A bathroom sink drain is clogged almost 100%. I used a basic snake attached
to my drill. It goes down 5' and stops. I opened the hatch in the ceiling
of the closet below. There is a sideways T fitting that the snake doesn't
get past. The top of the T has a plug. The problem is there is now a/c
ducts blocking access to the T.

Is there some other kind of snake that will get around the 90 degree angle?
I have not poured a liquid plumber type product down the drain. It has been
a couple days. so I expect at this point the only water in the drain is in
the P-trap.

Now the P-trap does not have a plug at the bottom, but a section of it
could be removed.

A plunger doesn't work as the sink has overflow holes. I don't see how they
can be closed off enough to withstand the force of the plunge.

My next step is to call a plumber, but I thought I would ask you all first.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

On Mon, 31 Oct 2016 21:42:26 -0400, Don Wiss
wrote:

A bathroom sink drain is clogged almost 100%. I used a basic snake attached
to my drill. It goes down 5' and stops. I opened the hatch in the ceiling
of the closet below. There is a sideways T fitting that the snake doesn't
get past. The top of the T has a plug. The problem is there is now a/c
ducts blocking access to the T.

Is there some other kind of snake that will get around the 90 degree angle?
I have not poured a liquid plumber type product down the drain. It has been
a couple days. so I expect at this point the only water in the drain is in
the P-trap.

Now the P-trap does not have a plug at the bottom, but a section of it
could be removed.

A plunger doesn't work as the sink has overflow holes. I don't see how they
can be closed off enough to withstand the force of the plunge.

My next step is to call a plumber, but I thought I would ask you all first.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

You may be able to wiggle it around the bend but they are really made
for sanitary fittings with a sweep type turn.

On 10/31/2016 09:42 PM, Don Wiss wrote:
A bathroom sink drain is clogged almost 100%. I used a basic snake attached
to my drill. It goes down 5' and stops. I opened the hatch in the ceiling
of the closet below. There is a sideways T fitting that the snake doesn't
get past. The top of the T has a plug. The problem is there is now a/c
ducts blocking access to the T.
snip

Have you ruled out using a chemical drain opener? At least for
soap/hair clogs I've found that the thick Drano Max gel (comes in a
yellow plastic container - Home Depot has it) often works wonders when
other types of chemical openers (not the acid ones) fail. I've used the
Drano product with success on completely plugged bathroom sink and tub
drains. Sincerely,

--
J. B. Wood e-mail:

On Mon, 31 Oct 2016 21:42:26 -0400, Don Wiss
wrote:

A bathroom sink drain is clogged almost 100%. I used a basic snake attached
to my drill. It goes down 5' and stops. I opened the hatch in the ceiling
of the closet below. There is a sideways T fitting that the snake doesn't
get past. The top of the T has a plug. The problem is there is now a/c
ducts blocking access to the T.

Is there some other kind of snake that will get around the 90 degree angle?
I have not poured a liquid plumber type product down the drain. It has been
a couple days. so I expect at this point the only water in the drain is in
the P-trap.

Now the P-trap does not have a plug at the bottom, but a section of it
could be removed.

A plunger doesn't work as the sink has overflow holes. I don't see how they
can be closed off enough to withstand the force of the plunge.

My next step is to call a plumber, but I thought I would ask you all first.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).


I would use a rotating, power, spring style snake. Used properly,
that should make it past the T.

What kind of material is the pipe made from? If galvanized pipe, it
could be rusted closed, in that case, you will probably have to bite
the bullet and replace some piping.

On Mon, 31 Oct 2016 22:11:31 -0400, wrote:

You may be able to wiggle it around the bend but they are really made
for sanitary fittings with a sweep type turn.

I tried twice. After the trap there is a bend (behind the a/c ducts) that
it does go around before it gets to the T.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

On Tue, 1 Nov 2016, "J.B. Wood" wrote:

Have you ruled out using a chemical drain opener? At least for
soap/hair clogs I've found that the thick Drano Max gel (comes in a
yellow plastic container - Home Depot has it) often works wonders when
other types of chemical openers (not the acid ones) fail. I've used the
Drano product with success on completely plugged bathroom sink and tub
drains. Sincerely,

As I wrote I have not. The stop is 5 feet in. Some chemical will be lost in
the trap. The drain pipe is 1-1/2". Will it even make it down to the
blockage?

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

Start ****ting elsewhere.

On Tuesday, November 1, 2016 at 5:54:30 AM UTC-7, Don Wiss wrote:
On Tue, 1 Nov 2016, "J.B. Wood" wrote:

Have you ruled out using a chemical drain opener? At least for
soap/hair clogs I've found that the thick Drano Max gel (comes in a
yellow plastic container - Home Depot has it) often works wonders when
other types of chemical openers (not the acid ones) fail. I've used the
Drano product with success on completely plugged bathroom sink and tub
drains. Sincerely,

As I wrote I have not. The stop is 5 feet in. Some chemical will be lost in
the trap. The drain pipe is 1-1/2". Will it even make it down to the
blockage?

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

Try taping over the overflow holes in the sink. It has worked for
me. A last resort would pouring a gallon of bleach down the drain
and let it sit all night and then pour boiling water down the drain.

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016 08:49:12 -0400, Don Wiss
wrote:

On Mon, 31 Oct 2016 22:11:31 -0400, wrote:

You may be able to wiggle it around the bend but they are really made
for sanitary fittings with a sweep type turn.

I tried twice. After the trap there is a bend (behind the a/c ducts) that
it does go around before it gets to the T.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

There are pressure solutions but I would remove the trap before I did
it if it is that thin plastic compression stuff.

On Tue, 1 Nov 2016, "Jack G." wrote:

Try taping over the overflow holes in the sink. It has worked for
me. A last resort would pouring a gallon of bleach down the drain
and let it sit all night and then pour boiling water down the drain.

Would tape really hold? The next problem is the sink is very small. I
regular toilet plunger is too big. Possibly something like:
http://www.harborfreight.com/power-plunger-99644.html

Then a correction. It is an S trap, not a P trap. If I remove the middle
piece, I have an open end facing downwards. But I don't know how to push
air into it.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016, Stormin' Norman wrote:

I would use a rotating, power, spring style snake. Used properly,
that should make it past the T.

I used this:
http://www.harborfreight.com/25-ft-d...ent-66262.html

Is there something different?

What kind of material is the pipe made from? If galvanized pipe, it
could be rusted closed, in that case, you will probably have to bite
the bullet and replace some piping.

Is it galvanized. To replace would require removing a/c ductwork. See:
http://donwiss.com/pictures/misc/T-in-drain-pipe.jpg

That looks like 2" pipe. Awfully wide to have a nearly 100% blockage.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016 11:48:36 -0400, wrote:

There are pressure solutions but I would remove the trap before I did
it if it is that thin plastic compression stuff.

This is the trap: http://donwiss.com/pictures/misc/S-trap.jpg

I don't follow about the thin compression stuff.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016 12:25:20 -0400, Don Wiss
wrote:

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016 11:48:36 -0400, wrote:

There are pressure solutions but I would remove the trap before I did
it if it is that thin plastic compression stuff.

This is the trap: http://donwiss.com/pictures/misc/S-trap.jpg

I don't follow about the thin compression stuff.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

These days that trap would all be thin wall plastic. Do you have a
compressor? You could use water pressure but that could get messy.
I would try to make an adapter that connects to the trap (disconnected
from the tail piece from the sink) and see if you can blow the clog on
down the line. That galvanized will tolerate the pressure and once it
gets to the cast iron it should go away. If you go that way, it is
good you have not used any drain cleaner because it may come back at
you.

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016 12:20:24 -0400, Don Wiss
wrote:

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016, Stormin' Norman wrote:

I would use a rotating, power, spring style snake. Used properly,
that should make it past the T.

I used this:
http://www.harborfreight.com/25-ft-d...ent-66262.html

Is there something different?

What kind of material is the pipe made from? If galvanized pipe, it
could be rusted closed, in that case, you will probably have to bite
the bullet and replace some piping.

Is it galvanized. To replace would require removing a/c ductwork. See:
http://donwiss.com/pictures/misc/T-in-drain-pipe.jpg

That looks like 2" pipe. Awfully wide to have a nearly 100% blockage.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

I have seen 2" galvanized pipes rust up over time, especially if
people have been using chemical drain cleaners in them. As most new
homes have been using PVC drain pipes for 30 - 40 years, odds are your
pipes are older than that?

As for the snake, this is the type of tool to which I an referring:

http://thd.co/2eR5lJ8

They can be rented at a reasonable price. However, why not just call
a drain cleaning company. If the pipe isn't destroyed, around here
they will come out and clear your drain for $60.

If the pipe is destroyed, you will have to bite the bullet and replace
it, preferably with PVC.

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016 12:20:24 -0400, Don Wiss
wrote:

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016, Stormin' Norman wrote:

I would use a rotating, power, spring style snake. Used properly,
that should make it past the T.

I used this:
http://www.harborfreight.com/25-ft-d...ent-66262.html

Is there something different?


That should work fine. The trick is to push hard when it stops and
get more coil in there. Keep it spinning slowly until it finds the
outlet, whereupon you'll feel it release the pressure you're applying.
I've got the basic setup in my bathroom (plugged T) and I snaked it
using the type of snake you have, except it's hand-cranked.

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016, Stormin' Norman wrote:

It is galvanized. To replace would require removing a/c ductwork. See:
http://donwiss.com/pictures/misc/T-in-drain-pipe.jpg

I have seen 2" galvanized pipes rust up over time, especially if
people have been using chemical drain cleaners in them. As most new
homes have been using PVC drain pipes for 30 - 40 years, odds are your
pipes are older than that?

The house is 1892. But that bathroom was added later. Possibly in the
1950s. The large horizontal cast iron pipe would be original, as there
originally were sinks for each bedroom in the pass through between them.

As for the snake, this is the type of tool to which I an referring:

http://thd.co/2eR5lJ8

They can be rented at a reasonable price.

I do have a couple rental places down the hill. This is what is at the
place where I have an account: http://mytoolrental.com/plumbing-equip/

However, why not just call
a drain cleaning company. If the pipe isn't destroyed, around here
they will come out and clear your drain for $60.

That is useful advice. I had been thinking of calling the local plumber,
but the drain cleaning people are cheaper and could be even better for such
a job.

If the pipe is destroyed, you will have to bite the bullet and replace
it, preferably with PVC.

And I will have to dismantle the a/c ductwork.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016 12:37:21 -0400, wrote:

These days that trap would all be thin wall plastic. Do you have a
compressor?

I do not.

When I was at Harbor Freight for my "No Purchase Required" gift of the day,
the cashier suggested a digital inspection camera. But looking at the one
on their website ($80 - 20% = $64) I see the cable is not long enough, nor
would it make it around a corner.

You could use water pressure but that could get messy.
I would try to make an adapter that connects to the trap (disconnected
from the tail piece from the sink) and see if you can blow the clog on
down the line. That galvanized will tolerate the pressure and once it
gets to the cast iron it should go away. If you go that way, it is
good you have not used any drain cleaner because it may come back at
you.

I've thought about blowing up the opened S-trap, but I don't see how to
make an attachment. I don't have a machine shop. Though probably in March I
will get the drill press at my mom's and bring it to my place. Not owing a
car limits moving things around.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016 17:24:32 -0400, Don Wiss
wrote:

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016, Stormin' Norman wrote:

It is galvanized. To replace would require removing a/c ductwork. See:
http://donwiss.com/pictures/misc/T-in-drain-pipe.jpg


The house is 1892. But that bathroom was added later. Possibly in the
1950s. The large horizontal cast iron pipe would be original, as there
originally were sinks for each bedroom in the pass through between them.

My money is on the pipe being rusted shut, but for your sake, I hope
not.


However, why not just call
a drain cleaning company. If the pipe isn't destroyed, around here
they will come out and clear your drain for $60.

That is useful advice. I had been thinking of calling the local plumber,
but the drain cleaning people are cheaper and could be even better for such
a job.

I own a power, rotary snake. It made more sense to buy one than to
keep on renting when I considered all of the different houses in the
extended family.



If the pipe is destroyed, you will have to bite the bullet and replace
it, preferably with PVC.

And I will have to dismantle the a/c ductwork.


Ya gotta do what ya gotta do.

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016 17:33:44 -0400, Don Wiss
wrote:

But looking at the one
on their website ($80 - 20% = $64) I see the cable is not long enough, nor
would it make it around a corner.

This camera cable is 16.404 feet (5 meters).

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0158DJ20W/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=sl1&tag=chri0e2-20&linkId=1a6646cad244979fa6fe7e332d1f5638

Shown working here. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdT4DPFXIkM

As to a drain clog, I've not used this product
http://momar.com/index

Product Information: http://bit.ly/SDMmzP

Powerful drain opener that gets to the plug fast. Formulated with
sodium hydroxide, which produces higher temperatures and works faster
than potassium hydroxide products. Contains no acids, chlorine
derivatives, solvents, or flammables.

Strong -- dissolves fat, grease, hair, sludge, paper, cloth, organic
matter, and slime
Safe -- formulated for metal and PVC lines
Odorless -- produces no acid fumes
Fast -- starts working on contact
Heavy -- 50% heavier than water
Contains red tracer dye


Momar, Inc
800-556-3967
http://www.momar.com

It is demonstrated here. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q02UvrMJ3r0

YMMV

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016 15:01:29 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016 17:33:44 -0400, Don Wiss wrote:

But looking at the one
on their website ($80 - 20% = $64) I see the cable is not long enough, nor
would it make it around a corner.

This camera cable is 16.404 feet (5 meters).

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0158DJ20W

Very impressive! It would be a fun tool to have. I do need to place an
order with Amazon. The mirror attachment might get me to look down the T.
Though I have to get it to also go around a bend somewhere.

I see several similar to pick from.

As to a drain clog, I've not used this product
http://momar.com/index

Product Information: http://bit.ly/SDMmzP

Looks impressive, but I see you have to request a quote and buy direct. I
do want something to periodically (like every few years) to keep the
kitchen drain free of grease.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

On 11/1/16 11:06 AM, Jack G. wrote:
Try taping over the overflow holes in the sink.

I have a sink that is similar, with 2 "openings" on the
bottom (that I think are more intended to be used for
"mounting posts" (from the floor) than for "overflow".

A little off-topic, but is there anything that works to
"plug" the holes so a plunger can be used on the sink
(without water coming out)...?

On 10/31/2016 06:42 PM, Don Wiss wrote:
A bathroom sink drain is clogged almost 100%. I used a basic snake attached
to my drill. It goes down 5' and stops. I opened the hatch in the ceiling
of the closet below. There is a sideways T fitting that the snake doesn't
get past. The top of the T has a plug. The problem is there is now a/c
ducts blocking access to the T.

Is there some other kind of snake that will get around the 90 degree angle?
I have not poured a liquid plumber type product down the drain. It has been
a couple days. so I expect at this point the only water in the drain is in
the P-trap.

Now the P-trap does not have a plug at the bottom, but a section of it
could be removed.

A plunger doesn't work as the sink has overflow holes. I don't see how they
can be closed off enough to withstand the force of the plunge.

My next step is to call a plumber, but I thought I would ask you all first.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).


I have a similar problem. I would love to know what you found out.

In ,
Don Wiss typed:
A bathroom sink drain is clogged almost 100%. I used a basic snake
attached to my drill. It goes down 5' and stops. I opened the hatch
in the ceiling of the closet below. There is a sideways T fitting
that the snake doesn't get past. The top of the T has a plug. The
problem is there is now a/c ducts blocking access to the T.

Is there some other kind of snake that will get around the 90 degree
angle? I have not poured a liquid plumber type product down the
drain. It has been a couple days. so I expect at this point the only
water in the drain is in the P-trap.

Now the P-trap does not have a plug at the bottom, but a section of it
could be removed.

A plunger doesn't work as the sink has overflow holes. I don't see
how they can be closed off enough to withstand the force of the
plunge.

My next step is to call a plumber, but I thought I would ask you all
first.

Here are my thoughts based on my own experiences with this type of issue:

1) When plunging, use a wet rag or something similar and stuff it in the
sink overflow hole and also hold it over the sink overflow hole to try to
close it off while plunging. It is hard to do that with one hand while also
plunging the drain with your other hand. But, I do my best. If you have a
helper, let the helper hold the wet rag in and over the sink overflow hole
so you can plunge with both hands.

2) Bend the spring tip of the auger at a slight angle. Then, while you are
turning the auger and pushing to advance it, it has a better chance of being
able to make any 90 degree turns, including the Tee that you are dealing
with.

3) I have a chrome P-trap (not S-trap) under my bathroom sink. In my case,
I used a hacksaw (or I could have used a tubing cutter or angle grinder) to
cut the horizontal part of my P-trap in two places about an inch apart.
Then I put in a chrome coupling that I could easily remove by hand when
needed. I used something like this as the coupling:
http://www.drainageonline.co.uk/Chro...14C-WP115C.htm
Then, when needed, I take the coupling off, I move the trap out of the way,
and I insert the snake directly into the pipe. That allows me to go through
less turns with the snake.

4) Or, I could do this, but I haven't tried it yet. I could use one of
these devices connected to a hose from a laundry sink etc:
https://www.lowes.com/pd/Cobra-Rubber-Bladder/999972138 . It is designed
to be placed directly inside the pipe and then use water pressure to try to
remove the clog.

In my case, I have a bathroom sink that leads to a narrow lead pipe drain
line under the floor and that has a couple of sharp 90 degree turns, so it
is hard to snake it out.

On Tue, 01 Nov 2016, Stormin' Norman wrote:

My money is on the pipe being rusted shut, but for your sake, I hope
not.

Update time! The most useful advice from this thread was to hire a drain
clearing specialist and not a general plumber, which was what I was
planning to do before I posted here. I had a card from when I used Mr.
Sewer in 2003 to clear my sewer line. I had even scanned it and had it on
my page of my local home service vendors.

I called him. Mr. Sewer died, but his helper bought the business and
renamed it Clogbusters. He first tried a snake. He had the same result as
I: it hitting that T and not getting past. So what he did was to drill a
hole on the side of the pipe below the T and snake upwards. It was filled
with rust. But this trick saved me from having to dismantle the ductwork
and replacing the pipes. I paid $250 cash for about 1-3/4 hours for him and
a helper.

I like hiring low overhead vendors. It is just the owner, the helper, a
truck, and a garage he rents for $400/month. Plus he pays $12,000 annually
for all the insurance he has to carry.

The second bit I liked from the replies was to buy the $15 endoscope
camera. In this case I did not see it helping. The mirror that sees around
the corner would have come off. But for the price it is a toy I would like
to have around.

Thanks all for your help.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016 18:33:36 -0400, Don Wiss
wrote:

The second bit I liked from the replies was to buy the $15 endoscope
camera. In this case I did not see it helping. The mirror that sees around
the corner would have come off. But for the price it is a toy I would like
to have around.

I agree. Forcing the camera and attachment into the pipe, trying to
get around the T may very well cause the mirror or hook to come off
and be lodged in the pipe.

A gun barrel inspection is another story and the price is reasonable.

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016 18:33:36 -0400, Don Wiss
wrote:

He had the same result as
I: it hitting that T and not getting past. So what he did was to drill a
hole on the side of the pipe below the T and snake upwards. It was filled
with rust.

Keep in mind, that rust came from the pipe wall in the area of the
clog. I wonder how much of the pipe wall is left and how much longer
it will last before it collapses completely and leaves you with a mess
in the crawl space.

Did he tell you how large of an opening he was able to make through
the clog? Was he able to get out all the rust and bring it back to
being a 2" pipe?

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016, Stormin' Norman wrote:

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016 18:33:36 -0400, Don Wiss wrote:

He had the same result as
I: it hitting that T and not getting past. So what he did was to drill a
hole on the side of the pipe below the T and snake upwards. It was filled
with rust.

Keep in mind, that rust came from the pipe wall in the area of the
clog. I wonder how much of the pipe wall is left and how much longer
it will last before it collapses completely and leaves you with a mess
in the crawl space.

Did he tell you how large of an opening he was able to make through
the clog? Was he able to get out all the rust and bring it back to
being a 2" pipe?

He left it with the drain flowing freely. That is all I know. To cover the
hole he used electrical tape.

Your questions above I could have asked, but didn't know to ask. I could
ask through the contact form at his website: http://clogbusterssewer.com/

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016 19:15:47 -0400, Don Wiss
wrote:

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016, Stormin' Norman wrote:

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016 18:33:36 -0400, Don Wiss wrote:

He had the same result as
I: it hitting that T and not getting past. So what he did was to drill a
hole on the side of the pipe below the T and snake upwards. It was filled
with rust.

Keep in mind, that rust came from the pipe wall in the area of the
clog. I wonder how much of the pipe wall is left and how much longer
it will last before it collapses completely and leaves you with a mess
in the crawl space.

Did he tell you how large of an opening he was able to make through
the clog? Was he able to get out all the rust and bring it back to
being a 2" pipe?

He left it with the drain flowing freely. That is all I know. To cover the
hole he used electrical tape.

Your questions above I could have asked, but didn't know to ask. I could
ask through the contact form at his website: http://clogbusterssewer.com/

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

Electrical tape to seal a hole in a sewer line?? That is absolutely
not acceptable. Remember, there are dangerous gases in sewer lines,
that is why traps are present in modern plumbing, they are there to
trap the gases.

I don't know how large of a hole he cut, but at the very least I would
plug that hole with an expanding pipe plug or a pipe repair clamp.

See:

http://amzn.to/2fg4BvB


or something like this

http://thd.co/2fg5pAR

The drain might be working now, but from what you write, it sounds
like a questionable job. You never want to take shortcuts with
plumbing or electrical.

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016, Stormin' Norman wrote:

Electrical tape to seal a hole in a sewer line?? That is absolutely
not acceptable. Remember, there are dangerous gases in sewer lines,
that is why traps are present in modern plumbing, they are there to
trap the gases.

I don't know how large of a hole he cut, but at the very least I would
plug that hole with an expanding pipe plug or a pipe repair clamp.

He said the reason he did not use a plug is they can fall into the drain
and clog it up.

See:

http://amzn.to/2fg4BvB

That appears it would work. I have not put everything back into the closet,
so I will hold off doing so.

or something like this

http://thd.co/2fg5pAR

I think the hole is no bigger than 1/2". Just enough to get the snake
inside.

The drain might be working now, but from what you write, it sounds
like a questionable job. You never want to take shortcuts with
plumbing or electrical.

He claimed it was fine when I questioned him on it.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016 19:52:32 -0400, Don Wiss
wrote:

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016, Stormin' Norman wrote:

Electrical tape to seal a hole in a sewer line?? That is absolutely
not acceptable. Remember, there are dangerous gases in sewer lines,
that is why traps are present in modern plumbing, they are there to
trap the gases.

I don't know how large of a hole he cut, but at the very least I would
plug that hole with an expanding pipe plug or a pipe repair clamp.

He said the reason he did not use a plug is they can fall into the drain
and clog it up.

See:

http://amzn.to/2fg4BvB

That appears it would work. I have not put everything back into the closet,
so I will hold off doing so.

or something like this

http://thd.co/2fg5pAR

I think the hole is no bigger than 1/2". Just enough to get the snake
inside.

The drain might be working now, but from what you write, it sounds
like a questionable job. You never want to take shortcuts with
plumbing or electrical.

He claimed it was fine when I questioned him on it.



OK, what do I know? Good luck.

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016 19:15:47 -0400, Don Wiss
wrote:

He left it with the drain flowing freely. That is all I know. To cover the
hole he used electrical tape.

Good luck. See you next time after the tape fails dramatically.

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016 23:40:02 +0000, Stormin' Norman
wrote:


Electrical tape to seal a hole in a sewer line?? That is absolutely
not acceptable. Remember, there are dangerous gases in sewer lines,
that is why traps are present in modern plumbing, they are there to
trap the gases.

I don't know how large of a hole he cut, but at the very least I would
plug that hole with an expanding pipe plug or a pipe repair clamp.


Electrical tape is not something a professional would do. In fact it's
very poor workmanship and not up to code. If you paid him already,
cancel the payment immediately, if it's a check or credit card. That
section of pipe needs to be cut out and a PVC coupler glued in there, or
better yet, a cleanout fitting. That tape will be leaking in no time. If
this guy is licensed, he should be reported and have his license
revoked. The guy charged you about $140 an hour. That's much more than
most plumbers charge. For what you paid, you could have probably gotten
that old steel pipe replaced with PVC, (by a REAL plumber), and not have
to worry about a clog again. If there was that much rust, that steel
pipe will soon be leaking, but the electrical tape will likely fail
first. To put it bluntly, you have been robbed, by an overpriced amateur
and idiot as well. (And yea, I'm a retired plumber and know what I'm
talking about)!

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016 21:28:35 -0500, wrote:

Electrical tape is not something a professional would do. In fact it's
very poor workmanship and not up to code. If you paid him already,
cancel the payment immediately, if it's a check or credit card. That
section of pipe needs to be cut out and a PVC coupler glued in there, or
better yet, a cleanout fitting. That tape will be leaking in no time. If
this guy is licensed, he should be reported and have his license
revoked. The guy charged you about $140 an hour. That's much more than
most plumbers charge. For what you paid, you could have probably gotten
that old steel pipe replaced with PVC, (by a REAL plumber), and not have
to worry about a clog again. If there was that much rust, that steel
pipe will soon be leaking, but the electrical tape will likely fail
first. To put it bluntly, you have been robbed, by an overpriced amateur
and idiot as well. (And yea, I'm a retired plumber and know what I'm
talking about)!

Uh, he charged a fraction of what a plumber in Brooklyn would have charged.
But the point is moot, as no plumber would have been able to solve the
problem. They would have charged me $250 to try to snake and would then
have given up.

Your suggesting that a section be replaced shows you have not read the rest
of the thread. To replace a section I would first have to get the a/c
people to come in and remove the ductwork. Then a plumber. Then the a/c
people to restore the ductwork. All of that would probably be $2000. Prices
in NYC are a lot higher than in a rural community.

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016 23:06:01 -0400, Don Wiss
wrote:

Uh, he charged a fraction of what a plumber in Brooklyn would have charged.
But the point is moot, as no plumber would have been able to solve the
problem. They would have charged me $250 to try to snake and would then
have given up.

I guess prices are a lot higher there, which is why I never reply to
posts where people ask for prices on this newsgroup. Where I live,
plumbers charge $70 to $100 an hour.

But if what you said is true, where you said "no plumber would have been
able to solve the problem. They would have charged me $250 to try to
snake and would then have given up." indicates they are NOT plumbers.
When I worked as a plumber, I NEVER gave up on any job. There were a few
I would have liked to give up, but I didn't. If pipes were that badly
clogged, I replaced them. Sometimes it got costly, but the customer got
working pipes that would last a long time.


Your suggesting that a section be replaced shows you have not read the rest
of the thread. To replace a section I would first have to get the a/c
people to come in and remove the ductwork. Then a plumber. Then the a/c
people to restore the ductwork. All of that would probably be $2000. Prices
in NYC are a lot higher than in a rural community.


Yea, I read most of this thread and know all about your A/C ducts that
were apparently not put in the right place (or you would not have this
issue). Since I have not seen your job, it's hard to say what I'd do,
but I'd bet I could replace the pipes without removing the ducts. PVC is
pretty easy to install in tight places, since I dont need room to swing
a pipe wrench. I'd likely cut up the steel pipe with a sawsall, and
replace the whole line. If it needs to be diverted around the ducts, PVC
can be moved and does not need to go in the same hole of the old pipes.
But I'm only speculating since I am not seeing your place.

If you're happy with the work, then so be it..... However I can almost
guarantee you'll be replacing pipes real soon, and that tape will be
leaking much sooner....

In ,
Don Wiss typed:
On Tue, 01 Nov 2016, Stormin' Norman
wrote:

My money is on the pipe being rusted shut, but for your sake, I hope
not.

Update time! The most useful advice from this thread was to hire a
drain clearing specialist and not a general plumber, which was what I
was planning to do before I posted here. I had a card from when I
used Mr. Sewer in 2003 to clear my sewer line. I had even scanned it
and had it on my page of my local home service vendors.

I called him. Mr. Sewer died, but his helper bought the business and
renamed it Clogbusters. He first tried a snake. He had the same
result as I: it hitting that T and not getting past. So what he did
was to drill a hole on the side of the pipe below the T and snake
upwards. It was filled with rust. But this trick saved me from having
to dismantle the ductwork and replacing the pipes. I paid $250 cash
for about 1-3/4 hours for him and a helper.

I like hiring low overhead vendors. It is just the owner, the helper,
a truck, and a garage he rents for $400/month. Plus he pays $12,000
annually for all the insurance he has to carry. . . . ,

Thanks for the update. I learn a lot by participating in this newsgroup, and
your update gave me information about another way to clean out a clogged
drain line that I didn't know about before.

Despite what some others said, I think you got a fair deal from the company
that you hired to resolve your problem. $250 is not a high price for drain
cleaning, and it is actually on the low side for my area (a suburban town in
South Jersey) for a drain cleaning company and/or many plumbers. You said
it was two people and about 1 3/4 hours of work. In my area, even for a
1-person drain cleaning job, $250 is a common price. Many companies charge
more than that to just send out one person and snake out a clogged main
sewer line with an easy access clean-out Tee in an open basement, and only
take 30 minutes or so to do it. I also often use my own local plumbing
company rather than a "drain cleaning company". My local plumbing company
charges $85/hour. If the guy comes out and he only has to plunge the curb
vent to clear the clog, the cost is $85. If he has to use a drain cleaning
machine, the charge is $85/hour plus something like $50 for use of the drain
cleaning machine. If he had to do what your two guys had to do, the cost
would have been for 2 hours plus about $50 -- so about $210 -- but for only
one person. And, again, my regular plumber's prices are low for my area
compared to a drain cleaning company.

And, about the electrical tape over the hole -- yes, it's a little hokey,
but it would have been good enough for me since he solved my issue and he
probably didn't have a clamp or whatever with him to put over the hole.
That wouldn't be enough for me to want to crucify the guy. The sewer line
is not under pressure, and if he taped it up well enough, I think it will be
fine. However, I think I would go ahead and clamp on a piece of rubber over
the hole or do some other type of clamp over the hole before putting things
back. That way, you would already have a removable clamp to gain access to
the pipe on your own in the future if needed.

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016 19:52:32 -0400, Don Wiss
wrote:

On Wed, 02 Nov 2016, Stormin' Norman wrote:

Electrical tape to seal a hole in a sewer line?? That is absolutely
not acceptable. Remember, there are dangerous gases in sewer lines,
that is why traps are present in modern plumbing, they are there to
trap the gases.

I don't know how large of a hole he cut, but at the very least I would
plug that hole with an expanding pipe plug or a pipe repair clamp.

He said the reason he did not use a plug is they can fall into the drain
and clog it up.

See:

http://amzn.to/2fg4BvB

That appears it would work. I have not put everything back into the closet,
so I will hold off doing so.

or something like this

http://thd.co/2fg5pAR

I think the hole is no bigger than 1/2". Just enough to get the snake
inside.

The drain might be working now, but from what you write, it sounds
like a questionable job. You never want to take shortcuts with
plumbing or electrical.

He claimed it was fine when I questioned him on it.


One more thought about your drain problem. When the pipe clogs up
again and you are forced to confront it one more time, keep in mind,
the flex duct in the picture you posted is a very easy to cut and
splice back together, so easy, you could do it yourself.

Make your cut in the middle of the longest accessible section, then
using a piece of trim-to-size duct fabrication metal as a splice,
insert that into the two ends of the flex and secure it with extra
long tie wraps from harbor freight and seal the ends with aluminum
foil duct tape, not the cloth crap. The good tape is also available at
HF, see:

http://bit.ly/2fiparh

One time, I even used a food service size, empty can which held green
beans as a flex duct splice. It worked flawlessly and is still in
place many years later.

The pipe repair isn't as daunting as you think either.

On Thu, 3 Nov 2016 10:36:03 -0400, "TomR" wrote:

Despite what some others said, I think you got a fair deal from the company
that you hired to resolve your problem. $250 is not a high price for drain
cleaning, and it is actually on the low side for my area (a suburban town in
South Jersey) for a drain cleaning company and/or many plumbers.

For a price comparison I looked at Yelp for Martin Plumbing, which is the
one I and my neighbors usually use. I find:

Edited 02/22/2013 - Another example of their expensive fees: electrically
clearing some draining stoppage: $375. If you're not in an emergency I
would definitely suggest to shop around.

From another review:

I also used them for a minor job: stop my toilet from running! It wasn't
cheap (about $100) but worth every cent because they came right away, took
5 minutes and did a good job.

You said
it was two people and about 1 3/4 hours of work.

It was that or a little longer. He also had to get here. He is based in
Queens, though in the morning he was a half mile from me. In between he was
off someplace else.

And, about the electrical tape over the hole -- yes, it's a little hokey,
but it would have been good enough for me since he solved my issue and he
probably didn't have a clamp or whatever with him to put over the hole.

I do plan to buy and install this recommended clamp:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00HYWEUL2

What is "electrically clearing some draining stoppage?"

Don. www.donwiss.com (e-mail link at home page bottom).

you really ought to get under there and pull it apart,
and Really clean it out,
and even if you have to replace a few pipe parts

this is a longer term solution - vs your what i might call a quick fix,
which may have to be done again, when i don't know...

you would learn something this/my way
[and maybe even get a little exercise]

marc

On 11/2/2016 10:28 PM, wrote:

The guy charged you about $140 an hour. That's much more than
most plumbers charge.

For two people? In New York? He had a helper with him. Good price most
anywhere, great price in NY.

On Thu, 3 Nov 2016 18:37:24 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 11/2/2016 10:28 PM, wrote:

The guy charged you about $140 an hour. That's much more than
most plumbers charge.

For two people? In New York? He had a helper with him. Good price most
anywhere, great price in NY.


Glad I live where I do.....
Of course I suppose the wages in NY are double or triple what they are
here too...