On 11/29/2019 09:45 AM, wrote:
At that point you have some
math to do. My take away is when the boneless, skinless, tasteless
breasts are on sale, it is a better deal than with the skin and ribs.
Not on sale, you have to do the math but your labor is worth something
too.

Tasteless and dry was what finally got me off the cheap breast meat.

I really prefer the dark meat anyway and if you are willing to buy
thigh quarters you can get them for less than a buck a pound in the 10
pound bag. Again there is lots of waste but if it is 69 cents a pound,
who cares? With a sharp paring knife, you can bone the whole thing out
in less than a minute and end up with one slab of meat that is great
on the grill. I leave the skin on for that.

I haven't gotten them in a long time but Costco had boneless thighs.
They were pretty good. I had the same reaction to pork loins. They were
inexpensive at Costco but dry. Pork shoulder is a lot tastier if I could
find a parcel less than 15 pounds. Costco seems to aim at a $20 portion,
which is a lot of pork shoulder.

On 11/29/2019 12:05 AM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 28 Nov 2019 22:09:32 -0500, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

You didn't ask what size it was going to be before you ordered it?

BTW why don't you just cook your own turkey. It is about the easiest
thing in the world to do.



I probably should have. They all seem to be the same size.

To cook the turkeys you have to wait about 2 days or so for the frozen
ones to thaw. The people cooking them do it over wood and sort of smoke
them.

Today I read about the Butterball people having a turkey that you just
pop in the oven even though it is frozen. It comes in a special bag and
is ready in about 4 hours. I may try that for Christmas.

We did get a small turkey breast and put it in the oven and cooked it
ourselves when we saw how small the cooked one was. It was one that was
not frozen and just the whole breast part with the legs and wings cut
off.
I generally order fresh chilled never frozen turkey if I think about
it early enough. Pick up from the butcher 2 days ahead.
I have also done the roast from frozen trick - and it worked pretty
good. The fresh never frozen doesn't generally lose as much weight
because they are not generally "pumped up" like the commercial frozen
bird


You don't like paying for the salt water that makes up 10% of the
sticker weight? When I was receiving religious indoctrination, adultery
was explained as watering the milk.

On 11/29/2019 12:09 AM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 28 Nov 2019 23:36:23 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 11/28/2019 10:46 PM, wrote:

You can usually get fresh (not frozen) turkeys around the holidays but
a lot of people say the frozen one is probably "fresher" since it was
flash frozen right after it was killed as opposed to being packed in
ice for up to a month.


Some years ago we bought a really fresh fresh bird locally. It was
better but much more expensive. Don't recall the price but at least
triple.

Went to my son's house and we had a frozen bird that was 49 cents a
pound. It was pretty damned good for that price.
When you get a b or c grade bird they are even cheaper - some have 3
wings or 1 1/2 legs or other configurations, or torn skin - but they
taste just as good


I'm not sure I'd eat a turkey with three wings; sounds like gene
splicing gone awry.

On 11/29/2019 05:21 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
On Friday, November 29, 2019 at 6:27:16 AM UTC-5, Beef wrote:

Cooking turkeys are a pain in the ass. Much easier to just buy some ground beef/pork stuffing and make a meatloaf. Form it into a turkey shape if you must.

But it doesn't taste like turkey and there's no stuffing. Turkey's highest
purposes is as a vessel for stuffing.

Precisely. My mother-in-law was a harridan who insisted on cooking the
stuffing in a separate pan. I had to retrain her daughter.

At least Beef didn't suggest cooking up a Tofurky.

In article ,
says...
indy mentioned the labor is the thing and not the meat. I agree with
that. For a few dollars more they could get a larger turkey. Then I
would not have had to spend that much more to get another turkey at the
grocery store and cook it.

If you're in the business of cooking or smoking turkeys, you can't
just buy turkeys that are twice the size and have the only impact
on your costs be the increased cost of the bigger turkeys. You have
X employees and Y size ovens or smokers. You can't put 20 pounds
of turkey into a 10 pound oven. Generally speaking, in addition
to the increased cost of the larger turkeys, you'd need either more/larger
ovens or twice as long to cook them. That's a big impact on costs.




For the restraunt turkeys all that is probably true.

For places like the volnteer fire departments, the labor is really free.
The ones doing the cooking are volunteers. They have a big brick
fireplace of somekind with a cover it. Seems to be a grill about 5 feet
wide and 20 feet long.. I have seen them, but never paid any attention
to them. They seem to cook the hams and turkeys all over the same fire
pit. That way size is no problem. Just put the smaller ones on later
in the time frame.

On Fri, 29 Nov 2019 12:59:11 -0500, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

So? How long ahead of time do you have to order the cooked ones?
Here since it's usually cold enough outside or in the garage,
I just leave them to thaw out for a couple days in the trunk
of the car. I wouldn't do that if it's 60 outside, but when it's
40F, it's fine. You can also thaw them in hours if you have to,
by putting it in a kitchen sink full of water. Or put it in a 5 gal
bucket and brine it for a day.


The people cooking them do it over wood and sort of smoke
them.

Yes, I agree that would be a good reason to buy a cooked one.






Today I read about the Butterball people having a turkey that you just
pop in the oven even though it is frozen. It comes in a special bag and
is ready in about 4 hours. I may try that for Christmas.

What do they put in it? Some more special chemicals? I'd bet that
it's also going to be one of those small ones that you don't like.







I do like the ones that are cooked over the wood for the flavor. Main
reason for buying them.

It is too hot here to do the thawing out of the refrigerator. At noon
today it is 57 deg F. If it were cooler I could put it in an out
building I store the lawn equipment in or the unheated garage.

Our refrigerator is small. I think only about 20 cuft. The house has 4
bed rooms. We bought the house used. Whoever built it put cabinets in
and only left a small space for the refrigerator. One would think that
with that many bedrooms they would have left a large space for a larger
refirgerator. As it is just me and the wife we did not think small
refrigerator would be a problem. For us, it isn't, but when a whole
turkey is in it, there is little room for much else special for the
larger family geathering. We do have a small freezer in the basement to
put forzen items in. By buying the cooked turkey a day ahead and
cutting it off the bones it takes up only a small space.

I don't know how they do the bagged Butterball. I just found out about
it Wensday after I got home and was looking around on the computer about
turkeys thinking about what to do for Christmas. If it is as good as
the unfrozen one we bought on Wensday, it will be ok. Not great, but
ok.



I can see you have a reason to buy a cooked one (the smoke flavor)
Maybe you just need to negotiate the size. If they are decent
businessman, you will serve your customer but don't be surprised if
the price is up a tad.

If you are going to buy a turkey and cook it in a bag, it will be
cheaper to just get a turkey on sale and buy a cooking bag. That is
really simple to do. If you like that crispy skin thing, open the bag
toward the end of the cooking cycle. I leave it sealed up the whole
time because my wife doesn't eat the skin anyway. It makes the turkey
juice squirting moist. Cook it breast down too. That keeps the white
meat moist.
I toss some spices in the bag with the flour they recommend and shake
it up to coat the turkey.

On Fri, 29 Nov 2019 11:34:03 -0700, rbowman
wrote:

On 11/29/2019 09:45 AM, wrote:
At that point you have some
math to do. My take away is when the boneless, skinless, tasteless
breasts are on sale, it is a better deal than with the skin and ribs.
Not on sale, you have to do the math but your labor is worth something
too.

Tasteless and dry was what finally got me off the cheap breast meat.

I really prefer the dark meat anyway and if you are willing to buy
thigh quarters you can get them for less than a buck a pound in the 10
pound bag. Again there is lots of waste but if it is 69 cents a pound,
who cares? With a sharp paring knife, you can bone the whole thing out
in less than a minute and end up with one slab of meat that is great
on the grill. I leave the skin on for that.

I haven't gotten them in a long time but Costco had boneless thighs.
They were pretty good. I had the same reaction to pork loins. They were
inexpensive at Costco but dry. Pork shoulder is a lot tastier if I could
find a parcel less than 15 pounds. Costco seems to aim at a $20 portion,
which is a lot of pork shoulder.

You don't really have to cook the whole shoulder, I cut the big ones
into two or 3 pieces and freeze the ones I don't cook right away.
Actually my dog likes pork shoulder too so we can make the leftovers
disappear. Pork shoulder is cheaper than most comparable dog food.

On Friday, November 29, 2019 at 12:59:21 PM UTC-5, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article ,
says...

So? How long ahead of time do you have to order the cooked ones?
Here since it's usually cold enough outside or in the garage,
I just leave them to thaw out for a couple days in the trunk
of the car. I wouldn't do that if it's 60 outside, but when it's
40F, it's fine. You can also thaw them in hours if you have to,
by putting it in a kitchen sink full of water. Or put it in a 5 gal
bucket and brine it for a day.


The people cooking them do it over wood and sort of smoke
them.

Yes, I agree that would be a good reason to buy a cooked one.






Today I read about the Butterball people having a turkey that you just
pop in the oven even though it is frozen. It comes in a special bag and
is ready in about 4 hours. I may try that for Christmas.

What do they put in it? Some more special chemicals? I'd bet that
it's also going to be one of those small ones that you don't like.







I do like the ones that are cooked over the wood for the flavor. Main
reason for buying them.

It is too hot here to do the thawing out of the refrigerator. At noon
today it is 57 deg F. If it were cooler I could put it in an out
building I store the lawn equipment in or the unheated garage.

I would still do it. Put it in a 5 gallon bucket, HD sells them if
you don't have one. Cover it with water day and a half before
cooking time. Then depending on the outside
temp, check the water temp a couple times a day. If it's getting too
warm, just add some ice. I think this is largely overblown. Even
if you took a frozen turkey and left it out somewhere that it's 60F,
I doubt anything bad is going to happen as long as you keep an eye
on it and use it as soon as it's thawed. First, it's frozen and the
temp of the outside is going to be lower than room temp until it all
thaws out. Second, it gets cooked to 160F which kills all the bacteria
anyway. So, I think you;d have to leave it someplace like 80F, let
it all thaw out and start to rot, before it was bad. And even then,
I would bet it would taste bad before it was capable of making you sick.










Our refrigerator is small. I think only about 20 cuft. The house has 4
bed rooms. We bought the house used. Whoever built it put cabinets in
and only left a small space for the refrigerator. One would think that
with that many bedrooms they would have left a large space for a larger
refirgerator. As it is just me and the wife we did not think small
refrigerator would be a problem. For us, it isn't, but when a whole
turkey is in it, there is little room for much else special for the
larger family geathering. We do have a small freezer in the basement to
put forzen items in. By buying the cooked turkey a day ahead and
cutting it off the bones it takes up only a small space.

I don't know how they do the bagged Butterball. I just found out about
it Wensday after I got home and was looking around on the computer about
turkeys thinking about what to do for Christmas. If it is as good as
the unfrozen one we bought on Wensday, it will be ok. Not great, but
ok.

I would think you could cook any bird from frozen. The only problem is,
the outside will become overcooked, dry, burned, before the inside is done,
so it's going to be far from perfect. I bet the cook from frozen ones
are smaller, which is a help. After that, IDK, good question what they
can do to make it work right.

On Friday, November 29, 2019 at 10:47:49 AM UTC-5, Ralph Mowery wrote:

I think I have made up my mind that for Christmas I am going to the get
one of the Butterball ones. They have one that is frozen and in a
baking bag. They advertise you just take it from the freezer and put it
in the oven and in about 4 hours it is ready. Has anyonne tried that
one ?

I have not. The notion of steaming a turkey in a plastic bag holds
no appeal. The best part of the turkey is the crispy skin.

Cindy Hamilton

On 11/29/2019 4:46 PM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
On Friday, November 29, 2019 at 10:47:49 AM UTC-5, Ralph Mowery wrote:

I think I have made up my mind that for Christmas I am going to the get
one of the Butterball ones. They have one that is frozen and in a
baking bag. They advertise you just take it from the freezer and put it
in the oven and in about 4 hours it is ready. Has anyonne tried that
one ?

I have not. The notion of steaming a turkey in a plastic bag holds
no appeal. The best part of the turkey is the crispy skin.

Cindy Hamilton

I've had the cooked-in-bag turkey. It was OK, but the skin is garbage.

On 2019-11-29 2:46 p.m., Cindy Hamilton wrote:
On Friday, November 29, 2019 at 10:47:49 AM UTC-5, Ralph Mowery wrote:

I think I have made up my mind that for Christmas I am going to the get
one of the Butterball ones. They have one that is frozen and in a
baking bag. They advertise you just take it from the freezer and put it
in the oven and in about 4 hours it is ready. Has anyonne tried that
one ?

I have not. The notion of steaming a turkey in a plastic bag holds
no appeal. The best part of the turkey is the crispy skin.

Cindy Hamilton

the best way to cook a turkey is on a spit over a real fire

writes:
On Fri, 29 Nov 2019 11:34:03 -0700, rbowman
wrote:


I haven't gotten them in a long time but Costco had boneless thighs.
They were pretty good. I had the same reaction to pork loins. They were
inexpensive at Costco but dry. Pork shoulder is a lot tastier if I could
find a parcel less than 15 pounds. Costco seems to aim at a $20 portion,
which is a lot of pork shoulder.

You don't really have to cook the whole shoulder, I cut the big ones
into two or 3 pieces and freeze the ones I don't cook right away.
Actually my dog likes pork shoulder too so we can make the leftovers
disappear. Pork shoulder is cheaper than most comparable dog food.

Costco's shoulder packs are about 14 pounds (2 7# butts) here; I smoke and pull them;
freeze the cooked pulled pork in 3.5 oz vacuum packs. Use for sandwiches,
stir into scrambled eggs, as a pizza topping, stir into mac&cheese,
stir-fry with vegetables, stir with mashed potatoes, gravy, onions and
mushrooms, etc, et alia, und so weiter.

On 11/29/2019 01:54 PM, wrote:
You don't really have to cook the whole shoulder, I cut the big ones
into two or 3 pieces and freeze the ones I don't cook right away.
Actually my dog likes pork shoulder too so we can make the leftovers
disappear. Pork shoulder is cheaper than most comparable dog food.

My 'freezer' is only operational this time of year.

On 11/29/2019 02:46 PM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
On Friday, November 29, 2019 at 10:47:49 AM UTC-5, Ralph Mowery wrote:

I think I have made up my mind that for Christmas I am going to the get
one of the Butterball ones. They have one that is frozen and in a
baking bag. They advertise you just take it from the freezer and put it
in the oven and in about 4 hours it is ready. Has anyonne tried that
one ?

I have not. The notion of steaming a turkey in a plastic bag holds
no appeal. The best part of the turkey is the crispy skin.

That goes double for duck.

On Fri, 29 Nov 2019 16:55:46 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 11/29/2019 4:46 PM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
On Friday, November 29, 2019 at 10:47:49 AM UTC-5, Ralph Mowery wrote:

I think I have made up my mind that for Christmas I am going to the get
one of the Butterball ones. They have one that is frozen and in a
baking bag. They advertise you just take it from the freezer and put it
in the oven and in about 4 hours it is ready. Has anyonne tried that
one ?

I have not. The notion of steaming a turkey in a plastic bag holds
no appeal. The best part of the turkey is the crispy skin.

Cindy Hamilton

I've had the cooked-in-bag turkey. It was OK, but the skin is garbage.

You can crisp up the skin by cutting the bag open for the last half
hour to hour of cooking.

On Fri, 29 Nov 2019 11:40:23 -0700, rbowman
wrote:

On 11/29/2019 12:09 AM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Thu, 28 Nov 2019 23:36:23 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 11/28/2019 10:46 PM, wrote:

You can usually get fresh (not frozen) turkeys around the holidays but
a lot of people say the frozen one is probably "fresher" since it was
flash frozen right after it was killed as opposed to being packed in
ice for up to a month.


Some years ago we bought a really fresh fresh bird locally. It was
better but much more expensive. Don't recall the price but at least
triple.

Went to my son's house and we had a frozen bird that was 49 cents a
pound. It was pretty damned good for that price.
When you get a b or c grade bird they are even cheaper - some have 3
wings or 1 1/2 legs or other configurations, or torn skin - but they
taste just as good


I'm not sure I'd eat a turkey with three wings; sounds like gene
splicing gone awry.
Nope - just bad packing of mutilated birds

In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 29 Nov 2019 13:46:14 -0800 (PST), Cindy
Hamilton wrote:

On Friday, November 29, 2019 at 10:47:49 AM UTC-5, Ralph Mowery wrote:

I think I have made up my mind that for Christmas I am going to the get
one of the Butterball ones. They have one that is frozen and in a
baking bag. They advertise you just take it from the freezer and put it
in the oven and in about 4 hours it is ready. Has anyonne tried that
one ?

I have not. The notion of steaming a turkey in a plastic bag holds
no appeal. The best part of the turkey is the crispy skin.

Cindy Hamilton

I tried streaming a turkey but Verizon said I had the wrong kind of
modem.

In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 29 Nov 2019 02:09:20 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Thu, 28 Nov 2019 23:36:23 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 11/28/2019 10:46 PM, wrote:

You can usually get fresh (not frozen) turkeys around the holidays but
a lot of people say the frozen one is probably "fresher" since it was
flash frozen right after it was killed as opposed to being packed in
ice for up to a month.


Some years ago we bought a really fresh fresh bird locally. It was
better but much more expensive. Don't recall the price but at least
triple.

Went to my son's house and we had a frozen bird that was 49 cents a
pound. It was pretty damned good for that price.
When you get a b or c grade bird they are even cheaper - some have 3
wings or 1 1/2 legs or other configurations, or torn skin - but they
taste just as good

I got an f grade once. He was not just cheaper, they paid ME to take
care of him. He'd been kicked out of turkey school and in return for the
pay, we had to give him classes on the meaning of various kinds of
gobbling and on turkey etiquette. He was a good student for 3 weeks
until we ate him.