhood
all day but what would be the point of that? It's not that we live on
a farm and need any rodents kept under control and would rather
protect rather than kill any other wildlife we have out there, whilst
we still have it. ;-(

'Man's best friend is a dog' and not much else compares.

They make such good companion animals because they have lived with and
worked for us for millions of years and so now rely on us (and us
them) for lots of practical things.

I guess when they can train a cat to sniff out drugs or do mountain
rescue, I'd consider one as a companion animal (or when I'm old and
infirm, maybe I'd succumb (but I doubt it)). ;-)

Cheers, T i m

On 01/07/18 16:48, T i m wrote:
On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 15:42:20 +0100, Richard
wrote:

snip

There are neighbours who like to have cats
visiting, but don't want the expense of owning one.

I'm sure there are. Did you have a point?

Yep. I provide a free service to people who may want a visiting cat.

And what of those who don't? What choice do *they* get?

It
is even there for those who don't yet know that they want a visiting cat.

And for those who know they don't, those trying to grow produce or
have children who like playing on the lawn and not in cat sh1t.

snip

Is your cat chipped OOI?

Yes, my cat is chipped.

Good to hear. We just need portable scanners that you can fit in your
garden and we can get you to come round and clear the sh1t up.

Why would I want a scanner in my garden? Anyway, I very much doubt that
my cat ****s in your garden. He is very discriminating.

snip

p.s. Our daughter is also a part time animal warden and much of the
time she's collecting dogs that have got out and been held by a member
of the public or taken to the vets etc. If the animal isn't chipped
and the owner comes forward they are charged to have the dog chipped
and also charged for the collection (and fined if they are repeat
offenders). If the dog has done any damage along the way the owners
can also be reported to the Police and subsequently charged and
further action taken.

Cats and other wild animals she often has to collect with a shovel.

Keeps her off the streets.

Well, not quite ... as that's where the flattest of them are often
found.

I am an animal lover and if I'm somewhere where there is a cat it will
often end up on my lap. But because I'm not some old mad cat lady and
actually think a 'companion animal' should just be that, if I had a
pet again it would have to be a dog and would *never* be a cat (even
an indoor one).

Oh. You deprived your daughter the joys of pet ownership so she now
roams the area looking for strays to pet and flatpack cat kits. Have you
no sense of shame?


Apart from all the negative things re cats, people rarely spend any
time with their 'companion animals' (cats) when away from the home and
for me, that would be very much part of the whole point.

Plus my social responsibility would mean I wouldn't want to inflict my
choice on others (different if it's an indoor cat, you live in the
middle of nowhere or it can't get out of your own grounds).

But this a lack of social responsibility and being 'happy' to
persevere with Brexit knowing 2/3rds of the electorate *didn't* vote
for it seem to go hand in hand. ;-)

Gotta bring Brexit into it. Shame you didn't have a stake in that.

On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 19:12:59 +0100, Richard
wrote:

snip

Good to hear. We just need portable scanners that you can fit in your
garden and we can get you to come round and clear the sh1t up.

Why would I want a scanner in my garden?

You left brainers have a difficulty with hypothetical scenarios don't
you?

Anyway, I very much doubt that
my cat ****s in your garden.

So do I?

He is very discriminating.

The chances are that's BS.

snip

I am an animal lover and if I'm somewhere where there is a cat it will
often end up on my lap. But because I'm not some old mad cat lady and
actually think a 'companion animal' should just be that, if I had a
pet again it would have to be a dog and would *never* be a cat (even
an indoor one).

Oh. You deprived your daughter the joys of pet ownership

Nope (can you not get anything right)? She has a miniature hamster
(rescue) in a very large home her room and the rabbits (also rescue)
round my Mums in her back garden.

so she now
roams the area looking for strays to pet and flatpack cat kits.

Not roams, when on call, responds to calls from the call centre.

Have you
no sense of shame?

I have a range of senses you couldn't even start to comprehend (you
being a left brainer n all). ;-(

snip

But this a lack of social responsibility and being 'happy' to
persevere with Brexit knowing 2/3rds of the electorate *didn't* vote
for it seem to go hand in hand. ;-)

Gotta bring Brexit into it.

Brexit is / will impact nearly everything we do so it's hard not to.

Shame you didn't have a stake in that.

Not really. See, if you have a stake in something that you voted on
but without knowing much about (as in final outcome and their
consequences) you would realise that being 'complicit' to such a scam
isn't something to be proud of.

Given you don't understand what that actually means it's not
surprising you say what you do. ;-(

Dick: "Yeah, I voted we all went on strike and they had to pay us more
money"!

Right Brainer: "Yeah, but didn't the factory close down soon after and
aren't you still on the dole?"

Dick: "Yeah, but we showed em ... "

Right Brainer: "But that means I'm working to pay your dole?"

Dick: "No, it comes from the government ... we showed em ... "

Cheers, T i m

On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 17:21:28 +1000, cantankerous geezer Rot Speed blabbered,
again:

FLUSH

I don¢t care about the expense,

FLUSH latest troll

Hardly anyone remained who still falls for you antics, eh, lonely troll? LOL

--
pamela about Rot Speed:
"His off the cuff expertise demonstrates how little he knows..."
MID:

On 01/07/18 17:30, T i m wrote:
On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 17:06:20 +0100, Terry Casey
wrote:

In article ,
says...

I'm pretty sure your cat wouldn't differentiate
between a wild sparrow and my budgie that I let out for it's afternoon
fly around in my back garden?


I guess this is what happens when you introduce a non-native species
to a country but don't let their natural predators have their way.


Wouldn't your 'non-native species' budgie be much happier
flying freely around in its own habitat rather than being
imprisoned in a cage in a foreign country for most of its
life?

It would, but being caged, fed and watered is still 'better' than
being mauled to death by a cat over several hours?

FWIW, I don't support the keeping of things like birds in small cages
(especially indoors) either. Owning a bird of prey (working a lure or
deterring feral pigeons) or racing pigeon would at least mean they
could be allowed to do what they naturally do for some proportion of
their lives.

We don't currently have a dog (we did have 3 at one point, all rescue
animals) because I don't feel we could give one what it would need.

We could have a cat ... and just let it out to roam the neighbourhood
all day but what would be the point of that? It's not that we live on
a farm and need any rodents kept under control and would rather
protect rather than kill any other wildlife we have out there, whilst
we still have it. ;-(

'Man's best friend is a dog' and not much else compares.

They make such good companion animals because they have lived with and
worked for us for millions of years and so now rely on us (and us
them) for lots of practical things.

I guess when they can train a cat to sniff out drugs or do mountain
rescue, I'd consider one as a companion animal (or when I'm old and
infirm, maybe I'd succumb (but I doubt it)). ;-)

Spelling again.
suck cum
YVW

On 01/07/18 20:15, T i m wrote:
On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 19:12:59 +0100, Richard
wrote:

snip

Good to hear. We just need portable scanners that you can fit in your
garden and we can get you to come round and clear the sh1t up.

Why would I want a scanner in my garden?

You left brainers have a difficulty with hypothetical scenarios don't
you?


Obsessed with not using your whole brain. Probably find that there is a
link between that and the inability to cast a vote.

On Mon, 2 Jul 2018 07:21:55 +0100, Richard
wrote:

On 01/07/18 20:15, T i m wrote:
On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 19:12:59 +0100, Richard
wrote:

snip

Good to hear. We just need portable scanners that you can fit in your
garden and we can get you to come round and clear the sh1t up.

Why would I want a scanner in my garden?

You left brainers have a difficulty with hypothetical scenarios don't
you?


Obsessed with not using your whole brain.

Isn't it a shame you still have no idea about brain lateralisation
Dicky. ;-(

Probably find that there is a
link between that and the inability to cast a vote.

Absolutely.

I'm sure a large proportion of those who didn't offer their reply to
the EU referendum poll did so because they didn't have enough
information to make an informed decision. They would more likely to be
right brainers as they typically need to see the bigger picture
(something none of us have re the final deal).

Left brainers are much more focused and therefore more likely to be,
or appear to be fanatics, latching onto one path and not being swayed
from it, no matter what further information they gain.

YVW

Cheers, T i m

On 02/07/18 09:18, T i m wrote:
On Mon, 2 Jul 2018 07:21:55 +0100, Richard
wrote:

On 01/07/18 20:15, T i m wrote:
On Sun, 1 Jul 2018 19:12:59 +0100, Richard
wrote:

snip

Good to hear. We just need portable scanners that you can fit in your
garden and we can get you to come round and clear the sh1t up.

Why would I want a scanner in my garden?

You left brainers have a difficulty with hypothetical scenarios don't
you?


Obsessed with not using your whole brain.

Isn't it a shame you still have no idea about brain lateralisation
Dicky. ;-(

Probably find that there is a
link between that and the inability to cast a vote.

Absolutely.

I'm sure a large proportion of those who didn't offer their reply to
the EU referendum poll did so because they didn't have enough
information to make an informed decision. They would more likely to be
right brainers as they typically need to see the bigger picture
(something none of us have re the final deal).

Left brainers are much more focused and therefore more likely to be,
or appear to be fanatics, latching onto one path and not being swayed
from it, no matter what further information they gain.

Thanks for the insight. There is one bloke in this group who has
fanatically latched onto the path that his inability to cast a vote is
the right thing to do. 'nother ****ing left brainer. I'll just stick to
being a whiole brainer thanks.

On Mon, 2 Jul 2018 07:05:57 +0100, Richard
wrote:

snip

I guess when they can train a cat to sniff out drugs or do mountain
rescue, I'd consider one as a companion animal (or when I'm old and
infirm, maybe I'd succumb (but I doubt it)). ;-)

Spelling again.
suck cum

Whilst I'm very grateful for your proof reading of all my posts
considering this is a 'discussion' not 'spelling' group, I think it
might be more appropriate if you made a bit more of an effort re
discussing the points (no matter how imaginative and hilarious your
efforts).

HTH?

Like ... can you explain why you (potentially) have no concern what
your cat might be doing whilst not under your supervision?

Is it *just* because you DGAF about anyone else (which is exactly how
I consider you) and how you might react if someone say regularly let
their dog sh1te all over your front garden (and not clear it up) or
climb on your car (scratching the paintwork) etc?

If I came round your house informing you that your cat climbed in
though our downstairs toilet window, fell into our toilet and then
scratched up our wallpaper in it's panicked efforts to get out and
that you owed us the cost of having that repaired, would you pay up?

If my dog had got hold of your cat (on our property) and caused
damage, requiring an expensive vets bill, would you expect me to pay
for it?

How much to you actually care for your cat. How much (/little) to you
care about those who live around you?

Cheers, T i m

On Mon, 2 Jul 2018 09:37:03 +0100, Richard
wrote:

snip

Thanks for the insight.

YVW

There is one bloke in this group who has
fanatically latched onto the path that his inability to cast a vote is
the right thing to do.

Oh, a 'rational person' you mean ... who wouldn't be bullied / scammed
into answering a poll before all the facts were known?

Ere, you didn't vote did you, you 'gambled' as you (and the 2/3rds of
the electorate who answered the poll), 2 years later on still have NO
IDEA what you vote is actually going to represent (in detail, maybe in
name and that could be fine for you because you are just on a crusade
and don't actually care if any final outcome is better for us or not).

But that's ok, you don't have to be embarrassed, you probably
*thought* you were doing a good thing.

snip

I'll just stick to
being a whiole brainer thanks.

'whole' (but there is no such thing).

YVW

Cheers, T i m

On 02/07/18 09:37, T i m wrote:
On Mon, 2 Jul 2018 07:05:57 +0100, Richard
wrote:


snip

Like ... can you explain why you (potentially) have no concern what
your cat might be doing whilst not under your supervision?

Unlike you, I'm not a control freak.


Is it *just* because you DGAF about anyone else (which is exactly how
I consider you) and how you might react if someone say regularly let
their dog sh1te all over your front garden (and not clear it up) or
climb on your car (scratching the paintwork) etc?

If I came round your house informing you that your cat climbed in
though our downstairs toilet window, fell into our toilet and then
scratched up our wallpaper in it's panicked efforts to get out and
that you owed us the cost of having that repaired, would you pay up?

If you could prove it, yes.


If my dog had got hold of your cat (on our property) and caused
damage, requiring an expensive vets bill, would you expect me to pay
for it?

How many times do you need to be told. You don't have a dog. I strongly
suggest you seek therapy for this imaginary man's best friend you have.


How much to you actually care for your cat. How much (/little) to you
care about those who live around you?

I care a lot about my cat. His vet bills are not on the NHS and he gets
fed very well. I ensure he is indoors at night - don't particularly want
him to be fox food. Having taken him for walks in the nature reserve, he
does tend to take a dump there. Before you scream about the cat fouling
the area, there are cattle in there at present and dog owners take their
dogs in - despite there being a sign asking them not to. But that's
considerate dog owners for you. You know the type. Bag up the dog ****
and hang it from trees. There was one individual who I actually saw
doing just that and since being confronted, there has been no recurrence.

The neighbours can do their own shopping etc.

On 02/07/2018 13:09, Richard wrote:
Bag up the dog ****
and hang it from trees. There was one individual who I actually saw
doing just that and since being confronted, there has been no recurrence.

Did he explain why he did it? I've never understood why.

On Mon, 02 Jul 2018 13:22:32 +0100, GB wrote:

On 02/07/2018 13:09, Richard wrote:
Bag up the dog **** and hang it from trees. There was one individual
who I actually saw doing just that and since being confronted, there
has been no recurrence.

Did he explain why he did it? I've never understood why.

Sorts out the cyclists using the paths in the park.

--
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