On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 11:35:32 -0400, micky
wrote:

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 10:29:23 -0400, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote:


"Vic Smith" wrote in message
. ..
Most people don't expect to get screwed on parts prices nowadays.
The parts costs are readily available, and they're not in the dark.
Labor cost is take it or leave it.
Car parts prices have been available for many years, and so has part
costs on the final bill.
Why go where you're going to get gouged on parts?

I don't drive one car much and often only have it serviced once a year. Get
it inspected and the oil changed. It tickles me to look at the bill and see
where they even add in shop supplies such as the rag the mechanic wipes his
hand with. You would think they would just charge so much and be done with
it instead of adding in all the small charges.

I think I saw that for the first time at the dealer a few months ago. I
never went to a dealer before, but he had a sale and was charging no
more for wheel alignment than Firestone. He also claimed both of my
inner boots had leaks and needed replacing for 800 dollars. In fact,
one only had 50 miles on it and the other was in perfect condition also.

That's the usual Firesone (and other chain shops) modus operendi.
A local tire shop was advertising for a service manager, claiming very
generous earnings for "the right person". After talking about my
experience etc, their final question was "could I sell?" They said for
someone who "could sell" the job could pay upwards of six figures per
year (and this was in the eighties!!!) I said "sell, or upsell?" I
could sell what was required, but I couldn't steal from customers.

Less than a year later the shop was closed down, and the management in
jail

On 6/23/2015 10:15 PM, wrote:
Like the customer at the service station who was making noises about
not getting screwed on auto repairs, complained the estimate was too
high and then when he came to pick up the car, wanted credit. I told
the boss either cash or cheque - no credit card, because I was sure
he'd dispute the bill with the bank - and when he decided to pay by
cheque I told the boss to lose the keys or whatever it took to keep
the guy in the shop for about 10 minutes while I grabbed the cheque
and headed out the back way with the truck to the customer's bank
branch - where I paid the $2 to have the cheque certified.
As I was going out the door the customer came in all out of breath and
asked to stop payment on the cheque, and I had a big grin on my face
when the teller told him "too late, that guy just certified the
cheque"


Reminds me a bit of one of the stories from Robert
Ringer's book "Winning through intimidation". He had
a moment like that, when he took an over night red
eye flight, to cash a check before the guy could
stop payment.

Nice going, with the certified.
-
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

On 6/23/2015 10:21 PM, Uncle Monster wrote:

There is an auto repair business in town called BYOP, Bring Your Own Parts and that's exactly how they work but I don't know about oil, cleaners and sealants. A lot of folks seem to like the company which advertises on local talk radio all the time. 8-)

[8~{} Uncle Car Monster


Wonder if they have a charge for wrong part,
and had to come back?

-
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 11:39:14 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 6/22/2015 10:28 PM, taxed and spent wrote:
"Ed Pawlowski" wrote in message
...
On 6/22/2015 9:31 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
Just had a first. I've been repairing refrigerators for
about twenty years. I went out this AM, and worked on a
refrigerator. Did my best. She called back about 6 PM,
it's still problems. She gave me more information, and
my diagnosis changed. Drove back (half hour from here)
to work on the fridge again. Used a new in the bag part,
I'd bought several years ago. Told her I guessed the part
was about $25, bought it years ago.

She asked if I had the receipt. Took a minute to understand.
She wants to see the receipt of what I paid at the wholesale
house. No, the receipt is in a drawer or folder at home.

And even if I did, I wouldn't show you. I sell for retail.
I'll make a phone call tomorrow, see what the current
retail price is, and call her back. What an evening.


Amazing. She expects to pay wholesale?

No, she expects the repair guy to not just make up a number out of his head.


The cost is what someone is willing to pay. Take bottles water. I'd
not pay 50¢ for a bottle at the store down the street, but stranded in
the middle of the desert I'd pay $20+ for it.

Fix my fridge and keep $200 worth of food from spoiling . . .
That is not the cost - that is the VALUE. The cost of the water may
be the same in both cases. It may be a bit higher if it has to be
trucked farther to the desert location.
The PRICE needs to reflect the value, and excede the cost, in order
for a business to be viable.

Like an auctioneer friend of mine said years ago - "an article is
worth exactly what the highest bidder is willing to pay on a
psrticular day - not one penny more, and not one penny less"

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 11:47:07 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 6/23/2015 5:42 AM, Vic Smith wrote:


Most people don't expect to get screwed on parts prices nowadays.
The parts costs are readily available, and they're not in the dark.
Labor cost is take it or leave it.
Car parts prices have been available for many years, and so has part
costs on the final bill.
Why go where you're going to get gouged on parts?
Even 50 years ago a good mechanic working for my cousin took me aside
and told me in a whisper I needed ignition wires. "Get them at the
parts store down the street and do it yourself. Mike is gonna charge
you twice what he pays for them."
Even he didn't like that practice.
That's what got me started doing most of my own repairs.




I used to do my own work. Just had brakes done and I saw what I was
charged for the pads. I know I could have gotten them cheaper, but I
don't get down on the ground so easy any more so I paid to have them put
in.

I also understand the shop had to either stock them or go get them etc.
He has to get a markup, he has to make a profit. What is the
difference if I pay $50 for pads and $50 for labor or if I pay $25 for
pads and $75 for labor? End of the day, the shop has to bring in a
certain amount of money to exist.
And you can buy pads, in the case of my Ranger for as little as
$29.00 or as much as $180.00. (wholesale from about $26 to $135.00)

Definitely not the same pads!!!!

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 11:53:39 -0400, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote:


"Ed Pawlowski" wrote in message
news , she expects the repair guy to not just make up a number out of his head.


The cost is what someone is willing to pay. Take bottles water. I'd not
pay 50¢ for a bottle at the store down the street, but stranded in the
middle of the desert I'd pay $20+ for it.


Went to a major league ball game a number of years ago. They wanted $ 4.00
for a bottle of water when you can get about 20 of them in the store for
that price.. Big ripoff when you take the family and have several to buy
for. The next time we went we took small coolers and our own drinks.

Most places wouldn't let you in with the cooler - a lot of places, not
even with a single water bottle.

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 10:27:26 -0600, Tony Hwang
wrote:

Ralph Mowery wrote:
"Vic Smith" wrote in message
...
Most people don't expect to get screwed on parts prices nowadays.
The parts costs are readily available, and they're not in the dark.
Labor cost is take it or leave it.
Car parts prices have been available for many years, and so has part
costs on the final bill.
Why go where you're going to get gouged on parts?

I don't drive one car much and often only have it serviced once a year. Get
it inspected and the oil changed. It tickles me to look at the bill and see
where they even add in shop supplies such as the rag the mechanic wipes his
hand with. You would think they would just charge so much and be done with
it instead of adding in all the small charges.


Common practice nowadays including so called disposal fee. But as long
as they do a good job, LOL! Go to a tire shop to have a set of new
tires, they have environmental fee, same with batteries.
And they pay that fee directly to the provincial stewardship fund -
it is a tax that just gets passed through, except for places that
"bury" the tax in the cost and charge markup on the tax too.....

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 10:03:42 -0700, "taxed and spent"
wrote:


"Ed Pawlowski" wrote in message
...
On 6/23/2015 11:35 AM, Oren wrote:
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:49:46 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:


I'm with you, that some customers are a bit too
much trouble.

Might just be my opinion, but doctors and lawyers are the worst
customers. They will nickel and dime you to death.


Nope, not just your opinion. I think lawyers have the winning edge
though.

Where do engineers fit in to this lineup?

I've had a few of them too. After one know-it-all engineer finished
telling me what needed to be fixed and how to do it I offered to rent
him my tools. He didn't have a snowball's chance in Hades of fixing
the car - and we both knew it!!!!

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 13:53:19 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 6/23/2015 1:03 PM, taxed and spent wrote:
"Ed Pawlowski" wrote in message
...
On 6/23/2015 11:35 AM, Oren wrote:
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:49:46 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:


I'm with you, that some customers are a bit too
much trouble.

Might just be my opinion, but doctors and lawyers are the worst
customers. They will nickel and dime you to death.


Nope, not just your opinion. I think lawyers have the winning edge
though.

Where do engineers fit in to this lineup?



They don't. They buy the part at a wholesale price and fix things
themselves.
Some of you do. There are lots of engineers who are totally incapable
of fixing ANYTHING - including what they design!!

On 6/23/2015 10:44 PM, wrote:
Where do engineers fit in to this lineup?

I've had a few of them too. After one know-it-all engineer finished
telling me what needed to be fixed and how to do it I offered to rent
him my tools. He didn't have a snowball's chance in Hades of fixing
the car - and we both knew it!!!!


I'd also expect engineers to make the wrong
diagnosis, compared to an experienced auto
mechanic.

As an AC / R guy, I've seen more than a few
wrong diagnosis by customers. Fortunately,
the "have the reciept" woman didn't diagnose
it for me. She did report the symptoms, and
did an excellent job of that.

-
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

On 6/23/2015 10:28 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 11:35:32 -0400, micky
I think I saw that for the first time at the dealer a few months ago. I
never went to a dealer before, but he had a sale and was charging no
more for wheel alignment than Firestone. He also claimed both of my
inner boots had leaks and needed replacing for 800 dollars. In fact,
one only had 50 miles on it and the other was in perfect condition also.

That's the usual Firesone (and other chain shops) modus operendi.
A local tire shop was advertising for a service manager, claiming very
generous earnings for "the right person". After talking about my
experience etc, their final question was "could I sell?" They said for
someone who "could sell" the job could pay upwards of six figures per
year (and this was in the eighties!!!) I said "sell, or upsell?" I
could sell what was required, but I couldn't steal from customers.

Less than a year later the shop was closed down, and the management in
jail


I've taken (but never again for the rest of
my life) repairs to Midas Muffler Brake.
They do nice quality work, but I don't like
the 1 - 2 - 4 level pricing. For example,
on the phone, it sounds like $100 job. Estimate
in writing says it's a $200 job. By the time
they find all the other things, it's $400.

I've talked to others about the Midas touch,
they were just as offended as I.

-
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 13:57:16 -0400, micky
wrote:

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 11:47:07 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 6/23/2015 5:42 AM, Vic Smith wrote:


Most people don't expect to get screwed on parts prices nowadays.
The parts costs are readily available, and they're not in the dark.
Labor cost is take it or leave it.
Car parts prices have been available for many years, and so has part
costs on the final bill.
Why go where you're going to get gouged on parts?
Even 50 years ago a good mechanic working for my cousin took me aside
and told me in a whisper I needed ignition wires. "Get them at the
parts store down the street and do it yourself. Mike is gonna charge
you twice what he pays for them."
Even he didn't like that practice.
That's what got me started doing most of my own repairs.




I used to do my own work. Just had brakes done and I saw what I was
charged for the pads. I know I could have gotten them cheaper, but I
don't get down on the ground so easy any more so I paid to have them put
in.

I also understand the shop had to either stock them or go get them etc.
He has to get a markup, he has to make a profit. What is the
difference if I pay $50 for pads and $50 for labor or if I pay $25 for
pads and $75 for labor? End of the day, the shop has to bring in a
certain amount of money to exist.

That's right. These guys are not getting rich, or Clare would still be
doing that. The mechanics make a good middle income living, I hope,
and the owner makes an upper middle income income, but he has lots of
money invested in the franchise and/or the building, the land, the
inventory, the tools that the mechanics don't bring, the commitment to
pay salaries, etc.

I don't feel that way about dealers, however.
Same with dealers - and sometimes even more so. They pay huge
franchise fee, and then are REQUIRED to spend on facility upgrades on
a regular basis to keep the franchise - and if they loose the
franchise for not doing what the manufacturer requires, they do NOT
get their franchise fee back - it is GONE.
They are required to buy all the "special service tools" and to
provide "factory training" for their technicians over and above what
the independents need to do.

I spent half of my life as a mechanic as a dealer service manager.
Sure, there are bad dealerships out there - but in my experience, the
big name chain shops - whether muffler, shock, transmission, or tire
related, have a much higher proportion of "crooks", and while there
are many good "independents" (and I worked for a few) there are lots
of inept grease monkeys willing to rob you blind, either purposely or
through their ineptitude, too.

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 12:07:23 -0600, Tony Hwang
wrote:

micky wrote:
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 11:47:07 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 6/23/2015 5:42 AM, Vic Smith wrote:


Most people don't expect to get screwed on parts prices nowadays.
The parts costs are readily available, and they're not in the dark.
Labor cost is take it or leave it.
Car parts prices have been available for many years, and so has part
costs on the final bill.
Why go where you're going to get gouged on parts?
Even 50 years ago a good mechanic working for my cousin took me aside
and told me in a whisper I needed ignition wires. "Get them at the
parts store down the street and do it yourself. Mike is gonna charge
you twice what he pays for them."
Even he didn't like that practice.
That's what got me started doing most of my own repairs.




I used to do my own work. Just had brakes done and I saw what I was
charged for the pads. I know I could have gotten them cheaper, but I
don't get down on the ground so easy any more so I paid to have them put
in.

I also understand the shop had to either stock them or go get them etc.
He has to get a markup, he has to make a profit. What is the
difference if I pay $50 for pads and $50 for labor or if I pay $25 for
pads and $75 for labor? End of the day, the shop has to bring in a
certain amount of money to exist.

That's right. These guys are not getting rich, or Clare would still be
doing that. The mechanics make a good middle income living, I hope,
and the owner makes an upper middle income income, but he has lots of
money invested in the franchise and/or the building, the land, the
inventory, the tools that the mechanics don't bring, the commitment to
pay salaries, etc.

I don't feel that way about dealers, however.

Good mechanics working in flat rate shop make pretty good money.
And many very poor mechanics in flat rate shops make good money too.
Many make more money with their pen than with their tools.

In my years as a mechanic , mechanics went from being the lowest paid
trade to being the lowest paid profession.

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 14:09:09 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 6/23/2015 12:42 PM, Tony Hwang wrote:
Oren wrote:

Might just be my opinion, but doctors and lawyers are the worst
customers. They will nickel and dime you to death.

Hey, my daughter is not, LOL! I was so mad when she paid 2G for
noisy wheel bearings(known issue for certain Subaru) Since she
asks me to take her car in for service.

There are some dealerships where they are sexist,
and treat women differently.

-
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.
The same goes for chain shops and independents.
And a few actually treat women better than men ----

wrote in message
...
They don't. They buy the part at a wholesale price and fix things
themselves.
Some of you do. There are lots of engineers who are totally incapable
of fixing ANYTHING - including what they design!!

Then there are engineers like one where I worked. He could come up with an
idea, but could not design it. I did most of his work for him on several
projects. He had the idea, but could not plan or design it. I would
design, install and draw up the electrical prints on paper free hand. He
would take that to the drafting department where a lady would put it on the
computer. Then sign his name to it as he had a Professional Engineer paper.

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 11:10:57 -0700, "taxed and spent"
wrote:


"Tony Hwang" wrote in message
...
Ralph Mowery wrote:
"Vic Smith" wrote in message
...
Most people don't expect to get screwed on parts prices nowadays.
The parts costs are readily available, and they're not in the dark.
Labor cost is take it or leave it.
Car parts prices have been available for many years, and so has part
costs on the final bill.
Why go where you're going to get gouged on parts?

I don't drive one car much and often only have it serviced once a year.
Get
it inspected and the oil changed. It tickles me to look at the bill and
see
where they even add in shop supplies such as the rag the mechanic wipes
his
hand with. You would think they would just charge so much and be done
with
it instead of adding in all the small charges.


Common practice nowadays including so called disposal fee. But as long as
they do a good job, LOL! Go to a tire shop to have a set of new tires,
they have environmental fee, same with batteries.

With tires, the disposal fee is charged whether or not you leave them tires
to dispose of. So, it is like a recycling fee charged on a can of soda.
But, you cannot turn in a tire and get the recycling fee back - that is why
you still see tires abandoned all over the place. If they would let people
turn in tires for a buck apiece, there wouldn't be any abandoned tires.

How many beer and liquor containers to you find strewn along
roadsides??? Perhaps not as many as before there were deposits/refunds
on them - but still WAY too many. Even in areas where pop cans have
deposits, you find them scattered all around. (enough to keep some
homeless folks busy collecting empties, anyway)

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 14:30:30 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 6/23/2015 12:29 PM, Tony Hwang wrote:
Ed Pawlowski wrote:

Amazing. She expects to pay wholesale? Do you charge for the trip? She
should check your odometer.

Quite unusual. parts plus labor is total of usual bill.
All kinda people in the world.

Well, someone has to pay the business expenses. Some
companies itemize that out as trip charge or "to
show up" fee. Others average it in.

-

.. Service call gets billed from my door to their door one way at full
rate.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 19:46:26 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 6/23/2015 5:51 PM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
4.00
for a bottle of water when you can get about 20 of them in the store for
that price.. Big ripoff when you take the family and have several to buy
for. The next time we went we took small coolers and our own drinks.



They let you bring your own drinks in?
--


This was in the Atlanta baseball about 20 or more years ago. The drinks had
to be in plastic bottles.


Watch this thread morph into refrigerator
repair in about 24 hours.

-
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.
The battery for my koolatron portable refrigerator doesn't last past
the second inning at the ball game. Do any of those battery revival
powders actually work? What about in VRLA batteries?


Gee, stormy - it didn't even take 3 hours!!!!!!!

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 22:28:32 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 11:35:32 -0400, micky
wrote:

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 10:29:23 -0400, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote:


"Vic Smith" wrote in message
...
Most people don't expect to get screwed on parts prices nowadays.
The parts costs are readily available, and they're not in the dark.
Labor cost is take it or leave it.
Car parts prices have been available for many years, and so has part
costs on the final bill.
Why go where you're going to get gouged on parts?

I don't drive one car much and often only have it serviced once a year. Get
it inspected and the oil changed. It tickles me to look at the bill and see
where they even add in shop supplies such as the rag the mechanic wipes his
hand with. You would think they would just charge so much and be done with
it instead of adding in all the small charges.

I think I saw that for the first time at the dealer a few months ago. I
never went to a dealer before, but he had a sale and was charging no
more for wheel alignment than Firestone. He also claimed both of my
inner boots had leaks and needed replacing for 800 dollars. In fact,
one only had 50 miles on it and the other was in perfect condition also.

That's the usual Firesone (and other chain shops) modus operendi.

But I went to the dealer because they were the same price. It's the
dealer who tried to sell me two boots.

I saw what you said about dealers having to buy all that stuff, and pay
for all that training, so I'll limit myself to this dealer. Except
that the whole setup makes it near impossible for the customer to know
what's going on. At most shops if I cant' go int the bay, in decent
weather I can stand outside the bay and see what he's doing. When he
finds rips in my boot, he'll call me in and show me, and I'm sure the
insurance allows for that. But at this dealer -- all dealer builtings
built in the last 20 years maybe????? I drop the car off at one end of
the building and they have someone else drive it around to the
mechanics. It's clear I'm not wanted in that big room.

Though the girl they assigned to talk to me said I coudl have seen the
car. Of course this was a day later when I called with questions. Even
when I first heard her rattle off stuf (I missed it iirc when she said I
needed boots.) by that time the car was done and returned to my side

We'll see what happns when I bring it back. They'll probably claim I
had the boots replaced.

A local tire shop was advertising for a service manager, claiming very
generous earnings for "the right person". After talking about my
experience etc, their final question was "could I sell?" They said for
someone who "could sell" the job could pay upwards of six figures per
year (and this was in the eighties!!!) I said "sell, or upsell?" I
could sell what was required, but I couldn't steal from customers.

Good for you. I guess you're not the "right person", with his
definition of right.

Less than a year later the shop was closed down, and the management in
jail

Wow. Makes you feel good,doesn't it.

wrote in message
...
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 11:10:57 -0700, "taxed and spent"
wrote:


"Tony Hwang" wrote in message
...
Ralph Mowery wrote:
"Vic Smith" wrote in message
...
Most people don't expect to get screwed on parts prices nowadays.
The parts costs are readily available, and they're not in the dark.
Labor cost is take it or leave it.
Car parts prices have been available for many years, and so has part
costs on the final bill.
Why go where you're going to get gouged on parts?

I don't drive one car much and often only have it serviced once a year.
Get
it inspected and the oil changed. It tickles me to look at the bill
and
see
where they even add in shop supplies such as the rag the mechanic wipes
his
hand with. You would think they would just charge so much and be done
with
it instead of adding in all the small charges.


Common practice nowadays including so called disposal fee. But as long
as
they do a good job, LOL! Go to a tire shop to have a set of new tires,
they have environmental fee, same with batteries.

With tires, the disposal fee is charged whether or not you leave them
tires
to dispose of. So, it is like a recycling fee charged on a can of soda.
But, you cannot turn in a tire and get the recycling fee back - that is
why
you still see tires abandoned all over the place. If they would let
people
turn in tires for a buck apiece, there wouldn't be any abandoned tires.

How many beer and liquor containers to you find strewn along
roadsides??? Perhaps not as many as before there were deposits/refunds
on them - but still WAY too many. Even in areas where pop cans have
deposits, you find them scattered all around. (enough to keep some
homeless folks busy collecting empties, anyway)

nowhere near as many as before the deposits. I worked on a farm along a
road and was constantly picking up many, many cans and bottles - until the
deposits were established.

On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 9:23:15 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:35:01 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:49:46 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:


I'm with you, that some customers are a bit too
much trouble.

Might just be my opinion, but doctors and lawyers are the worst
customers. They will nickel and dime you to death.
Doctor complained when after doing some repairs to his car I told
him that I was sure we had solved the problem, but if it wasn't 100%
to his liking he could bring it back and I'd do a final adjustment for
him, gratis. He thought for what we charged it should last forever,
and be perfect the first time.
I told him diagnosis is difficult, and everybody can miss once in a
while - but as a mechanic I fixed my mistakes - I didn't bury them.

Teacher complained mechanics charged too much (and this was after my
stint at teaching) so I said unlike teachers, I guaranteed my job.

Have you ever fired customers? When I was in business, I would fire a couple a year if they mistreated me. They were puzzled as to why I was no longer responding to their calls. Some people will never learn and when they screw over enough service companies, word gets out and nobody will do work for them.

Me and my brother considered what it would take to set up a website called "The Better Customer Bureau". Guys and gals in any service or contracting business who were registered members of TBCB could report customers who were difficult, disrespectful, nasty or refused to pay. I thought it would be a good idea to have a small DVR or (bodycam) running when there is any interaction with customers but you must let them know you're recording phone calls or video of them. You'd explain it was company policy to protect the customer and serviceman in case of a dispute or complaint of bad behavior by company personnel. You could also offer to provide pictures or video of what you find wrong and the work done at their home or business. I've worked as an independant contractor for large service companies which had websites where contractors are required to upload pictures and repair tickets. You could tell the new customer that you're a member of a professional organization that reports the names of good customers so they can get a discount for services from any of the members. The policy would be that only names and general area where the customer is located would be shared with other members and the information would never be used for unsolicited advertising of any sort. There would be a need for a separate website to list the names of businesses registered with the Good Customers List so customers could lookup the names of member companies. Of course members of TBCB could always check the names of potential customers to see if they've been reported as unacceptable or non payers. That's what the recordings are for. Those recordings would be uploaded the site for its members to see. Yes, I know,there are always legal ramifications of any service like the Better Business Bureau and we'd have to copy some of the ways they do things but revenge is always fun. Perhaps the site could be registered in Belize or someplace like that in case some crazy person gets upset about being outed as a lowdown jerk. I must wonder if it would be better to have the site available to only registered, vetted users or let it be wide open so the videos of nutjobs could go viral. Oh well, it's only a dream. ^_^

[8~{} Uncle Revenge Monster

On 6/23/2015 10:53 PM, wrote:


I spent half of my life as a mechanic as a dealer service manager.
Sure, there are bad dealerships out there - but in my experience, the
big name chain shops - whether muffler, shock, transmission, or tire
related, have a much higher proportion of "crooks", and while there
are many good "independents" (and I worked for a few) there are lots
of inept grease monkeys willing to rob you blind, either purposely or
through their ineptitude, too.


Sounds accurate from my experience. If you find a good shop, stick with
them. They may not be the cheapest on every job, but they will save you
a bundle if they are honest, knowledgeable and fair.

On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 9:31:10 PM UTC-5, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 6/23/2015 10:21 PM, Uncle Monster wrote:

There is an auto repair business in town called BYOP, Bring Your Own Parts and that's exactly how they work but I don't know about oil, cleaners and sealants. A lot of folks seem to like the company which advertises on local talk radio all the time. 8-)

[8~{} Uncle Car Monster


Wonder if they have a charge for wrong part,
and had to come back?

-
I'd have to find out but I think they also diagnose problems and tell you what parts are needed so you obtain the correct ones. I couldn't find a website of their own but they are listed on several web pages. 8-)

http://www.mechanicadvisor.com/al/bi...yop-birmingham

[8~{} Uncle Car Monster

On 06/24/2015 05:32 AM, Uncle Monster wrote:
Me and my brother considered what it would take to set up a website called "The Better Customer Bureau". Guys and gals in any service or contracting business who were registered members of TBCB could report customers who were difficult, disrespectful, nasty or refused to pay.

And www.UncleAngiesListMonster.com was born.

That's the usual Firesone (and other chain shops) modus operendi.
A local tire shop was advertising for a service manager, claiming very
generous earnings for "the right person". After talking about my
experience etc, their final question was "could I sell?" They said for
someone who "could sell" the job could pay upwards of six figures per
year (and this was in the eighties!!!) I said "sell, or upsell?" I
could sell what was required, but I couldn't steal from customers.

Less than a year later the shop was closed down, and the management in
jail


Do you remember the lawsuits against Sears some years ago? I think
the mechanics got a commission on parts on an individual basis. The
results
were almost inevitable. Customers got parts they really didn't need.

--
Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

wrote:
....
Like the customer at the service station who was making noises about
not getting screwed on auto repairs, complained the estimate was too
high and then when he came to pick up the car, wanted credit. I told
the boss either cash or cheque - no credit card, because I was sure
he'd dispute the bill with the bank - and when he decided to pay by
cheque I told the boss to lose the keys or whatever it took to keep
the guy in the shop for about 10 minutes while I grabbed the cheque
and headed out the back way with the truck to the customer's bank
branch - where I paid the $2 to have the cheque certified.
As I was going out the door the customer came in all out of breath and
asked to stop payment on the cheque, and I had a big grin on my face
when the teller told him "too late, that guy just certified the
cheque"

holy crap! if i were that worried about getting paid
i'd say cash up front.


songbird

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 11:47:07 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 6/23/2015 5:42 AM, Vic Smith wrote:


Most people don't expect to get screwed on parts prices nowadays.
The parts costs are readily available, and they're not in the dark.
Labor cost is take it or leave it.
Car parts prices have been available for many years, and so has part
costs on the final bill.
Why go where you're going to get gouged on parts?
Even 50 years ago a good mechanic working for my cousin took me aside
and told me in a whisper I needed ignition wires. "Get them at the
parts store down the street and do it yourself. Mike is gonna charge
you twice what he pays for them."
Even he didn't like that practice.
That's what got me started doing most of my own repairs.




I used to do my own work. Just had brakes done and I saw what I was
charged for the pads. I know I could have gotten them cheaper, but I
don't get down on the ground so easy any more so I paid to have them put
in.

I also understand the shop had to either stock them or go get them etc.
He has to get a markup, he has to make a profit. What is the
difference if I pay $50 for pads and $50 for labor or if I pay $25 for
pads and $75 for labor? End of the day, the shop has to bring in a
certain amount of money to exist.

My cousin (by marriage) was just screwing people on parts. That was
the gist of what the mechanic told me. He wasn't adjusting the labor
charges. It was simply added profit.
Most independents don't stock many parts. Parts stores deliver them
as needed. Where I live there's parts stores all over the place.

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 22:03:16 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 04:42:54 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:


Even 50 years ago a good mechanic working for my cousin took me aside
and told me in a whisper I needed ignition wires. "Get them at the
parts store down the street and do it yourself. Mike is gonna charge
you twice what he pays for them."
Even he didn't like that practice.
That's what got me started doing most of my own repairs.


It's been a LONG time since there was a 100% markup on auto parts -
but also remember the old saying about price and quality.


This was the late sixties. So he would charge you 20 bucks for a 10
buck wire set. It was simple gouging.

"If you want first quality oats, be ready to pay first quality price.
If you are willing to settle for oats that have already gone through
the horse, they do come a bit cheaper".

There are parts, and then there are parts - and there can be a LOT
more difference than just the price!!!!

Back then it was all AC Delco, FoMoCo and Mopar. All OEM.
You didn't have the choices you have now. Different world.

On Wed, 24 Jun 2015 00:45:52 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 6/23/2015 10:53 PM, wrote:


I spent half of my life as a mechanic as a dealer service manager.
Sure, there are bad dealerships out there - but in my experience, the
big name chain shops - whether muffler, shock, transmission, or tire
related, have a much higher proportion of "crooks", and while there
are many good "independents" (and I worked for a few) there are lots
of inept grease monkeys willing to rob you blind, either purposely or
through their ineptitude, too.


Sounds accurate from my experience. If you find a good shop, stick with
them. They may not be the cheapest on every job, but they will save you
a bundle if they are honest, knowledgeable and fair.

When I was working many hours I found a good mechanic only because my
wife's car stopped in front of his shop on a busy street.
First time I had a car in a shop in 27 years. Frankly, it was scary.
They pushed her right into the shop. Lucky place for her fuel pump to
fail. Used him until my son became a mechanic.
He wasn't cheap and wasn't expensive, and did every job one time only.
Never had to take a car back for something he did wrong.
There's good ones out there. You just have to find them.

On Wednesday, June 24, 2015 at 3:21:28 AM UTC-5, Nancy Pelosi wrote:
On 06/24/2015 05:32 AM, Uncle Monster wrote:
Me and my brother considered what it would take to set up a website called "The Better Customer Bureau". Guys and gals in any service or contracting business who were registered members of TBCB could report customers who were difficult, disrespectful, nasty or refused to pay.

And www.UncleAngiesListMonster.com was born.

Dammit! You shouldn't tease me like that. Heck, what else can a feller expect from a moonbat Democrat bee-auch. o_O

[8~{} Uncle Disappointed Monster

On 6/23/2015 11:02 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 14:30:30 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 6/23/2015 12:29 PM, Tony Hwang wrote:
Ed Pawlowski wrote:

Amazing. She expects to pay wholesale? Do you charge for the trip? She
should check your odometer.

Quite unusual. parts plus labor is total of usual bill.
All kinda people in the world.

Well, someone has to pay the business expenses. Some
companies itemize that out as trip charge or "to
show up" fee. Others average it in.

-

. Service call gets billed from my do[Makes sense, as different distances and time of day lead to different travel times.]or to their door one way at full
rate.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.


Reply center posted, in keeping with your
pattern.

..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

On 6/23/2015 11:32 PM, Uncle Monster wrote:
On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 9:23:15 PM UTC-5,
wrote:
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:35:01 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:49:46 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:


I'm with you, that some customers are a bit too much trouble.

Remember the "golden rule": 90% of your problems come from 10% of your
clients!


Have you ever fired customers? When I was in business, I would fire a
couple a year if they mistreated me. They were puzzled as to why I
was no longer responding to their calls. Some people will never learn
and when they screw over enough service companies, word gets out and
nobody will do work for them.


Ah, yes, truly one of the greatest "benefits" of being self-employed.

The ability to be able to "just say no!" is a wonderful thing and I find
that I am using it more and more as I wind down my practice.

On 6/24/2015 12:32 AM, Uncle Monster wrote:

Have you ever fired customers? When I was in
business, I would fire a couple a year if they
mistreated me. They were puzzled as to why I was
no longer responding to their calls. Some people
will never learn and when they screw over enough
service companies, word gets out and nobody will
do work for them.


[8~{} Uncle Revenge Monster


The first two I remember, both were small town used
car dealers. One was insulting, and I asked him to
moderate his tone a bit. He did not.

The other used to have NSF checks. The guy with the NSF
checks, short white guy with grey hair, who spent a lot
of time talking about his boat, on the bay. He had a
man who worked in the shop, who he often called that
G'damn n'word. I wasn't all that impressed. They were a
matched set, the guy in the shop used to do free lance
work on Saturdays, and steal tools and tires.


-
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

On 6/24/2015 12:32 AM, Uncle Monster wrote:

Me and my brother considered what it would take to set
up a website called "The Better Customer Bureau". Guys
and gals in any service or contracting business who were
registered members of TBCB could report customers who
were difficult, disrespectful, nasty or refused to pay.
I thought it would be a good idea to have a small DVR
or (bodycam) running when there is any interaction with
customers but you must let them know you're recording
phone calls or video of them. You'd explain it was
company policy to protect the customer and serviceman
in case of a dispute or complaint of bad behavior by
company personnel. You could also offer to provide pictures
or video of what you find wrong and the work done at their
home or business. I've worked as an independant contractor
for large service companies which had websites where
contractors are required to upload pictures and repair
tickets. You could tell the new customer that you're a
member of a professional organization that reports the
names of good customers so they can get a discount for
services from any of the members. The policy would be
that only names and general area where the customer is
located would be shared with other members and the
information would never be used for unsolicited
advertising of any sort. There would be a need for a
separate website to list the names of businesses
registered with the Good Customers List so customers
could lookup the names of member companies. Of course
members of TBCB could always check the names of
potential customers to see if they've been reported
as unacceptable or non payers. That's what the
recordings are for. Those recordings would be
uploaded the site for its members to see. Yes, I know,
there are always legal ramifications of any service like
the Better Business Bureau and we'd have to copy some of
the ways they do things but revenge is always fun. Perhaps
the site could be registered in Belize or someplace like
that in case some crazy person gets upset about being
outed as a lowdown jerk. I must wonder if it would be
better to have the site available to only registered,
vetted users or let it be wide open so the videos of
nutjobs could go viral. Oh well, it's only a dream. ^_^

[8~{} Uncle Revenge Monster


If everyone were honest as you and me, this would work
fine. I can imagine people filing bad reports on each
other to try and submarine the competition.

-
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

"Dean Hoffman" wrote in message
news

Do you remember the lawsuits against Sears some years ago? I
think
the mechanics got a commission on parts on an individual basis. The
results
were almost inevitable. Customers got parts they really didn't need.


I had a car in the shop a few years back. The online help from stores like
Autozone pointed to the mass air sensor ( think that was it) that was about
a $ 500 part. Instead of getting that part I took the car to a dealer where
I though they should be able to check out that part. The mechanic replaced
about 3 or 4 other things that cost form $ 50 to $ 100 each that did not
solve the problem. They finally replaced the sensor after about 2 weeks and
an email from me to Toyota about that dealer not being able to repair a
problem. I still had to pay for the other items that were replaced that
were not needed. I don't think I was ripped off by the mechanic other than
he did not how to check out a car. Just a parts changer instead of a real
mechanic.
The dealer did say he was just going to charge me their cost for several of
the items to try and make me happy.

That and a couple of other things cost them atleast 2 car sales from me over
the next 10 years, and I will only buy from them again if they are really
below out of town car prices.
They will be the last place I look at for a car.

On Wednesday, June 24, 2015 at 9:29:57 AM UTC-5, Ralph Mowery wrote:

I had a car in the shop a few years back. The online help from stores like
Autozone pointed to the mass air sensor ( think that was it) that was about
a $ 500 part. Instead of getting that part I took the car to a dealer where
I though they should be able to check out that part. The mechanic replaced
about 3 or 4 other things that cost form $ 50 to $ 100 each that did not
solve the problem. They finally replaced the sensor after about 2 weeks and
an email from me to Toyota about that dealer not being able to repair a
problem. I still had to pay for the other items that were replaced that
were not needed. I don't think I was ripped off by the mechanic other than
he did not how to check out a car. Just a parts changer instead of a real
mechanic.
The dealer did say he was just going to charge me their cost for several of
the items to try and make me happy.

That and a couple of other things cost them atleast 2 car sales from me over
the next 10 years, and I will only buy from them again if they are really
below out of town car prices.
They will be the last place I look at for a car.

I haven't seen MAF sensors much higher than $150? I got a new Hitachi part (MAF) for $82 on eBay...which was the same part available at AZ for $128 with a 20% discount.
That mechanic should watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2QLxxstRn8

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 22:15:23 -0400, wrote:

As I was going out the door the customer came in all out of breath and
asked to stop payment on the cheque, and I had a big grin on my face
when the teller told him "too late, that guy just certified the
cheque"

Wouldn't work today. You can bank from your phone now, including stop
payments. I haven't been inside a bank in over a year.

On 6/24/2015 10:29 AM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
That and a couple of other things cost them atleast 2 car sales from me over
the next 10 years, and I will only buy from them again if they are really
below out of town car prices.
They will be the last place I look at for a car.




The couple bucks from over charging, expensive in
the long run, as you take your business down the
road.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

"bob_villa" wrote in message
...
I haven't seen MAF sensors much higher than $150? I got a new Hitachi part
(MAF) for $82 on eBay...which was the same part available at AZ for $128
with a 20% discount.
That mechanic should watch this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2QLxxstRn8

It may not have been a MAF, but it was some sensor for the engine that
Autozone or a store like that had over $ 500 on that part on line. Maybe a
fuel flow sensor ? Anyway whatever part it was the cost was over $ 500 for
a sensor of some kind for a 1991 Camry. Even the dealer cost was close to
that.
As that was over 15 years ago, I may not be recalling the correct sensor,
just the price.

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 22:23:15 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:35:01 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:49:46 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:


I'm with you, that some customers are a bit too
much trouble.

Might just be my opinion, but doctors and lawyers are the worst
customers. They will nickel and dime you to death.

Doctor complained when after doing some repairs to his car I told
him that I was sure we had solved the problem, but if it wasn't 100%
to his liking he could bring it back and I'd do a final adjustment for
him, gratis. He thought for what we charged it should last forever,
and be perfect the first time.
I told him diagnosis is difficult, and everybody can miss once in a
while - but as a mechanic I fixed my mistakes - I didn't bury them.

Teacher complained mechanics charged too much (and this was after my
stint at teaching) so I said unlike teachers, I guaranteed my job.

As Ed, lawyers have the edge. I goofed on plenty years ago. Attorney
calls a federal prison; demanding I allow him to speak with his
client. I told him to write the crook a letter - cons can only call
out on collect calls. I thought the phone was about to smoke and
flame

He kept demanding; so I said, Hello..Hello..are you there?! Then I
hung up. His next call was less demanding.

Had another lawyer demanding he see his client right now. Sir, have a
seat, we have a count now. I'll get you an escort in a short time. He
popped a cork in the lobby. All nasty at me. When I explained that I
could have him removed for federal property he STFU and waited for his
escort.

One lawyer didn't know what to do when I would not let him bring a
satchel of cash in the prison. Told him he could put the money in my
truck or in his locked trunk...

Now my FAVORITE: When the Cranden Park Zoo, in Miami, Fl, closed our
Captain acquired a ten foot concrete alligator. It was set on the
edge of a lake in the center of the prison. Rain added water and then
water was less.

So, I'm escorting the attorney across the compound to the main lobby.
He was being cordial about how the prison "looked like a college
campus." I said, look at the 40 lb. catfish and 14 lb Bass. When I
was near, I yelled "alligator" .... this lawyer ran 150 yards. I told
Control to let him out... I loved goofin' on lawyers.

Good memories.