On Saturday, October 21, 2017 at 12:32:59 AM UTC-4, Rudy Canoza wrote:




I am certain the majority of people who follow this group make the wrong
decision on make-or-buy.

"If you did not make it yourself, it really isn't yours."

Dan

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 08:17:44 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
.. .
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 07:21:19 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

...
Or spending a great deal of money to catch a few fish.

That's why I use my SB lathe to build my own fishing rods.

A $1,000 investment and ten or twenty hours of work will save you
$200. Such a deal!

--
Ed Huntress

After using small home made tools to solve the immediate problem I
cleaned them up to look nice and took them to job interviews. I think
they got me into Segway.

-jsw


See, you're one of those guys (like some others here) who have one
foot in metalworking as part of your vocation, and the other foot in
metalworking as an avocation. That's a good deal -- "Have more fun at
work."

I got a bit of that when I was editing metalworking magazines. I'd
study something for an article, and sometimes I'd get to try it at
home, for fun.

For example, when I was trying to get a handle on filler metals for
welding 4130 and got to beat the crap out of this piece of tube:

http://magazine.fsmdirect.com/2016/sept/d/#page10

--
Ed Huntress

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 07:21:19 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
. ..
On Fri, 20 Oct 2017 21:32:55 -0700, Rudy Canoza

wrote:

On 10/20/2017 8:03 AM, Neon John wrote:
On Sun, 15 Oct 2017 11:09:46 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:


I am trying to collect material and ideas in order to make a
mini
backhoe. I may never make one, but I am proceeding on the
grounds that I will.

Why don't you just buy a mini-backhoe?

I am certain the majority of people who follow this group make the
wrong
decision on make-or-buy.

If this was a home economics NG, you would be right. But this is
nominally a recreational metalworking NG, and making wrong
economic
decisions is our raison d'être. d8-)

Making things when it makes no economic sense to do so, and
keeping
ridiculous old junk alive by fixing and making spare parts for it,
is
our equivalent of camping in a tent when you have a perfectly good
house to sleep in.

--
Ed Huntress

Or spending a great deal of money to catch a few fish.

That's why I use my SB lathe to build my own fishing rods.

A $1,000 investment and ten or twenty hours of work will save you
$200. Such a deal!

--
Ed Huntress

A co-worker got himself promoted by showing off his progress on a very
nice fly casting reel he was making at home.

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 08:28:04 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
.. .
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 07:21:19 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 20 Oct 2017 21:32:55 -0700, Rudy Canoza

wrote:

On 10/20/2017 8:03 AM, Neon John wrote:
On Sun, 15 Oct 2017 11:09:46 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:


I am trying to collect material and ideas in order to make a
mini
backhoe. I may never make one, but I am proceeding on the
grounds that I will.

Why don't you just buy a mini-backhoe?

I am certain the majority of people who follow this group make the
wrong
decision on make-or-buy.

If this was a home economics NG, you would be right. But this is
nominally a recreational metalworking NG, and making wrong
economic
decisions is our raison d'être. d8-)

Making things when it makes no economic sense to do so, and
keeping
ridiculous old junk alive by fixing and making spare parts for it,
is
our equivalent of camping in a tent when you have a perfectly good
house to sleep in.

--
Ed Huntress

Or spending a great deal of money to catch a few fish.

That's why I use my SB lathe to build my own fishing rods.

A $1,000 investment and ten or twenty hours of work will save you
$200. Such a deal!

--
Ed Huntress

A co-worker got himself promoted by showing off his progress on a very
nice fly casting reel he was making at home.

They can be more difficult than they look. I started one around 20
years ago and still have the parts. It was for salt water fly fishing
and I wanted a drag and a crank multiplier. I made it too complex.
Maybe I'll try again.

--
Ed Huntress

wrote in message
...
On Saturday, October 21, 2017 at 12:32:59 AM UTC-4, Rudy Canoza
wrote:




I am certain the majority of people who follow this group make the
wrong
decision on make-or-buy.

"If you did not make it yourself, it really isn't yours."

Dan

I would expand that to it isn't really mine unless I can fix it
myself. The frequent griping I hear from people who are dependent on
repair shops only reinforces that. I deflect them by claiming I need
the factory shop manuals which I bought with my cars.

Recently working on snow plows has reminded me of the knowledge gap
modern technology has created. Electrical schematics are as readable
as street signs to me but alien hieroglyphics to the plow owner.
http://pospert.org/wiring-diagram-fo...ern-snow-plow/

-jsw

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 09:15:07 -0400
"Jim Wilkins" wrote:

snip
Recently working on snow plows has reminded me of the knowledge gap
modern technology has created. Electrical schematics are as readable
as street signs to me but alien hieroglyphics to the plow owner.
http://pospert.org/wiring-diagram-fo...ern-snow-plow/

I went on a service call once, in a different lifetime...

For a GM plant, 70 mi drive one way. Problem, printer doesn't
work. Powers up okay but won't print anything. We were GE repair for
much of the western portion of the state.

As I was coming into the open office area and still 20 feet away I
could see the RS232 cable for the printer disconnected and on the
floor. That's all it was. Plugged the cable back in and they were
printing again. The department was labeled as engineering too

Some of us see problems readily. Others just see equipment that doesn't
work...

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

On Fri, 20 Oct 2017 11:03:04 -0400, Neon John wrote:

On Sun, 15 Oct 2017 11:09:46 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:


I am trying to collect material and ideas in order to make a mini backhoe. I may never make one, but I am proceeding on the grounds that I will.

Why don't you just buy a mini-backhoe? Either HF or Northern sells a
very nice one. A friend has one. I've borrowed it several times.

They're near $3k, while scrounging parts and building your own might
cost you a grand. Many of us are not well funded for our toy
departments.


Nice. It has a trailer hitch so you just tow it to the job.

That's illegal. They're not road licenseable in the USA.
The fine print on the site says "Not for use on highways or public
roads." Many cops would likely let it go, but the sticklers would
know they're not roadable and ticket you, possibly impounding it.
Caveat tow-er.

--
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to
succeed is more important than any one thing.
-- Abraham Lincoln

On Fri, 20 Oct 2017 23:42:21 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 20 Oct 2017 14:54:31 -0700 (PDT), Christopher Tidy
wrote:

Am Freitag, 20. Oktober 2017 17:03:11 UTC+2 schrieb Neon John:

Why don't you just buy a mini-backhoe?

Because it isn't as much fun? :-)
Generally when you buy one (chinese) from HF you get to "build" it
anyway.

Yeah, Griz, HF, Northern are all parts kits and you fit and finish
them, cleaning away cosmoline/goop, lubing, torquing, etc.


It's just a semi-finished kit shipped semi-assembled. You take
it apart and use your lathe, mill, and welders to make it what it
should have been - a fully functional machine - - -

Ayup, but they still cost at least $2k more than DIY, and DIY can be
built heavier-duty at little extra cost. It's scrap.

--
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to
succeed is more important than any one thing.
-- Abraham Lincoln

Leon Fisk wrote:
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 09:15:07 -0400
"Jim Wilkins" wrote:

snip
Recently working on snow plows has reminded me of the knowledge gap
modern technology has created. Electrical schematics are as readable
as street signs to me but alien hieroglyphics to the plow owner.
http://pospert.org/wiring-diagram-fo...ern-snow-plow/

I went on a service call once, in a different lifetime...

For a GM plant, 70 mi drive one way. Problem, printer doesn't
work. Powers up okay but won't print anything. We were GE repair for
much of the western portion of the state.

As I was coming into the open office area and still 20 feet away I
could see the RS232 cable for the printer disconnected and on the
floor. That's all it was. Plugged the cable back in and they were
printing again. The department was labeled as engineering too

Some of us see problems readily. Others just see equipment that doesn't
work...


I couldn't use my networked LASER printer after a brief power
outage. The damned thing had changed it's address on the network when it
rebooted. It had been through dozens of power outages, but that time it
incremented its address by one digit.

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 07:18:36 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Christopher Tidy" wrote in message
...
Am Samstag, 21. Oktober 2017 06:32:59 UTC+2 schrieb Rudy Canoza:

I am certain the majority of people who follow this group make the
wrong
decision on make-or-buy.

There aren't universal right and wrong decisions here. It depends on
the person, tools available, interest and time. Lately I built two
workbenches and a vice (vise, if you're American) myself. This was
better for me, because the end products were exactly what I needed and
it was fun. But someone else might have preferred to buy them.

=============

I faced the build-or-buy decision continually as a builder and
sometimes designer of industrial test equipment for new products.
Sometims the best choice was a split, such as contracting for the
refrigeration but building the heaters and controls for temperature
cycling chambers.

You operated on a much higher level than I, but the concept was the
same. I look at something and decide whether or not to build based on
cost, features, precision, and need. For things like the 0-30v 0-5a
bench supply, I figured I couldn't even source the parts for $46, and
it would take days to build, so that was an easy decision.


If the schedule permitted I'd attempt some new task like brazing
copper tubing at least once to better understand its potentials and
limitations. That's how I got into machining and welding and sheet
metal fab; I never intended to do them for a living, only better
understand how to employ them efficiently. The time was an educational
expense, just like the chemistry lab work we practiced but would
likely have an assistant for later.

I found that I really enjoyed imagining some new mechanism and then
creating it, sometimes more than using it. After the one flight lesson
I took the instructor, an aerospace engineer, told me that students
divide into those who enjoy building planes and those who only want to
fly them. I'm definitely on the builder side.

Ditto here. I've always wanted to know exactly how things work, and
disassembling/reassembling them or building them from scratch after
reading books/hitting Google was the best way. I think I enjoy the
research almost as much as the building and using of anything. And
after that, the information is mine to use again down the road.

I see how six different mfgrs build their gadgets, then I take the
best of the lot and assemble something with all the bells and whistles
I prefer, or build two, with different features on each. If I've
never seen the tool I need to do something, I'll design and build it,
then rebuild it during the first tests to make it better for (this
and) the next time.

Most of us here on RCM are Makers; tool-users to the Nth degree. It's
the only way to live.

--
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to
succeed is more important than any one thing.
-- Abraham Lincoln

Larry Jaques wrote:

I see how six different mfgrs build their gadgets, then I take the
best of the lot and assemble something with all the bells and whistles
I prefer, or build two, with different features on each.


Leave it to you to try to put a bell on a weasel! ;-)

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 08:10:43 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Christopher Tidy" wrote in message
...
Am Samstag, 21. Oktober 2017 06:32:59 UTC+2 schrieb Rudy Canoza:

I am certain the majority of people who follow this group make the
wrong
decision on make-or-buy.

There aren't universal right and wrong decisions here. It depends on
the person, tools available, interest and time. Lately I built two
workbenches and a vice (vise, if you're American) myself. This was
better for me, because the end products were exactly what I needed and
it was fun. But someone else might have preferred to buy them.
====================

I can build things that aren't commercially available, like the variac
battery charging power supplies that are economically practical only
with cheap flea market parts, or the hydraulic front-end loader for my
Sears garden tractor. It fit my need to clear snow to the upwind side
of my yard although the tractor is too small and light to excavate
soil.

I'll bet it could haul 10-15 gals of soil vs you having to tote it,
but you might have do dig it up first. It would still help in the
labor department, I'm sure. Have you tried fitting weights to the
back and stiffening the bucket base, or is it everything which is too
light for dirt work, not having been designed for it?


The sawmill was harder to justify versus buying one. I was looking at
Wood-Mizer and its competition until a neighbor parted out a crashed
motorcycle whose wheels were nearly perfect for a homebrew bandsaw

Very cool.


mill and I found a cheap heap of surplus pallet rack channel iron to
use for the tracks and frame.

And I'll bet it works as well as a $25k saw, too.

--
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to
succeed is more important than any one thing.
-- Abraham Lincoln

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 07:21:19 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
.. .
On Fri, 20 Oct 2017 21:32:55 -0700, Rudy Canoza

wrote:

On 10/20/2017 8:03 AM, Neon John wrote:
On Sun, 15 Oct 2017 11:09:46 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:


I am trying to collect material and ideas in order to make a mini
backhoe. I may never make one, but I am proceeding on the
grounds that I will.

Why don't you just buy a mini-backhoe?

I am certain the majority of people who follow this group make the
wrong
decision on make-or-buy.

If this was a home economics NG, you would be right. But this is
nominally a recreational metalworking NG, and making wrong economic
decisions is our raison d'être. d8-)

Making things when it makes no economic sense to do so, and keeping
ridiculous old junk alive by fixing and making spare parts for it,
is
our equivalent of camping in a tent when you have a perfectly good
house to sleep in.

--
Ed Huntress

Or spending a great deal of money to catch a few fish.

Over on the Wreck (rec.woodworking) we used to kid each other about
buying a $2,500 sliding table saw to build a $40 end table, etc. But
it's not about that. We's all tool users. Arr, arr, arr.

--
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to
succeed is more important than any one thing.
-- Abraham Lincoln

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 09:15:07 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

wrote in message
...
On Saturday, October 21, 2017 at 12:32:59 AM UTC-4, Rudy Canoza
wrote:




I am certain the majority of people who follow this group make the
wrong
decision on make-or-buy.

"If you did not make it yourself, it really isn't yours."

Dan

I would expand that to it isn't really mine unless I can fix it
myself. The frequent griping I hear from people who are dependent on
repair shops only reinforces that. I deflect them by claiming I need
the factory shop manuals which I bought with my cars.

Ditto. And I ask them how much the shop charges, tell them that I'd
ask for the same pay, except that I don't have the manuals for it.
So solly.


Recently working on snow plows has reminded me of the knowledge gap
modern technology has created. Electrical schematics are as readable
as street signs to me but alien hieroglyphics to the plow owner.
http://pospert.org/wiring-diagram-fo...ern-snow-plow/

Yeah, simple as a road map.

I've always like that, and made it my life's work. As an auto
mechanic, troubleshooter, computer repairman/builder, handyman, and
whatever. I fixed my sister's SodaStream last week, siliconed her
home windows so they would slide, repaired jewelry, and tracked down a
cracked elbow in her back yard irrigation piping.

What we're heading for in America is an entire population who doesn't
know how to redirect the spring in a pair of pliers, let alone sharpen
anything, repair electronics, connect plug-'n-play electronics
devices, etc. Whoever imports the repairmen will own us.

--
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to
succeed is more important than any one thing.
-- Abraham Lincoln

On Saturday, October 21, 2017 at 11:08:51 AM UTC-4, Larry Jaques wrote:


Nice. It has a trailer hitch so you just tow it to the job.

That's illegal. They're not road licenseable in the USA.
The fine print on the site says "Not for use on highways or public
roads." Many cops would likely let it go, but the sticklers would
know they're not roadable and ticket you, possibly impounding it.
Caveat tow-er.


Do you have any idea why they can not be licensed?

I can think of two possible reasons. One is they have no brake and running licenses. The second is that the tires are not rated for highway use.

Dan

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 07:18:36 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:


You operated on a much higher level than I, but the concept was the
same. I look at something and decide whether or not to build based
on
cost, features, precision, and need. For things like the 0-30v 0-5a
bench supply, I figured I couldn't even source the parts for $46,
and
it would take days to build, so that was an easy decision.
...

I built them as separate raw supplies and regulators, sized by what I
had available instead of trying to match the transformer's and
regulator's voltages and currents. The variac-adjusted raw supplies
will charge batteries and reform electrolytic caps by themselves and
the regulators can operate from my solar panels.

So far I'm impressed with this:
https://www.amazon.com/uniquegoods-S.../dp/B01N3YSE6S

My LM317 and LM350 metered linear regulators are good sizes for
periodically topping up or equalizing batteries.

-jsw

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 09:40:10 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Saturday, October 21, 2017 at 11:08:51 AM UTC-4, Larry Jaques wrote:


Nice. It has a trailer hitch so you just tow it to the job.

That's illegal. They're not road licenseable in the USA.
The fine print on the site says "Not for use on highways or public
roads." Many cops would likely let it go, but the sticklers would
know they're not roadable and ticket you, possibly impounding it.
Caveat tow-er.


Do you have any idea why they can not be licensed?

I can think of two possible reasons. One is they have no brake and running licenses. The second is that the tires are not rated for highway use.

Dan
I don't know about trailerable backhoes but log splitters can be
licensed in WA State. I called the Wa State Patrol about towing my log
splitter and they said it needs a license plate and is considered to
be a trailer. I asked why I see so many being towed without plates and
was told that they are illegal but almost nobody gets pulled over for
towing a log splitter. The tires on some splitters are rated for only
45 mph, I think the ones on my splitter are like this. So freeway
driving is probably not a good idea unless the tires are changed. I
bet I could get a plate for a trailerable backhoe here. The log
splitters I have seen towed didn't have lights and I think this may be
OK because the splitter doesn't obscure the towing vehicle's lights.
If the fine print does indeed say "for off road use only" it may be
just like you said. The thing is missing things needed to be driven on
public roads, like lights and a license plate. Who cares what someone
says on usenet? Call your local agency and find out first hand.
Eric

"Leon Fisk" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 09:15:07 -0400
"Jim Wilkins" wrote:

snip
Recently working on snow plows has reminded me of the knowledge gap
modern technology has created. Electrical schematics are as readable
as street signs to me but alien hieroglyphics to the plow owner.
http://pospert.org/wiring-diagram-fo...ern-snow-plow/

I went on a service call once, in a different lifetime...

For a GM plant, 70 mi drive one way. Problem, printer doesn't
work. Powers up okay but won't print anything. We were GE repair for
much of the western portion of the state.

As I was coming into the open office area and still 20 feet away I
could see the RS232 cable for the printer disconnected and on the
floor. That's all it was. Plugged the cable back in and they were
printing again. The department was labeled as engineering too

Some of us see problems readily. Others just see equipment that
doesn't
work...

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email


I wonder if it was simpler to call you than to get their union
electrician to come and plug in the cord. Someone may have quietly
kicked the plug out where you would see it.

GM paid to fly me first class from NH to Flint MI to turn the range
knob on a signal generator down one click. .

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 16:03:02 -0400
"Jim Wilkins" wrote:

snip
I wonder if it was simpler to call you than to get their union
electrician to come and plug in the cord. Someone may have quietly
kicked the plug out where you would see it.

One never knew for sure with those calls. We held a service contract
via GE for them. In theory they should have been billed but we were a
small shop and I doubt if they were. And yes, union stuff was a pain.

My feeling was they were just "too big to care". Call for service, let
them sort it out.

GM paid to fly me first class from NH to Flint MI to turn the range
knob on a signal generator down one click. .

Hmm... we could swap old repair fiascoes for quite some time ;-)

My point though... was just that some of us "see" stuff that isn't
right and other's don't, no matter how long they look.

I'm good with mechanical, electronic, electrical... stuff but not worth
a toot with language or grammar. My eye will blow right past improper
tense, homonyms, misspellings...

Probably why I don't get anything out of poetry, other than somebody
like Ogden Nash.

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 12:21:17 -0400, Michael A Terrell
wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:

I see how six different mfgrs build their gadgets, then I take the
best of the lot and assemble something with all the bells and whistles
I prefer, or build two, with different features on each.


Leave it to you to try to put a bell on a weasel! ;-)

I wish all speaking weasels (attorneys and politicians) had bells on.
BTW, you're thpeaking with a lithp thinth you came back from the
thelter. Get it looked at, eh?

--
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to
succeed is more important than any one thing.
-- Abraham Lincoln

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 13:05:38 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
.. .
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 07:18:36 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:


You operated on a much higher level than I, but the concept was the
same. I look at something and decide whether or not to build based
on
cost, features, precision, and need. For things like the 0-30v 0-5a
bench supply, I figured I couldn't even source the parts for $46,
and
it would take days to build, so that was an easy decision.
...

I built them as separate raw supplies and regulators, sized by what I
had available instead of trying to match the transformer's and
regulator's voltages and currents. The variac-adjusted raw supplies
will charge batteries and reform electrolytic caps by themselves and
the regulators can operate from my solar panels.

So far I'm impressed with this:
https://www.amazon.com/uniquegoods-S.../dp/B01N3YSE6S

Yeah, that's probably good for 7A. Teensy!

I ended up with a QW MS305D http://tinyurl.com/y8kdn2gt which works
alright.


My LM317 and LM350 metered linear regulators are good sizes for
periodically topping up or equalizing batteries.

And you don't even need a bench!

--
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to
succeed is more important than any one thing.
-- Abraham Lincoln

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 16:03:02 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Leon Fisk" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 09:15:07 -0400
"Jim Wilkins" wrote:

snip
Recently working on snow plows has reminded me of the knowledge gap
modern technology has created. Electrical schematics are as readable
as street signs to me but alien hieroglyphics to the plow owner.
http://pospert.org/wiring-diagram-fo...ern-snow-plow/

I went on a service call once, in a different lifetime...

For a GM plant, 70 mi drive one way. Problem, printer doesn't
work. Powers up okay but won't print anything. We were GE repair for
much of the western portion of the state.

As I was coming into the open office area and still 20 feet away I
could see the RS232 cable for the printer disconnected and on the
floor. That's all it was. Plugged the cable back in and they were
printing again. The department was labeled as engineering too

I've had 3 of those since opening my company in '91. 2 unplugs and 1
monitor unplugged from the computer which had the strange female plug
on the end. I always took pains to make it look more dire than it
was, then "fix it" for them so they wouldn't feel too bad about it.
Had they brought the computer to me, I would have told them the
problem, but when I went on a house call, I always charged. So I'd
optimize things while I was there instead of just plugging in,
charging my full fee, and leaving.

Getting computers working made me some good money in Oceanside, CA,
too. Fresh Boots from the USMC would invariably use WordPerfect to
edit their AUTOEXEC.BAT and CONFIG.SYS files back in the days of DOS.
I'd pull up, insert my special 5-1/4" floppy disc and have the box up
and running in no time. It had a copy of Norton Editor and NoteTabPro
('96 on) on it, so I could use either to fix the .wp save that
WordImperfect had heavied down on the poor little ASCII files. I did
that so often, I had a text printout I left with them to keep with the
computer, hopefully taped to the cover, which suggested text editors
for changing the config files. Yup, lots of money...


Some of us see problems readily. Others just see equipment that
doesn't
work...

Magic box no work!


I wonder if it was simpler to call you than to get their union
electrician to come and plug in the cord. Someone may have quietly
kicked the plug out where you would see it.

You wonder how companies can afford to survive with things like that.
I was almost mugged for attempting to plug a guy's cord in during the
setup at COMDEX back in the '90s. Union guys went ape**** when I
pointed out the lack of connection and walked over to make it for the
vendor, like a nice guy. They made it clear that it was thea union
sparky's job and nobody else was "legally" allowed to do it. Scared
the **** out of me, it did. I tiptoed around the rest of the trip.
I never much liked unions, but I've really disliked them after that.


GM paid to fly me first class from NH to Flint MI to turn the range
knob on a signal generator down one click. .

Oh, ouch!

--
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to
succeed is more important than any one thing.
-- Abraham Lincoln

"Leon Fisk" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 16:03:02 -0400
"Jim Wilkins" wrote:

...
My point though... was just that some of us "see" stuff that isn't
right and other's don't, no matter how long they look.
..
Leon Fisk

I scored major points with my boss when he, I and another guy were
working on terminals in the CAD room that I managed and the third guy
complained that his printout was garbled, specifically some of the
letters had turned into the previous letter.

I had recently been looking at printer plug pin assignments and
realized that the cause could be an open lowest bit, so I suggested
that the plug might be partly disconnected. He checked and sure
enough, that was the problem.

Eventually other departments brought me problems they had given up on,
and then became annoyed when I found the fault too quickly.

One problem was using analog single point ground plane design rules
with 74AS logic. Where a bus crossed the ground plane gap there was a
1-2 nanosecond ground bounce of 3V between sides. I knew where to
look as soon as I examined the PC board artworks and spent the rest of
the 15 minutes setting up a convincing scope display.

For another I was transmitting 10 million bits at 2400 per second to a
military satellite to test the suspected error rate of a certain piece
of secure voice comm gear. Someone asked me how much longer I would be
tying up the channel, so, knowing that 1/24th is 0.0416666.. because I
had graduated a dial for a 5/16-24 lathe feed screw I quickly
calculated 4166.67 seconds and then converted it to 1 hour, 9 minutes
and 26.67 seconds (3600+540+26.67) to give them a clock time, all
mentally. None of the Ph.Ds in the room could figure out how to check
my answer with their calculators.

We know radio signals travel through space but it's still weird to
watch them disappear up there for several seconds and return intact.

-jsw

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 12:21:17 -0400, Michael A Terrell
wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:

I see how six different mfgrs build their gadgets, then I take the
best of the lot and assemble something with all the bells and whistles
I prefer, or build two, with different features on each.


Leave it to you to try to put a bell on a weasel! ;-)

I wish all speaking weasels (attorneys and politicians) had bells on.
BTW, you're thpeaking with a lithp thinth you came back from the
thelter. Get it looked at, eh?


Oh sure, blame the messenger!

Larry Jaques wrote:

You wonder how companies can afford to survive with things like that.
I was almost mugged for attempting to plug a guy's cord in during the
setup at COMDEX back in the '90s. Union guys went ape**** when I
pointed out the lack of connection and walked over to make it for the
vendor, like a nice guy. They made it clear that it was thea union
sparky's job and nobody else was "legally" allowed to do it. Scared
the **** out of me, it did. I tiptoed around the rest of the trip.
I never much liked unions, but I've really disliked them after that.


You don't carry a 'suicide cord' for those types?

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 13:05:38 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:


So far I'm impressed with this:
https://www.amazon.com/uniquegoods-S.../dp/B01N3YSE6S

Yeah, that's probably good for 7A. Teensy!


AFAICT it performs as advertised. My variac + arc welder transformer
power supply goes to 57VDC or 70ADC but not both at once, and not over
30A for very long. I'm fairly sure I used it to test the DPS5015 at
15A to at least 35V but I can't find the data. It's a difficult
measurement because my power resistors have to be reconfigured several
times as the voltage rises and they get very hot, 500-600F.

-jsw

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 08:08:56 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Fri, 20 Oct 2017 11:03:04 -0400, Neon John wrote:

On Sun, 15 Oct 2017 11:09:46 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:


I am trying to collect material and ideas in order to make a mini backhoe. I may never make one, but I am proceeding on the grounds that I will.

Why don't you just buy a mini-backhoe? Either HF or Northern sells a
very nice one. A friend has one. I've borrowed it several times.

They're near $3k, while scrounging parts and building your own might
cost you a grand. Many of us are not well funded for our toy
departments.


Nice. It has a trailer hitch so you just tow it to the job.

That's illegal. They're not road licenseable in the USA.
The fine print on the site says "Not for use on highways or public
roads." Many cops would likely let it go, but the sticklers would
know they're not roadable and ticket you, possibly impounding it.
Caveat tow-er.
Up here they are towable equipment and do not require licencing -
but you need to change the axles and put in high-speed wheelbearings -
and DOT listed TRAILER tires instead of the wheelbarrow tires they
come with.
As long as it can't carry anything as a payload it is not a trailer
(does not require licencing)

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 19:13:43 -0400, Michael A Terrell
wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 12:21:17 -0400, Michael A Terrell
wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:

I see how six different mfgrs build their gadgets, then I take the
best of the lot and assemble something with all the bells and whistles
I prefer, or build two, with different features on each.


Leave it to you to try to put a bell on a weasel! ;-)

I wish all speaking weasels (attorneys and politicians) had bells on.
BTW, you're thpeaking with a lithp thinth you came back from the
thelter. Get it looked at, eh?


Oh sure, blame the messenger!

_Always_, ya slug.

--
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to
succeed is more important than any one thing.
-- Abraham Lincoln

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 19:52:17 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
.. .
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 13:05:38 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:


So far I'm impressed with this:
https://www.amazon.com/uniquegoods-S.../dp/B01N3YSE6S

Yeah, that's probably good for 7A. Teensy!


AFAICT it performs as advertised. My variac + arc welder transformer
power supply goes to 57VDC or 70ADC but not both at once, and not over
30A for very long. I'm fairly sure I used it to test the DPS5015 at
15A to at least 35V but I can't find the data. It's a difficult
measurement because my power resistors have to be reconfigured several
times as the voltage rises and they get very hot, 500-600F.

At least it's not C. Sounds like a pretty nifty supply. Was that a
little fan on the backside of the power transistor mount plate? Still,
they don't look up to 7.5A each, so I'm surprised. Cute little guy.

--
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to
succeed is more important than any one thing.
-- Abraham Lincoln

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 18:55:45 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Leon Fisk" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 16:03:02 -0400
"Jim Wilkins" wrote:

...
My point though... was just that some of us "see" stuff that isn't
right and other's don't, no matter how long they look.
..
Leon Fisk

I scored major points with my boss when he, I and another guy were
working on terminals in the CAD room that I managed and the third guy
complained that his printout was garbled, specifically some of the
letters had turned into the previous letter.

I had recently been looking at printer plug pin assignments and
realized that the cause could be an open lowest bit, so I suggested
that the plug might be partly disconnected. He checked and sure
enough, that was the problem.

Well done.


Eventually other departments brought me problems they had given up on,
and then became annoyed when I found the fault too quickly.

Cars and I are that way, and people hate it.


One problem was using analog single point ground plane design rules
with 74AS logic. Where a bus crossed the ground plane gap there was a
1-2 nanosecond ground bounce of 3V between sides. I knew where to
look as soon as I examined the PC board artworks and spent the rest of
the 15 minutes setting up a convincing scope display.

Dog and pony show for the bosses, eh?

For another I was transmitting 10 million bits at 2400 per second to a
military satellite to test the suspected error rate of a certain piece
of secure voice comm gear. Someone asked me how much longer I would be
tying up the channel, so, knowing that 1/24th is 0.0416666.. because I
had graduated a dial for a 5/16-24 lathe feed screw I quickly
calculated 4166.67 seconds and then converted it to 1 hour, 9 minutes
and 26.67 seconds (3600+540+26.67) to give them a clock time, all
mentally. None of the Ph.Ds in the room could figure out how to check
my answer with their calculators.

Ooooh, good one! Kudos, Mr. Wizard. Mensa pin earned.
(Was that done in your head or on your calculator?)


We know radio signals travel through space but it's still weird to
watch them disappear up there for several seconds and return intact.

Like talking to someone over long distance phone a while back? You
reminded me of watching the letters show up individually several
seconds after I'd typed things into a 2400baud modem/BBS. Yeah,
weird. It gives you some sense of the distance.

--
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to
succeed is more important than any one thing.
-- Abraham Lincoln

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 19:16:30 -0400, Michael A Terrell
wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:

You wonder how companies can afford to survive with things like that.
I was almost mugged for attempting to plug a guy's cord in during the
setup at COMDEX back in the '90s. Union guys went ape**** when I
pointed out the lack of connection and walked over to make it for the
vendor, like a nice guy. They made it clear that it was thea union
sparky's job and nobody else was "legally" allowed to do it. Scared
the **** out of me, it did. I tiptoed around the rest of the trip.
I never much liked unions, but I've really disliked them after that.

You don't carry a 'suicide cord' for those types?

I was surprised I didn't feel any garrotes that day. :-Q

--
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to
succeed is more important than any one thing.
-- Abraham Lincoln

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 19:16:30 -0400, Michael A Terrell
wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:

You wonder how companies can afford to survive with things like that.
I was almost mugged for attempting to plug a guy's cord in during the
setup at COMDEX back in the '90s. Union guys went ape**** when I
pointed out the lack of connection and walked over to make it for the
vendor, like a nice guy. They made it clear that it was thea union
sparky's job and nobody else was "legally" allowed to do it. Scared
the **** out of me, it did. I tiptoed around the rest of the trip.
I never much liked unions, but I've really disliked them after that.

You don't carry a 'suicide cord' for those types?

I was surprised I didn't feel any garrotes that day. :-Q


A 'Suicide Cord' has an AC plug at one end, and alligator clips on
the other end. You let the union type connect it for you. ;-)

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 12:04:36 -0400, Michael A Terrell
wrote:

Leon Fisk wrote:
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 09:15:07 -0400
"Jim Wilkins" wrote:

snip
Recently working on snow plows has reminded me of the knowledge gap
modern technology has created. Electrical schematics are as readable
as street signs to me but alien hieroglyphics to the plow owner.
http://pospert.org/wiring-diagram-fo...ern-snow-plow/

I went on a service call once, in a different lifetime...

For a GM plant, 70 mi drive one way. Problem, printer doesn't
work. Powers up okay but won't print anything. We were GE repair for
much of the western portion of the state.

As I was coming into the open office area and still 20 feet away I
could see the RS232 cable for the printer disconnected and on the
floor. That's all it was. Plugged the cable back in and they were
printing again. The department was labeled as engineering too

Some of us see problems readily. Others just see equipment that doesn't
work...


I couldn't use my networked LASER printer after a brief power
outage. The damned thing had changed it's address on the network when it
rebooted. It had been through dozens of power outages, but that time it
incremented its address by one digit.
IT dept gave up on wireless network printer (Brother HL-5370DW) and
ran cable - no more problems.

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 18:55:45 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:


Ooooh, good one! Kudos, Mr. Wizard. Mensa pin earned.
(Was that done in your head or on your calculator?)


In my head, thanks to years of practice juggling decimal points for
slide rule solutions to chemistry and physics homework. I think the
secret is being able to remember a couple of intermediate results long
enough to combine them, a skill I slowly developed through practice.

Memorizing reciprocals helps a lot with mental division. I worked with
very smart engineers who couldn't mentally convert a waveform period
shown on a scope to its frequency, and had to ask me every time. I
used the decimal equivalents of fractions to do it.

-jsw

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 19:52:17 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
. ..
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 13:05:38 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:


So far I'm impressed with this:
https://www.amazon.com/uniquegoods-S.../dp/B01N3YSE6S

Yeah, that's probably good for 7A. Teensy!


AFAICT it performs as advertised. My variac + arc welder transformer
power supply goes to 57VDC or 70ADC but not both at once, and not
over
30A for very long. I'm fairly sure I used it to test the DPS5015 at
15A to at least 35V but I can't find the data. It's a difficult
measurement because my power resistors have to be reconfigured
several
times as the voltage rises and they get very hot, 500-600F.

At least it's not C. Sounds like a pretty nifty supply. Was that a
little fan on the backside of the power transistor mount plate?
Still,
they don't look up to 7.5A each, so I'm surprised. Cute little
guy.

Yes it's a fan. I made an open backed aluminum box to house it. I
didn't check output noise and ripple because they don't matter for my
high current applications and I grabbed a 13.8V 19A supply cheap
during Radio Shack's clearance sale. The DPS5015 is somewhat unstable
in constant current mode.

Ripple from the unregulated welder transformer supply is surprisingly
low, about 1V p-p at 20A, thanks to its high self inductance and the
nearly 0.1 Farad output cap. Its output regulation is poor, Zout is
around 1 - 2 Ohms, which means the current stays nearly constant as
battery voltage rises. That's good during the bulk charging phase but
dangerous once the charge nears completion, so I have to limit the
maximum battery voltage by charging through a 20A solar panel
controller or the DPS5015.

The 20A controller is a WindyNation P20L. Amazon offered it for $19.99
until I bought one, then the price jumped to $30.

-jsw

Gerry wrote:

Michael A Terrell wrote:

I couldn't use my networked LASER printer after a brief power
outage. The damned thing had changed it's address on the network
when it rebooted. It had been through dozens of power outages, but
that time it incremented its address by one digit.

IT dept gave up on wireless network printer (Brother HL-5370DW) and
ran cable - no more problems.


I only use wireless, where I can't run a cable.

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 09:58:58 -0400, Leon Fisk
wrote:

On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 09:15:07 -0400
"Jim Wilkins" wrote:

snip
Recently working on snow plows has reminded me of the knowledge gap
modern technology has created. Electrical schematics are as readable
as street signs to me but alien hieroglyphics to the plow owner.
http://pospert.org/wiring-diagram-fo...ern-snow-plow/

I went on a service call once, in a different lifetime...

For a GM plant, 70 mi drive one way. Problem, printer doesn't
work. Powers up okay but won't print anything. We were GE repair for
much of the western portion of the state.

As I was coming into the open office area and still 20 feet away I
could see the RS232 cable for the printer disconnected and on the
floor. That's all it was. Plugged the cable back in and they were
printing again. The department was labeled as engineering too

Some of us see problems readily. Others just see equipment that doesn't
work...


We should swap tech stories sometime....lol

Gunner
Machine tool service tech


---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

On Sun, 22 Oct 2017 01:08:40 -0400, Michael A Terrell
wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Sat, 21 Oct 2017 19:16:30 -0400, Michael A Terrell
wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:

You wonder how companies can afford to survive with things like that.
I was almost mugged for attempting to plug a guy's cord in during the
setup at COMDEX back in the '90s. Union guys went ape**** when I
pointed out the lack of connection and walked over to make it for the
vendor, like a nice guy. They made it clear that it was thea union
sparky's job and nobody else was "legally" allowed to do it. Scared
the **** out of me, it did. I tiptoed around the rest of the trip.
I never much liked unions, but I've really disliked them after that.

You don't carry a 'suicide cord' for those types?

I was surprised I didn't feel any garrotes that day. :-Q


A 'Suicide Cord' has an AC plug at one end, and alligator clips on
the other end. You let the union type connect it for you. ;-)
Similar to a "widowmaker" coed with male plug on both ends?

On Sun, 22 Oct 2017 08:13:17 -0400, Michael A Terrell
wrote:

Gerry wrote:

Michael A Terrell wrote:

I couldn't use my networked LASER printer after a brief power
outage. The damned thing had changed it's address on the network
when it rebooted. It had been through dozens of power outages, but
that time it incremented its address by one digit.

IT dept gave up on wireless network printer (Brother HL-5370DW) and
ran cable - no more problems.


I only use wireless, where I can't run a cable.
or to connect to one of them "fruit" computers that don't have a
network cable option any more - - -

wrote:
On Sun, 22 Oct 2017 08:13:17 -0400, Michael A Terrell
wrote:

Gerry wrote:

Michael A Terrell wrote:

I couldn't use my networked LASER printer after a brief power
outage. The damned thing had changed it's address on the network
when it rebooted. It had been through dozens of power outages, but
that time it incremented its address by one digit.

IT dept gave up on wireless network printer (Brother HL-5370DW)
and ran cable - no more problems.


I only use wireless, where I can't run a cable.

Or to connect to one of them "fruit" computers that don't have a
network cable option any more - - -


Not a problem, so far. I even connect my Internet radio with Cat5.

I do use a 10"tablet to watch TV at times, but there is nothing on
it worth trying to hack. I put it o a stand, on top of my computer. It
is just below line of sight of the main 24" monitor.