On 6/8/2020 11:48 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 6/8/2020 11:13 AM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article ,
says...

Real estate taxes are on the land here, not the house.

Here, real estate taxes are on the land and all permanent
structures.Â* It's calculated based on the price you paid
when you bought the property (plus annual increases for
increases in the value of the property).




Here the land is taxed at one value depending on the usage and the
buildings at whatever the county decides the building is worth.

Cars are taxed with a seperate bill when youÂ* get a tag.Â* Not sure about
a car tax if it is just sitting around without a tag.



When I lived in CT it was taxed if registered.Â* No car tax or
inspections here in FL.

I see there are 23 states plus DC that don't charge personal property
tax on automobiles. That leaves 27 states that do.

That site didn't state about sales tax; figure virtually all have it for
the one-time charge.

As I suppose most, KS collects the personal property tax when you get
your tags; only $10 or so for title and tag fee, the personal property
tax bite is pretty steep and based on a lookup table for the vehicle.
Rate will be somewhat different on county-by-county basis.

--

On Monday, June 8, 2020 at 3:34:34 PM UTC-4, dpb wrote:
On 6/8/2020 11:48 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 6/8/2020 11:13 AM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article ,
says...

Real estate taxes are on the land here, not the house.

Here, real estate taxes are on the land and all permanent
structures.Â* It's calculated based on the price you paid
when you bought the property (plus annual increases for
increases in the value of the property).




Here the land is taxed at one value depending on the usage and the
buildings at whatever the county decides the building is worth.

Cars are taxed with a seperate bill when youÂ* get a tag.Â* Not sure about
a car tax if it is just sitting around without a tag.



When I lived in CT it was taxed if registered.Â* No car tax or
inspections here in FL.

I see there are 23 states plus DC that don't charge personal property
tax on automobiles. That leaves 27 states that do.

That site didn't state about sales tax; figure virtually all have it for
the one-time charge.

As I suppose most, KS collects the personal property tax when you get
your tags; only $10 or so for title and tag fee, the personal property
tax bite is pretty steep and based on a lookup table for the vehicle.
Rate will be somewhat different on county-by-county basis.

--

We don't have personal property tax, but the fee for the tags every
year is something like $150 for my 2004 Highlander. It amounts to
a tax, since it's nowhere near that much to process the tag renewal.

Cindy Hamilton

In article ,
says...

We don't have personal property tax, but the fee for the tags every
year is something like $150 for my 2004 Highlander. It amounts to
a tax, since it's nowhere near that much to process the tag renewal.



I guess it evens out around here. It is 36 for the tag renewal . They
give you a sticker to put on the plate with the new year. Then property
tax that depends on what the vehicle value is by a chart.


Just about the same but by a different name.
Overall I think ours is a little less, but not a whole lot.

On Sun, 7 Jun 2020 21:55:59 -0600, rbowman posted for all of us
to digest...


On 06/07/2020 08:55 PM, Jake56 wrote:


"rbowman" wrote in message
...
On 06/07/2020 01:47 PM, Jake56 wrote:


"rbowman" wrote in message
...
On 06/07/2020 07:29 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
On Sunday, June 7, 2020 at 9:12:41 AM UTC-4, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 6/6/20 11:12 PM, rbowman wrote:
On 06/06/2020 07:12 PM, Dean Hoffman wrote:
From Oz.
https://www.businessinsider.com/tiny-house-guys-urban-tiny-self-sufficient-home-wheels-2020-6




That's one of the ugliest tiny houses I've ever seen.
The idea of climbing a ladder to sleep doesn't appeal to me.
The
exterior just needs a few hippie style flowers and
maybe a portrait of the original Woodstock crowd to perk it right up.
I'll admit I'm too old to climb a ladder to sleep. Or, more to the
point,
to descend a ladder with a full bladder in the middle of the night.

Chamber pot...

Bit tricky getting down the ladder with a full one.

Go medieval; dump it out the window on passersby.

There is no window at that level and no passersby either.

Review the photo captioned 'The lofted bedroom is up the ladder beside
the kitchen.' You might have to wait for the passerby, preferably a
plumbing inspector.

Good one

--
Tekkie

On Mon, 8 Jun 2020 11:13:53 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Real estate taxes are on the land here, not the house.

Here, real estate taxes are on the land and all permanent
structures. It's calculated based on the price you paid
when you bought the property (plus annual increases for
increases in the value of the property).




Here the land is taxed at one value depending on the usage and the
buildings at whatever the county decides the building is worth.

Cars are taxed with a seperate bill when you get a tag. Not sure about
a car tax if it is just sitting around without a tag.


If you don't have tags, you don't pay the tag tax. My neighbor has a
race car in his driveway that is exactly that way.
The village tried to screw with him about having a "derelict vehicle"
because it was up on jack stands but the county code specifically
allows off road vehicles on your property. He keeps it off the tires
because they would flat spot and his tires cost more than some
people's cars. The car itself is way up in the Benz range in price.
I helped him with the code citations and the village slinked away.

On Mon, 08 Jun 2020 11:37:36 -0400, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 8 Jun 2020 08:22:01 -0700 (PDT), Cindy
Hamilton wrote:

On Monday, June 8, 2020 at 11:14:06 AM UTC-4, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article ,
says...

Real estate taxes are on the land here, not the house.

Here, real estate taxes are on the land and all permanent
structures. It's calculated based on the price you paid
when you bought the property (plus annual increases for
increases in the value of the property).




Here the land is taxed at one value depending on the usage and the
buildings at whatever the county decides the building is worth.

There are some places where assessed valuation does not go up until yo
usell the property. It encourages improvements and rewards ownership
but also makes it seem harder to move to another house or condo.

I have never been in a state like that. In fact that is why they have
"Save our Homes" or "Prop sumpin" laws, to cap assessments at some
low number for homesteaded properties. It is 3% in Florida.



No so dissimilar from here. I have experience only with residential
real estate.

Cars are taxed with a seperate bill when you get a tag. Not sure about
a car tax if it is just sitting around without a tag.

They call that a "fee" here (but it's probably a tax, in effect).
It's based on the (IIRC) MSRP of the car when it was new.

Cindy Hamilton

Until now, Indiana was the only state I knew of that taxed ownership of
cars. Registration and plates in states I've lived in are not
dependent on the value of the car.

I think Virginia had a "personal property tax" too and that included
cars.
Most states do tax on weight or some other metric tho when you get
your plates. Don't be confused, the main function of tags on cars is a
tax receipt. Everything else is bull****.

On Mon, 8 Jun 2020 12:48:43 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 6/8/2020 11:13 AM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article ,
says...

Real estate taxes are on the land here, not the house.

Here, real estate taxes are on the land and all permanent
structures. It's calculated based on the price you paid
when you bought the property (plus annual increases for
increases in the value of the property).




Here the land is taxed at one value depending on the usage and the
buildings at whatever the county decides the building is worth.

Cars are taxed with a seperate bill when you get a tag. Not sure about
a car tax if it is just sitting around without a tag.



When I lived in CT it was taxed if registered. No car tax or
inspections here in FL.

Not exactly true. A car coming into Florida, new or one you brought
from up north will get an impact fee (tax) and that is a few hundred
bucks. The only way out of that is if you have an old tag that was
still valid, even if expired (not replaced by another tag).
I still have an old tag here (~20 years old) that would get me out of
an impact fee if I wanted to add another vehicle to the fleet.

On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 04:38:43 +1000, "Rod Speed"
wrote:



"Cindy Hamilton" wrote in message
...
On Sunday, June 7, 2020 at 6:29:23 PM UTC-4, Rod Speed wrote:

Real estate taxes are on the land here, not the house.

Here, real estate taxes are on the land and all permanent
structures. It's calculated based on the price you paid
when you bought the property (plus annual increases for
increases in the value of the property).

Yeah, but it's an australian micro house on wheels,
so Greg's line about getting it registered as an RV
isnt even possible, it has no engine to drive it and
it wouldnt be registrable as a caravan either given
that it isn't road worthy. You would have to get a
permit to move it on the road in most states.


The differentiation between an RV and a (park model) mobile home has
nothing to do with being self propelled here. It really comes down to
whether HUD certifies it as a dwelling.
I found all of this out when my SIL bought a "tiny home" before tiny
homes were cool. He was a park ranger and they didn't have kids so his
home was as portable as his job. It made it a lot easier to work his
way up through the bureaucracy. If a better job opened, he could move
at a moment's notice.

On 6/8/2020 5:14 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 8 Jun 2020 12:48:43 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 6/8/2020 11:13 AM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article ,
says...

Real estate taxes are on the land here, not the house.

Here, real estate taxes are on the land and all permanent
structures. It's calculated based on the price you paid
when you bought the property (plus annual increases for
increases in the value of the property).




Here the land is taxed at one value depending on the usage and the
buildings at whatever the county decides the building is worth.

Cars are taxed with a seperate bill when you get a tag. Not sure about
a car tax if it is just sitting around without a tag.



When I lived in CT it was taxed if registered. No car tax or
inspections here in FL.

Not exactly true. A car coming into Florida, new or one you brought
from up north will get an impact fee (tax) and that is a few hundred
bucks. The only way out of that is if you have an old tag that was
still valid, even if expired (not replaced by another tag).
I still have an old tag here (~20 years old) that would get me out of
an impact fee if I wanted to add another vehicle to the fleet.



I paid no impact fee. My car was 13 months old when I moved here. Just
Googled it and it has been rescinded some years ago.

On Mon, 8 Jun 2020 17:24:25 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 6/8/2020 5:14 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 8 Jun 2020 12:48:43 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 6/8/2020 11:13 AM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article ,
says...

Real estate taxes are on the land here, not the house.

Here, real estate taxes are on the land and all permanent
structures. It's calculated based on the price you paid
when you bought the property (plus annual increases for
increases in the value of the property).




Here the land is taxed at one value depending on the usage and the
buildings at whatever the county decides the building is worth.

Cars are taxed with a seperate bill when you get a tag. Not sure about
a car tax if it is just sitting around without a tag.



When I lived in CT it was taxed if registered. No car tax or
inspections here in FL.

Not exactly true. A car coming into Florida, new or one you brought
from up north will get an impact fee (tax) and that is a few hundred
bucks. The only way out of that is if you have an old tag that was
still valid, even if expired (not replaced by another tag).
I still have an old tag here (~20 years old) that would get me out of
an impact fee if I wanted to add another vehicle to the fleet.



I paid no impact fee. My car was 13 months old when I moved here. Just
Googled it and it has been rescinded some years ago.

OK, Good to know.
Regular readers know, I don't buy a lot of cars. It was still here the
last time I did.

wrote in message
...
On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 04:38:43 +1000, "Rod Speed"
wrote:



"Cindy Hamilton" wrote in message
...
On Sunday, June 7, 2020 at 6:29:23 PM UTC-4, Rod Speed wrote:

Real estate taxes are on the land here, not the house.

Here, real estate taxes are on the land and all permanent
structures. It's calculated based on the price you paid
when you bought the property (plus annual increases for
increases in the value of the property).

Yeah, but it's an australian micro house on wheels,
so Greg's line about getting it registered as an RV
isnt even possible, it has no engine to drive it and
it wouldnt be registrable as a caravan either given
that it isn't road worthy. You would have to get a
permit to move it on the road in most states.

The differentiation between an RV and a (park model) mobile
home has nothing to do with being self propelled here. It
really comes down to whether HUD certifies it as a dwelling.

Sure, but it is an australian micro house
so what happens in the USA isnt relevant.

I found all of this out when my SIL bought a "tiny home" before
tiny homes were cool. He was a park ranger and they didn't have
kids so his home was as portable as his job. It made it a lot easier
to work his way up through the bureaucracy. If a better job
opened, he could move at a moment's notice.

On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 08:23:48 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest troll**** unread

--
Keema Nam addressing nym-shifting senile Rodent:
"You are now exposed as a liar, as well as an ignorant troll."
"MID: .com"

On Mon, 8 Jun 2020 11:38:17 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Cars are taxed with a seperate bill when you get a tag. Not sure about
a car tax if it is just sitting around without a tag.

They call that a "fee" here (but it's probably a tax, in effect).
It's based on the (IIRC) MSRP of the car when it was new.



The government gets money and call it a fee or tax, it ammounts to the
same thing.

About like if I shoot someone on the edge of a 10 story building and he
falls over. What did he die of, the bullet, hitting the ground from the
fall, or a heart attack on the way down. He is still dead and I
probably would be charged with killing him even if the bullet was only
in his leg.


I think our county actually calls the car money a tax.
Unless it is a relative, you can not even give anything that requires a
title (another fee/tax) to someone with out paying a tax/fee.
A coworker gave a boat trailer to a friend of his that di d ot have very
much money. The fellow brought the trailer back and said he could not
afford it. The tag people wanted around $ 100 for some kind of county
tax, not counting the title transfer fee and tag fee.

If you add up all the fees and taxes you pay in one form or another to
the government, They get well over half your paycheck.

Well over half? Yikes, that's rough. My best guess is that the government
gets less than 10% of what I earn, but I'm willing to round it up to 10%.

On 6/8/2020 8:41 PM, Jim Joyce wrote:
On Mon, 8 Jun 2020 11:38:17 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Cars are taxed with a seperate bill when you get a tag. Not sure about
a car tax if it is just sitting around without a tag.

They call that a "fee" here (but it's probably a tax, in effect).
It's based on the (IIRC) MSRP of the car when it was new.



The government gets money and call it a fee or tax, it ammounts to the
same thing.

About like if I shoot someone on the edge of a 10 story building and he
falls over. What did he die of, the bullet, hitting the ground from the
fall, or a heart attack on the way down. He is still dead and I
probably would be charged with killing him even if the bullet was only
in his leg.


I think our county actually calls the car money a tax.
Unless it is a relative, you can not even give anything that requires a
title (another fee/tax) to someone with out paying a tax/fee.
A coworker gave a boat trailer to a friend of his that di d ot have very
much money. The fellow brought the trailer back and said he could not
afford it. The tag people wanted around $ 100 for some kind of county
tax, not counting the title transfer fee and tag fee.

If you add up all the fees and taxes you pay in one form or another to
the government, They get well over half your paycheck.

Well over half? Yikes, that's rough. My best guess is that the government
gets less than 10% of what I earn, but I'm willing to round it up to 10%.

Good for you if you can. Consider sales tax. property tax, assorted
utility taxes, gas tax, it adds up pretty good.

In article , says...

Well over half? Yikes, that's rough. My best guess is that the government
gets less than 10% of what I earn, but I'm willing to round it up to 10%.

Good for you if you can. Consider sales tax. property tax, assorted
utility taxes, gas tax, it adds up pretty good.



Either you earn a lot and have accountants to figuer it out, or are in
something like a nursing home where you do not buy hardly anything.

Just the tax on food is a lot. The government has fees or taxes on just
about everything. That includes things like driver license, car tags,
gas tax, fees on the telephones, the list almost never ends. Some areas
charge for toal roads.

On Mon, 08 Jun 2020 19:41:15 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Mon, 8 Jun 2020 11:38:17 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Cars are taxed with a seperate bill when you get a tag. Not sure about
a car tax if it is just sitting around without a tag.

They call that a "fee" here (but it's probably a tax, in effect).
It's based on the (IIRC) MSRP of the car when it was new.



The government gets money and call it a fee or tax, it ammounts to the
same thing.

About like if I shoot someone on the edge of a 10 story building and he
falls over. What did he die of, the bullet, hitting the ground from the
fall, or a heart attack on the way down. He is still dead and I
probably would be charged with killing him even if the bullet was only
in his leg.


I think our county actually calls the car money a tax.
Unless it is a relative, you can not even give anything that requires a
title (another fee/tax) to someone with out paying a tax/fee.
A coworker gave a boat trailer to a friend of his that di d ot have very
much money. The fellow brought the trailer back and said he could not
afford it. The tag people wanted around $ 100 for some kind of county
tax, not counting the title transfer fee and tag fee.

If you add up all the fees and taxes you pay in one form or another to
the government, They get well over half your paycheck.

Well over half? Yikes, that's rough. My best guess is that the government
gets less than 10% of what I earn, but I'm willing to round it up to 10%.

I think they are talking about all taxes, not just the federal income
tax.
You do see state income tax (in most states), real estate tax, sales
tax, various car taxes etc.
That also includes a lot of taxes you don't really see because they
are buried in the price, like excise taxes on gasoline, phones, cable,
electricity, plane tickets, booze (and other sins). You could even
include taxes the corporations pay and pass along to you silently if
you wanted to be circumspect.

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 00:02:40 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 08 Jun 2020 19:41:15 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Mon, 8 Jun 2020 11:38:17 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Cars are taxed with a seperate bill when you get a tag. Not sure about
a car tax if it is just sitting around without a tag.

They call that a "fee" here (but it's probably a tax, in effect).
It's based on the (IIRC) MSRP of the car when it was new.



The government gets money and call it a fee or tax, it ammounts to the
same thing.

About like if I shoot someone on the edge of a 10 story building and he
falls over. What did he die of, the bullet, hitting the ground from the
fall, or a heart attack on the way down. He is still dead and I
probably would be charged with killing him even if the bullet was only
in his leg.


I think our county actually calls the car money a tax.
Unless it is a relative, you can not even give anything that requires a
title (another fee/tax) to someone with out paying a tax/fee.
A coworker gave a boat trailer to a friend of his that di d ot have very
much money. The fellow brought the trailer back and said he could not
afford it. The tag people wanted around $ 100 for some kind of county
tax, not counting the title transfer fee and tag fee.

If you add up all the fees and taxes you pay in one form or another to
the government, They get well over half your paycheck.

Well over half? Yikes, that's rough. My best guess is that the government
gets less than 10% of what I earn, but I'm willing to round it up to 10%.

I think they are talking about all taxes, not just the federal income
tax.
You do see state income tax (in most states), real estate tax, sales
tax, various car taxes etc.
That also includes a lot of taxes you don't really see because they
are buried in the price, like excise taxes on gasoline, phones, cable,
electricity, plane tickets, booze (and other sins). You could even
include taxes the corporations pay and pass along to you silently if
you wanted to be circumspect.

Yep, I understand the premise. The Federal tax burden is around 4-6%, and I
figure everything else is 2-3%. Everyone's situation is going to be
different.

On Monday, June 8, 2020 at 11:36:21 PM UTC-4, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article , says...

Well over half? Yikes, that's rough. My best guess is that the government
gets less than 10% of what I earn, but I'm willing to round it up to 10%.

Good for you if you can. Consider sales tax. property tax, assorted
utility taxes, gas tax, it adds up pretty good.



Either you earn a lot and have accountants to figuer it out, or are in
something like a nursing home where you do not buy hardly anything.

Just the tax on food is a lot.

Are you talking about hidden taxes on food?

Cindy Hamilton

In article ,
lid says...

Yep, I understand the premise. The Federal tax burden is around 4-6%, and I
figure everything else is 2-3%. Everyone's situation is going to be
different.




Where are you getting those numbers ? The Federal tax is way more than
6 % for the working class , then you have the state and FICA , If you
are working at any job more than part time, you are taxed at 12 % and if
over $ 40,000 it is 22% for just the Federal tax. In the state I live
in, the state and local sales tax for most every day items sold in
stores are around 7 %.

I have not kept up with the tax on many things for years, just paid the
bottom line. I was thinking that food was not taxed many years ago and
then a 'temporary' tax was put in and it never went away.

On 6/9/2020 12:02 AM, wrote:

I think they are talking about all taxes, not just the federal income
tax.
You could even
include taxes the corporations pay and pass along to you silently if
you wanted to be circumspect.


You bring up a good point. I hear people complaining that corporations
don't pay enough taxes. Well, corporation never truly pay taxes, they
add that cost into the product that we pay for in the end. Whoever is
the end buyer pays all the taxes accumulated.

Raising corporate taxes just increases prices to the consumer but most
are too dumb to realize that.

On 6/9/2020 6:33 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
On Monday, June 8, 2020 at 11:36:21 PM UTC-4, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article , says...

Well over half? Yikes, that's rough. My best guess is that the government
gets less than 10% of what I earn, but I'm willing to round it up to 10%.

Good for you if you can. Consider sales tax. property tax, assorted
utility taxes, gas tax, it adds up pretty good.



Either you earn a lot and have accountants to figuer it out, or are in
something like a nursing home where you do not buy hardly anything.

Just the tax on food is a lot.

Are you talking about hidden taxes on food?

Cindy Hamilton

Thirteen states have a sales tax on groceries, though a few at a lower
rate. Others just have a tax on candy and soda, some on prepared foods.
Mississippi takes 7% on everything.

On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 10:36:24 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Yep, I understand the premise. The Federal tax burden is around 4-6%, and I
figure everything else is 2-3%. Everyone's situation is going to be
different.




Where are you getting those numbers ?

TurboTax. In the summary at the end, it tells you your effective tax rate.
Over the past 20 years or so, mine usually bounces around between 0% to as
much as 6%. 2019 was another 0% year for me at the Federal level, but
that's not something that I count on. It's just nice when it happens.

The Federal tax is way more than
6 % for the working class , then you have the state and FICA , If you
are working at any job more than part time, you are taxed at 12 % and if
over $ 40,000 it is 22% for just the Federal tax. In the state I live
in, the state and local sales tax for most every day items sold in
stores are around 7 %.

I have not kept up with the tax on many things for years, just paid the
bottom line. I was thinking that food was not taxed many years ago and
then a 'temporary' tax was put in and it never went away.

When it comes to my personal finances and taxes, I take an active role and
I've found that as my personal situation has improved over the years, my
tax burden has fallen. It's not really fair, but that seems to be how the
system is set up. It doesn't just happen automatically, though. You have to
recognize opportunities and take advantage of them.

In article ,
lid says...
Yep, I understand the premise. The Federal tax burden is around 4-6%, and I
figure everything else is 2-3%. Everyone's situation is going to be
different.




Where are you getting those numbers ?

TurboTax. In the summary at the end, it tells you your effective tax rate.
Over the past 20 years or so, mine usually bounces around between 0% to as
much as 6%. 2019 was another 0% year for me at the Federal level, but
that's not something that I count on. It's just nice when it happens.





So you are saying that in a couple of years you paid no Federal income
tax ? Hardly possiable for most if working a regular job.


The concenses of the Turbo Tax calculation is just smoke and mirrows to
make it look good.

In other words they use the wrong lines on the form to really get the
tax rate.

For example one person says TT calculated about 6 % where really it is
about 17 %

I do use TT for my tax so do not think this is anything against them.


https://ttlc.intuit.com/community/ta.../how-turbotax-
calculated-my-effective-tax-rate-etr-it-divides-line-63-amount-by-line-
43-amount-on-the/00/708779#

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 00:48:30 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 00:02:40 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 08 Jun 2020 19:41:15 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Mon, 8 Jun 2020 11:38:17 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Cars are taxed with a seperate bill when you get a tag. Not sure about
a car tax if it is just sitting around without a tag.

They call that a "fee" here (but it's probably a tax, in effect).
It's based on the (IIRC) MSRP of the car when it was new.



The government gets money and call it a fee or tax, it ammounts to the
same thing.

About like if I shoot someone on the edge of a 10 story building and he
falls over. What did he die of, the bullet, hitting the ground from the
fall, or a heart attack on the way down. He is still dead and I
probably would be charged with killing him even if the bullet was only
in his leg.


I think our county actually calls the car money a tax.
Unless it is a relative, you can not even give anything that requires a
title (another fee/tax) to someone with out paying a tax/fee.
A coworker gave a boat trailer to a friend of his that di d ot have very
much money. The fellow brought the trailer back and said he could not
afford it. The tag people wanted around $ 100 for some kind of county
tax, not counting the title transfer fee and tag fee.

If you add up all the fees and taxes you pay in one form or another to
the government, They get well over half your paycheck.

Well over half? Yikes, that's rough. My best guess is that the government
gets less than 10% of what I earn, but I'm willing to round it up to 10%.

I think they are talking about all taxes, not just the federal income
tax.
You do see state income tax (in most states), real estate tax, sales
tax, various car taxes etc.
That also includes a lot of taxes you don't really see because they
are buried in the price, like excise taxes on gasoline, phones, cable,
electricity, plane tickets, booze (and other sins). You could even
include taxes the corporations pay and pass along to you silently if
you wanted to be circumspect.

Yep, I understand the premise. The Federal tax burden is around 4-6%, and I
figure everything else is 2-3%. Everyone's situation is going to be
different.

Who pays 4-6% Federal income tax? It is certainly not a family making
more than $50-60k. You also have to include the payroll tax that is
over 14% alone on your "first dollar" income. (yes you pay the
employer side with your labor).
Since most states have a sales tax of 6% or more, I am not sure where
the 2-3% comes from either since the less you make, the higher
percentage of your income goes to being spent on your day to day
expenses. Even if you rent, you are still paying the real estate taxes
on your home. It is just hidden in your rent and not deductible for
you.

You really have to be wearing blinders if you don't see how much of
your income goes to taxes. Just federal tax alone is over $11,000 a
year for every man, woman and child in the country.
That doesn't include all the money we put on the cuff for our kids to
pay. (Over $70k each for everyone here, in 2019, before this last
round of irrational borrowing).

On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 03:33:47 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
wrote:

On Monday, June 8, 2020 at 11:36:21 PM UTC-4, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article , says...

Well over half? Yikes, that's rough. My best guess is that the government
gets less than 10% of what I earn, but I'm willing to round it up to 10%.

Good for you if you can. Consider sales tax. property tax, assorted
utility taxes, gas tax, it adds up pretty good.



Either you earn a lot and have accountants to figuer it out, or are in
something like a nursing home where you do not buy hardly anything.

Just the tax on food is a lot.

Are you talking about hidden taxes on food?

Cindy Hamilton

Some states even tax food directly and most do if it is "ready to
eat". You can buy ham in the meat case without tax in Fla but sliced
at the deli is taxable.

On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 10:36:24 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Yep, I understand the premise. The Federal tax burden is around 4-6%, and I
figure everything else is 2-3%. Everyone's situation is going to be
different.




Where are you getting those numbers ? The Federal tax is way more than
6 % for the working class , then you have the state and FICA , If you
are working at any job more than part time, you are taxed at 12 % and if
over $ 40,000 it is 22% for just the Federal tax. In the state I live
in, the state and local sales tax for most every day items sold in
stores are around 7 %.

I have not kept up with the tax on many things for years, just paid the
bottom line. I was thinking that food was not taxed many years ago and
then a 'temporary' tax was put in and it never went away.

I always do a bottom line calculation of my income taxes (total income
vs tax paid)
After all of the gyrations on the 1040, when I was doing around
$100-110k, no kids, no mortgage, standard deduction was 11-12% plus
FICA on wages. These days when it is just pensions, IRA distributions
and SS, (~$76k) it is still 11-12% but no FICA.

40 years ago that was usually more like 18-20%

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 11:23:07 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 10:36:24 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Yep, I understand the premise. The Federal tax burden is around 4-6%, and I
figure everything else is 2-3%. Everyone's situation is going to be
different.




Where are you getting those numbers ?

TurboTax. In the summary at the end, it tells you your effective tax rate.
Over the past 20 years or so, mine usually bounces around between 0% to as
much as 6%. 2019 was another 0% year for me at the Federal level, but
that's not something that I count on. It's just nice when it happens.

The Federal tax is way more than
6 % for the working class , then you have the state and FICA , If you
are working at any job more than part time, you are taxed at 12 % and if
over $ 40,000 it is 22% for just the Federal tax. In the state I live
in, the state and local sales tax for most every day items sold in
stores are around 7 %.

I have not kept up with the tax on many things for years, just paid the
bottom line. I was thinking that food was not taxed many years ago and
then a 'temporary' tax was put in and it never went away.

When it comes to my personal finances and taxes, I take an active role and
I've found that as my personal situation has improved over the years, my
tax burden has fallen. It's not really fair, but that seems to be how the
system is set up. It doesn't just happen automatically, though. You have to
recognize opportunities and take advantage of them.

The people who take the worst beating are high income people who get
paid on a W-2. They usually don't have much they can do beyond writing
off the interest on their mortgage and the last tax reform chipped
away at that.

On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 12:41:57 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...
Yep, I understand the premise. The Federal tax burden is around 4-6%, and I
figure everything else is 2-3%. Everyone's situation is going to be
different.




Where are you getting those numbers ?

TurboTax. In the summary at the end, it tells you your effective tax rate.
Over the past 20 years or so, mine usually bounces around between 0% to as
much as 6%. 2019 was another 0% year for me at the Federal level, but
that's not something that I count on. It's just nice when it happens.





So you are saying that in a couple of years you paid no Federal income
tax ? Hardly possiable for most if working a regular job.

Yes, for the 2019 tax year my Federal refund was 100% of what had been
withheld during the year.

The concenses of the Turbo Tax calculation is just smoke and mirrows to
make it look good.

In other words they use the wrong lines on the form to really get the
tax rate.

For example one person says TT calculated about 6 % where really it is
about 17 %

I do use TT for my tax so do not think this is anything against them.


https://ttlc.intuit.com/community/ta.../how-turbotax-
calculated-my-effective-tax-rate-etr-it-divides-line-63-amount-by-line-
43-amount-on-the/00/708779#

When you get it all back, the calculation is easy.

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 15:06:23 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 11:23:07 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 10:36:24 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Yep, I understand the premise. The Federal tax burden is around 4-6%, and I
figure everything else is 2-3%. Everyone's situation is going to be
different.




Where are you getting those numbers ?

TurboTax. In the summary at the end, it tells you your effective tax rate.
Over the past 20 years or so, mine usually bounces around between 0% to as
much as 6%. 2019 was another 0% year for me at the Federal level, but
that's not something that I count on. It's just nice when it happens.

The Federal tax is way more than
6 % for the working class , then you have the state and FICA , If you
are working at any job more than part time, you are taxed at 12 % and if
over $ 40,000 it is 22% for just the Federal tax. In the state I live
in, the state and local sales tax for most every day items sold in
stores are around 7 %.

I have not kept up with the tax on many things for years, just paid the
bottom line. I was thinking that food was not taxed many years ago and
then a 'temporary' tax was put in and it never went away.

When it comes to my personal finances and taxes, I take an active role and
I've found that as my personal situation has improved over the years, my
tax burden has fallen. It's not really fair, but that seems to be how the
system is set up. It doesn't just happen automatically, though. You have to
recognize opportunities and take advantage of them.

The people who take the worst beating are high income people who get
paid on a W-2. They usually don't have much they can do beyond writing
off the interest on their mortgage and the last tax reform chipped
away at that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upifaeK0B5U

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 18:23:40 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 15:06:23 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 11:23:07 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 10:36:24 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Yep, I understand the premise. The Federal tax burden is around 4-6%, and I
figure everything else is 2-3%. Everyone's situation is going to be
different.




Where are you getting those numbers ?

TurboTax. In the summary at the end, it tells you your effective tax rate.
Over the past 20 years or so, mine usually bounces around between 0% to as
much as 6%. 2019 was another 0% year for me at the Federal level, but
that's not something that I count on. It's just nice when it happens.

The Federal tax is way more than
6 % for the working class , then you have the state and FICA , If you
are working at any job more than part time, you are taxed at 12 % and if
over $ 40,000 it is 22% for just the Federal tax. In the state I live
in, the state and local sales tax for most every day items sold in
stores are around 7 %.

I have not kept up with the tax on many things for years, just paid the
bottom line. I was thinking that food was not taxed many years ago and
then a 'temporary' tax was put in and it never went away.

When it comes to my personal finances and taxes, I take an active role and
I've found that as my personal situation has improved over the years, my
tax burden has fallen. It's not really fair, but that seems to be how the
system is set up. It doesn't just happen automatically, though. You have to
recognize opportunities and take advantage of them.

The people who take the worst beating are high income people who get
paid on a W-2. They usually don't have much they can do beyond writing
off the interest on their mortgage and the last tax reform chipped
away at that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upifaeK0B5U


So you got nothing.

On 06/09/2020 09:09 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 6/9/2020 12:02 AM, wrote:

I think they are talking about all taxes, not just the federal income
tax.
You could even
include taxes the corporations pay and pass along to you silently if
you wanted to be circumspect.


You bring up a good point. I hear people complaining that corporations
don't pay enough taxes. Well, corporation never truly pay taxes, they
add that cost into the product that we pay for in the end. Whoever is
the end buyer pays all the taxes accumulated.

Raising corporate taxes just increases prices to the consumer but most
are too dumb to realize that.

There is elastic demand and inelastic demand.

On 6/9/2020 11:24 PM, rbowman wrote:
On 06/09/2020 09:09 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 6/9/2020 12:02 AM, wrote:

I think they are talking about all taxes, not just the federal income
tax.
Â*You could even
include taxes the corporations pay and pass along to you silently if
you wanted to be circumspect.


You bring up a good point.Â* I hear people complaining that corporations
don't pay enough taxes.Â* Well, corporation never truly pay taxes, they
add that cost into the product that we pay for in the end.Â* Whoever is
the end buyer pays all the taxes accumulated.

Raising corporate taxes just increases prices to the consumer but most
are too dumb to realize that.

There is elastic demand and inelastic demand.

Taxes passed on can certainly harm an elastic product.

On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 21:24:12 -0600, rbowman wrote:

On 06/09/2020 09:09 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 6/9/2020 12:02 AM, wrote:

I think they are talking about all taxes, not just the federal income
tax.
You could even
include taxes the corporations pay and pass along to you silently if
you wanted to be circumspect.


You bring up a good point. I hear people complaining that corporations
don't pay enough taxes. Well, corporation never truly pay taxes, they
add that cost into the product that we pay for in the end. Whoever is
the end buyer pays all the taxes accumulated.

Raising corporate taxes just increases prices to the consumer but most
are too dumb to realize that.

There is elastic demand and inelastic demand.

When the corporate tax is somewhat uniform across a whole industry, it
really doesn't matter. Think of it as federal price fixing. Everyone
passes on the same tax. They still win or lose based on their
competitive advantages and balancing expense to revenue but the taxes
are a floor on those expenses.

On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 23:35:39 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 6/9/2020 11:24 PM, rbowman wrote:
On 06/09/2020 09:09 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 6/9/2020 12:02 AM, wrote:

I think they are talking about all taxes, not just the federal income
tax.
Â*You could even
include taxes the corporations pay and pass along to you silently if
you wanted to be circumspect.


You bring up a good point.Â* I hear people complaining that corporations
don't pay enough taxes.Â* Well, corporation never truly pay taxes, they
add that cost into the product that we pay for in the end.Â* Whoever is
the end buyer pays all the taxes accumulated.

Raising corporate taxes just increases prices to the consumer but most
are too dumb to realize that.

There is elastic demand and inelastic demand.

Taxes passed on can certainly harm an elastic product.

Only when you are competing with an offshore company that is not
paying the tax.

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 20:48:02 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 18:23:40 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 15:06:23 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 11:23:07 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 10:36:24 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Yep, I understand the premise. The Federal tax burden is around 4-6%, and I
figure everything else is 2-3%. Everyone's situation is going to be
different.




Where are you getting those numbers ?

TurboTax. In the summary at the end, it tells you your effective tax rate.
Over the past 20 years or so, mine usually bounces around between 0% to as
much as 6%. 2019 was another 0% year for me at the Federal level, but
that's not something that I count on. It's just nice when it happens.

The Federal tax is way more than
6 % for the working class , then you have the state and FICA , If you
are working at any job more than part time, you are taxed at 12 % and if
over $ 40,000 it is 22% for just the Federal tax. In the state I live
in, the state and local sales tax for most every day items sold in
stores are around 7 %.

I have not kept up with the tax on many things for years, just paid the
bottom line. I was thinking that food was not taxed many years ago and
then a 'temporary' tax was put in and it never went away.

When it comes to my personal finances and taxes, I take an active role and
I've found that as my personal situation has improved over the years, my
tax burden has fallen. It's not really fair, but that seems to be how the
system is set up. It doesn't just happen automatically, though. You have to
recognize opportunities and take advantage of them.

The people who take the worst beating are high income people who get
paid on a W-2. They usually don't have much they can do beyond writing
off the interest on their mortgage and the last tax reform chipped
away at that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upifaeK0B5U


So you got nothing.

The Seinfeld clip was a joke. I don't know what you were looking for. Am I
supposed to take a look at your finances and recommend ways for you to pay
less in taxes? That's not really a service that I offer.

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 23:58:05 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 20:48:02 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 18:23:40 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 15:06:23 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 11:23:07 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 10:36:24 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Yep, I understand the premise. The Federal tax burden is around 4-6%, and I
figure everything else is 2-3%. Everyone's situation is going to be
different.




Where are you getting those numbers ?

TurboTax. In the summary at the end, it tells you your effective tax rate.
Over the past 20 years or so, mine usually bounces around between 0% to as
much as 6%. 2019 was another 0% year for me at the Federal level, but
that's not something that I count on. It's just nice when it happens.

The Federal tax is way more than
6 % for the working class , then you have the state and FICA , If you
are working at any job more than part time, you are taxed at 12 % and if
over $ 40,000 it is 22% for just the Federal tax. In the state I live
in, the state and local sales tax for most every day items sold in
stores are around 7 %.

I have not kept up with the tax on many things for years, just paid the
bottom line. I was thinking that food was not taxed many years ago and
then a 'temporary' tax was put in and it never went away.

When it comes to my personal finances and taxes, I take an active role and
I've found that as my personal situation has improved over the years, my
tax burden has fallen. It's not really fair, but that seems to be how the
system is set up. It doesn't just happen automatically, though. You have to
recognize opportunities and take advantage of them.

The people who take the worst beating are high income people who get
paid on a W-2. They usually don't have much they can do beyond writing
off the interest on their mortgage and the last tax reform chipped
away at that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upifaeK0B5U


So you got nothing.

The Seinfeld clip was a joke. I don't know what you were looking for. Am I
supposed to take a look at your finances and recommend ways for you to pay
less in taxes? That's not really a service that I offer.

I didn't see a seinfeld clip, only an ad I guess, that seemed pretty
inappropriate. My bad.

It is sort of funny that a guy who has been here complaining about tax
cuts for the rich pays no taxes.

On Wed, 10 Jun 2020 11:33:39 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 23:58:05 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 20:48:02 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 18:23:40 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 15:06:23 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 11:23:07 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 10:36:24 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Yep, I understand the premise. The Federal tax burden is around 4-6%, and I
figure everything else is 2-3%. Everyone's situation is going to be
different.




Where are you getting those numbers ?

TurboTax. In the summary at the end, it tells you your effective tax rate.
Over the past 20 years or so, mine usually bounces around between 0% to as
much as 6%. 2019 was another 0% year for me at the Federal level, but
that's not something that I count on. It's just nice when it happens.

The Federal tax is way more than
6 % for the working class , then you have the state and FICA , If you
are working at any job more than part time, you are taxed at 12 % and if
over $ 40,000 it is 22% for just the Federal tax. In the state I live
in, the state and local sales tax for most every day items sold in
stores are around 7 %.

I have not kept up with the tax on many things for years, just paid the
bottom line. I was thinking that food was not taxed many years ago and
then a 'temporary' tax was put in and it never went away.

When it comes to my personal finances and taxes, I take an active role and
I've found that as my personal situation has improved over the years, my
tax burden has fallen. It's not really fair, but that seems to be how the
system is set up. It doesn't just happen automatically, though. You have to
recognize opportunities and take advantage of them.

The people who take the worst beating are high income people who get
paid on a W-2. They usually don't have much they can do beyond writing
off the interest on their mortgage and the last tax reform chipped
away at that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upifaeK0B5U


So you got nothing.

The Seinfeld clip was a joke. I don't know what you were looking for. Am I
supposed to take a look at your finances and recommend ways for you to pay
less in taxes? That's not really a service that I offer.

I didn't see a seinfeld clip, only an ad I guess, that seemed pretty
inappropriate. My bad.

It is sort of funny that a guy who has been here complaining about tax
cuts for the rich pays no taxes.

I don't know what's funny about it. Have you ever listened to Warren
Buffett? I guess he's funny, too.

On Wed, 10 Jun 2020 11:49:26 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Wed, 10 Jun 2020 11:33:39 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 23:58:05 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 20:48:02 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 18:23:40 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 15:06:23 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 11:23:07 -0500, Jim Joyce
wrote:

On Tue, 9 Jun 2020 10:36:24 -0400, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

Yep, I understand the premise. The Federal tax burden is around 4-6%, and I
figure everything else is 2-3%. Everyone's situation is going to be
different.




Where are you getting those numbers ?

TurboTax. In the summary at the end, it tells you your effective tax rate.
Over the past 20 years or so, mine usually bounces around between 0% to as
much as 6%. 2019 was another 0% year for me at the Federal level, but
that's not something that I count on. It's just nice when it happens.

The Federal tax is way more than
6 % for the working class , then you have the state and FICA , If you
are working at any job more than part time, you are taxed at 12 % and if
over $ 40,000 it is 22% for just the Federal tax. In the state I live
in, the state and local sales tax for most every day items sold in
stores are around 7 %.

I have not kept up with the tax on many things for years, just paid the
bottom line. I was thinking that food was not taxed many years ago and
then a 'temporary' tax was put in and it never went away.

When it comes to my personal finances and taxes, I take an active role and
I've found that as my personal situation has improved over the years, my
tax burden has fallen. It's not really fair, but that seems to be how the
system is set up. It doesn't just happen automatically, though. You have to
recognize opportunities and take advantage of them.

The people who take the worst beating are high income people who get
paid on a W-2. They usually don't have much they can do beyond writing
off the interest on their mortgage and the last tax reform chipped
away at that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upifaeK0B5U


So you got nothing.

The Seinfeld clip was a joke. I don't know what you were looking for. Am I
supposed to take a look at your finances and recommend ways for you to pay
less in taxes? That's not really a service that I offer.

I didn't see a seinfeld clip, only an ad I guess, that seemed pretty
inappropriate. My bad.

It is sort of funny that a guy who has been here complaining about tax
cuts for the rich pays no taxes.

I don't know what's funny about it. Have you ever listened to Warren
Buffett? I guess he's funny, too.

He is talking about paying 15%, not zero