On Fri, 29 Dec 2017 17:44:19 +0000 (GMT)
Tim+ wrote:

Can you not see how that doesn't answer my question?

But what if as a result of the engine getting wet the cam belt had
slipped? No, not really.

In article 20171230111610.771c67a5@Mars,
Rob Morley wrote:
On Fri, 29 Dec 2017 17:44:19 +0000 (GMT)
Tim+ wrote:

Can you not see how that doesn't answer my question?

But what if as a result of the engine getting wet the cam belt had
slipped? No, not really.

The last tine I had to investigate a cam belt (in a 1971 Cortina), I found
it was toothed, so couldn't slip. It had broken, "fixed" by a breakdown
service - one tooth out !

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

On 30/12/2017 11:46, charles wrote:
In article 20171230111610.771c67a5@Mars,
Rob Morley wrote:
On Fri, 29 Dec 2017 17:44:19 +0000 (GMT)
Tim+ wrote:

Can you not see how that doesn't answer my question?

But what if as a result of the engine getting wet the cam belt had
slipped? No, not really.

The last tine I had to investigate a cam belt (in a 1971 Cortina), I found
it was toothed, so couldn't slip. It had broken, "fixed" by a breakdown
service - one tooth out !


A friend drove a pinto engined sierra for several years, eventually he
asked to have the cam belt changed, it had been one tooth out since
before he bought it, after I had set it all up correctly, he complained
that the engine was less flexible and he had to change gear more often.
The cam had been one tooth retarded.

In article ,
Chris Whelan wrote:
Huge wrote:

On 2017-12-29, Chris Whelan wrote:
Huge wrote:


FFS give it a rest. No-one cares.

+1.

I'm current evaluating how I use my computer, and for what purposes. In
the new year, I think sadly it might be time to jump the sinking HMS
Usenet.

Facebook's no better.

From some perspectives, several orders of magnitude worse.

Closed FB groups can be OK, especially if you are a mod. ;-)

Trouble with Facebook is the ease of posting pics. Meaning you get lots of
rather boring ones. On a forum where you have to use a hosting site for
pics, the extra effort tends to make only relevant ones used.

This group will certainly die out along with the old farts who post on it.
As has happened to pretty well all others.

--
*Remember not to forget that which you do not need to know.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Huge wrote:
I have very mixed views about moderation. (Depending on whether I've
looked at uk.radio.amateur lately!) Most mods need to wind their necks
in.

Amateur radio does seem to attract a large number of cooks. Dunno why.

All the moderated forums I use - mostly car related - work very well.
If you look at similar on Facebook, they are awash with just pics of the
cars. Which most already know what they look like. Those who are the most
knowledgeable about a make and likely to give decent help with a problem
seem to prefer forums. Perhaps their experience has come with age, of
course.

--
*The e-mail of the species is more deadly than the mail *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article 20171230111252.442259b8@Mars,
Rob Morley wrote:
On Fri, 29 Dec 2017 17:42:33 +0000
Chris Hogg wrote:

The early minis were
particularly prone to conking out, as the plugs and distributor were
right out front and caught everything.

That reminds me of a particularly wet drive on the M1 in a new-to-me
Mini that kept cutting out. It emerged that a previous owner had lost
the plastic shield that should have sat between the front grille and
the distributor - as soon as I tied a carrier bag in its place the car
ran fine.

The shield only arrived on later Minis. Early ones had nothing - then that
rubber glove round the dizzy.

Seems the prototype(s) had the dizzy at the back. Which then caused carb
icing with the carb at the front. Which is why they turned the engine
round and had to add an intermediate gear.

--
*Indian Driver - Smoke signals only*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 29/12/2017 14:19, Jethro_uk wrote:
On Fri, 29 Dec 2017 12:59:48 +0000, Roger Hayter wrote:

Jethro_uk wrote:

On Thu, 28 Dec 2017 23:06:03 +0000, Andrew Gabriel wrote:

Probably 20 years ago, I drove my Ford Fiesta through some rather
deep water. It washed some grit into one of the front CV joints,
which made a nasty noise immediately afterwards, and had to be
replaced a few months later.

Didn't seize as you were going along throwing the car into a skid ?

Which is what I was told could happen if a stone got into the CV joint.
Sounded ******** then, and ******** now.

This is I suppose why the little rubber gaiters are an MOT item.

Well that's where I heard the warning Are there still **** mechanics
using ****ty cable ties to "fasten" them up ?

If they do I believe it's an MOT failure, or at the very least an
advisory item.

On 30/12/2017 11:46, charles wrote:
The last tine I had to investigate a cam belt (in a 1971 Cortina), I found
it was toothed, so couldn't slip.

err, they are all toothed belts, it's the only way to maintain correct
registration between crankshaft and camshaft(s).

They do indeed 'slip', by jumping around the sprocket and this is
how the valves and pistons have a deadly embrace (on some cars).

He's been offered £75 to come and colect the car for scrap, which
is a good deal. Possibly because the scrappy is betting on an oil
change, suck out the water from the cylinders and an instant
£600 profit.

On 29/12/2017 17:42, Chris Hogg wrote:
In decades past, when ignition systems weren't well protected, there
were always cars stuck in flood waters

Or in the case of minis and 1100's simply driving in heavy rain
could flood the distributor.

On 30/12/2017 12:36, Andrew wrote:

He's been offered £75 to come and colect the car for scrap, which
is a good deal.

I guess scrap prices must have fallen. I got £200 (collected) for the
Punto a few years ago. I rang round, and the offers varied quite a bit:
£50-200 IIRC.


Possibly because the scrappy is betting on an oil
change, suck out the water from the cylinders and an instant
£600 profit.

On Sat, 30 Dec 2017 12:37:52 +0000, Andrew wrote:

On 29/12/2017 17:42, Chris Hogg wrote:
In decades past, when ignition systems weren't well protected, there
were always cars stuck in flood waters

Or in the case of minis and 1100's simply driving in heavy rain could
flood the distributor.

Happened to my Land Rover once in those conditions, south of Canterbury.
I had to get all the passengers out to stand round the engine compartment
as a windbreak while I used the silicone spray.

Then off we went again!

--
My posts are my copyright and if @diy_forums or Home Owners' Hub
wish to copy them they can pay me £1 a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
*lightning surge protection* - a w_tom conductor

On Sat, 30 Dec 2017 12:24:36 +0000, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article 20171230111252.442259b8@Mars,
Rob Morley wrote:
On Fri, 29 Dec 2017 17:42:33 +0000 Chris Hogg wrote:

The early minis were particularly prone to conking out, as the plugs
and distributor were right out front and caught everything.

That reminds me of a particularly wet drive on the M1 in a new-to-me
Mini that kept cutting out. It emerged that a previous owner had lost
the plastic shield that should have sat between the front grille and
the distributor - as soon as I tied a carrier bag in its place the car
ran fine.

The shield only arrived on later Minis. Early ones had nothing - then
that rubber glove round the dizzy.

Seems the prototype(s) had the dizzy at the back. Which then caused carb
icing with the carb at the front. Which is why they turned the engine
round and had to add an intermediate gear.

Yes, that's right. Despite the slight loss of power.

Read "The Mini Story" by Laurence Pomeroy - the dizzy stuff is in there.
Some weird and wonderful minis in there - the Moke, of course, but also
the Twini (two engines, front and rear).



--
My posts are my copyright and if @diy_forums or Home Owners' Hub
wish to copy them they can pay me £1 a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
*lightning surge protection* - a w_tom conductor

On 30/12/2017 12:15, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Chris Whelan wrote:
Huge wrote:

On 2017-12-29, Chris Whelan wrote:
Huge wrote:


FFS give it a rest. No-one cares.

+1.

I'm current evaluating how I use my computer, and for what purposes. In
the new year, I think sadly it might be time to jump the sinking HMS
Usenet.

Facebook's no better.

From some perspectives, several orders of magnitude worse.

Closed FB groups can be OK, especially if you are a mod. ;-)

Trouble with Facebook is the ease of posting pics. Meaning you get lots of
rather boring ones. On a forum where you have to use a hosting site for
pics, the extra effort tends to make only relevant ones used.

This group will certainly die out along with the old farts who post on it.
As has happened to pretty well all others.

Probably true, although its interesting that its has survived so much
better than many of the others. If you ignore the politics etc, there is
still quite a large volume of on topic stuff still covered.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

In article ,
GB wrote:
He's been offered £75 to come and colect the car for scrap, which
is a good deal.

I guess scrap prices must have fallen. I got £200 (collected) for the
Punto a few years ago. I rang round, and the offers varied quite a bit:
£50-200 IIRC.

Pretty rare a recently running car is used only for scrap. Normally
dismantled for any useful parts. Which won't be just the engine.

--
*My wife has a slight impediment in her speech. She stops to breathe.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 30/12/2017 14:08, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
GB wrote:
He's been offered £75 to come and colect the car for scrap, which
is a good deal.

I guess scrap prices must have fallen. I got £200 (collected) for the
Punto a few years ago. I rang round, and the offers varied quite a bit:
£50-200 IIRC.

Pretty rare a recently running car is used only for scrap. Normally
dismantled for any useful parts. Which won't be just the engine.


not round here, there are now very few 'breakers' Land prices are too
high for them to keep going. Scrap places are taking in complete
runners, often under ten years old, they have the fluids removed,
batteries and alloy wheels removed, catalytic converters cut off, the
engine/box is torn out with a grab, and the remainder goes in the
crusher, then, elsewhere the remains are torn apart and separated on a
conveyor belt machine and useful stuff goes to be remelted.

On 30/12/17 1:50 PM, Jethro_uk wrote:
On Sat, 30 Dec 2017 12:46:57 +0000, GB wrote:

On 30/12/2017 12:36, Andrew wrote:

[quoted text muted]

I guess scrap prices must have fallen.

I think they're on the up.

2-3 years ago, we sometimes had 3 scrappies *a day* up & down.

Then nothing for about a year.

Just started hearing (one) again.


You shouldn't be hearing them. They aren't allowed to use loud hailers
or other noise pollution to tout for scrap any more.

On 30/12/2017 17:13, Peter Hill wrote:
On 30/12/17 1:50 PM, Jethro_uk wrote:
On Sat, 30 Dec 2017 12:46:57 +0000, GB wrote:

On 30/12/2017 12:36, Andrew wrote:

[quoted text muted]

I guess scrap prices must have fallen.

I think they're on the up.

2-3 years ago, we sometimes had 3 scrappies *a day* up & down.

Then nothing for about a year.

Just started hearing (one) again.


You shouldn't be hearing them. They aren't allowed to use loud hailers
or other noise pollution to tout for scrap any more.

Will you nip out and tell them?

In article ,
Jethro_uk wrote:
Well that's where I heard the warning Are there still ****
mechanics using ****ty cable ties to "fasten" them up ?

If they do I believe it's an MOT failure, or at the very least an
advisory item.

as long as the boot is intact and seated, and the tie isn't fouling
anything , it's a pass.

Not quite sure why decent cable ties ain't suitable anyway?

--
*Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Rob Morley wrote:
On Fri, 29 Dec 2017 17:44:19 +0000 (GMT)
Tim+ wrote:

Can you not see how that doesn't answer my question?

But what if as a result of the engine getting wet the cam belt had
slipped? No, not really.



But thats yet another different scenario to the my question (that everyone
seems to have forgotten), namely can a starter motor produce enough torque
to damage a hydraulically locked engine?

Of course a running engine may have already sustained irreparable damage
from ingesting water but I was curious as to whether attempting to turn an
already locked engine over with the starter could actually bend conrods
etc.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

On 30/12/17 6:36 PM, Tim+ wrote:
Rob Morley wrote:
On Fri, 29 Dec 2017 17:44:19 +0000 (GMT)
Tim+ wrote:

Can you not see how that doesn't answer my question?

But what if as a result of the engine getting wet the cam belt had
slipped? No, not really.



But thats yet another different scenario to the my question (that everyone
seems to have forgotten), namely can a starter motor produce enough torque
to damage a hydraulically locked engine?

Of course a running engine may have already sustained irreparable damage
from ingesting water but I was curious as to whether attempting to turn an
already locked engine over with the starter could actually bend conrods
etc.

Tim


Yes the starter can bend the con rod or damage the head gasket. Both
result in low compression on the locked cylinder and poor running.

MrCheerful wrote:
On 30/12/2017 17:13, Peter Hill wrote:
On 30/12/17 1:50 PM, Jethro_uk wrote:
On Sat, 30 Dec 2017 12:46:57 +0000, GB wrote:

On 30/12/2017 12:36, Andrew wrote:

[quoted text muted]

I guess scrap prices must have fallen.

I think they're on the up.

2-3 years ago, we sometimes had 3 scrappies *a day* up & down.

Then nothing for about a year.

Just started hearing (one) again.


You shouldn't be hearing them. They aren't allowed to use loud
hailers or other noise pollution to tout for scrap any more.

Will you nip out and tell them?

One of them that used to come round here used a loud hailer shouting "bring
out yer dead". Decent area, not a council estate. I've not seen him for
years.
They are handy though. My cheap lawn mower which was doing my back in but
still worked was dumped at the end of the drive, it was gone the next day.
If I had not got rid of it I'd be tempted to keep using it - getting no
younger. I will now HAVE to get a new one.
Been thinking of this: Two small lawns.
https://www.tesco.com/direct/flymo-u...?source=others

Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:

[snip]


My cheap lawn mower which was doing my back in but
still worked was dumped at the end of the drive, it was gone the next
day.
If I had not got rid of it I'd be tempted to keep using it - getting
no younger. I will now HAVE to get a new one.
Been thinking of this: Two small lawns.
https://www.tesco.com/direct/flymo-u...?source=others




I favour a sort of cyborg-mower: it ambles around the grass by itself
after the manner of a sheep, but programmed to avoid the flower beds;
then at night it parks itself over a drain and quietly defecates into
the sewer system where its faeces (along with waste from human sources)
are converted to methane to be stored for useful purposes.

It ought to be possible to genetically engineer cattle in much the same
way - it would save the farmers a lot of work. One can toilet-train
dogs, so why not cattle?

--
Graham J

On 30/12/2017 15:05, MrCheerful wrote:
On 30/12/2017 14:08, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Â*Â*Â* GB wrote:
He's been offered £75 to come and colect the car for scrap, which
is a good deal.

I guess scrap prices must have fallen. I got £200 (collected) for the
Punto a few years ago. I rang round, and the offers varied quite a bit:
£50-200 IIRC.

Pretty rare a recently running car is used only for scrap. Normally
dismantled for any useful parts. Which won't be just the engine.


not round here, there are now very few 'breakers'Â* Land prices are too
high for them to keep going.Â* Scrap places are taking in complete
runners, often under ten years old, they have the fluids removed,
batteries and alloy wheels removed, catalytic converters cut off, the
engine/box is torn out with a grab, and the remainder goes in the
crusher, then, elsewhere the remains are torn apart and separated on a
conveyor belt machine and useful stuff goes to be remelted.

My impression too. Last couple I have scrapped went straight to scrap
metal merchant (of which there are several within 20 miles paying useful
money). I occasionally get bits from a local breaker but these days more
usually via ebay (typically when wife writes off wing mirrors and tail
light clusters).

I guess there is a market for engines and gearbox from insurance
write-offs, but these days the reliability of stuff is so much better.
When I was running pretty marginal motors as a lad I'd be in the
scrappie a few times a year for dynamos, wiper motors, drive shafts,
speedos, stalks, doors, etc.

On 30/12/2017 12:24, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article 20171230111252.442259b8@Mars,
Rob Morley wrote:
On Fri, 29 Dec 2017 17:42:33 +0000
Chris Hogg wrote:

The early minis were
particularly prone to conking out, as the plugs and distributor were
right out front and caught everything.

That reminds me of a particularly wet drive on the M1 in a new-to-me
Mini that kept cutting out. It emerged that a previous owner had lost
the plastic shield that should have sat between the front grille and
the distributor - as soon as I tied a carrier bag in its place the car
ran fine.

The shield only arrived on later Minis. Early ones had nothing - then that
rubber glove round the dizzy.

I remember that too, one of my mates at school had one.


Seems the prototype(s) had the dizzy at the back. Which then caused carb
icing with the carb at the front. Which is why they turned the engine
round and had to add an intermediate gear.

Graham J wrote:
Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:

[snip]


My cheap lawn mower which was doing my back in but
still worked was dumped at the end of the drive, it was gone the next
day.
If I had not got rid of it I'd be tempted to keep using it - getting
no younger. I will now HAVE to get a new one.
Been thinking of this: Two small lawns.
https://www.tesco.com/direct/flymo-u...?source=others




I favour a sort of cyborg-mower: it ambles around the grass by itself
after the manner of a sheep, but programmed to avoid the flower beds;
then at night it parks itself over a drain and quietly defecates into
the sewer system where its faeces (along with waste from human
sources) are converted to methane to be stored for useful purposes.

It ought to be possible to genetically engineer cattle in much the
same way - it would save the farmers a lot of work. One can
toilet-train dogs, so why not cattle?

This sounds ideal.
Do you have a link to such a machine?
I can't find one. But, as you are such a clever **** I expect that you will
know of a supplier.

In article ,
Jethro_uk writes:
On Thu, 28 Dec 2017 23:06:03 +0000, Andrew Gabriel wrote:

Probably 20 years ago, I drove my Ford Fiesta through some rather deep
water. It washed some grit into one of the front CV joints, which made a
nasty noise immediately afterwards, and had to be replaced a few months
later.

Didn't seize as you were going along throwing the car into a skid ?

Which is what I was told could happen if a stone got into the CV joint.
Sounded ******** then, and ******** now.

Happened to my mum driving a mini many decades ago.
Fortunately a quiet country road where you couldn't
do more than about 20MPH up a windy steep hill, and
it lurched off the road and drove up the trunk of a
tree which was wider than the car.
No damage done - just reversed back down the tree,
and drove off up the road again. Apparently, it had
been making a noise for a while and it could be felt
through the steering, but that incident fixed it.

Later, it became part of the MoT test. My own mini
used to fail on the rubber boot split. At the time,
it was like 40p for a new boot, and £25 to fit it
(a lot at the time). I remember saying, couldn't they
find better quality boots for a quid?

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

"Graham J" wrote in message
news
Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:

[snip]


My cheap lawn mower which was doing my back in but
still worked was dumped at the end of the drive, it was gone the next
day.
If I had not got rid of it I'd be tempted to keep using it - getting
no younger. I will now HAVE to get a new one.
Been thinking of this: Two small lawns.
https://www.tesco.com/direct/flymo-u...?source=others




I favour a sort of cyborg-mower: it ambles around the grass by itself
after the manner of a sheep, but programmed to avoid the flower beds; then
at night it parks itself over a drain and quietly defecates into the sewer
system where its faeces (along with waste from human sources) are
converted to methane to be stored for useful purposes.

It ought to be possible to genetically engineer cattle in much the same
way - it would save the farmers a lot of work. One can toilet-train dogs,
so why not cattle?

Different brains.

On 30/12/2017 21:39, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
Graham J wrote:
Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:

[snip]


My cheap lawn mower which was doing my back in but
still worked was dumped at the end of the drive, it was gone the next
day.
If I had not got rid of it I'd be tempted to keep using it - getting
no younger. I will now HAVE to get a new one.
Been thinking of this: Two small lawns.
https://www.tesco.com/direct/flymo-u...?source=others




I favour a sort of cyborg-mower: it ambles around the grass by itself
after the manner of a sheep, but programmed to avoid the flower beds;
then at night it parks itself over a drain and quietly defecates into
the sewer system where its faeces (along with waste from human
sources) are converted to methane to be stored for useful purposes.

It ought to be possible to genetically engineer cattle in much the
same way - it would save the farmers a lot of work. One can
toilet-train dogs, so why not cattle?

This sounds ideal.
Do you have a link to such a machine?

If you skip the whole methane production bit, there are plenty of robo
mowers about. Good ones are not cheap though:

https://www.husqvarna.com/uk/product...50x/967622603/



--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

newshound wrote:

My impression too. Last couple I have scrapped went straight to scrap
metal merchant (of which there are several within 20 miles paying useful
money).

A while ago my Volvo 240 reached 13 years and 199,880 miles when
the diff overheated after running through floodwater (I thought I
knew Loughborough Meadows better than I actually did). I sold it
for £40 on ebay, and the enthusiast who bought it managed to
drive it home OK, passing 200,000 on the way.

I checked some time later, and it was still taxed and presumably
running.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Plant amazing Acers.

Rod Speed wrote:

[snip]

I favour a sort of cyborg-mower: it ambles around the grass by itself
after the manner of a sheep, but programmed to avoid the flower beds;
then at night it parks itself over a drain and quietly defecates into
the sewer system where its faeces (along with waste from human
sources) are converted to methane to be stored for useful purposes.

It ought to be possible to genetically engineer cattle in much the
same way - it would save the farmers a lot of work. One can
toilet-train dogs, so why not cattle?

Different brains.

genetically engineer

--
Graham J

Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:

[snip]

I favour a sort of cyborg-mower: it ambles around the grass by itself
after the manner of a sheep, but programmed to avoid the flower beds;
then at night it parks itself over a drain and quietly defecates into
the sewer system where its faeces (along with waste from human
sources) are converted to methane to be stored for useful purposes.

It ought to be possible to genetically engineer cattle in much the
same way - it would save the farmers a lot of work. One can
toilet-train dogs, so why not cattle?

This sounds ideal.
Do you have a link to such a machine?
I can't find one. But, as you are such a clever **** I expect that
you will know of a supplier.



I don't expect it exists yet.

But before 1900 we didn't have aircraft, and before 1800 we didn't have
trains. Arguably these inventions took much more innovation than the
sort of cyborg I suggest.

Apple iMower, anyone?

--
Graham J

On 31/12/17 9:55 AM, Graham J wrote:
Rod Speed wrote:

[snip]

I favour a sort of cyborg-mower: it ambles around the grass by itself
after the manner of a sheep, but programmed to avoid the flower beds;
then at night it parks itself over a drain and quietly defecates into
the sewer system where its faeces (along with waste from human
sources) are converted to methane to be stored for useful purposes.

It ought to be possible to genetically engineer cattle in much the
same way - it would save the farmers a lot of work. One can
toilet-train dogs, so why not cattle?

Different brains.

genetically engineer


The last thing we need is clever cows. They would learn that the
electric fence isn't always on.

Being able to find their own way to the milking parlour twice a day is
quite clever enough.

On 30/12/2017 21:39, Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:
Graham J wrote:
Mr Pounder Esquire wrote:

[snip]


My cheap lawn mower which was doing my back in but
still worked was dumped at the end of the drive, it was gone the next
day.
If I had not got rid of it I'd be tempted to keep using it - getting
no younger. I will now HAVE to get a new one.
Been thinking of this: Two small lawns.
https://www.tesco.com/direct/flymo-u...?source=others




I favour a sort of cyborg-mower: it ambles around the grass by itself
after the manner of a sheep, but programmed to avoid the flower beds;
then at night it parks itself over a drain and quietly defecates into
the sewer system where its faeces (along with waste from human
sources) are converted to methane to be stored for useful purposes.

It ought to be possible to genetically engineer cattle in much the
same way - it would save the farmers a lot of work. One can
toilet-train dogs, so why not cattle?

This sounds ideal.
Do you have a link to such a machine?
I can't find one. But, as you are such a clever **** I expect that you will
know of a supplier.



there are several autonomous mowers, they potter around and then go home
to recharge, they don't collect the clippings, since the cut is frequent
the cuttings are tiny and self mulch. about 700 quid upwards, argos sell
at least one type

On 31/12/2017 11:09, Jethro_uk wrote:
On Sun, 31 Dec 2017 10:10:36 +0000, MrCheerful wrote:

there are several autonomous mowers, they potter around and then go home
to recharge, they don't collect the clippings, since the cut is frequent
the cuttings are tiny and self mulch. about 700 quid upwards, argos sell
at least one type

Not so suitable for front lawns though.

They might escape and join up with the other robots...

--
Max Demian

"Peter Hill" wrote in message
news
On 31/12/17 9:55 AM, Graham J wrote:
Rod Speed wrote:

[snip]

I favour a sort of cyborg-mower: it ambles around the grass by itself
after the manner of a sheep, but programmed to avoid the flower beds;
then at night it parks itself over a drain and quietly defecates into
the sewer system where its faeces (along with waste from human
sources) are converted to methane to be stored for useful purposes.

It ought to be possible to genetically engineer cattle in much the
same way - it would save the farmers a lot of work. One can
toilet-train dogs, so why not cattle?

Different brains.

genetically engineer

The last thing we need is clever cows. They would learn that the electric
fence isn't always on.

Yeah, went to this last year.
https://www.facebook.com/Barellan-Wo...8049584655771/

They had what was allegedly the longest bullock train ever seen
this century, and its such an old fashioned operation you were
welcome to wander around where they were breaking up the
bullock teams and putting them onto the B double trucks.
http://www.boyleslivestock.com.au/im...ktransport.jpg

They do that up an earthen ramp that the truck backs up to, with
quite literally just a very long piece of string up the side of the ramp
to stop the individual bullocks heading off the side of the ramp.

Being able to find their own way to the milking parlour twice a day is
quite clever enough.

On 29/12/2017 18:00, Rob Morley wrote:
On Fri, 29 Dec 2017 10:04:47 +0000 (GMT)
Tim+ wrote:

A bad idea for sure without removing the plugs but would a starter
motor have enough power to do more damage?

I imagine it would depend on the state of the engine when the starter
kicked in - if it picked up some momentum before locking then it might
bend a rod, but if the hydro-lock was pretty much instantaneous then I
doubt it. And if the water-full cylinder was on the exhaust stroke then
no harm done.

So the engine sucks in a cylinder full of water in the flood, and stops
dead from running speed, locking the transmission as it does so.

I'll be amazed if the starter could do any more damage. My car only
cranks at about 120RPM.

Andy

On 30/12/2017 14:08, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Pretty rare a recently running car is used only for scrap. Normally
dismantled for any useful parts. Which won't be just the engine.

My wife's old car (which was driven to the garage, with a leaking sump
and some other expensive stuff coming) is currently acting as an advert
for the garage's "scrappage scheme".

She's not pleased. Had that car for 17 years from new.

Andy

Vir Campestris wrote:

On 29/12/2017 18:00, Rob Morley wrote:
On Fri, 29 Dec 2017 10:04:47 +0000 (GMT)
Tim+ wrote:

A bad idea for sure without removing the plugs but would a starter
motor have enough power to do more damage?

I imagine it would depend on the state of the engine when the starter
kicked in - if it picked up some momentum before locking then it might
bend a rod, but if the hydro-lock was pretty much instantaneous then I
doubt it. And if the water-full cylinder was on the exhaust stroke then
no harm done.

So the engine sucks in a cylinder full of water in the flood, and stops
dead from running speed, locking the transmission as it does so.

I'll be amazed if the starter could do any more damage. My car only
cranks at about 120RPM.

Andy

I would tend to agree with you. More conclusively, we are told the
starter did not turn it over at all. I would very much doubt that the
stationary torque of the starter, without any momentum of heavy parts to
back it up, could actually bend anything important.

--

Roger Hayter

Vir Campestris wrote:
On 30/12/2017 14:08, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Pretty rare a recently running car is used only for scrap. Normally
dismantled for any useful parts. Which won't be just the engine.

My wife's old car (which was driven to the garage, with a leaking sump
and some other expensive stuff coming) is currently acting as an advert
for the garage's "scrappage scheme".

She's not pleased. Had that car for 17 years from new.

Andy


What was the scrappage value?

I was allowed £3,500 for a 10-year old car worth about £1,500 - for a
new purchase at list price about £24,000. Admittedly I had the money to
spend.

--
Graham J

On 01/01/2018 23:09, Graham J wrote:

What was the scrappage value?

I was allowed £3,500 for a 10-year old car worth about £1,500 - for a
new purchase at list price about £24,000.Â* Admittedly I had the money to
spend.

Not a lot.

We got a reduction on the S/H car she's got to replace it.

Doubtless we've been ripped off... used car salesmen are legendary.

Andy