Was going to try fixing my 20year old zanusi
but on inspection it appears more than just bearings,
rusting etc...so decided to replace...
seems if you're happy with normal spin speeds
.... some news ones are really cheap ...
(1000 rpm etc and my wife uses 1 or 2 programs at most)
eg ...
BEKO WMB10W £160 delivered from comet
http://www.comet.co.uk/comet/html/cache/49_149403.html
or Servis M6011W £170 delivered from index...
I know they aren't built to last anymore ... but are models like
this just trouble... should I pay another £100+ for a basic bosch...
or are they pretty much all the same these days and buy the cheapest with
a view to replacing every 5 years?
Andrew

eg ...
BEKO WMB10W £160 delivered from comet
http://www.comet.co.uk/comet/html/cache/49_149403.html
or Servis M6011W £170 delivered from index...
I know they aren't built to last anymore ... but are models like
this just trouble... should I pay another £100+ for a basic bosch...
or are they pretty much all the same these days and buy the cheapest with
a view to replacing every 5 years?
Andrew

Well Servis are most likely to break down and not economical to repair due
to expensive spares, Beko on the other hand have much cheaper spares but
harder to find.

Peter

"Andrew" wrote in message
...
Was going to try fixing my 20year old zanusi
but on inspection it appears more than just bearings,
rusting etc...so decided to replace...
seems if you're happy with normal spin speeds
... some news ones are really cheap ...
(1000 rpm etc and my wife uses 1 or 2 programs at most)
eg ...
BEKO WMB10W £160 delivered from comet
http://www.comet.co.uk/comet/html/cache/49_149403.html
or Servis M6011W £170 delivered from index...
I know they aren't built to last anymore ... but are models like
this just trouble... should I pay another £100+ for a basic bosch...
or are they pretty much all the same these days and buy the cheapest with
a view to replacing every 5 years?
Andrew

Andy,

I would be careful when choosing a washing machine, I have an AEG 1400 max
spin speed I had to reinforce the floor as it vibrates violently at
intermittent speeds what ever wash the load.

It is maintained under contract and I have had the engineers several times
and they say there is nothing they can do adding they are meant for being
used on a concrete pad. How do people manage in a flat?!! I asked the
engineer he didn't reply.

This machine cost £450 I'm sure a lower spin seed would be just as good. Our
previous machine a Hoover lasted 14 years and we had twins it did all their
nappies in that time it owed me nothing I cant say it is justified to get a
high end washing machine that has all the bells and whistles, because as you
say you only use one or two programs. Say hot wash for whites and drip dry
for everything else.My AEG is 2,8 time more expensive than the BEKO Is the
AEG 2.8 times better or you could throw the Beco away every two years get a
new one and still be in pocket when comparing with the AEG.
MikeS

Was going to try fixing my 20year old zanusi
but on inspection it appears more than just bearings,
rusting etc...so decided to replace...

We bought the cheapest Candy available a few years ago (our Sack-Of-****
(TM) Hoover - top of the range - broke down for the final time in its
very short and regularly inoperable life (3 years at most I think it
lasted))

The motor controller PCB failed about 2 weeks before the warranty was due
up and was replaced without incident, and its worked perfectly since.

I think its 5 years old now, cost about the same as the Beko you
mentioned IIRC.

--
Please add "[newsgroup]" in the subject of any personal replies via email
--- My new email address has "ngspamtrap" & @btinternet.com in it ;-) ---

On Sun, 31 Oct 2004 13:07:20 +0000 (UTC), "Andrew"
wrote:

I know they aren't built to last anymore ... but are models like
this just trouble...

Cheap washing machines are great - very reliable. Mainly because they
just have less in them. And when they do finally go wrong, you can
_afford_ a simple bearing or seal, rather than a mutli-speed motor or
a controller that gets BBC7.

The ones to avoid are the mid-range ones. Lots of extra features
glopped on there, particularly complicated controllers. They're also
in the most competitive and price-squeezed part of the marketplace.
You get a lot of bits for your money, but you don't get reliability.

If you're a single bloke, get a cheap simple one. If you've got
freshly hatched sprogs, get an AEG Lavamat. One machine will get
little use and die of old calendar age, the other will be run into the
ground and actually _worn_ out..

_Why_ a washing machine (or CH boiler) controller PCB has less
complexity than a Tamagotchi, yet requires more maintenance overhead
than a space shuttle, is still beyond me.

Andy Dingley wrote:
_Why_ a washing machine (or CH boiler) controller PCB has less
complexity than a Tamagotchi, yet requires more maintenance overhead
than a space shuttle, is still beyond me.

IMO this is because they are not designed for the US market, where when
it breaks too readily, the lawyers file a class action and the resulting
publicity kills the company. IME US cheaper, white goods, products are
relatively reliable and very cheaply repairable, compared to their
European counterparts, performance can be another matter. I suspect
(based on experience of designing mass production items for a couple of
US companies) that they also do more product abusive life testing. The
US also employs older design engineers, who have already made a lot of
their mistakes and learned from them. The European ideal is to make
older engineers redundant as they are too expensive and then to
subcontract out the design and manufacturing to the cheapest source with
no back up in the form of tough product testing. Some European products,
I now note, have longer warranties, so we will see if the product life
actually improves.

This almost sounds like the moans about electronics in European cars!

Regards
Capitol

"Andy Dingley" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 31 Oct 2004 13:07:20 +0000 (UTC), "Andrew"
wrote:

I know they aren't built to last anymore ... but are models like
this just trouble...

Cheap washing machines are great - very reliable. Mainly because they
just have less in them. And when they do finally go wrong, you can
_afford_ a simple bearing or seal, rather than a mutli-speed motor or
a controller that gets BBC7.

The ones to avoid are the mid-range ones. Lots of extra features
glopped on there, particularly complicated controllers. They're also
in the most competitive and price-squeezed part of the marketplace.
You get a lot of bits for your money, but you don't get reliability.

If you're a single bloke, get a cheap simple one. If you've got
freshly hatched sprogs, get an AEG Lavamat. One machine will get
little use and die of old calendar age, the other will be run into the
ground and actually _worn_ out..

_Why_ a washing machine (or CH boiler) controller PCB has less
complexity than a Tamagotchi, yet requires more maintenance overhead
than a space shuttle, is still beyond me.
I agree Andy its the same all over when you compare how much computer
peripherals against most consumer electronics we must be barking mad to put
up with it. A case of TamIgocher!

MikeS

Andrew wrote:

Was going to try fixing my 20year old zanusi
but on inspection it appears more than just bearings,
rusting etc...so decided to replace...
seems if you're happy with normal spin speeds
... some news ones are really cheap ...
(1000 rpm etc and my wife uses 1 or 2 programs at most)
eg ...
BEKO WMB10W £160 delivered from comet
http://www.comet.co.uk/comet/html/cache/49_149403.html
or Servis M6011W £170 delivered from index...
I know they aren't built to last anymore ... but are models like
this just trouble... should I pay another £100+ for a basic bosch...
or are they pretty much all the same these days and buy the cheapest with
a view to replacing every 5 years?
Andrew



When I retirned to this contry in 1983, I bought a hotpoint. Its still
working after two new door seals overteh years.

In 1995 I got another cheapo hotpoint. Thepump went under warranty, the
concrete blocks smashed off its drm after a few years (now glued on with
car body filler) and the motor went short-to-earth a month or two back.

Its still going but I can't say I am pleased. The drum to frame gap is
adequate to ingest socks with alarming frequency.


Frankly, I'd got for a second hand machine thats battered to hell, but
still works.

My ma in law was praisong her orginla 1955 fridge 'it lasted for 14
years: I wish we still had it" I asked her what the cost price was
'around £200'

We had a whole garage built for £200 in 1955. Today that would cost
what? £5000? £20,000?

Most people today buy a machine with extended warranty, and throw it aay
and replace as soon as the warranty runs out and it goes wrong, because
frankly, with all out plus parts exceeding £150, the cost benefit of
fixing unless DIY is crap.

"Andrew" wrote in message ...
Was going to try fixing my 20year old zanusi
but on inspection it appears more than just bearings,
rusting etc...so decided to replace...
seems if you're happy with normal spin speeds
... some news ones are really cheap ...
(1000 rpm etc and my wife uses 1 or 2 programs at most)
eg ...
BEKO WMB10W £160 delivered from comet
http://www.comet.co.uk/comet/html/cache/49_149403.html
or Servis M6011W £170 delivered from index...
I know they aren't built to last anymore ... but are models like
this just trouble... should I pay another £100+ for a basic bosch...
or are they pretty much all the same these days and buy the cheapest with
a view to replacing every 5 years?
Andrew

why pay 160 for a cheapo when you can buy something much better 2
years old for 60-100?

NT

"N. Thornton" wrote in message
om...
"Andrew" wrote in message
...
Was going to try fixing my 20year old zanusi
but on inspection it appears more than just bearings,
rusting etc...so decided to replace...
seems if you're happy with normal spin speeds
... some news ones are really cheap ...
(1000 rpm etc and my wife uses 1 or 2 programs at most)
eg ...
BEKO WMB10W £160 delivered from comet
http://www.comet.co.uk/comet/html/cache/49_149403.html
or Servis M6011W £170 delivered from index...
I know they aren't built to last anymore ... but are models like
this just trouble... should I pay another £100+ for a basic bosch...
or are they pretty much all the same these days and buy the cheapest
with
a view to replacing every 5 years?
Andrew

why pay 160 for a cheapo when you can buy something much better 2
years old for 60-100?

NT

And how come when most electronic gadgets have touch controls, that washing
machines still have buttons with the 2" 'action'? Like something from the
70's!

Arthur

Capitol wrote:


Andy Dingley wrote:

_Why_ a washing machine (or CH boiler) controller PCB has less
complexity than a Tamagotchi, yet requires more maintenance overhead
than a space shuttle, is still beyond me.


IMO this is because they are not designed for the US market, where
when it breaks too readily, the lawyers file a class action and the
resulting publicity kills the company. IME US cheaper, white goods,
products are relatively reliable and very cheaply repairable, compared
to their European counterparts, performance can be another matter. I
suspect (based on experience of designing mass production items for a
couple of US companies) that they also do more product abusive life
testing. The US also employs older design engineers, who have already
made a lot of their mistakes and learned from them. The European ideal
is to make older engineers redundant as they are too expensive and then
to subcontract out the design and manufacturing to the cheapest source
with no back up in the form of tough product testing. Some European
products, I now note, have longer warranties, so we will see if the
product life actually improves.

This almost sounds like the moans about electronics in European cars!

Regards
Capitol


hmm, but what about the affect on Mercedes of being merge / bought out /
? with Chrysler. Now Mercedes cars are near the bottom of the
reliability stakes, because of the use of American design models!

Having said that, America does generally have a good reputation for
engineering.


--
--
Peter D

The information contained in this post may not be published
in, or used by http://www.diyprojects.info

Hadn't thought of this ... I assumed that all 5kg loads would be about the
same size... my local comet didn't have one in ... they said it was internet
only(?) - I presume it was t the drum and not the just the door
which was so small?

Thanks Andrew



Macie wrote:
On Sun, 31 Oct 2004 13:07:20 +0000 (UTC), "Andrew"
wrote:


BEKO WMB10W £160 delivered from comet
http://www.comet.co.uk/comet/html/cache/49_149403.html


Had a look at this yesterday with the intention of getting a cheapo
washing machine, and the drum was tiny! Had an OK load rating in
weight, but you would struggle to get three pairs of jeans in it, so
far too small IMO for doing a family wash.

This was also true for the next 3 or 4 cheapest machines that currys
had in stock so then you start to get to the £270 mark.

Peter wrote:
hmm, but what about the affect on Mercedes of being merge / bought out /
? with Chrysler. Now Mercedes cars are near the bottom of the
reliability stakes, because of the use of American design models!


Mercedes has had a ball of fun in the US. They started by telling their
German engineers to design an SUV like the US, with US parts and then to
make it in a part of the US with no engineering background or experience
of mass production. Hence the ML320. The US dealers refused to sell the
product for about a year AIUI because of the quality problems. If you
feel like real laugh, try a ride in the back set of one or if really
brave, try driving one, you'll soon realise why it became the ML430.
They then decided to become a world leader in high volume cars, and
arranged to take over Chrysler, change the management who understood the
US customer and fired all the experienced US engineers. I believe they
also managed to obtain access to a Chrysler cash mountain at the time,
not quite sure on this. The PT cruiser was already finished as a
rebody/redesign of the Neon and has sold well. However Mercedes decided
to replace the somewhat dubious mechanics of the Intrepid,for which
spares were always necessary (auto box 60K miles, water pump 55K (total
parts and labour cost to replace pump in 3 hours one day $130, including
fetching the replacement from 20 miles away), oxygen sensors 75K) but
readily and cheaply available, with more of those from Mitsubishi, some
of which are as available as hens teeth. Pity they never sold the
Intrepid in Europe as it was the most comfortable long distance 6 seater
car I've ever driven. However sales have been declining for some years.
The Chrysler engineering was quite good, however the build quality seems
always rather variable. The new 300 series etc AIUI is now rear wheel
drive, the ones I've seen have IMO the charisma of a brick. I'm waiting
to see if they can compete with Honda and Toyota, I doubt it even with a
Merc engine, as I understand that the workforce are not at all happy
with German management styles. Mercedes haven't got at the Caravan yet
AIUI, so sales there are holding up a bit better. In Europe I read that
Smart are up for sale, having lost money from day 1 and IMO they make a
57 Mini look as safe as a tank when in a collision. The German
management appears to be hell bent on cost reduction in Europe and
moving sourcing and production round to cheaper and cheaper locations.
The resulting products seem IMO to be getting to resemble those of BL at
it's worst. They also have lost a lot of their best dealers by deciding
to deal with the public direct in the UK. One UK Mercedes dealer
internally,just over a year ago, described the A series as less reliable
than a Corsa and not even in the same league for build quality IIRC!
Anyway, as you can see Mercedes quality is now German? engineering
driven with virtually zero US influence. Their mistakes are their own!!

I wonder if Screwfix have the same advisers?

Regards
Capitol

The Natural Philosopher wrote in message ...

Most people today buy a machine with extended warranty, and throw it aay
and replace as soon as the warranty runs out and it goes wrong, because
frankly, with call out plus parts exceeding £150, the cost benefit of
fixing unless DIY is crap.

but with such silly callout and repair charges, diy washer repair is
coming into its own now. Why pay someone else 150 when you can do it
yourself in 2-3 hours for 25?

NT

On Mon, 1 Nov 2004 23:51:51 +0000 (UTC), "Arthur"
wrote:


"N. Thornton" wrote in message
. com...
"Andrew" wrote in message
...
Was going to try fixing my 20year old zanusi
but on inspection it appears more than just bearings,
rusting etc...so decided to replace...
seems if you're happy with normal spin speeds
... some news ones are really cheap ...
(1000 rpm etc and my wife uses 1 or 2 programs at most)
eg ...
BEKO WMB10W £160 delivered from comet
http://www.comet.co.uk/comet/html/cache/49_149403.html
or Servis M6011W £170 delivered from index...
I know they aren't built to last anymore ... but are models like
this just trouble... should I pay another £100+ for a basic bosch...
or are they pretty much all the same these days and buy the cheapest
with
a view to replacing every 5 years?
Andrew

why pay 160 for a cheapo when you can buy something much better 2
years old for 60-100?

NT

And how come when most electronic gadgets have touch controls, that washing
machines still have buttons with the 2" 'action'? Like something from the
70's!

Arthur

Hi

I had to mail as I have also just said goodbye to my 22 year old
Zanussi Washer Drier - WD2249. During the time I had it (rom new when
I first left home to set up mine), I never had any probs that needed a
call-out. I only had to replace the spring clip on the door catch
about 6 years back at a wopping £8.50 ! But sadly my bearings also
expired and although I tried to get the large 'spider' assembly off
the back to draw the bearing/shaft out, a solid nut got rounded ansd I
had to concede defeat and replace the machine.

I opted for a Candy CNW136 Washer Dryer from Tesco.com and with a
current electrical discount deal only paid £286 delivered and old
machine removed. Got my full Clubcard points too, so was really £283.
Currently, a 10% discount coupon n the Christmas magazine will get you
it for £268, so go for that! 1300 spin, 5years parts/1 year labour
warranty.

Good luck

Mark
**REMOVE** 'myhat' from my return email address before sending!!

Mark,

I opted for a Candy CNW136 Washer Dryer from Tesco.com and with a
current electrical discount deal only paid £286 delivered and old
machine removed.

I was told just the other day that suppliers could no longer remove old
appliances; looks like I was misinformed, which is rather good news.
Thanks.

Bert
http://www.bertcoules.co.uk

(MG) wrote in message ...

I opted for a Candy CNW136 Washer Dryer from Tesco.com and with a
current electrical discount deal only paid £286 delivered and old
machine removed. Got my full Clubcard points too, so was really £283.
Currently, a 10% discount coupon n the Christmas magazine will get you
it for £268, so go for that! 1300 spin, 5years parts/1 year labour
warranty.

Realise thats a 1 year warranty, not 5. Heres' how it works with
hotpoint, I would expect other mfrs are the same.

With 5 yr parts warranties you get the parts free as long as you use
their service org and pay inflated prices for the labour. In other
words after 1 year its worthless in 99% of cases.


NT