I am shoping for a refrigerator. I can only connact to a 15A circuit.

I looked some of the Maytag and Kenmore models. Some just listed as
UL rating. Some stated that the maximum amps is 20.

So do I need a 20A circuit for a refrigerator? The fridge will be in
a finished basement.

Thanks for input.

Y.

"a guest" wrote in message
...
I am shoping for a refrigerator. I can only connact to a 15A circuit.

I looked some of the Maytag and Kenmore models. Some just listed as
UL rating. Some stated that the maximum amps is 20.

So do I need a 20A circuit for a refrigerator? The fridge will be in
a finished basement.

Why don't you just up the breaker to a 20 AMP?

Yeah, or just jumper around it.

Yeah, or just jumper around it.

"Dr. Hardcrab" wrote in message

So do I need a 20A circuit for a refrigerator? The fridge will be in
a finished basement.

Why don't you just up the breaker to a 20 AMP?

OK if you up the wire along with it. There are codes for wire size and
breaker size and it was developed to prevent fires.

a guest wrote:
I am shoping for a refrigerator. I can only connact to a 15A circuit.

I looked some of the Maytag and Kenmore models. Some just listed as
UL rating. Some stated that the maximum amps is 20.

So do I need a 20A circuit for a refrigerator? The fridge will be in
a finished basement.

Code only requires a 15A circuit. Doesn't even have to be dedicated, although
it ain't a bad idea.

"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
news:vAMSd.32750$s16.8322@trndny02...

"Dr. Hardcrab" wrote in message

So do I need a 20A circuit for a refrigerator? The fridge will be in
a finished basement.

Why don't you just up the breaker to a 20 AMP?

OK if you up the wire along with it. There are codes for wire size and
breaker size and it was developed to prevent fires.


Ooops!

My house has mostly 12-2 wire so going from a 15 to 20 amp breaker would
work. Probably not to code to have a 20 amp on 14-2 wire......

they are probably stating that they should be on a max 20A breaker so it has
a chance of tripping if there is a problem, not that the fridge under full
load draws 20 amps. find out what the fridge will actually draw... i
cannot imagine you need more than 15 amps.

randy

"a guest" wrote in message
...
I am shoping for a refrigerator. I can only connact to a 15A circuit.

I looked some of the Maytag and Kenmore models. Some just listed as
UL rating. Some stated that the maximum amps is 20.

So do I need a 20A circuit for a refrigerator? The fridge will be in
a finished basement.

Thanks for input.

Y.

I don't know where you got your code book Andy, but mine says 20 amp
dedicated.

"a guest" wrote in message
...
I am shoping for a refrigerator. I can only connact to a 15A circuit.

I looked some of the Maytag and Kenmore models. Some just listed as
UL rating. Some stated that the maximum amps is 20.

So do I need a 20A circuit for a refrigerator? The fridge will be in
a finished basement.

Thanks for input.

Y.

You should be OK. I just looked at a couple of web pages to see what power
they actually draw, but they did not list the specification. Kitchen Aid
did state a 15A or 20A circuit is sufficient.

As a matter of code I believe new homes must be wired with a single 20A
circuit for the refrigerator. This is to allow for a decent power draw and
it avoids having the fridge and toaster on the same line, blowing breakers,
etc. It is just good common sense.

I have a second fridge in the basement also and it is on a 15A line and has
been for over 20 years. New models take much less power than the older ones.
What you want to be careful of is putting a lot of other appliances or heavy
draw items on that branch circuit. Safety aside, you don't want the kids to
plug in a game, blow the breaker and they go out and play. Three days later
you find the fridge is now warm and food spoiled.

Yeah, or just jumper around it.

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
"a guest" wrote in message
...

I am shoping for a refrigerator. I can only connact to a 15A circuit.

I looked some of the Maytag and Kenmore models. Some just listed as
UL rating. Some stated that the maximum amps is 20.

So do I need a 20A circuit for a refrigerator? The fridge will be in
a finished basement.

Thanks for input.

Y.


You should be OK. I just looked at a couple of web pages to see what power
they actually draw, but they did not list the specification. Kitchen Aid
did state a 15A or 20A circuit is sufficient.

As a matter of code I believe new homes must be wired with a single 20A
circuit for the refrigerator. This is to allow for a decent power draw and
it avoids having the fridge and toaster on the same line, blowing breakers,
etc. It is just good common sense.

I have a second fridge in the basement also and it is on a 15A line and has
been for over 20 years. New models take much less power than the older ones.
What you want to be careful of is putting a lot of other appliances or heavy
draw items on that branch circuit. Safety aside, you don't want the kids to
plug in a game, blow the breaker and they go out and play. Three days later
you find the fridge is now warm and food spoiled.




Thanks all who replied.

I figured 15A is probably OK, as my current main refregerator is on
a 15A circuit shared with rangehhod and some lights.

Those refregerators doesn't require much energy - the yellow tags stated
that they run 400 - 600 KWH per year, which is $30 to $40 a year (it
costs less than 7 cents/KWH here.)

"Matt" wrote:
I don't know where you got your code book Andy, but mine says 20 amp
dedicated.

Hmmmm. Code book probably came out of the same bubble-gum machine my super-spy
decoder ring came out of.

Could've sworn 2002 NEC (which is my reference copy) put the 'fridge on one of
the two required Small Appliance circuits in the kitchen. Either I'm
mis-remembering (highly likely), or one of the newer NECs has added yet another
gratuitous dedicated circuit (there's so many required dedicated circuits
anymore, there must be kickbacks from the breaker box industry involved).

Naw. I don't really have a code book.

Got ya.

But, when I was doing residential electric.... anything other than a
dedicated 12 gauge 20 amp circuit would fail inspection everytime; and
that was back in 1981.

a guest wrote:

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

"a guest" wrote in message
...

I am shoping for a refrigerator. I can only connact to a 15A circuit.

I looked some of the Maytag and Kenmore models. Some just listed as
UL rating. Some stated that the maximum amps is 20.

So do I need a 20A circuit for a refrigerator? The fridge will be in
a finished basement.

Thanks for input.

Y.



You should be OK. I just looked at a couple of web pages to see what
power they actually draw, but they did not list the specification.
Kitchen Aid did state a 15A or 20A circuit is sufficient.

As a matter of code I believe new homes must be wired with a single
20A circuit for the refrigerator. This is to allow for a decent power
draw and it avoids having the fridge and toaster on the same line,
blowing breakers, etc. It is just good common sense.

I have a second fridge in the basement also and it is on a 15A line
and has been for over 20 years. New models take much less power than
the older ones. What you want to be careful of is putting a lot of
other appliances or heavy draw items on that branch circuit. Safety
aside, you don't want the kids to plug in a game, blow the breaker and
they go out and play. Three days later you find the fridge is now
warm and food spoiled.



Thanks all who replied.

I figured 15A is probably OK, as my current main refregerator is on
a 15A circuit shared with rangehhod and some lights.

Those refregerators doesn't require much energy - the yellow tags stated
that they run 400 - 600 KWH per year, which is $30 to $40 a year (it
costs less than 7 cents/KWH here.)

Finally somebody pointed that out. I just bought a frig and it uses
less than a 60-watt bulb running continuously. I actually checked this
with a Kill-A-Watt meter.

If your 60 watt bulb is running, you better catch it before it gets out
the door!

Ha!

William W. Plummer wrote:
a guest wrote:
Those refregerators doesn't require much energy - the yellow tags
stated
that they run 400 - 600 KWH per year, which is $30 to $40 a year
(it
costs less than 7 cents/KWH here.)

Finally somebody pointed that out. I just bought a frig and it uses

less than a 60-watt bulb running continuously. I actually checked
this
with a Kill-A-Watt meter.

I presume you mean it uses less *total kwh* than a 60-watt bulb running
continuously. What was the starting current and the running current? I
don't think the breaker is sized according to average current draw,
which includes time when it isn't running.

%mod%

"Matt" wrote:
Naw. I don't really have a code book.

Got ya.

But, when I was doing residential electric.... anything other than a
dedicated 12 gauge 20 amp circuit would fail inspection everytime; and
that was back in 1981.

Got me, I guess. Went and checked my doorstop, I mean, the NEC, and at least
the 2002 allows the 'fridge to be on one of the kitchen SA circuits (which have
to be 20A, 'tho -- mis-remembered that one). Sure seems unlikely the newer
NECs would require a dedicated circuit...newer 'fridges draw *less* juice than
the older ones, not less.

1981 seriously predated my trying to go by code. I occasionally helped my dad
wire up stuff around the house in that timeframe, but I can guarantee that a
large part of it never met code by any reasonable definition. Wonder if that
"required 20A dedicated circuit" you had to deal with was a local code
requirement?

Yah... could be; probably was local code. All I remember is wiring
kitchens was a real bitch cause of all the different dedicated circuits
you had to run for DW/Disposal, and appliances. I always hated
stringing 12 ga wire. Always got along real well with 14 ga; but 12 ga
and higher always ****ed me off. Except for 8 ga copper to the stove..
it always went in no problem.

One time I was in this SEVERLY HIGH END residential remodel job... some
freaking mansion from like 1920 that was being updated, and whoever
roughed the kitchen in ran 10 ga to an appliance outlet, but left the
old box in place, and the box was like 1/4 deep, or so it seemed, and I
was futzing with it and futzing with it and then I started cussing at
it and finally just got completely ****ed and jammed everything in, and
put the cover plate on, and it looked like complete hell cause the
outlet was crooked and also was not flush; and I turned around and
walked straight into the owner who had been watching me the whole time.
Ah, memories.

"a guest" wrote in message
...
I am shoping for a refrigerator. I can only connact to a 15A circuit.

I looked some of the Maytag and Kenmore models. Some just listed as
UL rating. Some stated that the maximum amps is 20.

So do I need a 20A circuit for a refrigerator? The fridge will be in
a finished basement.

Thanks for input.

Y.

From Whirlpool (copy & paste):
Electrical Requirements
15 OR 20 Ampere, 115 Volts, 60 Hertz (1/second). FUSED ELECTRICAL SUPPLY IS
REQUIRED. GROUNDED CIRCUIT IS REQUIRED. A TIME-DELAY FUSE OR CIRCUIT BREAKER
AND SEPARATE CIRCUIT IS RECOMMENDED.

Sure that was not maximum over current protection? As in max breaker
size?

a guest wrote:
I am shoping for a refrigerator. I can only connact to a 15A circuit.

I looked some of the Maytag and Kenmore models. Some just listed as
UL rating. Some stated that the maximum amps is 20.

So do I need a 20A circuit for a refrigerator? The fridge will be in
a finished basement.

Thanks for input.

Y.

"Andy Hill" wrote in message
...
"Matt" wrote:
I don't know where you got your code book Andy, but mine says 20 amp
dedicated.

Hmmmm. Code book probably came out of the same bubble-gum machine my
super-spy
decoder ring came out of.

Could've sworn 2002 NEC (which is my reference copy) put the 'fridge on
one of
the two required Small Appliance circuits in the kitchen. Either I'm
mis-remembering (highly likely), or one of the newer NECs has added yet
another
gratuitous dedicated circuit (there's so many required dedicated circuits
anymore, there must be kickbacks from the breaker box industry involved).

So now the fellow that wants a frig in his basement has to run a dropcord
upstairs to the kitchen receptical :-)

"Ralph Mowery" wrote:
"Andy Hill" wrote in message
.. .
"Matt" wrote:
I don't know where you got your code book Andy, but mine says 20 amp
dedicated.

Hmmmm. Code book probably came out of the same bubble-gum machine my
super-spy
decoder ring came out of.

Could've sworn 2002 NEC (which is my reference copy) put the 'fridge on
one of
the two required Small Appliance circuits in the kitchen. Either I'm
mis-remembering (highly likely), or one of the newer NECs has added yet
another
gratuitous dedicated circuit (there's so many required dedicated circuits
anymore, there must be kickbacks from the breaker box industry involved).

So now the fellow that wants a frig in his basement has to run a dropcord
upstairs to the kitchen receptical :-)

As long as he ain't getting inspected, it don't matter. Hell, I run my 'fridge
offa two bare wires running from my washer outlet. Only took the baby a
couple of times before she lernt to crawl around the wires.

BTW, ;-}

My house has mostly 12-2 wire so going from a 15 to 20 amp breaker would
work. Probably not to code to have a 20 amp on 14-2 wire......
-----------
That's right. 12-2 for 20 amp is code. 14-2 is 15 amp max by code.

wrote:
William W. Plummer wrote:

a guest wrote:

Those refregerators doesn't require much energy - the yellow tags

stated

that they run 400 - 600 KWH per year, which is $30 to $40 a year

(it

costs less than 7 cents/KWH here.)


Finally somebody pointed that out. I just bought a frig and it uses


less than a 60-watt bulb running continuously. I actually checked

this

with a Kill-A-Watt meter.


I presume you mean it uses less *total kwh* than a 60-watt bulb running
continuously. What was the starting current and the running current? I
don't think the breaker is sized according to average current draw,
which includes time when it isn't running.

%mod%


Ok, so far everyone is talking nonsense or around
the point. You are right, what one needs to know
is the running power usage.

My old whirlpool (no ice maker) says the running
power requirement is 330 to 420 watts. That
between 3 and 4 A. Newer machines undoubtedly use
more electricity, but I can't imagine one using 10
A except at start up and a 15 A breaker allows for
temporary overage at start up.

My house built in 1976 has no dedicated circuit
for the refrigerator. The reason refrigerator
and freezer manufactures emphasize using a
dedicated circuit is so that another device
doesn't trip the breaker and you loose all the
food. Imagine having a half a beef in your
freezer (or a 1/4 in a refrigerator/freezer unit)
and some other appliance popping the breaker,
especially while you are on vacation, and no one
notices for a week. A dedicated circuit has
nothing to do with safety, it has to do with
economics.

"George E. Cawthon" wrote in message
My old whirlpool (no ice maker) says the running power requirement is 330
to 420 watts. That between 3 and 4 A. Newer machines undoubtedly use
more electricity, but I can't imagine one using 10 A except at start up
and a 15 A breaker allows for temporary overage at start up.

Don't be suprised if the new ones use less. I got rid of an old 10 cu. ft
fridge and replaced it with a new 18 cu. ft. frost free and my electric bill
went down $10 a month. It has a nameplate rating of 4.75 A The kitchen
fridge has a Full Load rating of 6.5A for a 21 Cu. ft. side by side.

Searching a few web sites, they don't give any power requirements aside from
115V so doing any comparisons is not going to be simple. . In any case, a
15A breaker can certainly handle that load.


A dedicated circuit has nothing to do with safety, it has to do with
economics.

I'm not so sure. My house built in 1978 has a separate circuit. The safety
issue is not what the fridge will draw, but what other kitchen appliances
will do along with it. I'm not up on the code but I believe there is
specifics for counter receptacles as they can easily carry coffee makers,
toaster ovens, microwaves, all going at the same time.
--
Ed
http://pages.cthome.net/edhome/

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
"George E. Cawthon" wrote in message

My old whirlpool (no ice maker) says the running power requirement is 330
to 420 watts. That between 3 and 4 A. Newer machines undoubtedly use
more electricity, but I can't imagine one using 10 A except at start up
and a 15 A breaker allows for temporary overage at start up.


Don't be suprised if the new ones use less. I got rid of an old 10 cu. ft
fridge and replaced it with a new 18 cu. ft. frost free and my electric bill
went down $10 a month. It has a nameplate rating of 4.75 A The kitchen
fridge has a Full Load rating of 6.5A for a 21 Cu. ft. side by side.

Searching a few web sites, they don't give any power requirements aside from
115V so doing any comparisons is not going to be simple. . In any case, a
15A breaker can certainly handle that load.


A dedicated circuit has nothing to do with safety, it has to do with
economics.


I'm not so sure. My house built in 1978 has a separate circuit. The safety
issue is not what the fridge will draw, but what other kitchen appliances
will do along with it. I'm not up on the code but I believe there is
specifics for counter receptacles as they can easily carry coffee makers,
toaster ovens, microwaves, all going at the same time.

New units of the same size may use less
electricity, but many of the new ones are much
larger and have way more features that older
models which I expect would offset any increased
efficiency. Certainly your 4.76 and 6.5A ratings
are larger than mine. BTW, my figures came off
the circuit page for the frig.

I'm sure that safety isn't a factor. The
circuit(s) are protected by the breakers. The
only thing that putting the various appliances on
separate circuits does, is reduce the likelihood
that the breakers will trip. Tripping isn't a
safety problem, just an inconvenience or loss of
food if it goes unnoticed.

It would have to be a pretty big refrigerator to need a 20A breaker. I
think mine uses something like 8A.

wrote:
It would have to be a pretty big refrigerator to need a 20A breaker. I
think mine uses something like 8A.


I agree. My current main refregerator (25 cu ft) is on a 15A circuit
that is shared with some lights and rangehood. It never tripped the
circuit breaker.

However, browsing the net, and you see specifications like:
http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/produ...ab=spe#tablink

and maximum amps is 20.
I was wondering if the newer refregerators requires larger circuit.

"a guest" wrote in message

However, browsing the net, and you see specifications like:
http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/produ...ab=spe#tablink

and maximum amps is 20.
I was wondering if the newer refregerators requires larger circuit.

I think the maximum is for a safety factor to assure the breaker will trip
from a serious overload. I don't wee any amperage information on any of the
web pages I looked at for a few brands, just what is on the nameplate on
mine.

"Dr. Hardcrab" wrote:
"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
news:vAMSd.32750$s16.8322@trndny02...

"Dr. Hardcrab" wrote in message

So do I need a 20A circuit for a refrigerator? The fridge will be in
a finished basement.

Why don't you just up the breaker to a 20 AMP?

OK if you up the wire along with it. There are codes for wire size and
breaker size and it was developed to prevent fires.


Ooops!

My house has mostly 12-2 wire so going from a 15 to 20 amp breaker would
work. Probably not to code to have a 20 amp on 14-2 wire......

Color me curious, but why would you be running a 15A breaker on a circuit wired
with 12GA in the first place? Might as well let the circuit work up to its
capacity.

because most appliances are 15 amp or less.
if one goes haywire and smokes itself the 15 amp breaker
will trip before the 20


"Andy Hill" wrote in message
...
"Dr. Hardcrab" wrote:
"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
news:vAMSd.32750$s16.8322@trndny02...

"Dr. Hardcrab" wrote in message

So do I need a 20A circuit for a refrigerator? The fridge will be in
a finished basement.

Why don't you just up the breaker to a 20 AMP?

OK if you up the wire along with it. There are codes for wire size and
breaker size and it was developed to prevent fires.


Ooops!

My house has mostly 12-2 wire so going from a 15 to 20 amp breaker would
work. Probably not to code to have a 20 amp on 14-2 wire......

Color me curious, but why would you be running a 15A breaker on a circuit
wired
with 12GA in the first place? Might as well let the circuit work up to
its
capacity.

"George E. Cawthon" wrote in message
Don't be suprised if the new ones use less. I got rid of an old 10 cu. ft
fridge and replaced it with a new 18 cu. ft. frost free and my electric
bill went down $10 a month. It has a nameplate rating of 4.75 A The
kitchen fridge has a Full Load rating of 6.5A for a 21 Cu. ft. side by
side.

New units of the same size may use less electricity, but many of the new
ones are much larger and have way more features that older models which I
expect would offset any increased efficiency. Certainly your 4.76 and
6.5A ratings are larger than mine. BTW, my figures came off the circuit
page for the frig.

OK, the refrigerator I mentioned before was not 10 cu. ft, but 7.2. We have
it at work and I just checked the tag. It says I takes 5.5A. It has such
luxury features as a lightbulb inside. The freezer is inside the main door,
not a two door model.

The new 18 cu. ft. takes 4.5A and is frons free so a defrost cycle must run
as well as a fan. Two and a half times more in size, more features, less
power. The missing factor is how many hours they run to maintain the same
temperature, but as I said, my electrri bill went down $10 a month.
Improved compressor design, better insualtion, better door seals all make a
difference.

In article ,
Andy Hill wrote:

Color me curious, but why would you be running a 15A breaker on a circuit
wired
with 12GA in the first place? Might as well let the circuit work up to its
capacity.

The cable might have its ampacity reduced due to bundling, running
through a hot attic, etc. The rule of thumb of "14 AWG for 15 A" and
"12 AWG for 20 A" is generally acceptable but not always -- the real NEC
rules are quite a bit more complicated.

--
Steve Kives -- Unix sysadmin/netadmin -- Denver, CO
Forward and fiaka, Manacle an den gosaka

In article ,
Andy Hill wrote:

"Matt" wrote:
Naw. I don't really have a code book.

Got ya.

But, when I was doing residential electric.... anything other than a
dedicated 12 gauge 20 amp circuit would fail inspection everytime; and
that was back in 1981.

Got me, I guess. Went and checked my doorstop, I mean, the NEC, and at
least
the 2002 allows the 'fridge to be on one of the kitchen SA circuits (which
have
to be 20A, 'tho -- mis-remembered that one). Sure seems unlikely the newer
NECs would require a dedicated circuit...newer 'fridges draw *less* juice
than
the older ones, not less.

1981 seriously predated my trying to go by code. I occasionally helped my
dad
wire up stuff around the house in that timeframe, but I can guarantee that a
large part of it never met code by any reasonable definition. Wonder if
that
"required 20A dedicated circuit" you had to deal with was a local code
requirement?

The dedicated circuit for the fridge (whether required or not) is a good
idea for two reasons:

1) The kitchen circuits must be GFCI these days, and nuisance tripping
of those outlets means your ice cream could melt.

2) All the high power draws of modern kitchen appliances are more
likely to trip breakers, again causing your ice cream to melt.

It seems to me that a dedicated one-receptacle circuit for the fridge
(allowable by NEC to be non-GFCI) is a small price to pay for peace of
mind.

--
Steve Kives -- Unix sysadmin/netadmin -- Denver, CO
Forward and fiaka, Manacle an den gosaka