I don't have a very big shop, but I spend 'way too much time looking
around for this or that tool when I need it.
I know pretty well where my favorite micrometer and dial caliper are,
and the location of the most popular inserts that I use.
The trouble comes when I have to locate a piece of tooling or a piece
of measuring equipment that I don't use all that often. The problem is
complicated by having cabinets and shelves both by the lathe and by the
mill, with some storage by the drill press, too. That's in addition to
the Kennedy 52611 chest that I got for Christmas last year.
One other thing that I probably shouldn't admit to: Sometimes, when
I can't find the thing I really should be using, I may make do with
something else, just because I don't want to go "on the hunt". This
practice can be a cause for poor quality, frustration and rework.

Soooooo---- I finally sat down and made a list of all of that kind of
tool. (I put it on a spreadsheet, because I always do lists that way).
Then, after alphabetizing the list and grouping similar items to make
them easier to find on the list, I put a simple description of their
location next to each one. The list is general enough that it's only
one page long at this time---- I KNOW where the drill bits and the QC
tool holders are.
I wasn't very scientific about the locations, but I don't have to be.
It's MY shop. ---No GPS-type coordinates.

The list lives in the lid of the Kennedy chest. I left room between
every entry, so I can add things as needed.

Examples:
------------
Reamers:
General: Brown (Kennedy chest) right,(side) 3(3rd small Drawer)
Over and Under: Brown, Large, 1, (1st Large drawer)

Mill tramming stuff: Brown, left, 1
: Over Mill, left, 3
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
The reason I tell you this: On Saturday, I had to finish a rather
finicky job and I used the list no less than 4 times! I'll bet I saved
myself at least 20 minutes.

I am satisfied that this is "a good thing",
But, if anybody on this NG has a better idea, I am open to it.

Pete Stanaitis
-------------------------------

spaco fired this volley in
:

The reason I tell you this: On Saturday, I had to finish a rather
finicky job and I used the list no less than 4 times! I'll bet I
saved
myself at least 20 minutes.


Hmmmm... I found it much easier to make shelf with neat stacks of
corona-sized cigar boxes with a label on the front of each: "Large
milling cutters 3/4"", "spotting and center drills", "Centers and
dogs", etc...

Even with the (now) hundreds of tools and appertenances I've
collected, everything is "card file indexed" without a card file.

If you look past Carrie's boobs when she's digging through the MI5
parts inventory, you'll see many plastic drawer units (WallyWorld
style) on shelves, with alphabetized labels.

LLoyd


LLoyd

What helps for me is to go through my stuff once in a while, open all
drawers and see what is there,. etc.

In article ,
spaco wrote:

I don't have a very big shop, but I spend 'way too much time looking
around for this or that tool when I need it.

IF you can put the time into it, making the sorts of "fitted/outline"
storage boards for tools really helps, and grouping the tools on
boards/in drawers in a way that makes sense (to you, anyway). The fitted
or outlined storage makes it more obvious when something is NOT where
it's supposed to be, and IF you can make a part of your routine to check
for that and fix it before you leave the shop (when you will hopefully
still recall where you might have put the thing that's not "in it's
place") it eventually falls into a routine.

Those are big IFs if you don't naturally operate that way. I don't. But
I try to, because the various school/college shops I've worked in that
were organized that way were fairly pleasant to work in, and buying
three of something because you can't find the one you have (twice) is
annoying.

ie, the old Shaker maxim - "A place for everything and everything in
it's place"

It takes time, but it also saves time. As does organizing your stock
storage.

--
Cats, coffee, chocolate...vices to live by

spaco wrote:
I don't have a very big shop, but I spend 'way too much time looking
around for this or that tool when I need it.
I know pretty well where my favorite micrometer and dial caliper are,
and the location of the most popular inserts that I use.
The trouble comes when I have to locate a piece of tooling or a piece
of measuring equipment that I don't use all that often. The problem is
complicated by having cabinets and shelves both by the lathe and by the
mill, with some storage by the drill press, too. That's in addition to
the Kennedy 52611 chest that I got for Christmas last year.
One other thing that I probably shouldn't admit to: Sometimes, when I
can't find the thing I really should be using, I may make do with
something else, just because I don't want to go "on the hunt". This
practice can be a cause for poor quality, frustration and rework.

Soooooo---- I finally sat down and made a list of all of that kind of
tool. (I put it on a spreadsheet, because I always do lists that way).
Then, after alphabetizing the list and grouping similar items to make
them easier to find on the list, I put a simple description of their
location next to each one. The list is general enough that it's only
one page long at this time---- I KNOW where the drill bits and the QC
tool holders are.
I wasn't very scientific about the locations, but I don't have to be.
It's MY shop. ---No GPS-type coordinates.

The list lives in the lid of the Kennedy chest. I left room between
every entry, so I can add things as needed.

Examples:
------------
Reamers:
General: Brown (Kennedy chest) right,(side) 3(3rd small Drawer)
Over and Under: Brown, Large, 1, (1st Large drawer)

Mill tramming stuff: Brown, left, 1
: Over Mill, left, 3

Interesting idea.

I mostly use the low-cost roll-around toolboxes from Sears. I catch the
"workcenter" units with the plastic compartemented top. You can unscrew
the top and replace it with a standard top to match your workbenches, or
leave the plastic thing in place. I like to make all my work surfaces
the same height.
What works for me currently is arranging the lathe related tooling
next to the lathe it goes to. Tooling that works on either is in a
cabinet between the two. Same for milling machine tooling, it's between
the mill-drill and the minimill. Another cabinet is just for drills and
driling items, and it's between the millers and the drill-press.
Mechanical tools are in a separate chest
Measuring tools are in a separate chest.
tools that I use often - tailstock wrenches, etc are dedicated to each
machine and stored on pegboard behind it.
Popular (top 6) collets I keep with each machine on the pegboard, with
the larger set in the cabinet.

Also!

For christmas last year, SWMBO gifted me with one each
of these for wire gauge and fractional sizes:
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?P...PMPXNO=4881826

Out came the indexes hidden in drawers and duffel bags.
Drills got sorted and neatly put away in these dispensers.
They live next to the drill press. Now I have only
two places to look for drills rather than five.

This is very welcome and pleasant.

--Winston

On Mon, 01 Dec 2008 14:22:47 -0600, RB wrote:

spaco wrote:
I don't have a very big shop, but I spend 'way too much time looking
around for this or that tool when I need it.
I know pretty well where my favorite micrometer and dial caliper are,
and the location of the most popular inserts that I use.
The trouble comes when I have to locate a piece of tooling or a piece
of measuring equipment that I don't use all that often. The problem is
complicated by having cabinets and shelves both by the lathe and by the
mill, with some storage by the drill press, too. That's in addition to
the Kennedy 52611 chest that I got for Christmas last year.
One other thing that I probably shouldn't admit to: Sometimes, when I
can't find the thing I really should be using, I may make do with
something else, just because I don't want to go "on the hunt". This
practice can be a cause for poor quality, frustration and rework.

Soooooo---- I finally sat down and made a list of all of that kind of
tool. (I put it on a spreadsheet, because I always do lists that way).
Then, after alphabetizing the list and grouping similar items to make
them easier to find on the list, I put a simple description of their
location next to each one. The list is general enough that it's only
one page long at this time---- I KNOW where the drill bits and the QC
tool holders are.
I wasn't very scientific about the locations, but I don't have to be.
It's MY shop. ---No GPS-type coordinates.

The list lives in the lid of the Kennedy chest. I left room between
every entry, so I can add things as needed.

Examples:
------------
Reamers:
General: Brown (Kennedy chest) right,(side) 3(3rd small Drawer)
Over and Under: Brown, Large, 1, (1st Large drawer)

Mill tramming stuff: Brown, left, 1
: Over Mill, left, 3

Interesting idea.

I mostly use the low-cost roll-around toolboxes from Sears. I catch the
"workcenter" units with the plastic compartemented top. You can unscrew
the top and replace it with a standard top to match your workbenches, or
leave the plastic thing in place. I like to make all my work surfaces
the same height.
What works for me currently is arranging the lathe related tooling
next to the lathe it goes to. Tooling that works on either is in a
cabinet between the two. Same for milling machine tooling, it's between
the mill-drill and the minimill. Another cabinet is just for drills and
driling items, and it's between the millers and the drill-press.
Mechanical tools are in a separate chest
Measuring tools are in a separate chest.
tools that I use often - tailstock wrenches, etc are dedicated to each
machine and stored on pegboard behind it.
Popular (top 6) collets I keep with each machine on the pegboard, with
the larger set in the cabinet.


Get some of the old IBM punch card file cabinets. Work wonders for
organizing tools, tooling and whatnot

The old Simplicity pattern cabinets hold rotary tables and other tall
and wide stuff perfectly and have heavy heavy duty ball bearing glides.

Gunner

"They couldn't hit an elephant at this dist..."
Maj. Gen. John Sedgewick, killed by a sniper in 1864 at the battle of Spotsylvania

On Dec 1, 11:25*am, Ignoramus14497 ignoramus14...@NOSPAM.
14497.invalid wrote:
What helps for me is to go through my stuff once in a while, open all
drawers and see what is there,. etc.

I do that before making the rounds of all the local second-hand
stores, to remember what I have and what I could use. It also reminds
me where everything is. I usually take a 4" dial caliper, a Morse 2
sleeve and a copy of my threaded lathe spindle.

I tried to outline tools on a pegboard at home and gave up quickly,
not enough wall space. My pegboards are half a dozen tools deep on
each peg. It makes a lot more sense in an open school/company shop, so
the person in "charge", me, knows when something has been borrowed and
can point at the space and shrug when someone else wants it. There was
no way a lowly lab tech could enforce rules or a signout sheet on
Ph.D.'s

Jim Wilkins

Jim Wilkins wrote:
On Dec 1, 11:25 am, Ignoramus14497 ignoramus14...@NOSPAM.
14497.invalid wrote:
What helps for me is to go through my stuff once in a while, open all
drawers and see what is there,. etc.

I do that before making the rounds of all the local second-hand
stores, to remember what I have and what I could use. It also reminds
me where everything is. I usually take a 4" dial caliper, a Morse 2
sleeve and a copy of my threaded lathe spindle.

And a magnet and a tape measure...
And my PDA with the listings of all the prices of stuff and the dealers.

--
Michael Koblic,
Campbell River, BC

On 2008-12-02, Michael Koblic wrote:
Jim Wilkins wrote:
On Dec 1, 11:25 am, Ignoramus14497 ignoramus14...@NOSPAM.
14497.invalid wrote:
What helps for me is to go through my stuff once in a while, open all
drawers and see what is there,. etc.

I do that before making the rounds of all the local second-hand
stores, to remember what I have and what I could use. It also reminds
me where everything is. I usually take a 4" dial caliper, a Morse 2
sleeve and a copy of my threaded lathe spindle.

And a magnet and a tape measure...
And my PDA with the listings of all the prices of stuff and the dealers.


I think that the worst in "shop management" is to lose control of what
you have, to forget that you have something, or being unable to find
it, and then having to buy one more piece. It is like death spiral.

--
Due to extreme spam originating from Google Groups, and their inattention
to spammers, I and many others block all articles originating
from Google Groups. If you want your postings to be seen by
more readers you will need to find a different means of
posting on Usenet.
http://improve-usenet.org/

This is why I prefer pieces of pegboard to hang everything on. That
way, in theory, I can just stand there and look for it.
However, if I find myself looking for something, after I find it, and
use it, I put it in the first place I originally looked for it.
Believe it or not, that helps me find it next time.
I have a huge shop and I don't keep junk. If I don't have a use for
it, it's gone.
Now if I could just find my new eye loop......

Gunner Asch wrote in
:

On Mon, 01 Dec 2008 14:22:47 -0600, RB wrote:

spaco wrote:
I don't have a very big shop, but I spend 'way too much time looking
around for this or that tool when I need it.
I know pretty well where my favorite micrometer and dial caliper
are,
and the location of the most popular inserts that I use.
The trouble comes when I have to locate a piece of tooling or a
piece
of measuring equipment that I don't use all that often. The problem
is complicated by having cabinets and shelves both by the lathe and
by the mill, with some storage by the drill press, too. That's in
addition to the Kennedy 52611 chest that I got for Christmas last
year.
One other thing that I probably shouldn't admit to: Sometimes,
when I
can't find the thing I really should be using, I may make do with
something else, just because I don't want to go "on the hunt".
This practice can be a cause for poor quality, frustration and
rework.

Soooooo---- I finally sat down and made a list of all of that kind
of
tool. (I put it on a spreadsheet, because I always do lists that
way).
Then, after alphabetizing the list and grouping similar items to
make
them easier to find on the list, I put a simple description of their
location next to each one. The list is general enough that it's
only one page long at this time---- I KNOW where the drill bits and
the QC tool holders are.
I wasn't very scientific about the locations, but I don't have to
be.
It's MY shop. ---No GPS-type coordinates.

The list lives in the lid of the Kennedy chest. I left room between
every entry, so I can add things as needed.

Examples:
------------
Reamers:
General: Brown (Kennedy chest) right,(side) 3(3rd small
Drawer) Over and Under: Brown, Large, 1, (1st Large drawer)

Mill tramming stuff: Brown, left, 1
: Over Mill, left, 3

Interesting idea.

I mostly use the low-cost roll-around toolboxes from Sears. I catch
the "workcenter" units with the plastic compartemented top. You can
unscrew the top and replace it with a standard top to match your
workbenches, or leave the plastic thing in place. I like to make all
my work surfaces the same height.
What works for me currently is arranging the lathe related tooling
next to the lathe it goes to. Tooling that works on either is in a
cabinet between the two. Same for milling machine tooling, it's
between the mill-drill and the minimill. Another cabinet is just for
drills and driling items, and it's between the millers and the
drill-press. Mechanical tools are in a separate chest
Measuring tools are in a separate chest.
tools that I use often - tailstock wrenches, etc are dedicated to each
machine and stored on pegboard behind it.
Popular (top 6) collets I keep with each machine on the pegboard, with
the larger set in the cabinet.


Get some of the old IBM punch card file cabinets. Work wonders for
organizing tools, tooling and whatnot

The old Simplicity pattern cabinets hold rotary tables and other tall
and wide stuff perfectly and have heavy heavy duty ball bearing
glides.

Gunner

If you can find any, old thread/button cabinets work well for smaller
items - especially if you can find them with the original boxes inside.

About 2" deep x 3' wide drawers with 4-6 drawers/cabinet and each drawer
has a card holder just above the handle.

[SWMBO "rescued" a couple from an old store that had gone out of business
years earlier when she was helping the new owner of the building to set
up shop. G She uses a 4-drawer for her crafts and I use the 6-drawer
for tools. VBG]

spaco wrote in
:

I don't have a very big shop, but I spend 'way too much time looking
around for this or that tool when I need it.
I know pretty well where my favorite micrometer and dial caliper
are,
and the location of the most popular inserts that I use.
The trouble comes when I have to locate a piece of tooling or a
piece
of measuring equipment that I don't use all that often. The problem
is complicated by having cabinets and shelves both by the lathe and by
the mill, with some storage by the drill press, too. That's in
addition to the Kennedy 52611 chest that I got for Christmas last
year.
One other thing that I probably shouldn't admit to: Sometimes,
when
I can't find the thing I really should be using, I may make do with
something else, just because I don't want to go "on the hunt". This
practice can be a cause for poor quality, frustration and rework.

Soooooo---- I finally sat down and made a list of all of that kind
of
tool. (I put it on a spreadsheet, because I always do lists that
way).
Then, after alphabetizing the list and grouping similar items to
make
them easier to find on the list, I put a simple description of their
location next to each one. The list is general enough that it's only
one page long at this time---- I KNOW where the drill bits and the QC
tool holders are.
I wasn't very scientific about the locations, but I don't have to
be.
It's MY shop. ---No GPS-type coordinates.

The list lives in the lid of the Kennedy chest. I left room between
every entry, so I can add things as needed.

Examples:
------------
Reamers:
General: Brown (Kennedy chest) right,(side) 3(3rd small
Drawer) Over and Under: Brown, Large, 1, (1st Large drawer)

Mill tramming stuff: Brown, left, 1
: Over Mill, left, 3
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
------ The reason I tell you this: On Saturday, I had to finish a
rather finicky job and I used the list no less than 4 times! I'll bet
I saved myself at least 20 minutes.

I am satisfied that this is "a good thing",
But, if anybody on this NG has a better idea, I am open to it.

Pete Stanaitis
-------------------------------


Get a labelmaker - I use a Dyno Letratag - and label the drawers.

The labels come off cleanly if you rearrange "stuff". g

On 2008-12-01, Gunner Asch wrote:

Get some of the old IBM punch card file cabinets. Work wonders for
organizing tools, tooling and whatnot


These are the best of the best. I feel like a fool for having sold two
a few years ago.
--
Due to extreme spam originating from Google Groups, and their inattention
to spammers, I and many others block all articles originating
from Google Groups. If you want your postings to be seen by
more readers you will need to find a different means of
posting on Usenet.
http://improve-usenet.org/

I find that easily-accessible drawers (or drawer-like containers in
shelving/racks) with clearly marked labels are a large portion of the
solution to inventory management.

Additionally, making sure the drawers aren't overstuffed, and that they
don't include extraneous non-related material, to be an advantage to just
having lots of drawers to throw stuff into.

--
WB
..........
metalworking projects
www.kwagmire.com/metal_proj.html


"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote in message
. 3.70...
spaco fired this volley in
:

The reason I tell you this: On Saturday, I had to finish a rather
finicky job and I used the list no less than 4 times! I'll bet I
saved
myself at least 20 minutes.


Hmmmm... I found it much easier to make shelf with neat stacks of
corona-sized cigar boxes with a label on the front of each: "Large
milling cutters 3/4"", "spotting and center drills", "Centers and
dogs", etc...

Even with the (now) hundreds of tools and appertenances I've
collected, everything is "card file indexed" without a card file.

If you look past Carrie's boobs when she's digging through the MI5
parts inventory, you'll see many plastic drawer units (WallyWorld
style) on shelves, with alphabetized labels.

LLoyd


LLoyd

On Tue, 02 Dec 2008 20:35:42 -0600, Ignoramus21077
wrote:

On 2008-12-01, Gunner Asch wrote:

Get some of the old IBM punch card file cabinets. Work wonders for
organizing tools, tooling and whatnot


These are the best of the best. I feel like a fool for having sold two
a few years ago.


Last count, I have 11 of them, and regret letting 5 more go to
friends.

Gunner

wrote:
On Dec 2, 3:10 am, spaco wrote:
I don't have a very big shop, but I spend 'way too much time looking
around for this or that tool when I need it.

The reason I tell you this: On Saturday, I had to finish a rather
finicky job and I used the list no less than 4 times! I'll bet I saved
myself at least 20 minutes.

I am satisfied that this is "a good thing",
But, if anybody on this NG has a better idea, I am open to it.

Pete Stanaitis

Nope, your on your own on this one - the shop situation usually
reflects the rest of your life, because if you are a highly organised
person, then you wouldn't be asking this question.

The ideal, fantastic, machinists erotic dream is to have a storeman,
who checks things in and out, organises consumerables, replaces broken
tooling, has every item in the size you need, and cleans and oils your
machines at the end of the day.... The trade off is their nearly
always grumpy *******s cause they have to put up with you being slack
and hopeless and disorganised.... (apprentices take some time to
recognise that you NEVER atagonise the storeman, as he can make your
life absolute hell with very little effort on his part. You must
remember Xmas, and preferably his birthday as well, and take keen
interest in pictures of his grandchildren....)

Yep, Total Fantasy - the real world, mm, yes - a bit different, as
follows....

My shop - totally chaotic, have a vague idea where "some" things are -
the measuring tools in their own drawer, the rest.......have started
buying small plastic boxes, the 3 for $2 kind, they stack easy, label
them with a dymo machine, even built their own shelves for
them.....one day, I will finish cleaning up and sorting and actually
put things in them.....(hey, theres so many more interesting things to
do....)

One method that has a at least 95% chance of finding the "lost" tool
is to start a methodical clean up, starting with the workbench,
putting things back into racks/pegboard etc,spreading ever wider until
you find it. If your "sorta lucky" you will get to clean and wipe down
your benches just before you find said lost item. (then you can stop,
until the next lost tool crisis......) Oh, and the swarf tray under
the lathe is the LAST place you look - not because it is not likely to
be in there, its just a pig of a job.

A fatal thing to do is randomly stuff tools, consumerables wherever
they can fit at the time. Especially in unmarked boxes, or plastic
crates under the bench - you will have to do serious excavation to
find anything, complicated by being in the wrong section in the first
place....and get sidetracked by finding decoy items as you go...

The most deadly of all is to have something in your hand when the
phone rings - you will have no conscious memory of putting it down, so
theres no chance of finding it. Plus, small items ABSOLUTELY hate
light, they will try to scurry under benches and into dark corners
behind usually bloody heavy and hard to move items.

So. There. Didn't give you a solution, just telling it like it is. If
your a machinist for a living, either an employee or working for
yourself - your correct, its not a problem. Because if it was a
problem, your employer, or you, would go bust.

Hey, if its been chaotic for you for eons, it aint going to change -
think of some ways to make it easier, rather than the moon shot of
total re-organisation.

Remember, its only a hobby, its only a hobby, its only a hobby.

(and I have managed to waste 20 minutes writing all this, still have
boxes of "Junque" to sort out, and jobs to do.....if I can find the
right bit of aluminium I "know" is in here somewhere, I distinctly
remember saying to myself "mm, this will come in useful one day,
better keep it..."


Andrew VK3BFA.
You almost had me sending out the disciplinary team to present you with
the Judgemental Prig of the Year award, until I read on...

I direct the reader to two pieces of work that I'm sure many will
appreciate for their defense of those having enhanced visual filing
skills. This is not a term that Debbie Travis would use, by the way...

The first is the Economist of several years ago, in which
two extremes of "workplace organization" methodology were described.
At one end of the scale was Andrew's first example, the perfectly
organized, stored, cross-referenced and indexed, restocked and
"tidy" workplace. (The management of which, I suggest, might take
more time than available in a normal shift, leaving little opportunity
for real work...)

At the other end of the spectrum is the "visually organized" workplace,
sometimes called the "volcano" strategy, in which everything of
interest (if only for a few seconds at some point) is within view
and within reach. In a desk situation, "stuff" is piled up like blocks
in a children's game, around the edges of a vanishingly small patch of
space which is used for actual reminder-jotting or for changing the
batteries in the PDA that was supposed to help the user organize his
or her life.

Where's the agenda for the meeting that starts in 5 minutes?
Well, it was about a foot up the pile, slightly to the left of
centre, close to the yellow 2-for-1 pizza flyer that expired
last month. You get the picture.

The Volcano term refers to the ever-rising height of the pile,
and with occasional gravitational interventions causing parts
thereof to spread onto the older piles of "stuff" on the floor.

The second item worth a look is a short feature film called,
appropriately, "Clutter", which gladdened my heart. While
the maker of this video did poke a little fun at "us", the
effort did provide some support for our cause by illustrating
that even the most frightening clutterbugs can be highly efficient
in their retrieval skills.

Me? well, my spouse manages to keep me from spreading too
many things into the non-workshop rooms in the house. My
workbench (well, each of several) has no room for sorting,
nor does the floor, and there isn't any more space for shelves.

But I have a wonderful time, every year or so, diving into the
boxes and bins, reacquainting myself with my many treasures,
and stacking up a bit of stuff for the dumpster. And I'll
get to that job at some point, but right now, I have to
get another cup of coffee, run down to the hardware store to
get a 1/8 inch drill (which will eventually find its way into
the drawer full of other 1/8 inch drills, when I find said
drawer) so that I can fix the broken weed-wacker that some
maladroit discarded. Now, where did I put the car keys....

/mark in clutterland

On 2008-12-03, John Martin wrote:
On Dec 1, 9:10?pm, Ignoramus14497 ignoramus14...@NOSPAM.
14497.invalid wrote:

I think that the worst in "shop management" is to lose control of what
you have, to forget that you have something, or being unable to find
it, and then having to buy one more piece. It is like ?death spiral.



No, Iggy, what's worse is to discover you need a special tool for a
job, make one up, use it, label it and put it away - and discover next
to it the tool that you made up for the same job just a few years
earlier.

I did it, not with physical tools but with shell or perl scripts. Very
embarrassing.

--
Due to extreme spam originating from Google Groups, and their inattention
to spammers, I and many others block all articles originating
from Google Groups. If you want your postings to be seen by
more readers you will need to find a different means of
posting on Usenet.
http://improve-usenet.org/

wrote:
On Dec 2, 3:10 am, spaco wrote:
I don't have a very big shop, but I spend 'way too much time looking
around for this or that tool when I need it.

The reason I tell you this: On Saturday, I had to finish a rather
finicky job and I used the list no less than 4 times! I'll bet I saved
myself at least 20 minutes.

I am satisfied that this is "a good thing",
But, if anybody on this NG has a better idea, I am open to it.

Pete Stanaitis

Nope, your on your own on this one - the shop situation usually
reflects the rest of your life, because if you are a highly organised
person, then you wouldn't be asking this question.

The ideal, fantastic, machinists erotic dream is to have a storeman,
who checks things in and out, organises consumerables, replaces broken
tooling, has every item in the size you need, and cleans and oils your
machines at the end of the day.... The trade off is their nearly
always grumpy *******s cause they have to put up with you being slack
and hopeless and disorganised.... (apprentices take some time to
recognise that you NEVER atagonise the storeman, as he can make your
life absolute hell with very little effort on his part. You must
remember Xmas, and preferably his birthday as well, and take keen
interest in pictures of his grandchildren....)

Yep, Total Fantasy - the real world, mm, yes - a bit different, as
follows....

My shop - totally chaotic, have a vague idea where "some" things are -
the measuring tools in their own drawer, the rest.......have started
buying small plastic boxes, the 3 for $2 kind, they stack easy, label
them with a dymo machine, even built their own shelves for
them.....one day, I will finish cleaning up and sorting and actually
put things in them.....(hey, theres so many more interesting things to
do....)

One method that has a at least 95% chance of finding the "lost" tool
is to start a methodical clean up, starting with the workbench,
putting things back into racks/pegboard etc,spreading ever wider until
you find it. If your "sorta lucky" you will get to clean and wipe down
your benches just before you find said lost item. (then you can stop,
until the next lost tool crisis......) Oh, and the swarf tray under
the lathe is the LAST place you look - not because it is not likely to
be in there, its just a pig of a job.

A fatal thing to do is randomly stuff tools, consumerables wherever
they can fit at the time. Especially in unmarked boxes, or plastic
crates under the bench - you will have to do serious excavation to
find anything, complicated by being in the wrong section in the first
place....and get sidetracked by finding decoy items as you go...

The most deadly of all is to have something in your hand when the
phone rings - you will have no conscious memory of putting it down, so
theres no chance of finding it. Plus, small items ABSOLUTELY hate
light, they will try to scurry under benches and into dark corners
behind usually bloody heavy and hard to move items.

So. There. Didn't give you a solution, just telling it like it is. If
your a machinist for a living, either an employee or working for
yourself - your correct, its not a problem. Because if it was a
problem, your employer, or you, would go bust.

Hey, if its been chaotic for you for eons, it aint going to change -
think of some ways to make it easier, rather than the moon shot of
total re-organisation.

Remember, its only a hobby, its only a hobby, its only a hobby.

(and I have managed to waste 20 minutes writing all this, still have
boxes of "Junque" to sort out, and jobs to do.....if I can find the
right bit of aluminium I "know" is in here somewhere, I distinctly
remember saying to myself "mm, this will come in useful one day,
better keep it..."


Andrew VK3BFA.

Andrew? We may be related.

John Martin wrote:
On Dec 1, 9:10 pm, Ignoramus14497 ignoramus14...@NOSPAM.
14497.invalid wrote:
I think that the worst in "shop management" is to lose control of what
you have, to forget that you have something, or being unable to find
it, and then having to buy one more piece. It is like death spiral.



No, Iggy, what's worse is to discover you need a special tool for a
job, make one up, use it, label it and put it away - and discover next
to it the tool that you made up for the same job just a few years
earlier.

LOL I've done that!

wrote in message
...
On Dec 2, 3:10 am, spaco wrote:
I don't have a very big shop, but I spend 'way too much time looking
around for this or that tool when I need it.

The reason I tell you this: On Saturday, I had to finish a rather
finicky job and I used the list no less than 4 times! I'll bet I saved
myself at least 20 minutes.

I am satisfied that this is "a good thing",
But, if anybody on this NG has a better idea, I am open to it.

Pete Stanaitis

Nope, your on your own on this one - the shop situation usually
reflects the rest of your life, because if you are a highly organised
person, then you wouldn't be asking this question.

The ideal, fantastic, machinists erotic dream is to have a storeman,
who checks things in and out, organises consumerables, replaces broken
tooling, has every item in the size you need, and cleans and oils your
machines at the end of the day.... The trade off is their nearly
always grumpy *******s cause they have to put up with you being slack
and hopeless and disorganised.... (apprentices take some time to
recognise that you NEVER atagonise the storeman, as he can make your
life absolute hell with very little effort on his part. You must
remember Xmas, and preferably his birthday as well, and take keen
interest in pictures of his grandchildren....)

Yep, Total Fantasy - the real world, mm, yes - a bit different, as
follows....

My shop - totally chaotic, have a vague idea where "some" things are -
the measuring tools in their own drawer, the rest.......have started
buying small plastic boxes, the 3 for $2 kind, they stack easy, label
them with a dymo machine, even built their own shelves for
them.....one day, I will finish cleaning up and sorting and actually
put things in them.....(hey, theres so many more interesting things to
do....)

One method that has a at least 95% chance of finding the "lost" tool
is to start a methodical clean up, starting with the workbench,
putting things back into racks/pegboard etc,spreading ever wider until
you find it. If your "sorta lucky" you will get to clean and wipe down
your benches just before you find said lost item. (then you can stop,
until the next lost tool crisis......) Oh, and the swarf tray under
the lathe is the LAST place you look - not because it is not likely to
be in there, its just a pig of a job.

A fatal thing to do is randomly stuff tools, consumerables wherever
they can fit at the time. Especially in unmarked boxes, or plastic
crates under the bench - you will have to do serious excavation to
find anything, complicated by being in the wrong section in the first
place....and get sidetracked by finding decoy items as you go...

The most deadly of all is to have something in your hand when the
phone rings - you will have no conscious memory of putting it down, so
theres no chance of finding it. Plus, small items ABSOLUTELY hate
light, they will try to scurry under benches and into dark corners
behind usually bloody heavy and hard to move items.

So. There. Didn't give you a solution, just telling it like it is. If
your a machinist for a living, either an employee or working for
yourself - your correct, its not a problem. Because if it was a
problem, your employer, or you, would go bust.

Hey, if its been chaotic for you for eons, it aint going to change -
think of some ways to make it easier, rather than the moon shot of
total re-organisation.

Remember, its only a hobby, its only a hobby, its only a hobby.

(and I have managed to waste 20 minutes writing all this, still have
boxes of "Junque" to sort out, and jobs to do.....if I can find the
right bit of aluminium I "know" is in here somewhere, I distinctly
remember saying to myself "mm, this will come in useful one day,
better keep it..."


Andrew VK3BFA.


The technique I use is the Point-to point pickup.

When all else fails and there's No Fxxking Way I can spend another 3 minutes
looking for ...Part X or ...Tool Y, I start cleaning.

Pick up the most egregious offense to neat and orderly, and carefully return
it to where it needs to really be. Pick up the next close offender and
return it to its designated resting place. and the next worst and the next
worst and so on.

Pretty soon I'm back to semi organized and sorta tidy.

Keeping an eye open whilst doing the above usually finds the necessary tool
or part ....eventually.

If not i buy a new one and the old one majically appears after the new one
arrives.

Mark





----== Posted via Pronews.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.pronews.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups
---= - Total Privacy via Encryption =---

Jim Wilkins wrote:

[snip]

I tried to outline tools on a pegboard at home and gave up quickly,
not enough wall space. My pegboards are half a dozen tools deep on
each peg. It makes a lot more sense in an open school/company shop, so
the person in "charge", me, knows when something has been borrowed and
can point at the space and shrug when someone else wants it. There was
no way a lowly lab tech could enforce rules or a signout sheet on
Ph.D.'s

A friend of mine outfitted his shop with a large pegboard wall with
hooks and silhouettes of each tool attached to its assigned place.

He claims that its the best system to use when one has a couple of
teenage boys, as he can take one look at all the markings on the
pegboard and know exactly how many tools he used to have.

--
Paul Hovnanian
------------------------------------------------------------------
I think you left the stove on.

On Thu, 04 Dec 2008 21:26:19 -0800, "Paul Hovnanian P.E."
wrote:

Jim Wilkins wrote:

[snip]

I tried to outline tools on a pegboard at home and gave up quickly,
not enough wall space. My pegboards are half a dozen tools deep on
each peg. It makes a lot more sense in an open school/company shop, so
the person in "charge", me, knows when something has been borrowed and
can point at the space and shrug when someone else wants it. There was
no way a lowly lab tech could enforce rules or a signout sheet on
Ph.D.'s

A friend of mine outfitted his shop with a large pegboard wall with
hooks and silhouettes of each tool attached to its assigned place.

He claims that its the best system to use when one has a couple of
teenage boys, as he can take one look at all the markings on the
pegboard and know exactly how many tools he used to have.

Yeahbut whatdyado when each hook has three or more items hung on it?
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

Gerald Miller wrote:
On Thu, 04 Dec 2008 21:26:19 -0800, "Paul Hovnanian P.E."
wrote:

Jim Wilkins wrote:
[snip]

I tried to outline tools on a pegboard at home and gave up quickly,
not enough wall space. My pegboards are half a dozen tools deep on
each peg. It makes a lot more sense in an open school/company shop, so
the person in "charge", me, knows when something has been borrowed and
can point at the space and shrug when someone else wants it. There was
no way a lowly lab tech could enforce rules or a signout sheet on
Ph.D.'s
A friend of mine outfitted his shop with a large pegboard wall with
hooks and silhouettes of each tool attached to its assigned place.

He claims that its the best system to use when one has a couple of
teenage boys, as he can take one look at all the markings on the
pegboard and know exactly how many tools he used to have.

Yeahbut whatdyado when each hook has three or more items hung on it?

Adopt.

--Winston

I've found this part to be very true, Andrew..

Hey, if its been chaotic for you for eons, it aint going to change -
think of some ways to make it easier, rather than the moon shot of
total re-organisation.

I have yet to see a disorganized person become organized. I've taken it upon
myself to clean and organize other guys' shops and garages because they were
constantly bitchin and going into fits of rage for not being able to find
what they needed, even though it was nearby.

I don't/won't do that anymore, it's a complete waste of time. I generally
try to avoid their shop areas.
I may be obsessive, but I refuse to climb or trip over their crap to try to
help them. I typically don't rely on my feet to clear a work space.
If they want to bring something to me, I'll very likely be glad to help.

--
WB
..........
metalworking projects
www.kwagmire.com/metal_proj.html


wrote in message
...

Nope, your on your own on this one - the shop situation usually
reflects the rest of your life, because if you are a highly organised
person, then you wouldn't be asking this question.

The ideal, fantastic, machinists erotic dream is to have a storeman,
who checks things in and out, organises consumerables, replaces broken
tooling, has every item in the size you need, and cleans and oils your
machines at the end of the day.... The trade off is their nearly
always grumpy *******s cause they have to put up with you being slack
and hopeless and disorganised.... (apprentices take some time to
recognise that you NEVER atagonise the storeman, as he can make your
life absolute hell with very little effort on his part. You must
remember Xmas, and preferably his birthday as well, and take keen
interest in pictures of his grandchildren....)

Yep, Total Fantasy - the real world, mm, yes - a bit different, as
follows....

My shop - totally chaotic, have a vague idea where "some" things are -
the measuring tools in their own drawer, the rest.......have started
buying small plastic boxes, the 3 for $2 kind, they stack easy, label
them with a dymo machine, even built their own shelves for
them.....one day, I will finish cleaning up and sorting and actually
put things in them.....(hey, theres so many more interesting things to
do....)

One method that has a at least 95% chance of finding the "lost" tool
is to start a methodical clean up, starting with the workbench,
putting things back into racks/pegboard etc,spreading ever wider until
you find it. If your "sorta lucky" you will get to clean and wipe down
your benches just before you find said lost item. (then you can stop,
until the next lost tool crisis......) Oh, and the swarf tray under
the lathe is the LAST place you look - not because it is not likely to
be in there, its just a pig of a job.

A fatal thing to do is randomly stuff tools, consumerables wherever
they can fit at the time. Especially in unmarked boxes, or plastic
crates under the bench - you will have to do serious excavation to
find anything, complicated by being in the wrong section in the first
place....and get sidetracked by finding decoy items as you go...

The most deadly of all is to have something in your hand when the
phone rings - you will have no conscious memory of putting it down, so
theres no chance of finding it. Plus, small items ABSOLUTELY hate
light, they will try to scurry under benches and into dark corners
behind usually bloody heavy and hard to move items.

So. There. Didn't give you a solution, just telling it like it is. If
your a machinist for a living, either an employee or working for
yourself - your correct, its not a problem. Because if it was a
problem, your employer, or you, would go bust.

Hey, if its been chaotic for you for eons, it aint going to change -
think of some ways to make it easier, rather than the moon shot of
total re-organisation.

Remember, its only a hobby, its only a hobby, its only a hobby.

(and I have managed to waste 20 minutes writing all this, still have
boxes of "Junque" to sort out, and jobs to do.....if I can find the
right bit of aluminium I "know" is in here somewhere, I distinctly
remember saying to myself "mm, this will come in useful one day,
better keep it..."


Andrew VK3BFA.

On Sat, 06 Dec 2008 01:21:56 -0500, the infamous Gerald Miller
scrawled the following:

On Thu, 04 Dec 2008 21:26:19 -0800, "Paul Hovnanian P.E."
wrote:

Jim Wilkins wrote:

[snip]

I tried to outline tools on a pegboard at home and gave up quickly,
not enough wall space. My pegboards are half a dozen tools deep on
each peg. It makes a lot more sense in an open school/company shop, so
the person in "charge", me, knows when something has been borrowed and
can point at the space and shrug when someone else wants it. There was
no way a lowly lab tech could enforce rules or a signout sheet on
Ph.D.'s

A friend of mine outfitted his shop with a large pegboard wall with
hooks and silhouettes of each tool attached to its assigned place.

He claims that its the best system to use when one has a couple of
teenage boys, as he can take one look at all the markings on the
pegboard and know exactly how many tools he used to have.

Yeahbut whatdyado when each hook has three or more items hung on it?

I think you missed the point, Gerry. The pegboard tools are all for
the kids. You keep the REAL tools locked up in your good tool boxes
where they can't be used as hammers, prybars, paint stirrers, etc.

As to what to do, lock the garage door the next time the perp enters
it and tell them that they can come out only after the tools are
returned to their proper spots.

--
Smell is a potent wizard that transports you across
thousands of miles and all the years you have lived.
-- Helen Keller

"Wild_Bill" wrote in message
...
I've found this part to be very true, Andrew..

Hey, if its been chaotic for you for eons, it aint going to change -
think of some ways to make it easier, rather than the moon shot of
total re-organisation.

I have yet to see a disorganized person become organized. I've taken it
upon myself to clean and organize other guys' shops and garages because
they were constantly bitchin and going into fits of rage for not being
able to find what they needed, even though it was nearby.




The damnedest part of it is, I usually wind up owning at least THREE of most
every really useful hand-tool. Cause when you REALLY need it, the original
can't be found, and it is usually (easier/simpler/quicker - take your pick)
to run around to the "toy store" and buy one more ('cause you just never
know when you might need it).

(In my will, my entire claw-hammer collection will be divided between my
kids and my best friend down the street, with a few left over nail the box
shut)

Flash

On 2008-12-07, Flash wrote:

[ ... ]

The damnedest part of it is, I usually wind up owning at least THREE of most
every really useful hand-tool. Cause when you REALLY need it, the original
can't be found, and it is usually (easier/simpler/quicker - take your pick)
to run around to the "toy store" and buy one more ('cause you just never
know when you might need it).

Hmm ... I've *intentionally* bought extras of a tool that I
could find. Examples are digital calipers and digital 0-1" micrometers.
(The larger sizes I have only one each of, of course, but there is a
Starrett digital mic and digital 0-6" caliper near the Emco-Maier
Compact-5/CNC lathe (and the Emco C5 toy milling machine), and the other
of each (Mitutoyo caliper and SPI micrometer IIRC) are normally kept
within reach of the Clausing 12x24" lathe, and sometimes moved near the
Nichols horizontal mill and the 7" Rockwell/Delta (really AMMCO design)
shaper.

Granted -- both original and secondary purchases were eBay
auctions at pretty good prices.

Oh yes -- there is also a cheap Digital caliper upstairs near
the computer -- except that I haven't seen it for a couple of weeks.
That one was $18.00 at a hamfest -- complete with a Whitworth thread
chart on the back. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---