Where's the benefit to our country when a Democratic-Party-dominated
Congress is trying to pass a bill chastising the Turks for Armenian
"genocide" that occurred in 1915... NINETY-TWO YEARS AGO?

The answer... NONE!

It's nothing but a mean-spirited attempt to anger a very good ally.

Are Democrats SO stupid as to think that most Americans will not
recognize this attempt for exactly what it is?

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona Voice480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax480)460-2142 | Brass Rat |
| http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave

Jim Thompson wrote:
Where's the benefit to our country when a Democratic-Party-dominated
Congress is trying to pass a bill chastising the Turks for Armenian
"genocide" that occurred in 1915... NINETY-TWO YEARS AGO?

The answer... NONE!

It's nothing but a mean-spirited attempt to anger a very good ally.

Are Democrats SO stupid as to think that most Americans will not
recognize this attempt for exactly what it is?

Turkey is our one true ally in the region. Without their help,
the war in Iraq could not have been prosecuted.

So, the Democrats are trying to **** off Turkey so they will kick
us out of their country (we have a major base there), and will
make the war in Iraq more dangerous for our kids fighting it.

Mean spirited? Yep! But with Democrats (most politicians, actually)
the ends always justifies the means.

-Chuck

Jim Thompson wrote:
Where's the benefit to our country when a Democratic-Party-dominated
Congress is trying to pass a bill chastising the Turks for Armenian
"genocide" that occurred in 1915... NINETY-TWO YEARS AGO?

The answer... NONE!

It's nothing but a mean-spirited attempt to anger a very good ally.

Are Democrats SO stupid as to think that most Americans will not
recognize this attempt for exactly what it is?

They're tired of Bush being in the running for the Greatest Doof of All
Time?

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

Do you need to implement control loops in software?
"Applied Control Theory for Embedded Systems" gives you just what it says.
See details at http://www.wescottdesign.com/actfes/actfes.html

On 16/10/2007 Jim Thompson wrote:

Where's the benefit to our country when a Democratic-Party-dominated
Congress is trying to pass a bill chastising the Turks for Armenian
"genocide" that occurred in 1915... NINETY-TWO YEARS AGO?

The answer... NONE!

It's nothing but a mean-spirited attempt to anger a very good ally.

Are Democrats SO stupid as to think that most Americans will not
recognize this attempt for exactly what it is?

...Jim Thompson

These are politicians we are talking about. They do not do it to
benefit the country, only themselves. For the destination of any benfit
going, look in their pockets.

--
John B

Jim Thompson wrote:
Where's the benefit to our country when a Democratic-Party-dominated
Congress is trying to pass a bill chastising the Turks for Armenian
"genocide" that occurred in 1915... NINETY-TWO YEARS AGO?

The answer... NONE!
(snip)

It is an invitation for them to pass a similar statement
about our genocide of the Amerinds. We need to admit this,
but cannot bring ourselves to do it, so we are motivating
them to do it for us. The difference between their genocide
and ours, is that their present government was not
responsible but ours was.

On Tue, 16 Oct 2007 20:52:44 -0400, John Popelish
wrote:

Jim Thompson wrote:
Where's the benefit to our country when a Democratic-Party-dominated
Congress is trying to pass a bill chastising the Turks for Armenian
"genocide" that occurred in 1915... NINETY-TWO YEARS AGO?

The answer... NONE!
(snip)

It is an invitation for them to pass a similar statement
about our genocide of the Amerinds. We need to admit this,
but cannot bring ourselves to do it, so we are motivating
them to do it for us. The difference between their genocide
and ours, is that their present government was not
responsible but ours was.

Horse pucky. Do you think our present government bears any
resemblance to our government back then?

Our present government can't even kiss its own ass without
apologizing... when the Democrats gain power it will be the beginning
of the end... much like that of the Roman Empire :-(

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona Voice480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax480)460-2142 | Brass Rat |
| http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave

"John Popelish" schreef in bericht
. ..
Jim Thompson wrote:
Where's the benefit to our country when a Democratic-Party-dominated
Congress is trying to pass a bill chastising the Turks for Armenian
"genocide" that occurred in 1915... NINETY-TWO YEARS AGO?

The answer... NONE!
(snip)

It is an invitation for them to pass a similar statement about our
genocide of the Amerinds. We need to admit this, but cannot bring
ourselves to do it, so we are motivating them to do it for us. The
difference between their genocide and ours, is that their present
government was not responsible but ours was.

A more important difference is that a US judge/jury will not condemn you for
admitting, the Turkish will do. (Or did so till very recently.) Nevertheless
I also ask what reasons a US Congress has to pass a bill about another
country internal affairs. If Turkish politicians lie about it, so what? They
might have learned from their US colleagues. So they better concentrate on
the human rights like freedom of press. Not in a US law but by diplomacy in
foreign affairs.

petrus bitbyter

petrus bitbyter wrote:

I also ask what reasons a US Congress has to pass a bill about another
country internal affairs.

LOL !

The US has a long history of meddling in other countries' internal affairs
including supporting military coups ! Passing a Bill asking Turkey to 'own up'
to genocide is quite mild in comparison.

Graham

flipper wrote:

Eeyore wrote:
petrus bitbyter wrote:

I also ask what reasons a US Congress has to pass a bill about another
country internal affairs.

LOL !

The US has a long history of meddling in other countries' internal affairs
including supporting military coups ! Passing a Bill asking Turkey to 'own up'
to genocide is quite mild in comparison.

Dead people can't "own up" to a 95 year old situation.

It's the *live people* who are being asked to do that actually.

Graham

"Jim Thompson" wrote in
message ...
Where's the benefit to our country when a Democratic-Party-dominated
Congress is trying to pass a bill chastising the Turks for Armenian
"genocide" that occurred in 1915... NINETY-TWO YEARS AGO?

The answer... NONE!

It's nothing but a mean-spirited attempt to anger a very good ally.

Are Democrats SO stupid as to think that most Americans will not
recognize this attempt for exactly what it is?


The absolutely only reason they are doing this is because of the war in
iraq. They cannot get tehre way with the troops so they resort to **** like
this. They know damn well what its going to do and thats why they did it
now. They've probably had that ace up there sleeve for years.

And no, they are not that stupid. Most americans are and hence will fall for
it. The outcome is that turkey will probably kick us out and more solders
will get killed from it(in which democrates will whine more and do more to
make the us loose in iraq and more will get killed). The democrates will
stop at nothing to get there way no matter the cost. They see it as a
political issue and could care less about its long term effects on
American's. (did you ever think they actually really care about you and me?
(of course republicans don't care either))

On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 11:33:13 +0100, Eeyore
wrote:



petrus bitbyter wrote:

I also ask what reasons a US Congress has to pass a bill about another
country internal affairs.

LOL !

The US has a long history of meddling in other countries' internal affairs
including supporting military coups ! Passing a Bill asking Turkey to 'own up'
to genocide is quite mild in comparison.

---
"People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones" dontcha
know...

I suspect that "The sun never sets on the British Empire" didn't
come about by you all not meddling in other countries' internal
affairs.


--
JF

"Jim Thompson" wrote in message
...
Where's the benefit to our country when a Democratic-Party-dominated
Congress is trying to pass a bill chastising the Turks for Armenian
"genocide" that occurred in 1915... NINETY-TWO YEARS AGO?

It depends upon if you believe in freedom of speech. The bill is not only
about events that happened 92 years ago but about events that are
happening today.

Here is a quote from a BBC article on this topic:

"In Turkey, the penal code makes calling "for the recognition of the
Armenian genocide" illegal. Writers and translators have been prosecuted
for attempting to stimulate debate on the subject."

The full article is at: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6045182.stm

When a country makes even discussing history a crime then those who
believe in freedom of speech should not be quiet.

Here is another article upon a Turkish journalist who was murdered because
he wrote about the genocide: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6289275.stm

Dan Coby wrote:

When a country makes even discussing history a crime then those who
believe in freedom of speech should not be quiet.

Oh, you mean like the Patriot Act and the DMCA? :-)

On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 11:29:59 -0700, "Dan Coby"
wrote:

"Jim Thompson" wrote in message
.. .
Where's the benefit to our country when a Democratic-Party-dominated
Congress is trying to pass a bill chastising the Turks for Armenian
"genocide" that occurred in 1915... NINETY-TWO YEARS AGO?

It depends upon if you believe in freedom of speech. The bill is not only
about events that happened 92 years ago but about events that are
happening today.

Here is a quote from a BBC article on this topic:

"In Turkey, the penal code makes calling "for the recognition of the
Armenian genocide" illegal. Writers and translators have been prosecuted
for attempting to stimulate debate on the subject."

The full article is at: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6045182.stm

When a country makes even discussing history a crime then those who
believe in freedom of speech should not be quiet.

Here is another article upon a Turkish journalist who was murdered because
he wrote about the genocide: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6289275.stm


(1) I don't give a damn what the BBC has to say on ANY subject.

(2) I consider any attempt to damage US relations with a very good
ally a treasonous act. I note this morning that the Democrat fairies
sent Murtha out to make a statement withdrawing the attempt. He
should be hanged.

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona Voice480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax480)460-2142 | Brass Rat |
| http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave

Jon Slaughter wrote:

"Jim Thompson" wrote

Where's the benefit to our country when a Democratic-Party-dominated
Congress is trying to pass a bill chastising the Turks for Armenian
"genocide" that occurred in 1915... NINETY-TWO YEARS AGO?

The answer... NONE!

It's nothing but a mean-spirited attempt to anger a very good ally.

Are Democrats SO stupid as to think that most Americans will not
recognize this attempt for exactly what it is?

The absolutely only reason they are doing this is because of the war in
iraq. They cannot get tehre way with the troops so they resort to **** like
this. They know damn well what its going to do and thats why they did it
now. They've probably had that ace up there sleeve for years.

I'd say it's more likely they're doing it in order to present a position
consistent with the EU who are also asking for Turkey to address this matter.

Graham

flipper wrote:

Eeyore wrote:
flipper wrote:
Eeyore wrote:
petrus bitbyter wrote:

I also ask what reasons a US Congress has to pass a bill about another
country internal affairs.

LOL !

The US has a long history of meddling in other countries' internal affairs
including supporting military coups ! Passing a Bill asking Turkey to 'own up'
to genocide is quite mild in comparison.

Dead people can't "own up" to a 95 year old situation.

It's the *live people* who are being asked to do that actually.

Right. People who weren't even born at the time, hadn't one damn thing
to do with it, nor can they do anything about it. Plus not even
technically the same 'country' (Ottoman Empire) or government.

No different from blacks seeking to castigate Britain for its involvement in the slave
trade which has been a recent topic of debate and a public statement on the issue has
recently been made by the British Goverment.

It's probably largely silly but it wouldn't actually hurt Turkey to admit what
happened.


In other words, typical left wing stupidity of poking sticks in
people's eyes for no productive purpose whatsoever other than to
mollify their apparently insatiable desire to poke sticks in people's
eyes.

As opposed to right wing tactics of poking guns in peoples' faces !


Btw, it was a 'jihad' to eradicate (Armenian) Christians because they
were, obviously, not Muslim. You know, the sort of thing you've
claimed either doesn't exist or is nothing but a 'few kooks'.

Uh ? Cite please.

Graham

John Fields wrote:

Eeyore wrote:
petrus bitbyter wrote:

I also ask what reasons a US Congress has to pass a bill about another
country internal affairs.

LOL !

The US has a long history of meddling in other countries' internal affairs
including supporting military coups ! Passing a Bill asking Turkey to 'own up'
to genocide is quite mild in comparison.

---
"People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones" dontcha
know...

I suspect that "The sun never sets on the British Empire" didn't
come about by you all not meddling in other countries' internal
affairs.

The difference being that we've long stopped doing it except of course for the
recent Iraq nonsense which was at the behest of the USA in its new Imperial quest.

Graham

Eeyore wrote in
:



John Fields wrote:

Eeyore wrote:
petrus bitbyter wrote:

I also ask what reasons a US Congress has to pass a bill about
another country internal affairs.

LOL !

The US has a long history of meddling in other countries' internal
affairs including supporting military coups ! Passing a Bill asking
Turkey to 'own up' to genocide is quite mild in comparison.

---
"People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones" dontcha
know...

I suspect that "The sun never sets on the British Empire" didn't
come about by you all not meddling in other countries' internal
affairs.

The difference being that we've long stopped doing it except of course
for the recent Iraq nonsense which was at the behest of the USA in its
new Imperial quest.

Graham



Long is a bit of a stretch, Falkland Islands.

----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----

Dan Coby wrote:

"Jim Thompson" wrote

Where's the benefit to our country when a Democratic-Party-dominated
Congress is trying to pass a bill chastising the Turks for Armenian
"genocide" that occurred in 1915... NINETY-TWO YEARS AGO?

It depends upon if you believe in freedom of speech. The bill is not only
about events that happened 92 years ago but about events that are
happening today.

Here is a quote from a BBC article on this topic:

"In Turkey, the penal code makes calling "for the recognition of the
Armenian genocide" illegal. Writers and translators have been prosecuted
for attempting to stimulate debate on the subject."

The full article is at: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6045182.stm

When a country makes even discussing history a crime then those who
believe in freedom of speech should not be quiet.

Here is another article upon a Turkish journalist who was murdered because
he wrote about the genocide: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6289275.stm

And Turkey couldn't wouldn't be allowed to join the EU with laws like that on the
statute book..

Graham

CptDondo wrote:

Dan Coby wrote:

When a country makes even discussing history a crime then those who
believe in freedom of speech should not be quiet.

Oh, you mean like the Patriot Act and the DMCA? :-)

I suspect he means EXACTLY like that.

Graham

On Tue, 16 Oct 2007 20:13:12 UTC, Jim Thompson
wrote:

Where's the benefit to our country when a Democratic-Party-dominated
Congress is trying to pass a bill chastising the Turks for Armenian
"genocide" that occurred in 1915... NINETY-TWO YEARS AGO?


Sounds like a waste of time. Now if the historians want to establish
the truth, that's a different matter.

It does have similarities with pursuing WW2 war criminals who must now
be at least 80 years old.



--
Jim Backus running OS/2 Warp 3 & 4, Debian Linux and Win98SE
bona fide replies to j dot backus the circle thingy jita dot
demon dot co dot uk

me wrote:

Eeyore wrote
John Fields wrote:
Eeyore wrote:
petrus bitbyter wrote:

I also ask what reasons a US Congress has to pass a bill about
another country internal affairs.

LOL !

The US has a long history of meddling in other countries' internal
affairs including supporting military coups ! Passing a Bill asking
Turkey to 'own up' to genocide is quite mild in comparison.

---
"People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones" dontcha
know...

I suspect that "The sun never sets on the British Empire" didn't
come about by you all not meddling in other countries' internal
affairs.

The difference being that we've long stopped doing it except of course
for the recent Iraq nonsense which was at the behest of the USA in its
new Imperial quest.


Long is a bit of a stretch, Falkland Islands.

The Falklands is and was then British. It was the Argentinians who were interfering in
OUR affairs.

Graham

Eeyore wrote in
:



me wrote:

Eeyore wrote
John Fields wrote:
Eeyore wrote:
petrus bitbyter wrote:

I also ask what reasons a US Congress has to pass a bill about
another country internal affairs.

LOL !

The US has a long history of meddling in other countries'
internal affairs including supporting military coups ! Passing a
Bill asking Turkey to 'own up' to genocide is quite mild in
comparison.

---
"People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones" dontcha
know...

I suspect that "The sun never sets on the British Empire" didn't
come about by you all not meddling in other countries' internal
affairs.

The difference being that we've long stopped doing it except of
course for the recent Iraq nonsense which was at the behest of the
USA in its new Imperial quest.


Long is a bit of a stretch, Falkland Islands.

The Falklands is and was then British. It was the Argentinians who were
interfering in OUR affairs.

Graham



Quite right. However the statement was in reference to;

I suspect that "The sun never sets on the British Empire" didn't
come about by you all not meddling in other countries' internal
affairs.

The difference being that we've long stopped doing it except of
course for the recent Iraq nonsense which was at the behest of the
USA in its new Imperial quest.

saying that "you" still retain territories from colonial times, which was
the reason it "contested".

I was not saying it was necessarily a bad thing...

----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----

On 10/17/07 11:34 AM, in article ,
"CptDondo" wrote:

Dan Coby wrote:

When a country makes even discussing history a crime then those who
believe in freedom of speech should not be quiet.

Oh, you mean like the Patriot Act and the DMCA? :-)

Ok! That's twice. Say what you mean to say and don't be so chicken ****.

me wrote:

Eeyore wrote
me wrote:
Eeyore wrote
John Fields wrote:
Eeyore wrote:
petrus bitbyter wrote:

I also ask what reasons a US Congress has to pass a bill about
another country internal affairs.

LOL !

The US has a long history of meddling in other countries'
internal affairs including supporting military coups ! Passing a
Bill asking Turkey to 'own up' to genocide is quite mild in
comparison.

---
"People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones" dontcha
know...

I suspect that "The sun never sets on the British Empire" didn't
come about by you all not meddling in other countries' internal
affairs.

The difference being that we've long stopped doing it except of
course for the recent Iraq nonsense which was at the behest of the
USA in its new Imperial quest.


Long is a bit of a stretch, Falkland Islands.

The Falklands is and was then British. It was the Argentinians who were
interfering in OUR affairs.


Quite right. However the statement was in reference to;

I suspect that "The sun never sets on the British Empire" didn't
come about by you all not meddling in other countries' internal
affairs.

The difference being that we've long stopped doing it except of
course for the recent Iraq nonsense which was at the behest of the
USA in its new Imperial quest.

saying that "you" still retain territories from colonial times, which was
the reason it "contested".

I was not saying it was necessarily a bad thing...

I don't see any reference to colonies there.

Graham

Eeyore wrote in
:



me wrote:

Eeyore wrote
me wrote:
Eeyore wrote
John Fields wrote:
Eeyore wrote:
petrus bitbyter wrote:

I also ask what reasons a US Congress has to pass a bill
about another country internal affairs.

LOL !

The US has a long history of meddling in other countries'
internal affairs including supporting military coups ! Passing
a Bill asking Turkey to 'own up' to genocide is quite mild in
comparison.

---
"People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones"
dontcha know...

I suspect that "The sun never sets on the British Empire"
didn't come about by you all not meddling in other countries'
internal affairs.

The difference being that we've long stopped doing it except of
course for the recent Iraq nonsense which was at the behest of
the USA in its new Imperial quest.


Long is a bit of a stretch, Falkland Islands.

The Falklands is and was then British. It was the Argentinians who
were interfering in OUR affairs.


Quite right. However the statement was in reference to;

I suspect that "The sun never sets on the British Empire" didn't
come about by you all not meddling in other countries' internal
affairs.

The difference being that we've long stopped doing it except of
course for the recent Iraq nonsense which was at the behest of
the USA in its new Imperial quest.

saying that "you" still retain territories from colonial times, which
was the reason it "contested".

I was not saying it was necessarily a bad thing...

I don't see any reference to colonies there.

Graham


The British Empire from "The sun never sets on the British Empire" was
not made up of lands that begged to be included in it.

----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----

Eeyore wrote:


John Fields wrote:


Eeyore wrote:

petrus bitbyter wrote:


I also ask what reasons a US Congress has to pass a bill about another
country internal affairs.

LOL !

The US has a long history of meddling in other countries' internal affairs
including supporting military coups ! Passing a Bill asking Turkey to 'own up'
to genocide is quite mild in comparison.

---
"People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones" dontcha
know...

I suspect that "The sun never sets on the British Empire" didn't
come about by you all not meddling in other countries' internal
affairs.


The difference being that we've long stopped doing it except of course for the
recent Iraq nonsense which was at the behest of the USA in its new Imperial quest.

Graham

Ha,
The British never stopped, they just came up with different ways of
doing it.
You're living proof.

--
"I'm never wrong, once i thought i was, but was mistaken"
Real Programmers Do things like this.
http://webpages.charter.net/jamie_5

"flipper" wrote in message ...
When a country makes even discussing history a crime then those who
believe in freedom of speech should not be quiet.

Then you should speak to the French because their parliament voted to
make denying it was genocide a crime and in 1990 they made it a crime
to deny the Jewish Holocaust.

Might want to speak to the Swiss too because they apparently also
passed a law making it illegal.

Seems the E.U. has a case of pot-kettle-pot=kettle.

I do not think that any government should put any constraint upon the free speech
of its citizens. This includes both denying and requiring that the events in
Turkey in 1915 be called a genocide, or requiring or denying the Holocaust, etc.

What happened in 1915 in Turkey was terrible. However all of the people
involved are dead. Thus I consider the issue only important as a lesson to
be learned about what should not be done. To me, history is important as
a means to learn about both the good and bad things that people can do.

I am bothered by the current government in Turkey (or any other
government) prosecuting its citizens for crimes like 'an insult against
the Turkish state' (also known as Article 301). Nobel laureate Orham Pamuk
was convicted under that law. The journalist Hrant Dink was also convicted
under that law for writing about those events. He was latter murdered.

In defense of Turkey, the government is currently prosecuting people for Dink's
murder and there are efforts by various groups to change Article 301:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/25/wo.../Dink,%20Hrant
(You will note that this URL is from the NY Times since a previous poster refused
to believe the BBC.)

I am bothered by many in this country (U. S.) that consider any disagreement
with the Bush government as being 'treasonous'. I consider this a violation
of the basic concepts of free speech that this country has as one of its
founding (and greatest) principles.

I do realize that pretty much all peoples and all governments have
committed hypocrisies with regard to both prosecution of sub groups and
also limitations on free speech. This does not mean that we should not try to
improve both ourselves and our governments.

flipper wrote:

Eeyore wrote:
flipper wrote:

In other words, typical left wing stupidity of poking sticks in
people's eyes for no productive purpose whatsoever other than to
mollify their apparently insatiable desire to poke sticks in people's
eyes.

As opposed to right wing tactics of poking guns in peoples' faces !

In self defense.

Invading Iraq was 'self defence' ???

Bwahahahahahhahahaa

Graham

flipper wrote:

Eeyorewrote:
flipper wrote:

Btw, it was a 'jihad' to eradicate (Armenian) Christians because they
were, obviously, not Muslim. You know, the sort of thing you've
claimed either doesn't exist or is nothing but a 'few kooks'.

Uh ? Cite please.

Try reading some history before flapping your lips.

Made-up history ?

Graham

flipper wrote:

Eeyore wrote:

The Falklands is and was then British. It was the Argentinians who were interfering in
OUR affairs.

The Falklands were, no doubt, errant islands of the North Sea that
broke loose, wandered across the Atlantic, and bumped up against South
America.

If geographic location is your criterion, then I look forward to the USA ceasing to have
any claim on Hawaii, Alaska, Puerto Rico, Guam, the Virgin Islands, the Marianas and
miscellaneous other uninhabited Pacific islands.

Graham

flipper wrote:

"Dan Coby" wrote:

"In Turkey, the penal code makes calling "for the recognition of the
Armenian genocide" illegal. Writers and translators have been prosecuted
for attempting to stimulate debate on the subject."

The full article is at: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6045182.stm

When a country makes even discussing history a crime then those who
believe in freedom of speech should not be quiet.

Then you should speak to the French because their parliament voted to
make denying it was genocide a crime and in 1990 they made it a crime
to deny the Jewish Holocaust.

Might want to speak to the Swiss too because they apparently also
passed a law making it illegal.

Seems the E.U. has a case of pot-kettle-pot=kettle.

Where is the restriction on ** discussing ** the holocaust ?

Graham

flipper wrote:

Eeyore wrote:
flipper wrote:
"Dan Coby" wrote:

"In Turkey, the penal code makes calling "for the recognition of the
Armenian genocide" illegal. Writers and translators have been prosecuted
for attempting to stimulate debate on the subject."

The full article is at: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6045182.stm

When a country makes even discussing history a crime then those who
believe in freedom of speech should not be quiet.

Then you should speak to the French because their parliament voted to
make denying it was genocide a crime and in 1990 they made it a crime
to deny the Jewish Holocaust.

Might want to speak to the Swiss too because they apparently also
passed a law making it illegal.

Seems the E.U. has a case of pot-kettle-pot=kettle.

Where is the restriction on ** discussing ** the holocaust ?

Thank you for clarifying that your version of 'free speech' is as long
as you use the proper terms and say the proper thing and don't speak
something illegal.

Why would anyone want to deny a historical fact anyway ?

Can you tell me that ?

Graham

flipper wrote:

Eeyore wrote:
flipper wrote:
Eeyore wrote:
flipper wrote:

In other words, typical left wing stupidity of poking sticks in
people's eyes for no productive purpose whatsoever other than to
mollify their apparently insatiable desire to poke sticks in people's
eyes.

As opposed to right wing tactics of poking guns in peoples' faces !

In self defense.

Invading Iraq was 'self defence' ???

Bwahahahahahhahahaa

As I've pointed out before, leave it to the left to defend a WMD
obsessed mass murdering dictator who spent 10 years violating over
13 mandatory U.N. chapter 7 resolutions and the terms of cease fire
for the second of two regional wars he started in addition to his
terrorist activities.

Yes, it was defense.

********.

Graham

flipper wrote:

Eeyore wrote:
flipper wrote:
Eeyore wrote:

The Falklands is and was then British. It was the Argentinians who were interfering in
OUR affairs.

The Falklands were, no doubt, errant islands of the North Sea that
broke loose, wandered across the Atlantic, and bumped up against South
America.

If geographic location is your criterion, then I look forward to the USA ceasing to have
any claim on Hawaii, Alaska, Puerto Rico, Guam, the Virgin Islands, the Marianas and
miscellaneous other uninhabited Pacific islands.

Has nothing to do with 'my', or anyone else's, 'criteria'. The topic
was your declaration of British 'purity'.

Why do keep making things up and attributing to me things I never said ?

Is there something wrong with your brain (aside from it just being a muddled, dumb American
brain) ?

Graham

On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 21:00:33 -0700, "Dan Coby"
wrote:

[snip]

I am bothered by many in this country (U. S.) that consider any disagreement
with the Bush government as being 'treasonous'. I consider this a violation
of the basic concepts of free speech that this country has as one of its
founding (and greatest) principles.

[snip]

It is certainly not treasonous to _speak_ of anything. But for a
governmental body (Congress), presently dominated by the pansy side of
our population, to attempt to create a BILL to antagonize one of our
best allies... that IS treason.

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona Voice480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax480)460-2142 | Brass Rat |
| http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave

"flipper" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 18 Oct 2007 08:00:33 -0700, Jim Thompson
wrote:

On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 21:00:33 -0700, "Dan Coby"
wrote:

[snip]

I am bothered by many in this country (U. S.) that consider any
disagreement
with the Bush government as being 'treasonous'. I consider this a
violation
of the basic concepts of free speech that this country has as one of its
founding (and greatest) principles.

[snip]

It is certainly not treasonous to _speak_ of anything. But for a
governmental body (Congress), presently dominated by the pansy side of
our population, to attempt to create a BILL to antagonize one of our
best allies... that IS treason.

It would be 'treason' only if they intended to give aid and/or comfort
to the enemy.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treason


Do you not believe that the ramifications of what will most likely happen on
passing such a bill actually does? It is definitely an act of disloyalty.
Infact,

"To avoid the abuses of the English law (including executions by Henry VIII
of those who criticized his repeated marriages), treason was specifically
defined in the United States Constitution, the only crime so defined.
Article III Section 3 delineates treason as follows:

Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against
them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No
Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two
Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.
The Congress shall have Power to declare the Punishment of Treason, but no
Attainder of Treason shall work Corruption of Blood, or Forfeiture except
during the Life of the Person attainted."

Essentially they are giving aid and comfort to Al-Qaeda and iran. They are
trying to get american's out of iraq any way they can and they are going so
far as to indirectly support the enemey.


But just plain stupid is another matter.

Stupidity is not an excuse for treason.

On 10/18/07 8:00 AM, in article ,
"Jim Thompson" wrote:

On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 21:00:33 -0700, "Dan Coby"
wrote:

[snip]

I am bothered by many in this country (U. S.) that consider any disagreement
with the Bush government as being 'treasonous'. I consider this a violation
of the basic concepts of free speech that this country has as one of its
founding (and greatest) principles.

[snip]

It is certainly not treasonous to _speak_ of anything. But for a
governmental body (Congress), presently dominated by the pansy side of
our population, to attempt to create a BILL to antagonize one of our
best allies... that IS treason.

More of your ignorant BS. It is NOT treasonable.

I can see why you would be upset..... You pick your friends according to
whether they agree with you and what they might do for you, so by
transference, you believe the US government should do the same.

Some of us (the leftist weenie contingent by your definition) care about the
character of the people we choose to call, and treat as, friend. The
government of Turkey, by officially denying it's citizens free speech, shows
a serious lack of character, dangerously similar to other government leaders
that the US and other governments have castigated.

Is Turkey it's government, or it's people?

You initiated this thread with a blurting of your personal opinion (as you
often do). Why don't you expect better of yourself?



...Jim Thompson

On 10/18/07 1:06 AM, in article , "Eeyore"
wrote:



flipper wrote:

Eeyore wrote:

The Falklands is and was then British. It was the Argentinians who were
interfering in
OUR affairs.

The Falklands were, no doubt, errant islands of the North Sea that
broke loose, wandered across the Atlantic, and bumped up against South
America.

If geographic location is your criterion, then I look forward to the USA
ceasing to have
any claim on Hawaii, Alaska, Puerto Rico, Guam, the Virgin Islands, the
Marianas and
miscellaneous other uninhabited Pacific islands.

Graham


Tsk. Tsk,

On 10/18/07 8:37 AM, in article ,
"flipper" wrote:

On Thu, 18 Oct 2007 14:41:11 +0100, Eeyore
wrote:



flipper wrote:

Eeyore wrote:
flipper wrote:
"Dan Coby" wrote:

"In Turkey, the penal code makes calling "for the recognition of the
Armenian genocide" illegal. Writers and translators have been prosecuted
for attempting to stimulate debate on the subject."

The full article is at: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6045182.stm

When a country makes even discussing history a crime then those who
believe in freedom of speech should not be quiet.

Then you should speak to the French because their parliament voted to
make denying it was genocide a crime and in 1990 they made it a crime
to deny the Jewish Holocaust.

Might want to speak to the Swiss too because they apparently also
passed a law making it illegal.

Seems the E.U. has a case of pot-kettle-pot=kettle.

Where is the restriction on ** discussing ** the holocaust ?

Thank you for clarifying that your version of 'free speech' is as long
as you use the proper terms and say the proper thing and don't speak
something illegal.

Why would anyone want to deny a historical fact anyway ?

Only those involved know for sure what their motives were so your
question is based on a false premise.

What is the false premise?



Can you tell me that ?


Graham