The company's stock seems down a good bit and I've heard rumors of
one of those accounting scandals and read bits of it on the web.
Supposedly there's a recent WSJ article about it all but I've not seen
it though I suscribe to WSJ online. Anyone know what's up?

Many thanks, Charles Morrill

"Charles Morrill" wrote in message
news:200504241708441575%deichles@yahoocom...
The company's stock seems down a good bit and I've heard rumors of one
of those accounting scandals and read bits of it on the web. Supposedly
there's a recent WSJ article about it all but I've not seen it though I
suscribe to WSJ online. Anyone know what's up?

Many thanks, Charles Morrill



This article make it sound like everything is ok today;
http://www.atholdailynews.com/700Des...d_y=3905&d_m=4


They did have some probems associated with their CMM's back in 2002
http://www.telegram.com/static/starr...v8charges.html

Lane

All I know is I sent them about 20 1"x 130" saw blades for welding, and they
informed me that not only would they *not* weld the blades, they were going
to *throw them out*!!!!
And righteously snippy about it!!!!
Well, you can well imagine the multiple imprints of my head in my ceiling.
They eventually sent them back.

The pernt bein:
If the rest of their company is run like their blade welding dept, they
likely got *big* goddamm problems.
I avoid Starrett like the plague, just on GP.
----------------------------
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll
"Charles Morrill" wrote in message
news:200504241708441575%deichles@yahoocom...
The company's stock seems down a good bit and I've heard rumors of one
of those accounting scandals and read bits of it on the web. Supposedly
there's a recent WSJ article about it all but I've not seen it though I
suscribe to WSJ online. Anyone know what's up?

Many thanks, Charles Morrill

"Proctologically Violated©®" wrote in message
...
All I know is I sent them about 20 1"x 130" saw blades for welding, and
they informed me that not only would they *not* weld the blades, they were
going to *throw them out*!!!!
And righteously snippy about it!!!!
Well, you can well imagine the multiple imprints of my head in my ceiling.
They eventually sent them back.

The pernt bein:
If the rest of their company is run like their blade welding dept, they
likely got *big* goddamm problems.
I avoid Starrett like the plague, just on GP.
----------------------------


I'm wondering why you thought that they would weld your blades. I wouldn't
send my Ford PU back to the factory for tire changes.

Lane

"Lane" lane (no spam) at copperaccents dot com wrote in message
news

"Proctologically Violated©®" wrote in message
...
All I know is I sent them about 20 1"x 130" saw blades for welding, and
they informed me that not only would they *not* weld the blades, they
were
going to *throw them out*!!!!
And righteously snippy about it!!!!
Well, you can well imagine the multiple imprints of my head in my
ceiling.
They eventually sent them back.

The pernt bein:
If the rest of their company is run like their blade welding dept, they
likely got *big* goddamm problems.
I avoid Starrett like the plague, just on GP.
----------------------------


I'm wondering why you thought that they would weld your blades. I wouldn't
send my Ford PU back to the factory for tire changes.

Lane


Uh huh! Unless they advertise that they accept stray blades for welding,
it's a huge mistake to assume they'd welcome them. I weld blades and know
that not all material is created equally. Their equipment is likely proper
for the stock they offer, so they can stand behind the work they do when you
buy their blades.

Imagine the potential mess they'd endure as blades arrived that weren't
worth welding----teeth missing, teeth well worn, badly rusted stock---
blades that ended up the wrong length----- the list is endless.

Harold

In article , Proctologically Violated©® says...

All I know is I sent them about 20 1"x 130" saw blades for welding, and they
informed me that not only would they *not* weld the blades, they were going
to *throw them out*!!!!

Ah, lemme get this straight - were these blades made by starrett?

Jim


--
==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at pkmfgvm4 (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================

I sent them because my tool supplier, a Starrett dealer/rep, told me they do
blade welding, and that he routinely sends blades to them for welding.
In fact, HE sent them!
Don't mind them not welding them, do mind my blades in their garbage.

Again, a peculiar way to deal w/ customers....

Yer local Do-All dealer may do blade welding as well. Good job, too. Ours,
in Queens, NY, has a hellified blade welder, about the size of a desk.
Do-All don't threaten to throw out yer blades.... they may laugh a little,
at quiltwork-blades, but they'll still weld'em...
----------------------------
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll
"Proctologically Violated©®" wrote in message
...
All I know is I sent them about 20 1"x 130" saw blades for welding, and
they informed me that not only would they *not* weld the blades, they were
going to *throw them out*!!!!
And righteously snippy about it!!!!
Well, you can well imagine the multiple imprints of my head in my ceiling.
They eventually sent them back.

The pernt bein:
If the rest of their company is run like their blade welding dept, they
likely got *big* goddamm problems.
I avoid Starrett like the plague, just on GP.
----------------------------
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll
"Charles Morrill" wrote in message
news:200504241708441575%deichles@yahoocom...
The company's stock seems down a good bit and I've heard rumors of
one of those accounting scandals and read bits of it on the web.
Supposedly there's a recent WSJ article about it all but I've not seen it
though I suscribe to WSJ online. Anyone know what's up?

Many thanks, Charles Morrill

On Mon, 25 Apr 2005 19:19:25 -0400, "Proctologically Violated©®"
wrote:

I sent them because my tool supplier, a Starrett dealer/rep, told me they do
blade welding, and that he routinely sends blades to them for welding.
In fact, HE sent them!
Don't mind them not welding them, do mind my blades in their garbage.

Again, a peculiar way to deal w/ customers....

Yer local Do-All dealer may do blade welding as well. Good job, too. Ours,
in Queens, NY, has a hellified blade welder, about the size of a desk.
Do-All don't threaten to throw out yer blades.... they may laugh a little,
at quiltwork-blades, but they'll still weld'em...
----------------------------
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll
"Proctologically Violated©®" wrote in message
...
All I know is I sent them about 20 1"x 130" saw blades for welding, and
they informed me that not only would they *not* weld the blades, they were
going to *throw them out*!!!!
And righteously snippy about it!!!!
Well, you can well imagine the multiple imprints of my head in my ceiling.
They eventually sent them back.

The pernt bein:
If the rest of their company is run like their blade welding dept, they
likely got *big* goddamm problems.
I avoid Starrett like the plague, just on GP.
----------------------------
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll
"Charles Morrill" wrote in message
news:200504241708441575%deichles@yahoocom...
The company's stock seems down a good bit and I've heard rumors of
one of those accounting scandals and read bits of it on the web.
Supposedly there's a recent WSJ article about it all but I've not seen it
though I suscribe to WSJ online. Anyone know what's up?

Many thanks, Charles Morrill




I don't know how Starret stays in business anymore. Since I haven't
bought anything from them for a long time because of bad experiences I
don't know how they are acting today, but it looks like they haven't
changed. It's too bad. They used to have good products, properly
finished, and delivered timely.
ERS

yeah, and did you expect them to pickup the freight for the return trip? You
see, if you didn't buy the the blades from Starrett, you can't call yourself
a customer so don't expect any special treatment. If I worked there I would
have told you to come to Athol and pick them up.

Tony

"Proctologically Violated©®" wrote in message
...
I sent them because my tool supplier, a Starrett dealer/rep, told me they
do
blade welding, and that he routinely sends blades to them for welding.
In fact, HE sent them!
Don't mind them not welding them, do mind my blades in their garbage.

Again, a peculiar way to deal w/ customers....

Yer local Do-All dealer may do blade welding as well. Good job, too.
Ours,
in Queens, NY, has a hellified blade welder, about the size of a desk.
Do-All don't threaten to throw out yer blades.... they may laugh a little,
at quiltwork-blades, but they'll still weld'em...
----------------------------
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll
"Proctologically Violated©®" wrote in message
...
All I know is I sent them about 20 1"x 130" saw blades for welding, and
they informed me that not only would they *not* weld the blades, they
were
going to *throw them out*!!!!
And righteously snippy about it!!!!
Well, you can well imagine the multiple imprints of my head in my
ceiling.
They eventually sent them back.

The pernt bein:
If the rest of their company is run like their blade welding dept, they
likely got *big* goddamm problems.
I avoid Starrett like the plague, just on GP.
----------------------------
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll
"Charles Morrill" wrote in message
news:200504241708441575%deichles@yahoocom...
The company's stock seems down a good bit and I've heard rumors of
one of those accounting scandals and read bits of it on the web.
Supposedly there's a recent WSJ article about it all but I've not seen
it
though I suscribe to WSJ online. Anyone know what's up?

Many thanks, Charles Morrill

Is there a problem here???

I don't have a problem with them not welding my ****....

I don't have a problem paying the freight for my ****...
Altho, when you think about it, when they just refuse to do the work cuz the
fukn blade metallurgy wadn't up to their fukn standards, one wonders whether
one *should* have to pay return freight...

I had a problem with those cocksuckers tryna throw my **** out...

Izzat clear? Finally??
It really isn't complicated.... but I can explain it again....

Mebbe this difficulty in grokking an asshole company like Starrett is how
Starrett manages to stay in bidniss?
----------------------------
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll
"Tony" wrote in message
...
yeah, and did you expect them to pickup the freight for the return trip?
You
see, if you didn't buy the the blades from Starrett, you can't call
yourself
a customer so don't expect any special treatment. If I worked there I
would
have told you to come to Athol and pick them up.

Tony

"Proctologically Violated©®" wrote in message
...
I sent them because my tool supplier, a Starrett dealer/rep, told me they
do
blade welding, and that he routinely sends blades to them for welding.
In fact, HE sent them!
Don't mind them not welding them, do mind my blades in their garbage.

Again, a peculiar way to deal w/ customers....

Yer local Do-All dealer may do blade welding as well. Good job, too.
Ours,
in Queens, NY, has a hellified blade welder, about the size of a desk.
Do-All don't threaten to throw out yer blades.... they may laugh a
little,
at quiltwork-blades, but they'll still weld'em...
----------------------------
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll
"Proctologically Violated©®" wrote in message
...
All I know is I sent them about 20 1"x 130" saw blades for welding, and
they informed me that not only would they *not* weld the blades, they
were
going to *throw them out*!!!!
And righteously snippy about it!!!!
Well, you can well imagine the multiple imprints of my head in my
ceiling.
They eventually sent them back.

The pernt bein:
If the rest of their company is run like their blade welding dept, they
likely got *big* goddamm problems.
I avoid Starrett like the plague, just on GP.
----------------------------
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll
"Charles Morrill" wrote in message
news:200504241708441575%deichles@yahoocom...
The company's stock seems down a good bit and I've heard rumors of
one of those accounting scandals and read bits of it on the web.
Supposedly there's a recent WSJ article about it all but I've not seen
it
though I suscribe to WSJ online. Anyone know what's up?

Many thanks, Charles Morrill

"Proctologically Violated©®" wrote in message
...
I sent them because my tool supplier, a Starrett dealer/rep, told me they
do
blade welding, and that he routinely sends blades to them for welding.
In fact, HE sent them!
Don't mind them not welding them, do mind my blades in their garbage.

Again, a peculiar way to deal w/ customers....


Chuckle! Sounds like the Starrett dealer/rep was well trained by Starrett!

I agree, they shouldn't have made the garbage decision for
you-----especially today when a long distance call takes seconds and costs
next to nothing. Customers deserve more respect than that.

Not to worry. If they have such an attitude, it won't be long until the
Chinese are putting out comparable products and they, like other over-priced
and under quality operations here in the US will be out of business. We,
as a nation, seem to be slow in getting the message. We can no longer do
business "as usual".

Harold

On Mon, 25 Apr 2005 11:45:43 -0400, "Proctologically Violated©®"
wrote:

All I know is I sent them about 20 1"x 130" saw blades for welding, and they
informed me that not only would they *not* weld the blades, they were going
to *throw them out*!!!!
And righteously snippy about it!!!!
Well, you can well imagine the multiple imprints of my head in my ceiling.
They eventually sent them back.

The pernt bein:
If the rest of their company is run like their blade welding dept, they
likely got *big* goddamm problems.
I avoid Starrett like the plague, just on GP.


You need a box of 1" 10T raker set Nicholson blade stock? Ill trade
you for a box of 3/4" 10T I could even live with 6T if I had to.

Gunner

----------------------------
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll
"Charles Morrill" wrote in message
news:200504241708441575%deichles@yahoocom...
The company's stock seems down a good bit and I've heard rumors of one
of those accounting scandals and read bits of it on the web. Supposedly
there's a recent WSJ article about it all but I've not seen it though I
suscribe to WSJ online. Anyone know what's up?

Many thanks, Charles Morrill



"At the core of liberalism is the spoiled child -
miserable, as all spoiled children are, unsatisfied,
demanding, ill-disciplined, despotic and useless.
Liberalism is a philosphy of sniveling brats." -- P.J. O'Rourke

"Harold and Susan Vordos" wrote in
:

Not to worry. If they have such an attitude, it won't be long until
the Chinese are putting out comparable products and they, like other
over-priced and under quality operations here in the US will be out of
business. We, as a nation, seem to be slow in getting the message.
We can no longer do business "as usual".

Heh. Starrett "Exact" dial calipers are made in China. I guess they figured
the quality wouldn't be any different. They still sell for over $100.00
though. $200.00+ for 12 inchers. For that kind of dough I'll take the Brown
& Sharpe Swiss made ones. Or Etalon.

--

Dan

I'm sorry to hear complaints about Starrett's service. Given their
reputation, the only future for them is probably to go up market. I
routinely buy their stuff and like it a good bit but it seems awfully
expensive sometimes. I've had good luck with their customer service.
Recently I sent my three year old digital calipers back to them when
the display stopped functioning correctly. They rebuilt them completely
and didn't charge me anything. I was quite impressed.
They ought to think about making limited runs of some of their
tools for collectors. Perhaps they do and I've not heard.

charles morrill

On Tue, 26 Apr 2005 23:59:22 GMT, the renowned Charles Morrill
wrote:

I'm sorry to hear complaints about Starrett's service. Given their
reputation, the only future for them is probably to go up market. I
routinely buy their stuff and like it a good bit but it seems awfully
expensive sometimes. I've had good luck with their customer service.
Recently I sent my three year old digital calipers back to them when
the display stopped functioning correctly. They rebuilt them completely
and didn't charge me anything. I was quite impressed.
They ought to think about making limited runs of some of their
tools for collectors. Perhaps they do and I've not heard.

charles morrill

The big problem they had with the US government a few years ago had to
do with coordinate measuring machines (really upmarket compared to
micrometers) that allegedly did not perform properly. From some
complaints I read on the web, and if I remember correctly, it might
have had more to do with software issues than mechanical quality.


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

"D Murphy" wrote in message
...
"Harold and Susan Vordos" wrote in
:

Not to worry. If they have such an attitude, it won't be long until
the Chinese are putting out comparable products and they, like other
over-priced and under quality operations here in the US will be out of
business. We, as a nation, seem to be slow in getting the message.
We can no longer do business "as usual".

Heh. Starrett "Exact" dial calipers are made in China. I guess they
figured
the quality wouldn't be any different. They still sell for over $100.00
though. $200.00+ for 12 inchers. For that kind of dough I'll take the
Brown
& Sharpe Swiss made ones. Or Etalon.
Dan


Yep! Hard to argue with that, and I have a toolbox full of Starrett stuff.
Their "Last Word" (DTI) indicators are nothing short of garbage ( I can
say that, I have one). I have two B&S BesTest indicators that are likely
the finest indicator there is for use on machines. The LW is not reliable
and often gives poor results. They're worthless when working under a
thou.

Harold

In article , Harold and Susan Vordos says...

The LW is not reliable
and often gives poor results. They're worthless when working under a
thou.

While I agree with you on the bestest indicators (recently purchased
one here at work) I would have to say you are going to be
perpetually doomed to disapointment if you expect an indicator
which has graduations down to a thousanth, to be reliable down
*below* a thousanth. [1]

Yes I know some last words have half thou tick marks. But the
spacing is the same between thousanths.

I do own one last work that has tenths graduations, and it does
read reliably in that range. This is the 711-D-10. The besttest
is noticeably nicer than that one.

Jim

[1] this is richard feynan's "The Last Click Is Never Any Good"
theory. Basically it says that in any instrument, the last digit
on the dial, or the last click on the switch (in, say, an amplifier
gain setting, or a scope timebase setting) is basically a JC
maneuver by the manufacturer.

It should never be really believed because if it were solid, the
manufacturer would say 'hey, we can squeeze out one more digit
or one more dial click' so the scope can have a 0.01 microsecond
per division last click on the dial, instead of a 0.1 microsecond
click.

So the manufacturing algorithm is: make an instrument, and see how
reliably and repeatably it measures. Then put one more division on
the dial, one more digit on the meter, or one more click on the
switch. Then market and sell. This is what starrett did when they
put a half tenths division on those last word indicators.

Sounds crazy I know, but the rule is true more often than not. It's
a rare manufacturer who's instruments can meet the spec with factors
of two or five left over. You probably know all of them by name,
in your field of expertise. In my business they have names like
Tektronix, or Agilent (formely HP).

The "Last Click Is Never Any Good" rule is a corolary to my bosses
"The last click on the dial is what costs all the money" maxim


--
==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at pkmfgvm4 (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================

Surely you jest....
----------------------------
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll
"jim rozen" wrote in message
...
In article , Harold and Susan Vordos says...

The LW is not reliable
and often gives poor results. They're worthless when working under a
thou.

While I agree with you on the bestest indicators (recently purchased
one here at work) I would have to say you are going to be
perpetually doomed to disapointment if you expect an indicator
which has graduations down to a thousanth, to be reliable down
*below* a thousanth. [1]

Yes I know some last words have half thou tick marks. But the
spacing is the same between thousanths.

I do own one last work that has tenths graduations, and it does
read reliably in that range. This is the 711-D-10. The besttest
is noticeably nicer than that one.

Jim

[1] this is richard feynan's "The Last Click Is Never Any Good"
theory. Basically it says that in any instrument, the last digit
on the dial, or the last click on the switch (in, say, an amplifier
gain setting, or a scope timebase setting) is basically a JC
maneuver by the manufacturer.

It should never be really believed because if it were solid, the
manufacturer would say 'hey, we can squeeze out one more digit
or one more dial click' so the scope can have a 0.01 microsecond
per division last click on the dial, instead of a 0.1 microsecond
click.

So the manufacturing algorithm is: make an instrument, and see how
reliably and repeatably it measures. Then put one more division on
the dial, one more digit on the meter, or one more click on the
switch. Then market and sell. This is what starrett did when they
put a half tenths division on those last word indicators.

Sounds crazy I know, but the rule is true more often than not. It's
a rare manufacturer who's instruments can meet the spec with factors
of two or five left over. You probably know all of them by name,
in your field of expertise. In my business they have names like
Tektronix, or Agilent (formely HP).

The "Last Click Is Never Any Good" rule is a corolary to my bosses
"The last click on the dial is what costs all the money" maxim


--
==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at pkmfgvm4 (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================

"jim rozen" wrote in message
...
In article , Harold and Susan Vordos says...

The LW is not reliable
and often gives poor results. They're worthless when working under a
thou.

While I agree with you on the bestest indicators (recently purchased
one here at work) I would have to say you are going to be
perpetually doomed to disapointment if you expect an indicator
which has graduations down to a thousanth, to be reliable down
*below* a thousanth. [1]

Yes I know some last words have half thou tick marks. But the
spacing is the same between thousanths.

I do own one last work that has tenths graduations, and it does
read reliably in that range. This is the 711-D-10. The besttest
is noticeably nicer than that one.

Jim

I've owned a Last Word for over 46 years. It has been returned to Starrett
once in its lifetime, and worked at what I would consider an acceptable
level for a minor fraction of its life in my possession. By contrast,
I've owned both of my BesTest indicators for well over 30 years, and neither
of them has had any attention aside from the crystal being replaced in one
of them, and the other now in need of the same thing. Mechanically, they
are flawless and can be trusted to .0002" with no problems. These are
both calibrated in half thou increments.

The Last Word indicator suffers from a dreadful design. All it takes to get
one working poorly is to bump the point, driving the jeweled arm out of the
spiral shaft. Maybe they considered that a safety feature, to protect the
guts of the indicator. Dunno. The one thing for sure is, they lack the
necessary sensitivity to function properly. It's not uncommon to dial in
an object with a LW, then follow up with a different indicator, only to find
the object is not running true as indicated by the LW. When it gets down to
minor adjustments, the needle tends to not move, but the entire body of the
indicator flexes instead, absorbing the runout, indicating a true surface.
Mine rarely comes out of the toolbox anymore. The one place it was used
with good success, and it will once again when I finally get the shop fully
set up, is on precision grinding machines, where one sets taper. It
served flawlessly on a centerless grinder, as well as on cylindrical and
internal machines. Beyond that, I refuse to even try anymore. What's
the point?

Harold

"Harold and Susan Vordos" wrote in
:

Yep! Hard to argue with that, and I have a toolbox full of Starrett
stuff. Their "Last Word" (DTI) indicators are nothing short of
garbage ( I can say that, I have one). I have two B&S BesTest
indicators that are likely the finest indicator there is for use on
machines. The LW is not reliable and often gives poor results.
They're worthless when working under a thou.

I just bought a brand new BesTest to replace one that was damaged. I fixed
the old one so now I can save the new one for use when I really need to be
..0001" or better. IMO the BesTest is the best all around indicator even if
it is a lttle light. The Compac is more accurate, heavier, and better
built but it doesn't always fit where I need it to. For bench inspection
it's hands down the best choice. The Interapid I have is very well built
and very accurate provided you can get it set at the proper angle, which is
very hard to do anywhere else but on a surface plate. So that's where I use
that one. I always say that the Interapid is the best built most miserable
P.O.S. indicator I've ever seen. I stole a brand new Mitutoyo in the
plastic wrap, off of Ebay for less money than you could probably scrounge
in change out of your couch. So far it's been a good indicator. It has a
slim design and a small dial so it fits into places where no other
indicator will fit. I don't know how it would fare in every day use, it's
kind of light. Plus I have a hell of a time seeing anything small anymore.
Which is another reason to look at the Compac, they make some models with
big dials. But when I need to dial in a 7mm Swiss, the Mitutoyo and an eye
loupe are the only way I've found to get it done.

--

Dan

"D Murphy" wrote in message
...
Spehro Pefhany wrote in
:

The big problem they had with the US government a few years ago had to
do with coordinate measuring machines (really upmarket compared to
micrometers) that allegedly did not perform properly. From some
complaints I read on the web, and if I remember correctly, it might
have had more to do with software issues than mechanical quality.

It was both a software issue and a mechanical issue. The mechanical issue
had to do with components made out of Aluminum which caused thermal
displacement. The government got involved because some of these CMM's were
being used by contratcors to the DOD, and someone turned them in under the
"Whistleblower Law." The real problem is that Starrett alledgedly knew
about these problems and didn't tell their customers. Considering that
there are plenty of applications where failure to measure accurately puts
lives at risk, there is no excuse for Starrett not disclosing these
problems to their customers immediately.


Yeah, and it did take half of forever to get my blades back...
----------------------------
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll


--

Dan