Posted with no comment G



"In contrast to the ideals, opinions and feelings of today's
"Hollywonk" the real actors of yester-year loved the United States.


They had class and integrity as well as brains and talent. With the
advent of
World War II many of our actors went to fight rather than stand and
rant
against this country we all love.


They gave up their wealth, position and fame to become service men &
women, many as simple "enlisted men".


So, while the "Entertainers" of 2003 & 2004 have been in all of the
news media lately I would like to remind the people of what the
entertainers of 1943 were doing, (60 years ago).


Most of these brave men have since passed away.


REAL HOLLYWOOD HEROES:


Alec Guinness (Star Wars) operated a British Royal Navy landing craft
on D-Day.


James Doohan ("Scotty" on Star Trek) landed in Normandy with the U.
S. Army on D-Day.


Donald Pleasance (The Great Escape) really was an R. A. F. pilot who
was shot down, held prisoner and tortured by the Germans.


David Niven was a Sandhurst graduate and Lt. Colonel of the British
Commandos in Normandy.


James Stewart Entered the Army Air Force as a private and worked his
way to the rank of Colonel. During World War II, Stewart served as
a bomber
pilot, his service record crediting him with leading more than 20
missions
over Germany, and taking part in hundreds of air strikes during his
tour of
duty. Stewart earned the Air Medal, the Distinguished Flying Cross,
France's Croix de Guerre, and 7 Battle Stars during World War II.


In peace time, Stewart continued to be an active member of the Air
Force as a reservist, reaching the rank of Brigadier General before
retiring in the late 1950s.


Clark Gable (Mega-Movie Star when war broke out) Although he was
beyond the draft age at the time the U.S. entered WW II, Clark Gable
enlisted as a private in the AAF on Aug. 12, 1942 at Los Angeles.
He attended the Officers' Candidate School at Miami Beach, Fla. and
graduated as a second lieutenant on Oct. 28, 1942.


He then attended aerial gunnery school and in Feb. 1943 he was
assigned to the 351st Bomb Group at Polebrook where flew operational
missions over Europe in B-17s.


Capt. Gable returned to the U.S. in Oct. 1943 and was relieved from
active duty as a major on Jun. 12, 1944 at his own request, since he
was over-age for combat.


Charlton Heston was an Army Air Corps Sergeant in Kodiak.


Earnest Borgnine was a U. S. Navy Gunners Mate 1935-1945.


Charles Durning was a U. S. Army Ranger at Normandy earning a Silver
Star and awarded the Purple Heart.


Charles Bronson was a tail gunner in the Army Air Corps, more
specifically on B-29s in the 20th Air Force out of Guam, Tinian, and
Saipan


George C. Scott was a decorated U. S. Marine.


Eddie Albert (Green Acres TV) was awarded a Bronze Star for his
heroic action as a U. S. Naval officer aiding Marines at the horrific
battle on the island of Tarawa in the Pacific Nov. 1943.


Brian Keith served as a U.S. Marine rear gunner in several actions
against the Japanese on Rabal in the Pacific.


Lee Marvin was a U.S. Marine on Saipan during the Marianas campaign
when he was wounded earning the Purple Heart.


John Russell: In 1942, he enlisted in the Marine Corps where he
received a battlefield commission and was wounded and highly
decorated for valor at Guadalcanal.


Robert Ryan was a U. S. Marine who served with the O. S. S. in
Yugoslavia.


Tyrone Power (an established movie star when Pearl Harbor was bombed)
joined the U.S. Marines, was a pilot flying supplies into, and
wounded Marines out of, Iwo Jima and Okinawa.


Audie Murphy, little 5'5" tall 110 pound guy from Texas who played
cowboy parts?


Most Decorated serviceman of WWII and earned: Medal of Honor,
Distinguished Service Cross, 2 Silver Star Medals, Legion of Merit, 2
Bronze Star Medals with "V", 2 Purple Hearts, U.S. Army Outstanding
Civilian Service Medal, Good Conduct Medal, 2 Distinguished Unit
Emblems, American Campaign Medal, European-African-Middle Eastern
Campaign Medal with One Silver Star, Four Bronze Service Stars
(representing nine campaigns) and one Bronze Arrowhead (representing
assault landing at Sicily and Southern France) World War II Victory
Medal Army of Occupation Medal with Germany Clasp, Armed Forces
Reserve Medal, Combat Infantry Badge, Marksman Badge with Rifle Bar,
Expert Badge with Bayonet Bar, French Fourragere in Colors of the
Croix de Guerre, French Legion of Honor, Grade of Chevalier, French
Croix de Guerre With Silver Star, French Croix de Guerre with Palm,
Medal of


Liberated France, Belgian Croix de Guerre 1940 Palm.


So how do you feel the real heroes of the silver screen acted when
compared to the Hollypansies today who spray out anti-American drivel
as they bite the hand that feeds them? Can you imagine these stars
of yester-year saying they hate our flag, making anti-war speeches,
marching in anti-American parades and saying they hate our president?


I thought not, neither did I!


If you enjoyed the story send it on.

Believe it or not, they were all registered republicans. "
"At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child -
miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied,
demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless.
Liberalism is a philosphy of sniveling brats." -- P.J. O'Rourke

On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 09:22:48 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

Posted with no comment G

That's good as, IIRC, most of it is false as many of
us may well recall from the prior times that you have posted
the same thing (or very similar).

Wingers NEVER learn.

HTH
--
Cliff

On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 09:22:48 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

I would like to remind the people of what the
entertainers of 1943 were doing, (60 years ago).

Let me guess .. WW-II was going on? The neocons
& wingers were not in control with their endless lies?
Am I warm?
--
Cliff

Gunner wrote:
Posted with no comment G

WW II was the war against the anti-Socialist. FDR, a socialist, whas
desperate to help his friend and ally, "Uncle Joe" Stalin, and get
America into the War. So, yes, Hollywood, already heavily infiltrated by
Soviet Agents and their useful idiots, was pro war. The left wing would
not say one bas word against anyone who fought against the Nazis. Do
note how leftist today condemn the U.S. for the atomic bombing of Japan,
however.

"Gunner" wrote in message
...
Posted with no comment G



snip of well-documented information

The original author forgot one: Richard Todd (The Dam Busters, The Longest
Day).

We all remember the scenes in The Longest Day where Richard Todd portrayed
British Glider Troop Major Howard with orders to "Hold until relieved" at
the Orde River Bridge.

LT. Richard Todd was the Commando officer who actually relieved Maj. Howard
(whom he portrayed in the film) on 6/6/44.

In misc.survivalism Gunner wrote:

"In contrast to the ideals, opinions and feelings of today's
"Hollywonk" the real actors of yester-year loved the United States.

Naw, they were a bunch of Communists!!

Didn't you hear?

Cliff wrote:

On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 09:22:48 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

Posted with no comment G

That's good as, IIRC, most of it is false as many of
us may well recall from the prior times that you have posted
the same thing (or very similar).

Look it all up dickhead. Oh, sorry, I forgot that would require you to have
a synapse of some kind.


Wingers NEVER learn.

You've been shot in the arm?

Cliff wrote:

If only I had a friend, then they could do my thinking for me.

On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 18:12:32 +0000 (UTC), the inscrutable
spake:

In misc.survivalism Gunner wrote:

"In contrast to the ideals, opinions and feelings of today's
"Hollywonk" the real actors of yester-year loved the United States.

Naw, they were a bunch of Communists!!

Didn't you hear?

I'm surprised that the heroine, Jane Fonda, wasn't mentioned.
duckin', big time


--== May The Angst Be With You! ==--
-Yoda, on a bad day
--
http://diversify.com Ending Your Web Page Angst.

On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 18:12:32 +0000 (UTC),
wrote:

In misc.survivalism Gunner wrote:

"In contrast to the ideals, opinions and feelings of today's
"Hollywonk" the real actors of yester-year loved the United States.

Naw, they were a bunch of Communists!!

Didn't you hear?

No, I didnt. According to the data..the ones mentioned were
Republicans (not counting the Brits)
However, it is well documented that there were many many actual active
Communists in Hollywood. But I rather doubt any of them were landing
on beaches etc. They tend to want to save their own skins......

Gunner

"At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child -
miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied,
demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless.
Liberalism is a philosphy of sniveling brats." -- P.J. O'Rourke

"Gunner" wrote in message
...
SNIP
| However, it is well documented that there were many many actual active
| Communists in Hollywood. But I rather doubt any of them were landing
| on beaches etc. They tend to want to save their own skins......

They also obsess when they don't get their way, whine, moan, and
generally become a pain in the ass. They love to talk politics, but are far
less likely to actually vote (oh, wait, that one applies to most of us!) I
forgot to mention the current ones love to try to antagonize others rather
than discuss things in a rational manner. As if yelling and insults ever
won an argument or changed any minds. They prefer not to discuss things
with someone that's not "their kind" because then they'd have to think about
the real reasons they hold the positions they do. I suppose I can simply
hold Cliff up as an example, but I suspect a serious communist (rather than
a wannabe) will at least have some perspective to argue with.

You got one thing wrong. Doohan was a Canadian and served in the CANADIAN
forces on D day. The Americans were NOT the only forces there at the time,
despite what Hollywood would have you believe.

Tom

James Doohan ("Scotty" on Star Trek) landed in Normandy with the U.
S. Army on D-Day.

On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 22:43:47 GMT, the inscrutable Gunner
spake:

--snip--
However, it is well documented that there were many many actual active
Communists in Hollywood.

Sure, why not? Wherever there's money to be spread around, there they
are. Kinda like politicians on both sides of the aisle, wot?


But I rather doubt any of them were landing
on beaches etc. They tend to want to save their own skins......

Sure they'll be landing on beaches. In Santa Monica, Newport, and
Laguna, and (most importantly) Malibu, right?


To get it back to a metal content, I'm now licensed to pack it.
Took the NRA course the 15th, got the paperwork, got it filled out
and was printed on the 18th, and my license came in the mail today,
2 weeks earlier than promised. AFAIK, they didn't even check my
references. That surprised me.


----------------------------------------------------------------
"Let's sing praise to Aphrodite || www.diversify.com
She may seem a little flighty, || Full Service Websites
but she wears a green gauze nighty, || PHP Applications
And she's good enough for me." || SQL Database Development

"Tom Miller" wrote in message
...
You got one thing wrong. Doohan was a Canadian and served in the CANADIAN
forces on D day. The Americans were NOT the only forces there at the
time,
despite what Hollywood would have you believe.

In fact, the top four names on that list consists of three Brits and a
Canadian.

Not to take anything away from the ones listed below, but what do those four
have to do with American actors in Hollywood?

(Also, FWIW, Alec Guinness did NOT operate a British Royal Navy landing
craft
on D-Day, unless it was in Sicily. g)

--
Ed Huntress

I decided to spot check the first three of these citation to see if they are
on the up and up, and indeed they appear to be so: Comments and references
are inserted below.

John



Most of these brave men have since passed away.


REAL HOLLYWOOD HEROES:


Alec Guinness (Star Wars) operated a British Royal Navy landing craft
on D-Day.



I found plenty of references to Guinness joining up with the Royal Navy in
WWII, but couldn't find anything about his activities on D-day, which does
not mean that the original post was wrong, but simply that I couldn't find
more details in 10 minutes of googling.

See for example:
http://www.britishcinemagreats.com/A...ess_page_1.htm



James Doohan ("Scotty" on Star Trek) landed in Normandy with the U.
S. Army on D-Day.


Almost right. Doohan was a Canadian and served in the Canadian military
were he rose to the rank of Captain.

See: http://www.startrek.com/startrek/vie...ast/69073.html



Donald Pleasance (The Great Escape) really was an R. A. F. pilot who
was shot down, held prisoner and tortured by the Germans.


Looks exactly correct, see:
http://www.geocities.com/pleasence/Pleasence.html


So, to those who claim that the list is a bunch of lies .... I think not!

John

"Cliff" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 09:22:48 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

Posted with no comment G

That's good as, IIRC, most of it is false as many of
us may well recall from the prior times that you have posted
the same thing (or very similar).

Wingers NEVER learn.

HTH
--
Cliff


Hmmm, I just checked the first three references and they seem to be
materially correct.

John

"John Horner" wrote in message
news:1aZce.3105$db7.1259@trnddc01...

I decided to spot check the first three of these citation to see if they
are
on the up and up...

An excellent idea, especially given the transgressions of this source in the
past. d8-)

..., and indeed they appear to be so: Comments and references
are inserted below.

John



Most of these brave men have since passed away.


REAL HOLLYWOOD HEROES:


Alec Guinness (Star Wars) operated a British Royal Navy landing craft
on D-Day.



I found plenty of references to Guinness joining up with the Royal Navy in
WWII, but couldn't find anything about his activities on D-day, which does
not mean that the original post was wrong, but simply that I couldn't find
more details in 10 minutes of googling.

He was not in Normandy on D-Day. His boat commands were in Sicily. He was
also involved in supplying Yugoslav partisans. It's in his biography,
through a paid service that I have access to through my work.

So, to those who claim that the list is a bunch of lies .... I think not!

I must have missed the people claiming it was a bunch of lies. What it is,
is a bunch of Brits and a Canadian represented as the old Hollywood, during
WWII. At least regarding the first four, we can say that foreign actors were
convinced that WWII was a war worth fighting. So was almost everyone else in
the Allied countries.

The premise of the essay, if it's worthy of that name, is that today's
Hollywood actors are somehow less principled. That may be, but WWII versus
the wars of today is not much of a litmus test. When the US, the UK, and the
Commonwealth countries were under attack, a large percentage of men in those
countries enlisted and served, actors or not. When we're not under attack
and we go to war anyway, it's a bit harder to meet recruitment
quotas...actors or not.

--
Ed Huntress

Strabo wrote:

Other Notables:

Jack Palance
Robert Mitchum
Roy Rogers
Dean Martin

I find it fascinating to watch war films made after WWII
featuring war veteran actors who actually experienced many
of the scenarios depicted.




Strabo,

You did get one right. Jack Palance was a bomber pilot in WWII and
suffered burns in a crash that gave him his famous gaunt looks.

However:

Robert Mitchum was drafted in 1945 after spending most of the war acting
movies and theater. He spent only 8 months in the military, mostly
promoting a war movie he made.

Roy Rogers never served. He spent the war years making singing cowboy
movies, filling a vacancy left by western actor Gene Autry who did join up.

Dean Martin was excused from serving due to a hernia.

Just the facts, man, just the facts.

Fred

John Horner wrote:
"Cliff" wrote in message
...

On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 09:22:48 GMT, Gunner
wrote:


Posted with no comment G

That's good as, IIRC, most of it is false as many of
us may well recall from the prior times that you have posted
the same thing (or very similar).

Wingers NEVER learn.

HTH
--
Cliff



Hmmm, I just checked the first three references and they seem to be
materially correct.

John



Cliffy has never let facts stand in the way of his inflexible spoonfed
opinion.

For an exhaustive review of the article, see:
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/alt.folklore.urban/browse_mrm/thread/8688861618c87fed/b02db7d0b7cf5a6?q=niven+doohan+guiness+murphy+grou p:alt.folklore.urban&rnum=1&hl=en#b02db7d0b7fcf5a6

I'd makeashorterlink of it but my clipboard isn't working. If the
hand-typed link doesn't work, just Google Groups search
alt.folklore.urban for a post that includes all the words: niven
doohan guiness murphy



TK

--
Cogito ergo bibo

On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 19:30:05 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 22:43:47 GMT, the inscrutable Gunner
spake:

--snip--
However, it is well documented that there were many many actual active
Communists in Hollywood.

Sure, why not? Wherever there's money to be spread around, there they
are. Kinda like politicians on both sides of the aisle, wot?


But I rather doubt any of them were landing
on beaches etc. They tend to want to save their own skins......

Sure they'll be landing on beaches. In Santa Monica, Newport, and
Laguna, and (most importantly) Malibu, right?


To get it back to a metal content, I'm now licensed to pack it.
Took the NRA course the 15th, got the paperwork, got it filled out
and was printed on the 18th, and my license came in the mail today,
2 weeks earlier than promised. AFAIK, they didn't even check my
references. That surprised me.



Bravo!!!

Whatcha carrying?

Feel free to email, if it bothers you to post here.

Gunner, normally with an AMT .45 DAO somewhere about his person.
Though there may be a custom Series 70 .45 tucked away, depending on
location, season and risk factors.
Or a 57 S&W, or....



----------------------------------------------------------------
"Let's sing praise to Aphrodite || www.diversify.com
She may seem a little flighty, || Full Service Websites
but she wears a green gauze nighty, || PHP Applications
And she's good enough for me." || SQL Database Development

"At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child -
miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied,
demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless.
Liberalism is a philosphy of sniveling brats." -- P.J. O'Rourke

On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 09:22:48 GMT, Gunner wrote:

Posted with no comment G



"In contrast to the ideals, opinions and feelings of today's
"Hollywonk" the real actors of yester-year loved the United States.


They had class and integrity as well as brains and talent. With the
advent of
World War II many of our actors went to fight rather than stand and
rant
against this country we all love.


They gave up their wealth, position and fame to become service men &
women, many as simple "enlisted men".


So, while the "Entertainers" of 2003 & 2004 have been in all of the
news media lately I would like to remind the people of what the
entertainers of 1943 were doing, (60 years ago).


Most of these brave men have since passed away.


REAL HOLLYWOOD HEROES:


Alec Guinness (Star Wars) operated a British Royal Navy landing craft
on D-Day.


James Doohan ("Scotty" on Star Trek) landed in Normandy with the U.
S. Army on D-Day.


Donald Pleasance (The Great Escape) really was an R. A. F. pilot who
was shot down, held prisoner and tortured by the Germans.


David Niven was a Sandhurst graduate and Lt. Colonel of the British
Commandos in Normandy.


James Stewart Entered the Army Air Force as a private and worked his
way to the rank of Colonel. During World War II, Stewart served as
a bomber
pilot, his service record crediting him with leading more than 20
missions
over Germany, and taking part in hundreds of air strikes during his
tour of
duty. Stewart earned the Air Medal, the Distinguished Flying Cross,
France's Croix de Guerre, and 7 Battle Stars during World War II.


In peace time, Stewart continued to be an active member of the Air
Force as a reservist, reaching the rank of Brigadier General before
retiring in the late 1950s.


Clark Gable (Mega-Movie Star when war broke out) Although he was
beyond the draft age at the time the U.S. entered WW II, Clark Gable
enlisted as a private in the AAF on Aug. 12, 1942 at Los Angeles.
He attended the Officers' Candidate School at Miami Beach, Fla. and
graduated as a second lieutenant on Oct. 28, 1942.


He then attended aerial gunnery school and in Feb. 1943 he was
assigned to the 351st Bomb Group at Polebrook where flew operational
missions over Europe in B-17s.


Capt. Gable returned to the U.S. in Oct. 1943 and was relieved from
active duty as a major on Jun. 12, 1944 at his own request, since he
was over-age for combat.


Charlton Heston was an Army Air Corps Sergeant in Kodiak.


Earnest Borgnine was a U. S. Navy Gunners Mate 1935-1945.


Charles Durning was a U. S. Army Ranger at Normandy earning a Silver
Star and awarded the Purple Heart.

He was also a survivor of the Bataan Death March.

(snip)

On Sun, 1 May 2005 12:26:59 +1000, "Tom Miller" wrote:

You got one thing wrong. Doohan was a Canadian and served in the CANADIAN
forces on D day. The Americans were NOT the only forces there at the time,
despite what Hollywood would have you believe.

Tom

James Doohan ("Scotty" on Star Trek) landed in Normandy with the U.
S. Army on D-Day.

That would mean this statement is technically correct then, since Canadian
forces and US forces(along with all the other Allied forces) were landing in
Normandy on D-Day in 1944. Unless Doohan was with the Axis forces on D-Day, he
was with the US Army on D-Day.

On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 09:49:44 -0700, Stuart Grey
wrote:

Do
note how leftist today condemn the U.S. for the atomic bombing of Japan,
however.

Actually, it could have easily been mostly avoided.

Mountain tops would have worked about as well
as demonstrations, as would have the sea or bays.

It was overkill.
--
Cliff

On Sun, 01 May 2005 01:57:13 GMT, "carl mciver"
wrote:


"Gunner" wrote in message
.. .
SNIP
| However, it is well documented that there were many many actual active
| Communists in Hollywood. But I rather doubt any of them were landing
| on beaches etc. They tend to want to save their own skins......

They also obsess when they don't get their way, whine, moan, and
generally become a pain in the ass. They love to talk politics, but are far
less likely to actually vote (oh, wait, that one applies to most of us!) I
forgot to mention the current ones love to try to antagonize others rather
than discuss things in a rational manner. As if yelling and insults ever
won an argument or changed any minds. They prefer not to discuss things
with someone that's not "their kind" because then they'd have to think about
the real reasons they hold the positions they do.

Stop picking on poor Gunner.

I suppose I can simply
hold Cliff up as an example, but I suspect a serious communist (rather than
a wannabe) will at least have some perspective to argue with.

Found those "WMDs" yet?

How about the ones that the US is using in Iraq
(probably among other places)?

Wingers .... sheesh.

HTH
--
Cliff

On Sun, 01 May 2005 08:20:25 GMT, Strabo
wrote:

To make up for my deficiency I found others (confirmed).

How many congresscritters quit to go kill in Iran?
How many sent their own kids?

Notice all the neocon & their supporters signing up to flood the
ranks of the US military with new volunteers?

dead silence

HTH
--
Cliff

On Sun, 01 May 2005 08:02:11 GMT, the inscrutable Gunner
spake:

Bravo!!!

Whatcha carrying?

A nice, light, (and loud) KelTec P-11. I've wanted something on me
when I go out to photograph the backwoods with a couple grand worth
of camera equipment.


Feel free to email, if it bothers you to post here.

Gunner, normally with an AMT .45 DAO somewhere about his person.
Though there may be a custom Series 70 .45 tucked away, depending on
location, season and risk factors.
Or a 57 S&W, or....

The guys at the range asked me about the 4" dia. pole sticking up from
the back of my pickup bed. I was going to tell them of my little M2
http://www.olive-drab.com/images/firearms_mg_m2.jpg and watch their
eyes light up (as they'd ask me to go shooting with them, and BRING
THE TRUCK!, I'm sure), I would have laughed and told them the truth:
It was the pickup crane mount. snort Instead, I just told the truth.

I found that my welds didn't hold on that puppy, either. I think I'll
do some more practice welding today, then re-weld the bracket.


--
STOP THE SLAUGHTER! || http://diversify.com
Boycott Baby Oil! || Programmed Websites

Cliff wrote:
On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 09:49:44 -0700, Stuart Grey
wrote:


Do
note how leftist today condemn the U.S. for the atomic bombing of Japan,
however.


Actually, it could have easily been mostly avoided.

Mountain tops would have worked about as well
as demonstrations, as would have the sea or bays.

It was overkill.


Q.E.D..

John Horner wrote:
"Cliff" wrote in message
...

On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 09:22:48 GMT, Gunner
wrote:


Posted with no comment G

That's good as, IIRC, most of it is false as many of
us may well recall from the prior times that you have posted
the same thing (or very similar).

Wingers NEVER learn.

HTH
--
Cliff



Hmmm, I just checked the first three references and they seem to be
materially correct.

John

The section on Audie Murphy was a bit off. Murphy was a poor Texas farm
boy who's father had died and the decided to join the service in 1942,
shortly after the Peral Harbor attack and the declaration of war. He was
not, at the time, a Movie star. He became a movie star after he returned
from WW II.

Murphy's actions in WW II were astounding. They were actually toned down
to make them more believable in the movie, "To Hell and Back".

But yes, many of the movie stars out there are of poor character.

Like I said, socialist APPROVED of WW II because it was the war to save
Stalin's ass, and to re-install the socialist & communist in France.
Hitler hated the socialist/communist. As noted by the House Un American
Activities Committee after the war, Hollywood, as well as our media,
schools, government, were infested with Soviet Agents and their useful
idiots (Useful idiots being Stalin's term for Democrats, basically...).
McCarthy, in the Senate, targeted Soviets in the government. FDR and
later Truman, kept and protected Soviet Agents within our government, an
act of high treason. The Soviets managed to propagandize and smear the
efforts to remove their agents, and got people to believe that there
were no Soviet agents in the media, the schools, and our government.

But the Vennona project provided conclusive evidence that McCarthy and
others were right. Now, ask yourself, if they were really there, and the
American people bought the Soviet propaganda that there were none, where
did they go if they were never gotten rid of?

Now you see why Hollywood, college campuses, and many parts of the
government are so left wing.

"Cliff" wrote in message
...
SNIP
| I suppose I can simply
| hold Cliff up as an example, but I suspect a serious communist (rather
than
| a wannabe) will at least have some perspective to argue with.
|
| Found those "WMDs" yet?

I'm still waiting for some reasonable discussion from your direction,
but all I keep hearing is the same old thing. As a matter of fact, the
_exact_ same old thing. There's no point in using facts and logic with
folks like you, so we don't even bother trying to refute your arguments
anymore.
If you could use your brain instead of letting "journalists" who publish
their crap on the web think for you, it might actually be enlightening. I
know that when you wake up in the morning you need to decide whether to stay
in bed or go **** (well, you could do both, but I'll give you some credit)
that is actually free will and independent thought, and the relief from
letting the drug residue drain from your body is a direct result of that
minute decision, and you still have the option to continue to think for
yourself for the rest of the day. Some of us have more experience at it
than others, noted merely by the nature of our responses.
I'm paraphrasing here, but someone once said "Better to keep your mouth
shut and be thought a fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt."

"Stuart Grey" wrote in message
...

But the Vennona project provided conclusive evidence that McCarthy and
others were right.

Let's not forget, based on Soviet archives made available to researchers in
1991, McCarthy proved to be WRONG in every case but one (possibly two) about
WHO those people were.

He knew something was going on, but he destroyed a lot of lives and careers
because he really didn't care who he painted with his brush.

--
Ed Huntress

On Sun, 01 May 2005 06:48:56 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Sun, 01 May 2005 08:02:11 GMT, the inscrutable Gunner
spake:

Bravo!!!

Whatcha carrying?

A nice, light, (and loud) KelTec P-11. I've wanted something on me
when I go out to photograph the backwoods with a couple grand worth
of camera equipment.


The 9mm out of that short barrel is not known for being a critter
stopped of any note. But if you are comfortable with it..shrug.
Lots of online projects for the KelTecs btw

http://www.perkloafm.com/projects2.html


Feel free to email, if it bothers you to post here.

Gunner, normally with an AMT .45 DAO somewhere about his person.
Though there may be a custom Series 70 .45 tucked away, depending on
location, season and risk factors.
Or a 57 S&W, or....

The guys at the range asked me about the 4" dia. pole sticking up from
the back of my pickup bed. I was going to tell them of my little M2
http://www.olive-drab.com/images/firearms_mg_m2.jpg and watch their
eyes light up (as they'd ask me to go shooting with them, and BRING
THE TRUCK!, I'm sure), I would have laughed and told them the truth:
It was the pickup crane mount. snort Instead, I just told the truth.

I found that my welds didn't hold on that puppy, either. I think I'll
do some more practice welding today, then re-weld the bracket.

Also known as Ma Deuce. Not real concealable, but in certain
situations...invaluable G

Gunner

"At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child -
miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied,
demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless.
Liberalism is a philosphy of sniveling brats." -- P.J. O'Rourke

1) The conservatives have an advantage on the home turf of logic and
responsibility.
2) The liberals have an advantage on their home turf of emotion and
indulgence.


Actors, who's trade is in emotions, might be more likely to liberal.
The exceptions are when testosterone is needed to play the part, like
Bruce Willis, Steven Seagal, Tom Selleck, Kurt Russell, etc.
Those guys are not going to play the role of a Jewish hairdresser/lawyer
from New York.
They don't look like liberals.
They look like men.
Hollywood must make money, and despite the pinko agenda, they must hire
real men to play real men.

Strabo wrote:

In OT-Hollywierd Fact or fiction? on Sun, 01 May 2005
06:58:21 GMT, by ff, we read:

Strabo wrote:

Other Notables:

Jack Palance
Robert Mitchum
Roy Rogers
Dean Martin

I find it fascinating to watch war films made after WWII
featuring war veteran actors who actually experienced many
of the scenarios depicted.




Strabo,

You did get one right. Jack Palance was a bomber pilot in WWII and
suffered burns in a crash that gave him his famous gaunt looks.

However:

Robert Mitchum was drafted in 1945 after spending most of the war acting
movies and theater. He spent only 8 months in the military, mostly
promoting a war movie he made.

Then that's two. Service: U.S. Army (WWII, PFC, 1945 Apr-Oct)

I couldn't find anything on Google confirming Rogers or Martin
though I read that they served.


Roy Rogers never served. He spent the war years making singing cowboy
movies, filling a vacancy left by western actor Gene Autry who did join up.

Dean Martin was excused from serving due to a hernia.

Just the facts, man, just the facts.

Fred

To make up for my deficiency I found others (confirmed).


Gene Autry - Sgt. Autry was in the U.S. Army Air Force, flying
supplies in the China-India-Burma theater of war, and served for
4+ years.

James Arness (Marshal Matt Dillon of Gunsmoke and brother of
Peter Graves, the "Mission Impossible" guy) was involved in the
landings at Anzio and was wounded there.

Richard Boone served as a tail gunner in Navy Torpedo planes and
saw action during W.W.II.

Trevor Howard served in the British Airborne Division and saw
action in W.W.II. He was medically discharged after he received
the Military Cross for Valour in the field.

Mel Brooks (Yes, Mel Brooks) was in the Combat Engineers and saw
action in the Ardennes in the "Battle of the Bulge" He
deactivated mines and helped to clear mine fields. He used to
answer German propaganda that was broadcast at regular intervals
with a oudspeaker shouting "Toot Toot Tootsie goodbye!" I guess
Mel Brooks was Mel Brooks even back then.

Neville Brand fought in the European theatre of operations in
W.W.II from December 16th 1944 onwards, he fought in the Ardennes
aka "The Battle Of the Bulge," also in the Rhineland and Central
Europe. He received the Silver Star for Gallantry while in
hospital for his actions in combat. Also he was awarded the
Purple Heart, The Good Conduct Medal, the American defense
Ribbon, the European/African/Middle Eastern Theatre Ribbon with
three Battle Stars, one Overseas Service Bar, one Service Stripe,
and the Combat Infantryman's Badge.

Richard Attenborough served for 3 years in the RAF during W.W.II.

Gene Audrey was a pilot in the USAAF.

Pat Brady, Roy Rogers partner, was awarded 2 purple Hearts while
in combat in France.

Raymond Burr served in the US navy.

Robery Clary who played ' Lebeau' in Hogan's Heroes spent 3 years
in a concentration camp and still had the tattoo on his arm.


Jackie Coogan was a glider pilot and served in the Pacific.

Tony Curtis served in Submarines aboard the USS Dragonette.

George Kennedy served under General Patton.

Walter Mathau was a gunner and radio operator over the skies of
Europe and he was awarded 6 battle stars.

Rod Steiger Joined the US Navy and fought in the Pacific Fleet in
W.W.II. Information is a little sketchy about his exploits except
to say that he was a torpedo operator and that he fought in the
Battle of Midway.





Don't forget SFC Sabu Dastigir, AKA Sabu the Elephant boy from Tarzan
movies. SFC Dastigir DFC was a ball turret gunner for a full tour.

BTW, according to an essay in the web page "Tender Tales", Tony Curtis
(real name: Bernard Schwartz) served aboard sub tenders although he
was qualified to serve on subs.

Russ
--
Russ
"Two-fifteen, no ambulance needed!" (G. J. Golden, ECPD)
Subtract all nines to reply

Strabo wrote:





To make up for my deficiency I found others (confirmed).


Gene Autry - Sgt. Autry was in the U.S. Army Air Force, flying
supplies in the China-India-Burma theater of war, and served for
4+ years.

James Arness (Marshal Matt Dillon of Gunsmoke and brother of
Peter Graves, the "Mission Impossible" guy) was involved in the
landings at Anzio and was wounded there.

Richard Boone served as a tail gunner in Navy Torpedo planes and
saw action during W.W.II.

Trevor Howard served in the British Airborne Division and saw
action in W.W.II. He was medically discharged after he received
the Military Cross for Valour in the field.

Mel Brooks (Yes, Mel Brooks) was in the Combat Engineers and saw
action in the Ardennes in the "Battle of the Bulge" He
deactivated mines and helped to clear mine fields. He used to
answer German propaganda that was broadcast at regular intervals
with a oudspeaker shouting "Toot Toot Tootsie goodbye!" I guess
Mel Brooks was Mel Brooks even back then.

Neville Brand fought in the European theatre of operations in
W.W.II from December 16th 1944 onwards, he fought in the Ardennes
aka "The Battle Of the Bulge," also in the Rhineland and Central
Europe. He received the Silver Star for Gallantry while in
hospital for his actions in combat. Also he was awarded the
Purple Heart, The Good Conduct Medal, the American defense
Ribbon, the European/African/Middle Eastern Theatre Ribbon with
three Battle Stars, one Overseas Service Bar, one Service Stripe,
and the Combat Infantryman's Badge.

Richard Attenborough served for 3 years in the RAF during W.W.II.

Gene Audrey was a pilot in the USAAF.

Pat Brady, Roy Rogers partner, was awarded 2 purple Hearts while
in combat in France.

Raymond Burr served in the US navy.

Robery Clary who played ' Lebeau' in Hogan's Heroes spent 3 years
in a concentration camp and still had the tattoo on his arm.


Jackie Coogan was a glider pilot and served in the Pacific.

Tony Curtis served in Submarines aboard the USS Dragonette.

George Kennedy served under General Patton.

Walter Mathau was a gunner and radio operator over the skies of
Europe and he was awarded 6 battle stars.

Rod Steiger Joined the US Navy and fought in the Pacific Fleet in
W.W.II. Information is a little sketchy about his exploits except
to say that he was a torpedo operator and that he fought in the
Battle of Midway.






Well then, if history is any guide to the future, several of the
soldiers in the Iraq war will become famous movie actors, no?

Clark Magnuson wrote:

1) The conservatives have an advantage on the home turf of logic and
responsibility.
2) The liberals have an advantage on their home turf of emotion and
indulgence.


Actors, who's trade is in emotions, might be more likely to liberal.
The exceptions are when testosterone is needed to play the part, like
Bruce Willis, Steven Seagal, Tom Selleck, Kurt Russell, etc.
Those guys are not going to play the role of a Jewish
hairdresser/lawyer from New York.
They don't look like liberals.
They look like men.
Hollywood must make money, and despite the pinko agenda, they must
hire real men to play real men.


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7504339/

Ed Huntress wrote:
"Stuart Grey" wrote in message
...

But the Vennona project provided conclusive evidence that McCarthy and
others were right.


Let's not forget, based on Soviet archives made available to researchers in
1991, McCarthy proved to be WRONG in every case but one (possibly two) about
WHO those people were.

What are you talking about? McCarthy was damned because he refused to
name them. The one he did name was dead on a soviet agent.

Perhaps you're thinking of the House Un-American activities committee,
which DID make mistakes.

He knew something was going on, but he destroyed a lot of lives and careers
because he really didn't care who he painted with his brush.

Now I know you're talking about the HUAC. Senator McCarthy was a
senator, not a member of the house.

"Stuart Grey" wrote in message
...
Ed Huntress wrote:
"Stuart Grey" wrote in message
...

But the Vennona project provided conclusive evidence that McCarthy and
others were right.


Let's not forget, based on Soviet archives made available to researchers
in
1991, McCarthy proved to be WRONG in every case but one (possibly two)
about
WHO those people were.

What are you talking about? McCarthy was damned because he refused to
name them. The one he did name was dead on a soviet agent.

This is a myth. McCarthy's committee publicly named 83 individuals because
they had invoked the 5th Amendment in private hearings. He specifically
accused these people of treason: Howard McMurray, Mary Jane Keeney, John
Service, Gustavo Duran, Julian Wadleigh, and Harlow Shapley.

He also gave additional names to the Senate -- 81 of them -- accusing them
of communist "involvement." Some had, indeed, been communists during the
'30s. Most had nothing to do with communism.

Although McCarthy did try in the early days to keep names private, he
loosened his grip on that effort as he came under more political heat.
Eventually, he was accusing everyone in sight.


Perhaps you're thinking of the House Un-American activities committee,
which DID make mistakes.

Another kettle of fish...and reptiles, amphibians, and bird-brains.


He knew something was going on, but he destroyed a lot of lives and
careers
because he really didn't care who he painted with his brush.

Now I know you're talking about the HUAC. Senator McCarthy was a
senator, not a member of the house.

Nope. The McCarthy committee was a Senate committee.

--
Ed Huntress

"Clark Magnuson" wrote in message
...
1) The conservatives have an advantage on the home turf of logic and
responsibility.
2) The liberals have an advantage on their home turf of emotion and
indulgence.


Actors, who's trade is in emotions, might be more likely to liberal.
The exceptions are when testosterone is needed to play the part, like
Bruce Willis, Steven Seagal, Tom Selleck, Kurt Russell, etc.
Those guys are not going to play the role of a Jewish hairdresser/lawyer
from New York.
They don't look like liberals.
They look like men.
Hollywood must make money, and despite the pinko agenda, they must hire
real men to play real men.

Like Rock Hudson?

"Tom Miller" wrote in
message ...


Like Rock Hudson?



LOL. Good one.

If Bruce promotes his film in France that does not make him a
commie-fag-junkie.

It DOES make him part of a film that features the United Nation without
deploring the UN as being on a level with slavery and Nazism.