Hi. I am putting a hard rock maple countertop in my deli. I found what
seems to be a good supplier that has good prices for unfinished 1.5"
countertops. I had a couple of questions/comments if anybody cares to lend
a hand.

First, here are the dimensions of what I need:

- 36" x 15 ft.
- 36" x 5 ft.
- 24" or 25" x 4 ft.
- 12" x 14 ft.
- 12" x 11' 8"

1. Can anybody recommend (email?) someone who makes quality counters at a
good price?
2. Only the 36" x 15 ft. piece is going to have food contact, so I was going
to use mineral oil for that one. The others are either for checkout or for
customer seating and I though I'd use a poly or other nice finish. Any
comment?
3. Should I seal the end grain with paint or other? Some of the end grains
will be visible, so I'd like to use something that is durable and looks OK,
like maybe a clear sealer.
4. Some of these pieces will be joined together in an L shape. I was
thinking of putting L shaped plywood down first, and then laying the two
pieces on top of that. Then I could drill into each piece from underneath
the plywood. I'm not sure if this will give me the best, most seamless fit
(probably not). Any suggestions here?

Thanks for any help,
dwhite

I got mine from Grainger. $200 for a 30x72x1.75

"Greg" wrote in message
...
I got mine from Grainger. $200 for a 30x72x1.75


Is that for hard maple? That looks like a great price. I looked around for
Grainger but couldn't find anything. You're not talking about the equipment
supply Grainger, are you?

Thanks,
dwhite

You're not talking about the equipment
supply Grainger, are you

Yup, they call it a workbench top

"Greg" wrote in message
...
You're not talking about the equipment
supply Grainger, are you

Yup, they call it a workbench top

see
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/pro...774389&ccitem=

http://www.lumberliquidators.com/

Great prices

"Dan White" wrote in message
news
Hi. I am putting a hard rock maple countertop in my deli. I found what
seems to be a good supplier that has good prices for unfinished 1.5"
countertops. I had a couple of questions/comments if anybody cares to
lend
a hand.

First, here are the dimensions of what I need:

- 36" x 15 ft.
- 36" x 5 ft.
- 24" or 25" x 4 ft.
- 12" x 14 ft.
- 12" x 11' 8"

1. Can anybody recommend (email?) someone who makes quality counters at a
good price?
2. Only the 36" x 15 ft. piece is going to have food contact, so I was
going
to use mineral oil for that one. The others are either for checkout or
for
customer seating and I though I'd use a poly or other nice finish. Any
comment?
3. Should I seal the end grain with paint or other? Some of the end
grains
will be visible, so I'd like to use something that is durable and looks
OK,
like maybe a clear sealer.
4. Some of these pieces will be joined together in an L shape. I was
thinking of putting L shaped plywood down first, and then laying the two
pieces on top of that. Then I could drill into each piece from underneath
the plywood. I'm not sure if this will give me the best, most seamless
fit
(probably not). Any suggestions here?

Thanks for any help,
dwhite

Thanks Greg, Rob and Lawrence. I'll check into those sources before buying
yet.

dwhite

"Rob V" wrote in message
m...
http://www.lumberliquidators.com/

Great prices

"Dan White" wrote in message
news
Hi. I am putting a hard rock maple countertop in my deli. I found what
seems to be a good supplier that has good prices for unfinished 1.5"
countertops. I had a couple of questions/comments if anybody cares to
lend
a hand.

First, here are the dimensions of what I need:

- 36" x 15 ft.
- 36" x 5 ft.
- 24" or 25" x 4 ft.
- 12" x 14 ft.
- 12" x 11' 8"

1. Can anybody recommend (email?) someone who makes quality counters at
a
good price?
2. Only the 36" x 15 ft. piece is going to have food contact, so I was
going
to use mineral oil for that one. The others are either for checkout or
for
customer seating and I though I'd use a poly or other nice finish. Any
comment?
3. Should I seal the end grain with paint or other? Some of the end
grains
will be visible, so I'd like to use something that is durable and looks
OK,
like maybe a clear sealer.
4. Some of these pieces will be joined together in an L shape. I was
thinking of putting L shaped plywood down first, and then laying the two
pieces on top of that. Then I could drill into each piece from
underneath
the plywood. I'm not sure if this will give me the best, most seamless
fit
(probably not). Any suggestions here?

Thanks for any help,
dwhite

I didn't want an oil finish on my counter so I liberally washed the Edsal top I
got from Grainger with mineral spirits and put down a bunch of coats of poly.
It came out a rich honey oak color with good grain definition. The wife was
happy.
I am about a year later now and it is holding up very well under pretty harsh
use. When it does finally get banged up I will hit it with my belt sander and
finish it again.

"Greg" wrote in message
...
I didn't want an oil finish on my counter so I liberally washed the Edsal
top I
got from Grainger with mineral spirits and put down a bunch of coats of
poly.
It came out a rich honey oak color with good grain definition. The wife
was
happy.
I am about a year later now and it is holding up very well under pretty
harsh
use. When it does finally get banged up I will hit it with my belt sander
and
finish it again.

I looked through Grainger and it doesn't look like they carry custom sizes.
I need a pretty big piece and would rather not piece small ones together. I
have to get some mineral oil and test the samples I have to see if it is
attractive enough like that.

thanks,
dwhite

If you're going to clearcoat the rest why not sand a couple grits
finer on end grain and use same material? Samples for sure.

On Wed, 08 Sep 2004 18:39:16 GMT, "Dan White"
wrote:

3. Should I seal the end grain with paint or other? Some of the end grains
will be visible, so I'd like to use something that is durable and looks OK,
like maybe a clear sealer.

On Wed, 08 Sep 2004 18:39:16 GMT, "Dan White"
wrote:

Hi. I am putting a hard rock maple countertop in my deli. I found what
seems to be a good supplier that has good prices for unfinished 1.5"
countertops. I had a couple of questions/comments if anybody cares to lend
a hand.

4. Some of these pieces will be joined together in an L shape. I was
thinking of putting L shaped plywood down first, and then laying the two
pieces on top of that. Then I could drill into each piece from underneath
the plywood. I'm not sure if this will give me the best, most seamless fit
(probably not). Any suggestions here?

Because the plywood will be more dimensionally stable than the maple I
think you will be in trouble with this plan. Be sure not to fasten
your tops solidly or they may crack as the temp/humidity changes
(DAMHIKT). For the L I would use the cross bolt type connectors they
sell for joining countertops. Can't think of the exact name right now.

Tim Douglass

http://www.DouglassClan.com

"Tim Douglass" wrote in message
...


Because the plywood will be more dimensionally stable than the maple I
think you will be in trouble with this plan. Be sure not to fasten
your tops solidly or they may crack as the temp/humidity changes
(DAMHIKT). For the L I would use the cross bolt type connectors they
sell for joining countertops. Can't think of the exact name right now.

Are you talking about the connectors that are sunk into grooves under the
countertop (like a Mills Pride type countertop corner) or just the L shaped
flat brackets?

dwhite

That seems best. I just didn't know if there was more to sealing end grain
than I thought.

dwhite

wrote in message
...
If you're going to clearcoat the rest why not sand a couple grits
finer on end grain and use same material? Samples for sure.

On Wed, 08 Sep 2004 18:39:16 GMT, "Dan White"
wrote:

3. Should I seal the end grain with paint or other? Some of the end
grains
will be visible, so I'd like to use something that is durable and looks
OK,
like maybe a clear sealer.

"Dan White" wrote in
t:

That seems best. I just didn't know if there was more to sealing end
grain than I thought.

dwhite

Sanding to a finer grit reduces the amount of finish absorbed to
approximate the absorption of the edge/face grain, while providing the same
sealing properties. Or so I've been led to understand.

Otherwise, it darkens, and stands out visually.

Patriarch


wrote in message
...
If you're going to clearcoat the rest why not sand a couple grits
finer on end grain and use same material? Samples for sure.

On Wed, 08 Sep 2004 18:39:16 GMT, "Dan White"
wrote:

3. Should I seal the end grain with paint or other? Some of the end
grains
will be visible, so I'd like to use something that is durable and
looks
OK,
like maybe a clear sealer.

On Thu, 09 Sep 2004 19:34:15 GMT, "Dan White"
wrote:

"Tim Douglass" wrote in message
.. .


Because the plywood will be more dimensionally stable than the maple I
think you will be in trouble with this plan. Be sure not to fasten
your tops solidly or they may crack as the temp/humidity changes
(DAMHIKT). For the L I would use the cross bolt type connectors they
sell for joining countertops. Can't think of the exact name right now.

Are you talking about the connectors that are sunk into grooves under the
countertop (like a Mills Pride type countertop corner) or just the L shaped
flat brackets?

The recessed ones. One hole in each piece with a groove between and a
bolt through to pull them together.

Like this:
http://www.rockler.com/ecom7/product...r=cross%20bolt

Tiny version:
http://tinyurl.com/5kmu7

Tim Douglass

http://www.DouglassClan.com

"Tim Douglass" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 09 Sep 2004 19:34:15 GMT, "Dan White"
wrote:
Are you talking about the connectors that are sunk into grooves under the
countertop (like a Mills Pride type countertop corner) or just the L
shaped
flat brackets?

The recessed ones. One hole in each piece with a groove between and a
bolt through to pull them together.

Like this:

http://www.rockler.com/ecom7/product...r=cross%20bolt

Tiny version:
http://tinyurl.com/5kmu7


OK. I'd have to cut the hard maple myself to do this. They only supply the
raw block. The supplier recommended I drill holes where needed and connect
the two pieces of counter with dowels and wood glue. That sounds easier if
I can be careful enough to drill holes that allow the pieces to come
together evenly.

dwhite

"Dan White" wrote in
et:

"Tim Douglass" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 09 Sep 2004 19:34:15 GMT, "Dan White"
wrote:
Are you talking about the connectors that are sunk into grooves
under the countertop (like a Mills Pride type countertop corner) or
just the L
shaped
flat brackets?

The recessed ones. One hole in each piece with a groove between and a
bolt through to pull them together.

Like this:

http://www.rockler.com/ecom7/product...gs_id=349&obje
ctgroup_id=72&catid=22&filter=cross%20bolt

Tiny version:
http://tinyurl.com/5kmu7


OK. I'd have to cut the hard maple myself to do this. They only
supply the raw block. The supplier recommended I drill holes where
needed and connect the two pieces of counter with dowels and wood
glue. That sounds easier if I can be careful enough to drill holes
that allow the pieces to come together evenly.

dwhite


Dan, is there any chance you can find a local woodworker friend to help you
with this? It's not difficult, if you've done it before, and have a few of
the right tools. However, you can screw up some expensive maple, and maybe
draw a little blood, if you don't take the right precautions.

I'm not at all certain that dowels are the route that I'd take. Clamping
might be an adventure for the inexperienced and/or person with insufficient
clamp inventory.

Patriarch

"patriarch astDOTnet" patriarch wrote in message
.17...
"Dan White" wrote in
et:

"Tim Douglass" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 09 Sep 2004 19:34:15 GMT, "Dan White"
wrote:
Are you talking about the connectors that are sunk into grooves
under the countertop (like a Mills Pride type countertop corner) or
just the L
shaped
flat brackets?

The recessed ones. One hole in each piece with a groove between and a
bolt through to pull them together.

Like this:

http://www.rockler.com/ecom7/product...gs_id=349&obje
ctgroup_id=72&catid=22&filter=cross%20bolt

Tiny version:
http://tinyurl.com/5kmu7


OK. I'd have to cut the hard maple myself to do this. They only
supply the raw block. The supplier recommended I drill holes where
needed and connect the two pieces of counter with dowels and wood
glue. That sounds easier if I can be careful enough to drill holes
that allow the pieces to come together evenly.

dwhite


Dan, is there any chance you can find a local woodworker friend to help
you
with this? It's not difficult, if you've done it before, and have a few
of
the right tools. However, you can screw up some expensive maple, and
maybe
draw a little blood, if you don't take the right precautions.

I'm not at all certain that dowels are the route that I'd take. Clamping
might be an adventure for the inexperienced and/or person with
insufficient
clamp inventory.


Well, the only thing about the dowelling that I wasn't sure of is getting a
tight seam without a clamp. The L is 15' on one side and 5' on the other,
so that's joining the 5' piece crosswise (3') to the long one, so I'm not
sure how I'd clamp it anyway. Do they make 8' clamps? I've used the clamps
you showed on a Home Depot laminate top where I had to join 2 - 8' mitered
tops. I wasn't happy with the result. It didn't seem to pull the pieces
together well enough. Part of the problem is that I had to set the counter
pretty close to where it was going to be, and it was hard to really get a
good reach on the bolt. That sounds lame, but I couldn't join 2 8' pieces
upside down and then move them into place, unless maybe I had several guys
who could keep it from flexing apart in the process.

I don't really know a woodworker who could add those recesses although I am
hiring a carpenter for some other work. I could probably do it actually if
I had to. I have a router and have cut keyholes in soft wood in the past.

Of course, if you are in NJ, you're welcome to give it a try for handsome
remuneration, of course!

thanks,
dan

"Dan White" wrote in
. net:

snip
Well, the only thing about the dowelling that I wasn't sure of is
getting a tight seam without a clamp. The L is 15' on one side and 5'
on the other, so that's joining the 5' piece crosswise (3') to the
long one, so I'm not sure how I'd clamp it anyway. Do they make 8'
clamps? I've used the clamps you showed on a Home Depot laminate top
where I had to join 2 - 8' mitered tops. I wasn't happy with the
result. It didn't seem to pull the pieces together well enough. Part
of the problem is that I had to set the counter pretty close to where
it was going to be, and it was hard to really get a good reach on the
bolt. That sounds lame, but I couldn't join 2 8' pieces upside down
and then move them into place, unless maybe I had several guys who
could keep it from flexing apart in the process.

I don't really know a woodworker who could add those recesses although
I am hiring a carpenter for some other work. I could probably do it
actually if I had to. I have a router and have cut keyholes in soft
wood in the past.

Of course, if you are in NJ, you're welcome to give it a try for
handsome remuneration, of course!


Two things: 1) I don't do this for money. Takes the joy out of it, and
I'm not that fast. And 2) I'm a California boy, 5 generations worth on one
line, 4 on another. It's been a long time since I was in Jersey, and it's
not in the schedule, right now anyway. Otherwise...

Yes, they do make 8' clamps. Actually, they can be longer. Black iron
pipe, usually 3/4" OD, in my case (although it is rumoured that Michael
Baglio recommends using 1/2" ;-)) can be had in lengths up to pretty much
'more than you can carry'. And threaded and coupled, too. The pipe clamp
heads won't set you back more than the cost of a good pastrami sandwich
each.

Since one side of this countertop is going to be hidden from the public,
underneath the counter, cleats can be temporarily attached to that side
with good screws, allowing some additional, not 8' long, clamping points.

If dowels are your choice, purchase or fabricate a simple doweling jig.
One of the problems with dowels is that they are simple to get wrong. A
jig helps avoid that. A self-centering jig really helps that. Your
carpenter may have one. A good, old-school hardware store, one that's been
around since maybe the '50's, almost certainly would. ShopNotes probably
ran 5 feature articles on how to make one from baltic birch plywood.

Let me think about how to cut the keyholes with a router. There's a way to
do it safely and easily. If someone else doesn't jump in, I'll have
something more for you tomorrow evening.

Patriarch

On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 23:34:23 GMT, "Dan White"
wrote:

"Tim Douglass" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 09 Sep 2004 19:34:15 GMT, "Dan White"
wrote:
Are you talking about the connectors that are sunk into grooves under the
countertop (like a Mills Pride type countertop corner) or just the L
shaped
flat brackets?

The recessed ones. One hole in each piece with a groove between and a
bolt through to pull them together.

Like this:

http://www.rockler.com/ecom7/product...r=cross%20bolt

Tiny version:
http://tinyurl.com/5kmu7


OK. I'd have to cut the hard maple myself to do this. They only supply the
raw block. The supplier recommended I drill holes where needed and connect
the two pieces of counter with dowels and wood glue. That sounds easier if
I can be careful enough to drill holes that allow the pieces to come
together evenly.

The advantage to the connectors over dowels is that you can get them
snug, then adjust the joint before finally tightening them. I've done
butcher block counter tops without glue, but if you want, a layer of
Gorilla Glue would probably be helpful. I wouldn't use anything with a
faster set time. To join two 3' pieces in an L I would use at least 3
and probably 4 of the connectors, but realize that all any type of
connector is doing is holding alignment, the actual joint must be cut
accurately and the alignment must be assured in the positioning of the
tops. If one is slightly higher than the other or something you will
*never* get a good joint.

Tim Douglass

http://www.DouglassClan.com

"Tim Douglass" wrote in message
...

The advantage to the connectors over dowels is that you can get them
snug, then adjust the joint before finally tightening them. I've done
butcher block counter tops without glue, but if you want, a layer of
Gorilla Glue would probably be helpful. I wouldn't use anything with a
faster set time. To join two 3' pieces in an L I would use at least 3
and probably 4 of the connectors, but realize that all any type of
connector is doing is holding alignment, the actual joint must be cut
accurately and the alignment must be assured in the positioning of the
tops. If one is slightly higher than the other or something you will
*never* get a good joint.


Thanks. I think if I can get the joint to come together close enough, I can
always sand down the surface a smidge at the joint. Hopefully there won't
be much of a gap other than the height difference.

dwhite