On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 22:48:04 -0000, Meanie wrote:

On 12/15/2016 5:38 PM, trader_4 wrote:
On Thursday, December 15, 2016 at 5:30:57 PM UTC-5, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 15:46:06 -0000, Muggles wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 05:17:13 -0500, Dev Null
wrote:
Law-abiding
people are just happy another criminal is dead.

That's probably true, but this man wasn't a criminal.

He looked like he was carrying a firearm.

1) Don't look like you're carrying a firearm
2) Don't live in a ****ed up country where most people do carry one, so you're assumed to have one.


Just for the record, most people in the USA don't carry guns, not
even close. Only a small percentage. IDK anyone who carries, other
than cops that I've know, and that's for my entire life. Part of
that reason is that here in NJ, you basically can't get a permit,
it isn't allowed. And I'm not living with gang bangers. Now, if
you went to certain high crime area, infested with drugs and gangs,
like parts of Chicago, Detroit, Camden, etc, well then you'd find
more people carrying, but I highly doubt that even there it's anywhere
near a majority. It only takes small percentages of bad actors to
cause most of the problems.


Don't spoil the boys fun. His simple mind thinks every single American
is the same. That's what the Brits learn.

The stats show you shoot each other all the time. The whole of the world knows America is a third world country where you kill each other like Muslim neanderthals.

--
If a person with multiple personalities threatens suicide, is that person considered a hostage situation?

On 12/15/2016 5:52 PM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 22:48:04 -0000, Meanie wrote:

On 12/15/2016 5:38 PM, trader_4 wrote:
On Thursday, December 15, 2016 at 5:30:57 PM UTC-5, James Wilkinson
Sword wrote:
On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 15:46:06 -0000, Muggles
wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 05:17:13 -0500, Dev Null
wrote:
Law-abiding
people are just happy another criminal is dead.

That's probably true, but this man wasn't a criminal.

He looked like he was carrying a firearm.

1) Don't look like you're carrying a firearm
2) Don't live in a ****ed up country where most people do carry one,
so you're assumed to have one.


Just for the record, most people in the USA don't carry guns, not
even close. Only a small percentage. IDK anyone who carries, other
than cops that I've know, and that's for my entire life. Part of
that reason is that here in NJ, you basically can't get a permit,
it isn't allowed. And I'm not living with gang bangers. Now, if
you went to certain high crime area, infested with drugs and gangs,
like parts of Chicago, Detroit, Camden, etc, well then you'd find
more people carrying, but I highly doubt that even there it's anywhere
near a majority. It only takes small percentages of bad actors to
cause most of the problems.


Don't spoil the boys fun. His simple mind thinks every single American
is the same. That's what the Brits learn.

The stats show you shoot each other all the time. The whole of the
world knows America is a third world country where you kill each other
like Muslim neanderthals.


Then ensure you don't wear your turban when you visit. The good part is
you'll never visit. Sissies never do.

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 13:27:50 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:
The most effective, simplest thing would be for
perps to cooperate with the police, accept being
detained or arrested, not resist arrest, etc.

The problem is the public is not trained to respond to police, BUT
the police ARE highly trained to respond to the public.

It's time the police engage their training and stop resorting to
lethal force as a first response.

--
Maggie

On Thursday, December 15, 2016 at 4:46:05 PM UTC-6, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

As I understand it, in most of America it's easy to get a gun. In the UK it's very difficult. You have to prove it's for shooting game etc, and not carry it about in the street.


In the USA anyone of age who is not a convicted felon can purchase
a gun from a dealer. There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal. Are those buyers or sellers felons
or in possession of stolen weapons? Maybe, maybe not but there's
no law preventing them from doing the deal.

Do I have a gun? Yes. Do I have a permit to carry it? Yes.
Do I? No.

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 13:29:57 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:
I agree, but LE needs to first acknowledge their
procedures need an overhaul.

We'll put you in charge of that overhaul.

How about LE engaging the training they have already?

Lethal force is not their only choice in how they respond. Military
tactics should also be a last resort, yet it's used against ordinary
citizens when deescalation techniques would have a more positive
result.

--
Maggie

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 17:13:25 -0500, Meanie wrote:
She'll spin it any way possible to fit her agenda. It's
what liberals do.

Funny thing is, I'm a conservative and republican.

--
Maggie

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 17:11:56 -0500, Meanie wrote:
emotional liberals (Mr and Mrs Muggles) who
complain when they don't

You two seem a little obsessed with me. Geeez...

--
Maggie

On 15/12/2016 21:57, Oren wrote:
On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 14:51:43 +0000, Bod wrote:

I wonder what your life expectancy would be if you were a cop.


In the USA or the UK police?

In the UK you would die from exhaustion the first day as a rookie,
passing out chocolate bars and doing hug-a-thugs.

Maybe your crooks are only guilty of singing to loud in church.

One things for sure, our cops are a lot more patient and not
confrontational. That's why very few get shot by cops here.
If a driver gets stopped here, you can get out of the car and walk up to
the cops with your hands wherever you like, in your pockets or wherever
you choose to put them and the cops won't bark any commands at you or be
worried and no cop will pull a gun on you, it just doesn't happen in
normal road stops.

The simple reason is that 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun so it's
all done casual and friendly.

Your cops are on edge because of the proliferation of guns. It's a
simple fact.

On 12/16/2016 1:47 AM, Bod wrote:
One things for sure, our cops are a lot more patient and not confrontational. That's why very few get shot by cops here.


[bod**** snipped]


Your cops are on edge because of the proliferation of guns. It's a simple fact.


You think we can't google?

http://www.news.com.au/world/breakin...355bf6c9a18b36

On 12/15/2016 11:04 PM, ItsJoanNotJoann wrote:
On Thursday, December 15, 2016 at 4:46:05 PM UTC-6, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

As I understand it, in most of America it's easy to get a gun. In the UK it's very difficult. You have to prove it's for shooting game etc, and not carry it about in the street.


In the USA anyone of age who is not a convicted felon can purchase
a gun from a dealer. There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal. Are those buyers or sellers felons
or in possession of stolen weapons? Maybe, maybe not but there's
no law preventing them from doing the deal.

Do I have a gun? Yes. Do I have a permit to carry it? Yes.
Do I? No.

Then one would think that you'd be better informed (or at least know how
to properly phrase your thoughts/beliefs in writing).

1) There are laws to prohibiting buyers and sellers from dealing in
stolen guns.

2) There are laws prohibiting convicted felons (and some others) from
buying or possessing guns.

3) In many states private transactions in firearms are prohibited UNLESS
the buyer and seller abide by background checks through the state.

4) In other states, Minnesota for one, you must obtain a permit from the
police in order to purchase a handgun through a licensed dealer.

So, there ARE laws designed to prohibit the transactions you refer to
but there is also a law - applicable to just about any state, country or
culture you can name that says, "Thou shall not kill."

How's that working to prevent all murders?

On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 06:47:55 +0000
Bod wrote:

One things for sure, our cops are a lot more patient

Just the ones without a gun and no balls...
oh wait that is most of them...pussified *******s..Kissy!

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:04:37 AM UTC-5, ItsJoanNotJoann wrote:
On Thursday, December 15, 2016 at 4:46:05 PM UTC-6, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

As I understand it, in most of America it's easy to get a gun. In the UK it's very difficult. You have to prove it's for shooting game etc, and not carry it about in the street.


In the USA anyone of age who is not a convicted felon can purchase
a gun from a dealer.


Not true. Federal law and the federal database also block people who
have been confined to a mental hospital, adjudicated nuts by a court,
terrorist types put on there by FBI, etc.

And then many states have additional blocks. NJ for example has a permit
process where you have to answer questions about mental health, give job
and personal references. The police then check you out, call the references,
and if they find something, they will deny the permit.



There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal. Are those buyers or sellers felons
or in possession of stolen weapons? Maybe, maybe not but there's
no law preventing them from doing the deal.


That's not true either. Not true in NJ, for the above listed reasons.
And not true in the 50 states either if you know the person you're
selling it to is a felon for example.



Do I have a gun? Yes. Do I have a permit to carry it? Yes.
Do I? No.

I'm surprised you don't know the laws then.

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 9:00:37 AM UTC-5, Unquestionably Confused wrote:
On 12/15/2016 11:04 PM, ItsJoanNotJoann wrote:
On Thursday, December 15, 2016 at 4:46:05 PM UTC-6, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

As I understand it, in most of America it's easy to get a gun. In the UK it's very difficult. You have to prove it's for shooting game etc, and not carry it about in the street.


In the USA anyone of age who is not a convicted felon can purchase
a gun from a dealer. There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal. Are those buyers or sellers felons
or in possession of stolen weapons? Maybe, maybe not but there's
no law preventing them from doing the deal.

Do I have a gun? Yes. Do I have a permit to carry it? Yes.
Do I? No.

Then one would think that you'd be better informed (or at least know how
to properly phrase your thoughts/beliefs in writing).

1) There are laws to prohibiting buyers and sellers from dealing in
stolen guns.

2) There are laws prohibiting convicted felons (and some others) from
buying or possessing guns.

3) In many states private transactions in firearms are prohibited UNLESS
the buyer and seller abide by background checks through the state.

Exactly. NJ for example, you need a firearms ID card to buy any
long gun. And a separate permit for each pistol purchased, whether
from a private party or at a dealer. To obtain either of those
requires filling out an application where they ask about mental
health, job reference, personal references. You have to be
fingerprinted and they use that together with the other info
to do a background check with the FBI. The local police call
the references. Last time I did a pistol permit, it took almost
a year.



4) In other states, Minnesota for one, you must obtain a permit from the
police in order to purchase a handgun through a licensed dealer.

So, there ARE laws designed to prohibit the transactions you refer to
but there is also a law - applicable to just about any state, country or
culture you can name that says, "Thou shall not kill."

How's that working to prevent all murders?

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 1:48:00 AM UTC-5, Bod wrote:
On 15/12/2016 21:57, Oren wrote:
On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 14:51:43 +0000, Bod wrote:

I wonder what your life expectancy would be if you were a cop.


In the USA or the UK police?

In the UK you would die from exhaustion the first day as a rookie,
passing out chocolate bars and doing hug-a-thugs.

Maybe your crooks are only guilty of singing to loud in church.

One things for sure, our cops are a lot more patient and not
confrontational. That's why very few get shot by cops here.
If a driver gets stopped here, you can get out of the car and walk up to
the cops with your hands wherever you like, in your pockets or wherever
you choose to put them and the cops won't bark any commands at you or be
worried and no cop will pull a gun on you, it just doesn't happen in
normal road stops.

The simple reason is that 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun so it's
all done casual and friendly.

The same is true here. 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun. But it
only takes one bad guy. How lucky do you feel today?



Your cops are on edge because of the proliferation of guns. It's a
simple fact.

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:12:01 AM UTC-5, Muggles wrote:
On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 13:29:57 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:
I agree, but LE needs to first acknowledge their
procedures need an overhaul.

We'll put you in charge of that overhaul.

How about LE engaging the training they have already?

Lethal force is not their only choice in how they respond. Military
tactics should also be a last resort, yet it's used against ordinary
citizens when deescalation techniques would have a more positive
result.

--
Maggie

Cite the evidence that the officers in this case did not follow
procedure. Being a loon, you jump to the unsupported conclusion
that because some person who did not have a gun was shot, the
police were wrong, did not follow procedure. So, show us the
procedures of that police dept that they did not follow. Once
again, you're junping to conclusions, instead of waiting for a
full investigation of the incident.

On Thursday, December 15, 2016 at 1:32:21 PM UTC-5, FromTheRafters wrote:
It happens that trader_4 formulated :
On Wednesday, December 14, 2016 at 4:44:13 PM UTC-5, James Wilkinson Sword
wrote:
On Wed, 14 Dec 2016 17:14:57 -0000, Bod wrote:

Yet another unarmed man killed by police.

Police in Bakersfield, Calif., found a crucifix on an unarmed
73-year-old retiree with dementia shot dead by an officer, after police
said the man ignored their requests to remove his hands from his jacket.

"During a search of Mr. Serna a dark-colored simulated woodgrain
crucifix was recovered," read a statement from the Bakersfield Police
Department. "Mr. Serna was not armed at the time of the shooting. No
firearm has been recovered."

Serna has never carried a gun and was opposed to firearms, Serna's son,
Frank Serna, told KGET. "I don't know what led police to believe he had
a gun," Frank Serna said.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2...e-ca/95399066/

The problem is not the police, the problem is the high likelihood of an
American citizen carrying a gun. The demented man looked like he was hiding
a gun. So here we have an example of gun owners making it more dangerous
for non gun owners, without even touching them.

--
G.A.Y. - Got Aids Yet?

What total BS. What made it particularly dangerous for this man was
that the police had received 911 calls telling them that this man
was accosting people and THAT HE HAD A GUN. Police got there and
his behavior was consistent with a perp hiding a gun, refusing to take
his hands out of his pockets.

As someone else pointed out, it's also possible that this was a suicide
by cop.

That was me speculating. It just seemed to me that he might have been
accosting neighbors while pretending to have a gun so that they would
call the police. The outcome is very predictable. Some insurance
policies have double or triple indemnity for violent or accidental
death and no payout at all for suicides.

Again, it is a case of wait and see what the investigation turns up
instead of jumping to conclusions based on practically zero evidence as
some here are known to do.

Things don't always turn out as first reported. Just today
we learned that the muslim student who claimed to have been harassed
over her religion, by several drunks on a train that said "Trump"
is a total liar. She now admits she made it up because she was late
coming home after curfew.

In this case I wonder how that neighbor feels about amplifying the
'might have been a gun' to 'has a revolver' which is a very specific
statement.

The neighbor was the husband of the woman the guy came up to. He may
have amplified it, but we don't know what she actually said to him,
what he heard, etc. But regardless, it was called into the police as
a guy with a revolver.

I wonder what the other neighbor who had the incident the afternoon
before thinks? Had that neighbor called police, this might have been
prevented. But, at the end of the day, this deranged guy was allowed
to leave his house at least 3 times in about 12 hours, causing
incidents each time. Like I said in other posts, if I had someone
like that at home, I'd tell the neighbors so they know what's going
on and I'd figure out how to keep them from getting out so easily.

On 16/12/2016 16:43, trader_4 wrote:
On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 1:48:00 AM UTC-5, Bod wrote:
On 15/12/2016 21:57, Oren wrote:
On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 14:51:43 +0000, Bod wrote:

I wonder what your life expectancy would be if you were a cop.


In the USA or the UK police?

In the UK you would die from exhaustion the first day as a rookie,
passing out chocolate bars and doing hug-a-thugs.

Maybe your crooks are only guilty of singing to loud in church.

One things for sure, our cops are a lot more patient and not
confrontational. That's why very few get shot by cops here.
If a driver gets stopped here, you can get out of the car and walk up to
the cops with your hands wherever you like, in your pockets or wherever
you choose to put them and the cops won't bark any commands at you or be
worried and no cop will pull a gun on you, it just doesn't happen in
normal road stops.

The simple reason is that 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun so it's
all done casual and friendly.

The same is true here. 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun. But it
only takes one bad guy. How lucky do you feel today?

If that is so in the US, then why do your police tell drivers to put their hands where they can see them
and make the driver stay in his/her car?
None of that nonsense happens here.

Your cops are on edge because of the proliferation of guns. It's a
simple fact.

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:01:57 PM UTC-5, Bod wrote:
On 16/12/2016 16:43, trader_4 wrote:
On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 1:48:00 AM UTC-5, Bod wrote:
On 15/12/2016 21:57, Oren wrote:
On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 14:51:43 +0000, Bod wrote:

I wonder what your life expectancy would be if you were a cop.


In the USA or the UK police?

In the UK you would die from exhaustion the first day as a rookie,
passing out chocolate bars and doing hug-a-thugs.

Maybe your crooks are only guilty of singing to loud in church.

One things for sure, our cops are a lot more patient and not
confrontational. That's why very few get shot by cops here.
If a driver gets stopped here, you can get out of the car and walk up to
the cops with your hands wherever you like, in your pockets or wherever
you choose to put them and the cops won't bark any commands at you or be
worried and no cop will pull a gun on you, it just doesn't happen in
normal road stops.

The simple reason is that 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun so it's
all done casual and friendly.

The same is true here. 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun. But it
only takes one bad guy. How lucky do you feel today?

If that is so in the US, then why do your police tell drivers to put their hands where they can see them
and make the driver stay in his/her car?

I've been stopped many times over the years and never been told to
do anything special with my hands. But that's probably because I
pull over, open the window, don't have reefer smoke coming out,
don't have outstanding warrants, and cooperate. I don't recall being
told to stay in the car either. But that's what I just naturally do.
A big part of staying in your car is for your own safety, so you don't
get hit by a car.

And one time I was pulled over for speeding on my Harley and I
had 3 pistols on the bike. The only difference in that instance
was the cop called for backup. Otherwise, it was like any other
road stop, except that the cops asked me to take the pistols
out of the saddle bags. So, there I was, at the side of the road,
laying out my pistols on the hood of the cop car. But they didn't
have their guns out, they didn't tell me what to do with my hands.

When it was all over, I got a ticket for speeding. I was just
about to ask the cop why his second or third question was if I
had any guns with me. But, before I could ask, he said that
next time when I left the pistol range it would be a good idea
to take my pistol range ID card off my jacket.

The simple reason is that 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun so it's
all done casual and friendly.

The same is true here. 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun. But it
only takes one bad guy. How lucky do you feel today?

If that is so in the US, then why do your police tell drivers to put their hands where they can see them
and make the driver stay in his/her car?

I've been stopped many times over the years and never been told to
do anything special with my hands. But that's probably because I
pull over, open the window, don't have reefer smoke coming out,
don't have outstanding warrants, and cooperate. I don't recall being
told to stay in the car either. But that's what I just naturally do.
A big part of staying in your car is for your own safety, so you don't
get hit by a car.

And one time I was pulled over for speeding on my Harley and I
had 3 pistols on the bike. The only difference in that instance
was the cop called for backup. Otherwise, it was like any other
road stop, except that the cops asked me to take the pistols
out of the saddle bags. So, there I was, at the side of the road,
laying out my pistols on the hood of the cop car. But they didn't
have their guns out, they didn't tell me what to do with my hands.

When it was all over, I got a ticket for speeding. I was just
about to ask the cop why his second or third question was if I
had any guns with me. But, before I could ask, he said that
next time when I left the pistol range it would be a good idea
to take my pistol range ID card off my jacket.

Hmm, that's a different story to what I've seen in Youtube videos and
been told from other Americans first hand.
Maybe procedures differ from state to state?

On 16/12/2016 17:34, Bod wrote:

The simple reason is that 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun so it's
all done casual and friendly.

The same is true here. 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun. But it
only takes one bad guy. How lucky do you feel today?

If that is so in the US, then why do your police tell drivers to put
their hands where they can see them
and make the driver stay in his/her car?

I've been stopped many times over the years and never been told to
do anything special with my hands. But that's probably because I
pull over, open the window, don't have reefer smoke coming out,
don't have outstanding warrants, and cooperate. I don't recall being
told to stay in the car either. But that's what I just naturally do.
A big part of staying in your car is for your own safety, so you don't
get hit by a car.

And one time I was pulled over for speeding on my Harley and I
had 3 pistols on the bike. The only difference in that instance
was the cop called for backup. Otherwise, it was like any other
road stop, except that the cops asked me to take the pistols
out of the saddle bags. So, there I was, at the side of the road,
laying out my pistols on the hood of the cop car. But they didn't
have their guns out, they didn't tell me what to do with my hands.

When it was all over, I got a ticket for speeding. I was just
about to ask the cop why his second or third question was if I
had any guns with me. But, before I could ask, he said that
next time when I left the pistol range it would be a good idea
to take my pistol range ID card off my jacket.


This link totally disagrees with what you've just said:

How to Act when the Police Pull You Over (USA)

http://www.wikihow.com/Act-when-the-...-You-Over-(USA)

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:34:33 PM UTC-5, Bod wrote:
The simple reason is that 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun so it's
all done casual and friendly.

The same is true here. 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun. But it
only takes one bad guy. How lucky do you feel today?

If that is so in the US, then why do your police tell drivers to put their hands where they can see them
and make the driver stay in his/her car?

I've been stopped many times over the years and never been told to
do anything special with my hands. But that's probably because I
pull over, open the window, don't have reefer smoke coming out,
don't have outstanding warrants, and cooperate. I don't recall being
told to stay in the car either. But that's what I just naturally do.
A big part of staying in your car is for your own safety, so you don't
get hit by a car.

And one time I was pulled over for speeding on my Harley and I
had 3 pistols on the bike. The only difference in that instance
was the cop called for backup. Otherwise, it was like any other
road stop, except that the cops asked me to take the pistols
out of the saddle bags. So, there I was, at the side of the road,
laying out my pistols on the hood of the cop car. But they didn't
have their guns out, they didn't tell me what to do with my hands.

When it was all over, I got a ticket for speeding. I was just
about to ask the cop why his second or third question was if I
had any guns with me. But, before I could ask, he said that
next time when I left the pistol range it would be a good idea
to take my pistol range ID card off my jacket.

Hmm, that's a different story to what I've seen in Youtube videos and
been told from other Americans first hand.
Maybe procedures differ from state to state?

I haven't been stopped by the police for almost 20 years. If I were
to be stopped, I'd be keep my hands up on the wheel just to let the
officer know I'm not a threat. It's just good sense.

My husband has a concealed-carry permit. When he was in the classes
required to get the permit, he was told that police routinely do a
database lookup from their car before approaching a vehicle that
he stopped, so the police already know if the driver has a carry
permit (assuming he's driving his own car).

He was, in fact, pulled over for speeding while on the way to
the pistol range, during a "fundraiser" by the local LEOs.
He put his hands on the wheel, and said to the officer
"I have a concealed carry permit. I am not carrying, but
I am on my way to name of range and they are locked up
in the back of the SUV." He avoided using the word "gun",
lest the partner back in the car hear that word over the
microphone that the officer had clipped to his collar,
and think that the officer was announcing that my husband
had a gun. Plain and simple common sense.

Incidentally, my husband never carries. He got the permit
so that he could load his magazines at home rather than having
to do it at the range. They travel outside the gun.

Cindy Hamilton

On 16/12/2016 17:53, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:34:33 PM UTC-5, Bod wrote:
The simple reason is that 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun so it's
all done casual and friendly.

The same is true here. 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun. But it
only takes one bad guy. How lucky do you feel today?

If that is so in the US, then why do your police tell drivers to put their hands where they can see them
and make the driver stay in his/her car?

I've been stopped many times over the years and never been told to
do anything special with my hands. But that's probably because I
pull over, open the window, don't have reefer smoke coming out,
don't have outstanding warrants, and cooperate. I don't recall being
told to stay in the car either. But that's what I just naturally do.
A big part of staying in your car is for your own safety, so you don't
get hit by a car.

And one time I was pulled over for speeding on my Harley and I
had 3 pistols on the bike. The only difference in that instance
was the cop called for backup. Otherwise, it was like any other
road stop, except that the cops asked me to take the pistols
out of the saddle bags. So, there I was, at the side of the road,
laying out my pistols on the hood of the cop car. But they didn't
have their guns out, they didn't tell me what to do with my hands.

When it was all over, I got a ticket for speeding. I was just
about to ask the cop why his second or third question was if I
had any guns with me. But, before I could ask, he said that
next time when I left the pistol range it would be a good idea
to take my pistol range ID card off my jacket.

Hmm, that's a different story to what I've seen in Youtube videos and
been told from other Americans first hand.
Maybe procedures differ from state to state?

I haven't been stopped by the police for almost 20 years. If I were
to be stopped, I'd be keep my hands up on the wheel just to let the
officer know I'm not a threat. It's just good sense.

My husband has a concealed-carry permit. When he was in the classes
required to get the permit, he was told that police routinely do a
database lookup from their car before approaching a vehicle that
he stopped, so the police already know if the driver has a carry
permit (assuming he's driving his own car).

He was, in fact, pulled over for speeding while on the way to
the pistol range, during a "fundraiser" by the local LEOs.
He put his hands on the wheel, and said to the officer
"I have a concealed carry permit. I am not carrying, but
I am on my way to name of range and they are locked up
in the back of the SUV." He avoided using the word "gun",
lest the partner back in the car hear that word over the
microphone that the officer had clipped to his collar,
and think that the officer was announcing that my husband
had a gun. Plain and simple common sense.

Incidentally, my husband never carries. He got the permit
so that he could load his magazines at home rather than having
to do it at the range. They travel outside the gun.

Cindy Hamilton

Ok.

Bod explained on 12/16/2016 :
The simple reason is that 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun so it's
all done casual and friendly.

The same is true here. 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun. But it
only takes one bad guy. How lucky do you feel today?

If that is so in the US, then why do your police tell drivers to put
their hands where they can see them
and make the driver stay in his/her car?

I've been stopped many times over the years and never been told to
do anything special with my hands. But that's probably because I
pull over, open the window, don't have reefer smoke coming out,
don't have outstanding warrants, and cooperate. I don't recall being
told to stay in the car either. But that's what I just naturally do.
A big part of staying in your car is for your own safety, so you don't
get hit by a car.

And one time I was pulled over for speeding on my Harley and I
had 3 pistols on the bike. The only difference in that instance
was the cop called for backup. Otherwise, it was like any other
road stop, except that the cops asked me to take the pistols
out of the saddle bags. So, there I was, at the side of the road,
laying out my pistols on the hood of the cop car. But they didn't
have their guns out, they didn't tell me what to do with my hands.

When it was all over, I got a ticket for speeding. I was just
about to ask the cop why his second or third question was if I
had any guns with me. But, before I could ask, he said that
next time when I left the pistol range it would be a good idea
to take my pistol range ID card off my jacket.

Hmm, that's a different story to what I've seen in Youtube videos and
been told from other Americans first hand.
Maybe procedures differ from state to state?

In California I was stopped for expired registration one time. They
didn't give me any special instructions at all, and since I was
actually on my way back from getting my registration stickers they just
let me go on my merry way.

They *did* ask me a question which I thought was strange though. "Do
you have any guns, knives, or grenades?"

Grenades?

South Central Los Angeles is a tough neighborhood, but grenades?

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 21:04:34 -0800 (PST), ItsJoanNotJoann
wrote:

In the USA anyone of age who is not a convicted felon can purchase
a gun from a dealer. There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal. Are those buyers or sellers felons
or in possession of stolen weapons? Maybe, maybe not but there's
no law preventing them from doing the deal.

Better read the current laws in your state and the federal laws.

Involuntary commitment or civil commitment to mental health precludes
one from buying a gun - does not include a person voluntarily seeking
counseling or treatment.

"...In most jurisdictions, involuntary commitment is specifically
applied to individuals believed to be experiencing a mental illness
that impairs their reasoning ability to such an extent that the agents
of the law, state, or courts determine that decisions will be made for
the individual, under a legal framework. (In some jurisdictions, this
is a distinct proceeding from being "found incompetent.")"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Involuntary_commitment#See_also

Domestic violence convictions prevent a gun purchase.

Nevada just passed, by ballot measure that closed the ALLEDGED gun
show loop hole (spit) You can't lone a weapon to a friend for hunting
purposes without both going to a FFL and having a "background check".

"Shall Chapter 202 of the Nevada Revised Statutes be amended to
prohibit, except in certain circumstances, a person from selling or
transferring a firearm to another person unless a federally-licensed
dealer first conducts a federal background check on the potential
buyer or transferee?
--
"Someone ever tries to kill you, you try to kill 'em right back" - Captain Malcolm Reynolds

On 16/12/2016 18:32, FromTheRafters wrote:
Bod explained on 12/16/2016 :
The simple reason is that 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun so
it's
all done casual and friendly.

The same is true here. 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun. But it
only takes one bad guy. How lucky do you feel today?

If that is so in the US, then why do your police tell drivers to
put their hands where they can see them
and make the driver stay in his/her car?

I've been stopped many times over the years and never been told to
do anything special with my hands. But that's probably because I
pull over, open the window, don't have reefer smoke coming out,
don't have outstanding warrants, and cooperate. I don't recall being
told to stay in the car either. But that's what I just naturally do.
A big part of staying in your car is for your own safety, so you don't
get hit by a car.

And one time I was pulled over for speeding on my Harley and I
had 3 pistols on the bike. The only difference in that instance
was the cop called for backup. Otherwise, it was like any other
road stop, except that the cops asked me to take the pistols
out of the saddle bags. So, there I was, at the side of the road,
laying out my pistols on the hood of the cop car. But they didn't
have their guns out, they didn't tell me what to do with my hands.

When it was all over, I got a ticket for speeding. I was just
about to ask the cop why his second or third question was if I
had any guns with me. But, before I could ask, he said that
next time when I left the pistol range it would be a good idea
to take my pistol range ID card off my jacket.

Hmm, that's a different story to what I've seen in Youtube videos and
been told from other Americans first hand.
Maybe procedures differ from state to state?

In California I was stopped for expired registration one time. They
didn't give me any special instructions at all, and since I was actually
on my way back from getting my registration stickers they just let me go
on my merry way.

They *did* ask me a question which I thought was strange though. "Do you
have any guns, knives, or grenades?"

Grenades?

South Central Los Angeles is a tough neighborhood, but grenades?

lol.

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 8:00:37 AM UTC-6, Unquestionably Confused wrote:

On 12/15/2016 11:04 PM, ItsJoanNotJoann wrote:

On Thursday, December 15, 2016 at 4:46:05 PM UTC-6, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

As I understand it, in most of America it's easy to get a gun. In the UK it's very difficult. You have to prove it's for shooting game etc, and not carry it about in the street.


In the USA anyone of age who is not a convicted felon can purchase
a gun from a dealer. There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal. Are those buyers or sellers felons
or in possession of stolen weapons? Maybe, maybe not but there's
no law preventing them from doing the deal.

Do I have a gun? Yes. Do I have a permit to carry it? Yes.
Do I? No.

Then one would think that you'd be better informed (or at least know how
to properly phrase your thoughts/beliefs in writing).

Reading comprehension, it's a wonderful thing. Evidently you did not
read my statements, just skimmed and couldn't wait to attempt to rip
me a new one.

1) There are laws to prohibiting buyers and sellers from dealing in
stolen guns.

Did I not pretty much state that? I said 'licensed dealers.'

2) There are laws prohibiting convicted felons (and some others) from
buying or possessing guns.

I said that, you didn't read it did you?

3) In many states private transactions in firearms are prohibited UNLESS
the buyer and seller abide by background checks through the state.

Like the police are going to be patroling every parking lot looking for
'illegal' gun sales. Criminals don't buy guns, they steal them.

4) In other states, Minnesota for one, you must obtain a permit from the
police in order to purchase a handgun through a licensed dealer.

Goody for Minnesota.

Background checks by licensed gun dealers are performed to PREVENT a
felon or anyone wanted by the polic from purchasing.

So, there ARE laws designed to prohibit the transactions you refer to
but there is also a law - applicable to just about any state, country or
culture you can name that says, "Thou shall not kill."

How's that working to prevent all murders?

Quote me THRUTHFUL figures of _licensed gun owners_ committing
those murders.

How about working on getting all robbers incarcerated?

How about working on getting all the drug dealers locked up?

How about castrating all the pedophiles?

How about giving back all those beatings that spousal abusers
are so eager to commit? (Before you go off half cocked I didn't
say male abusers, I said 'all.')

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:42:38 PM UTC-5, Bod wrote:
On 16/12/2016 17:34, Bod wrote:

The simple reason is that 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun so it's
all done casual and friendly.

The same is true here. 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun. But it
only takes one bad guy. How lucky do you feel today?

If that is so in the US, then why do your police tell drivers to put
their hands where they can see them
and make the driver stay in his/her car?

I've been stopped many times over the years and never been told to
do anything special with my hands. But that's probably because I
pull over, open the window, don't have reefer smoke coming out,
don't have outstanding warrants, and cooperate. I don't recall being
told to stay in the car either. But that's what I just naturally do.
A big part of staying in your car is for your own safety, so you don't
get hit by a car.

And one time I was pulled over for speeding on my Harley and I
had 3 pistols on the bike. The only difference in that instance
was the cop called for backup. Otherwise, it was like any other
road stop, except that the cops asked me to take the pistols
out of the saddle bags. So, there I was, at the side of the road,
laying out my pistols on the hood of the cop car. But they didn't
have their guns out, they didn't tell me what to do with my hands.

When it was all over, I got a ticket for speeding. I was just
about to ask the cop why his second or third question was if I
had any guns with me. But, before I could ask, he said that
next time when I left the pistol range it would be a good idea
to take my pistol range ID card off my jacket.


This link totally disagrees with what you've just said:

How to Act when the Police Pull You Over (USA)

http://www.wikihow.com/Act-when-the-...-You-Over-(USA)

Even for a troll, you're incredibly incompetent. Nothing there
contradicts what I said. And besides, how could it? I just told you
my life's experience with traffic stops. How could your wiki link know my
experiences? WTF is wrong with you?

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 10:33:43 AM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:04:37 AM UTC-5, ItsJoanNotJoann wrote:

In the USA anyone of age who is not a convicted felon can purchase
a gun from a dealer.


Not true. Federal law and the federal database also block people who
have been confined to a mental hospital, adjudicated nuts by a court,
terrorist types put on there by FBI, etc.

Ummmmmmmm, I think ALL states you have to answer those questions in
order to purchase a firearm.

And then many states have additional blocks. NJ for example has a permit
process where you have to answer questions about mental health, give job
and personal references. The police then check you out, call the references,
and if they find something, they will deny the permit.

I'm having doubt on the police calling the people a person might give
as references. They have a whole department that sits on the phone
all day calling people to verify you are a fine upstanding person who
can purchase a firearm? How long that must take to call all those
people I can't imagine.

There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal. Are those buyers or sellers felons
or in possession of stolen weapons? Maybe, maybe not but there's
no law preventing them from doing the deal.

From the NJ website:

It is unlawful to sell, give, transfer, assign, or otherwise dispose of or receive, purchase, or otherwise acquire a rifle or shotgun, other than an antique rifle or shotgun, unless the purchaser assignee, donee, receiver, or holder is licensed as a dealer under New Jersey law or possesses a valid FID, and first exhibits the FID to the seller, donor, transferrer, or assignor, and the purchaser assignee, donee, receiver, or holder signs a written certification on a form prescribed by the Superintendent of State Police, which identifies the purchaser, his address and FID or dealer's number, and states he presently is not disqualified from purchase.

Your statement is not quite true. A holder of a gun permit CAN sell
their weapon in a parking lot; not just dealers. Read the part where
it states OR HOLDER, but I do see they have to have some sort of
paper from the Superintendent of the S.P. saying you are a fine fellow.

That's not true either. Not true in NJ, for the above listed reasons.
And not true in the 50 states either if you know the person you're
selling it to is a felon for example.

Remember, felons don't follow the law so if they want to purchase a
firearm in a parking lot they will do it. You really don't think
they're going to state to the seller "Bye the way, I'm a felon" do
you?

Do I have a gun? Yes. Do I have a permit to carry it? Yes.
Do I? No.

I'm surprised you don't know the laws then.

I know the laws in MY state. What NJ, Oregon, Maine, etc. have
on their books matter not one whit to me. I'm surprised I had
to explain all this to you.

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:34:33 PM UTC-5, Bod wrote:
The simple reason is that 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun so it's
all done casual and friendly.

The same is true here. 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun. But it
only takes one bad guy. How lucky do you feel today?

If that is so in the US, then why do your police tell drivers to put their hands where they can see them
and make the driver stay in his/her car?

I've been stopped many times over the years and never been told to
do anything special with my hands. But that's probably because I
pull over, open the window, don't have reefer smoke coming out,
don't have outstanding warrants, and cooperate. I don't recall being
told to stay in the car either. But that's what I just naturally do.
A big part of staying in your car is for your own safety, so you don't
get hit by a car.

And one time I was pulled over for speeding on my Harley and I
had 3 pistols on the bike. The only difference in that instance
was the cop called for backup. Otherwise, it was like any other
road stop, except that the cops asked me to take the pistols
out of the saddle bags. So, there I was, at the side of the road,
laying out my pistols on the hood of the cop car. But they didn't
have their guns out, they didn't tell me what to do with my hands.

When it was all over, I got a ticket for speeding. I was just
about to ask the cop why his second or third question was if I
had any guns with me. But, before I could ask, he said that
next time when I left the pistol range it would be a good idea
to take my pistol range ID card off my jacket.

Hmm, that's a different story to what I've seen in Youtube videos and
been told from other Americans first hand.
Maybe procedures differ from state to state?

That's likely because what goes up on youtube are not the millions of
routine stops made each year, but instead the ones where somebody refuses
to cooperate, has a warrant, resists arrest, etc. You think?

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:58:36 PM UTC-6, Oren wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 21:04:34 -0800 (PST), ItsJoanNotJoann
wrote:

In the USA anyone of age who is not a convicted felon can purchase
a gun from a dealer. There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal. Are those buyers or sellers felons
or in possession of stolen weapons? Maybe, maybe not but there's
no law preventing them from doing the deal.

Better read the current laws in your state and the federal laws.

Involuntary commitment or civil commitment to mental health precludes
one from buying a gun - does not include a person voluntarily seeking
counseling or treatment.

You don't think mentally ill people are smart enough to lie on a
firearms application??

Nevada just passed, by ballot measure that closed the ALLEDGED gun
show loop hole (spit) You can't lone a weapon to a friend for hunting
purposes without both going to a FFL and having a "background check".

And you think Bob wants to borrow Bills gun to go hunting and he's going
to say let me get an FFL and do a background check on you?

On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 15:04:41 -0800 (PST), ItsJoanNotJoann
wrote:

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:58:36 PM UTC-6, Oren wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 21:04:34 -0800 (PST), ItsJoanNotJoann
wrote:

In the USA anyone of age who is not a convicted felon can purchase
a gun from a dealer. There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal. Are those buyers or sellers felons
or in possession of stolen weapons? Maybe, maybe not but there's
no law preventing them from doing the deal.

Better read the current laws in your state and the federal laws.

Involuntary commitment or civil commitment to mental health precludes
one from buying a gun - does not include a person voluntarily seeking
counseling or treatment.

You don't think mentally ill people are smart enough to lie on a
firearms application??


A felony. Does your state or the feds have a record on mentally ill
trying to buy a gun?

Nevada just passed, by ballot measure that closed the ALLEDGED gun
show loop hole (spit) You can't lone a weapon to a friend for hunting
purposes without both going to a FFL and having a "background check".

And you think Bob wants to borrow Bills gun to go hunting and he's going
to say let me get an FFL and do a background check on you?


You miss the point. It would be against the law.

I can skirt any law. Doesn't mean I'm allowed to do it, by law.

Ignorance of the law is no excuse.

You did write "There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal."

That is not fact.

On 12/16/2016 5:34 PM, Oren wrote:
On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 15:04:41 -0800 (PST), ItsJoanNotJoann
wrote:

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:58:36 PM UTC-6, Oren wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 21:04:34 -0800 (PST), ItsJoanNotJoann
wrote:

In the USA anyone of age who is not a convicted felon can purchase
a gun from a dealer. There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal. Are those buyers or sellers felons
or in possession of stolen weapons? Maybe, maybe not but there's
no law preventing them from doing the deal.

Better read the current laws in your state and the federal laws.

Involuntary commitment or civil commitment to mental health precludes
one from buying a gun - does not include a person voluntarily seeking
counseling or treatment.

You don't think mentally ill people are smart enough to lie on a
firearms application??


A felony. Does your state or the feds have a record on mentally ill
trying to buy a gun?

Nevada just passed, by ballot measure that closed the ALLEDGED gun
show loop hole (spit) You can't lone a weapon to a friend for hunting
purposes without both going to a FFL and having a "background check".

And you think Bob wants to borrow Bills gun to go hunting and he's going
to say let me get an FFL and do a background check on you?


You miss the point. It would be against the law.

I can skirt any law. Doesn't mean I'm allowed to do it, by law.

Ignorance of the law is no excuse.

You did write "There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal."

That is not fact.



Don't confuse her with facts, Oren. She made a broad statement based on
her biases and doesn't appreciate it when called on it.

Why is it that when laws are ignored, more laws and restrictions are the
answer rather than enforcing the laws being ignored. Ah, yes, it's feel
good time. Just like the participation awards being handed out like
dust motes so no one's "self of steam" will be affected.

Screw all the pansies!

On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 17:42:01 -0600, Unquestionably Confused
wrote:

On 12/16/2016 5:34 PM, Oren wrote:
On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 15:04:41 -0800 (PST), ItsJoanNotJoann
wrote:

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:58:36 PM UTC-6, Oren wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 21:04:34 -0800 (PST), ItsJoanNotJoann
wrote:

In the USA anyone of age who is not a convicted felon can purchase
a gun from a dealer. There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal. Are those buyers or sellers felons
or in possession of stolen weapons? Maybe, maybe not but there's
no law preventing them from doing the deal.

Better read the current laws in your state and the federal laws.

Involuntary commitment or civil commitment to mental health precludes
one from buying a gun - does not include a person voluntarily seeking
counseling or treatment.

You don't think mentally ill people are smart enough to lie on a
firearms application??


A felony. Does your state or the feds have a record on mentally ill
trying to buy a gun?

Nevada just passed, by ballot measure that closed the ALLEDGED gun
show loop hole (spit) You can't lone a weapon to a friend for hunting
purposes without both going to a FFL and having a "background check".

And you think Bob wants to borrow Bills gun to go hunting and he's going
to say let me get an FFL and do a background check on you?


You miss the point. It would be against the law.

I can skirt any law. Doesn't mean I'm allowed to do it, by law.

Ignorance of the law is no excuse.

You did write "There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal."

That is not fact.



Don't confuse her with facts, Oren. She made a broad statement based on
her biases and doesn't appreciate it when called on it.

Why is it that when laws are ignored, more laws and restrictions are the
answer rather than enforcing the laws being ignored. Ah, yes, it's feel
good time. Just like the participation awards being handed out like
dust motes so no one's "self of steam" will be affected.

Screw all the pansies!


Joann may read he state laws before she tells me there are "no law".

My guess is she needs a refresher course :-\

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 5:54:07 PM UTC-5, ItsJoanNotJoann wrote:
On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 10:33:43 AM UTC-6, trader_4 wrote:

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:04:37 AM UTC-5, ItsJoanNotJoann wrote:

In the USA anyone of age who is not a convicted felon can purchase
a gun from a dealer.


Not true. Federal law and the federal database also block people who
have been confined to a mental hospital, adjudicated nuts by a court,
terrorist types put on there by FBI, etc.

Ummmmmmmm, I think ALL states you have to answer those questions in
order to purchase a firearm.


Well then how does that square with you claiming that anyone who isn't
a felon can buy a gun from a dealer?


And then many states have additional blocks. NJ for example has a permit
process where you have to answer questions about mental health, give job
and personal references. The police then check you out, call the references,
and if they find something, they will deny the permit.

I'm having doubt on the police calling the people a person might give
as references. They have a whole department that sits on the phone
all day calling people to verify you are a fine upstanding person who
can purchase a firearm? How long that must take to call all those
people I can't imagine.

There aren't so many people, not everyone is running out to get a
firearms ID card or pistol permit. Whatever the number, the police
handle it.



There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal. Are those buyers or sellers felons
or in possession of stolen weapons? Maybe, maybe not but there's
no law preventing them from doing the deal.

From the NJ website:

It is unlawful to sell, give, transfer, assign, or otherwise dispose of or receive, purchase, or otherwise acquire a rifle or shotgun, other than an antique rifle or shotgun, unless the purchaser assignee, donee, receiver, or holder is licensed as a dealer under New Jersey law or possesses a valid FID, and first exhibits the FID to the seller, donor, transferrer, or assignor, and the purchaser assignee, donee, receiver, or holder signs a written certification on a form prescribed by the Superintendent of State Police, which identifies the purchaser, his address and FID or dealer's number, and states he presently is not disqualified from purchase.

Your statement is not quite true. A holder of a gun permit CAN sell
their weapon in a parking lot; not just dealers.

I did not say that you could not sell a gun in a parking lot in NJ.
I said that to sell a long gun, whether you are a dealer or an individual,
the purchaser has to have a NJ firearms ID card. That is exactly what
you quoted above says. And if it's a pistol, then the purchaser needs
a pistol permit to buy it. The ID card, once issued, is good for any
number of long gun purchases. A new pistol permit is needed for each
pistol purchaed.


Read the part where
it states OR HOLDER, but I do see they have to have some sort of
paper from the Superintendent of the S.P. saying you are a fine fellow.

"unless the purchaser assignee, donee, receiver, or holder is licensed as a dealer under New Jersey law or possesses a valid FID, "

The purchaser either needs to be a FFL or the purchaser needs a valid FID.
That applies in NJ whether you buy the gun from a dealer or from your cousin.

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 6:04:44 PM UTC-5, ItsJoanNotJoann wrote:
On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:58:36 PM UTC-6, Oren wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 21:04:34 -0800 (PST), ItsJoanNotJoann
wrote:

In the USA anyone of age who is not a convicted felon can purchase
a gun from a dealer. There is also no law anyone cannot purchase
a gun in a parking lot deal. Are those buyers or sellers felons
or in possession of stolen weapons? Maybe, maybe not but there's
no law preventing them from doing the deal.

Better read the current laws in your state and the federal laws.

Involuntary commitment or civil commitment to mental health precludes
one from buying a gun - does not include a person voluntarily seeking
counseling or treatment.

You don't think mentally ill people are smart enough to lie on a
firearms application??

You said that if you're not a felon you can buy a gun from a dealer
anywhere in the USA. That implies that it's the only disqualifying
issue. That isn't true. Sure, a mental case can lie. So too can
a felon. So, what's your point? Obviously you've stepped in it,
now instead of simply admitting a mistake, you're doubling down.
Are you related to Trump?

In the entire USA if you've be confined to a mental hospital, adjucated
a nut by a court, etc, you are prohibited from buying a gun, just as if
you were a felon. Many states have far more disqualifiers than that.




Nevada just passed, by ballot measure that closed the ALLEDGED gun
show loop hole (spit) You can't lone a weapon to a friend for hunting
purposes without both going to a FFL and having a "background check".

And you think Bob wants to borrow Bills gun to go hunting and he's going
to say let me get an FFL and do a background check on you?

Your claim was with regard to "buying" a gun.

On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 00:16:37 -0000, Meanie wrote:

On 12/15/2016 5:52 PM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 22:48:04 -0000, Meanie wrote:

On 12/15/2016 5:38 PM, trader_4 wrote:
On Thursday, December 15, 2016 at 5:30:57 PM UTC-5, James Wilkinson
Sword wrote:
On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 15:46:06 -0000, Muggles
wrote:

On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 05:17:13 -0500, Dev Null
wrote:
Law-abiding
people are just happy another criminal is dead.

That's probably true, but this man wasn't a criminal.

He looked like he was carrying a firearm.

1) Don't look like you're carrying a firearm
2) Don't live in a ****ed up country where most people do carry one,
so you're assumed to have one.


Just for the record, most people in the USA don't carry guns, not
even close. Only a small percentage. IDK anyone who carries, other
than cops that I've know, and that's for my entire life. Part of
that reason is that here in NJ, you basically can't get a permit,
it isn't allowed. And I'm not living with gang bangers. Now, if
you went to certain high crime area, infested with drugs and gangs,
like parts of Chicago, Detroit, Camden, etc, well then you'd find
more people carrying, but I highly doubt that even there it's anywhere
near a majority. It only takes small percentages of bad actors to
cause most of the problems.


Don't spoil the boys fun. His simple mind thinks every single American
is the same. That's what the Brits learn.

The stats show you shoot each other all the time. The whole of the
world knows America is a third world country where you kill each other
like Muslim neanderthals.


Then ensure you don't wear your turban when you visit. The good part is
you'll never visit. Sissies never do.

Thanks for making my point.

--
An airliner was having engine trouble, and the pilot instructed the cabin crew to have the passengers take their seats and get prepared for an emergency landing.
A few minutes later, the pilot asked the flight attendants if everyone was buckled in and ready.
"All set back here, Captain," came the reply, "except one lawyer who is still going around passing out business cards."

On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 13:43:35 -0000, Hugh G. Bigly wrote:

On 12/16/2016 1:47 AM, Bod wrote:
One things for sure, our cops are a lot more patient and not confrontational. That's why very few get shot by cops here.


[bod**** snipped]


Your cops are on edge because of the proliferation of guns. It's a simple fact.


You think we can't google?

http://www.news.com.au/world/breakin...355bf6c9a18b36

Someone running around with an axe deserves to die.

--
Windows 95: n. 32 bit extensions and a graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit operating system originally coded for a 4 bit microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that can't stand 1 bit of competition.

On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 17:12:34 -0000, trader_4 wrote:

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:01:57 PM UTC-5, Bod wrote:
On 16/12/2016 16:43, trader_4 wrote:
On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 1:48:00 AM UTC-5, Bod wrote:
On 15/12/2016 21:57, Oren wrote:
On Thu, 15 Dec 2016 14:51:43 +0000, Bod wrote:

I wonder what your life expectancy would be if you were a cop.


In the USA or the UK police?

In the UK you would die from exhaustion the first day as a rookie,
passing out chocolate bars and doing hug-a-thugs.

Maybe your crooks are only guilty of singing to loud in church.

One things for sure, our cops are a lot more patient and not
confrontational. That's why very few get shot by cops here.
If a driver gets stopped here, you can get out of the car and walk up to
the cops with your hands wherever you like, in your pockets or wherever
you choose to put them and the cops won't bark any commands at you or be
worried and no cop will pull a gun on you, it just doesn't happen in
normal road stops.

The simple reason is that 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun so it's
all done casual and friendly.

The same is true here. 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun. But it
only takes one bad guy. How lucky do you feel today?

If that is so in the US, then why do your police tell drivers to put their hands where they can see them
and make the driver stay in his/her car?

I've been stopped many times over the years and never been told to
do anything special with my hands. But that's probably because I
pull over, open the window, don't have reefer smoke coming out,
don't have outstanding warrants, and cooperate. I don't recall being
told to stay in the car either. But that's what I just naturally do.
A big part of staying in your car is for your own safety, so you don't
get hit by a car.

Can't you use our eyes to watch for cars?

And one time I was pulled over for speeding on my Harley and I
had 3 pistols on the bike. The only difference in that instance
was the cop called for backup. Otherwise, it was like any other
road stop, except that the cops asked me to take the pistols
out of the saddle bags. So, there I was, at the side of the road,
laying out my pistols on the hood of the cop car. But they didn't
have their guns out, they didn't tell me what to do with my hands.

When it was all over, I got a ticket for speeding. I was just
about to ask the cop why his second or third question was if I
had any guns with me. But, before I could ask, he said that
next time when I left the pistol range it would be a good idea
to take my pistol range ID card off my jacket.

Eh?

--
tittynope, n. €“ a small quantity of something left over

On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 17:53:56 -0000, Cindy Hamilton wrote:

On Friday, December 16, 2016 at 12:34:33 PM UTC-5, Bod wrote:
The simple reason is that 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun so it's
all done casual and friendly.

The same is true here. 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun. But it
only takes one bad guy. How lucky do you feel today?

If that is so in the US, then why do your police tell drivers to put their hands where they can see them
and make the driver stay in his/her car?

I've been stopped many times over the years and never been told to
do anything special with my hands. But that's probably because I
pull over, open the window, don't have reefer smoke coming out,
don't have outstanding warrants, and cooperate. I don't recall being
told to stay in the car either. But that's what I just naturally do.
A big part of staying in your car is for your own safety, so you don't
get hit by a car.

And one time I was pulled over for speeding on my Harley and I
had 3 pistols on the bike. The only difference in that instance
was the cop called for backup. Otherwise, it was like any other
road stop, except that the cops asked me to take the pistols
out of the saddle bags. So, there I was, at the side of the road,
laying out my pistols on the hood of the cop car. But they didn't
have their guns out, they didn't tell me what to do with my hands.

When it was all over, I got a ticket for speeding. I was just
about to ask the cop why his second or third question was if I
had any guns with me. But, before I could ask, he said that
next time when I left the pistol range it would be a good idea
to take my pistol range ID card off my jacket.

Hmm, that's a different story to what I've seen in Youtube videos and
been told from other Americans first hand.
Maybe procedures differ from state to state?

I haven't been stopped by the police for almost 20 years. If I were
to be stopped, I'd be keep my hands up on the wheel just to let the
officer know I'm not a threat. It's just good sense.

My husband has a concealed-carry permit. When he was in the classes
required to get the permit, he was told that police routinely do a
database lookup from their car before approaching a vehicle that
he stopped, so the police already know if the driver has a carry
permit (assuming he's driving his own car).

And assuming he doesn't have illegal weapons. So no point in checking that at all.

--
When I told my mum I was going to buy a motorbike she went crazy:
"Don't you remember what happened to your brother? He was killed on one! Why would you want to buy one when you could just have his?"

On Fri, 16 Dec 2016 18:32:20 -0000, FromTheRafters wrote:

Bod explained on 12/16/2016 :
The simple reason is that 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun so it's
all done casual and friendly.

The same is true here. 99.99% of drivers don't have a gun. But it
only takes one bad guy. How lucky do you feel today?

If that is so in the US, then why do your police tell drivers to put
their hands where they can see them
and make the driver stay in his/her car?

I've been stopped many times over the years and never been told to
do anything special with my hands. But that's probably because I
pull over, open the window, don't have reefer smoke coming out,
don't have outstanding warrants, and cooperate. I don't recall being
told to stay in the car either. But that's what I just naturally do.
A big part of staying in your car is for your own safety, so you don't
get hit by a car.

And one time I was pulled over for speeding on my Harley and I
had 3 pistols on the bike. The only difference in that instance
was the cop called for backup. Otherwise, it was like any other
road stop, except that the cops asked me to take the pistols
out of the saddle bags. So, there I was, at the side of the road,
laying out my pistols on the hood of the cop car. But they didn't
have their guns out, they didn't tell me what to do with my hands.

When it was all over, I got a ticket for speeding. I was just
about to ask the cop why his second or third question was if I
had any guns with me. But, before I could ask, he said that
next time when I left the pistol range it would be a good idea
to take my pistol range ID card off my jacket.

Hmm, that's a different story to what I've seen in Youtube videos and
been told from other Americans first hand.
Maybe procedures differ from state to state?

In California I was stopped for expired registration one time. They
didn't give me any special instructions at all, and since I was
actually on my way back from getting my registration stickers they just
let me go on my merry way.

They *did* ask me a question which I thought was strange though. "Do
you have any guns, knives, or grenades?"

Grenades?

South Central Los Angeles is a tough neighborhood, but grenades?

Maybe he was having a laugh. I have amused officers by having a sticker on the back of my car saying "Speed camera test vehicle".

--
The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one -- George Bernard Shaw