I just picked up a couple of $130 Costco LG Stylo 3 Plus phones as
last-minute stocking stuffers, where I ran the following hardware-only
comparison below.
http://wetakepic.com/images/2017/12/24/stylophones.jpg

I try to always only speak valid verifiable fact on Usenet.

Did I do a fair hardware comparison below of the two stocking stuffers?
If not, what hardware spec comparison did I miss?

(NOTE: It's not fair to iOS to perform an app functionality comparison
because there are scores of app functionalities on Android all by its itty
bitty self not on iOS and none on iOS not already on Android - so this is
only about the hardware comparison because all iOS devices lose in an
app-functionality comparison to almost any Android phone).

*HARDWARE COMPARISON OF STOCKING SUFFERS: iPhone 7 Plus vs Stylo 3 Plus:*
Price: The Stylo was $130; while the iPhone is ~$670 (~five times more!)
CPU: The Stylo has 8 cores; while the iPhone has only 4
CPU top speed: iPhone is 2.34GHz for 2 cores; Stylo is 1.4GHz for 4 cores
CPU lower speed: iPhone is 1.1GHz for 2 cores; Stylo is 1.1GHz for 4 cores
Storage: Both are 32GB
Expandable: Stylo expands to 2TB; iPhone is missing this functionality
Screen size: Stylo is 5.7 inches; iPhone is 5.5 inches
Display type: Both are IPS LCD
Pixel density: iPhone is 401ppi; Stylo is 386ppi
Screen resolution: both are the same at full HD 1080x1920 pixels
Main camera: Stylo rear camera is 13MP, while the iPhone 7 is 12MP
Selfie camera: iPhone is 7MP with flash; Stylo is 5MP with flash
Video: both are the same full HD at 1920x1080pixels at 30fps
Wi-Fi: both are the same at 802.11 everything up to ac, dual band
VoLTE: both are the same
NFC: both have NFC
Sensors: both have the same stuff
Bands: both have what is needed for the T-Mobile carrier we often use
Bluetooth: both are the same spec at version 4.2
Battery ease: Stylo is removable; while the iPhone 7 is not
Battery capacity: Stylo is 3080mAh, while the iPhone 7 is 2900mAh but no
RAM: iPhone 7 is 3GB while the Stylo is 2GB
Fingerprint sensor: iPhone 7 is on front; Stylo is on the back
SIM: Both are single nano SIM
Network: Both seem to support the same networks
Stylus: Stylo has a stylus; iPhone 7 is missing this functionality
FM Radio: Stylo has an FM radio; iPhone 7 is missing this functionality
Headphone: Stylo has a courageous jack; iPhone 7 is lost functionality
Wordsize: Both are 64-bit

The specs seems similar but the price is a whopping 5X difference.
Did I miss an important hardware spec to compare the two phablets?

As stocking stuffers...
Q: Which do you think, based on hardware, has better priceerformance?

REFERENCES:
https://www.gadgetsnow.com/compare-mobile-phones/LG-Stylo-3-Plus-vs-Apple-iPhone-7-Plus
https://www.phonearena.com/phones/compare/LG-Stylo-3-Plus,Apple-iPhone-7-Plus/phones/10534%2C9816
http://membershipwireless.com/50699/apple-iphone-7-plus-black-32gb/activationtype/new
http://membershipwireless.com/52734/stylo-3-plus/activationtype/new

In article , harry newton
wrote:


Did I do a fair hardware comparison below of the two stocking stuffers?

no, but you aren't interested in fair anything. you hate apple, so get
the android phone.

unless of course, you just want to troll.

On 12/24/2017 1:01 PM, harry newton wrote:
I just picked up a couple of $130 Costco LG Stylo 3 Plus phones as
last-minute stocking stuffers, where I ran the following hardware-only
comparison below.


When buying smartphones, make sure they have the WPA2 KRACK patch available.

I got a couple 18-month-old Verizon branded HTC phones that the manufacturer no longer issues security patch updates so no more HTC phones for me.

AFAIK, Apple has patched the WPA2 KRACK vulnerability in their phones.

He who is nospam said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 13:19:35 -0500:

Did I do a fair hardware comparison below of the two stocking stuffers?

no, but you aren't interested in fair anything. you hate apple, so get
the android phone.

As you know, I own and have bought plenty of Apple and Android devices.
They each have their strengths and weaknesses.

And, as you well know, I very often give iPhones and iPads as gifts.\
For gifts, what matters is what the kids want, and how much that costs.

When giving stocking stuffers, the fundamental price-to-performance ratio
is a key factor - because you want the most bang for your buck.

For your own personal phone, as I did with mine, I bought the best there
was at the time it was made, and I've been happy ever since.

But for a stocking stuffer - you care more about price-to-performance.
Hence why I ran the hardware comparison (I know the software already).

This is my first "phablet" as a gift, where I figured I'd put a few in the
stockings as a last-minute gift - so I didn't spend a lot of time on the
hardware comparison.

I'm thinking of picking up a few more of these phablets, but some of the
kids I'll be giving them to may want Apple devices, so that's why I ran the
hardware comparison just now.

What is missing or incorrect about the hardware comparison given already?

On Sunday, December 24, 2017 at 1:27:16 PM UTC-5, harry newton wrote:
He who is nospam said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 13:19:35 -0500:

Did I do a fair hardware comparison below of the two stocking stuffers?

no, but you aren't interested in fair anything. you hate apple, so get
the android phone.

As you know, I own and have bought plenty of Apple and Android devices.
They each have their strengths and weaknesses.

And, as you well know, I very often give iPhones and iPads as gifts.\
For gifts, what matters is what the kids want, and how much that costs.

When giving stocking stuffers, the fundamental price-to-performance ratio
is a key factor - because you want the most bang for your buck.

MAybe we have different definitions of stocking stuffer. To me that means
some low cost or moderate cost items that anyone can use. A cell phone,
especially for the younger folks, would seem to be a poor choice. First,
they all have them already. Second, it's a status symbol kind of thing
and they want what they want. If they want an iPhone, they probably aren't going
to be happy with a $130 LG. You need to make sure that whatever carrier
they have will accept that phone because people don't want to or can't
switch. Many, especially the majors, have a
short list of what they will accept. Sprint for example was a bunch of
iphones and a few motorolla G phones.

If I was going to give a cell phone as a gift, I'd be sure to know exactly
what the requirements are for the person receiving it.

Is the 'stylus' special, or just the ordinary one with the rubber tip
that you can get in a variety of colors at the 99-Cents-Only store?
They work really nicely for clumsy people with fat fingers.

--
Cheers, Bev
It doesn't matter who you vote for, the government always gets in.

In article , harry newton
wrote:


Did I do a fair hardware comparison below of the two stocking stuffers?

no, but you aren't interested in fair anything. you hate apple, so get
the android phone.

As you know, I own and have bought plenty of Apple and Android devices.

except you don't know how to use any of them to their fullest potential
(ios *or* android), even going so far to intentionally disable basic
functionality.

They each have their strengths and weaknesses.

if only you actually meant that.

you refuse to acknowledge any strength of apple or any weakness of
android, and whenever anything is pointed out, you go off on a lunatic
rant.

On Sunday, December 24, 2017 at 1:45:30 PM UTC-5, The Real Bev wrote:
Is the 'stylus' special, or just the ordinary one with the rubber tip
that you can get in a variety of colors at the 99-Cents-Only store?
They work really nicely for clumsy people with fat fingers.

--
Cheers, Bev
It doesn't matter who you vote for, the government always gets in.

I think the screens are capacitive responsive and the stylus is designed
to work with it. You can buy them, I've heard of people making them, but AFAIK,
in general you can't just use any stick, pointer, etc.

On 12/24/2017 11:27 AM, harry newton wrote:
I'm thinking of picking up a few more of these phablets, but some of the
kids I'll be giving them to may want Apple devices, so that's why I ran the
hardware comparison just now.

You have hit on it. Apple fans, including kids swayed by their peers or
Apple advertising, will accept nothing but Apple, regardless of the cost.

In article , rbowman
wrote:


You have hit on it. Apple fans, including kids swayed by their peers or
Apple advertising, will accept nothing but Apple, regardless of the cost.

apple haters will continue hating, regardless of facts.

In comp.mobile.android, on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 18:01:01 +0000 (UTC), harry
newton wrote:

I just picked up a couple of $130 Costco LG Stylo 3 Plus phones as
last-minute stocking stuffers, where I ran the following hardware-only
comparison below.
http://wetakepic.com/images/2017/12/24/stylophones.jpg

I try to always only speak valid verifiable fact on Usenet.

Did I do a fair hardware comparison below of the two stocking stuffers?
If not, what hardware spec comparison did I miss?

(NOTE: It's not fair to iOS to perform an app functionality comparison
because there are scores of app functionalities on Android all by its itty
bitty self not on iOS and none on iOS not already on Android - so this is
only about the hardware comparison because all iOS devices lose in an
app-functionality comparison to almost any Android phone).

The Stylo sure seems like a better buy for much less money.

*HARDWARE COMPARISON OF STOCKING SUFFERS: iPhone 7 Plus vs Stylo 3 Plus:*
Price: The Stylo was $130; while the iPhone is ~$670 (~five times more!)

Since this is the way most people express it, I would have let it go,
except you compound it below. It may well be easier to convince you of
the one below than this one, but here goes.

The iPhone is 5 times as much, but it is only 4 times more.

Or "it is more. 5 times as much."

CPU: The Stylo has 8 cores; while the iPhone has only 4
CPU top speed: iPhone is 2.34GHz for 2 cores; Stylo is 1.4GHz for 4 cores
CPU lower speed: iPhone is 1.1GHz for 2 cores; Stylo is 1.1GHz for 4 cores
Storage: Both are 32GB
Expandable: Stylo expands to 2TB; iPhone is missing this functionality
Screen size: Stylo is 5.7 inches; iPhone is 5.5 inches
Display type: Both are IPS LCD
Pixel density: iPhone is 401ppi; Stylo is 386ppi
Screen resolution: both are the same at full HD 1080x1920 pixels
Main camera: Stylo rear camera is 13MP, while the iPhone 7 is 12MP
Selfie camera: iPhone is 7MP with flash; Stylo is 5MP with flash
Video: both are the same full HD at 1920x1080pixels at 30fps
Wi-Fi: both are the same at 802.11 everything up to ac, dual band
VoLTE: both are the same
NFC: both have NFC
Sensors: both have the same stuff
Bands: both have what is needed for the T-Mobile carrier we often use
Bluetooth: both are the same spec at version 4.2
Battery ease: Stylo is removable; while the iPhone 7 is not
Battery capacity: Stylo is 3080mAh, while the iPhone 7 is 2900mAh but no
RAM: iPhone 7 is 3GB while the Stylo is 2GB
Fingerprint sensor: iPhone 7 is on front; Stylo is on the back
SIM: Both are single nano SIM
Network: Both seem to support the same networks
Stylus: Stylo has a stylus; iPhone 7 is missing this functionality
FM Radio: Stylo has an FM radio; iPhone 7 is missing this functionality
Headphone: Stylo has a courageous jack; iPhone 7 is lost functionality
Wordsize: Both are 64-bit

The specs seems similar but the price is a whopping 5X difference.

The difference is 4x. If you subtract the lower from the higher to get
the difference, and then divide by the lower, the answer is rougly 4.

Did I miss an important hardware spec to compare the two phablets?

As stocking stuffers...
Q: Which do you think, based on hardware, has better priceerformance?

REFERENCES:
https://www.gadgetsnow.com/compare-mobile-phones/LG-Stylo-3-Plus-vs-Apple-iPhone-7-Plus
https://www.phonearena.com/phones/compare/LG-Stylo-3-Plus,Apple-iPhone-7-Plus/phones/10534%2C9816
http://membershipwireless.com/50699/apple-iphone-7-plus-black-32gb/activationtype/new
http://membershipwireless.com/52734/stylo-3-plus/activationtype/new

In comp.mobile.android, on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 10:45:25 -0800, The Real Bev
wrote:

Is the 'stylus' special,

When you said special, it prompted me to ask if the stylo was a special
sale, a loss leader, or anything like that, so that it overrepresented
the price advantage of LG over iphone.

I once bought a PCJr that was iirc, well I can't really, maybe 200
dollars if you came with 20 proofs of purchase from the makers of
Kleenex and other products. So I bought one, and they stopped selling
them a week later. So that was there closeout price.

(Still, I got my money's worth. Used it for 9 years until I got a used,
modified, and only partly restored to its original setup XT.I thought it
would work when I got it home but I had to learn a couple things, I'm
surprised I could find the things to learn.)

or just the ordinary one with the rubber tip
that you can get in a variety of colors at the 99-Cents-Only store?
They work really nicely for clumsy people with fat fingers.

He who is trader_4 said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 10:52:30 -0800 (PST):

Is the 'stylus' special, or just the ordinary one with the rubber tip
that you can get in a variety of colors at the 99-Cents-Only store?
They work really nicely for clumsy people with fat fingers.

--
Cheers, Bev
It doesn't matter who you vote for, the government always gets in.

I think the screens are capacitive responsive and the stylus is designed
to work with it. You can buy them, I've heard of people making them, but AFAIK,
in general you can't just use any stick, pointer, etc.

I have never bought a phablet before now, particularly one with a stylus,
so it's a good question of whether the stylus is a commodity or if it has
to be the one that is clipped into the phone.
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=how+does+a+tablet+stylus+work
https://www.techwalla.com/articles/how-does-a-stylus-pen-work

This says a capacitive stylus is easy to make at home:
https://www.howtogeek.com/177376/not-all-tablet-styluses-are-equal-capacitive-wacom-and-bluetooth-explained/
http://www.instructables.com/id/Make-a-working-touchscreen-stylus-for-your-phone-o/

Certainly there is a mechanical fit that has to fit the Stylus 3 Plus,
which, a quick google, shows the Stylo 3 Plus does NOT even fit a Stylo 3:
https://www.amazon.com/Eaglestar-Replacement-Stylus-Touch-Stylo/dp/B077T4PJ1R

But the cost is about 10 bucks for it so it might not matter all that much:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/For-LG-Stylo-3-Plus-LS777-Touch-Pen-Replacement-Stylus-S-Original-High-Quality/253252457463

He who is trader_4 said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 10:40:56 -0800 (PST):

MAybe we have different definitions of stocking stuffer. To me that means
some low cost or moderate cost items that anyone can use. A cell phone,
especially for the younger folks, would seem to be a poor choice. First,
they all have them already.

These are meant to be second phones for the kids, which is why the
price-to-performance is a factor - since I want to get the best bang for
the buck.

Second, it's a status symbol kind of thing
and they want what they want. If they want an iPhone, they probably aren't going
to be happy with a $130 LG. You need to make sure that whatever carrier
they have will accept that phone because people don't want to or can't
switch.

I've had all three main US carriers (yes, I know there are 4) where I've
pretty much talked most of the Silicon Valley based extended family into
using T-Mobile - so for these phones - it's the T-Mobile carrier so the
phone is technically a LG-TP450 (which is the T-Mobile variant at Costco).
http://wetakepic.com/images/2017/12/24/stylo3plus.jpg

Many, especially the majors, have a
short list of what they will accept. Sprint for example was a bunch of
iphones and a few motorolla G phones.

I can put the T-Mobile SIM card into almost any GSM phone and it just
works. In this hardware comparison, it seems that the GSM part of the
hardware specs is the same for both phablets being compared.

If I was going to give a cell phone as a gift, I'd be sure to know exactly
what the requirements are for the person receiving it.

I have plenty of iOS & Android devices, I've received plenty of both as
gifts, and I've given plenty as gifts. It's a thing with our family. Here,
for example, is a collection sitting in my office right now at this very
moment where you see iPads with iPhones with Android phablets.
http://wetakepic.com/images/2017/12/24/devices.jpg

Since I have both Android & iOS devices, but since I have never bought a
phablet before and since I may buy a few more today, I wanted to double
check with all of you for a fair hardware comparison between the iPhone 7
Plus & Stylo 3 Plus.

What did you think of the hardware comparison?
Did I get anything wrong or miss a key hardware-comparison factor?

He who is nospam said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 13:48:06 -0500:

you refuse to acknowledge any strength of apple or any weakness of
android, and whenever anything is pointed out, you go off on a lunatic
rant.

Please try to stay on topic.

I have plenty of iOS & Android devices, I've received plenty of both as
gifts, and I've given plenty as gifts. It's a thing with our family. Here,
for example, is a collection sitting in my office right now at this very
moment where you see iPads with iPhones with Android phablets.
http://wetakepic.com/images/2017/12/24/devices.jpg

Since I have both Android & iOS devices, but since I have never bought a
phablet before and since I may buy a few more today, I wanted to double
check with all of you for a fair hardware comparison between the iPhone 7
Plus & Stylo 3 Plus.

What did you think of the hardware comparison?
Did I get anything wrong or miss a key hardware-comparison factor?

He who is rbowman said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 11:54:58 -0700:

I'm thinking of picking up a few more of these phablets, but some of the
kids I'll be giving them to may want Apple devices, so that's why I ran the
hardware comparison just now.

You have hit on it. Apple fans, including kids swayed by their peers or
Apple advertising, will accept nothing but Apple, regardless of the cost.

While I have never bought a phablet before, it does seem that these LG
Stylo 3 Plus phones I bought as last-minute stocking stuffers are one fifth
the price of the equivalent iPhone 7 Plus based on the hardware specs.

Since I had only expected an equivalent iPhone to cost about double the
price of an equivalent Android phone, I was amazed that these seemingly
comparable devices are so vastly different in price.

For the price of one iPhone 7 Plus, I can give five equivalent Android
phones, based on the hardware specs I listed in the OP.

Since that Android-to-iOS price-to-performance comparison seems too good to
be true, I wanted to ask if I somehow got the hardware specs wrong, or
maybe the price wrong on the iPhone (I already paid the $130 so I know that
the price on the Android phablet is accurate).

Did I get the 5X price comparison correct?
Is my hardware comparison correct?

If so, with respect only to hardware, would you consider the two phones to
be essentially equivalent?

In article , harry newton
wrote:

Please try to stay on topic.

stop snipping to alter context and you'll see that i do.

He who is nospam said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 15:06:16 -0500:

stop snipping to alter context and you'll see that i do.

Did I get the 5X price comparison correct?
Is my hardware comparison correct?

If so, with respect only to the hardware, would you consider the two phones
to be essentially equivalent?

Why or why not?

On Sunday, December 24, 2017 at 2:53:15 PM UTC-5, harry newton wrote:
He who is trader_4 said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 10:40:56 -0800 (PST):

MAybe we have different definitions of stocking stuffer. To me that means
some low cost or moderate cost items that anyone can use. A cell phone,
especially for the younger folks, would seem to be a poor choice. First,
they all have them already.

These are meant to be second phones for the kids, which is why the
price-to-performance is a factor - since I want to get the best bang for
the buck.


That concept does not compute, at least for me.





Second, it's a status symbol kind of thing
and they want what they want. If they want an iPhone, they probably aren't going
to be happy with a $130 LG. You need to make sure that whatever carrier
they have will accept that phone because people don't want to or can't
switch.

I've had all three main US carriers (yes, I know there are 4) where I've
pretty much talked most of the Silicon Valley based extended family into
using T-Mobile - so for these phones - it's the T-Mobile carrier so the
phone is technically a LG-TP450 (which is the T-Mobile variant at Costco)..



I just switched to t-mobile myself. Way better than sprint here in my area of NJ. Actually I'm with Mint Sim, which is the sub whore of a whore. T-mobile is the carrier, ultra is the sub wholesaler, Mint is owned by Ultra. They have 3 levels of service, 2,5,or 10gb of data. If you prepay for a year, it's $15, $20, or $25 a month. Through end of year, they have a deal where you get 6 months for the price of 3, so its costing me $12.50 a month for the first 6 months on the 10gb plan. They also have a $5 trial, 100 mins, 100 text, 100 mb data. They send you two sims, if you like it, you can get a regular plan and activate the second Sim. It's blazing fast, I get 76 mbits down at home.




http://wetakepic.com/images/2017/12/24/stylo3plus.jpg

Many, especially the majors, have a
short list of what they will accept. Sprint for example was a bunch of
iphones and a few motorolla G phones.

I can put the T-Mobile SIM card into almost any GSM phone and it just
works.

It won't work in a locked phone from another carrier. And it won't work in a boost mobile/sprint phone, even though the hardware supports GSM and the phone is unlocked,because the firmware for GSM is disabled.



In this hardware comparison, it seems that the GSM part of the
hardware specs is the same for both phablets being compared.

If I was going to give a cell phone as a gift, I'd be sure to know exactly
what the requirements are for the person receiving it.

I have plenty of iOS & Android devices, I've received plenty of both as
gifts, and I've given plenty as gifts. It's a thing with our family. Here,
for example, is a collection sitting in my office right now at this very
moment where you see iPads with iPhones with Android phablets.
http://wetakepic.com/images/2017/12/24/devices.jpg

Since I have both Android & iOS devices, but since I have never bought a
phablet before and since I may buy a few more today, I wanted to double
check with all of you for a fair hardware comparison between the iPhone 7
Plus & Stylo 3 Plus.


I was looking at the stylo before I decided on the ZTE. This has a 6" screen, 4000mah battery and I love it.




What did you think of the hardware comparison?
Did I get anything wrong or miss a key hardware-comparison factor?

Fast charging on the Lg? Charging time? And to really compare the cpu performance you need benchmarks.

He who is Bob said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 13:23:56 -0500:

On 12/24/2017 1:01 PM, harry newton wrote:
I just picked up a couple of $130 Costco LG Stylo 3 Plus phones as
last-minute stocking stuffers, where I ran the following hardware-only
comparison below.


When buying smartphones, make sure they have the WPA2 KRACK patch available.

I got a couple 18-month-old Verizon branded HTC phones that the manufacturer no longer issues security patch updates so no more HTC phones for me.

AFAIK, Apple has patched the WPA2 KRACK vulnerability in their phones.

Thanks for that advice to ensure that the KRACK attack is patched.
I do keep abreast of security vulnerabilities in both Android & in iOS.

In fact, I'm the guy that broke the news of that KRACK attack on both the
iOS and Android newsgroups - so I'm well aware of the vulnerability.
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/pI1pmUNYGbM

If it were an iOS phone, I'd have to ensure it doesn't have the secret
permanent and drastic CPU slowdown "feature" also - which is another
vulnerability I was the first to post on the iOS newsgroups.
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/GdEtzzrc9F0

So I'm up to speed on the software vulnerabilities - but the topic of this
thread is whether I got the hardware comparisons correct.

Is my hardware comparison correct?

If so, with respect only to hardware, would you consider the two phones to
be essentially equivalent? Why or why not?

In article , harry newton
wrote:

Is my hardware comparison correct?

no.

If so, with respect only to the hardware, would you consider the two phones
to be essentially equivalent?

not even remotely close to equivalent.

any idiot can see a $130 device is not equivalent to a $600 device.

you're also ignoring that iphones start at $350, not $600.

He who is trader_4 said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 12:30:24 -0800 (PST):

These are meant to be second phones for the kids, which is why the
price-to-performance is a factor - since I want to get the best bang for
the buck.

That concept does not compute, at least for me.

Just like with buying tools, you want to make sure that they pay for
themselves over time, or that you get the best tool for the best price.

You can get the best tool at the worst price and you can get a bad tool at
an even worse price - but the concept of getting the best bang for the buck
should be familiar to you.

Is it not?

I just switched to t-mobile myself. Way better than sprint here in my area
of NJ. Actually I'm with Mint Sim, which is the sub whore of a whore.

I know people in NJ who are in love with Verizon signal.
They can't stand Verizon prices - but the signal strength is their gig.
So I have to get them Verizon phones.
But these phones are for local kids - where T-Mobile is just fine.

I can put the T-Mobile SIM card into almost any GSM phone and it just
works.

It won't work in a locked phone from another carrier.

I haven't had Verizon since they started unlocking phones, but AT&T
unlocked every phone I asked them to unlock, as did T-Mobile.

The paperwork from Costco clearly says T-mobile will unlock these phablets
after two billing cycles - so I will help the parents of these kids to get
them unlocked ASAP (because the FCC rules on unlocking, actually Library of
Congress regulations, change over time).

I was looking at the stylo before I decided on the ZTE.
This has a 6" screen, 4000mah battery and I love it.

That's a bit bigger in both screen size and battery size.
Is the battery removable?

To me, the battery being removable is one of the most precious hardware
features of many Android phones. For example, I bought my Samsung Galaxy
SIII when it was new, and now I change batteries any time I want. I have a
7,000mAH battery for example, which works beautifully.

You can see the external battery charger I use in this picture - where I
typically charge four new batteries at a time so that I can run 24/7 as
long as the electricity holds out.
http://wetakepic.com/images/2017/12/24/stylo3plus_phones.jpg

My model for myself is the same that most of us use for my shop tools.
I buy the best phone that exists for whatever price it costs, and then I
use it forever or until it's no longer feasible.

At about 5 years for my Samsung Galaxy SIII, it still is going strong
(since I replace batteries any time I want) but the USB port has been worn
out so I do all my transferring of data over the air to a networked drive
on my local home network.

How to mount the entire mobile device file system on Windows
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/j2nTvKDVF2Y/W4CvRyK1AAAJ

What did you think of the hardware comparison?
Did I get anything wrong or miss a key hardware-comparison factor?

Fast charging on the Lg?

Thanks for that addition. Fast charging is a good point.

The LG claims to have "fast charging" and the charger that came with it
explicitly says that on the side.

You can see the LG "fast" charger in this pic:
http://wetakepic.com/images/2017/12/24/devices.jpg

I'm not sure though, "what" fast charging really means because I generally
use 2.4Amp 5VDC five port wall worts - so what would this "fast charger"
that came with the phone do that the wall wort doesn't already do?

Charging time?

Somewhere in the literature I saw "2 hours" charge time from dead to full.
Does that sound reasonable for a phablet?

And to really compare the cpu performance you need benchmarks.

I agree. Surprisingly I didn't find any benchmarks for the LG Stylo 3 Plus
that I could compare to the iPhone 7 Plus.

These benchmarks would be interesting because while the iPhone 7 Plus has
half as many CPU cores as does the Stylo 3 Plus, the speed of the 2 cores
that the iPhone has is a bit faster and there is more RAM in the iPhone.

So it would be interesting to see how the doubling of CPUs benchmarks
against that hardware feature.

If anyone has comparison benchmark numbers, that would be fantastic!

He who is nospam said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 13:59:34 -0500:

apple haters will continue hating, regardless of facts.

This is off topic.

We all know that the world loves Apple products.

In fact, I authored a thread in which you responded specifically outlining
all the reasons we all love Apple products in different ways.

Why is the iPhone/iPad one of the most successful mobile device platforms
in the market?
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/x8QlA5W81Yw

Here is the opening post I made to that thread...
"What are the main reasons millions of people, including some
of my own relatives, *love* the Apple iOS platform?"

So it's off topic for you to harp on your "apple haters" tirade.

All we want to know here is whether the cold hard facts are correct, and if
they're not, what are the cold hard facts about the hardware comparison
between the $130 LG Stylo 3 Plus and the equivalent $670 iPhone 7 Plus.

He who is micky said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 14:03:03 -0500:
The Stylo sure seems like a better buy for much less money.

Thanks for being the first person to hazard a guess, as I know it's risky
to state an opinion based on facts on the Usenet.

The main question is which is a better phone - from the hardware standpoint
only.

That's really the question - where the advantage of the iOS device is in a
faster CPU speed for half the cores (the same CPU speed for the other half
of it's cores) and the iPhone 7 has an extra GB of RAM.

Both of those are nice.

But on many other hardware factors (e.g., the Stylo 3 Plus has twice as
many CPU cores and expansion memory of up to 2 Terabytes) the Stylo 3 Plus
is clearly better than the iPhone 7 Plus.

It's the end analysis which I ask you about since each one of us weighs the
varying factors differently (e.g., I don't care about a camera but a kid
might care a lot - and where these two cameras seem 'about the same' but
they're not exactly the same).

The iPhone is 5 times as much, but it is only 4 times more.
Or "it is more. 5 times as much."

I ended up asking my wife to buy a couple more of the phablets today.

I'm ok with the equivalent iPhone being only 4 times as expensive as the
equivalent Android phone. The main calculation is that, for the same amount
of money, I can get 5 Android phones for the price of one equivalent iOS
phone.

That's what matters since these are gifts so I have to stuff more than one
stocking (one set of the recipients for example, are twins).

The difference is 4x. If you subtract the lower from the higher to get
the difference, and then divide by the lower, the answer is rougly 4.

That's fine. I understand.

The way I think about the math is that I can buy 5 Android phones for the
price of an essentially equivalent iOS phone.

In this case, I bought 4, so I had money to spare for something else (like
2 terabyte sd cards for each of the four phones!).

The important technical aspect of this question though isn't the price.

The question here is only of fact and how you interpret the hardware
comparison in the original post since we all weight the factors differently
and you never have to exactly equivalent android/ios phones in all hardware
respects.

On Sunday, December 24, 2017 at 3:48:58 PM UTC-5, harry newton wrote:
He who is trader_4 said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 12:30:24 -0800 (PST):

These are meant to be second phones for the kids, which is why the
price-to-performance is a factor - since I want to get the best bang for
the buck.

That concept does not compute, at least for me.

Just like with buying tools, you want to make sure that they pay for
themselves over time, or that you get the best tool for the best price.

You can get the best tool at the worst price and you can get a bad tool at
an even worse price - but the concept of getting the best bang for the buck
should be familiar to you.

Is it not?

I was referring to the concept of a kid needing out wanting a second cell phone. Unless they're a terrorist or drug dealer and need a burner phone.





I just switched to t-mobile myself. Way better than sprint here in my area
of NJ. Actually I'm with Mint Sim, which is the sub whore of a whore.

I know people in NJ who are in love with Verizon signal.

Verizon probably had the best coverage and the cost to go with it.


They can't stand Verizon prices - but the signal strength is their gig.
So I have to get them Verizon phones.
But these phones are for local kids - where T-Mobile is just fine.

I can put the T-Mobile SIM card into almost any GSM phone and it just
works.

It won't work in a locked phone from another carrier.

I haven't had Verizon since they started unlocking phones, but AT&T
unlocked every phone I asked them to unlock, as did T-Mobile.

The paperwork from Costco clearly says T-mobile will unlock these phablets
after two billing cycles - so I will help the parents of these kids to get
them unlocked ASAP (because the FCC rules on unlocking, actually Library of
Congress regulations, change over time).

So, it's not unlocked, it's a t-mobile phone. Then my previous comments still apply. It can probably go to another company that uses the t-mobile network, but I wouldn't count on it going to a CDMA carrier, even if they unlock it. And even if it's not firmware crippled, nothing says another carrier has to accept it. Sprint for example has a short list of phones that they will accept.




I was looking at the stylo before I decided on the ZTE.
This has a 6" screen, 4000mah battery and I love it.

That's a bit bigger in both screen size and battery size.
Is the battery removable?

No.



To me, the battery being removable is one of the most precious hardware
features of many Android phones. For example, I bought my Samsung Galaxy
SIII when it was new, and now I change batteries any time I want. I have a
7,000mAH battery for example, which works beautifully


I agree, that's a very good feature that I would prefer. But when you get a big phone, high resolution screen, for $100, some compromise is acceptable. And as phones get bigger and thinner you'll see more non removable.



You can see the external battery charger I use in this picture - where I
typically charge four new batteries at a time so that I can run 24/7 as
long as the electricity holds out.
http://wetakepic.com/images/2017/12/24/stylo3plus_phones.jpg

My model for myself is the same that most of us use for my shop tools.
I buy the best phone that exists for whatever price it costs, and then I
use it forever or until it's no longer feasible.

At about 5 years for my Samsung Galaxy SIII, it still is going strong
(since I replace batteries any time I want) but the USB port has been worn
out so I do all my transferring of data over the air to a networked drive
on my local home network.

How to mount the entire mobile device file system on Windows
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/j2nTvKDVF2Y/W4CvRyK1AAAJ

What did you think of the hardware comparison?
Did I get anything wrong or miss a key hardware-comparison factor?

Fast charging on the Lg?

Thanks for that addition. Fast charging is a good point.

The LG claims to have "fast charging" and the charger that came with it
explicitly says that on the side.

You can see the LG "fast" charger in this pic:
http://wetakepic.com/images/2017/12/24/devices.jpg

I'm not sure though, "what" fast charging really means because I generally
use 2.4Amp 5VDC five port wall worts - so what would this "fast charger"
that came with the phone do that the wall wort doesn't already do?


They boost voltage to at least 9v. The most widely used spec is Qualcomm quickcharge 3.0. That actually supports up to 21v, but I don't think anyone uses 21 for a phone, probably for tablets and such. But some manufactures have their own methods, eg Samsung. I don't think LG stylo has quick charging. This 4000mah battery charges in just over an hour.




Charging time?

Somewhere in the literature I saw "2 hours" charge time from dead to full..

Idk, sounds too fast for a regular charger, slow for a fast charger.


Does that sound reasonable for a phablet?

And to really compare the cpu performance you need benchmarks.

I agree. Surprisingly I didn't find any benchmarks for the LG Stylo 3 Plus
that I could compare to the iPhone 7 Plus.

These benchmarks would be interesting because while the iPhone 7 Plus has
half as many CPU cores as does the Stylo 3 Plus, the speed of the 2 cores
that the iPhone has is a bit faster and there is more RAM in the iPhone.

So it would be interesting to see how the doubling of CPUs benchmarks
against that hardware feature.

If anyone has comparison benchmark numbers, that would be fantastic!

Another thing to compare is the USB port. New Androids are going to usb-c, which is what I have. Apple of course has their own proprietary bs.

He who is JF Mezei said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 16:52:37 -0500:

any idiot can see a $130 device is not equivalent to a $600 device.

I disagree.

Price is not an indication of quality. Price is an indication of demand.
Nothing else.

If you have a hurricane, the price for a piece of lumber can triple.
The quality didn't triple - only the demand did.

You can have a pharmaceutical company make Viagra for $100 a pill and then
when the patent turns off, the same guy can sell the blue pill for $100 and
the white pill for $50 where the only difference is demand.

You can buy car parts on your own or you can let the body shop buy them for
you and the price will be ten times for the same part when the body shop
buys it.

Price is never an indication of quality.
Price is only an indication of demand - which is highly influenced by ...
guess what ... c'mon ... guess.....

MARKETING.

I have a friend who bought an Asus Zen phone. On paper, it
had all the "superior" specs.

Hardware specs aren't everything I agree.
What matters is price to performance.

I would expect and hope that the iPhone 7 Plus is at least five times
faster in all meaningful benchmarks than the LG Stylo 3 Plus is, as the
Stylo has a *lot* of nice things that the iPhone will never have (e.g.,
removable battery, 2TB storage,

But it trurns out the camera, in real life, takes lousy shots, not good
in dark etc. The 5000mAh battery is great but doesn't give 2.8 times
the autonomy you'd get on an iPhone with 1800mAh.

I'll look on DXoMark for the camera comparison because they seem "similar"
but not the same.

For example, I think the f stop rating for the iPhone 7 Plus is better than
the f stop rating for the LG Stylo 3 Plus - which would make the cameras
perform differently when in low-light conditions.

I will defer to the camera tests to see which has the better camera where I
would hope that the iPhone has a far better camera because we all know
(from extensive DxoMark tests over time) that the iPhone cameras generally
are in the bottom of the top ten of the best Android cameras.
https://www.dxomark.com/introducing-the-new-dxomark-mobile-test-protocol/

A lot of playesr in the phone market play the specs game. Apple's specs
are traditionally unimpressive, but in real life, yields better quality
photos, more battery autonomy, faster CPU etc.

That's just dead wrong on the camera. You're too influenced by MARKETING.
Apple camera results are fine - but they're historically in the bottom of
the top ten or dozen of the best Android cameras at the same time.

We have many threads on this topic ... here's just one:
Finally, Apple makes a smartphone camera that isn't the worst
of the top ten best!
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/s-_cGzvapwY/58sodzJ8BQAJ

So just looking at the specs isn't enough, and a lot of the real life
measurements are not scientific, they are subjective (such as image
quality for photos taken).

I think that anyone who thinks iPhone cameras are the best is unduly
influenced by MARKETING where the specs aren't the problem. They are just
wrong (since the people who test camera output know how to test them).

Apple camera output is good - and it's in the top ten - but almost always
over time - it's been in the BOTTOM of the top ten at any given moment -
although for a moment or two - they were the number one camera - and then
slipped back - only weeks later to fourth or fifth place before dropping
back to where they typically are, in tenth place.

Still - the cameras are good - they're just not the best and never were.

But I do agree with you that the specifications don't tell everything but
that camera ranking is based on output - not on specs.

Back to the comparison of the $130 LG Stylo 3 Plus to the iPhone 7 Plus, I
would HOPE to dear God that the iPhone (at its price) has (far) better
meaningful benchmark numbers. It must - but I haven't found the direct
1-to-1 comparison benchmarks yet.

On 12/24/2017 2:53 PM, harry newton wrote:
He who is trader_4 said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 10:40:56 -0800 (PST):

MAybe we have different definitions of stocking stuffer.* To me that
means
some low cost or moderate cost items that anyone can use.* A cell phone,
especially for the younger folks, would seem to be a poor choice.* First,
they all have them already.

These are meant to be second phones for the kids, which is why the
price-to-performance is a factor - since I want to get the best bang for
the buck.


Second phone? I'd not give my kids a first phone let alone a second. I
did not buy them cars either. They appreciate what they worked to get.

On 12/24/2017 11:59 AM, nospam wrote:
In article , rbowman
wrote:


You have hit on it. Apple fans, including kids swayed by their peers or
Apple advertising, will accept nothing but Apple, regardless of the cost.

apple haters will continue hating, regardless of facts.


Certainly. That is a corollary of the first statement. I neither hate or
love Apple. However up to this point nobody has offered my money to
create software for an Apple product so I have little interest in them.

My only brush with one was after I was gifted with a iPod Shuffle. I
will say iTunes was one of the least usable interfaces I've ever used.

He who is rbowman said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 19:18:43 -0700:

Certainly. That is a corollary of the first statement. I neither hate or
love Apple. However up to this point nobody has offered my money to
create software for an Apple product so I have little interest in them.

My only brush with one was after I was gifted with a iPod Shuffle. I
will say iTunes was one of the least usable interfaces I've ever used.

It's well known that iTunes is an abomination (just google iTunes and
bloatware to find that they're associated intimately).

Luckily, you can use an older version of Sharepod, which I use all the
time, which allows you to transfer any data to and from any iPod to and
from any Windows desktop computer without risk of blowing away any of your
songs like iTunes has a tendency to do because of its idiotic restrictive
"library" concept.

Luckily for me, I have older versions of Sharepod lying around and sitting
on all my iPods - so if you can find an older version - you're good as gold
because there are ZERO restrictions.

With SHarepod freeware, you can copy anything from any iPod to any Windows
machine without ever needing a login or password or even storing a single
bit of the executable on Windows (it runs off the iPod as a Windows
executable stored on the iPod).

Basically, you get an Excel-like spreadsheet with the older versions of
Sharepod where you just click to transfer anything to anything - where I've
very often transferred songs from one iPod to another or to DVD or from DVD
or to disk or from disk or whatever.

He who is Ed Pawlowski said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 20:29:33 -0500:

These are meant to be second phones for the kids, which is why the
price-to-performance is a factor - since I want to get the best bang for
the buck.


Second phone? I'd not give my kids a first phone let alone a second. I
did not buy them cars either. They appreciate what they worked to get.

Kids learn a lot from their electronics though.

He who is trader_4 said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 13:20:37 -0800 (PST):

Is it not?

I was referring to the concept of a kid needing out wanting a
second cell phone. Unless they're a terrorist or drug dealer
and need a burner phone.

Oh. Thanks for explaining. Yes. That's an apropos observation.

I ended up purchasing four of the Android phablets, where for the money
saved on not buying the fifth, I'll get the kids each a decently sized sd
card.

It's quite nice that the Android tablet can handle up to 2 terabytes of the
sd card storage - although I've never bought a card anywhere near that
large.


I know people in NJ who are in love with Verizon signal.

Verizon probably had the best coverage and the cost to go with it.

Yes. That seems to be the case. Maybe because AT&T started in NJ and
Verizon picked up from them at some point some of their infrastructure?

Out here, Verizon signal is ok. So is AT&T. SO it T-Mobile.
Depends on which mountain your house sits on top of.

So, it's not unlocked, it's a t-mobile phone.
Then my previous comments still apply. It can probably go to
another company that uses the t-mobile network, but I wouldn't
count on it going to a CDMA carrier, even if they unlock it.

I've had so many cellphones that I can't count them, but never had I had a
trouble with unlocking them. It's been easier in the past few years that it
was in the beginning where I had to jailbreak just to switch an iOS phone
from AT&T to T-Mobile.

Costco gave me paperwork that explicityly says T-mobile will unlock the
phones after two billing cycles - so - given that Costco gives 90 day
no-questions-asked returns, I can unlock the phone and return it a month
later - not that I'd do that - but the point is that unlocking is so easy
that it's not an issue in the least.

And even if it's not firmware crippled, nothing says another
carrier has to accept it. Sprint for example has a short list
of phones that they will accept.

Here, in California, I've never had a problem unlocking any AT&T or
T-Mobile phone in the past few years. So it's a non issue. Like the color
of the phone. It's meaningless in the scheme of things.

That's a bit bigger in both screen size and battery size.
Is the battery removable?

No.

Bummer. The one thing that keeps my Samsung Galaxy SIII alive is the fact
that I can pop in any battery I want at any time I want. It's one of the
most important features of a modern smart phone to have the user
replaceable battery, IMHO.

I agree, that's a very good feature that I would prefer.
But when you get a big phone, high resolution screen, for $100,
some compromise is acceptable. And as phones get bigger and
thinner you'll see more non removable.

I agree that it's better for the manufacturer, in very many ways, to make
the phone non removable - but maybe not so much a benefit to the user
except perhaps in momentary water proofness in longer immersions.

In short accidental immersions, there may be a huge benefit to popping the
battery out quickly - as I've done many times on my S3 over the years
(given I hike in all weather with that phone).

They boost voltage to at least 9v. The most widely used spec is
Qualcomm quickcharge 3.0. That actually supports up to 21v, but
I don't think anyone uses 21 for a phone, probably for tablets
and such. But some manufactures have their own methods, eg Samsung.

Interesting. The current is all that matters, in the end, but the way to
get current is with pressure, and that's what the voltage is all about.

I don't think LG stylo has quick charging. ]

It says it does and it says so on the battery charger that came with the
phone.

This 4000mah battery charges in just over an hour.

Thanks. Now I have an idea of the charging time expected for a "quick
charger". Much appreciated.

It's so nice to deal with the non-iOS-group people who are actually helpful
and not so scornful as nospam and some of the others habitually are. Thanks
for being a good helpful person.

Idk, sounds too fast for a regular charger, slow for a fast charger.

Interesting. I need to dig more into this "fast charging" stuff as it's new
to me, although the electronics is old school stuff of course.

Another thing to compare is the USB port. New Androids are going to usb-c,
which is what I have. Apple of course has their own proprietary bs.

Looking at the specs, I noticed both are essentially USB 2.0, although
Apple is, of course, proprietary.

The one good thing that came out of the Apple-proprietary port was it may
have spurred the micro-usb people to build a port spec that goes both ways,
which is a nice thing Apple did (accidentally) for the industry.

Back to the topic, I assume the benchmark speeds on the LG Stylo 3 Plus
will be dismal compared to the iPhone 7 Plus - but I'm awaiting finding
them to be sure.

He who is harry newton said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 18:01:01 +0000 (UTC):

Q: Which do you think, based on hardware, has better priceerformance?

What's interesting is this :singshot Extreme" benchmark I just found, which
validates what I thought would happen, which is that the iPhone 7 Plus is
faster than the LG Stylo 3 Plus.

iPhone 7 Plus:
https://www.futuremark.com/hardware/...+7+Plus/review

LG Stylo 3 Plus:
https://www.futuremark.com/hardware/...+3+Plus/review

If someone has more insight into the relevance of this "Sling Shot Extreme"
benchmark, that would be helpful.

Here are the raw numbers.

Physics test part 1 LG=22 FPS iPhone=26 FPS
Physics test part 2 LG=13 FPS iPhone=10 FPS
Physics test part 3 LG=7 FPS iPhone=6 FPS
Physics score LG=1279 iPhone=1145
-
Graphics test 1 LG=2 FPS iPhone=24 FPS
Graphics test 2 LG=1 FPS iPhone=11 FPS
Graphics score LG=244 iPhone=3342
-
Average score = LG=297 iPhone=2307

On 12/24/2017 08:08 PM, harry newton wrote:
He who is Ed Pawlowski said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 20:29:33 -0500:

These are meant to be second phones for the kids, which is why the
price-to-performance is a factor - since I want to get the best bang for
the buck.

Second phone? I'd not give my kids a first phone let alone a second. I
did not buy them cars either. They appreciate what they worked to get.

Kids learn a lot from their electronics though.

I think they learn more from working.

--
Cheers, Bev
'Politics' comes from an ancient Greek word meaning
'many blood-sucking leeches.' -- Mark Russell

He who is The Real Bev said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 21:20:29 -0800:

Kids learn a lot from their electronics though.

I think they learn more from working.

Well, I have four of these phablets in four different stockings.
They'll open them tomorrow morning.
I hope they like 'em.

Merry Christmas!

On Sunday, December 24, 2017 at 11:08:58 PM UTC-5, harry newton wrote:
He who is trader_4 said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 13:20:37 -0800 (PST):

Is it not?

I was referring to the concept of a kid needing out wanting a
second cell phone. Unless they're a terrorist or drug dealer
and need a burner phone.

Oh. Thanks for explaining. Yes. That's an apropos observation.

I ended up purchasing four of the Android phablets, where for the money
saved on not buying the fifth, I'll get the kids each a decently sized sd
card.

It's quite nice that the Android tablet can handle up to 2 terabytes of the
sd card storage - although I've never bought a card anywhere near that
large.



Does the phone say it can take that much? Highest I've seen is 256GB,
not that it matters to me, I'd never use it. For an SD card, I'd
recommend the Sandisk Extreme Plus microSD SDXC. The new ones are
rated A1, which is yet another spec. It means the card is fast
enough to run apps off of. The newer Androids allow that now, for apps
to be on an external card. Be careful that it's a real one, there
are all kinds of fakes on Ebay for example.




I know people in NJ who are in love with Verizon signal.

Verizon probably had the best coverage and the cost to go with it.

Yes. That seems to be the case. Maybe because AT&T started in NJ and
Verizon picked up from them at some point some of their infrastructure?

Out here, Verizon signal is ok. So is AT&T. SO it T-Mobile.
Depends on which mountain your house sits on top of.

So, it's not unlocked, it's a t-mobile phone.
Then my previous comments still apply. It can probably go to
another company that uses the t-mobile network, but I wouldn't
count on it going to a CDMA carrier, even if they unlock it.

I've had so many cellphones that I can't count them, but never had I had a
trouble with unlocking them. It's been easier in the past few years that it
was in the beginning where I had to jailbreak just to switch an iOS phone
from AT&T to T-Mobile.

Costco gave me paperwork that explicityly says T-mobile will unlock the
phones after two billing cycles - so - given that Costco gives 90 day
no-questions-asked returns, I can unlock the phone and return it a month
later - not that I'd do that - but the point is that unlocking is so easy
that it's not an issue in the least.

We just keep talking past each other. In one of the first posts, I explained
how even if you unlock a phone that you buy from a carrier, you may not
be able to take it to another carrier, because while it's unlocked, some
carriers cripple the phone so it's impossible to do so. These are not
a generic phone from the manufacturer. They are built to the specs of
the carrier who sells them. They are loaded with the crapware that the
carrier tells them to put on them and only have whatever the carrier tells
them to turn on, enabled.

Let's go over the example of Boost or Sprint again. They are CDMA. You
can buy a phone like the ZTE Max XL from Boost. You can go look at the
Max XL specs online at ZTE. The phone hardware supports CDMA and GSM.
You look at the freqs, etc it matches what T-Mobile uses. OK, so you
buy it at Sprint or Boost. You have to have service with them for a year for
them to unlock it. That's the longest allowed by the agreement they signed,
but it's still fair. BTW, another go screw you is that they don't tell
you that they count that by months of service with you, not for the phone.
So, if you're at month 10, you could give the phone to your nephew or sell
it and then screw them, the clock starts all over. Which doesn't seem fair,
it's a subsidized $100 phone. They get 10 months out of you, your nephew
has it 2 months, you'd think they should unlock it, but no, screw you.
Also you have to request unlocking within 60 days of ending service, otherwise,
screw you.

OK, continuing on with the Sprint or Boost example, you play by their rules,
you have a full 12 months of paid service. You call up customer service.
They give you the run around, tell you excuses, have to put a ticket into
the back office, it will take days, etc.. Finally they give you the unlock
code. How did you unlock those phones you did? Typically it's by just
putting the other carrier's SIM in and it comes up with a prompt for the
unlock code. Well, guess what. Because these phones are made to the
carrier's spec, there is no way to put the lock code in. You put a foreign
SIM in, it just says "invalid sim", no way to do anything else. So you
google and find that for many phones you can also get the unlock prompt
by typing ##23543** or whatever into the phone dialer. There are several
strings that work with various other phones. Guess what? Nothing works
with that ZTE Max XL or other phones that Sprint/Boost sells. So, you
call up their customer service and they tell you it's not their problem,
they can't help you, it's the other carrier that you want to take the
phone to, it's their problem to reprogram the phone.

Finally, if you ever got far enough to actual get some of these unlocked
by whatever method and you actually tried to run them on a GSM carrier,
you'd find that the GSM doesn't work, because the firmware that;s in
that phone made for Sprint/Boost, doesn't enable GSM, even thought the
hardware supports it. If you don't believe me, just google and you;ll
see people going through all of the above. I don't doubt that some
carriers are more ethical and may actually allow you to unlock a phone
and not cripple it. But the final go screw you is that there is no
requirement whatever that another carrier take it. Like I said, try
bringing your own phone to Sprint. When I looked last spring, they
had a very short list of phones that they will accept. They say they
have to certify them to work and this is the short list, it was iphones
and a very few Motorola. Anything else, screw you, we won't allow it.
They deliberately make it next to impossible to actually take the
phone to another carrier.

My point is that if you intend to buy a phone and be able to use it
anywhere and not get caught in the above traps, you better buy an
unlocked one that comes from the manufacturer, not a carrier. The
problem with all the above is that it's a mine field. I'd bet that
of the people who have a phone from a specific carrier, the ones
that are successful unlocking it to go to a completely different
carrier are the minority. If you're going within that carrier, from
the carrier itself to one of it's sub whores, eg from MetroPCS to
Mint Sim, both of which run on T-Mobile, you have a better chance of
success. But even then it's not easy. I bought a MetroPCS phone,
unlocked, and still had trouble getting hotspot to work on MintSim.
Mint simply says, hotspot will not work with us on that phone,
even though prior to buying it I ran the IMEI on the Mint website
and it said the phone was compatible. So, it's compatible, but
not with hotspot. Which dovetails perfectly with the fine print all these carriers have
on their websites, which says, even if we unlock it, even if it works
on another carrier, "all features and services may not be available".
I finally figured out a way around it through research, but the average
person would have given up and sold the phone on Ebay a long time ago.
My point is that it's a real minefield out there when it comes to
unlocking. While I don't doubt you were successful and had a different
experience, it's still a big problem and I would never buy a phone
worth more than about $100 from a carrier and expect to be able to unlock it and
take it to another carrier. Not after what I learned from the above.
Another advantage to a true unlocked phone from the manufacturer is that
it's not loades with all the carrier crapware that you can't get rid of.
Did you try to get rid of Facebook, Amazon, Twitter, etc, whatever came
with a carrier phone that you don't want, don't use? Almost all of it,
you can't remove, even if they eventually unlock it. You'd think maybe
they'd have a policy that after 6 months or a year if you haven't used it,
you could remove it. But no, screw you, it's going to take up memory
space, directory space, show up in the app drawer and there is no way
to get rid of it unless you root the phone.







And even if it's not firmware crippled, nothing says another
carrier has to accept it. Sprint for example has a short list
of phones that they will accept.

Here, in California, I've never had a problem unlocking any AT&T or
T-Mobile phone in the past few years. So it's a non issue. Like the color
of the phone. It's meaningless in the scheme of things.

That;s like saying because I never had an auto accident, they are
meaningless, because it's not happening to other people with other
phones and other carriers. And again, it's not just unlocking.
If you have a problem, the carrier tells you we gave you the code,
or it's unlocked, the fact it won't work on someone else's network
isn't our problem. So, now what?






That's a bit bigger in both screen size and battery size.
Is the battery removable?

No.

Bummer. The one thing that keeps my Samsung Galaxy SIII alive is the fact
that I can pop in any battery I want at any time I want. It's one of the
most important features of a modern smart phone to have the user
replaceable battery, IMHO.

I agree, that's a very good feature that I would prefer.
But when you get a big phone, high resolution screen, for $100,
some compromise is acceptable. And as phones get bigger and
thinner you'll see more non removable.

I agree that it's better for the manufacturer, in very many ways, to make
the phone non removable - but maybe not so much a benefit to the user
except perhaps in momentary water proofness in longer immersions.

In short accidental immersions, there may be a huge benefit to popping the
battery out quickly - as I've done many times on my S3 over the years
(given I hike in all weather with that phone).

They boost voltage to at least 9v. The most widely used spec is
Qualcomm quickcharge 3.0. That actually supports up to 21v, but
I don't think anyone uses 21 for a phone, probably for tablets
and such. But some manufactures have their own methods, eg Samsung.

Interesting. The current is all that matters, in the end, but the way to
get current is with pressure, and that's what the voltage is all about.

I don't think LG stylo has quick charging. ]

It says it does and it says so on the battery charger that came with the
phone.

Well then I guess it does. Does it say it's Qualcomm QC 3.0 or 2.0?
If so, then you can use any QC 3.0 charger. If not, you're stuck with
their charger or I guess one of the other chargers that say they can
quick charge it by some other smart charging method.



This 4000mah battery charges in just over an hour.

Thanks. Now I have an idea of the charging time expected for a "quick
charger". Much appreciated.

It's so nice to deal with the non-iOS-group people who are actually helpful
and not so scornful as nospam and some of the others habitually are. Thanks
for being a good helpful person.

No problem. Most of those Apple people are like a cult, totally sold
on the Apple marketing.



Idk, sounds too fast for a regular charger, slow for a fast charger.

Interesting. I need to dig more into this "fast charging" stuff as it's new
to me, although the electronics is old school stuff of course.

Another thing to compare is the USB port. New Androids are going to usb-c,
which is what I have. Apple of course has their own proprietary bs.

Looking at the specs, I noticed both are essentially USB 2.0, although
Apple is, of course, proprietary.

ARe you sure? I thought Apple has their own port too, but I think
I saw somewhere that some of the newer ones have USB-C? But in
general, that's an area where Apple is a pain in the ass. They were
late to the quick charging party and now they have their own scheme.
But I guess part of that is because the way the Android guys get
QC 3.0 is it's built into the Qualcomm chipset and licensed from
them. Not only doesn't Apple use Qualcmomm's chipset, they are in
a death battle in the courts with QC. I think that's why others like
Samsung are not using QC 3.0 too, they use non-Qualcomm chipsets.



The one good thing that came out of the Apple-proprietary port was it may
have spurred the micro-usb people to build a port spec that goes both ways,
which is a nice thing Apple did (accidentally) for the industry.

Back to the topic, I assume the benchmark speeds on the LG Stylo 3 Plus
will be dismal compared to the iPhone 7 Plus - but I'm awaiting finding
them to be sure.

It would be interesting to see. I would expect that there would be a
significant difference in Apple's favor too. The Apple is likely on
a newer, smaller pitch process, which gives them the speed and probably
lower power too. How much that matters I guess depends on what you
do with it. That $100 ZTE is perfectly fine for everything I use it for.
If you want to use it to play advanced games, then maybe the extra
perf is needed, IDK.

On Sunday, December 24, 2017 at 3:03:54 PM UTC-5, harry newton wrote:
He who is rbowman said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 11:54:58 -0700:

I'm thinking of picking up a few more of these phablets, but some of the
kids I'll be giving them to may want Apple devices, so that's why I ran the
hardware comparison just now.

You have hit on it. Apple fans, including kids swayed by their peers or
Apple advertising, will accept nothing but Apple, regardless of the cost.

While I have never bought a phablet before, it does seem that these LG
Stylo 3 Plus phones I bought as last-minute stocking stuffers are one fifth
the price of the equivalent iPhone 7 Plus based on the hardware specs.

Since I had only expected an equivalent iPhone to cost about double the
price of an equivalent Android phone, I was amazed that these seemingly
comparable devices are so vastly different in price.

They clearly have a significant difference, the Apple has a 50%
higher clock rate. That likely means it;s on a newer smaller pitch
process that would also bring lower power. It's like looking at
two PCs, that both have the same memory and hard drive size but
one has a CPU that's 50% faster and saying they are seemingly
the same, why should one cost a lot more than the other?
How much that matters in the real world on these phones who knows,
because it's complex. One has more CPUs, so potentially they could
make up for some of it, but to what extent, who knows.

On 12/24/2017 09:24 PM, harry newton wrote:
He who is The Real Bev said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 21:20:29 -0800:

Kids learn a lot from their electronics though.

I think they learn more from working.

Well, I have four of these phablets in four different stockings.
They'll open them tomorrow morning.
I hope they like 'em.

You should have put a lump of coal in the bottom of each one just in
case! Merry Christmas!

--
Cheers, Bev
Nothing is so stupid that you can't find somebody who
did it at least once if you look hard enough.

On Monday, December 25, 2017 at 12:26:04 AM UTC-5, trader_4 wrote:
On Sunday, December 24, 2017 at 11:08:58 PM UTC-5, harry newton wrote:
He who is trader_4 said on Sun, 24 Dec 2017 13:20:37 -0800 (PST):

Is it not?

I was referring to the concept of a kid needing out wanting a
second cell phone. Unless they're a terrorist or drug dealer
and need a burner phone.

Oh. Thanks for explaining. Yes. That's an apropos observation.

I ended up purchasing four of the Android phablets, where for the money
saved on not buying the fifth, I'll get the kids each a decently sized sd
card.

It's quite nice that the Android tablet can handle up to 2 terabytes of the
sd card storage - although I've never bought a card anywhere near that
large.



Does the phone say it can take that much? Highest I've seen is 256GB,
not that it matters to me, I'd never use it. For an SD card, I'd
recommend the Sandisk Extreme Plus microSD SDXC. The new ones are
rated A1, which is yet another spec. It means the card is fast
enough to run apps off of. The newer Androids allow that now, for apps
to be on an external card. Be careful that it's a real one, there
are all kinds of fakes on Ebay for example.




I know people in NJ who are in love with Verizon signal.

Verizon probably had the best coverage and the cost to go with it.

Yes. That seems to be the case. Maybe because AT&T started in NJ and
Verizon picked up from them at some point some of their infrastructure?

Out here, Verizon signal is ok. So is AT&T. SO it T-Mobile.
Depends on which mountain your house sits on top of.

So, it's not unlocked, it's a t-mobile phone.
Then my previous comments still apply. It can probably go to
another company that uses the t-mobile network, but I wouldn't
count on it going to a CDMA carrier, even if they unlock it.

I've had so many cellphones that I can't count them, but never had I had a
trouble with unlocking them. It's been easier in the past few years that it
was in the beginning where I had to jailbreak just to switch an iOS phone
from AT&T to T-Mobile.

Costco gave me paperwork that explicityly says T-mobile will unlock the
phones after two billing cycles - so - given that Costco gives 90 day
no-questions-asked returns, I can unlock the phone and return it a month
later - not that I'd do that - but the point is that unlocking is so easy
that it's not an issue in the least.

We just keep talking past each other. In one of the first posts, I explained
how even if you unlock a phone that you buy from a carrier, you may not
be able to take it to another carrier, because while it's unlocked, some
carriers cripple the phone so it's impossible to do so. These are not
a generic phone from the manufacturer. They are built to the specs of
the carrier who sells them. They are loaded with the crapware that the
carrier tells them to put on them and only have whatever the carrier tells
them to turn on, enabled.

Let's go over the example of Boost or Sprint again. They are CDMA. You
can buy a phone like the ZTE Max XL from Boost. You can go look at the
Max XL specs online at ZTE. The phone hardware supports CDMA and GSM.
You look at the freqs, etc it matches what T-Mobile uses. OK, so you
buy it at Sprint or Boost. You have to have service with them for a year for
them to unlock it. That's the longest allowed by the agreement they signed,
but it's still fair. BTW, another go screw you is that they don't tell
you that they count that by months of service with you, not for the phone..
So, if you're at month 10, you could give the phone to your nephew or sell
it and then screw them, the clock starts all over. Which doesn't seem fair,
it's a subsidized $100 phone. They get 10 months out of you, your nephew
has it 2 months, you'd think they should unlock it, but no, screw you.
Also you have to request unlocking within 60 days of ending service, otherwise,
screw you.

OK, continuing on with the Sprint or Boost example, you play by their rules,
you have a full 12 months of paid service. You call up customer service.
They give you the run around, tell you excuses, have to put a ticket into
the back office, it will take days, etc.. Finally they give you the unlock
code. How did you unlock those phones you did? Typically it's by just
putting the other carrier's SIM in and it comes up with a prompt for the
unlock code. Well, guess what. Because these phones are made to the
carrier's spec, there is no way to put the lock code in. You put a foreign
SIM in, it just says "invalid sim", no way to do anything else. So you
google and find that for many phones you can also get the unlock prompt
by typing ##23543** or whatever into the phone dialer. There are several
strings that work with various other phones. Guess what? Nothing works
with that ZTE Max XL or other phones that Sprint/Boost sells. So, you
call up their customer service and they tell you it's not their problem,
they can't help you, it's the other carrier that you want to take the
phone to, it's their problem to reprogram the phone.

Finally, if you ever got far enough to actual get some of these unlocked
by whatever method and you actually tried to run them on a GSM carrier,
you'd find that the GSM doesn't work, because the firmware that;s in
that phone made for Sprint/Boost, doesn't enable GSM, even thought the
hardware supports it. If you don't believe me, just google and you;ll
see people going through all of the above. I don't doubt that some
carriers are more ethical and may actually allow you to unlock a phone
and not cripple it. But the final go screw you is that there is no
requirement whatever that another carrier take it. Like I said, try
bringing your own phone to Sprint. When I looked last spring, they
had a very short list of phones that they will accept. They say they
have to certify them to work and this is the short list, it was iphones
and a very few Motorola. Anything else, screw you, we won't allow it.
They deliberately make it next to impossible to actually take the
phone to another carrier.

My point is that if you intend to buy a phone and be able to use it
anywhere and not get caught in the above traps, you better buy an
unlocked one that comes from the manufacturer, not a carrier. The
problem with all the above is that it's a mine field. I'd bet that
of the people who have a phone from a specific carrier, the ones
that are successful unlocking it to go to a completely different
carrier are the minority. If you're going within that carrier, from
the carrier itself to one of it's sub whores, eg from MetroPCS to
Mint Sim, both of which run on T-Mobile, you have a better chance of
success. But even then it's not easy. I bought a MetroPCS phone,
unlocked, and still had trouble getting hotspot to work on MintSim.
Mint simply says, hotspot will not work with us on that phone,
even though prior to buying it I ran the IMEI on the Mint website
and it said the phone was compatible. So, it's compatible, but
not with hotspot. Which dovetails perfectly with the fine print all these carriers have
on their websites, which says, even if we unlock it, even if it works
on another carrier, "all features and services may not be available".
I finally figured out a way around it through research, but the average
person would have given up and sold the phone on Ebay a long time ago.
My point is that it's a real minefield out there when it comes to
unlocking. While I don't doubt you were successful and had a different
experience, it's still a big problem and I would never buy a phone
worth more than about $100 from a carrier and expect to be able to unlock it and
take it to another carrier. Not after what I learned from the above.
Another advantage to a true unlocked phone from the manufacturer is that
it's not loades with all the carrier crapware that you can't get rid of.
Did you try to get rid of Facebook, Amazon, Twitter, etc, whatever came
with a carrier phone that you don't want, don't use? Almost all of it,
you can't remove, even if they eventually unlock it. You'd think maybe
they'd have a policy that after 6 months or a year if you haven't used it,
you could remove it. But no, screw you, it's going to take up memory
space, directory space, show up in the app drawer and there is no way
to get rid of it unless you root the phone.







And even if it's not firmware crippled, nothing says another
carrier has to accept it. Sprint for example has a short list
of phones that they will accept.

Here, in California, I've never had a problem unlocking any AT&T or
T-Mobile phone in the past few years. So it's a non issue. Like the color
of the phone. It's meaningless in the scheme of things.

That;s like saying because I never had an auto accident, they are
meaningless, because it's not happening to other people with other
phones and other carriers. And again, it's not just unlocking.
If you have a problem, the carrier tells you we gave you the code,
or it's unlocked, the fact it won't work on someone else's network
isn't our problem. So, now what?






That's a bit bigger in both screen size and battery size.
Is the battery removable?

No.

Bummer. The one thing that keeps my Samsung Galaxy SIII alive is the fact
that I can pop in any battery I want at any time I want. It's one of the
most important features of a modern smart phone to have the user
replaceable battery, IMHO.

I agree, that's a very good feature that I would prefer.
But when you get a big phone, high resolution screen, for $100,
some compromise is acceptable. And as phones get bigger and
thinner you'll see more non removable.

I agree that it's better for the manufacturer, in very many ways, to make
the phone non removable - but maybe not so much a benefit to the user
except perhaps in momentary water proofness in longer immersions.

In short accidental immersions, there may be a huge benefit to popping the
battery out quickly - as I've done many times on my S3 over the years
(given I hike in all weather with that phone).

They boost voltage to at least 9v. The most widely used spec is
Qualcomm quickcharge 3.0. That actually supports up to 21v, but
I don't think anyone uses 21 for a phone, probably for tablets
and such. But some manufactures have their own methods, eg Samsung.

Interesting. The current is all that matters, in the end, but the way to
get current is with pressure, and that's what the voltage is all about.

I don't think LG stylo has quick charging. ]

It says it does and it says so on the battery charger that came with the
phone.

Well then I guess it does. Does it say it's Qualcomm QC 3.0 or 2.0?
If so, then you can use any QC 3.0 charger. If not, you're stuck with
their charger or I guess one of the other chargers that say they can
quick charge it by some other smart charging method.



This 4000mah battery charges in just over an hour.

Thanks. Now I have an idea of the charging time expected for a "quick
charger". Much appreciated.

It's so nice to deal with the non-iOS-group people who are actually helpful
and not so scornful as nospam and some of the others habitually are. Thanks
for being a good helpful person.

No problem. Most of those Apple people are like a cult, totally sold
on the Apple marketing.



Idk, sounds too fast for a regular charger, slow for a fast charger.

Interesting. I need to dig more into this "fast charging" stuff as it's new
to me, although the electronics is old school stuff of course.

Another thing to compare is the USB port. New Androids are going to usb-c,
which is what I have. Apple of course has their own proprietary bs.

Looking at the specs, I noticed both are essentially USB 2.0, although
Apple is, of course, proprietary.

ARe you sure? I thought Apple has their own port too, but I think
I saw somewhere that some of the newer ones have USB-C? But in
general, that's an area where Apple is a pain in the ass. They were
late to the quick charging party and now they have their own scheme.
But I guess part of that is because the way the Android guys get
QC 3.0 is it's built into the Qualcomm chipset and licensed from
them. Not only doesn't Apple use Qualcmomm's chipset, they are in
a death battle in the courts with QC. I think that's why others like
Samsung are not using QC 3.0 too, they use non-Qualcomm chipsets.



The one good thing that came out of the Apple-proprietary port was it may
have spurred the micro-usb people to build a port spec that goes both ways,
which is a nice thing Apple did (accidentally) for the industry.

Back to the topic, I assume the benchmark speeds on the LG Stylo 3 Plus
will be dismal compared to the iPhone 7 Plus - but I'm awaiting finding
them to be sure.

It would be interesting to see. I would expect that there would be a
significant difference in Apple's favor too. The Apple is likely on
a newer, smaller pitch process, which gives them the speed and probably
lower power too. How much that matters I guess depends on what you
do with it. That $100 ZTE is perfectly fine for everything I use it for.
If you want to use it to play advanced games, then maybe the extra
perf is needed, IDK.

Another way of looking at this unlocking trap is as follows. You just bought a LG stylo 3 from t-mobile. Let's say instead, you bought it from Boost or sprint. They both sell it. Now you've seen the specs, that the Lg specs say the phone does both CDMA and GSM. It has the frequencies to work on tmobile. A reasonable person would figure they could take it to att or t-mobile. So, after a year you get sprint or boost to unlock it. They give you an unlock code. I'm pretty sure what you will find is there is then no way to enter that code into the phone. The phone will not prompt you for the code like you've seen in your experience with your phones. Boost will tell you, not our issue, its up to the other carrier to reprogram the phone, even though obviously it's sprint or boost that put the lock on it. And even if you somehow got it unlocked, it still wouldn't work on t-mobile, because the GSM section is disabled in the firmware for those phones sold by sprint and boost. So, while you're lead to believe all LG stylo 3 are the same, in fact they are not. Do all carriers do this? No. But between the above and other tricks, you have to be very careful and even if you are, it's very hard, if not impossible, to figure out what phones can be moved to another carrier.

On 12/24/2017 09:08 PM, harry newton wrote:
With SHarepod freeware, you can copy anything from any iPod to any Windows
machine without ever needing a login or password or even storing a single
bit of the executable on Windows (it runs off the iPod as a Windows
executable stored on the iPod).

My main machine is Linux and my non-Apple MP3 players show up as mass
storage devices that I can copy files to. I got the Shuffle loaded and
that was that. I have no intention of ever trying to reload it.

On 12/25/2017 12:25 AM, trader_4 wrote:
Did you try to get rid of Facebook, Amazon, Twitter, etc, whatever came
with a carrier phone that you don't want, don't use? Almost all of it,
you can't remove, even if they eventually unlock it. You'd think maybe
they'd have a policy that after 6 months or a year if you haven't used it,
you could remove it. But no, screw you, it's going to take up memory
space, directory space, show up in the app drawer and there is no way
to get rid of it unless you root the phone.


You're right.Â* I foolishly made the mistake of buying a Verizon branded smartphone. I paid full retail price yet the thing is loaded with crapware like FecesBook and ****ter.Â* I'd like to be able to remove their crapware so I can make room for apps I do
need.

The business practices of telecom companies (cable and wireless) are abusive if not criminal.Â* They'd all be out of business in a month if people had any other choice.