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Electronics Repair (sci.electronics.repair) Discussion of repairing electronic equipment. Topics include requests for assistance, where to obtain servicing information and parts, techniques for diagnosis and repair, and annecdotes about success, failures and problems. |
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#1
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Can I Record Audio onto the Video Tracks of my VHS Video Recorder?
Hi,
I sometimes record radio shows onto video cassette with my VHS VCR, enjoying the benefits of being able to record at a pre-programmed time and the long, continuous recording time that that brings. I record onto the audio tracks from a SCART patch cable hooked into the headphones socket of a radio, and, although the VCR is not Hi-Fi stereo, the results sound fine to me (and I only tend to record documentaries anyway). I was wondering if and how I could record audio onto the video tracks as surely this would make for much better audio (given a high-quality audio source, of course) and would be better for music shows. I had a look on the web but couldn't find anything except mainly for a site about Betamax recorders where a 'Sony PCM add-on' was used. I have only a little knowledge of these things and would love to hear from anyone about my problem. Thanks a lot. Yours, Gary Hayward. |
#2
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"Gazza" wrote in message ... | Hi, | | I sometimes record radio shows onto video cassette with my VHS VCR, enjoying .... | only tend to record documentaries anyway). I was wondering if and how I | could record audio onto the video tracks as surely this would make for much Use a HiFi VHS (stereo) and use the stereo inputs. Same result - you are using the spinning head. N |
#3
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NSM wrote:
"Gazza" wrote in message ... | Hi, | | I sometimes record radio shows onto video cassette with my VHS VCR, enjoying ... | only tend to record documentaries anyway). I was wondering if and how I | could record audio onto the video tracks as surely this would make for much Use a HiFi VHS (stereo) and use the stereo inputs. Same result - you are using the spinning head. N Hi, Thanks for the reply. Is there a way, though, to record onto the video tracks on my existing VCR? Yours, Gary Hayward. |
#4
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"Gazza" wrote in message ... | Hi, | | Thanks for the reply. | | Is there a way, though, to record onto the video tracks on my existing VCR? Really, no. Ideally you should have a video signal applied so the system can sync itself on record and playback, even if the video and audio don't match. N |
#5
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In fact, before DAT (digital audio tape) recorders were available, there
were PCM modulators build, that sampled audio and put the bits in a video stream that could be recorded by a normal VCR. I do not think you will get one of these units anymore, and if so, it will probably be more expensive than a HIFI-VCR... Andre NSM wrote: "Gazza" wrote in message ... | Hi, | | Thanks for the reply. | | Is there a way, though, to record onto the video tracks on my existing VCR? Really, no. Ideally you should have a video signal applied so the system can sync itself on record and playback, even if the video and audio don't match. N -- Please change no_spam to a.lodwig when replying via email! |
#6
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Gazza writes:
Hi, I sometimes record radio shows onto video cassette with my VHS VCR, enjoying the benefits of being able to record at a pre-programmed time and the long, continuous recording time that that brings. I record onto the audio tracks from a SCART patch cable hooked into the headphones socket of a radio, and, although the VCR is not Hi-Fi stereo, the results sound fine to me (and I only tend to record documentaries anyway). I was wondering if and how I could record audio onto the video tracks as surely this would make for much better audio (given a high-quality audio source, of course) and would be better for music shows. I had a look on the web but couldn't find anything except mainly for a site about Betamax recorders where a 'Sony PCM add-on' was used. I have only a little knowledge of these things and would love to hear from anyone about my problem. Just get a HiFi VCR and use that. It's not worth the effort to use the video of a normal VCR for high quality audio. --- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Mirror: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/ Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/REPAIR/ +Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/sam/lasersam.htm | Mirror Sites: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/REPAIR/F_mirror.html Note: These links are hopefully temporary until we can sort out the excessive traffic on Repairfaq.org. Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header above is ignored unless my full name is included in the subject line. Or, you can contact me via the Feedback Form in the FAQs. |
#7
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"Sam Goldwasser" wrote in message ... | Just get a HiFi VCR and use that. It's not worth the effort to use | the video of a normal VCR for high quality audio. Plus with no video signal I wonder how stable the playback speed would be. N |
#8
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Gazza wrote:
Hi, I sometimes record radio shows onto video cassette with my VHS VCR, enjoying the benefits of being able to record at a pre-programmed time and the long, continuous recording time that that brings. I record onto the audio tracks from a SCART patch cable hooked into the headphones socket of a radio, and, although the VCR is not Hi-Fi stereo, the results sound fine to me (and I only tend to record documentaries anyway). I was wondering if and how I could record audio onto the video tracks as surely this would make for much better audio (given a high-quality audio source, of course) and would be better for music shows. I had a look on the web but couldn't find anything except mainly for a site about Betamax recorders where a 'Sony PCM add-on' was used. I have only a little knowledge of these things and would love to hear from anyone about my problem. Thanks a lot. Yours, Gary Hayward. Gary, I would ditch the VCR idea entirely. Presumably, you've proven you have a computer since you are on this group. Does it have a sound card? Free Windows softwa http://www.audiograbber.com-us.net I use it & recommend it. You can dump to a wave file with this program, and the length of time you can record is limited only by your hard drive. You can record for days and days for less than a Gig of space. (I sample at 11 KHz for voice programs. Of course if you want real fidelity, you can consume disk space much, much faster.) Oops, I see your header says you are using Knode, (me too!) The Winders software is likely of interest to others, so I'll leave it. So, For Linux: If you are partial to KDE: http://software.jodda.de Or... http://www.taolab.it/opensource/flrec/index_en.htm This one has a scheduler.. http://www.redfelineninja.dsl.pipex....are/pydar.html Or go to http://freshmeat.net and search for "audio recorder". Sorry, I haven't tried any of these Linux programs. Hmmm, maybe I will now... Thanks, Steve |
#9
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"NSM" writes:
"Sam Goldwasser" wrote in message ... | Just get a HiFi VCR and use that. It's not worth the effort to use | the video of a normal VCR for high quality audio. Plus with no video signal I wonder how stable the playback speed would be. Yes, if it recorded anything at all. If it doesn't see a reasonably legitimate video signal, it won't be happy. And, don't forget the sync and blanking that will be in the playback regardless. --- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Mirror: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/ Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/REPAIR/ +Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/sam/lasersam.htm | Mirror Sites: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/REPAIR/F_mirror.html Note: These links are hopefully temporary until we can sort out the excessive traffic on Repairfaq.org. Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header above is ignored unless my full name is included in the subject line. Or, you can contact me via the Feedback Form in the FAQs. |
#10
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Steve wrote:
Gazza wrote: Hi, I sometimes record radio shows onto video cassette with my VHS VCR, enjoying the benefits of being able to record at a pre-programmed time and the long, continuous recording time that that brings. I record onto the audio tracks from a SCART patch cable hooked into the headphones socket of a radio, and, although the VCR is not Hi-Fi stereo, the results sound fine to me (and I only tend to record documentaries anyway). I was wondering if and how I could record audio onto the video tracks as surely this would make for much better audio (given a high-quality audio source, of course) and would be better for music shows. I had a look on the web but couldn't find anything except mainly for a site about Betamax recorders where a 'Sony PCM add-on' was used. I have only a little knowledge of these things and would love to hear from anyone about my problem. Thanks a lot. Yours, Gary Hayward. Gary, I would ditch the VCR idea entirely. Presumably, you've proven you have a computer since you are on this group. Does it have a sound card? Free Windows softwa http://www.audiograbber.com-us.net I use it & recommend it. You can dump to a wave file with this program, and the length of time you can record is limited only by your hard drive. You can record for days and days for less than a Gig of space. (I sample at 11 KHz for voice programs. Of course if you want real fidelity, you can consume disk space much, much faster.) Oops, I see your header says you are using Knode, (me too!) The Winders software is likely of interest to others, so I'll leave it. So, For Linux: If you are partial to KDE: http://software.jodda.de Or... http://www.taolab.it/opensource/flrec/index_en.htm This one has a scheduler.. http://www.redfelineninja.dsl.pipex....are/pydar.html Or go to http://freshmeat.net and search for "audio recorder". Sorry, I haven't tried any of these Linux programs. Hmmm, maybe I will now... Thanks, Steve Hi, Thanks for the recommendations. I have Windows '98 on one of my boxes and have used GoldWave and N-Track Studio (these aren't expensive but aren't free either, but they seem okay from what use I've made of them). I like Audacity under Mandrake but I haven't been able to find find any plug-ins for it from anywhere. I use an M-Audio Delta 1010 LT audio interface and a Behringer 1832FX-Pro analogue mixing desk. Yours, Gary Hayward. |
#11
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"Sam Goldwasser" wrote in message ... | Yes, if it recorded anything at all. If it doesn't see a reasonably | legitimate video signal, it won't be happy. And, don't forget the | sync and blanking that will be in the playback regardless. My thought was to use any signal, even a test pattern, and record the desired audio signal. Even at the 6 hr rate the audio will be very good. N |
#12
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"NSM" writes:
"Sam Goldwasser" wrote in message ... | Yes, if it recorded anything at all. If it doesn't see a reasonably | legitimate video signal, it won't be happy. And, don't forget the | sync and blanking that will be in the playback regardless. My thought was to use any signal, even a test pattern, and record the desired audio signal. Even at the 6 hr rate the audio will be very good. Yes, on a HiFi VCR. I've done that even using off-the-air video with audio from a separate source. --- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Mirror: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/ Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/REPAIR/ +Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/sam/lasersam.htm | Mirror Sites: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/REPAIR/F_mirror.html Note: These links are hopefully temporary until we can sort out the excessive traffic on Repairfaq.org. Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header above is ignored unless my full name is included in the subject line. Or, you can contact me via the Feedback Form in the FAQs. |
#13
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Hi!
I agree with the others that have posted on this topic, but just for grins and giggles I tried it with a ToteVision (Goldstar) cheap-o 2 head VCR and a Samsung 4 head unit, model # unknown. It appears that this could actually work, as both units happily recorded audio onto the tape at SP speed with my (mis)using the composite video input for audio from a CD player. However, the audio signal was rather grossly overloaded, so you'd probably need to attenuate it a bit for better results. I didn't try LP or EP speeds. Other than the overloaded audio signal, the Samsung VCR did a pretty good job of putting the sound on the video tracks of the tape. The Totevision (Goldstar) machine had big problems maintaining speed. It was easy to tell that the speed was wandering up and down just by listening to the "tape drive" motor while it was recording. You can also watch the recorded signal on your TV, but I don't know that there is anything to be learned from doing so. (I did at least this much many years ago by plugging a composite computer screen into a musical keyboard and watching what happened when I played the keyboard...) I have no idea if this places extra stress on your TV, but it worked just fine a minutes ago and all those years ago on the computer monitor. So now you know. I doubt you can harm your VCR by trying this, but "the usual disclaimer" applies. If you break something while doing this, you are the proud owner of the remaining pieces. You do this at your own risk. William |
#14
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SONY used to make a pulse code modulation (PCM) convertor specifically
for recording hi fidelity audio onto VCR tapes. I don't recall the specifics but it was a high end device. -- Joe Leikhim K4SAT "The RFI-EMI-GUY" The Lost Deep Thoughts By: Jack Handey Before a mad scientist goes mad, there's probably a time when he's only partially mad. And this is the time when he's going to throw his best parties. |
#15
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Gazza wrote: Hi, I sometimes record radio shows onto video cassette with my VHS VCR, enjoying the benefits of being able to record at a pre-programmed time and the long, continuous recording time that that brings. I record onto the audio tracks from a SCART patch cable hooked into the headphones socket of a radio, and, although the VCR is not Hi-Fi stereo, the results sound fine to me (and I only tend to record documentaries anyway). I was wondering if and how I could record audio onto the video tracks as surely this would make for much better audio (given a high-quality audio source, of course) and would be better for music shows. I had a look on the web but couldn't find anything except mainly for a site about Betamax recorders where a 'Sony PCM add-on' was used. I have only a little knowledge of these things and would love to hear from anyone about my problem. Thanks a lot. Yours, Gary Hayward. Find a hi-fi (not liner hi-fi but true hi-fi) VCR. You will then have essentially the same thing as a DAT recorder. With that you can achieve CD quality sound but only in SP mode. Assuming a good quality audio source. That will limit you to two hours recording. In EP the quality will not be still be good just not as good as SP. I do the same thing myself with a Sony hi-fi vcr with a mini dish as the source. Works great. It is then possible to edit the songs you would like to keep and burn em onto a CD. Not that I would do that. Or even recommend or suggest that. |
#16
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HiFi VCRs are not the same thing as DAT recorders. Not even close. The
audio may be far superior to linear tracks on a VCR but not only is the performance in a different class than DAT, the technology is completely different. It does not make sense to try to use the video tracks for audio without some form of encoding and decoding. The sync necessary to record at all is in the audible range. HiFi tracks are adequate for most applications but most machines will require some video to sync up. Leonard "Wildcard" wrote in message ... Find a hi-fi (not liner hi-fi but true hi-fi) VCR. You will then have essentially the same thing as a DAT recorder. With that you can achieve CD quality sound but only in SP mode. Assuming a good quality audio source. That will limit you to two hours recording. In EP the quality will not be still be good just not as good as SP. I do the same thing myself with a Sony hi-fi vcr with a mini dish as the source. Works great. It is then possible to edit the songs you would like to keep and burn em onto a CD. Not that I would do that. Or even recommend or suggest that. |
#17
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True hi-fi vcr's don't record on the video track. They have separate
audio heads built into the drum to record alongside the video track. Independent L + R. I'm by no means a expert on DAT but I understand they do the same thing without the video. Sure feed a digital audio signal into a DAT and you'll get a better recording. Feed in standard analog stereo and I doubt you will notice any difference between the vcr and the DAT recording. The surround sound out of my prerecorded tapes sounds just as good as the sound from the DVD. I will say the digital surround out of the DVD doesn't so much sound better. It just gives a wider range of more distinct individual sounds. I actually prefer the analog since it seems to cut off the ability for the sound people to really screw up the sound track. I just hate it when you can barely hear the dialogue then they blow you out of the room with a action scene. Leonard Caillouet wrote: HiFi VCRs are not the same thing as DAT recorders. Not even close. The audio may be far superior to linear tracks on a VCR but not only is the performance in a different class than DAT, the technology is completely different. It does not make sense to try to use the video tracks for audio without some form of encoding and decoding. The sync necessary to record at all is in the audible range. HiFi tracks are adequate for most applications but most machines will require some video to sync up. Leonard "Wildcard" wrote in message ... Find a hi-fi (not liner hi-fi but true hi-fi) VCR. You will then have essentially the same thing as a DAT recorder. With that you can achieve CD quality sound but only in SP mode. Assuming a good quality audio source. That will limit you to two hours recording. In EP the quality will not be still be good just not as good as SP. I do the same thing myself with a Sony hi-fi vcr with a mini dish as the source. Works great. It is then possible to edit the songs you would like to keep and burn em onto a CD. Not that I would do that. Or even recommend or suggest that. |
#18
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"Wildcard" bravely wrote to "All" (15 Jan 05 18:45:24)
--- on the heady topic of " Can I Record Audio onto the Video Tracks of my = VHS Video Recorder?" Wi From: Wildcard Wi Xref: aeinews sci.electronics.repair:7314 Wi True hi-fi vcr's don't record on the video track. They have separate Wi audio heads built into the drum to record alongside the video Wi track. Independent L + R. No, VHS hifi audio is an FM signal recorded under the video track using the same rotating drum with the audio heads alongside the video heads. It is normal audio that is striped linearly on a separate R/L head. Hifi audio is nearly equal to CD quality while normal audio isn't much better than a good cassette recording. A*s*i*m*o*v .... A stereo system is the altar to the god of music. |
#19
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DAT records digitally, HiFi VCRs record analog FM. They are similar in that
they use a similar technique for laying down the information. Regardless of what you feed into either, using a digital process will eliminate the switching noise that is always present to some degree on AFM HiFi machines. It also eliminates any loss in the analog stages of processing and any added noise in the record/play process. HiFi VCRs may be adequate for your purpose, and you may not find the difference significant, but to consider them comparable to DAT as a record/playback system is simply incorrect. Any comparison side by side would be pretty obvious on any decent audio system. If you are finding a loss of dialogue on Dolby Digital compared to analog you are not using your decoder correctly. Learn about the steering in Dolby Pro Logic an Digital processes and either get a center channel that is set up correctly, use the phantom mode on your processor, or use the two channel analog output from your DVD player. Leonard "Wildcard" wrote in message ... True hi-fi vcr's don't record on the video track. They have separate audio heads built into the drum to record alongside the video track. Independent L + R. I'm by no means a expert on DAT but I understand they do the same thing without the video. Sure feed a digital audio signal into a DAT and you'll get a better recording. Feed in standard analog stereo and I doubt you will notice any difference between the vcr and the DAT recording. The surround sound out of my prerecorded tapes sounds just as good as the sound from the DVD. I will say the digital surround out of the DVD doesn't so much sound better. It just gives a wider range of more distinct individual sounds. I actually prefer the analog since it seems to cut off the ability for the sound people to really screw up the sound track. I just hate it when you can barely hear the dialogue then they blow you out of the room with a action scene. Leonard Caillouet wrote: HiFi VCRs are not the same thing as DAT recorders. Not even close. The audio may be far superior to linear tracks on a VCR but not only is the performance in a different class than DAT, the technology is completely different. It does not make sense to try to use the video tracks for audio without some form of encoding and decoding. The sync necessary to record at all is in the audible range. HiFi tracks are adequate for most applications but most machines will require some video to sync up. Leonard "Wildcard" wrote in message ... Find a hi-fi (not liner hi-fi but true hi-fi) VCR. You will then have essentially the same thing as a DAT recorder. With that you can achieve CD quality sound but only in SP mode. Assuming a good quality audio source. That will limit you to two hours recording. In EP the quality will not be still be good just not as good as SP. I do the same thing myself with a Sony hi-fi vcr with a mini dish as the source. Works great. It is then possible to edit the songs you would like to keep and burn em onto a CD. Not that I would do that. Or even recommend or suggest that. |
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