on Wed, 21 Apr 2021 15:15:25 -0400 typed in
rec.woodworking the following:

I'd been saving scrap brass & copper "cause I know I can find a
use for it sometime." Well, some time came, and I sold it for gas
money. "Okay, that works."

I heard a story of the guy who had one Jeep on a trailer behind
his New Jeep. New Jeep engine seized, so he swapped jeeps and headed
home. Gets in an accident, his jeep is totaled. Buys it back from
the insurance company and parts it out. Files a claim for the engine
(under warranty), gets a bigger engine installed. End of the month,
he's got a bigger engine in New Jeep, he's parted out the old jeep and
is ahead a thousand bucks.

Sounds like a lot of work for $1K.

Maybe it is. But you know how it goes, a thousand here, a thousand
there, pretty soon you're talking real money.

A day here and a day there, pretty soon you've taken your whole life.
There's always more money to be had. Never more life.

Of course "every body else" is doing it wrong.

His money, his life, his junked Jeep. As long as he's not an
active hazard to the community, what's it to ya?
--
pyotr filipivich
This Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them(tm)
Selecting who insufficiently Woke(tm) as to serve as the new Them(tm)

On Thu, 22 Apr 2021 07:58:30 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:

on Wed, 21 Apr 2021 15:15:25 -0400 typed in
rec.woodworking the following:

I'd been saving scrap brass & copper "cause I know I can find a
use for it sometime." Well, some time came, and I sold it for gas
money. "Okay, that works."

I heard a story of the guy who had one Jeep on a trailer behind
his New Jeep. New Jeep engine seized, so he swapped jeeps and headed
home. Gets in an accident, his jeep is totaled. Buys it back from
the insurance company and parts it out. Files a claim for the engine
(under warranty), gets a bigger engine installed. End of the month,
he's got a bigger engine in New Jeep, he's parted out the old jeep and
is ahead a thousand bucks.

Sounds like a lot of work for $1K.

Maybe it is. But you know how it goes, a thousand here, a thousand
there, pretty soon you're talking real money.

A day here and a day there, pretty soon you've taken your whole life.
There's always more money to be had. Never more life.

Of course "every body else" is doing it wrong.

His money, his life, his junked Jeep. As long as he's not an
active hazard to the community, what's it to ya?

Opinion. It's a poor use of time. I doubt many consider the number
of heartbeats they have left, in their economic decisions. ...or even
the opportunity cost of doing such things. I would probably pay
better to be a greeter at WallWorld.

on Thu, 22 Apr 2021 20:19:32 -0400 typed in
rec.woodworking the following:
On Thu, 22 Apr 2021 07:58:30 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:

on Wed, 21 Apr 2021 15:15:25 -0400 typed in
rec.woodworking the following:

I'd been saving scrap brass & copper "cause I know I can find a
use for it sometime." Well, some time came, and I sold it for gas
money. "Okay, that works."

I heard a story of the guy who had one Jeep on a trailer behind
his New Jeep. New Jeep engine seized, so he swapped jeeps and headed
home. Gets in an accident, his jeep is totaled. Buys it back from
the insurance company and parts it out. Files a claim for the engine
(under warranty), gets a bigger engine installed. End of the month,
he's got a bigger engine in New Jeep, he's parted out the old jeep and
is ahead a thousand bucks.

Sounds like a lot of work for $1K.

Maybe it is. But you know how it goes, a thousand here, a thousand
there, pretty soon you're talking real money.

A day here and a day there, pretty soon you've taken your whole life.
There's always more money to be had. Never more life.

Of course "every body else" is doing it wrong.

His money, his life, his junked Jeep. As long as he's not an
active hazard to the community, what's it to ya?

Opinion. It's a poor use of time. I doubt many consider the number
of heartbeats they have left, in their economic decisions. ...or even
the opportunity cost of doing such things. I would probably pay
better to be a greeter at WallWorld.

Good point.

Bye.

--
pyotr filipivich
I shall now ask my colleague to tell you how good I am at delegating.

wrote:

On Wed, 21 Apr 2021 13:59:07 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

It's OK, my daughter and her partner will just dig deeper into their pockets to buy
basic supplies for their students. Then they can load the supplies into their cars
and drive to school on the crappy roads that didn't get repaired because we all
protested our assessments to lower our county taxes.

It has nothing to do with supplies or anything else tangible. There
is no interest in teaching kids anything. The purpose of "education"
is to enrich unions (not teachers) and indoctrinate (not teach)
children. Answer me this - why is civics no longer taught, when
"Heather has Two Mommies" is? Or, how our mathematics scores are
among the lowest in the western world, and getting worse. Speaking of
"western world", why is that such an evil thing in education today.

+1

Children are our future. Indoctrination has always been a vital element
with every Communist revolution. By far the worst mistake this country
has made yet was not guarding our children from the leftists agenda sooner.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRbir8vCcXw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zx5ZE36XsuA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VfSqsUfE7V0

On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 19:40:02 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

wrote:

On Wed, 21 Apr 2021 13:59:07 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

It's OK, my daughter and her partner will just dig deeper into their pockets to buy
basic supplies for their students. Then they can load the supplies into their cars
and drive to school on the crappy roads that didn't get repaired because we all
protested our assessments to lower our county taxes.

It has nothing to do with supplies or anything else tangible. There
is no interest in teaching kids anything. The purpose of "education"
is to enrich unions (not teachers) and indoctrinate (not teach)
children. Answer me this - why is civics no longer taught, when
"Heather has Two Mommies" is? Or, how our mathematics scores are
among the lowest in the western world, and getting worse. Speaking of
"western world", why is that such an evil thing in education today.

+1

Children are our future. Indoctrination has always been a vital element
with every Communist revolution. By far the worst mistake this country
has made yet was not guarding our children from the leftists agenda sooner.



Facts are scary - to those who have such hard-felt "beliefs" -
but facts matter ...

Look at the 24 countries ranking better than good 'ol US of A
and decide which of those are .. just a little bit more socialist ..

https://factsmaps.com/pisa-2018-worl...ience-reading/

I'll never stand-and-defend the big-fat-cat public service unions
but will not blame the teachers ! In my experience they are a
very dedicated bunch. The good ones can often rank above
the parents - for positive influence on the kids - and will be
remembered for life by their grateful students.
.. the few bad ones will also be well remembered ..
and it wasn't the union that made them that way.
John T.

On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 16:34:02 -0400, wrote:

On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 19:40:02 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

wrote:

On Wed, 21 Apr 2021 13:59:07 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

It's OK, my daughter and her partner will just dig deeper into their pockets to buy
basic supplies for their students. Then they can load the supplies into their cars
and drive to school on the crappy roads that didn't get repaired because we all
protested our assessments to lower our county taxes.

It has nothing to do with supplies or anything else tangible. There
is no interest in teaching kids anything. The purpose of "education"
is to enrich unions (not teachers) and indoctrinate (not teach)
children. Answer me this - why is civics no longer taught, when
"Heather has Two Mommies" is? Or, how our mathematics scores are
among the lowest in the western world, and getting worse. Speaking of
"western world", why is that such an evil thing in education today.

+1

Children are our future. Indoctrination has always been a vital element
with every Communist revolution. By far the worst mistake this country
has made yet was not guarding our children from the leftists agenda sooner.



Facts are scary - to those who have such hard-felt "beliefs" -
but facts matter ...

Look at the 24 countries ranking better than good 'ol US of A
and decide which of those are .. just a little bit more socialist ..

https://factsmaps.com/pisa-2018-worl...ience-reading/

I'll never stand-and-defend the big-fat-cat public service unions
but will not blame the teachers ! In my experience they are a
very dedicated bunch. The good ones can often rank above
the parents - for positive influence on the kids - and will be
remembered for life by their grateful students.
.. the few bad ones will also be well remembered ..
and it wasn't the union that made them that way.
John T.

The Nazis were very dedicated. Being dedicated is not enough--being
dedicated in a direction that improves society is what is needed.
Unfortunately the teachers are the products of colleges and
universities and those colleges and universities are dominated by
"professors" whose only real skill is professing and who have very
little touch with the reality of life outside of academia.

The unions need to go but more importantly the "professors" need a
good hard dose of reality beaten into them.

On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 4:56:57 PM UTC-4, J. Clarke wrote:
On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 16:34:02 -0400, wrote:

On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 19:40:02 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

wrote:

On Wed, 21 Apr 2021 13:59:07 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

It's OK, my daughter and her partner will just dig deeper into their pockets to buy
basic supplies for their students. Then they can load the supplies into their cars
and drive to school on the crappy roads that didn't get repaired because we all
protested our assessments to lower our county taxes.

It has nothing to do with supplies or anything else tangible. There
is no interest in teaching kids anything. The purpose of "education"
is to enrich unions (not teachers) and indoctrinate (not teach)
children. Answer me this - why is civics no longer taught, when
"Heather has Two Mommies" is? Or, how our mathematics scores are
among the lowest in the western world, and getting worse. Speaking of
"western world", why is that such an evil thing in education today.

+1

Children are our future. Indoctrination has always been a vital element
with every Communist revolution. By far the worst mistake this country
has made yet was not guarding our children from the leftists agenda sooner.



Facts are scary - to those who have such hard-felt "beliefs" -
but facts matter ...

Look at the 24 countries ranking better than good 'ol US of A
and decide which of those are .. just a little bit more socialist ..

https://factsmaps.com/pisa-2018-worl...ience-reading/

I'll never stand-and-defend the big-fat-cat public service unions
but will not blame the teachers ! In my experience they are a
very dedicated bunch. The good ones can often rank above
the parents - for positive influence on the kids - and will be
remembered for life by their grateful students.
.. the few bad ones will also be well remembered ..
and it wasn't the union that made them that way.
John T.
The Nazis were very dedicated. Being dedicated is not enough--being
dedicated in a direction that improves society is what is needed.
Unfortunately the teachers are the products of colleges and
universities and those colleges and universities are dominated by
"professors" whose only real skill is professing and who have very
little touch with the reality of life outside of academia.

The unions need to go but more importantly the "professors" need a
good hard dose of reality beaten into them.

When you paint an entire group with one broad brush, you do a
disservice to many, maybe even to the majority.

I've got 2 daughters and 2 semi-daughters-in-law who all work in
the educational arena. One has her Doctorate, the rest have Masters.
One daughter has a Dual-Masters. All four are in different segments
of the educational space and all 4 are making a difference. That
"direction that improves society" type of difference.

They all went to different universities. A total of 9 different universities.
They are all making that positive difference because they all had
professors that were dedicated to "improving society". The one
with the PhD just accepted an Assistant Professor position at
Purdue where she will be teaching and running a lab doing studies
on certain health issues. She is dedicated to "improving society".

Coincidence? Did these 4 women just happen to stumble into the
only programs (across 9 universities) that were run by professors
dedicated to "improving society" or is it possible that it's not as dire
a situation as you believe?

wrote:

On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 19:40:02 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

wrote:

On Wed, 21 Apr 2021 13:59:07 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

It's OK, my daughter and her partner will just dig deeper into their pockets to buy
basic supplies for their students. Then they can load the supplies into their cars
and drive to school on the crappy roads that didn't get repaired because we all
protested our assessments to lower our county taxes.

It has nothing to do with supplies or anything else tangible. There
is no interest in teaching kids anything. The purpose of "education"
is to enrich unions (not teachers) and indoctrinate (not teach)
children. Answer me this - why is civics no longer taught, when
"Heather has Two Mommies" is? Or, how our mathematics scores are
among the lowest in the western world, and getting worse. Speaking of
"western world", why is that such an evil thing in education today.

+1

Children are our future. Indoctrination has always been a vital element
with every Communist revolution. By far the worst mistake this country
has made yet was not guarding our children from the leftists agenda sooner.



Facts are scary - to those who have such hard-felt "beliefs" -
but facts matter ...

Look at the 24 countries ranking better than good 'ol US of A
and decide which of those are .. just a little bit more socialist ..

https://factsmaps.com/pisa-2018-worl...ience-reading/

So, if the "good 'ol USA" was "just a little bit more socialist" we too,
could climb up the list... OK. Got it.

Except, back in the '60s, I'm pretty sure the "good 'ol USA" was near the
top of the 'list' (certainly in the top 5), yet we were inarguably far less
"socialist" than we are now. So yea, John "facts matter".

DerbyDad03 wrote:

On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 4:56:57 PM UTC-4, J. Clarke wrote:
On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 16:34:02 -0400, wrote:

On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 19:40:02 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

wrote:

On Wed, 21 Apr 2021 13:59:07 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

It's OK, my daughter and her partner will just dig deeper into their pockets to buy
basic supplies for their students. Then they can load the supplies into their cars
and drive to school on the crappy roads that didn't get repaired because we all
protested our assessments to lower our county taxes.

It has nothing to do with supplies or anything else tangible. There
is no interest in teaching kids anything. The purpose of "education"
is to enrich unions (not teachers) and indoctrinate (not teach)
children. Answer me this - why is civics no longer taught, when
"Heather has Two Mommies" is? Or, how our mathematics scores are
among the lowest in the western world, and getting worse. Speaking of
"western world", why is that such an evil thing in education today.

+1

Children are our future. Indoctrination has always been a vital element
with every Communist revolution. By far the worst mistake this country
has made yet was not guarding our children from the leftists agenda sooner.



Facts are scary - to those who have such hard-felt "beliefs" -
but facts matter ...

Look at the 24 countries ranking better than good 'ol US of A
and decide which of those are .. just a little bit more socialist ..

https://factsmaps.com/pisa-2018-worl...ience-reading/

I'll never stand-and-defend the big-fat-cat public service unions
but will not blame the teachers ! In my experience they are a
very dedicated bunch. The good ones can often rank above
the parents - for positive influence on the kids - and will be
remembered for life by their grateful students.
.. the few bad ones will also be well remembered ..
and it wasn't the union that made them that way.
John T.
The Nazis were very dedicated. Being dedicated is not enough--being
dedicated in a direction that improves society is what is needed.
Unfortunately the teachers are the products of colleges and
universities and those colleges and universities are dominated by
"professors" whose only real skill is professing and who have very
little touch with the reality of life outside of academia.

The unions need to go but more importantly the "professors" need a
good hard dose of reality beaten into them.

When you paint an entire group with one broad brush, you do a
disservice to many, maybe even to the majority.

I've got 2 daughters and 2 semi-daughters-in-law who all work in
the educational arena. One has her Doctorate, the rest have Masters.
One daughter has a Dual-Masters. All four are in different segments
of the educational space and all 4 are making a difference. That
"direction that improves society" type of difference.

They all went to different universities. A total of 9 different universities.
They are all making that positive difference because they all had
professors that were dedicated to "improving society". The one
with the PhD just accepted an Assistant Professor position at
Purdue where she will be teaching and running a lab doing studies
on certain health issues. She is dedicated to "improving society".

Coincidence? Did these 4 women just happen to stumble into the
only programs (across 9 universities) that were run by professors
dedicated to "improving society" or is it possible that it's not as dire
a situation as you believe?

Paul Rossi, the former math teacher at Grace Church High School:
https://pdst.fm/e/chtbl.com/track/384D27/traffic.megaphone.fm/MKA9554446066.mp3

On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 18:17:22 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

wrote:

On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 19:40:02 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

wrote:

On Wed, 21 Apr 2021 13:59:07 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

It's OK, my daughter and her partner will just dig deeper into their pockets to buy
basic supplies for their students. Then they can load the supplies into their cars
and drive to school on the crappy roads that didn't get repaired because we all
protested our assessments to lower our county taxes.

It has nothing to do with supplies or anything else tangible. There
is no interest in teaching kids anything. The purpose of "education"
is to enrich unions (not teachers) and indoctrinate (not teach)
children. Answer me this - why is civics no longer taught, when
"Heather has Two Mommies" is? Or, how our mathematics scores are
among the lowest in the western world, and getting worse. Speaking of
"western world", why is that such an evil thing in education today.

+1

Children are our future. Indoctrination has always been a vital element
with every Communist revolution. By far the worst mistake this country
has made yet was not guarding our children from the leftists agenda sooner.



Facts are scary - to those who have such hard-felt "beliefs" -
but facts matter ...

Look at the 24 countries ranking better than good 'ol US of A
and decide which of those are .. just a little bit more socialist ..

https://factsmaps.com/pisa-2018-worl...ience-reading/

So, if the "good 'ol USA" was "just a little bit more socialist" we too,
could climb up the list... OK. Got it.

Except, back in the '60s, I'm pretty sure the "good 'ol USA" was near the
top of the 'list' (certainly in the top 5), yet we were inarguably far less
"socialist" than we are now. So yea, John "facts matter".


You're using beliefs and opinions again ..
Without going back 60 years, I also suspect that the USA is
trending downward - but I'll stop short of blaming the teachers
or their unions for everything that is wrong with the system.
John T.

On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 18:26:46 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

DerbyDad03 wrote:

On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 4:56:57 PM UTC-4, J. Clarke wrote:
On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 16:34:02 -0400, wrote:

On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 19:40:02 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

wrote:

On Wed, 21 Apr 2021 13:59:07 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

It's OK, my daughter and her partner will just dig deeper into their pockets to buy
basic supplies for their students. Then they can load the supplies into their cars
and drive to school on the crappy roads that didn't get repaired because we all
protested our assessments to lower our county taxes.

It has nothing to do with supplies or anything else tangible. There
is no interest in teaching kids anything. The purpose of "education"
is to enrich unions (not teachers) and indoctrinate (not teach)
children. Answer me this - why is civics no longer taught, when
"Heather has Two Mommies" is? Or, how our mathematics scores are
among the lowest in the western world, and getting worse. Speaking of
"western world", why is that such an evil thing in education today.

+1

Children are our future. Indoctrination has always been a vital element
with every Communist revolution. By far the worst mistake this country
has made yet was not guarding our children from the leftists agenda sooner.



Facts are scary - to those who have such hard-felt "beliefs" -
but facts matter ...

Look at the 24 countries ranking better than good 'ol US of A
and decide which of those are .. just a little bit more socialist ..

https://factsmaps.com/pisa-2018-worl...ience-reading/

I'll never stand-and-defend the big-fat-cat public service unions
but will not blame the teachers ! In my experience they are a
very dedicated bunch. The good ones can often rank above
the parents - for positive influence on the kids - and will be
remembered for life by their grateful students.
.. the few bad ones will also be well remembered ..
and it wasn't the union that made them that way.
John T.
The Nazis were very dedicated. Being dedicated is not enough--being
dedicated in a direction that improves society is what is needed.
Unfortunately the teachers are the products of colleges and
universities and those colleges and universities are dominated by
"professors" whose only real skill is professing and who have very
little touch with the reality of life outside of academia.

The unions need to go but more importantly the "professors" need a
good hard dose of reality beaten into them.

When you paint an entire group with one broad brush, you do a
disservice to many, maybe even to the majority.

I've got 2 daughters and 2 semi-daughters-in-law who all work in
the educational arena. One has her Doctorate, the rest have Masters.
One daughter has a Dual-Masters. All four are in different segments
of the educational space and all 4 are making a difference. That
"direction that improves society" type of difference.

They all went to different universities. A total of 9 different universities.
They are all making that positive difference because they all had
professors that were dedicated to "improving society". The one
with the PhD just accepted an Assistant Professor position at
Purdue where she will be teaching and running a lab doing studies
on certain health issues. She is dedicated to "improving society".

Coincidence? Did these 4 women just happen to stumble into the
only programs (across 9 universities) that were run by professors
dedicated to "improving society" or is it possible that it's not as dire
a situation as you believe?

Paul Rossi, the former math teacher at Grace Church High School:
https://pdst.fm/e/chtbl.com/track/384D27/traffic.megaphone.fm/MKA9554446066.mp3

Are they actually improving society or are they doing things that
professors with no experience of the real world _think_ will improve
society?

Participating in feel-good programs is not improving society.

And medicine is in a different category for most academia in that it
still requires an apprenticeship.

On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 14:42:15 -0400, wrote:

On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 18:17:22 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

wrote:

On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 19:40:02 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

wrote:

On Wed, 21 Apr 2021 13:59:07 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

It's OK, my daughter and her partner will just dig deeper into their pockets to buy
basic supplies for their students. Then they can load the supplies into their cars
and drive to school on the crappy roads that didn't get repaired because we all
protested our assessments to lower our county taxes.

It has nothing to do with supplies or anything else tangible. There
is no interest in teaching kids anything. The purpose of "education"
is to enrich unions (not teachers) and indoctrinate (not teach)
children. Answer me this - why is civics no longer taught, when
"Heather has Two Mommies" is? Or, how our mathematics scores are
among the lowest in the western world, and getting worse. Speaking of
"western world", why is that such an evil thing in education today.

+1

Children are our future. Indoctrination has always been a vital element
with every Communist revolution. By far the worst mistake this country
has made yet was not guarding our children from the leftists agenda sooner.



Facts are scary - to those who have such hard-felt "beliefs" -
but facts matter ...

Look at the 24 countries ranking better than good 'ol US of A
and decide which of those are .. just a little bit more socialist ..

https://factsmaps.com/pisa-2018-worl...ience-reading/

So, if the "good 'ol USA" was "just a little bit more socialist" we too,
could climb up the list... OK. Got it.

Except, back in the '60s, I'm pretty sure the "good 'ol USA" was near the
top of the 'list' (certainly in the top 5), yet we were inarguably far less
"socialist" than we are now. So yea, John "facts matter".


You're using beliefs and opinions again ..
Without going back 60 years, I also suspect that the USA is
trending downward - but I'll stop short of blaming the teachers
or their unions for everything that is wrong with the system.
John T.

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon. It also turned the automobile from a toy for the
elite to transportation for everyman, put a TV in nearly every house,
and made food available at reasonable prices in bewildering variety,
started rolling out cell phones, and invented the microprocessor. Oh,
and incidentally defeated the Nazis and the Japanese at more or less
the same time.

This was all done by the products of an education system that was
according to the professors badly broken and needed to be fixed with
massive influxes of Federal money. So the Federal money started in
1958--the first products of this new and improved education system
would have graduated around 1970. So what have they done for us? They
expanded the cell netork, finished Arpanet, and continued development
of the microprocessor, and produced bigger and better games. Oh, and
they have managed to drag the world back kicking and screaming to the
days when a computer was something that you paid by the hour to use.

There is some light but one wonders why it took somebody from South
Africa to turn it on.

On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 18:26:46 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

DerbyDad03 wrote:

On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 4:56:57 PM UTC-4, J. Clarke wrote:
On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 16:34:02 -0400, wrote:

On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 19:40:02 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

wrote:

On Wed, 21 Apr 2021 13:59:07 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

It's OK, my daughter and her partner will just dig deeper into their pockets to buy
basic supplies for their students. Then they can load the supplies into their cars
and drive to school on the crappy roads that didn't get repaired because we all
protested our assessments to lower our county taxes.

It has nothing to do with supplies or anything else tangible. There
is no interest in teaching kids anything. The purpose of "education"
is to enrich unions (not teachers) and indoctrinate (not teach)
children. Answer me this - why is civics no longer taught, when
"Heather has Two Mommies" is? Or, how our mathematics scores are
among the lowest in the western world, and getting worse. Speaking of
"western world", why is that such an evil thing in education today.

+1

Children are our future. Indoctrination has always been a vital element
with every Communist revolution. By far the worst mistake this country
has made yet was not guarding our children from the leftists agenda sooner.



Facts are scary - to those who have such hard-felt "beliefs" -
but facts matter ...

Look at the 24 countries ranking better than good 'ol US of A
and decide which of those are .. just a little bit more socialist ..

https://factsmaps.com/pisa-2018-worl...ience-reading/

I'll never stand-and-defend the big-fat-cat public service unions
but will not blame the teachers ! In my experience they are a
very dedicated bunch. The good ones can often rank above
the parents - for positive influence on the kids - and will be
remembered for life by their grateful students.
.. the few bad ones will also be well remembered ..
and it wasn't the union that made them that way.
John T.
The Nazis were very dedicated. Being dedicated is not enough--being
dedicated in a direction that improves society is what is needed.
Unfortunately the teachers are the products of colleges and
universities and those colleges and universities are dominated by
"professors" whose only real skill is professing and who have very
little touch with the reality of life outside of academia.

The unions need to go but more importantly the "professors" need a
good hard dose of reality beaten into them.

When you paint an entire group with one broad brush, you do a
disservice to many, maybe even to the majority.

I've got 2 daughters and 2 semi-daughters-in-law who all work in
the educational arena. One has her Doctorate, the rest have Masters.
One daughter has a Dual-Masters. All four are in different segments
of the educational space and all 4 are making a difference. That
"direction that improves society" type of difference.

They all went to different universities. A total of 9 different universities.
They are all making that positive difference because they all had
professors that were dedicated to "improving society". The one
with the PhD just accepted an Assistant Professor position at
Purdue where she will be teaching and running a lab doing studies
on certain health issues. She is dedicated to "improving society".

Coincidence? Did these 4 women just happen to stumble into the
only programs (across 9 universities) that were run by professors
dedicated to "improving society" or is it possible that it's not as dire
a situation as you believe?

Paul Rossi, the former math teacher at Grace Church High School:
https://pdst.fm/e/chtbl.com/track/384D27/traffic.megaphone.fm/MKA9554446066.mp3

I get nothing but the progress bar.

On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 14:42:15 -0400, wrote:

On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 18:17:22 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

wrote:

On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 19:40:02 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

wrote:

On Wed, 21 Apr 2021 13:59:07 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

It's OK, my daughter and her partner will just dig deeper into their pockets to buy
basic supplies for their students. Then they can load the supplies into their cars
and drive to school on the crappy roads that didn't get repaired because we all
protested our assessments to lower our county taxes.

It has nothing to do with supplies or anything else tangible. There
is no interest in teaching kids anything. The purpose of "education"
is to enrich unions (not teachers) and indoctrinate (not teach)
children. Answer me this - why is civics no longer taught, when
"Heather has Two Mommies" is? Or, how our mathematics scores are
among the lowest in the western world, and getting worse. Speaking of
"western world", why is that such an evil thing in education today.

+1

Children are our future. Indoctrination has always been a vital element
with every Communist revolution. By far the worst mistake this country
has made yet was not guarding our children from the leftists agenda sooner.



Facts are scary - to those who have such hard-felt "beliefs" -
but facts matter ...

Look at the 24 countries ranking better than good 'ol US of A
and decide which of those are .. just a little bit more socialist ..

https://factsmaps.com/pisa-2018-worl...ience-reading/

So, if the "good 'ol USA" was "just a little bit more socialist" we too,
could climb up the list... OK. Got it.

Except, back in the '60s, I'm pretty sure the "good 'ol USA" was near the
top of the 'list' (certainly in the top 5), yet we were inarguably far less
"socialist" than we are now. So yea, John "facts matter".


You're using beliefs and opinions again ..
Without going back 60 years, I also suspect that the USA is
trending downward - but I'll stop short of blaming the teachers
or their unions for everything that is wrong with the system.

Sixty years ago *we* were trending downward into socialism. Teachers
were already indoctrinated, particularly in the humanities and "soft
sciences" (anything with "science" in it's title, isn't).

I was there. As he said, facts matter.

On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 14:42:15 -0400, wrote:

On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 18:17:22 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

wrote:

On Sat, 24 Apr 2021 19:40:02 +0000, Spalted Walt
wrote:

wrote:

On Wed, 21 Apr 2021 13:59:07 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

It's OK, my daughter and her partner will just dig deeper into their pockets to buy
basic supplies for their students. Then they can load the supplies into their cars
and drive to school on the crappy roads that didn't get repaired because we all
protested our assessments to lower our county taxes.

It has nothing to do with supplies or anything else tangible. There
is no interest in teaching kids anything. The purpose of "education"
is to enrich unions (not teachers) and indoctrinate (not teach)
children. Answer me this - why is civics no longer taught, when
"Heather has Two Mommies" is? Or, how our mathematics scores are
among the lowest in the western world, and getting worse. Speaking of
"western world", why is that such an evil thing in education today.

+1

Children are our future. Indoctrination has always been a vital element
with every Communist revolution. By far the worst mistake this country
has made yet was not guarding our children from the leftists agenda sooner.



Facts are scary - to those who have such hard-felt "beliefs" -
but facts matter ...

Look at the 24 countries ranking better than good 'ol US of A
and decide which of those are .. just a little bit more socialist ..

https://factsmaps.com/pisa-2018-worl...ience-reading/

So, if the "good 'ol USA" was "just a little bit more socialist" we too,
could climb up the list... OK. Got it.

Except, back in the '60s, I'm pretty sure the "good 'ol USA" was near the
top of the 'list' (certainly in the top 5), yet we were inarguably far less
"socialist" than we are now. So yea, John "facts matter".


You're using beliefs and opinions again ..
Without going back 60 years, I also suspect that the USA is
trending downward - but I'll stop short of blaming the teachers
or their unions for everything that is wrong with the system.
John T.

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

It also turned the automobile from a toy for the
elite to transportation for everyman, put a TV in nearly every house,
and made food available at reasonable prices in bewildering variety,
started rolling out cell phones, and invented the microprocessor. Oh,
and incidentally defeated the Nazis and the Japanese at more or less
the same time.

Designed by people schooled in the 60s and 70s. Engineering types.
Not Black-Female-Trans-middle-ages-English majors. All that crept
into STEM. In fact, it's now called "STEAM" to deprecate the
sciences.

This was all done by the products of an education system that was
according to the professors badly broken and needed to be fixed with
massive influxes of Federal money. So the Federal money started in
1958--the first products of this new and improved education system
would have graduated around 1970. So what have they done for us? They
expanded the cell netork, finished Arpanet, and continued development
of the microprocessor, and produced bigger and better games. Oh, and
they have managed to drag the world back kicking and screaming to the
days when a computer was something that you paid by the hour to use.

Perhaps '70s but, again, it filtered from the liberal schools into the
sciences about then. I was at the beginning ('70-'74) of that
nonsense in the Engineering curriculum. It's now complete.

There is some light but one wonders why it took somebody from South
Africa to turn it on.

Huh?

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

Seems this is when the Japanese entered our market and pretty much
showed us how a vehicle should be built.

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

Seems this is when the Japanese entered our market and pretty much
showed us how a vehicle should be built.



Glad you only went back to 1972 !
1971 MotorTrend's Car Of The Year
Chevy Vega ... :-)
John T.

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 12:01:38 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

Seems this is when the Japanese entered our market and pretty much
showed us how a vehicle should be built.



Glad you only went back to 1972 !
1971 MotorTrend's Car Of The Year
Chevy Vega ... :-)

Which was actually a pretty nice car until it rusted away. My Dad had
one--he really enjoyed driving it.

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 13:50:36 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 12:01:38 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

Seems this is when the Japanese entered our market and pretty much
showed us how a vehicle should be built.



Glad you only went back to 1972 !
1971 MotorTrend's Car Of The Year
Chevy Vega ... :-)

Which was actually a pretty nice car until it rusted away. My Dad had
one--he really enjoyed driving it.


I had one as a teenager - my second car - it was ~ 4 years old
& I paid $ 450. for it - I needed wheels fast for a job transfer -
- the rust-repairs were already failing badly ;
it burned oil ; noisy ; no trunk space ; uncomfortable seats ;
terrible rear wheel drive traction ; etc
I can't think of a single plus that I could grant it.

One winter morning, I was spinning on a patch of snow in the
parking lot when a nice guy offered a push - he put one hand on the
drivers door handle and his other hand grabbed the rear fender well -
and gave a good heave-ho - he apologized as he stood there with
a good chunk of fender in his hand - I thanked him for the help and
said don't worry about it .. you can keep that .. :-) true story.

Drove it about 2 years and gladly scrapped it.
Car-Of-The-Year ! yeah right.
John T.

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 14:25:19 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 13:50:36 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 12:01:38 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

Seems this is when the Japanese entered our market and pretty much
showed us how a vehicle should be built.



Glad you only went back to 1972 !
1971 MotorTrend's Car Of The Year
Chevy Vega ... :-)

Which was actually a pretty nice car until it rusted away. My Dad had
one--he really enjoyed driving it.


I had one as a teenager - my second car - it was ~ 4 years old
& I paid $ 450. for it - I needed wheels fast for a job transfer -
- the rust-repairs were already failing badly ;
it burned oil ; noisy ; no trunk space ; uncomfortable seats ;
terrible rear wheel drive traction ; etc
I can't think of a single plus that I could grant it.

One winter morning, I was spinning on a patch of snow in the
parking lot when a nice guy offered a push - he put one hand on the
drivers door handle and his other hand grabbed the rear fender well -
and gave a good heave-ho - he apologized as he stood there with
a good chunk of fender in his hand - I thanked him for the help and
said don't worry about it .. you can keep that .. :-) true story.

Drove it about 2 years and gladly scrapped it.
Car-Of-The-Year ! yeah right.
John T.

I suspect one of the reasons my Dad liked it was that we lived in
Florida where winter traction wasn't an issue.

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

And millenials had exactly what to do with that?

Seems this is when the Japanese entered our market and pretty much
showed us how a vehicle should be built.

After our parents showed them how to do it.

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 12:01:38 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

Seems this is when the Japanese entered our market and pretty much
showed us how a vehicle should be built.



Glad you only went back to 1972 !
1971 MotorTrend's Car Of The Year
Chevy Vega ... :-)
John T.

The Monza was the Car of the Year for 1975. It was just a dressed up
Vega.

I had a '70 AMC Gremlin. That really should have been Car of the
year. They made more money on parts than the car. It _had_ to be
profitable.

I got rid of that four years later for a Mustang II, which was just a
Pinto in drag. I could really pick 'em.

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 14:25:19 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 13:50:36 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 12:01:38 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

Seems this is when the Japanese entered our market and pretty much
showed us how a vehicle should be built.



Glad you only went back to 1972 !
1971 MotorTrend's Car Of The Year
Chevy Vega ... :-)

Which was actually a pretty nice car until it rusted away. My Dad had
one--he really enjoyed driving it.


I had one as a teenager - my second car - it was ~ 4 years old
& I paid $ 450. for it - I needed wheels fast for a job transfer -
- the rust-repairs were already failing badly ;
it burned oil ; noisy ; no trunk space ; uncomfortable seats ;
terrible rear wheel drive traction ; etc
I can't think of a single plus that I could grant it.

$450

One winter morning, I was spinning on a patch of snow in the
parking lot when a nice guy offered a push - he put one hand on the
drivers door handle and his other hand grabbed the rear fender well -
and gave a good heave-ho - he apologized as he stood there with
a good chunk of fender in his hand - I thanked him for the help and
said don't worry about it .. you can keep that .. :-) true story.

Drove it about 2 years and gladly scrapped it.
Car-Of-The-Year ! yeah right.

I only had my Mustang II for three years until the body rotted out so
badly it couldn't be driven.

I had a '70 AMC Gremlin. That really should have been Car of the
year. They made more money on parts than the car. It _had_ to be
profitable.


I had a couple friends with AMC cars - they seemed to have the
weirdest things break - a Gremlin was the only case that I have ever
heard of a seat breaking - drivers seat-back - the car wasn't
abused and no extra-large drivers. The rolling greenhouse Pacer
was said to be a nightmare for getting parts - mid year model
changes & a parts/supply chain that couldn't cope ..
John T.

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 21:22:26 -0400, wrote:



I had a '70 AMC Gremlin. That really should have been Car of the
year. They made more money on parts than the car. It _had_ to be
profitable.


I had a couple friends with AMC cars - they seemed to have the
weirdest things break - a Gremlin was the only case that I have ever
heard of a seat breaking - drivers seat-back - the car wasn't
abused and no extra-large drivers. The rolling greenhouse Pacer
was said to be a nightmare for getting parts - mid year model
changes & a parts/supply chain that couldn't cope ..

I don't remember which car it was (probably the Gremlin) but I had a
seat back break too. It was a 2-door so the front seat tilted
forward. There was a sheet metal part of the seat that blocked a pin
on the bottom frame sheet metal. The pin bent the metal and... Of
course the parts were part of the seat and couldn't be replaced
without replacing the seat. It was 40+ years ago and I can't remember
how I got by.

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 21:22:26 -0400, wrote:



I had a '70 AMC Gremlin. That really should have been Car of the
year. They made more money on parts than the car. It _had_ to be
profitable.


I had a couple friends with AMC cars - they seemed to have the
weirdest things break - a Gremlin was the only case that I have ever
heard of a seat breaking - drivers seat-back - the car wasn't
abused and no extra-large drivers. The rolling greenhouse Pacer
was said to be a nightmare for getting parts - mid year model
changes & a parts/supply chain that couldn't cope ..

Friend of mine had an Eagle--by the time he sold it Flintsone Brakes
was an option--there was no longer a floor in it.
John T.

On 4/26/2021 12:50 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 12:01:38 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

Seems this is when the Japanese entered our market and pretty much
showed us how a vehicle should be built.



Glad you only went back to 1972 !
1971 MotorTrend's Car Of The Year
Chevy Vega ... :-)

Which was actually a pretty nice car until it rusted away. My Dad had
one--he really enjoyed driving it.



I had one, a 72 GT. I lived 3 miles from the coast and never had rust
in 3 years. Unfortunately the engines were a POC.

The basic design was decent though. In 1975 the basic same car with an
updated body and V6 and V8 engines were introduced as the Olds Starfire,
Chev Monza, Buick Skyhawk, and Pontiac Sunbird?, something or another.

On 4/26/2021 7:53 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 14:25:19 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 13:50:36 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 12:01:38 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

Seems this is when the Japanese entered our market and pretty much
showed us how a vehicle should be built.



Glad you only went back to 1972 !
1971 MotorTrend's Car Of The Year
Chevy Vega ... :-)

Which was actually a pretty nice car until it rusted away. My Dad had
one--he really enjoyed driving it.


I had one as a teenager - my second car - it was ~ 4 years old
& I paid $ 450. for it - I needed wheels fast for a job transfer -
- the rust-repairs were already failing badly ;
it burned oil ; noisy ; no trunk space ; uncomfortable seats ;
terrible rear wheel drive traction ; etc
I can't think of a single plus that I could grant it.

$450

One winter morning, I was spinning on a patch of snow in the
parking lot when a nice guy offered a push - he put one hand on the
drivers door handle and his other hand grabbed the rear fender well -
and gave a good heave-ho - he apologized as he stood there with
a good chunk of fender in his hand - I thanked him for the help and
said don't worry about it .. you can keep that .. :-) true story.

Drove it about 2 years and gladly scrapped it.
Car-Of-The-Year ! yeah right.

I only had my Mustang II for three years until the body rotted out so
badly it couldn't be driven.


Ford liked to dress up other model cars and call them the Mustang. When
they turned the Pinto into a Mustang it was a bad move.

On 4/26/2021 7:40 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

And millenials had exactly what to do with that?

Nothing but before the millenials many things were poorly designed.



Seems this is when the Japanese entered our market and pretty much
showed us how a vehicle should be built.

After our parents showed them how to do it.

Well at least they learned, out parents failed with many of us.

On Tue, 27 Apr 2021 11:11:15 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/26/2021 7:40 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

And millenials had exactly what to do with that?

Nothing but before the millenials many things were poorly designed.

"Nothing" is the point. ...and never will, as a group. Sure there are
exceptions but living in mommy's basement doesn't make a serious
person.

Seems this is when the Japanese entered our market and pretty much
showed us how a vehicle should be built.

After our parents showed them how to do it.

Well at least they learned, out parents failed with many of us.

True that. And it's taken a nose dive in the last 20 years.

On Monday, April 26, 2021 at 9:20:46 PM UTC-4, wrote:

I had a '70 AMC Gremlin. That really should have been Car of the
year. They made more money on parts than the car. It _had_ to be
profitable.

I had a couple friends with AMC cars - they seemed to have the
weirdest things break - a Gremlin was the only case that I have ever
heard of a seat breaking - drivers seat-back - the car wasn't
abused and no extra-large drivers.

I had a 1966 Rambler Ambassador 990.

Weird thing to have break: The vacuum booster pump that was mounted
to the top of the fuel pump, causing the windshield wipers to stop working.
I solved the issue by pulling the hoses off both sides of the pump and
connecting them to each other. It worked great as long as you didn't mind
the wipers stopping mid-wipe when you accelerated, like you might do
while getting on a highway. :-O

The same thing happened to my buddy's AMC Javelin while we were driving
from Cleveland to NJ in a 40° rain storm. In that case the wipers failed in the
up position, but would come back down if we turned them off via the slide
control. Off brought them down, On sent them up - until the cable inside the
dashboard broke. That's when we tied a wire to the wiper arm itself so the
passenger could pull them down and then let them go back up. If you don't
think that that is a thing, ask the Marines:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyPI438nGjI

Then there was the time I had to replace the starter on the Rambler. I went
to the parts store and found out that there was 3 different starters used
on that car. The only way to determine which one I needed was to bring in
my old one and match up the bolt pattern. AMC designed body styles
but used parts from various manufacturers, so you never knew what
you'd find while working on them.

Oh yeah, then there was the vertically mounted AM radio. I wanted to swap
a AM/FM stereo into the Rambler so I started taking the OEM radio out. Turns
out that they needed to make room for the AC ductwork, so they used a radio
that was tall and shallow vs. the more normal short and deep.

https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/plwAA...T88/s-l300.jpg

The rolling greenhouse Pacer
was said to be a nightmare for getting parts - mid year model
changes & a parts/supply chain that couldn't cope

I knew a guy that was an auto mechanic and also plowed snow as
a side job. He built a plow truck by mounting a Pacer body on a 4x4
truck chassis. He said he wanted the extra visibility provided by the
Pacer's expansive glass. Funny looking vehicle, but it got the job done.

On Tuesday, April 27, 2021 at 12:11:22 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 4/26/2021 7:40 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

And millenials had exactly what to do with that?
Nothing but before the millenials many things were poorly designed.

25% of the engineers and scientists at NASA are millennials. Maybe they
do live in their mommy's basements and play X-Box when they're not doing
rocket-scientist type stuff, but I won't fault them for that.

DerbyDad03 writes:
On Tuesday, April 27, 2021 at 12:11:22 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 4/26/2021 7:40 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

And millenials had exactly what to do with that?
Nothing but before the millenials many things were poorly designed.

25% of the engineers and scientists at NASA are millennials. Maybe they
do live in their mommy's basements and play X-Box when they're not doing
rocket-scientist type stuff, but I won't fault them for that.

Something like 80% of SpaceX is millenials. The idea that the current
generation is (insert phrase like lazier, less intelligent, less
motivated, less patriotic) than a prior generation has been a meme amongst old people
for centuries, and it has never been true.

On Tue, 27 Apr 2021 12:14:51 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Tuesday, April 27, 2021 at 12:11:22 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 4/26/2021 7:40 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

And millenials had exactly what to do with that?
Nothing but before the millenials many things were poorly designed.

25% of the engineers and scientists at NASA are millennials. Maybe they
do live in their mommy's basements and play X-Box when they're not doing
rocket-scientist type stuff, but I won't fault them for that.

When was the last time that the US actually built a new rocket?

On Tuesday, April 27, 2021 at 4:16:35 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 27 Apr 2021 12:14:51 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Tuesday, April 27, 2021 at 12:11:22 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 4/26/2021 7:40 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

And millenials had exactly what to do with that?
Nothing but before the millenials many things were poorly designed.

25% of the engineers and scientists at NASA are millennials. Maybe they
do live in their mommy's basements and play X-Box when they're not doing
rocket-scientist type stuff, but I won't fault them for that.

When was the last time that the US actually built a new rocket?

Define "US".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SpaceX

Besides, it takes more - a lot more - than "building rockets" for a space
program to succeed.

Moving on...

writes:
On Tue, 27 Apr 2021 12:14:51 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Tuesday, April 27, 2021 at 12:11:22 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 4/26/2021 7:40 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

And millenials had exactly what to do with that?
Nothing but before the millenials many things were poorly designed.

25% of the engineers and scientists at NASA are millennials. Maybe they
do live in their mommy's basements and play X-Box when they're not doing
rocket-scientist type stuff, but I won't fault them for that.

When was the last time that the US actually built a new rocket?

https://www.blueorigin.com/
https://www.spacex.com/
https://www.rocketlabusa.com/

and a host of other, smaller launch operations here and worldwide
all developing various space (or supersonic and hypersonic passenger
planes) today.

Heck, SpaceX builds a new Starship almost each week.

On Tue, 27 Apr 2021 12:07:28 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Monday, April 26, 2021 at 9:20:46 PM UTC-4, wrote:

I had a '70 AMC Gremlin. That really should have been Car of the
year. They made more money on parts than the car. It _had_ to be
profitable.

I had a couple friends with AMC cars - they seemed to have the
weirdest things break - a Gremlin was the only case that I have ever
heard of a seat breaking - drivers seat-back - the car wasn't
abused and no extra-large drivers.

I had a 1966 Rambler Ambassador 990.

Weird thing to have break: The vacuum booster pump that was mounted
to the top of the fuel pump, causing the windshield wipers to stop working.
I solved the issue by pulling the hoses off both sides of the pump and
connecting them to each other. It worked great as long as you didn't mind
the wipers stopping mid-wipe when you accelerated, like you might do
while getting on a highway. :-O

Oh, I'd forgotten that part. I remember the wipers slowing on
acceleration and going a mile a minute when decelerating. I don't
remember a booster but I did have to replace the vacuum wiper motor
several times. Good thing it was easy and relatively cheap
("relatively" because I was a poor student).

No one would believe that vacuum wipers still existed.

The same thing happened to my buddy's AMC Javelin while we were driving
from Cleveland to NJ in a 40° rain storm. In that case the wipers failed in the
up position, but would come back down if we turned them off via the slide
control. Off brought them down, On sent them up - until the cable inside the
dashboard broke. That's when we tied a wire to the wiper arm itself so the
passenger could pull them down and then let them go back up. If you don't
think that that is a thing, ask the Marines:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyPI438nGjI

Then there was the time I had to replace the starter on the Rambler. I went
to the parts store and found out that there was 3 different starters used
on that car. The only way to determine which one I needed was to bring in
my old one and match up the bolt pattern. AMC designed body styles
but used parts from various manufacturers, so you never knew what
you'd find while working on them.

My Gremlin had an Auburn clutch. The parts guy gave me a Borg clutch.
While it didn't look at all like the one that came out of there, the
hole pattern matched, including three extras. Thinking that it was a
later upgrade we put the clutch in anyway. Nope. We took the new and
old part back to the parts store and the guy couldn't believe anyone
had used an Auburn clutch in 20 years (at that time). He felt bad for
me so took the old one back (we'd damaged it) and ordered the right
clutch (which wasn't in his book). Of course we had to do the job
twice and were without a car for several days.

The reason we had to replace the clutch was that the starter took out
the ring gear. I got pretty good at jump starting the car and could
do it by myself (not all that safe but I was 19 or 20, invincible) but
SWMBO wasn't pleased with the situation.

Oh yeah, then there was the vertically mounted AM radio. I wanted to swap
a AM/FM stereo into the Rambler so I started taking the OEM radio out. Turns
out that they needed to make room for the AC ductwork, so they used a radio
that was tall and shallow vs. the more normal short and deep.

https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/plwAA...T88/s-l300.jpg

The rolling greenhouse Pacer
was said to be a nightmare for getting parts - mid year model
changes & a parts/supply chain that couldn't cope

I knew a guy that was an auto mechanic and also plowed snow as
a side job. He built a plow truck by mounting a Pacer body on a 4x4
truck chassis. He said he wanted the extra visibility provided by the
Pacer's expansive glass. Funny looking vehicle, but it got the job done.

Uh, what model is it?
Well, it's a '49, '50, '51, '52, '53,
'54, '55, '56, '57, '58, '59 automobile
It's a '60, '61, '62, '63, '64, '65, '66, '67
'68, '69, '70 automobile

On Tue, 27 Apr 2021 13:34:50 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Tuesday, April 27, 2021 at 4:16:35 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 27 Apr 2021 12:14:51 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Tuesday, April 27, 2021 at 12:11:22 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 4/26/2021 7:40 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

And millenials had exactly what to do with that?
Nothing but before the millenials many things were poorly designed.

25% of the engineers and scientists at NASA are millennials. Maybe they
do live in their mommy's basements and play X-Box when they're not doing
rocket-scientist type stuff, but I won't fault them for that.

When was the last time that the US actually built a new rocket?

Define "US".

Since the comment was about NASA...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SpaceX

Besides, it takes more - a lot more - than "building rockets" for a space
program to succeed.

Moving on...

On Tue, 27 Apr 2021 22:10:32 GMT, (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:

writes:
On Tue, 27 Apr 2021 12:14:51 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Tuesday, April 27, 2021 at 12:11:22 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 4/26/2021 7:40 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 26 Apr 2021 09:52:14 -0500, Leon [email protected]
wrote:

On 4/25/2021 8:42 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 25 Apr 2021 17:07:12 -0400, J. Clarke
wrote:

Snip

Between 1900 and 1975 the US managed to invent and bring into
production the airplane, nuclear power, computers, and the capability
to land on the Moon.

With the people born in the '30 and '40s. The millenials live in
mommy's basement and play X-Box. We were talking about 60 the last 60
years.

Well in all fairness, vehicles built in the US were pieces of crap from
72~2000. Progressively getting better year by year. Emission systems
that hardly worked and wasted fuel was not healthier for the earth.

And millenials had exactly what to do with that?
Nothing but before the millenials many things were poorly designed.

25% of the engineers and scientists at NASA are millennials. Maybe they
do live in their mommy's basements and play X-Box when they're not doing
rocket-scientist type stuff, but I won't fault them for that.

When was the last time that the US actually built a new rocket?

https://www.blueorigin.com/
https://www.spacex.com/
https://www.rocketlabusa.com/

and a host of other, smaller launch operations here and worldwide
all developing various space (or supersonic and hypersonic passenger
planes) today.

Heck, SpaceX builds a new Starship almost each week.

I see you can't follow the thread either.

DerbyDad03 on Mon, 19 Apr 2021 14:57:00 -0700
(PDT) typed in rec.woodworking the following:

Unobtanium is something you can't get. We're looking for the word for
something that you can't get rid of. ;-)

Not so much "can't get rid of" as "I can't keep this, I "can't"
really sell it, I'm sure someone would want it for their Project."

It's actually a multi-word phrase:
https://[your-city-name-here].cr...uff/search/zip

I knew there was a reason I hadn't put craigslist in the bookmarks
.... "Oh, hey, neat ..."

Thanks

pyotr
--
pyotr filipivich
This Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them(tm)
Selecting who insufficiently Woke(tm) as to serve as the new Them(tm)