I have been using a Maxtor external drive, sadly it has stopped working.
As the drive does not like windows 10 I cannot test it easily.
I have a desktop computer with 931Gb drive of which 103Gb is in use. I
would dearly like a simple, well easy to operate, backup and restore
software and a suitable external drive. All help welcomed. TIA

On 11/10/2018 10:32, Broadback wrote:
I have been using a Maxtor external drive, sadly it has stopped working.
As the drive does not like windows 10 I cannot test it easily.
I have a desktop computer with 931Gb drive of which 103Gb is in use. I
would dearly like a simple, well easy to operate, backup and restore
software and a suitable external drive. All help welcomed. TIA

For drives, I favour Western Digital though I am using a Toshiba
portable drive (USB) on this laptop. For software, I've been using
Macrium Free for some years now and it have never let me down - and it
is very cheap!

One of the best things I learned over the years is to divide large disks
running under Windows into at least two partitions. I reserve one
partition for the operating system with as little else as reasonably
possible. So I can backup and restore my main "C" drive in less than ten
minutes. Other data I backup and restore less frequently.

Since I retired I don't bother with scheduled backups, I just backup and
restore as required. I backup the C drive after updates or other major
changes, and I restore it after installing unwanted software or
suspicious activity. Data drives, including email, I backup about every
fortnight.

--
Oliver

On 11/10/2018 10:32, Broadback wrote:
I have been using a Maxtor external drive, sadly it has stopped working.
As the drive does not like windows 10 I cannot test it easily.
I have a desktop computer with 931Gb drive of which 103Gb is in use. I
would dearly like a simple, well easy to operate, backup and restore
software and a suitable external drive. All help welcomed. TIA

I find little batch files based on robocopy are very convenient. For
example I back up the data on a couple of laptops to their SD card, then
swap these out periodically as "offsite copies" kept in the workshop.

This one is something else, it takes all the data on a USB stick and
backs it up to a windows machine. (Obviously, the stick *has* to be the
H drive). The clever bit is the /MIR switches. I forget what they all
do, but this includes just copying files which have changed. The pause
is to let you see that it has worked.

robocopy H:\ c:\Users\me\documents\H_backup /MIR
pause

On 11/10/18 11:33, newshound wrote:
On 11/10/2018 10:32, Broadback wrote:
I have been using a Maxtor external drive, sadly it has stopped
working. As the drive does not like windows 10 I cannot test it easily.
I have a desktop computer with 931Gb drive of which 103Gb is in use. I
would dearly like a simple, well easy to operate, backup and restore
software and a suitable external drive. All help welcomed. TIA

I find little batch files based on robocopy are very convenient. For
example I back up the data on a couple of laptops to their SD card, then
swap these out periodically as "offsite copies" kept in the workshop.

This one is something else, it takes all the data on a USB stick and
backs it up to a windows machine. (Obviously, the stick *has* to be the
H drive). The clever bit is the /MIR switches. I forget what they all
do, but this includes just copying files which have changed. The pause
is to let you see that it has worked.

robocopy H:\ c:\Users\me\documents\H_backup /MIR
pause


I gave up with local backups and went to

https://tresorit.com/cloud-storage

£12/month for 1TB, but zero knowledge encryption, Swiss DC and works on
everything (even Linux - the client there is fully fledged).

On 11/10/18 10:32, Broadback wrote:
I have been using a Maxtor external drive, sadly it has stopped working.
As the drive does not like windows 10 I cannot test it easily.
I have a desktop computer with 931Gb drive of which 103Gb is in use. I
would dearly like a simple, well easy to operate, backup and restore
software and a suitable external drive. All help welcomed. TIA

Why doesn't the drive like Windows 10? Is it formatted with a file
system W10 can't read? What error message - if any - does W10 give? Does
the disk work on other machines? What is its interface? USB?

I haven't used Windows of any flavour for about three years, but when I
did I used EaseUS Todo backup. Simple, effective, and reliable (and free).

--

Jeff

On 11/10/2018 11:36, Jeff Layman wrote:
On 11/10/18 10:32, Broadback wrote:
I have been using a Maxtor external drive, sadly it has stopped working.
As the drive does not like windows 10 I cannot test it easily.
I have a desktop computer with 931Gb drive of which 103Gb is in use. I
would dearly like a simple, well easy to operate, backup and restore
software and a suitable external drive. All help welcomed. TIA

Why doesn't the drive like Windows 10? Is it formatted with a file
system W10 can't read? What error message - if any - does W10 give? Does
the disk work on other machines? What is its interface? USB?

I haven't used Windows of any flavour for about three years, but when I
did I used EaseUS Todo backup. Simple, effective, and reliable (and free).

It fails to recognise the disk, so I am stumped. the supplies software,
which I have tried reloading does not work either. :-((

it may be the hard drive broken or the enclosure.

New USB enclosures are about £10 on ebay, USB3 is fastest (and backwards compatible)

I have lots of external hard drives with various old backups.

I dont bother with software to backup,
just use windows to open two file windows and copy across into a new folder on external hard drive (or to an old folder if I want it just to overwrite files which i've changed since last time.

I agree with Oliver, I have a C: windows partition and a D: data partition which holds my documents and most of my other data folders, and my thunderbird email folders.

On 11/10/2018 11:49, Broadback wrote:
On 11/10/2018 11:36, Jeff Layman wrote:
On 11/10/18 10:32, Broadback wrote:
I have been using a Maxtor external drive, sadly it has stopped working.
As the drive does not like windows 10 I cannot test it easily.
I have a desktop computer with 931Gb drive of which 103Gb is in use. I
would dearly like a simple, well easy to operate, backup and restore
software and a suitable external drive. All help welcomed. TIA

Why doesn't the drive like Windows 10? Is it formatted with a file
system W10 can't read? What error message - if any - does W10 give?
Does the disk work on other machines? What is its interface? USB?

I haven't used Windows of any flavour for about three years, but when
I did I used EaseUS Todo backup. Simple, effective, and reliable (and
free).

It fails to recognise the disk, so I am stumped. the supplies software,
which I have tried reloading does not work either. :-((

GIYF but there is loads you can try, depending on how much time you have
to waste. Do you have access to any other Windows PCs? Do you know
anyone with a Mac or a Linux box? You could get yourself a Linux boot
stick for about a tenner from eBay, or download and burn your own. Then
see if they can mount the drive.

If it is a fairly old drive and there is nothing of value on it perhaps
it is simplest to throw it away and buy something else.

newshound wrote:

robocopy H:\ c:\Users\me\documents\H_backup /MIR

Be aware that with robocopy, the /MIR switch will delete a file in the
destination if it no longer exists in the source, that can catch people
out if they expect files to "accumulate" in the destination over time ...

Tim Watts Wrote in message:
On 11/10/18 11:33, newshound wrote:
On 11/10/2018 10:32, Broadback wrote:
I have been using a Maxtor external drive, sadly it has stopped
working. As the drive does not like windows 10 I cannot test it easily.
I have a desktop computer with 931Gb drive of which 103Gb is in use. I
would dearly like a simple, well easy to operate, backup and restore
software and a suitable external drive. All help welcomed. TIA

I find little batch files based on robocopy are very convenient. For
example I back up the data on a couple of laptops to their SD card, then
swap these out periodically as "offsite copies" kept in the workshop.

This one is something else, it takes all the data on a USB stick and
backs it up to a windows machine. (Obviously, the stick *has* to be the
H drive). The clever bit is the /MIR switches. I forget what they all
do, but this includes just copying files which have changed. The pause
is to let you see that it has worked.

robocopy H:\ c:\Users\me\documents\H_backup /MIR
pause


I gave up with local backups and went to

https://tresorit.com/cloud-storage

£12/month for 1TB, but zero knowledge encryption, Swiss DC and works on
everything (even Linux - the client there is fully fledged).



I still have local backups, most data here lives on a server in
the cellar, with an attached external drive , theoretically all
the laptops/PC backup locally to the server as well and hence
onto the external drive. But I'd sowntimes prone to people
fiddling with things :-)

But we also use a cloud backup service, in this case Crashplan, as
I don't want to rely on local backups

I also need everything automated or it doesn't happen.
--
Chris French

On Thursday, 11 October 2018 10:32:23 UTC+1, Broadback wrote:

I have been using a Maxtor external drive, sadly it has stopped working.
As the drive does not like windows 10 I cannot test it easily.
I have a desktop computer with 931Gb drive of which 103Gb is in use. I
would dearly like a simple, well easy to operate, backup and restore
software and a suitable external drive. All help welcomed. TIA

You've already got easy to operate software. OPen file manager, select all, copy. Go to your new external usb disc, create a new folder and paste. It could not be simpler. You certainly should have more than 1 backup disc if you want to keep your files.


NT

Why cannot some enterprising person make a network drive that can see what
machines are on the network and back them up when they are seen?
Brian

--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Oliver" wrote in message
...
On 11/10/2018 10:32, Broadback wrote:
I have been using a Maxtor external drive, sadly it has stopped working.
As the drive does not like windows 10 I cannot test it easily.
I have a desktop computer with 931Gb drive of which 103Gb is in use. I
would dearly like a simple, well easy to operate, backup and restore
software and a suitable external drive. All help welcomed. TIA

For drives, I favour Western Digital though I am using a Toshiba portable
drive (USB) on this laptop. For software, I've been using Macrium Free for
some years now and it have never let me down - and it is very cheap!

One of the best things I learned over the years is to divide large disks
running under Windows into at least two partitions. I reserve one
partition for the operating system with as little else as reasonably
possible. So I can backup and restore my main "C" drive in less than ten
minutes. Other data I backup and restore less frequently.

Since I retired I don't bother with scheduled backups, I just backup and
restore as required. I backup the C drive after updates or other major
changes, and I restore it after installing unwanted software or suspicious
activity. Data drives, including email, I backup about every fortnight.

--
Oliver

Depends what you think your data is worth.
Brian

--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Tim Watts" wrote in message
...
On 11/10/18 11:33, newshound wrote:
On 11/10/2018 10:32, Broadback wrote:
I have been using a Maxtor external drive, sadly it has stopped working.
As the drive does not like windows 10 I cannot test it easily.
I have a desktop computer with 931Gb drive of which 103Gb is in use. I
would dearly like a simple, well easy to operate, backup and restore
software and a suitable external drive. All help welcomed. TIA

I find little batch files based on robocopy are very convenient. For
example I back up the data on a couple of laptops to their SD card, then
swap these out periodically as "offsite copies" kept in the workshop.

This one is something else, it takes all the data on a USB stick and
backs it up to a windows machine. (Obviously, the stick *has* to be the H
drive). The clever bit is the /MIR switches. I forget what they all do,
but this includes just copying files which have changed. The pause is to
let you see that it has worked.

robocopy H:\ c:\Users\me\documents\H_backup /MIR
pause


I gave up with local backups and went to

https://tresorit.com/cloud-storage

£12/month for 1TB, but zero knowledge encryption, Swiss DC and works on
everything (even Linux - the client there is fully fledged).

On 11/10/2018 13:00, Andy Burns wrote:
newshound wrote:

robocopy H:\ c:\Users\me\documents\H_backup /MIR

Be aware that with robocopy, the /MIR switch will delete a file in the
destination if it no longer exists in the source, that can catch people
out if they expect files to "accumulate" in the destination over time ...

Ah yes, very good point. But I am using that deliberately in some of my
cases where I might change file names to help manage data structures
better. It does mean you are not left with multiple copies of otherwise
very similar stuff, much of it slightly out of date.

Brian Gaff wrote

Why cannot some enterprising person make a network drive that can see
what machines are on the network and back them up when they are seen?

They can, and do. But it gets tricky backing up
files that are in use on a Win system, remotely.

Easier to do it on the Win system.

"Oliver" wrote in message
...
On 11/10/2018 10:32, Broadback wrote:
I have been using a Maxtor external drive, sadly it has stopped working.
As the drive does not like windows 10 I cannot test it easily.
I have a desktop computer with 931Gb drive of which 103Gb is in use. I
would dearly like a simple, well easy to operate, backup and restore
software and a suitable external drive. All help welcomed. TIA

For drives, I favour Western Digital though I am using a Toshiba portable
drive (USB) on this laptop. For software, I've been using Macrium Free
for some years now and it have never let me down - and it is very cheap!

One of the best things I learned over the years is to divide large disks
running under Windows into at least two partitions. I reserve one
partition for the operating system with as little else as reasonably
possible. So I can backup and restore my main "C" drive in less than ten
minutes. Other data I backup and restore less frequently.

Since I retired I don't bother with scheduled backups, I just backup and
restore as required. I backup the C drive after updates or other major
changes, and I restore it after installing unwanted software or
suspicious activity. Data drives, including email, I backup about every
fortnight.

--
Oliver

In message ,
newshound writes
On 11/10/2018 13:00, Andy Burns wrote:
newshound wrote:

robocopy H:\ c:\Users\me\documents\H_backup /MIR
Be aware that with robocopy, the /MIR switch will delete a file in
the destination if it no longer exists in the source, that can catch
people out if they expect files to "accumulate" in the destination
over time ...

Ah yes, very good point. But I am using that deliberately in some of my
cases where I might change file names to help manage data structures
better. It does mean you are not left with multiple copies of otherwise
very similar stuff, much of it slightly out of date.

I always wonder why so few seem to recommend Microsoft's Synctoy to
provide the various types of data backup as discussed above. Is there a
reason?

https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/down....aspx?id=15155

--
Bill

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

On Fri, 12 Oct 2018 02:14:35 +1100, cantankerous trolling senile geezer Rot
Speed blabbered, again:


Why cannot some enterprising person make a network drive that can see
what machines are on the network and back them up when they are seen?

They can, and do. But it gets tricky backing up
files that are in use on a Win system, remotely.

Not with the right software, bull**** artist!

--
Cursitor Doom about Rot Speed:
"The man is a conspicuous and unashamed ignoramus."
MID:

"Bill" wrote in message
...
In message , newshound
writes
On 11/10/2018 13:00, Andy Burns wrote:
newshound wrote:

robocopy H:\ c:\Users\me\documents\H_backup /MIR
Be aware that with robocopy, the /MIR switch will delete a file in the
destination if it no longer exists in the source, that can catch people
out if they expect files to "accumulate" in the destination over time
...

Ah yes, very good point. But I am using that deliberately in some of my
cases where I might change file names to help manage data structures
better. It does mean you are not left with multiple copies of otherwise
very similar stuff, much of it slightly out of date.

I always wonder why so few seem to recommend Microsoft's Synctoy to
provide the various types of data backup as discussed above. Is there a
reason?

https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/down....aspx?id=15155

Other stuff works better.

On Fri, 12 Oct 2018 08:11:46 +1100, cantankerous trolling senile geezer Rot
Speed blabbered, again:


I always wonder why so few seem to recommend Microsoft's Synctoy to
provide the various types of data backup as discussed above. Is there a
reason?

https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/down....aspx?id=15155

Other stuff works better.

Depends on what you need to do, senile wisenheimer!

--
Bill Wright addressing senile Ozzie cretin Rot Speed:
"Well you make up a lot of stuff and it's total ******** most of it."
MID:

On 11/10/2018 15:40, Brian Gaff wrote:
Why cannot some enterprising person make a network drive that can see what
machines are on the network and back them up when they are seen?
Brian

If you are using Google drive and also their apps such as Calendar and
Keep that is exactly what happens.

On Thursday, 11 October 2018 15:40:56 UTC+1, Brian Gaff wrote:
Why cannot some enterprising person make a network drive that can see what
machines are on the network and back them up when they are seen?
Brian

That's called backup software it's on a mac in the form of Time Machine, it can be used with Apples Time Capsules.
But I prefer local HD backups personally, not that there's anything wrong with network storage for relatively small size files.
I prefer manualy backing up files when I feel like it, but do use time machine and in fact have just recieved a 2TB WD HD for work after realising that the college network didn't back up my files and wasn't interested in setting an automated backup, so I have to DIY it :-)

On Thu, 11 Oct 2018 15:54:46 +0100
newshound wrote:

Ah yes, very good point. But I am using that deliberately in some of
my cases where I might change file names to help manage data
structures better. It does mean you are not left with multiple copies
of otherwise very similar stuff, much of it slightly out of date.

That's what version control software is for.

On Thu, 11 Oct 2018 06:14:44 -0700 (PDT)
wrote:

You've already got easy to operate software. OPen file manager,
select all, copy. Go to your new external usb disc, create a new
folder and paste. It could not be simpler.

That only works as long as you remember to save a fresh copy of
anything that changes, or regularly save everything then de-dupe it.

rob wrote [
That only works as long as you remember to save a fresh copy of
anything that changes, or regularly save everything then de-dupe it. ]

No, in my windows 10 when i select and copy a folder then paste it into my backup folder on external hard drive windows asks if i want to overwrite or skip duplicated files with the same date.

Skip is a lot faster

[g]

On Fri, 12 Oct 2018 13:27:10 +0100, Rob Morley wrote:

On Thu, 11 Oct 2018 06:14:44 -0700 (PDT)
wrote:

You've already got easy to operate software. OPen file manager, select
all, copy. Go to your new external usb disc, create a new folder and
paste. It could not be simpler.

That only works as long as you remember to save a fresh copy of anything
that changes, or regularly save everything then de-dupe it.

Or use a backup system that de-dupes below the file level, automatically.

--
My posts are my copyright and if @diy_forums or Home Owners' Hub
wish to copy them they can pay me £1 a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
*lightning surge protection* - a w_tom conductor

On Friday, 12 October 2018 13:37:22 UTC+1, George Miles wrote:
rob wrote [
That only works as long as you remember to save a fresh copy of
anything that changes, or regularly save everything then de-dupe it. ]

No, in my windows 10 when i select and copy a folder then paste it into my backup folder on external hard drive windows asks if i want to overwrite or skip duplicated files with the same date.

Yes because that is classed as a copy NOT a backup , the clue here is when you 'copy' the folder.
if I do this on my mac I get an extra option to merge the files, skip or replace.

A backup system would lok at the name of the file thens it;s creation date and the modified date if the modified date is more recent then it will copy just those files over to your backup. Proper backup software would NOT delete the older file but would create a new one, without deleting the old one, just in case you need it.



Skip is a lot faster

Yep it skips files, skip the whole folder and it copies really fast ;-)


[g]

On Friday, 12 October 2018 13:27:13 UTC+1, Rob Morley wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2018 06:14:44 -0700 (PDT)
tabbypurr wrote:

You've already got easy to operate software. OPen file manager,
select all, copy. Go to your new external usb disc, create a new
folder and paste. It could not be simpler.

That only works as long as you remember to save a fresh copy of
anything that changes, or regularly save everything then de-dupe it.

or save everything every however often you choose and don't bother deduping it.


NT

In message ,
writes
On Friday, 12 October 2018 13:27:13 UTC+1, Rob Morley wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2018 06:14:44 -0700 (PDT)
tabbypurr wrote:

You've already got easy to operate software. OPen file manager,
select all, copy. Go to your new external usb disc, create a new
folder and paste. It could not be simpler.

That only works as long as you remember to save a fresh copy of
anything that changes, or regularly save everything then de-dupe it.

or save everything every however often you choose and don't bother deduping it.


NT
I have a writer friend who used to do this and ended up with utter
chaos.

Files have to be closed before they will copy, so you have to be certain
where all the data files are and that they are all closed.

Far better to take occasional full images of the machine and then
regular backups of specific areas of data. I use Macrium for the images
and SyncToy for the backups of data, the data being organised so that it
is in a known area rather than lost in Microsoft'e virtual directories.

My reason for sticking to SyncToy is that I still do some audio work on
different machines and the audio (and video) is set to make cumulative
backups rather than destructive or duplicate ones.
--
Bill

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On Friday, 12 October 2018 17:12:35 UTC+1, Bill wrote:
In message ,
tabbypurr writes
On Friday, 12 October 2018 13:27:13 UTC+1, Rob Morley wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2018 06:14:44 -0700 (PDT)
tabbypurr wrote:

You've already got easy to operate software. OPen file manager,
select all, copy. Go to your new external usb disc, create a new
folder and paste. It could not be simpler.

That only works as long as you remember to save a fresh copy of
anything that changes, or regularly save everything then de-dupe it.

or save everything every however often you choose and don't bother deduping it.

I have a writer friend who used to do this and ended up with utter
chaos.

it's about the simplest way to backup going, and simplest way to restore data. If they ended up with chaos I can only conclude they were doing something else. It also has the benefit of keeping a few copies of earlier versions.

Files have to be closed before they will copy, so you have to be certain
where all the data files are and that they are all closed.

not on any PC I've ever used.
I can't imagine not knowing where my data is, though I know there are users like that.

Far better to take occasional full images of the machine and then
regular backups of specific areas of data. I use Macrium for the images
and SyncToy for the backups of data, the data being organised so that it
is in a known area rather than lost in Microsoft'e virtual directories.

why would you not just backup the lot frequently in one move? Any data you've not backed up in a while is going to be far out of date, and your approach much complicates restoring data if you have a drive or FS die.


NT

My reason for sticking to SyncToy is that I still do some audio work on
different machines and the audio (and video) is set to make cumulative
backups rather than destructive or duplicate ones.

On 12/10/18 13:27, Rob Morley wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2018 06:14:44 -0700 (PDT)
wrote:

You've already got easy to operate software. OPen file manager,
select all, copy. Go to your new external usb disc, create a new
folder and paste. It could not be simpler.

That only works as long as you remember to save a fresh copy of
anything that changes, or regularly save everything then de-dupe it.


I agree. The best backup system "just works" whenever it can.

That's why I like Tresorit (but it could be any number of cloud
solutions). If my computer is logged in as me, and has Internet access,
the client is running and syncing. As it's hooked into the linux dnotify
subsystem, it's efficient too as the kernel pings it whenever somehting
changed or got added.

You could probably do something home based with a NAS too - it's really
about how good the backup software is.

On 12/10/18 14:08, Bob Eager wrote:
On Fri, 12 Oct 2018 13:27:10 +0100, Rob Morley wrote:

On Thu, 11 Oct 2018 06:14:44 -0700 (PDT)
wrote:

You've already got easy to operate software. OPen file manager, select
all, copy. Go to your new external usb disc, create a new folder and
paste. It could not be simpler.

That only works as long as you remember to save a fresh copy of anything
that changes, or regularly save everything then de-dupe it.

Or use a backup system that de-dupes below the file level, automatically.


I have this at work - dedup is on the storage machine itself. It manages
an amazing amount of savings - each backup set (even full cycles) adds
only a very small extra dint in the space remaining.

In message ,
writes
why would you not just backup the lot frequently in one move? Any data
you've not backed up in a while is going to be far out of date, and
your approach much complicates restoring data if you have a drive or FS
die.

Maybe it's a question of scale. My writer friend has something like
650GB of text and over a TB of music on a separate machine. He is
currently backing up to a separate 2TB drive in his main machine and a
2TB external drive (he can't get his head round networking).
I have several machines with audio and video and backup over the network
to a pair of Linux backup servers.
There is nothing complicated about the data backups with my system. The
D: drives on the machines just have a couple, 3 at most, base
directories set up for ease of backing up - Media for the cumulative
backups, another base directory for the files that need to be
synchronised. Nothing anywhere like My Documents, My Music etc. For
example the Media directories all have subdirectories for video, pics,
audio and the further subdirectories as required.
The cumulative stuff is merged on the servers, the individual machine
stuff held separately.
Everything is uncompressed and unencrypted, so can be accessed simply
over the network.
Only the first backup takes hours or days. Once set up, it's simple and
quite quick.
--
Bill

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newshound posted
On 11/10/2018 13:00, Andy Burns wrote:
newshound wrote:

robocopy H:\ c:\Users\me\documents\H_backup /MIR
Be aware that with robocopy, the /MIR switch will delete a file in
the destination if it no longer exists in the source, that can catch
people out if they expect files to "accumulate" in the destination
over time ...

Ah yes, very good point.

xcopy d:\usr\*.* H:\Archive /d/s/i/c/r/h/y/f
will copy all new files and folders on d:\usr to the backup drive h:,
and overwrite existing backed-up files on H: with the newer versions on
d:, without deleting anything on H.

But I am using that deliberately in some of my cases where I might
change file names to help manage data structures better. It does mean
you are not left with multiple copies of otherwise very similar stuff,
much of it slightly out of date.

But sometimes it's handy to keep the earlier versions.

--
Jack