Thanks. I'm glad you already know. It would have taken at least 20
seconds to type the answer.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"RicodJour"
wrote in message
...


Most people will ignore your bait.
Some will rise to it and agree with you and point out how wonderful
the Republican party is.
Others will disagree and point out how horrible the Republican party
is.
I am leaving your bait untouched, and will ask you a question instead.

As a, presumably, man of Jesus, what did you do to help out those
unfortunate people? Did you offer to try to help the son? Point him
in the direction of some work, ask if he had any other marketable
skills, offer to hire him for even a few hours of paid work? Did you
tell the father something to soothe his soul and offer him hope? Or
did you decide that bitching and moaning on Usenet to further your
political views would cover all of your bases and get you into heaven
that much sooner?

Problems are never solved by dividing people. Even in war, unless
there is overwhelming military superiority, AND the other side doesn't
really care if they win or lose, things are decided and solved by
people coming together.

We are not at war, we are one people with problems that need to be
solved.
Neither side has overwhelming superiority of any sort.
No need to answer my question if you did anything for the laid off son
- I already know the answer.

R

Well, during the GWB time, we had about 5% unemployment. I believe
that the spike in unemployment was due to the BHO tax increases,
reckless spending, and many new regulations and other unfunded
mandates.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Larry W"
wrote in message ...

If not for Obama's policies the father would likely also be laid off.

--
There are no stupid questions, but there are lots of stupid
answers.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar.
org

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...

"Bob F" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
Took my truck in for oil change, today. The mechanic said that
business is so slow. The economy is really awful.

"I laid off my son, today" he says. Doesn't have enough work to pay
him.

So, how are all you Democrats enjoying life, these days? Was this
the
change you were hoping for? Anyone out there going to vote for more
of
this change? I hope not.

We're smart enough to know that many years of repubs trashing the
American
economy can't be undone in 2 years. At least it isn't going bad
anywhere near
like it was when Bush left office.




I'm not sure which planet you inhabit. But, where I am, the Dems have
spent several trillion dollars, and enacted all manner of legislation
that really killed the economy.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
I'm not sure which planet you inhabit. But, where I am, the Dems have
spent several trillion dollars, and enacted all manner of legislation
that really killed the economy.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uDGlNklZnc


In this country, we read from the top down.

I've also noticed that.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Country" wrote in message
...

Ain't it interesting that every politician, regardless of affiliation,
in the 45 years I've been voting has been a proponent of "changing how
things are done in Washington" and yet it never changes?

Country

On 10/26/2010 8:38 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
Took my truck in for oil change, today. The mechanic said that
business is so slow. The economy is really awful.

"I laid off my son, today" he says. Doesn't have enough work to pay
him.

So, how are all you Democrats enjoying life, these days? Was this the
change you were hoping for? Anyone out there going to vote for more of
this change? I hope not.


I want to like you, then you say the dumbest and most offensive things. Why?

The financial system was in free fall when Obama came in. GE, with a AAA
rating was unable to finance it's operation that is how bad it was. Job
losses were 600K + a month.

Now, if you want to talk about jobs, just how many were added during W's
8 years, not many. In fact he came within a few thousand of having a net
loss his first term and overall the figure is under $19K/month. Pathetic
considering population growth needs 150K to 200K month. Do a little
looking into exactly what the unemployment rate is and how it is
measured and you'll see it is a figure with little meaning.

The savings rate for almost all of the W tenure was negative. The
housing market was artificially inflated by lax policies and no oversite
over lending. All this has to be corrected and it will take a long time.
Financial meltdowns like this always lead to long recoveries. You have
no knowledge of history of you don't know that.

Frankly I am satisfied with Obama. The government is doing it's job
again. At the end of W almost every department was leaderless through
the top several layers and functionally broken. This has largely been
repaired although Repubs have held up many many appointments.

Here's the way I see the Republicans. They want to break government,
but they still need the services. In fact red states suck more from the
government nipple than blue. And the answer to every problem is a tax
cut. The same party that tripled the deficit under W and sneered at
Clinton when he balanced the budget now whine about spending in the
middle of a recession. What group do such policies help, there is only
one and that is short term and it is the millionaires.

There are only two kinds of Republicans, Millionaires and fools.
Which do you fall in?

Jeff

OK, but do you want to wake up the toddler to see it?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas"
wrote in message ...

Take your ****ing politics to a goddamn politics newsgroup
ASSHOLE....

PLONK



LOOK! A Plonkasaurus, get the camera!

TDD

Stormin Mormon wrote:
I'm not sure which planet you inhabit. But, where I am, the Dems have
spent several trillion dollars, and enacted all manner of legislation
that really killed the economy.


"Bob F" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
Took my truck in for oil change, today. The mechanic said that
business is so slow. The economy is really awful.

"I laid off my son, today" he says. Doesn't have enough work to pay
him.

So, how are all you Democrats enjoying life, these days? Was this
the
change you were hoping for? Anyone out there going to vote for more
of
this change? I hope not.

We're smart enough to know that many years of repubs trashing the
American
economy can't be undone in 2 years. At least it isn't going bad
anywhere near
like it was when Bush left office.

I don't live on that planet. Mine is closer to reality.

HeyBub wrote:
JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
"Stormin Mormon" wrote in
message ...
Took my truck in for oil change, today. The mechanic said that
business is so slow. The economy is really awful.

"I laid off my son, today" he says. Doesn't have enough work to pay
him.

So, how are all you Democrats enjoying life, these days? Was this
the change you were hoping for? Anyone out there going to vote for
more of this change? I hope not.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFZ1j...eature=related


Explain with great precision exactly what you would've done
differently from Obama if you'd been the president to follow George
W. Bush. Failure to explain your plan in your next message will be an
admission that you are drunk.

Gosh! We'd be here all night. I'll tackle just one: tax cuts.

The Congress has known for TEN YEARS that the tax cuts are going to
expire on January 1st. Neither they nor the president have done squat
about it.
This uncertainty is driving the business community nuts. Businesses
HATE the unknown. Without knowing what their tax burden will be next
year, they can't plan. They can't invest. They can't hire.

Sure. Massive give aways to the ultra rich are somehow necessary to save out
economy and balance the budget. That fantasy has been repeated ad-nasium. It is
rediculous.

Democrats wanted to push through the tax cuts for the masses. The repubs blocked
them. Like they blocked everything. Mitch McConnell has bragged that their most
important task is to keep Obama from being reelected. That means more important
than halping the American economy recover. We can all see what the Repubs care
about. It's not the American people.

On 10/27/2010 8:48 AM, HeyBub wrote:
DGDevin wrote:
"HeyBub" wrote in message
m...



So, you ask, what could have been done differently? Had Obama
tackled this issue fifteen months ago, businesses would probably
have invested more, hired more, expanded more. And the economy would
be better for it.

Obama doesn't make the law, Congress does. And in case it's escaped
your eagle eye, in Congress the Republicans have done about
everything they can to delay, disrupt and simply stop the Dems from
doing almost anything. Lone Republican legislators have used every
trick in the book to hold up federal appointments, but we're supposed
to believe the party as a whole would have cooperated if Obama had
asked them to? What color is the sky on your planet?

I agree Congress makes the laws. For example, they passed new health care
legislation. But this new law is known as "Obamacare," not "Congresscare."
We won't know whether the tax law situation would be different today if the
president had pushed for action. But he should have.

As for Republicans stopping the Dems, that's what they were born to do. It's
what they were trained to do. It's what they need to do. For honor's sake.
For duty's sake. For glory's sake. [to paraphrase a movie voice-over]

Regarding the holding up appointments, sigh, if only. Look at Obama's
cabinet: almost all come from government or academia. Very few (like two -
Treasury and AG) have any recent experience in the private sector.

Here's the list:

State - former senator and 1st Lady
Treasury - Wall Street
Defense - holdover
Justice - law firm
Interior - former governor
Agriculture - former governor
Commerce - former governor
Labor - former House member
Health& Human Services - former governor
HUD - city department head
Transportation - former House member
Energy - academic
Education - school superintendent
Homeland security - former governor
Veteran affairs - military

This has got to be the most inexperienced cabinet since that of Ulysses S
Grant.

One could also say that they are the most experienced group. Most, have
extensive administrative experience and were very good at what they had
done.

You preferred then W's technique of whether he connected with them
personally. Heck of a job Brownie?

All these departments are functioning, rather than being broken as
they were under W.

But then, you must have a lot of faith in the private sector. Just
how well do you think this countries first MBA president did?

Jeff

That said, just today, the Democratic senator from Virgina (Webb) announced
he was holding up ALL promotions of general/flag rank until he gets some
data from DOD on base closures.
http://www.startribune.com/politics/...7PQLanchO7DiUr

On Oct 27, 6:50*am, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:
Well, during the GWB time, we had about 5% unemployment. I believe
that the spike in unemployment was due to the BHO tax increases,
reckless spending, and many new regulations and other unfunded
mandates.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
*www.lds.org
.

"Larry W"
wrote in ...

If not for Obama's policies the father would likely also be laid off.

--
* *There are no stupid questions, but there are lots of stupid
answers.

* * *Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar.

On 10/27/2010 9:50 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
Well, during the GWB time, we had about 5% unemployment. I believe
that the spike in unemployment was due to the BHO tax increases,
reckless spending, and many new regulations and other unfunded
mandates.



That unemployment number you are so fond of only counts those that were
employed. Under W there was nearly a net loss of jobs his first term and
a pathetic total over the whole 8 years.

As far as unfunded mandates, what about the Medicare Dug Bill W pushed
through, there never was any funding for that. Nor were the wars in Iraq
and Afghanistan ever funded. What about it? Nor were his tax cuts for
the rich ever funded.

And just what benefit did we get out of deregulating derivatives?
That was McCaine's chief economic advisor who snuck that through in the
dead of night.

At this point it looks like you are just babbling talking points
without any real knowledge. But blind faith is your thing, isn't it?

You should have just kept your OT hate to yourself.

Jeff

In article ,
"A. Baum" wrote:

On Tue, 26 Oct 2010 20:38:06 -0400, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Took my truck in for oil change, today. The mechanic said that business
is so slow. The economy is really awful.

"I laid off my son, today" he says. Doesn't have enough work to pay him.

So, how are all you Democrats enjoying life, these days? Was this the
change you were hoping for? Anyone out there going to vote for more of
this change? I hope not.

Skyrocketing unemployment. Government takeover of health, auto and
banking. Unfathomable debit and trade deficits. All in two years.

Seem republicans suffer from long term memory loss about three years
and Dems from Short term about two years.

--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden
http://www.informationisbeautiful.ne...l-supplements/

"Jeff Thies" wrote in message
...


And just what benefit did we get out of deregulating derivatives?


Hey - be fair. Hedge fund managers need to live too. Do you have any idea
what it costs for a decent landscaping service in southwestern Connecticut
these days?

In article ,
Jeff Thies wrote:


As far as unfunded mandates, what about the Medicare Dug Bill W pushed
through, there never was any funding for that. Nor were the wars in Iraq
and Afghanistan ever funded. What about it? Nor were his tax cuts for
the rich ever funded.

While I more or less agree except with the tax cuts. That assumes
that the government is entitled to some of your money just because it
was there before. Also, you do realize that the cuts included taking the
former 10% bracket down to nothing at all, correct?


And just what benefit did we get out of deregulating derivatives?
That was McCaine's chief economic advisor who snuck that through in the
dead of night.

You do realize that the bill doing that was passed by large
majorities, so the Dems voted for it in droves. And "sneaking it through
in the dead of night" included votes in both Houses-after committee
meetings-- sending it to the conference committee and then back to both
Houses. I'd have to look it up again, but IIRC, the vote in the Senate
was by acclimation or voice vote.


At this point it looks like you are just babbling talking points
without any real knowledge. But blind faith is your thing, isn't it?
Seems to work well for both sides.

--
"Even I realized that money was to politicians what the ecalyptus tree is to koala bears: food, water, shelter and something to crap on."
---PJ O'Rourke

"DGDevin" wrote in message
m...
"HeyBub" wrote in message
m...



So, you ask, what could have been done differently? Had Obama tackled
this issue fifteen months ago, businesses would probably have invested
more, hired more, expanded more. And the economy would be better for it.

Obama doesn't make the law, Congress does. And in case it's escaped your
eagle eye, in Congress the Republicans have done about everything they can
to delay, disrupt and simply stop the Dems from doing almost anything.
Lone Republican legislators have used every trick in the book to hold up
federal appointments, but we're supposed to believe the party as a whole
would have cooperated if Obama had asked them to? What color is the sky
on your planet?

Wrong, moron. Congress does Barry's bidding, and the Supreme Court
appointees back it up legislating from the bench, even though that's not
their branch of government.

Steve

On 10/26/2010 8:38 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
Took my truck in for oil change, today. The mechanic said that
business is so slow. The economy is really awful.

"I laid off my son, today" he says. Doesn't have enough work to pay
him.

So, how are all you Democrats enjoying life, these days? Was this the
change you were hoping for? Anyone out there going to vote for more of
this change? I hope not.

Somehow in a society where you live, Utah, a man having to lay off his own
son is a sign of terrible times ahead. In an area of the country where
employers stack their roles with employees, some of which do absolutely
nothing, it is scary that they would let one of their own go. I guess he
chose his son over his Mom, Dad, and wives, and just had to cut someone. In
most areas, they cut an unproductive worker.

Steve
http://www.exmormon.org/

On 10/27/2010 9:46 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
I'm not sure which planet you inhabit. But, where I am, the Dems have
spent several trillion dollars, and enacted all manner of legislation
that really killed the economy.


Really? The Dems arrived just in time to pronouce it dead and attempt
to resuscitate....Bush left a pile of poo for the next admin. to clean up.

On Wed, 27 Oct 2010 10:31:54 -0400, Jeff Thies
wrote:

On 10/27/2010 9:50 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
Well, during the GWB time, we had about 5% unemployment. I believe
that the spike in unemployment was due to the BHO tax increases,
reckless spending, and many new regulations and other unfunded
mandates.



That unemployment number you are so fond of only counts those that were
employed. Under W there was nearly a net loss of jobs his first term and
a pathetic total over the whole 8 years.


Employment figures mean nothing if they're not sustainable.
The former machinist or factory laborer doing customer service or
applying lawn care chemicals or selling cell phones isn't sustainable.

Didn't see anybody here get to the real problem.
Manufacturing has always been the core of America's wealth.
The core is almost gone.
The economy was always trickle up, from the manufacturing core.

The factory workers enriched the economy and were consumers in the
economy.
They were to key factor for most of the "service" economy.
Call them the flywheel, the pilot light, the sourdough starter, or
whatever you want.

Look around you right now. What do you see that didn't come from a
factory or mill?
Nothing.

All that "employment" of service workers for the last 15 years or so
was not sustainable.
Because America's "core" has been shipped overseas.
It ain't hard to figure out.

People making 50 grand buying 300 grand houses and 40 grand cars.
Full of stuff manufactured overseas.
Paid for with more debt.
Gimbel a break.

Didn't anybody here see that coming?
Nobody here struggle to save for their first house and wonder how
their kids could ever afford a house?

Nobody here ever work in a factory whose work was off shored?
Nobody here ever work an IT job that was off shored?

Then you got your public sector salaries and pensions.
Ever wonder why "administrators" pull down $3-400k salaries.
Then $100k pensions after 10 years?

I don't know when this "wealth creation" BS started.
Started noticing it in the Clinton years.
Money grows on trees by shuffling paper.

Don't normally work that way.
Wealth come from work and production.
And making sure more comes in than goes out.
That's why China is rich and we ain't.
Just check out the history of trade balance.

Sure, some get rich by luck with Ponzi schemes like Wall Street
equities.
They got paid for investing to offshore jobs.
But that's the exception, not the rule.
Quirk of timing.

Anyway, in the end people usually get what they deserve.
So the guy who got rich with stock "investments" deserves that.
The SOB who laid off his own son deserves that too.
Some people are laughers, some crybabies.
Some just work every day and do both.

You work the "system" to do what's best for you.
Same with changing the "system."
If you don't like it, change it.
Try not to be a sucker for anybody.
Nothing new.

--Vic

Steve B wrote:

Wrong, moron. Congress does Barry's bidding, and the Supreme Court
appointees back it up legislating from the bench, even though that's
not their branch of government.

Supreme court legislating from the bench? Do you mean the right wing supreme
court? The one that took a simple case and turned it into the biggest threat to
democracy in our history by giving corporations and billionaires the right to
buy our elections?

Stormin Mormon wrote:
Well, during the GWB time, we had about 5% unemployment. I believe
that the spike in unemployment was due to the BHO tax increases,
reckless spending, and many new regulations and other unfunded
mandates.

And which way was it going when Bush left office? Tell us also exactly the
policies you would propose to solve the problem in the last 2 years. Please
remember that it was the Rupub policies that started the fall. How many changes
have Repubs proposed in those plolicies if they take over?

You're going to need all that money to pay for Obamacare. Millions of
welfare people are relying on you.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Smitty Two" wrote in message
news In article ,
"Stormin Mormon" wrote:


So, how are all you Democrats enjoying life, these days? Was this
the
change you were hoping for? Anyone out there going to vote for more
of
this change? I hope not.

Pretty good. Business is booming. Had my best month ever last month.
Just hired another worker. Kicked in another $100 to the Democratic
Senatorial Campaign Committee. Just spent $1200 on a couple of sticks
of
antique furniture for my new office. Let's keep the recovery on track.

DGDevin wrote:
"Country" wrote in message
...


Ain't it interesting that every politician, regardless of
affiliation, in the 45 years I've been voting has been a proponent
of "changing how things are done in Washington" and yet it never
changes?

So long as the law allows corporations to pour billions into "campaign
donations" it will never change, not much. When corporate lobbyists
write the laws supposed to ensure oversight of the industries that
hire those lobbyists, well what should we expect to happen?

You can thank Republican apointees to the supreme court for that.

I don't believe that for a second. The Dems (such as Clinton and his
"worked harder than he has for anything ever but can't giv you a tax
cut) are the party of raised taxes.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Bob F"
wrote in message ...

Democrats wanted to push through the tax cuts for the masses. The
repubs blocked
them. Like they blocked everything.

The Democrat legacy.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"A. Baum" wrote in message
news
Skyrocketing unemployment. Government takeover of health, auto and
banking. Unfathomable debit and trade deficits. All in two years.

DGDevin wrote:
So your captain steers the ocean liner onto the rocks, and now you're
blaming the tugboat captain because he hasn't been able to pull the
liner off yet?

Who took the cop off the beat on Wall St.?

Who doubled the federal debt in large part due to an unjustified war,
which according to the CBO will end up costing well over two trillion
dollars (much of it borrowed from our dear friend China)?

Who decided torturing prisoners was a good way to go?

Who figured the feds shouldn't need a court order to listen to your
phone calls or read your e-mails?

Who was President when TARP was signed into law, who bailed out GM and
Chrysler and AIG?

In other words, Einstein, who was in charge when all this **** hit
the fan?
I have no illusions about the Dems being incompetent and corrupt if
they're left in office long enough, they are no different from the
Repubs in that respect. But I am astonished at how short the
memories of some folks are, people who apparently believe that the
clowns who aimed the ship at the rocks are the ones we should now
trust not to do it again.

There memories aren't that bad. Don't forget how long every problem in this
country was blamed on Bill Clinton.

You should know-- Dems don't give to charity. Republicans do.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Higgs Boson" wrote in message
...
On Oct 27, 5:19 am, Smitty Two wrote:
In article ,
"Stormin Mormon" wrote:



So, how are all you Democrats enjoying life, these days? Was this
the
change you were hoping for? Anyone out there going to vote for
more of
this change? I hope not.

Pretty good. Business is booming. Had my best month ever last month.
Just hired another worker. Kicked in another $100 to the Democratic
Senatorial Campaign Committee. Just spent $1200 on a couple of
sticks of
antique furniture for my new office. Let's keep the recovery on
track.

How much did you give to charity?

HB

I'd propose a massive cut in Federal spending. Extend the Bush tax
cuts, and ashcan the Obama medical care take over. I'd propose
simplifying the tax code, and make all elected persons subject to the
same laws, entitlements, and medical care that thier constituents
have.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Bob F"
wrote in message ...

And which way was it going when Bush left office? Tell us also exactly
the
policies you would propose to solve the problem in the last 2 years.
Please
remember that it was the Rupub policies that started the fall. How
many changes
have Repubs proposed in those plolicies if they take over?

And the effects of the Clinton tax hike and recession are still being
felt.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Bob F" wrote in message
...

There memories aren't that bad. Don't forget how long every problem in
this
country was blamed on Bill Clinton.

A. Baum wrote:
On Tue, 26 Oct 2010 20:38:06 -0400, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Took my truck in for oil change, today. The mechanic said that
business is so slow. The economy is really awful.

"I laid off my son, today" he says. Doesn't have enough work to pay
him.

So, how are all you Democrats enjoying life, these days? Was this the
change you were hoping for? Anyone out there going to vote for more
of this change? I hope not.

Skyrocketing unemployment. Government takeover of health, auto and
banking. Unfathomable debit and trade deficits. All in two years.

Guess what? It's not going bad at nearly the rate it was two years ago. Pretty
good, considering how long they spent screwing everything up before that.

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...
Took my truck in for oil change, today. The mechanic said that
business is so slow. The economy is really awful.

"I laid off my son, today" he says.....

"He was a lazy SOB."

Jeff Thies wrote:

Regarding the holding up appointments, sigh, if only. Look at Obama's
cabinet: almost all come from government or academia. Very few (like
two - Treasury and AG) have any recent experience in the private
sector. Here's the list:

State - former senator and 1st Lady
Treasury - Wall Street
Defense - holdover
Justice - law firm
Interior - former governor
Agriculture - former governor
Commerce - former governor
Labor - former House member
Health& Human Services - former governor
HUD - city department head
Transportation - former House member
Energy - academic
Education - school superintendent
Homeland security - former governor
Veteran affairs - military

This has got to be the most inexperienced cabinet since that of
Ulysses S Grant.

One could also say that they are the most experienced group. Most,
have extensive administrative experience and were very good at what
they had done.

You preferred then W's technique of whether he connected with them
personally. Heck of a job Brownie?

All these departments are functioning, rather than being broken as
they were under W.

But then, you must have a lot of faith in the private sector. Just
how well do you think this countries first MBA president did?


He actually did quite well. For the first six years we had unemployment
below 5%, the DJIA above 14,000, almost no inflation, 25 consecutive
quarters of economic growth, and so on. All this in spite of two wars,
Katrina, and 9/11.

Then the Democrats took over Congress...

Stormin Mormon wrote:
I don't believe that for a second. The Dems (such as Clinton and his
"worked harder than he has for anything ever but can't giv you a tax
cut) are the party of raised taxes.

You don't believe it, but it is true.

Under Obama, there was a middle class tax cut. It is there in your paycheck -
less taxes taken out. More recently, Democrats proposed extending the Bush cuts
for the middle class, but not the rich. Republicans blocked it.

Bob F wrote:
Steve B wrote:

Wrong, moron. Congress does Barry's bidding, and the Supreme Court
appointees back it up legislating from the bench, even though that's
not their branch of government.

Supreme court legislating from the bench? Do you mean the right wing
supreme court? The one that took a simple case and turned it into the
biggest threat to democracy in our history by giving corporations and
billionaires the right to buy our elections?

Leaving the constitutional arguments aside, the answer to political speech
is more political speech, not less. And to the degree that removing
restrictions enlarges the dialog, the better.

More is spent on advertising potato chips than is spent on presidential
campaigns. (There are those, however, who would argue that one gets more
benefit and satisfaction from a potato chip than a president.)

Stormin Mormon wrote:
I'd propose a massive cut in Federal spending. Extend the Bush tax
cuts, and ashcan the Obama medical care take over. I'd propose
simplifying the tax code, and make all elected persons subject to the
same laws, entitlements, and medical care that thier constituents
have.

Tax cuts have never helped balance the budget. The medical care changes are
going to save 2 trillion over 10 years. Since most of the tax code is there to
give tax favors to big business, that might help.

Stormin Mormon wrote:
And the effects of the Clinton tax hike and recession are still being
felt.

Without the Bush tax cuts, we might even still have the federal budget surplus
that Clinton left us with. We would be mired in the mess we are in.

Stormin Mormon wrote:
You should know-- Dems don't give to charity. Republicans do.

And you should know you made that up.



"Higgs Boson" wrote in message
...
On Oct 27, 5:19 am, Smitty Two wrote:
In article ,
"Stormin Mormon" wrote:



So, how are all you Democrats enjoying life, these days? Was this
the
change you were hoping for? Anyone out there going to vote for
more of
this change? I hope not.

Pretty good. Business is booming. Had my best month ever last month.
Just hired another worker. Kicked in another $100 to the Democratic
Senatorial Campaign Committee. Just spent $1200 on a couple of
sticks of
antique furniture for my new office. Let's keep the recovery on
track.

How much did you give to charity?

HB

Stormin Mormon wrote:
You're going to need all that money to pay for Obamacare. Millions of
welfare people are relying on you.

Fortunately "Obamacare" will save the Feds $2 trillion over 10 years.




So, how are all you Democrats enjoying life, these days? Was this
the
change you were hoping for? Anyone out there going to vote for more
of
this change? I hope not.

Pretty good. Business is booming. Had my best month ever last month.
Just hired another worker. Kicked in another $100 to the Democratic
Senatorial Campaign Committee. Just spent $1200 on a couple of sticks
of
antique furniture for my new office. Let's keep the recovery on track.

Bob F wrote:
The Congress has known for TEN YEARS that the tax cuts are going to
expire on January 1st. Neither they nor the president have done squat
about it.
This uncertainty is driving the business community nuts. Businesses
HATE the unknown. Without knowing what their tax burden will be next
year, they can't plan. They can't invest. They can't hire.

Sure. Massive give aways to the ultra rich are somehow necessary to
save out economy and balance the budget. That fantasy has been
repeated ad-nasium. It is rediculous.

Democrats wanted to push through the tax cuts for the masses. The
repubs blocked them. Like they blocked everything. Mitch McConnell
has bragged that their most important task is to keep Obama from
being reelected. That means more important than halping the American
economy recover. We can all see what the Repubs care about. It's not
the American people.

The Republicans have blocked nothing. The tax bills causing all the concern
have not come up in the 111th Congress. Several have been introduced,
including some by Republicans, but not a single committee hearing has been
held; not a single mark-up done. Not a fix for the expiring Bush tax cuts,
not a fix for capital gains, not a fix for the AMT, not a fix for the
inheritance tax. NOT A SINGLE ONE has come up for a mark-up, vote,
amendment, or consideration.

It is the Democrats that are blocking tax proposals, not Republicans.

Both the Democrats and Republicans want to get the economy back on track.
The Democrats want to do it with more trickle-down (from the government)
economics, government ownership of banks and auto companies, taking over
student loans, running health care, and more regulations. The Republicans
want to improve the economy by getting rid of Obama.

Differing tactics, same goal.

Stormin Mormon wrote:
I don't believe that for a second. The Dems (such as Clinton and his
"worked harder than he has for anything ever but can't giv you a tax
cut) are the party of raised taxes.

Democrats, in general, believe that the size of the pie is fixed and want it
re-sliced into more equal pieces. Republicans, all, believe that tax cuts
can eliminate poverty, soothe bee-bites, and cure cancer.

Both groups exaggerate a little.

Vic Smith wrote:

Employment figures mean nothing if they're not sustainable.
The former machinist or factory laborer doing customer service or
applying lawn care chemicals or selling cell phones isn't sustainable.

Didn't see anybody here get to the real problem.
Manufacturing has always been the core of America's wealth.
The core is almost gone.
The economy was always trickle up, from the manufacturing core.

The factory workers enriched the economy and were consumers in the
economy.
They were to key factor for most of the "service" economy.
Call them the flywheel, the pilot light, the sourdough starter, or
whatever you want.

A romantic notion.

Gone are the days of the hunter/gatherer society. It was replaced by an
agrarian society.

Then the agrarian society was replaced by the industrial revolution.

We are at the beginning of the manufacturing society being replaced by the
information and service society.

The largest employer in the U.S. is Walmart, and they manufacture nothing.
They leave the production of goods to those who can do them best.