http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...ter-ministers/

At last! It is blatantly clear that part of the cause of fly-tipping is
the fact that it is so difficult to dispose of waste. We used to have a
council-run rubbish/recycling centre near us, then it was closed, then
re-opened under a contractor, who charges £6 per car-load. But it never
seems to be open, so it's impossible to make any plans to go there.

Another problem is where to dispose of used engine oil and coolant.
Both are no-nos for putting down the drain. "Find a willing local
garage" is the advice. No, I want to take it to a place that will
accept it, rather than try to persuade an unwilling garage, with whom
I do no business.

And finally, there is a collection of old gardening powders, paint,
snail repellent etc in our garage. Some of it may be old enough to
qualify as historical and worthy of a museum. But in order to dispose of
it, whereas I would like to just put it all in a box and take it to my
local waste centre, I am supposed to itemise it by description and
quantity, and then call for a Hazmat lorry to come and collect it, and
pay £45 for the privilege.
And they wonder why people fly-tip.

--
Davey.

Davey wrote:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...ter-ministers/

At last! It is blatantly clear that part of the cause of fly-tipping is
the fact that it is so difficult to dispose of waste. We used to have a
council-run rubbish/recycling centre near us, then it was closed, then
re-opened under a contractor, who charges £6 per car-load. But it never
seems to be open, so it's impossible to make any plans to go there.

Another problem is where to dispose of used engine oil and coolant.
Both are no-nos for putting down the drain. "Find a willing local
garage" is the advice. No, I want to take it to a place that will
accept it, rather than try to persuade an unwilling garage, with whom
I do no business.

And finally, there is a collection of old gardening powders, paint,
snail repellent etc in our garage. Some of it may be old enough to
qualify as historical and worthy of a museum. But in order to dispose of
it, whereas I would like to just put it all in a box and take it to my
local waste centre, I am supposed to itemise it by description and
quantity, and then call for a Hazmat lorry to come and collect it, and
pay £45 for the privilege.
And they wonder why people fly-tip.


I suspect that the majority of flytipping doesn't come from DIYers though
so I can't see this having a huge impact unfortunately.

It's the tradesmen working on tight margins who will still have the
incentive to flytip. I'd like to see "free" waste disposal for DIYers AND
tradesmen with a turnover less that a certain amount. Of course this would
have to be paid for by rates/community charge/whatever but it would be
worth it to stop this appalling scourge on our countryside.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

On 09/04/2017 02:59, Tim+ wrote:

I suspect that the majority of flytipping doesn't come from DIYers though
so I can't see this having a huge impact unfortunately.

It's the tradesmen working on tight margins who will still have the
incentive to flytip. I'd like to see "free" waste disposal for DIYers AND
tradesmen with a turnover less that a certain amount. Of course this would
have to be paid for by rates/community charge/whatever but it would be
worth it to stop this appalling scourge on our countryside.

Tim


My local council has waste disposal centres open 7 days a week that take
almost everything including paint, old engine oil, fridges, electronic
goods etc. although no commercial waste allowed, which is enforced
mainly on quantity of waste and type of vehicle. During busy times the
queuing time to get in may be up to 30 minutes.


--
mailto: news {at} admac {dot] myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

Yes when the site clearance folk came to dismantle an old asbestos garage
they told me that it was the fact that so few sites were legal and that even
though they double wrapped and labelled it it was still charged for.
The problem is that the government imposes a land fill tax on councils so
unless they stop this tax on rubbish, there will be no change
The idea of the taxis for land fill to be reduced, which implies more
recycling, on the face of it a good idea, but there are things that cannot
be recycled that need too be rated differently and then there should be no
charge. However now we have private companies involved who have to make a
profit, I can see that the end result will be that if the dumper is not
paying the cost will be shared by the council tax payers or more cuts in
services.
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Davey" wrote in message
news
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...ter-ministers/

At last! It is blatantly clear that part of the cause of fly-tipping is
the fact that it is so difficult to dispose of waste. We used to have a
council-run rubbish/recycling centre near us, then it was closed, then
re-opened under a contractor, who charges £6 per car-load. But it never
seems to be open, so it's impossible to make any plans to go there.

Another problem is where to dispose of used engine oil and coolant.
Both are no-nos for putting down the drain. "Find a willing local
garage" is the advice. No, I want to take it to a place that will
accept it, rather than try to persuade an unwilling garage, with whom
I do no business.

And finally, there is a collection of old gardening powders, paint,
snail repellent etc in our garage. Some of it may be old enough to
qualify as historical and worthy of a museum. But in order to dispose of
it, whereas I would like to just put it all in a box and take it to my
local waste centre, I am supposed to itemise it by description and
quantity, and then call for a Hazmat lorry to come and collect it, and
pay £45 for the privilege.
And they wonder why people fly-tip.

--
Davey.

On 09/04/17 00:40, Davey wrote:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...ter-ministers/

At last! It is blatantly clear that part of the cause of fly-tipping is
the fact that it is so difficult to dispose of waste. We used to have a
council-run rubbish/recycling centre near us, then it was closed, then
re-opened under a contractor, who charges £6 per car-load. But it never
seems to be open, so it's impossible to make any plans to go there.

Another problem is where to dispose of used engine oil and coolant.
Both are no-nos for putting down the drain. "Find a willing local
garage" is the advice. No, I want to take it to a place that will
accept it, rather than try to persuade an unwilling garage, with whom
I do no business.

All the dumps I've been to have an engine oil disposal sump.

And finally, there is a collection of old gardening powders, paint,
snail repellent etc in our garage. Some of it may be old enough to
qualify as historical and worthy of a museum. But in order to dispose of
it, whereas I would like to just put it all in a box and take it to my
local waste centre, I am supposed to itemise it by description and
quantity, and then call for a Hazmat lorry to come and collect it, and
pay £45 for the privilege.
And they wonder why people fly-tip.

Again - our dump (even the small one) has a special zone for chemicals.

What I've done with paint when skipping before (the skip company did not
want liquid paint) is to get loads of cardboard boxes from the
supermarket, and loads of newspapers and line the boxes in the garden
with paper, then pour out the cans into the boxes.

Leave for a couple of days to dry then dispose of as dry waste.

On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 01:59:36 -0000 (UTC), Tim+
wrote:



I suspect that the majority of flytipping doesn't come from DIYers though
so I can't see this having a huge impact unfortunately.

It's the tradesmen working on tight margins who will still have the
incentive to flytip.

Till a lot of councils altered their conditions a lot of those Jobs
done by smaller tradesmen became part DIY , The DIY bit being the
waste disposal as the tradesmen left the waste for the householder
to dispose of "free" and that would be reflected in the cost of the
job done.

Now the there is a cost some householders are fly tipping to save
money,some directly , others by employing a cheap disposal service
offered by some dubious character with a flatbed.
Not all householders know or care about asking to see the relevant
paperwork that legitimate operators should have, other householders
are just innocently unaware which has resulted in some nasty surprises
when the source of the rubbish has been traced by a an envelope with
an address for example and legal action has followed.
Personally I would like to any vehicle involved with fly tipping
seized and crushed within hours, preferably with the perpetuator in
it.

G.Harman

In article ,
Tim Watts wrote:
On 09/04/17 00:40, Davey wrote:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...ter-ministers/

At last! It is blatantly clear that part of the cause of fly-tipping is
the fact that it is so difficult to dispose of waste. We used to have a
council-run rubbish/recycling centre near us, then it was closed, then
re-opened under a contractor, who charges £6 per car-load. But it never
seems to be open, so it's impossible to make any plans to go there.

Another problem is where to dispose of used engine oil and coolant.
Both are no-nos for putting down the drain. "Find a willing local
garage" is the advice. No, I want to take it to a place that will
accept it, rather than try to persuade an unwilling garage, with whom
I do no business.

All the dumps I've been to have an engine oil disposal sump.

And finally, there is a collection of old gardening powders, paint,
snail repellent etc in our garage. Some of it may be old enough to
qualify as historical and worthy of a museum. But in order to dispose of
it, whereas I would like to just put it all in a box and take it to my
local waste centre, I am supposed to itemise it by description and
quantity, and then call for a Hazmat lorry to come and collect it, and
pay £45 for the privilege.
And they wonder why people fly-tip.

Again - our dump (even the small one) has a special zone for chemicals.

What I've done with paint when skipping before (the skip company did not
want liquid paint) is to get loads of cardboard boxes from the
supermarket, and loads of newspapers and line the boxes in the garden
with paper, then pour out the cans into the boxes.

Leave for a couple of days to dry then dispose of as dry waste.

The decoprators' merchant where i buy my painsdt also sell a paint
hardening chemical.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

charles wrote:
In article ,
Tim Watts wrote:
On 09/04/17 00:40, Davey wrote:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...ter-ministers/

At last! It is blatantly clear that part of the cause of fly-tipping is
the fact that it is so difficult to dispose of waste. We used to have a
council-run rubbish/recycling centre near us, then it was closed, then
re-opened under a contractor, who charges £6 per car-load. But it never
seems to be open, so it's impossible to make any plans to go there.

Another problem is where to dispose of used engine oil and coolant.
Both are no-nos for putting down the drain. "Find a willing local
garage" is the advice. No, I want to take it to a place that will
accept it, rather than try to persuade an unwilling garage, with whom
I do no business.

All the dumps I've been to have an engine oil disposal sump.

And finally, there is a collection of old gardening powders, paint,
snail repellent etc in our garage. Some of it may be old enough to
qualify as historical and worthy of a museum. But in order to dispose of
it, whereas I would like to just put it all in a box and take it to my
local waste centre, I am supposed to itemise it by description and
quantity, and then call for a Hazmat lorry to come and collect it, and
pay £45 for the privilege.
And they wonder why people fly-tip.

Again - our dump (even the small one) has a special zone for chemicals.

What I've done with paint when skipping before (the skip company did not
want liquid paint) is to get loads of cardboard boxes from the
supermarket, and loads of newspapers and line the boxes in the garden
with paper, then pour out the cans into the boxes.

Leave for a couple of days to dry then dispose of as dry waste.

The decoprators' merchant where i buy my painsdt also sell a paint
hardening chemical.

The paint and varnishes I use seem to have it built in!
Whenever I go back to a part used tin the contents are useless.

In article ,
Tim+ wrote:
It's the tradesmen working on tight margins who will still have the
incentive to flytip. I'd like to see "free" waste disposal for DIYers
AND tradesmen with a turnover less that a certain amount. Of course this
would have to be paid for by rates/community charge/whatever but it
would be worth it to stop this appalling scourge on our countryside.

And there's the rub. Something must be done - but no one wants to pay for
it.

--
*Why do the two "sanction"s (noun and verb) mean opposites?*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Tim Watts wrote:
Another problem is where to dispose of used engine oil and coolant.
Both are no-nos for putting down the drain. "Find a willing local
garage" is the advice. No, I want to take it to a place that will
accept it, rather than try to persuade an unwilling garage, with whom
I do no business.

All the dumps I've been to have an engine oil disposal sump.

It should have some value in that it can be re-cycled. But with low oil
prices, may not be economic.

--
*Everyone has a photographic memory. Some don't have film *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 09:44:17 +0100
Tim Watts wrote:

All the dumps I've been to have an engine oil disposal sump.

And finally, there is a collection of old gardening powders, paint,
snail repellent etc in our garage. Some of it may be old enough to
qualify as historical and worthy of a museum. But in order to
dispose of it, whereas I would like to just put it all in a box and
take it to my local waste centre, I am supposed to itemise it by
description and quantity, and then call for a Hazmat lorry to come
and collect it, and pay £45 for the privilege.
And they wonder why people fly-tip.

Again - our dump (even the small one) has a special zone for
chemicals.

I envy you your council! It could teach mine a thing or two.

--
Davey.

On 09/04/2017 02:59, Tim+ wrote:
Davey wrote:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...ter-ministers/

At last! It is blatantly clear that part of the cause of fly-tipping is
the fact that it is so difficult to dispose of waste. We used to have a
council-run rubbish/recycling centre near us, then it was closed, then
re-opened under a contractor, who charges £6 per car-load. But it never
seems to be open, so it's impossible to make any plans to go there.

Another problem is where to dispose of used engine oil and coolant.
Both are no-nos for putting down the drain. "Find a willing local
garage" is the advice. No, I want to take it to a place that will
accept it, rather than try to persuade an unwilling garage, with whom
I do no business.

And finally, there is a collection of old gardening powders, paint,
snail repellent etc in our garage. Some of it may be old enough to
qualify as historical and worthy of a museum. But in order to dispose of
it, whereas I would like to just put it all in a box and take it to my
local waste centre, I am supposed to itemise it by description and
quantity, and then call for a Hazmat lorry to come and collect it, and
pay £45 for the privilege.
And they wonder why people fly-tip.


I suspect that the majority of flytipping doesn't come from DIYers though
so I can't see this having a huge impact unfortunately.

It's the tradesmen working on tight margins who will still have the
incentive to flytip. I'd like to see "free" waste disposal for DIYers AND
tradesmen with a turnover less that a certain amount. Of course this would
have to be paid for by rates/community charge/whatever but it would be
worth it to stop this appalling scourge on our countryside.



Then shoot or gas the pikeys.


--
Adam

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Tim Watts wrote:
Another problem is where to dispose of used engine oil and coolant.
Both are no-nos for putting down the drain. "Find a willing local
garage" is the advice. No, I want to take it to a place that will
accept it, rather than try to persuade an unwilling garage, with whom
I do no business.

All the dumps I've been to have an engine oil disposal sump.

It should have some value in that it can be re-cycled. But with low oil
prices, may not be economic.


Many small garages burn it for heating in their boilers.

On 09/04/17 10:01, charles wrote:

The decoprators' merchant where i buy my painsdt also sell a paint
hardening chemical.


Not heard of that - ta

On 09/04/17 11:51, Davey wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 09:44:17 +0100
Tim Watts wrote:

All the dumps I've been to have an engine oil disposal sump.

And finally, there is a collection of old gardening powders, paint,
snail repellent etc in our garage. Some of it may be old enough to
qualify as historical and worthy of a museum. But in order to
dispose of it, whereas I would like to just put it all in a box and
take it to my local waste centre, I am supposed to itemise it by
description and quantity, and then call for a Hazmat lorry to come
and collect it, and pay £45 for the privilege.
And they wonder why people fly-tip.

Again - our dump (even the small one) has a special zone for
chemicals.

I envy you your council! It could teach mine a thing or two.


I'm in Devon right now and I could not believe it when the ice cream
merchant in one of the Haytor rocks car parks on Dartmoor told me there
were no public rubbish bins anywhere on the moor (bar maybe villages).

I counted at least 10 doggie **** bags on the ground, behind rocks, down
cracks.

One of those stupid things - it would be better to let the dog **** on
the ground and leave it there - or better, take a trowel, lift a divot,
shove **** in and replace divot.

Dog **** bags are an utterly stupid idea compared to just leaving it,
IMO, unless you are going to bother providing bins!

Could not believe Devon council are such a bunch of retarded cheapskates
that they cannot be arsed to provide bins in one of the most scenic and
touristy areas in the SW.

Conversely Hamshire council provide ample bins and recycling bins all
over the New Forest.

Brian Gaff wrote:

now we have private companies involved who have to make a profit

They are subcontracted by the council to run the site, TUPE over the
staff etc, so the profit should be from that that, not on raking a few
extra quid from everyone trying to get rid of a tub of rubble etc.

In article ,
Andy Burns wrote:
Brian Gaff wrote:

now we have private companies involved who have to make a profit

They are subcontracted by the council to run the site, TUPE over the
staff etc, so the profit should be from that that, not on raking a few
extra quid from everyone trying to get rid of a tub of rubble etc.

as I understand it, while the operation of the sites is contracted out, it
is the County Council that sets the fees for the disposal of certian
categories of waste.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

On 09/04/2017 11:29, Bob Minchin wrote:

The paint and varnishes I use seem to have it built in!
Whenever I go back to a part used tin the contents are useless.

Store the cans upside down for a day to make a seal.

Bill

In article ,
Tim Watts writes:

What I've done with paint when skipping before (the skip company did not
want liquid paint) is to get loads of cardboard boxes from the
supermarket, and loads of newspapers and line the boxes in the garden
with paper, then pour out the cans into the boxes.

Leave for a couple of days to dry then dispose of as dry waste.

Some of the London council tips take tins of paint, and make then available
for free to poor people who want to do up their properties. The paint
should still be usable (i.e. not stored for 20 years in the garden shed).

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On 09/04/17 14:11, charles wrote:
In article ,
Andy Burns wrote:
Brian Gaff wrote:

now we have private companies involved who have to make a profit

They are subcontracted by the council to run the site, TUPE over the
staff etc, so the profit should be from that that, not on raking a few
extra quid from everyone trying to get rid of a tub of rubble etc.

as I understand it, while the operation of the sites is contracted out, it
is the County Council that sets the fees for the disposal of certian
categories of waste.


Our local tip is contracted out to Veolia and the boss man is the most
helpful chap in the world. That is not necessarily true of all Veolia
sites but they seem to have a work environment that lets a good local
man have enough flexibility to run a helpful service.

Bill Wright wrote:

Bob Minchin wrote:

The paint and varnishes I use seem to have it built in!
Whenever I go back to a part used tin the contents are useless.

Store the cans upside down for a day to make a seal.

Then the next time you lever them open, dried and crust bits will fall
into the remaining paint ...

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Tim+ wrote:
It's the tradesmen working on tight margins who will still have the
incentive to flytip. I'd like to see "free" waste disposal for DIYers
AND tradesmen with a turnover less that a certain amount. Of course this
would have to be paid for by rates/community charge/whatever but it
would be worth it to stop this appalling scourge on our countryside.

And there's the rub. Something must be done - but no one wants to pay for
it.

but we are paying for it anyway

the question is, what's the cheapest way to pay for it

tim

"charles" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Tim Watts wrote:
On 09/04/17 00:40, Davey wrote:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...ter-ministers/

At last! It is blatantly clear that part of the cause of fly-tipping is
the fact that it is so difficult to dispose of waste. We used to have a
council-run rubbish/recycling centre near us, then it was closed, then
re-opened under a contractor, who charges £6 per car-load. But it never
seems to be open, so it's impossible to make any plans to go there.

Another problem is where to dispose of used engine oil and coolant.
Both are no-nos for putting down the drain. "Find a willing local
garage" is the advice. No, I want to take it to a place that will
accept it, rather than try to persuade an unwilling garage, with whom
I do no business.

All the dumps I've been to have an engine oil disposal sump.

And finally, there is a collection of old gardening powders, paint,
snail repellent etc in our garage. Some of it may be old enough to
qualify as historical and worthy of a museum. But in order to dispose
of
it, whereas I would like to just put it all in a box and take it to my
local waste centre, I am supposed to itemise it by description and
quantity, and then call for a Hazmat lorry to come and collect it, and
pay £45 for the privilege.
And they wonder why people fly-tip.

Again - our dump (even the small one) has a special zone for chemicals.

What I've done with paint when skipping before (the skip company did not
want liquid paint) is to get loads of cardboard boxes from the
supermarket, and loads of newspapers and line the boxes in the garden
with paper, then pour out the cans into the boxes.

Leave for a couple of days to dry then dispose of as dry waste.

The decoprators' merchant where i buy my painsdt also sell a paint
hardening chemical.

a book of instructions telling you to leave the lid off

tim

"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message
news
In article ,
Tim Watts writes:

What I've done with paint when skipping before (the skip company did not
want liquid paint) is to get loads of cardboard boxes from the
supermarket, and loads of newspapers and line the boxes in the garden
with paper, then pour out the cans into the boxes.

Leave for a couple of days to dry then dispose of as dry waste.

Some of the London council tips take tins of paint, and make then
available
for free to poor people who want to do up their properties. The paint
should still be usable (i.e. not stored for 20 years in the garden shed).

and the health and safety bods put a stop to it because the tins might not
actually contain paint

tim



--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

Andy Burns wrote:
Bill Wright wrote:

Bob Minchin wrote:

The paint and varnishes I use seem to have it built in!
Whenever I go back to a part used tin the contents are useless.

Store the cans upside down for a day to make a seal.

Then the next time you lever them open, dried and crust bits will fall
into the remaining paint ...

Yes. I found this out to my cost. I just turn the can upside down for a few
seconds to hopefully make a seal.
On the last cans of paint I've stuck some cling film over the tops before
putting the lids back on.
Dunno if this is going to work or not.

On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 17:36:18 +0100, "tim..."
wrote:




AND tradesmen with a turnover less that a certain amount. Of course this
would have to be paid for by rates/community charge/whatever but it
would be worth it to stop this appalling scourge on our countryside.

And there's the rub. Something must be done - but no one wants to pay for
it.

but we are paying for it anyway

Some though are paying more than others, Restrict the times, close a
waste center and start charging for some waste then the County
Councils who run most of them via contractors can point out that the
operation is costing less and they are saving money. Meanwhile the
fly tippers are dumping the waste where a district council has to
clean it up so the costs now fall on them, or if it is dumped on
private land the cost falls on the landowner.
Another stunt that is being pulled is leaving stuff like old broken
furniture or childrens old garden toys etc outside charity shops
though the condition of the items is such that they can not be reused
or sold. So the shops have to pay for disposal.



the question is, what's the cheapest way to pay for it

tim

Via central government so you don't pit one tier of lesser government
against another. And start putting a levy on take away food and drink
containers that just might make the coffee shops and fast food
joints,drink suppliers etc consider the implications that their
profits are because council tax payers are subsidising their business
model by partly picking up the tab for disposing of their containers
when at least some should be washed up and reused .
And if that means some branches close and the Grazers can't get a
fancy Coffee to fawn over every half mile then **** em. They can by a
tartan patterned flask and make their own at home.
That's not DIY waste I appreciate but litter has become the scourge of
many areas.

G.Harman

On Sun, 09 Apr 2017 18:15:26 +0100, damduck-egg wrote:

Some though are paying more than others, Restrict the times, close a
waste center and start charging for some waste then the County Councils
who run most of them via contractors can point out that the operation is
costing less and they are saving money. Meanwhile the fly tippers are
dumping the waste where a district council has to clean it up so the
costs now fall on them, or if it is dumped on private land the cost
falls on the landowner.

I have twice recently been to the local tip, and have been told that the
container I need to use is 'full, mate. Can't take any more'. The place
is designed to allow quick container swaps, with plenty of spare
containers.

This is run by Biffa, who I believe recently won the contract away from
Serco.

--
My posts are my copyright and if @diy_forums or Home Owners' Hub
wish to copy them they can pay me £1 a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
*lightning surge protection* - a w_tom conductor

On 09/04/17 17:36, tim... wrote:


"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Tim+ wrote:
It's the tradesmen working on tight margins who will still have the
incentive to flytip. I'd like to see "free" waste disposal for DIYers
AND tradesmen with a turnover less that a certain amount. Of course this
would have to be paid for by rates/community charge/whatever but it
would be worth it to stop this appalling scourge on our countryside.

And there's the rub. Something must be done - but no one wants to pay for
it.

but we are paying for it anyway

the question is, what's the cheapest way to pay for it


Almost always by avoiding excess government.

I was at one time involved in an EU inspired 'competition' to get grants
to do useful local 'internet stuff'.


3/4 of the grant went on consultants to decide who would get it.

The consultants also worked for BT.

BT got a free market survey telling them where rural interest in
broadband was high.

The actual communities got peanuts.


In the old days rag and bone men collected junk, sorted it into
recyclable scrap and total junk, which was then burnt or taken to the
tip for free burial.

It gave a man some employment and dealt with household waste that wasnt
catered for by the 'dustmen'

The equivalent today is travellers, but they don't take the rest to the
tip do they? Or restrict themselves to what is freely given.

Cue happy song

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7GeZ3YmONw

tim





--
There is something fascinating about science. One gets such wholesale
returns of conjecture out of such a trifling investment of fact.

Mark Twain

On Sunday, 9 April 2017 18:15:30 UTC+1, wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 17:36:18 +0100, "tim..."
wrote:

AND tradesmen with a turnover less that a certain amount. Of course this
would have to be paid for by rates/community charge/whatever but it
would be worth it to stop this appalling scourge on our countryside.

And there's the rub. Something must be done - but no one wants to pay for
it.

but we are paying for it anyway

Some though are paying more than others, Restrict the times, close a
waste center and start charging for some waste then the County
Councils who run most of them via contractors can point out that the
operation is costing less and they are saving money. Meanwhile the
fly tippers are dumping the waste where a district council has to
clean it up so the costs now fall on them, or if it is dumped on
private land the cost falls on the landowner.
Another stunt that is being pulled is leaving stuff like old broken
furniture or childrens old garden toys etc outside charity shops
though the condition of the items is such that they can not be reused
or sold. So the shops have to pay for disposal.



the question is, what's the cheapest way to pay for it

tim

Via central government so you don't pit one tier of lesser government
against another. And start putting a levy on take away food and drink
containers that just might make the coffee shops and fast food
joints,drink suppliers etc consider the implications that their
profits are because council tax payers are subsidising their business
model by partly picking up the tab for disposing of their containers
when at least some should be washed up and reused .
And if that means some branches close and the Grazers can't get a
fancy Coffee to fawn over every half mile then **** em. They can by a
tartan patterned flask and make their own at home.
That's not DIY waste I appreciate but litter has become the scourge of
many areas.

G.Harman

Businesses already minimise waste, with the odd exception. They're not looking to throw money away. There are reasons for the packaging that's used. Taxing them means that tax is passed to the customer, ie all it would be is one more way for government to scam money out of us all. And squander some of it collecting & policing the tax.


NT

On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 13:28:53 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

And start putting a levy on take away food and drink
containers that just might make the coffee shops and fast food
joints,drink suppliers etc consider the implications that their
profits are because council tax payers are subsidising their business
model by partly picking up the tab for disposing of their containers
when at least some should be washed up and reused .
And if that means some branches close and the Grazers can't get a
fancy Coffee to fawn over every half mile then **** em. They can buy a
tartan patterned flask and make their own at home.
That's not DIY waste I appreciate but litter has become the scourge of
many areas.

Businesses already minimise waste, with the odd exception. They're not looking to throw money away. There are reasons for the packaging that's used.
They don't look to throw their own money away , they are quite happy
to provide packaging that if the customer is an irresponsible ****
creates a situation that means most of us end up paying a little to
enable them to trade by having to via council tax pay to clear away
refuse when it has just been thrown on the ground.
That is getting on for a subsidy.



Taxing them means that tax is passed to the customer,
As many of those customers are the ones not disposing of the packaging
properly I can't say that bothers me much.
And those that are not irresponsible , well it may be unfortunate but
perhaps that is the price to pay for the convenience of fast food or
the pretentious ******** that seems to go with having a coffee
nowadays.



ie all it would be is one more way for government to scam money out of us all.
And squander some of it collecting & policing the tax.

Yes they properly would.

G.harman

On Sunday, 9 April 2017 23:29:36 UTC+1, wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 13:28:53 -0700 (PDT), tabbypurr wrote:

And start putting a levy on take away food and drink
containers that just might make the coffee shops and fast food
joints,drink suppliers etc consider the implications that their
profits are because council tax payers are subsidising their business
model by partly picking up the tab for disposing of their containers
when at least some should be washed up and reused .
And if that means some branches close and the Grazers can't get a
fancy Coffee to fawn over every half mile then **** em. They can buy a
tartan patterned flask and make their own at home.
That's not DIY waste I appreciate but litter has become the scourge of
many areas.

Businesses already minimise waste, with the odd exception. They're not looking to throw money away. There are reasons for the packaging that's used.
They don't look to throw their own money away , they are quite happy
to provide packaging that if the customer is an irresponsible ****
creates a situation that means most of us end up paying a little to
enable them to trade by having to via council tax pay to clear away
refuse when it has just been thrown on the ground.
That is getting on for a subsidy.

Taxing them means that tax is passed to the customer,
As many of those customers are the ones not disposing of the packaging
properly I can't say that bothers me much.
And those that are not irresponsible , well it may be unfortunate but
perhaps that is the price to pay for the convenience of fast food or
the pretentious ******** that seems to go with having a coffee
nowadays.



ie all it would be is one more way for government to scam money out of us all.
And squander some of it collecting & policing the tax.

Yes they properly would.

G.harman

All of us buy goods in packaging. So it would be a pointless tax on all of us.


NT

In message , Andy Burns
writes
Bill Wright wrote:

Bob Minchin wrote:

The paint and varnishes I use seem to have it built in!
Whenever I go back to a part used tin the contents are useless.

Store the cans upside down for a day to make a seal.

Then the next time you lever them open, dried and crust bits will fall
into the remaining paint ...

Leave cans upside-down, but check that nothing is leaking. If a crust
forms, it will be at the bottom end of the can.

When you want to use the paint again, you can decant the runny paint off
into another container. [In fact, you can decant only the amount you
think you are going to need.]

If it has thickened, it may need a drop of white spirit or water (as
appropriate), and a good stir.



--
Ian

On Sunday, 9 April 2017 17:36:54 UTC+1, tim... wrote:
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Tim+ wrote:
It's the tradesmen working on tight margins who will still have the
incentive to flytip. I'd like to see "free" waste disposal for DIYers
AND tradesmen with a turnover less that a certain amount. Of course this
would have to be paid for by rates/community charge/whatever but it
would be worth it to stop this appalling scourge on our countryside.

And there's the rub. Something must be done - but no one wants to pay for
it.

but we are paying for it anyway

the question is, what's the cheapest way to pay for it

tim

If we asked the Chinese to take back the empties the customers gathering the fist cause could pay for it except that the industries already doing something similar are the oil importers.

But their supply system is arranged so that they clean their sludge off on the way back and most of it gets dumped around Antarctica where nobody sees it.

I have no doubt that a nation once geared up to murdering grandparents, that moved overnight to murdering children would soon come up with some bright ideas.

wrote:
All of us buy goods in packaging. So it would be a pointless tax on all of us.


NT


The landfill tax already exists so we're paying at the moment anyway!

wrote in message
...
On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 17:36:18 +0100, "tim..."
wrote:




AND tradesmen with a turnover less that a certain amount. Of course
this
would have to be paid for by rates/community charge/whatever but it
would be worth it to stop this appalling scourge on our countryside.

And there's the rub. Something must be done - but no one wants to pay
for
it.

but we are paying for it anyway

Some though are paying more than others, Restrict the times, close a
waste center and start charging for some waste then the County
Councils who run most of them via contractors can point out that the
operation is costing less and they are saving money. Meanwhile the
fly tippers are dumping the waste where a district council has to
clean it up so the costs now fall on them, or if it is dumped on
private land the cost falls on the landowner.
Another stunt that is being pulled is leaving stuff like old broken
furniture or childrens old garden toys etc outside charity shops
though the condition of the items is such that they can not be reused
or sold. So the shops have to pay for disposal.



the question is, what's the cheapest way to pay for it

tim

Via central government so you don't pit one tier of lesser government
against another. And start putting a levy on take away food and drink
containers that just might make the coffee shops and fast food

I honestly don't think that a 10 (or even 20)p levy on a 5 pound (plus)
takeaway is going to make the slightest difference

tim

wrote in message
...
On Sunday, 9 April 2017 18:15:30 UTC+1, wrote:
On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 17:36:18 +0100, "tim..."
wrote:


Businesses already minimise waste, with the odd exception.

Nonsense

they use package for "marketing"

If the marketing value is greater than the cost of the packaging they will
use it, they don't care about the extra costs of disposal because it doesn't
fall on them

You only have to go to Germany to see this. There, the manufactures do have
to pay for the disposal costs of their marketing material, and packaging
really is pared to the bone.

They're not looking to throw money away.

they not - they see an added value in it.

There are reasons for the packaging that's used.

because it provides a widow for marketing

Taxing them means that tax is passed to the customer, ie all it would be
is one more way for government to scam money out of us all.

Didn't work that way in Germany - the unnecessary packaging disappeared at
no costs to the consumer

tim

In article ,
tim... wrote:
Nonsense

they use package for "marketing"

If the marketing value is greater than the cost of the packaging they
will use it, they don't care about the extra costs of disposal because
it doesn't fall on them

Topically, just look at Easter eggs. The packaging apparently - by the
price - adds more value than the contents.

--
*I'm out of my mind, but feel free to leave a message.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 09/04/2017 11:46, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Tim+ wrote:
It's the tradesmen working on tight margins who will still have the
incentive to flytip. I'd like to see "free" waste disposal for DIYers
AND tradesmen with a turnover less that a certain amount. Of course this
would have to be paid for by rates/community charge/whatever but it
would be worth it to stop this appalling scourge on our countryside.

And there's the rub. Something must be done - but no one wants to pay for
it.


Making tips free doesn't stop fly tipping.
The tips are free around here and people still fly tip.
Some people are just too idle to take it to a tip or they choose to go
when its shut and dump it elsewhere.

On 10/04/2017 09:51, Capitol wrote:
wrote:
All of us buy goods in packaging. So it would be a pointless tax on
all of us.


NT


The landfill tax already exists so we're paying at the moment anyway!

Recycle the packaging and there is no landfill tax to pay.
That is why the tax exists.
Some people will not recycle however easy it is so some means of
charging for actual landfill waste is needed.

On 10/04/2017 13:34, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
tim... wrote:
Nonsense

they use package for "marketing"

If the marketing value is greater than the cost of the packaging they
will use it, they don't care about the extra costs of disposal because
it doesn't fall on them

Topically, just look at Easter eggs. The packaging apparently - by the
price - adds more value than the contents.


Look at perfume and after shave, all the "value" is the packaging.