Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded
on timer. The display showed 80 minutes
of recording.

On pressing "play", the head whirred up for
around 20 seconds, an then the VCR when into
"standby" mode.

A little experimentation revealed that this is what
happened regardless of key presses.

In particular, eject didn't work :-(

I removed the case, and noticed that a cam-cog, driven
by a worm gear, appeared to be jamming in some way.

A hefty prod with a finger managed to get it
to travel "fully", and I managed to eject the tape.

Trying to load a (old, unwanted...) tape was futile,
with loading failing with the same jam of the cam-cog,
sometimes accompanied by clicking noises that sounded
like a cog slipping a tooth. The cassette case loaded OK,
and the tape threds over the head OK, but "something"
that the cam-cog does ... doesn't.

The local TV shop has quoted a MINIMUM repair fee of 100 quid,
and VCR's aren't really available on the market right now.

In a bid to save money, and defer the inevitable
(eventual) purchase of a HDD/DVD or PVR box,
I would like to try to get my VCR going again.

It's a five year old Panasonic NV-HS830B, and I've put a wide shot
of the internals, and a close up of the "cam-cog" he

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...830b/video.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...hs830b/cog.jpg

If anyone has tips, advice or experience, I'd be a happy man :-)

BugBear

bugbear wrote:
Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded
on timer. The display showed 80 minutes
of recording.

On pressing "play", the head whirred up for
around 20 seconds, an then the VCR when into
"standby" mode.

A little experimentation revealed that this is what
happened regardless of key presses.

In particular, eject didn't work :-(

I removed the case, and noticed that a cam-cog, driven
by a worm gear, appeared to be jamming in some way.

A hefty prod with a finger managed to get it
to travel "fully", and I managed to eject the tape.

Trying to load a (old, unwanted...) tape was futile,
with loading failing with the same jam of the cam-cog,
sometimes accompanied by clicking noises that sounded
like a cog slipping a tooth. The cassette case loaded OK,
and the tape threds over the head OK, but "something"
that the cam-cog does ... doesn't.

The local TV shop has quoted a MINIMUM repair fee of 100 quid,
and VCR's aren't really available on the market right now.

In a bid to save money, and defer the inevitable
(eventual) purchase of a HDD/DVD or PVR box,
I would like to try to get my VCR going again.

It's a five year old Panasonic NV-HS830B, and I've put a wide shot
of the internals, and a close up of the "cam-cog" he

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...830b/video.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...hs830b/cog.jpg

If anyone has tips, advice or experience, I'd be a happy man :-)

BugBear
Two or three suggestions:
1. Sign up to your local freecycle group - http://www.freecycle.org - as
people are giving VCRs and CRT TVs away for free now - I just passed on
a VCR this way myself.
2. Use eBay to buy a replacement - remember, they are worth very little
now (see 1)
3. Buy a DVD Recorder and borrow a VHS player and move all your tapes to
DVD - I am now VHSless.

Paul R

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Wed, 05 Sep 2007 09:01:19 +0100, bugbear
wrote:

Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded
on timer. The display showed 80 minutes
of recording.

On pressing "play", the head whirred up for
around 20 seconds, an then the VCR when into
"standby" mode.

A little experimentation revealed that this is what
happened regardless of key presses.

In particular, eject didn't work :-(

I removed the case, and noticed that a cam-cog, driven
by a worm gear, appeared to be jamming in some way.

A hefty prod with a finger managed to get it
to travel "fully", and I managed to eject the tape.

Trying to load a (old, unwanted...) tape was futile,
with loading failing with the same jam of the cam-cog,
sometimes accompanied by clicking noises that sounded
like a cog slipping a tooth. The cassette case loaded OK,
and the tape threds over the head OK, but "something"
that the cam-cog does ... doesn't.

The local TV shop has quoted a MINIMUM repair fee of 100 quid,
and VCR's aren't really available on the market right now.

In a bid to save money, and defer the inevitable
(eventual) purchase of a HDD/DVD or PVR box,
I would like to try to get my VCR going again.

It's a five year old Panasonic NV-HS830B, and I've put a wide shot
of the internals, and a close up of the "cam-cog" he

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...830b/video.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...hs830b/cog.jpg

If anyone has tips, advice or experience, I'd be a happy man :-)

BugBear

Well, I can't really help, but I had a JVC VCR that had a similar
problem, but I though it might've been a sensor not detecting the tape
properly. It's not worth paying £100 to get it repaired. I got a
lovely used JVC VCR off Ebay for £20 (top of the range, S-VHS) so I
think that would be your best bet if you need another VCR. Also, try
to look for another Panasonic, so there are no problems playing back
stuff you recorded on your old VCR. My recordings of the JVC don't
play as well on other brands of VCR.

Marky P.

bugbear wrote:

VCR's aren't really available on the market right now.

Try your local Tesco.

Peter

bugbear wrote:

If anyone has tips, advice or experience, I'd be a happy man :-)

BugBear

Post this to sci.electronics.repair

--
Adrian C

In article , Bugbear wrote:
Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded
on timer. The display showed 80 minutes
of recording.
[...]
The local TV shop has quoted a MINIMUM repair fee of 100 quid,
and VCR's aren't really available on the market right now.

Richer Sounds are selling a 6 head Nicam stereo VHS for £59.95, and
there are probably a few others if you do an online search.

In a bid to save money, and defer the inevitable
(eventual) purchase of a HDD/DVD or PVR box,
I would like to try to get my VCR going again.

Don't waste your time. I had a 10 year old VHS that went crunch in a
similar manner, a small plastic component having snapped. I've tried
repairing plastic cogs before, and it never works. Glue doesn't stick,
there isn't room to bolt or splint anything, and it's extremely
unlikely you'll be able to buy a replacement part. You can buy a brand
new machine for less than the cost of repairing the old one (if it's
even possible to repair it at all).

My only need for a VHS now is to make the occasional transfer to disk,
so I just got the cheapest one I could find that could do stereo
playback, but if you have no archive material on tape, your decision is
even easier. Disk recorders are a bit more expensive, but you'd be
buying one someday soon anyway.

Rod.

Adrian C wrote:
bugbear wrote:

If anyone has tips, advice or experience, I'd be a happy man :-)

BugBear

Post this to sci.electronics.repair


So many forums that I didn't know about :-)

- thanks

BugBear

(reposted to pick up sci.electronics.repair)

bugbear wrote:
Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded
on timer. The display showed 80 minutes
of recording.

On pressing "play", the head whirred up for
around 20 seconds, an then the VCR when into
"standby" mode.

A little experimentation revealed that this is what
happened regardless of key presses.

In particular, eject didn't work :-(

I removed the case, and noticed that a cam-cog, driven
by a worm gear, appeared to be jamming in some way.

A hefty prod with a finger managed to get it
to travel "fully", and I managed to eject the tape.

Trying to load a (old, unwanted...) tape was futile,
with loading failing with the same jam of the cam-cog,
sometimes accompanied by clicking noises that sounded
like a cog slipping a tooth. The cassette case loaded OK,
and the tape threds over the head OK, but "something"
that the cam-cog does ... doesn't.

The local TV shop has quoted a MINIMUM repair fee of 100 quid,
and VCR's aren't really available on the market right now.

In a bid to save money, and defer the inevitable
(eventual) purchase of a HDD/DVD or PVR box,
I would like to try to get my VCR going again.

It's a five year old Panasonic NV-HS830B, and I've put a wide shot
of the internals, and a close up of the "cam-cog" he

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...830b/video.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...hs830b/cog.jpg

If anyone has tips, advice or experience, I'd be a happy man :-)

BugBear

bugbear brought next idea :
Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded
on timer. The display showed 80 minutes
of recording.

On pressing "play", the head whirred up for
around 20 seconds, an then the VCR when into
"standby" mode.

A little experimentation revealed that this is what
happened regardless of key presses.

In particular, eject didn't work :-(

I removed the case, and noticed that a cam-cog, driven
by a worm gear, appeared to be jamming in some way.

A hefty prod with a finger managed to get it
to travel "fully", and I managed to eject the tape.

Trying to load a (old, unwanted...) tape was futile,
with loading failing with the same jam of the cam-cog,
sometimes accompanied by clicking noises that sounded
like a cog slipping a tooth. The cassette case loaded OK,
and the tape threds over the head OK, but "something"
that the cam-cog does ... doesn't.

The local TV shop has quoted a MINIMUM repair fee of 100 quid,
and VCR's aren't really available on the market right now.

In a bid to save money, and defer the inevitable
(eventual) purchase of a HDD/DVD or PVR box,
I would like to try to get my VCR going again.

It's a five year old Panasonic NV-HS830B, and I've put a wide shot
of the internals, and a close up of the "cam-cog" he

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...830b/video.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...hs830b/cog.jpg

If anyone has tips, advice or experience, I'd be a happy man :-)

BugBear

The last VCR we bought cost around £40 new, so certainly not worth the
expense of repairing. As others have suggested, try your local
Freecycle for a free VCR and then transfer over to DVD's.

--

Regards,
Harry (M1BYT) (L)
http://www.ukradioamateur.co.uk

In message , Paul R
writes
bugbear wrote:
Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...hs830b/cog.jpg
If anyone has tips, advice or experience, I'd be a happy man :-)
BugBear
Two or three suggestions:
1. Sign up to your local freecycle group - http://www.freecycle.org -
as people are giving VCRs and CRT TVs away for free now - I just passed
on a VCR this way myself.
2. Use eBay to buy a replacement - remember, they are worth very little
now (see 1)
3. Buy a DVD Recorder and borrow a VHS player and move all your tapes
to DVD - I am now VHSless.

Paul R


Or something like this

http://www.richersounds.com/showprod...t&pid=LG-RC278


I took three video recorders to the tip last week

--
geoff

"bugbear" wrote in message
...
Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded
on timer. The display showed 80 minutes
of recording.

On pressing "play", the head whirred up for
around 20 seconds, an then the VCR when into
"standby" mode.

A little experimentation revealed that this is what
happened regardless of key presses.

In particular, eject didn't work :-(

I removed the case, and noticed that a cam-cog, driven
by a worm gear, appeared to be jamming in some way.

A hefty prod with a finger managed to get it
to travel "fully", and I managed to eject the tape.

Trying to load a (old, unwanted...) tape was futile,
with loading failing with the same jam of the cam-cog,
sometimes accompanied by clicking noises that sounded
like a cog slipping a tooth. The cassette case loaded OK,
and the tape threds over the head OK, but "something"
that the cam-cog does ... doesn't.

The local TV shop has quoted a MINIMUM repair fee of 100 quid,
and VCR's aren't really available on the market right now.

In a bid to save money, and defer the inevitable
(eventual) purchase of a HDD/DVD or PVR box,
I would like to try to get my VCR going again.

It's a five year old Panasonic NV-HS830B, and I've put a wide shot
of the internals, and a close up of the "cam-cog" he

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...830b/video.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...hs830b/cog.jpg

If anyone has tips, advice or experience, I'd be a happy man :-)


The common fault with that particular model (Z deck) is teeth stripping on
the tu loading arm.

The parts are relatively cheap (under a fiver) and pretty easy to replace, I
used to do them trade for about £18.00.. however as others have pointed out,
although they are a very nice vcr when one considers what a DVD recorder or
lower end PVR can now be purchased for, even if you could find someone to
repair it for around £30.00 it wouldn't nowadays be considered to be a
worthwhile proposition.



BugBear

Ivan wrote:

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...830b/video.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...hs830b/cog.jpg

If anyone has tips, advice or experience, I'd be a happy man :-)


The common fault with that particular model (Z deck) is teeth stripping
on the tu loading arm.

The parts are relatively cheap (under a fiver) and pretty easy to
replace, I used to do them trade for about £18.00.. however as others
have pointed out, although they are a very nice vcr when one considers
what a DVD recorder or lower end PVR can now be purchased for, even if
you could find someone to repair it for around £30.00 it wouldn't
nowadays be considered to be a worthwhile proposition.

Since I'd like to defer the PVR/HDD/DVD decision for a bit
(AV is still an expensive minefield), would you care to point me
at a parts source and/or manual ?

I mean, the broken VCR is currently worthless,
so I can't reduce it's value by trying to repair
(and failing) to repair it!

BugBear

"bugbear" wrote in message
...

Since I'd like to defer the PVR/HDD/DVD decision for a bit
(AV is still an expensive minefield), would you care to point me
at a parts source and/or manual ?

I mean, the broken VCR is currently worthless,
so I can't reduce it's value by trying to repair
(and failing) to repair it!


Whilst I can't say with absolute certainty that this is the problem with
your VCR, in my experience it's by far and away the most likely cause of the
problems you describe.
Unfortunately I no longer have any trade contacts as (due to illness) I'm
now retired however I've supplied a link where the part can be obtained, oh
and make sure you get the teeth located correctly first time, otherwise
you're likely to end up with even more grief!


http://tinyurl.com/2f5zqc


BugBear

Ivan wrote:

"bugbear" wrote in message
...

Since I'd like to defer the PVR/HDD/DVD decision for a bit
(AV is still an expensive minefield), would you care to point me
at a parts source and/or manual ?

I mean, the broken VCR is currently worthless,
so I can't reduce it's value by trying to repair
(and failing) to repair it!


Whilst I can't say with absolute certainty that this is the problem with
your VCR, in my experience it's by far and away the most likely cause of
the problems you describe.
Unfortunately I no longer have any trade contacts as (due to illness)
I'm now retired however I've supplied a link where the part can be
obtained, oh and make sure you get the teeth located correctly first
time, otherwise you're likely to end up with even more grief!


http://tinyurl.com/2f5zqc

Thanks; I can't see that part on my picture (handy having a hi-res
picture at work!)

Somewhere near here?

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...hs830b/cog.jpg

(overall picture...
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...830b/video.jpg
)

BugBear

"bugbear" wrote in message
...
Ivan wrote:

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...830b/video.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...hs830b/cog.jpg

If anyone has tips, advice or experience, I'd be a happy man :-)


The common fault with that particular model (Z deck) is teeth stripping
on the tu loading arm.

The parts are relatively cheap (under a fiver) and pretty easy to
replace, I used to do them trade for about £18.00.. however as others
have pointed out, although they are a very nice vcr when one considers
what a DVD recorder or lower end PVR can now be purchased for, even if
you could find someone to repair it for around £30.00 it wouldn't
nowadays be considered to be a worthwhile proposition.

Since I'd like to defer the PVR/HDD/DVD decision for a bit
(AV is still an expensive minefield), would you care to point me
at a parts source and/or manual ?

I mean, the broken VCR is currently worthless,
so I can't reduce it's value by trying to repair
(and failing) to repair it!



Apologies 'forget' my previous posts, I've just had a look at the photos you
provided and unfortunately had a different deck (Z) associated with the
model number that you provided.

Some common problems on the deck in your photographs is the small plastic
coupling device on the loading motor spindle which fits inside the worm
gear, reasonably simple to replace including replacing the mode switch
(which is essential to line up correctly) whilst you've got it all apart.

A rarer occurrence can be the teeth stripping on the plastic sliding rack,
which to replace could be somewhat difficult and would be best not to become
involved with.

The main cam (visible in the right hand top of the photo) can also become
broken underneath and may need replacing.

All of these problems aren't too bad once you've done a few and you have the
proper Panasonic repair manuals however for the uninitiated it would
probably be best to follow the herd and relegate it to the nearest landfill.



HTH Ivan


BugBear

Ivan wrote:

"bugbear" wrote in message
...
Ivan wrote:

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...830b/video.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f2...hs830b/cog.jpg

If anyone has tips, advice or experience, I'd be a happy man :-)


The common fault with that particular model (Z deck) is teeth
stripping on the tu loading arm.

The parts are relatively cheap (under a fiver) and pretty easy to
replace, I used to do them trade for about £18.00.. however as others
have pointed out, although they are a very nice vcr when one
considers what a DVD recorder or lower end PVR can now be purchased
for, even if you could find someone to repair it for around £30.00 it
wouldn't nowadays be considered to be a worthwhile proposition.

Since I'd like to defer the PVR/HDD/DVD decision for a bit
(AV is still an expensive minefield), would you care to point me
at a parts source and/or manual ?

I mean, the broken VCR is currently worthless,
so I can't reduce it's value by trying to repair
(and failing) to repair it!



Apologies 'forget' my previous posts, I've just had a look at the photos
you provided and unfortunately had a different deck (Z) associated with
the model number that you provided.

Some common problems on the deck in your photographs is the small
plastic coupling device on the loading motor spindle which fits inside
the worm gear, reasonably simple to replace including replacing the
mode switch (which is essential to line up correctly) whilst you've got
it all apart.

A rarer occurrence can be the teeth stripping on the plastic sliding
rack, which to replace could be somewhat difficult and would be best not
to become involved with.

The main cam (visible in the right hand top of the photo) can also
become broken underneath and may need replacing.

All of these problems aren't too bad once you've done a few and you have
the proper Panasonic repair manuals however for the uninitiated it would
probably be best to follow the herd and relegate it to the nearest
landfill.

When I dumped my 20 year old portable tv I bought an even older one on
EBay for £2, which I suppose saves one unit from landfill.

bugbear wrote:
Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded
Its last century's electro-mechanical technology. Dump it and get
something modern.
Skip DVD recorders which are last year's gadgets and get a harddisk
recorder. You'll be amazed at the difference in functionality.
Can you still get VHS tapes anywhere except charity shops?
In fact I still have VCR which cost £400 in 1997 but I haven't used it
for 2 years as the quality is no longer acceptable.

In message , OldBill
writes
bugbear wrote:
Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded
Its last century's electro-mechanical technology. Dump it and get
something modern.
Skip DVD recorders which are last year's gadgets and get a harddisk
recorder.

So what do you record to then ?

HDD/DVD

You'll be amazed at the difference in functionality.
Can you still get VHS tapes anywhere except charity shops?

Yeah - me I have thousands

In fact I still have VCR which cost £400 in 1997 but I haven't used it
for 2 years as the quality is no longer acceptable.

--
geoff

On Thu, 06 Sep 2007 21:23:37 +0100, OldBill
wrote:

bugbear wrote:
Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded
Its last century's electro-mechanical technology. Dump it and get
something modern.
Skip DVD recorders which are last year's gadgets and get a harddisk
recorder. You'll be amazed at the difference in functionality.
Can you still get VHS tapes anywhere except charity shops?
In fact I still have VCR which cost £400 in 1997 but I haven't used it
for 2 years as the quality is no longer acceptable.

I remember when my parents bought their first VCR in 1987. I had
never seen a VCR picture before close up (saw 'em at school, but TV
was a good 20 foot away) and I was surprised at how bad the picturte
quality was. I was expecting close to broadcast quality, but I was
only 15 at the time.

Marky P.

On Sep 5, 9:01 am, bugbear wrote:
and VCR's aren't really available on the market right now.

Don't be silly!

MBQ

On Sep 6, 9:23 pm, OldBill wrote:
bugbear wrote:
Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded

Its last century's electro-mechanical technology. Dump it and get
something modern.
Skip DVD recorders which are last year's gadgets and get a harddisk
recorder.

How do you archive material when the disk is full? What happens when
the disk fails and you lose everything as you were unable to archive
all your favourite material?

I suggest you keep the DVD recorder.

MBQ

On Fri, 07 Sep 2007 01:39:49 -0700, "
wrote:

How do you archive material when the disk is full? What happens when
the disk fails and you lose everything as you were unable to archive
all your favourite material?

I suggest you keep the DVD recorder.

I have a Toppy and a DVD recorder, but when I want to archive
anything, I just copy it to my PC via USB, where I can watch it at
broadcast quality. The DVD recorder is just going to waste.
--
Andrew, contact via http://interpleb.googlepages.com
Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
please don't top post. Trim replies to quote only relevant text.
Check groups.google.com before asking an obvious question.

In article , OldBill
scribeth thus
bugbear wrote:
Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded
Its last century's electro-mechanical technology. Dump it and get
something modern.
Skip DVD recorders which are last year's gadgets and get a harddisk
recorder. You'll be amazed at the difference in functionality.
Can you still get VHS tapes anywhere except charity shops?
In fact I still have VCR which cost £400 in 1997 but I haven't used it
for 2 years as the quality is no longer acceptable.

Should clean the heads then Do bear in mind that should you need to
take that recording elsewhere or send it to someone, its a bit tedious
sending a hard drive!.

Course hard disk recording is still electro mechanical and hard drives
can and do fail;!....
--
Tony Sayer

"tony sayer" wrote in message
...
In article , OldBill
scribeth thus
bugbear wrote:
Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded
Its last century's electro-mechanical technology. Dump it and get
something modern.
Skip DVD recorders which are last year's gadgets and get a harddisk
recorder. You'll be amazed at the difference in functionality.
Can you still get VHS tapes anywhere except charity shops?
In fact I still have VCR which cost £400 in 1997 but I haven't used it
for 2 years as the quality is no longer acceptable.

Should clean the heads then Do bear in mind that should you need to
take that recording elsewhere or send it to someone, its a bit tedious
sending a hard drive!.

Course hard disk recording is still electro mechanical and hard drives
can and do fail;!....

Flash memory devices are steadily increasing in capacity whilst the price
has dropped dramatically (SD cards now up to 8 GB) However I do have to
admit not being up to speed on these kind of developments, so I'd like to
ask the more knowledgeable on this group 'is there any major technical
reason why some kind of memory card can't became a De Facto interchangeable
standard on millions of PVR's around the world, maybe coupled with MPEG4?.
especially as it's almost certain that not only will memory capacity
continue to improve but prices will also plummet.


--
Tony Sayer

In article , Ivan wrote:
Flash memory devices are steadily increasing in capacity whilst the price*
has dropped dramatically (SD cards now up to 8 GB) However I do have to*
admit not being up to speed on these kind of developments, so I'd like to*
ask the more knowledgeable on this group 'is there any major technical*
reason why some kind of memory card can't became a De Facto interchangeable*
standard on millions of PVR's around the world, maybe coupled with MPEG4?.*
especially as it's almost certain that not only will memory capacity*
continue to improve but prices will also plummet.

SD already is a sort of de facto standard for storing material on all sorts of
gadgets, mostly pocket ones, though I suspect it is used a lot less frequently
for exchange of data between gadgets, because mostly people just want to swap
the occasional snapshot, and they can use bluetooth or MMS for that. For
swapping stuff between computers, the USB dongle drive seems pretty popular.
Whatever is cheapest and easiest to use will always be the one most people
use, and in five years time there will be something completely different, and
Sony will invent their own incompatible version of the same thing, then a
smaller one that needs an adaptor, and so on.

Rod.

"Andrew" wrote...
" wrote:

How do you archive material when the disk is full? What happens when
the disk fails and you lose everything as you were unable to archive
all your favourite material?

I suggest you keep the DVD recorder.

I have a Toppy and a DVD recorder, but when I want to archive
anything, I just copy it to my PC via USB, where I can watch it at
broadcast quality. The DVD recorder is just going to waste.

Ditto for me, changing "Toppy" to "Hummy". I make DVDs on the computer
and use my DVD recorder mainly just as a player.

Matti

Ivan wrote:

"tony sayer" wrote in message
...
In article , OldBill
scribeth thus
bugbear wrote:
Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded
Its last century's electro-mechanical technology. Dump it and get
something modern.
Skip DVD recorders which are last year's gadgets and get a harddisk
recorder. You'll be amazed at the difference in functionality.
Can you still get VHS tapes anywhere except charity shops?
In fact I still have VCR which cost £400 in 1997 but I haven't used it
for 2 years as the quality is no longer acceptable.

Should clean the heads then Do bear in mind that should you need to
take that recording elsewhere or send it to someone, its a bit tedious
sending a hard drive!.

Course hard disk recording is still electro mechanical and hard drives
can and do fail;!....

Flash memory devices are steadily increasing in capacity whilst the
price has dropped dramatically (SD cards now up to 8 GB) However I do
have to admit not being up to speed on these kind of developments, so
I'd like to ask the more knowledgeable on this group 'is there any major
technical reason why some kind of memory card can't became a De Facto
interchangeable standard on millions of PVR's around the world, maybe
coupled with MPEG4?. especially as it's almost certain that not only
will memory capacity continue to improve but prices will also plummet.

The average size of an divx/xvid feature film is well under 1 gb. I
don't know what the quality would be like on a 40" tv, but they're fine
on a 24".

wrote in message
ps.com...
On Sep 6, 9:23 pm, OldBill wrote:
bugbear wrote:
Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded

Its last century's electro-mechanical technology. Dump it and get
something modern.
Skip DVD recorders which are last year's gadgets and get a harddisk
recorder.

How do you archive material when the disk is full? What happens when
the disk fails and you lose everything as you were unable to archive
all your favourite material?

Archive? What's the point of that then? It's just telly - seen it once, no
need to see it again.

(anyway you can transfer from HD to DVD, easily if you've got something
which does it, but still possible if you haven't).

cheers,
clive

bugbear wrote:
Post this to sci.electronics.repair


So many forums that I didn't know about :-)

- thanks

BugBear

Hi BugBear,

Could you repost this as a new post (without the crossposts) to
sci.electronics.repair alone?

Title it as "Panasonic VCR NV-HS830B - loading problems"

The VCR Techs who haunt over there will pick up on that...

The "scrap it and get a DVD/PVR" noise is not helping your plight!

--
Adrian C

"Stuart Noble" wrote in message
...
Ivan wrote:

"tony sayer" wrote in message
...
In article , OldBill
scribeth thus
bugbear wrote:
Two nights ago my VCR refused to play a tape;
the tape was already in, and had been recorded
Its last century's electro-mechanical technology. Dump it and get
something modern.
Skip DVD recorders which are last year's gadgets and get a harddisk
recorder. You'll be amazed at the difference in functionality.
Can you still get VHS tapes anywhere except charity shops?
In fact I still have VCR which cost £400 in 1997 but I haven't used it
for 2 years as the quality is no longer acceptable.

Should clean the heads then Do bear in mind that should you need to
take that recording elsewhere or send it to someone, its a bit tedious
sending a hard drive!.

Course hard disk recording is still electro mechanical and hard drives
can and do fail;!....

Flash memory devices are steadily increasing in capacity whilst the price
has dropped dramatically (SD cards now up to 8 GB) However I do have to
admit not being up to speed on these kind of developments, so I'd like to
ask the more knowledgeable on this group 'is there any major technical
reason why some kind of memory card can't became a De Facto
interchangeable standard on millions of PVR's around the world, maybe
coupled with MPEG4?. especially as it's almost certain that not only will
memory capacity continue to improve but prices will also plummet.

The average size of an divx/xvid feature film is well under 1 gb. I don't
know what the quality would be like on a 40" tv, but they're fine on a
24".


Yes, I have Toshiba portable portable LCD TV which has a card slot and will
play DivX and MPEG4, it has a composite output for TV which produces
respectable pictures on a 28" widescreen telly from a 2 GB SD card, (I saw
some 2 GB cards being sold on one of the shopping channels a few days ago at
£11.00 each) this is what set me thinking as it seems a logical way to go,
especially when considering that people's biggest complaint by far about
PVRs is transferability and their inability to archive material, even many
very cheap items such as printers now have card slots built in as standard.

In article , Huge wrote:
How do you archive material when the disk is full? What happens when
the disk fails and you lose everything as you were unable to archive
all your favourite material?

Archive? What's the point of that then? It's just telly - seen it once, no*
need to see it again.

Good Lhord. What a barbarian. I watch some movies over and over again.

And there's music of course. Lots of people listen to it over and over again.

Rod.

"Huge" wrote in message
...
On 2007-09-07, Clive George wrote:
wrote in message
ps.com...

How do you archive material when the disk is full? What happens when
the disk fails and you lose everything as you were unable to archive
all your favourite material?

Archive? What's the point of that then? It's just telly - seen it once,
no
need to see it again.

Good Lhord. What a barbarian. I watch some movies over and over again.

Hmm. I'm more amenable to seeing things more than once than my wife, but
I've still never gone for the collection of films-which-you've-seen which
seem to be so popular. There's a sufficient turnover of stuff to watch
compared to the amount I actually do watch that I never run out.

Then again, I watch the films - unlike some (not by implication you) who
treat them as background.

Music is different though.

cheers,
clive

"Clive George" wrote in message
...
"Huge" wrote in message
...

Good Lhord. What a barbarian. I watch some movies over and over again.

Hmm. I'm more amenable to seeing things more than once than my wife, but
I've still never gone for the collection of films-which-you've-seen which
seem to be so popular. There's a sufficient turnover of stuff to watch
compared to the amount I actually do watch that I never run out.

That's not how it works.

The presence of a film on the shelf (and the equipment to play it) means you
never actually have to watch it.

Douglas Adams correctly pointed out that a VCR is a time-saving device.

--
Max Demian

"Roderick Stewart" wrote in message
.. .
In article , Ivan wrote:
Flash memory devices are steadily increasing in capacity whilst the price
has dropped dramatically (SD cards now up to 8 GB) However I do have to
admit not being up to speed on these kind of developments, so I'd like to
ask the more knowledgeable on this group 'is there any major technical
reason why some kind of memory card can't became a De Facto
interchangeable
standard on millions of PVR's around the world, maybe coupled with
MPEG4?.
especially as it's almost certain that not only will memory capacity
continue to improve but prices will also plummet.

SD already is a sort of de facto standard for storing material on all
sorts of
gadgets, mostly pocket ones, though I suspect it is used a lot less
frequently
for exchange of data between gadgets, because mostly people just want to
swap
the occasional snapshot, and they can use bluetooth or MMS for that. For
swapping stuff between computers, the USB dongle drive seems pretty
popular.
Whatever is cheapest and easiest to use will always be the one most people
use, and in five years time there will be something completely different,
and
Sony will invent their own incompatible version of the same thing, then a
smaller one that needs an adaptor, and so on.

So Rod it would appear that apart from cost technically there is absolutely
no reason why the SD card couldn't be king in the PVR world.

This evening I did a bit of experimentation, I converted an hour long TV
programme from my Humax (.TS files) to MPEG 2 and transferred them to a 2 GB
SD card, the total file size was 1.45 GB, and the results on my my 28" w/s
appeared to be equally as good as when played back from the original HD
(allowing for the fact that my Toshiba player only outputs composite video).

I know very little about MPEG 4 but I'm assuming that it's more efficient
than MPEG 2, so it follows that the file sizes would be smaller, can you
give me a rough idea by how much and would be resultant picture quality be
as good as with MPEG 2?

Cheers Ivan


Rod.

Ivan wrote:

"Roderick Stewart" wrote in message
.. .
In article , Ivan wrote:
Flash memory devices are steadily increasing in capacity whilst the
price
has dropped dramatically (SD cards now up to 8 GB) However I do have to
admit not being up to speed on these kind of developments, so I'd
like to
ask the more knowledgeable on this group 'is there any major technical
reason why some kind of memory card can't became a De Facto
interchangeable
standard on millions of PVR's around the world, maybe coupled with
MPEG4?.
especially as it's almost certain that not only will memory capacity
continue to improve but prices will also plummet.

SD already is a sort of de facto standard for storing material on all
sorts of
gadgets, mostly pocket ones, though I suspect it is used a lot less
frequently
for exchange of data between gadgets, because mostly people just want
to swap
the occasional snapshot, and they can use bluetooth or MMS for that. For
swapping stuff between computers, the USB dongle drive seems pretty
popular.
Whatever is cheapest and easiest to use will always be the one most
people
use, and in five years time there will be something completely
different, and
Sony will invent their own incompatible version of the same thing, then a
smaller one that needs an adaptor, and so on.

So Rod it would appear that apart from cost technically there is
absolutely no reason why the SD card couldn't be king in the PVR world.

This evening I did a bit of experimentation, I converted an hour long TV
programme from my Humax (.TS files) to MPEG 2 and transferred them to a
2 GB SD card, the total file size was 1.45 GB, and the results on my my
28" w/s appeared to be equally as good as when played back from the
original HD (allowing for the fact that my Toshiba player only outputs
composite video).

I know very little about MPEG 4 but I'm assuming that it's more
efficient than MPEG 2, so it follows that the file sizes would be
smaller, can you give me a rough idea by how much and would be resultant
picture quality be as good as with MPEG 2?

Cheers Ivan


Rod.


An awful lot of info on here

http://www.videohelp.com/

if you're *really* interested in the technology. Not for the
fainthearted though.

Max Demian wrote:
"Clive George" wrote in message
...
"Huge" wrote in message
...

Good Lhord. What a barbarian. I watch some movies over and over again.
Hmm. I'm more amenable to seeing things more than once than my wife, but
I've still never gone for the collection of films-which-you've-seen which
seem to be so popular. There's a sufficient turnover of stuff to watch
compared to the amount I actually do watch that I never run out.

That's not how it works.

The presence of a film on the shelf (and the equipment to play it) means you
never actually have to watch it.

Douglas Adams correctly pointed out that a VCR is a time-saving device.

:-)

In article , Ivan wrote:
Sony will invent their own incompatible version of the same thing, then a
smaller one that needs an adaptor, and so on.

So Rod it would appear that apart from cost technically there is absolutely*
no reason why the SD card couldn't be king in the PVR world.

No practical reason at all as far as I can see. SD cards with capacities of
4GB (and rising) are readily available now, and the more we buy, the cheaper
they will become. The more people use them, the more gadgets and adaptors will
be produced to handle them. It all depends on what people want.

Rod.

"Roderick Stewart" wrote in message
.. .
In article , Ivan wrote:
Sony will invent their own incompatible version of the same thing, then
a
smaller one that needs an adaptor, and so on.

So Rod it would appear that apart from cost technically there is
absolutely
no reason why the SD card couldn't be king in the PVR world.

No practical reason at all as far as I can see. SD cards with capacities
of
Your new home sales in our home see why are you or are you so you CEDIA by
the by line or year's work or home And is that to the you know who or where
are you know how the mass on the are you why 4GB (and rising) are readily
available now, and the more we buy, the cheaper
they will become. The more people use them, the more gadgets and adaptors
will
be produced to handle them. It all depends on what people want.

Yes I was thinking that something along the lines of a 4 GB SD card becoming
the equivalent of a much higher quality VHS 4 hour tape, but with some kind
of LP option for maybe 8 hours of standard VHS quality. Are you why are you

It would be a simple matter of an onscreen menu asking if the user would
like to transfer program/s to card.. So all it needs now then is for
Topfield and Humax to get their heads together and incorporate an optional
standardised card slot on their new models, I couldn't see it adding much
more than a tenner in the way of additional hardware.


Rod.

In article , Roderick
Stewart scribeth thus
In article , Ivan wrote:
Sony will invent their own incompatible version of the same thing, then a
smaller one that needs an adaptor, and so on.

So Rod it would appear that apart from cost technically there is absolutely*
no reason why the SD card couldn't be king in the PVR world.

No practical reason at all as far as I can see. SD cards with capacities of
4GB (and rising) are readily available now, and the more we buy, the cheaper
they will become. The more people use them, the more gadgets and adaptors will
be produced to handle them. It all depends on what people want.

Rod.


NE1 any experience of getting a windows PC to boot from a flash card or
flash type memory at all?...
--
Tony Sayer

On 2007-09-08 12:12:14 +0100, tony sayer said:

NE1 any experience of getting a windows PC to boot from a flash card or
flash type memory at all?...

Yes you can do it most easily with a compact flash card or equivalent
plus an adaptor that emulates an IDE interface.

However, this may not be very long lived. The problem is that the
Windows monitor writes temporary and other files all over the place and
generally makes a mess. Flash memory devices often have a limited
number of allowable read/write cycles before going tits up.

The technique is much easier to do with operating systems. For
example, with Linux, one can mount all of the filesystems bar one as
read-only. During boot, a Ramdisk is created and files that need to
be RW or temporary files can be put on that. I have this working in
a little dedicated, embedded machine used as a terminal server. It
even has a watchdog timer to reboot if ever needed, but it hasn't been
so far in two years.

If you want to do an embedded type of application, there are some
products around optimised with what's needed. I've used Advantech
stuff a few times with good results.