Spain is not often noted for leading the way but their new pricing for electricity, which has three price periods per 24 hrs, and includes weekends, seems better than the UK's E7 system.

This along with proposed surge pricing (for periods of high demand which could have had user agreed load shedding) was the great opportunity that the UK government managed to waste with the superfluous (and entirely passive) smart meters.

The irony is that Spain started this to lay the way for electric car charging overnight but if take-up is big, then the high power cars will suck up might make usage overnight a high price rate period! Not many people will want to drive at night and charge during the day to save money!

https://www.eyeonspain.com/blogs/liv...e-pricing.aspx

On 22/05/2021 12:45, wrote:
Spain is not often noted for leading the way but their new pricing for electricity, which has three price periods per 24 hrs, and includes weekends, seems better than the UK's E7 system.

This along with proposed surge pricing (for periods of high demand which could have had user agreed load shedding) was the great opportunity that the UK government managed to waste with the superfluous (and entirely passive) smart meters.

The irony is that Spain started this to lay the way for electric car charging overnight but if take-up is big, then the high power cars will suck up might make usage overnight a high price rate period! Not many people will want to drive at night and charge during the day to save money!

https://www.eyeonspain.com/blogs/liv...e-pricing.aspx


Octopussy energy have a demand pricing tariff called "Agile" but if
you look at the 18-month graph of average max and min charges you can
an interesting change this year compared to last year even without
drilling down into the data -


https://www.energy-stats.uk/octopus-...stern-england/

Either they have significantly increased their rates for this
tariff or this is because of the La Nina effect. Not sure which
it is.

After serious thinking wrote :
Spain is not often noted for leading the way but their new pricing for
electricity, which has three price periods per 24 hrs, and includes weekends,
seems better than the UK's E7 system.

This along with proposed surge pricing (for periods of high demand which
could have had user agreed load shedding) was the great opportunity that the
UK government managed to waste with the superfluous (and entirely passive)
smart meters.

Hardly a missed opportunity, Octopus optionally offer a tarriff which
is entirely variable, they just advise you in advance what the rate
will be. Nothing to prevent other suppliers doing similar.

wrote:
Spain is not often noted for leading the way but their new pricing for
electricity, which has three price periods per 24 hrs, and includes
weekends, seems better than the UK's E7 system.


Well maybe, but smart meters as being installed in the UK allow a lot more
flexibility. Spain are a bit ahead of the game in rolling out smart
meters.


This along with proposed surge pricing (for periods of high demand which
could have had user agreed load shedding) was the great opportunity that
the UK government managed to waste with the superfluous (and entirely
passive) smart meters.


Superfluous? How to the the Spanish electricity meters know when and how
much power is being consumed throughout the day unless theyre also to a
degree €œsmart€�?

We have all the tech to make it work here and its got nothing to do with
the government, its down to the power companies utilising the data
available to them, like Octopus have done with their Agile tariff.

Tim
--
Please don't feed the trolls

Well I cannot change supplier here, and that is because I get a good billing
system for blind people, but when I enquired about tariffs they told me
there are no more cheap ones than their standard e7 variable, which they say
does vary, well a clue is in the name I guess, and the others come back as
more costly but are preserved at 2 and three years respectively. This seems
to me like you are being asked to gamble, IE if you look recent performance
of the standard e7 variable and the current other products they are not much
different, but if prices rise generally you may find the more expensive
option is cheaper for the next couple of years.
My Smart meter arrives tomorrow, I wonder what the next cock up will be?
Brian

--

This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
" wrote in message
...
Spain is not often noted for leading the way but their new pricing for
electricity, which has three price periods per 24 hrs, and includes
weekends, seems better than the UK's E7 system.

This along with proposed surge pricing (for periods of high demand which
could have had user agreed load shedding) was the great opportunity that the
UK government managed to waste with the superfluous (and entirely passive)
smart meters.

The irony is that Spain started this to lay the way for electric car
charging overnight but if take-up is big, then the high power cars will suck
up might make usage overnight a high price rate period! Not many people will
want to drive at night and charge during the day to save money!

https://www.eyeonspain.com/blogs/liv...e-pricing.aspx

On 23/05/2021 10:46, Jethro_uk wrote:
If there was any honesty in the free market mantra the Tories use to shot
on us, we should be able to buy our electricity from Spain. Or indeed
anywhere.

There's nothing stopping you from buying your electricity from Spain.
Put your DIY hat on and there are obvious options - especially if you
have space for a couple of containers of batteries which can be trucked
in as and when.

I'm still waiting to be able to change my water company - as promised by
their privatisation. When's that due ?


Where were you promised the ability to do that? I was on the fringes of
water privatisation and everything I saw envisaged there would be /very/
limited competition - only for /very/ high volume users (think 100s of
megalitres a year).


--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

Jethro_uk wrote:

I'm still waiting to be able to change my water company

Households can't (yet?) but businesses can

https://www.open-water.org.uk/for-customers/eligibility-guide

On 23/05/2021 10:46, Jethro_uk wrote:

If there was any honesty in the free market mantra the Tories use to shot
on us, we should be able to buy our electricity from Spain. Or indeed
anywhere.

I'm still waiting to be able to change my water company - as promised by
their privatisation. When's that due ?

I don't have a meter and pay what I consider is an excessive charge, but
the company claims that they can't review it as it's based on the rates
that don't exist any more.

I don't think competition does the customer any good apart from tins of
beans on the supermarket shelf.

--
Max Demian

Brian Gaff (Sofa) used his keyboard to write :
Well I cannot change supplier here, and that is because I get a good billing
system for blind people, but when I enquired about tariffs they told me there
are no more cheap ones than their standard e7 variable, which they say does
vary, well a clue is in the name I guess, and the others come back as more
costly but are preserved at 2 and three years respectively. This seems to me
like you are being asked to gamble, IE if you look recent performance of the
standard e7 variable and the current other products they are not much
different, but if prices rise generally you may find the more expensive
option is cheaper for the next couple of years.
My Smart meter arrives tomorrow, I wonder what the next cock up will be?

I have stayed on fixed period, fixed tarriffs for the past few years
and have broken more of less even each year, until this current year.

The current year, MSE emailed to suggest my present provider was
offering a cheaper tarriff and I should swap. I swapped without
checking, MSE then followed it up with an email saying they had got it
wrong. It turned out they had actually got it right and I'm now on a
cheaper tarrif than I would have had, had I sought out the best deal
when my contract expired.

On 23/05/2021 11:30, Max Demian wrote:
I don't have a meter and pay what I consider is an excessive charge, but
the company claims that they can't review it as it's based on the rates
that don't exist any more.

So get a meter.

On 23/05/2021 14:09, Chris Bacon wrote:
On 23/05/2021 11:30, Max Demian wrote:
I don't have a meter and pay what I consider is an excessive charge,
but the company claims that they can't review it as it's based on the
rates that don't exist any more.

So get a meter.

Not sure if it's possible. (I've heard that if you ask for a meter and
they can't supply one you can get a discount for single occupancy.)

Don't really want one. I don't want to have to think, "Should I flush
the bog?"

("If it's yellow, let it mellow; if it's brown, flush it down.")

--
Max Demian

Max Demian wrote:

Don't really want one. I don't want to have to think, "Should I flush
the bog?"

("If it's yellow, let it mellow; if it's brown, flush it down.")

under 1p and 2p respectively, if you have a dual flush cistern.

In message
Max Demian wrote:

On 23/05/2021 14:09, Chris Bacon wrote:
On 23/05/2021 11:30, Max Demian wrote:
I don't have a meter and pay what I consider is an excessive charge,
but the company claims that they can't review it as it's based on the
rates that don't exist any more.

So get a meter.

Not sure if it's possible. (I've heard that if you ask for a meter and
they can't supply one you can get a discount for single occupancy.)

Don't really want one. I don't want to have to think, "Should I flush
the bog?"

("If it's yellow, let it mellow; if it's brown, flush it down.")

Four years ago had a meter fitted. Single person occupancy and my water
bill has halved...

--
John Bryan

"Max Demian" wrote in message
...
On 23/05/2021 10:46, Jethro_uk wrote:

If there was any honesty in the free market mantra the Tories use to shot
on us, we should be able to buy our electricity from Spain. Or indeed
anywhere.

I'm still waiting to be able to change my water company - as promised by
their privatisation. When's that due ?

I don't have a meter and pay what I consider is an excessive charge, but
the company claims that they can't review it as it's based on the rates
that don't exist any more.

I don't think competition does the customer any good apart from tins of
beans on the supermarket shelf.

Competition made one hell of a difference when we dumped our
monopoly phone company and got real competition. With the
mobile phone service in spades. We have $10/month for unlimited
calls and texts and MMSs to any landline and mobile in the country
now.

Electricity and gas is much more competitive now too.

On Mon, 24 May 2021 02:24:58 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest troll**** unread

02:24 in Australia??? And you are up and trolling ALREADY? LOL Do you sick
senile swine really know NO shame AT ALL?

--
Xeno to senile Rodent:
"You're a sad old man Rod, truly sad."
MID:

"Max Demian" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 23/05/2021 14:09, Chris Bacon wrote:
On 23/05/2021 11:30, Max Demian wrote:
I don't have a meter and pay what I consider is an excessive charge, but
the company claims that they can't review it as it's based on the rates
that don't exist any more.

So get a meter.

Not sure if it's possible. (I've heard that if you ask for a meter and
they can't supply one you can get a discount for single occupancy.)

Don't really want one. I don't want to have to think, "Should I flush the
bog?"

("If it's yellow, let it mellow; if it's brown, flush it down.")

The problem isnt flushing the dunny, its showers, baths
and watering the garden and washing the car etc.

I realise you poms keep the coal in the bath and only have
a shower once a year whether you need one or not.

On 23/05/2021 14:35, Max Demian wrote:
On 23/05/2021 14:09, Chris Bacon wrote:
On 23/05/2021 11:30, Max Demian wrote:
I don't have a meter and pay what I consider is an excessive charge,
but the company claims that they can't review it as it's based on the
rates that don't exist any more.

So get a meter.

Not sure if it's possible. (I've heard that if you ask for a meter and
they can't supply one you can get a discount for single occupancy.)

Don't really want one. I don't want to have to think, "Should I flush
the bog?"

("If it's yellow, let it mellow; if it's brown, flush it down.")


Before we opted for having a meter, I fitted my own meter and monitored
our consumption for a year - and then calculated what we would have paid
for metered water vs what we actually paid for unmetered. It was a
no-brainer. We're now paying only about half of what unmetered would
cost. And our habits haven't changed - we don't go out of our way to
save water.
--
Cheers,
Roger

On 22/05/2021 21:19, Tim+ wrote:
wrote:
Spain is not often noted for leading the way but their new pricing for
electricity, which has three price periods per 24 hrs, and includes
weekends, seems better than the UK's E7 system.


Well maybe, but smart meters as being installed in the UK allow a lot more
flexibility. Spain are a bit ahead of the game in rolling out smart
meters.


This along with proposed surge pricing (for periods of high demand which
could have had user agreed load shedding) was the great opportunity that
the UK government managed to waste with the superfluous (and entirely
passive) smart meters.


Superfluous? How to the the Spanish electricity meters know when and how
much power is being consumed throughout the day unless theyre also to a
degree €œsmart€�?

We have all the tech to make it work here and its got nothing to do with
the government, its down to the power companies utilising the data
available to them, like Octopus have done with their Agile tariff.

Tim


Except that that tariff seems to have become much less advantageous if
the 18-month chart of max, min and average rates is correct.

Energy prices have increased a lot recently Brian. Many of the cheapo
tariffs have been withdrawn. Martyn Lewis was shouting on about this
last week.

Andrew


On 23/05/2021 08:09, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
Well I cannot change supplier here, and that is because I get a good billing
system for blind people, but when I enquired about tariffs they told me
there are no more cheap ones than their standard e7 variable, which they say
does vary, well a clue is in the name I guess, and the others come back as
more costly but are preserved at 2 and three years respectively. This seems
to me like you are being asked to gamble, IE if you look recent performance
of the standard e7 variable and the current other products they are not much
different, but if prices rise generally you may find the more expensive
option is cheaper for the next couple of years.
My Smart meter arrives tomorrow, I wonder what the next cock up will be?
Brian

Andrew wrote:
On 22/05/2021 21:19, Tim+ wrote:
wrote:
Spain is not often noted for leading the way but their new pricing for
electricity, which has three price periods per 24 hrs, and includes
weekends, seems better than the UK's E7 system.


Well maybe, but smart meters as being installed in the UK allow a lot more
flexibility. Spain are a bit ahead of the game in rolling out smart
meters.


This along with proposed surge pricing (for periods of high demand which
could have had user agreed load shedding) was the great opportunity that
the UK government managed to waste with the superfluous (and entirely
passive) smart meters.


Superfluous? How to the the Spanish electricity meters know when and how
much power is being consumed throughout the day unless theyre also to a
degree €œsmart€�?

We have all the tech to make it work here and its got nothing to do with
the government, its down to the power companies utilising the data
available to them, like Octopus have done with their Agile tariff.

Tim


Except that that tariff seems to have become much less advantageous if
the 18-month chart of max, min and average rates is correct.


Indeed! I jumped ship to Octopus Go as frankly the Agile tariff was getting
too punitive. I was just making the point that we can do variable tariffs
here in the UK and that Spain isnt doing something new.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

On 23/05/2021 10:46, Jethro_uk wrote:
If there was any honesty in the free market mantra the Tories use to shot
on us, we should be able to buy our electricity from Spain. Or indeed
anywhere.

I'm still waiting to be able to change my water company - as promised by
their privatisation. When's that due ?

That was never offered with privatisation. You had the option to go onto
metered water and pay for what you actually use. You can always go off
grid, with your own well and private sewage treatment works, as some
rural folks have to.

There cannot be an option to switch suppliers without a National water
grid, which will never happen.

On 23 May 2021 at 15:54:37 BST, "John Bryan" wrote:

In message
Max Demian wrote:

On 23/05/2021 14:09, Chris Bacon wrote:
On 23/05/2021 11:30, Max Demian wrote:
I don't have a meter and pay what I consider is an excessive charge,
but the company claims that they can't review it as it's based on the
rates that don't exist any more.

So get a meter.

Not sure if it's possible. (I've heard that if you ask for a meter and
they can't supply one you can get a discount for single occupancy.)

Don't really want one. I don't want to have to think, "Should I flush
the bog?"

("If it's yellow, let it mellow; if it's brown, flush it down.")

Four years ago had a meter fitted. Single person occupancy and my water
bill has halved...

Pretty much my experience over the past year. I think I've another year left
before I decide whether to keep it.

--
Cheers, Rob

On 23/05/2021 15:54, John Bryan wrote:
In message
Max Demian wrote:

On 23/05/2021 14:09, Chris Bacon wrote:
On 23/05/2021 11:30, Max Demian wrote:
I don't have a meter and pay what I consider is an excessive charge,
but the company claims that they can't review it as it's based on the
rates that don't exist any more.

So get a meter.

Not sure if it's possible. (I've heard that if you ask for a meter and
they can't supply one you can get a discount for single occupancy.)

Don't really want one. I don't want to have to think, "Should I flush
the bog?"

("If it's yellow, let it mellow; if it's brown, flush it down.")

Four years ago had a meter fitted. Single person occupancy and my water
bill has halved...


My bill with Southern water was over £330 until I had a meter installed
about 15 years ago and immediately it went down to about £120/year.

On 23 May 2021 at 17:24:58 BST, ""Rod Speed""
wrote:



"Max Demian" wrote in message
...
On 23/05/2021 10:46, Jethro_uk wrote:

If there was any honesty in the free market mantra the Tories use to shot
on us, we should be able to buy our electricity from Spain. Or indeed
anywhere.

I'm still waiting to be able to change my water company - as promised by
their privatisation. When's that due ?

I don't have a meter and pay what I consider is an excessive charge, but
the company claims that they can't review it as it's based on the rates
that don't exist any more.

I don't think competition does the customer any good apart from tins of
beans on the supermarket shelf.

Competition made one hell of a difference when we dumped our
monopoly phone company and got real competition. With the
mobile phone service in spades. We have $10/month for unlimited
calls and texts and MMSs to any landline and mobile in the country
now.

Electricity and gas is much more competitive now too.

And just imagine how much better and cheaper it would be if state owned and
run :-)

--
Cheers, Rob

On Mon, 24 May 2021 02:42:33 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH more of the trolling senile asshole's latest troll**** unread


--
Norman Wells addressing trolling senile Rodent:
"Ah, the voice of scum speaks."
MID:

On 23/05/2021 18:30, Andrew wrote:
On 23/05/2021 10:46, Jethro_uk wrote:

If there was any honesty in the free market mantra the Tories use to shot
on us, we should be able to buy our electricity from Spain. Or indeed
anywhere.

I'm still waiting to be able to change my water company - as promised by
their privatisation. When's that due ?

That was never offered with privatisation. You had the option to go onto
metered water and pay for what you actually use. You can always go off
grid, with your own well and private sewage treatment works, as some
rural folks have to.

There cannot be an option to switch suppliers without a National water
grid, which will never happen.

That's about how the utility is delivered, which is the same with
electricity and gas.

Competition is between the people who send out the bills.

--
Max Demian

On 24/05/2021 07:49, Jethro_uk wrote:
On Sun, 23 May 2021 11:22:31 +0100, Robin wrote:

Where were you promised the ability to do that? I was on the fringes of
water privatisation and everything I saw envisaged there would be /very/
limited competition - only for /very/ high volume users (think 100s of
megalitres a year).

It was the overall mantra of privatisations - starting with British
Telecom.

It was a recurring theme of privatisations /before/ water. I don't see
you have cause for complaint just because you assumed the same would be
true of water.

"Better choice for the consumer even if our mates in the city
make a killing.


So, 30 years on, where the ****ity **** is my choice ?

DIY? As in **** off and dig a ****ing great well and sewage treatment
plant?


--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

On 22/05/2021 12:45, wrote:
Spain is not often noted for leading the way but their new pricing for electricity, which has three price periods per 24 hrs, and includes weekends, seems better than the UK's E7 system.


There has always been some element of tariffs which vary by time in
Spain. Originally when they started rolling out new meters they insisted
that you had room for two meters in the meter box.

There is also one big difference between Spain and the UK. In Spain you
pay for the size of your feed via the standing charge. So unlike the UK
where you pay a flat charge, in Spain its per maximum load. So you can
choose between rates from around 2Kw up to 10Kw.


This along with proposed surge pricing (for periods of high demand which could have had user agreed load shedding) was the great opportunity that the UK government managed to waste with the superfluous (and entirely passive) smart meters.


In Spain they have the same Smart meters except that they are mandatory
and as a customer you must pay for them. They also enforce the above Kw
limit so if you exceed your maximum load your pweer blips.

The irony is that Spain started this to lay the way for electric car charging overnight but if take-up is big, then the high power cars will suck up might make usage overnight a high price rate period! Not many people will want to drive at night and charge during the day to save money!

https://www.eyeonspain.com/blogs/liv...e-pricing.aspx


Power in Spain seems mire unreliable in the UK.

Dave

On 22/05/2021 21:19, Tim+ wrote:
wrote:
Spain is not often noted for leading the way but their new pricing for
electricity, which has three price periods per 24 hrs, and includes
weekends, seems better than the UK's E7 system.


Well maybe, but smart meters as being installed in the UK allow a lot more
flexibility. Spain are a bit ahead of the game in rolling out smart
meters.


The Spanish Smart meters are very similar to the UK ones except you
don't get an in house display. They also cap the maximum load.
You also have no option. You have to have one and you have to pay for it.


This along with proposed surge pricing (for periods of high demand which
could have had user agreed load shedding) was the great opportunity that
the UK government managed to waste with the superfluous (and entirely
passive) smart meters.


Superfluous? How to the the Spanish electricity meters know when and how
much power is being consumed throughout the day unless theyre also to a
degree €œsmart€�?


They are Smart. You just don't get an in house display.

We have all the tech to make it work here and its got nothing to do with
the government, its down to the power companies utilising the data
available to them, like Octopus have done with their Agile tariff.


I think this is what will happen in the UK.

Tim

In article , David Wade
writes
On 22/05/2021 21:19, Tim+ wrote:
wrote:
Spain is not often noted for leading the way but their new pricing for
electricity, which has three price periods per 24 hrs, and includes
weekends, seems better than the UK's E7 system.
Well maybe, but smart meters as being installed in the UK allow a
lot more
flexibility. Spain are a bit ahead of the game in rolling out smart
meters.


The Spanish Smart meters are very similar to the UK ones except you
don't get an in house display. They also cap the maximum load.
You also have no option. You have to have one and you have to pay for it.


This along with proposed surge pricing (for periods of high demand which
could have had user agreed load shedding) was the great opportunity that
the UK government managed to waste with the superfluous (and entirely
passive) smart meters.
Superfluous? How to the the Spanish electricity meters know when
and how
much power is being consumed throughout the day unless theyre also to a
degree €œsmart€�?


They are Smart. You just don't get an in house display.

We have all the tech to make it work here and its got nothing to do with
the government, its down to the power companies utilising the data
available to them, like Octopus have done with their Agile tariff.


I think this is what will happen in the UK.

Tim



Makes comparing suppliers a bit tricky.
--
bert

On 24/05/2021 07:48, Jethro_uk wrote:
On Sun, 23 May 2021 18:33:09 +0100, Andrew wrote:

On 23/05/2021 15:54, John Bryan wrote:
In message
Max Demian wrote:

On 23/05/2021 14:09, Chris Bacon wrote:
On 23/05/2021 11:30, Max Demian wrote:
I don't have a meter and pay what I consider is an excessive charge,
but the company claims that they can't review it as it's based on
the rates that don't exist any more.

So get a meter.

Not sure if it's possible. (I've heard that if you ask for a meter and
they can't supply one you can get a discount for single occupancy.)

Don't really want one. I don't want to have to think, "Should I flush
the bog?"

("If it's yellow, let it mellow; if it's brown, flush it down.")

Four years ago had a meter fitted. Single person occupancy and my water
bill has halved...


My bill with Southern water was over £330 until I had a meter installed
about 15 years ago and immediately it went down to about £120/year.

You find yourself wondering where they make up their shortfall from
then ...


From the people who waste water unnecessarily or used far more than
I did and expected me to pay for it.

On 23/05/2021 22:33, Max Demian wrote:
On 23/05/2021 18:30, Andrew wrote:
On 23/05/2021 10:46, Jethro_uk wrote:

If there was any honesty in the free market mantra the Tories use to
shot
on us, we should be able to buy our electricity from Spain. Or indeed
anywhere.

I'm still waiting to be able to change my water company - as promised by
their privatisation. When's that due ?

That was never offered with privatisation. You had the option to go onto
metered water and pay for what you actually use. You can always go off
grid, with your own well and private sewage treatment works, as some
rural folks have to.

There cannot be an option to switch suppliers without a National water
grid, which will never happen.

That's about how the utility is delivered, which is the same with
electricity and gas.

Competition is between the people who send out the bills.


Err, no. With gas and electricity all the inputs are fed into
the respective grid system. The users all tap into these two
grid systems. The gas and electrons could have come from anywhere
on the grid.

On 23/05/2021 18:30, Andrew wrote:
On 23/05/2021 10:46, Jethro_uk wrote:
If there was any honesty in the free market mantra the Tories use to shot
on us, we should be able to buy our electricity from Spain. Or indeed
anywhere.

I'm still waiting to be able to change my water company - as promised by
their privatisation. When's that due ?

That was never offered with privatisation. You had the option to go onto
metered water and pay for what you actually use. You can always go off
grid, with your own well and private sewage treatment works, as some
rural folks have to.

There cannot be an option to switch suppliers without a National water
grid, which will never happen.

A national water grid has been looked at many times. What I've never
seen are plans for a national sewage grid.

--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

In article , Andrew
wrote:
On 23/05/2021 22:33, Max Demian wrote:
On 23/05/2021 18:30, Andrew wrote:
On 23/05/2021 10:46, Jethro_uk wrote:

If there was any honesty in the free market mantra the Tories use to
shot on us, we should be able to buy our electricity from Spain. Or
indeed anywhere.

I'm still waiting to be able to change my water company - as promised
by their privatisation. When's that due ?

That was never offered with privatisation. You had the option to go
onto metered water and pay for what you actually use. You can always
go off grid, with your own well and private sewage treatment works, as
some rural folks have to.

There cannot be an option to switch suppliers without a National water
grid, which will never happen.

That's about how the utility is delivered, which is the same with
electricity and gas.

Competition is between the people who send out the bills.


Err, no. With gas and electricity all the inputs are fed into the
respective grid system. The users all tap into these two grid systems.
The gas and electrons could have come from anywhere on the grid.

The electrons I buy are blue ones from Scotland

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On 22/05/2021 12:45, wrote:


The irony is that Spain started this to lay the way for electric car charging overnight but if take-up is big, then the high power cars will suck up might make usage overnight a high price rate period! Not many people will want to drive at night and charge during the day to save money!


Interesting article on Aluminium Ion batteries.

https://thedriven.io/2021/05/18/brisbanes-gmg-says-new-aluminium-battery-can-charge-20-to-60-times-faster/

60 times faster charge than lithium ion. At that rate people could
charge during the day.

On 24/05/2021 15:21, Andrew wrote:
On 23/05/2021 22:33, Max Demian wrote:
On 23/05/2021 18:30, Andrew wrote:
On 23/05/2021 10:46, Jethro_uk wrote:

If there was any honesty in the free market mantra the Tories use to
shot
on us, we should be able to buy our electricity from Spain. Or indeed
anywhere.

I'm still waiting to be able to change my water company - as
promised by
their privatisation. When's that due ?

That was never offered with privatisation. You had the option to go onto
metered water and pay for what you actually use. You can always go off
grid, with your own well and private sewage treatment works, as some
rural folks have to.

There cannot be an option to switch suppliers without a National water
grid, which will never happen.

That's about how the utility is delivered, which is the same with
electricity and gas.

Competition is between the people who send out the bills.

Err, no. With gas and electricity all the inputs are fed into
the respective grid system. The users all tap into these two
grid systems. The gas and electrons could have come from anywhere
on the grid.

How would a water grid change things?

--
Max Demian

In article ,
Max Demian wrote:
On 24/05/2021 15:21, Andrew wrote:
On 23/05/2021 22:33, Max Demian wrote:
On 23/05/2021 18:30, Andrew wrote:
On 23/05/2021 10:46, Jethro_uk wrote:

If there was any honesty in the free market mantra the Tories use to
shot
on us, we should be able to buy our electricity from Spain. Or indeed
anywhere.

I'm still waiting to be able to change my water company - as
promised by
their privatisation. When's that due ?

That was never offered with privatisation. You had the option to go onto
metered water and pay for what you actually use. You can always go off
grid, with your own well and private sewage treatment works, as some
rural folks have to.

There cannot be an option to switch suppliers without a National water
grid, which will never happen.

That's about how the utility is delivered, which is the same with
electricity and gas.

Competition is between the people who send out the bills.

Err, no. With gas and electricity all the inputs are fed into
the respective grid system. The users all tap into these two
grid systems. The gas and electrons could have come from anywhere
on the grid.

How would a water grid change things?

I could buy Scottish water here in Surrey. It isn't full of calcium

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On 24/05/2021 17:58, charles wrote:
In article ,
Max Demian wrote:
On 24/05/2021 15:21, Andrew wrote:
On 23/05/2021 22:33, Max Demian wrote:
On 23/05/2021 18:30, Andrew wrote:
On 23/05/2021 10:46, Jethro_uk wrote:

If there was any honesty in the free market mantra the Tories use to
shot
on us, we should be able to buy our electricity from Spain. Or indeed
anywhere.

I'm still waiting to be able to change my water company - as
promised by
their privatisation. When's that due ?

That was never offered with privatisation. You had the option to go onto
metered water and pay for what you actually use. You can always go off
grid, with your own well and private sewage treatment works, as some
rural folks have to.

There cannot be an option to switch suppliers without a National water
grid, which will never happen.

That's about how the utility is delivered, which is the same with
electricity and gas.

Competition is between the people who send out the bills.

Err, no. With gas and electricity all the inputs are fed into
the respective grid system. The users all tap into these two
grid systems. The gas and electrons could have come from anywhere
on the grid.

How would a water grid change things?

I could buy Scottish water here in Surrey. It isn't full of calcium

do you really think you could?
And at what price to have it pumped all the way
cheaper to buy a water softener



--
"Socialist governments traditionally do make a financial mess. They
always run out of other people's money. It's quite a characteristic of them"

Margaret Thatcher

In article , The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
On 24/05/2021 17:58, charles wrote:
In article , Max
Demian wrote:
On 24/05/2021 15:21, Andrew wrote:
On 23/05/2021 22:33, Max Demian wrote:
On 23/05/2021 18:30, Andrew wrote:
On 23/05/2021 10:46, Jethro_uk wrote:

If there was any honesty in the free market mantra the Tories use
to shot on us, we should be able to buy our electricity from
Spain. Or indeed anywhere.

I'm still waiting to be able to change my water company - as
promised by their privatisation. When's that due ?

That was never offered with privatisation. You had the option to go
onto metered water and pay for what you actually use. You can
always go off grid, with your own well and private sewage treatment
works, as some rural folks have to.

There cannot be an option to switch suppliers without a National
water grid, which will never happen.

That's about how the utility is delivered, which is the same with
electricity and gas.

Competition is between the people who send out the bills.

Err, no. With gas and electricity all the inputs are fed into the
respective grid system. The users all tap into these two grid
systems. The gas and electrons could have come from anywhere on the
grid.

How would a water grid change things?

I could buy Scottish water here in Surrey. It isn't full of calcium

do you really think you could?

no, but it makes about as much sense as buying 'green' electricity

And at what price to have it pumped all the way cheaper to buy a water
softener

I have one ;-)

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

Robin wrote:
On 23/05/2021 18:30, Andrew wrote:
On 23/05/2021 10:46, Jethro_uk wrote:
If there was any honesty in the free market mantra the Tories use to shot
on us, we should be able to buy our electricity from Spain. Or indeed
anywhere.

I'm still waiting to be able to change my water company - as promised by
their privatisation. When's that due ?

That was never offered with privatisation. You had the option to go onto
metered water and pay for what you actually use. You can always go off
grid, with your own well and private sewage treatment works, as some
rural folks have to.

There cannot be an option to switch suppliers without a National water
grid, which will never happen.

A national water grid has been looked at many times.

I believe its always been scuppered by pumping costs. Water companies are
already one of the biggest consumers of electricity in the country.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls