I just got my first gas bill after a full month of use on my new
hi-efficiency furnace.

On the bill they put a comparison of usage from the present date and
compare it to last year.

Fortunately for the sake of comparison the temp this year averaged one
degree colder than last year but the usage was only 85% as much.

Not only that, since my wife hates the cold, I told her we could keep
the temp, in the house a few degrees warmer at night.

I used to turn it down to 62F and now I just turn it down to 64 or 65



House is 1900 sq ft but has a basement that I keep slightly heated.

Average temp 15F

total gas charges including surcharges $210


Something I can actually afford



Got my $150 energy rebate check a few days ago

On 3/5/2015 7:01 AM, philo wrote:
I just got my first gas bill after a full month of use on my new
hi-efficiency furnace.

total gas charges including surcharges $210

Something I can actually afford


Thanks for the good news, hope someone is able
to afford some thing. I signed up with Energetix
a couple years ago, when the door to door guy
promised it would be cheaper. After hearing radio
ads for Noco, I went online and made some calls.
Find out for Dec, I could have spent #103 less
if I had Noco. I put in for switch, but they
can only do that at meter reads, two months from
now. So, please compare energy provider prices
if you have a choice in your area.

-
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

On Thu, 05 Mar 2015 06:01:16 -0600, philo wrote in


I just got my first gas bill after a full month of use on my new
hi-efficiency furnace.

On the bill they put a comparison of usage from the present date and
compare it to last year.

Fortunately for the sake of comparison the temp this year averaged one
degree colder than last year but the usage was only 85% as much.

Not only that, since my wife hates the cold, I told her we could keep
the temp, in the house a few degrees warmer at night.

I used to turn it down to 62F and now I just turn it down to 64 or 65

House is 1900 sq ft but has a basement that I keep slightly heated.

Average temp 15F

total gas charges including surcharges $210

Something I can actually afford

Got my $150 energy rebate check a few days ago

Seems like a good deal. What was the total cost of the new furnace?
--
Web based forums are like subscribing to 10 different newspapers
and having to visit 10 different news stands to pickup each one.
Email list-server groups and USENET are like having all of those
newspapers delivered to your door every morning.

On 3/5/2015 7:25 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 3/5/2015 7:01 AM, philo wrote:
I just got my first gas bill after a full month of use on my new
hi-efficiency furnace.

total gas charges including surcharges $210

Something I can actually afford


Thanks for the good news, hope someone is able
to afford some thing. I signed up with Energetix
a couple years ago, when the door to door guy
promised it would be cheaper. After hearing radio
ads for Noco, I went online and made some calls.
Find out for Dec, I could have spent #103 less
if I had Noco. I put in for switch, but they
can only do that at meter reads, two months from
now. So, please compare energy provider prices
if you have a choice in your area.

Door to door guy, only a mormon would sign up for one of those deals.

--
Froz...


The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.

FrozenNorth wrote:
On 3/5/2015 7:25 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 3/5/2015 7:01 AM, philo wrote:
I just got my first gas bill after a full month of use on my new
hi-efficiency furnace.

total gas charges including surcharges $210

Something I can actually afford


Thanks for the good news, hope someone is able
to afford some thing. I signed up with Energetix
a couple years ago, when the door to door guy
promised it would be cheaper. After hearing radio
ads for Noco, I went online and made some calls.
Find out for Dec, I could have spent #103 less
if I had Noco. I put in for switch, but they
can only do that at meter reads, two months from
now. So, please compare energy provider prices
if you have a choice in your area.

Door to door guy, only a mormon would sign up for one of those deals.

Hi,
I think the door to door guy was a Mormon too.

On 03/05/2015 10:24 AM, CRNG wrote:
afford

Got my $150 energy rebate check a few days ago

Seems like a good deal. What was the total cost of the new furnace?




After the rebate it was about $3600

It's 96% efficiency. The former one (23 years ago) was 80% efficiency
and about $2900...so it was not too bad.


The contractor did not charge me extra for priority which I needed due
to the old one breaking down in winter...plus there was no charge for
them to do a follow up call a month later to confirm all was working
ok...and to fine tune the venting.


It will pay for itself in 7 or 8 years I'm guessing.

On Thu, 05 Mar 2015 10:43:58 -0700, Tony Hwang
wrote:

Door to door guy, only a mormon would sign up for one of those deals.

Hi,
I think the door to door guy was a Mormon too.

Two guy here, posing as Mormons invaded a home...

_Mormon imposters sentenced to 7 years to life in prison_

http://www.reviewjournal.com/news/las-vegas/mormon-imposters-sentenced-7-years-life-prison

"Oren" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 05 Mar 2015 10:43:58 -0700, Tony Hwang
wrote:

Door to door guy, only a mormon would sign up for one of those deals.

Hi,
I think the door to door guy was a Mormon too.

Two guy here, posing as Mormons invaded a home...

_Mormon imposters sentenced to 7 years to life in prison_

http://www.reviewjournal.com/news/las-vegas/mormon-imposters-sentenced-7-years-life-prison

enhanced sentence for being fake Mormons?

philo wrote in :

On 03/05/2015 10:24 AM, CRNG wrote:
afford

Got my $150 energy rebate check a few days ago

Seems like a good deal. What was the total cost of the new furnace?




After the rebate it was about $3600

It's 96% efficiency. The former one (23 years ago) was 80% efficiency
and about $2900...so it was not too bad.


The contractor did not charge me extra for priority which I needed due
to the old one breaking down in winter...plus there was no charge for
them to do a follow up call a month later to confirm all was working
ok...and to fine tune the venting.


It will pay for itself in 7 or 8 years I'm guessing.


Based on your earlier posts: current bill = $210 which is 85% of you
previous bill of same month last year, so previous bill ~= $247, so saving
approx $37/month; but you wrote that this was a high-heat month, so
gestimating an average saving of $30/month your payback will be
approgimately 120 months. That's pretty good.

On Thu, 5 Mar 2015 10:04:55 -0800, "Reggie"
wrote:


"Oren" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 05 Mar 2015 10:43:58 -0700, Tony Hwang
wrote:

Door to door guy, only a mormon would sign up for one of those deals.

Hi,
I think the door to door guy was a Mormon too.

Two guy here, posing as Mormons invaded a home...

_Mormon imposters sentenced to 7 years to life in prison_

http://www.reviewjournal.com/news/las-vegas/mormon-imposters-sentenced-7-years-life-prison

enhanced sentence for being fake Mormons?


Singing to loud in Church!

"... guilty of robbery with a deadly weapon, conspiracy to commit
robbery, first-degree kidnapping with use of a deadly weapon, burglary
and battery charges."
--
"No matter how cynical you become, it's never enough to keep up."
-- Lily Tomlin

Zak W wrote:
philo wrote in :

On 03/05/2015 10:24 AM, CRNG wrote:
afford

Got my $150 energy rebate check a few days ago

Seems like a good deal. What was the total cost of the new furnace?




After the rebate it was about $3600

It's 96% efficiency. The former one (23 years ago) was 80% efficiency
and about $2900...so it was not too bad.


The contractor did not charge me extra for priority which I needed due
to the old one breaking down in winter...plus there was no charge for
them to do a follow up call a month later to confirm all was working
ok...and to fine tune the venting.


It will pay for itself in 7 or 8 years I'm guessing.


Based on your earlier posts: current bill = $210 which is 85% of you
previous bill of same month last year, so previous bill ~= $247, so saving
approx $37/month; but you wrote that this was a high-heat month, so
gestimating an average saving of $30/month your payback will be
approgimately 120 months. That's pretty good.

Hi,
Assuming gas price stays put. Regardless saving is a saving however
small it maybe. I went thru same thing couple years ago. They just
installed furnace, gave me CO detector and I declined programmable
thermostat. I installed my own wireless thermostat and the CO detector.
I paid 400.00 less.

On 03/05/2015 12:50 PM, Tony Hwang wrote:



snip
Hi,
Assuming gas price stays put. Regardless saving is a saving however
small it maybe. I went thru same thing couple years ago. They just
installed furnace, gave me CO detector and I declined programmable
thermostat. I installed my own wireless thermostat and the CO detector.
I paid 400.00 less.



I don't see gas prices going down...but no matter what, the furnace will
eventually pay for itself.


I already have a CO detector and the humidifier from the old furnace was
fine, so re-used it...but the rest was new:

Furnace
Air cleaner assembly
Two stage thermostat
The old thermostat would have worked but I was told the two stage
would be better . An insignificant expense at any rate.

Zak W wrote in
:

philo wrote in :

On 03/05/2015 10:24 AM, CRNG wrote:
afford

Got my $150 energy rebate check a few days ago

Seems like a good deal. What was the total cost of the new furnace?


After the rebate it was about $3600

It's 96% efficiency. The former one (23 years ago) was 80% efficiency
and about $2900...so it was not too bad.


The contractor did not charge me extra for priority which I needed
due to the old one breaking down in winter...plus there was no charge
for them to do a follow up call a month later to confirm all was
working ok...and to fine tune the venting.


It will pay for itself in 7 or 8 years I'm guessing.


Based on your earlier posts: current bill = $210 which is 85% of you
previous bill of same month last year, so previous bill ~= $247, so
saving approx $37/month; but you wrote that this was a high-heat
month, so gestimating an average saving of $30/month your payback will
be approgimately 120 months. That's pretty good.

Upon further reflection, that $30/month may be too high. I doubt you
will save $30/month in June, July, August. So I'm thinking a better
guesstimate would be $20/month annual average. That makes the payback
180 months. Still pretty good.

On 3/5/2015 1:50 PM, Tony Hwang wrote:

I went thru same thing couple years ago. They just
installed furnace, gave me CO detector and I declined programmable
thermostat. I installed my own wireless thermostat and the CO detector.
I paid 400.00 less.

What is the advantage of a wireless thermostat? Mine are programmable
and rarely ever touch them. I see T-stats you can change using your
phone, but I've never found the need.

On 03/05/2015 03:21 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

I went thru same thing couple years ago. They just
installed furnace, gave me CO detector and I declined programmable
thermostat. I installed my own wireless thermostat and the CO detector.
I paid 400.00 less.

What is the advantage of a wireless thermostat? Mine are programmable
and rarely ever touch them. I see T-stats you can change using your
phone, but I've never found the need.

I think the idea of a remotely controllable thermostat is that one
could, e.g., as leaving work, set the thermostat to raise the
temperature to a comfortable level in time taken to get home minutes
time, rather than having a regular programmable thermostat that is set
on the assumption that one will arrive home at the same time every
insert day of the week.

We don't have a remotely programmable thermostat, so we will return from
vacation to a house that is hotter or colder than desirable. A remotely
programmable thermostat would let us reset the temperature when we get
to the airport.

Perce

On Thursday, March 5, 2015 at 1:34:48 PM UTC-5, Zak W wrote:
philo wrote in :

On 03/05/2015 10:24 AM, CRNG wrote:
afford

Got my $150 energy rebate check a few days ago

Seems like a good deal. What was the total cost of the new furnace?




After the rebate it was about $3600

It's 96% efficiency. The former one (23 years ago) was 80% efficiency
and about $2900...so it was not too bad.


The contractor did not charge me extra for priority which I needed due
to the old one breaking down in winter...plus there was no charge for
them to do a follow up call a month later to confirm all was working
ok...and to fine tune the venting.


It will pay for itself in 7 or 8 years I'm guessing.


Based on your earlier posts: current bill = $210 which is 85% of you
previous bill of same month last year, so previous bill ~= $247, so saving
approx $37/month; but you wrote that this was a high-heat month, so
gestimating an average saving of $30/month your payback will be
approgimately 120 months. That's pretty good.

120 months of winter works out to ~24 years, 120/5 months = 24 years.
That isn't a very good value proposition.

On 03/05/2015 02:47 PM, trader_4 wrote:


Based on your earlier posts: current bill = $210 which is 85% of you
previous bill of same month last year, so previous bill ~= $247, so saving
approx $37/month; but you wrote that this was a high-heat month, so
gestimating an average saving of $30/month your payback will be
approgimately 120 months. That's pretty good.

120 months of winter works out to ~24 years, 120/5 months = 24 years.
That isn't a very good value proposition.




There is no way the payback will be 24 years. I figure ten at the very most.

In the cold months the difference will be more than $30 and in Wisconsin
there are more than five cold months a year.

Heck the furnace can be in use as much as 8 or 9 months a year.

On Thursday, March 5, 2015 at 3:11:20 PM UTC-5, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 3/5/2015 1:50 PM, Tony Hwang wrote:

I went thru same thing couple years ago. They just
installed furnace, gave me CO detector and I declined programmable
thermostat. I installed my own wireless thermostat and the CO detector.
I paid 400.00 less.

What is the advantage of a wireless thermostat? Mine are programmable
and rarely ever touch them. I see T-stats you can change using your
phone, but I've never found the need.

Depends on what is meant by wireless. If it's wireless connectivity
to the internet, I see the usage for that. If you're away on a trip,
you can have it set back and when you arrive at the airport, have it
resume so the house is warm/cool when you arrive. Or if you're coming
home early from work one day, you can get it going. Or if you leave
on a trip and aren't sure if you turned it down, you can check and
adjust. Or if you're away
and want to check to make sure the temp is OK, furnace is working.
Or if it'a a vacation rental you own. Guests are arriving at 5PM
this Fri, turn it up, etc. Next one I get will have wifi.

On Thursday, March 5, 2015 at 3:07:12 PM UTC-5, Zak W wrote:
Zak W wrote in
:

philo wrote in :

On 03/05/2015 10:24 AM, CRNG wrote:
afford

Got my $150 energy rebate check a few days ago

Seems like a good deal. What was the total cost of the new furnace?


After the rebate it was about $3600

It's 96% efficiency. The former one (23 years ago) was 80% efficiency
and about $2900...so it was not too bad.


The contractor did not charge me extra for priority which I needed
due to the old one breaking down in winter...plus there was no charge
for them to do a follow up call a month later to confirm all was
working ok...and to fine tune the venting.


It will pay for itself in 7 or 8 years I'm guessing.


Based on your earlier posts: current bill = $210 which is 85% of you
previous bill of same month last year, so previous bill ~= $247, so
saving approx $37/month; but you wrote that this was a high-heat
month, so gestimating an average saving of $30/month your payback will
be approgimately 120 months. That's pretty good.

Upon further reflection, that $30/month may be too high. I doubt you
will save $30/month in June, July, August. So I'm thinking a better
guesstimate would be $20/month annual average. That makes the payback
180 months. Still pretty good.

Keep reflecting. That 180 months is ~36 years. 180/5 months usage a year,
36 years. And that's without factoring in the time value of money....
Not saying getting a new furnace is a bad thing, just that numbers are
what they are.

On 03/05/2015 02:55 PM, trader_4 wrote:
OnX

It will pay for itself in 7 or 8 years I'm guessing.


Based on your earlier posts: current bill = $210 which is 85% of you
previous bill of same month last year, so previous bill ~= $247, so
saving approx $37/month; but you wrote that this was a high-heat
month, so gestimating an average saving of $30/month your payback will
be approgimately 120 months. That's pretty good.

Upon further reflection, that $30/month may be too high. I doubt you
will save $30/month in June, July, August. So I'm thinking a better
guesstimate would be $20/month annual average. That makes the payback
180 months. Still pretty good.

Keep reflecting. That 180 months is ~36 years. 180/5 months usage a year,
36 years. And that's without factoring in the time value of money....
Not saying getting a new furnace is a bad thing, just that numbers are
what they are.




Maybe you are not familiar with Wisconsin winters. They are damn cold
and the furnace is used much longer than 5 months a year.

(Plus being married, I have to set it higher than what I could deal with
on my own.)


In some of the coldest months it runs almost continuously and some years
even until the end of May I still need to run it.


At any rate it would have made no sense for me to stick a lot of money
into my 23 year old furnace and I had to do it no matter what.

"trader_4" wrote in message
...
Upon further reflection, that $30/month may be too high. I doubt you
will save $30/month in June, July, August. So I'm thinking a better
guesstimate would be $20/month annual average. That makes the payback
180 months. Still pretty good.

Keep reflecting. That 180 months is ~36 years. 180/5 months usage a
year,
36 years. And that's without factoring in the time value of money....
Not saying getting a new furnace is a bad thing, just that numbers are
what they are.

Yes, getting a new furnace is not a bad thing, especially if the one you
have craps out or is very old. Just don't expect to get the payback that is
often listed. If that same ammout of money (the cost of the furnace, not
the savings) could be put in a stock fund that gave say 5 % each year you
would be ahead of the game to keep the old one depending on your age. I
almost put in some solar panels after hearing a good talk about them,
However at 66 years old and a 15 year or more payback, I decided against it.
Then got to thinking that after 15 years if they lasted that long Iwould
have to put in a new system.

I bought a house about 10 years ago. The origional heatpump crapped out
after about 2 years, so I installed a new one instead of repairing the old
one as it was getting close to 15 years old or older. Not sure how much if
any it saved on the power bill, but thought at 20 years old it was on the
verge of causing lots of problems. I can't complain anyway as the total
electric bill for just my wife and me goes from about $ 150 to $ 200
depending on the seasons. That is for the well pump, electric dryer and
everything else in a 4 bedroom house.

"philo" wrote in message
...
On 03/05/2015 02:55 PM, trader_4 wrote:
In some of the coldest months it runs almost continuously and some years
even until the end of May I still need to run it.


At any rate it would have made no sense for me to stick a lot of money
into my 23 year old furnace and I had to do it no matter what.

That is the way I would look at it, at over 20 years old, it is time for a
replacement instead of a repair job. You may or may not save anything in
the long run,but you will not be throwing money at an on going problem.

On Thursday, March 5, 2015 at 3:51:59 PM UTC-5, philo wrote:
On 03/05/2015 02:47 PM, trader_4 wrote:


Based on your earlier posts: current bill = $210 which is 85% of you
previous bill of same month last year, so previous bill ~= $247, so saving
approx $37/month; but you wrote that this was a high-heat month, so
gestimating an average saving of $30/month your payback will be
approgimately 120 months. That's pretty good.

120 months of winter works out to ~24 years, 120/5 months = 24 years.
That isn't a very good value proposition.




There is no way the payback will be 24 years. I figure ten at the very most.

In the cold months the difference will be more than $30 and in Wisconsin
there are more than five cold months a year.

Heck the furnace can be in use as much as 8 or 9 months a year.

I didn't start the math, someone else did. But you did provide the
numbers from what you say is a bill that just arrived. That should be
a *peak* month. Even if the furnace is being used 9 months a year,
it sure isn't being used anywhere near as much in June, July and Aug
as it is in the current bill, so if you're saving $37 this month,
it's going to be a small fraction of that in those warmer months.
Believe what you want, but
numbers are numbers and the other posters math that the furnace pays
itself off in 120 months, later corrected to 180 months, isn't calendar
months, it's months of substantial usage. I used 5 months. Adjust it
to 6, 7 of substantial use. You still wind up with a payback of 25
years.

In article ,
Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 3/5/2015 1:50 PM, Tony Hwang wrote:

I went thru same thing couple years ago. They just
installed furnace, gave me CO detector and I declined programmable
thermostat. I installed my own wireless thermostat and the CO detector.
I paid 400.00 less.

What is the advantage of a wireless thermostat? Mine are programmable
and rarely ever touch them. I see T-stats you can change using your
phone, but I've never found the need.

We have times when we go away for a couple weeks, long weekend, etc.,
during the winter. It is easier to turn the thermostat down to say 50
whilst we are gone, put it back up to normal as we are getting on the
plane and be nice and toasty when we get back. Last winter we also had a
stretch of -10+ weather while we were gone and I added extra heat,
albeit largely to make me feel better. That and I like to play with my
gadgets.
--
³Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive,
but what they conceal is vital.²
‹ Aaron Levenstein

philo wrote:
On 03/05/2015 12:50 PM, Tony Hwang wrote:



snip
Hi,
Assuming gas price stays put. Regardless saving is a saving however
small it maybe. I went thru same thing couple years ago. They just
installed furnace, gave me CO detector and I declined programmable
thermostat. I installed my own wireless thermostat and the CO detector.
I paid 400.00 less.



I don't see gas prices going down...but no matter what, the furnace will
eventually pay for itself.


I already have a CO detector and the humidifier from the old furnace was
fine, so re-used it...but the rest was new:

Furnace
Air cleaner assembly
Two stage thermostat
The old thermostat would have worked but I was told the two stage
would be better . An insignificant expense at any rate.
Hi,
That's good. I noticed 2nd stage comes on very seldom, only when it is
really cold outside. Few days a month on average. Today it is 13C, on
week end it'll be upto 17C.

On 03/05/2015 04:36 PM, Tony Hwang wrote:
philo wrote:



I don't see gas prices going down...but no matter what, the furnace will
eventually pay for itself.


I already have a CO detector and the humidifier from the old furnace was
fine, so re-used it...but the rest was new:

Furnace
Air cleaner assembly
Two stage thermostat
The old thermostat would have worked but I was told the two stage
would be better . An insignificant expense at any rate.
Hi,
That's good. I noticed 2nd stage comes on very seldom, only when it is
really cold outside. Few days a month on average. Today it is 13C, on
week end it'll be upto 17C.




Same here, the 2nd stage does not usually come on...but when it does,
it really cranks out the heat ...and fast!

On 03/05/2015 03:48 PM, trader_4 wrote:
O



There is no way the payback will be 24 years. I figure ten at the very most.

In the cold months the difference will be more than $30 and in Wisconsin
there are more than five cold months a year.

Heck the furnace can be in use as much as 8 or 9 months a year.

I didn't start the math, someone else did. But you did provide the
numbers from what you say is a bill that just arrived. That should be
a *peak* month. Even if the furnace is being used 9 months a year,
it sure isn't being used anywhere near as much in June, July and Aug
as it is in the current bill, so if you're saving $37 this month,
it's going to be a small fraction of that in those warmer months.
Believe what you want, but
numbers are numbers and the other posters math that the furnace pays
itself off in 120 months, later corrected to 180 months, isn't calendar
months, it's months of substantial usage. I used 5 months. Adjust it
to 6, 7 of substantial use. You still wind up with a payback of 25
years.




Well whatever it is...it's a done deal now.


One other thing was that I no longer need to use the chimney for the
furnace and due to all the condensation I would have needed to have a
liner put in. That was one other expense I will not have to deal with.

On 03/05/2015 03:40 PM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
"philo" wrote in message
...
On 03/05/2015 02:55 PM, trader_4 wrote:
In some of the coldest months it runs almost continuously and some years
even until the end of May I still need to run it.


At any rate it would have made no sense for me to stick a lot of money
into my 23 year old furnace and I had to do it no matter what.

That is the way I would look at it, at over 20 years old, it is time for a
replacement instead of a repair job. You may or may not save anything in
the long run,but you will not be throwing money at an on going problem.





Yep.

If I'm still here and get a new furnace in 20 years...even if it has not
100% paid for itself, it will have paid for a huge portion at any
rate...and it was something I would have had to get anyway even had
there been zero payback.

On Thu, 05 Mar 2015 07:25:13 -0500, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 3/5/2015 7:01 AM, philo wrote:
I just got my first gas bill after a full month of use on my new
hi-efficiency furnace.

total gas charges including surcharges $210

Something I can actually afford


Thanks for the good news, hope someone is able
to afford some thing. I signed up with Energetix
a couple years ago, when the door to door guy
promised it would be cheaper. After hearing radio
ads for Noco, I went online and made some calls.
Find out for Dec, I could have spent #103 less
if I had Noco. I put in for switch, but they
can only do that at meter reads, two months from
now. So, please compare energy provider prices
if you have a choice in your area.

-
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.
You are virtually always better off buying at spot price than signing
a fixed price contract for 2 or more years. (long term)

On 05 Mar 2015 18:34:42 GMT, Zak W wrote:

philo wrote in :

On 03/05/2015 10:24 AM, CRNG wrote:
afford

Got my $150 energy rebate check a few days ago

Seems like a good deal. What was the total cost of the new furnace?




After the rebate it was about $3600

It's 96% efficiency. The former one (23 years ago) was 80% efficiency
and about $2900...so it was not too bad.


The contractor did not charge me extra for priority which I needed due
to the old one breaking down in winter...plus there was no charge for
them to do a follow up call a month later to confirm all was working
ok...and to fine tune the venting.


It will pay for itself in 7 or 8 years I'm guessing.


Based on your earlier posts: current bill = $210 which is 85% of you
previous bill of same month last year, so previous bill ~= $247, so saving
approx $37/month; but you wrote that this was a high-heat month, so
gestimating an average saving of $30/month your payback will be
approgimately 120 months. That's pretty good.
120 months of heating - that's 30 years at 4 months of winter per
year - Move north a bit and have 6 months of cold weather and it's
only 20 years.
90% chance the furnace doesn't last until it's paid for itself.

Sorry for the downer -----
Still a good idea to have a good current furnace.

On 3/5/2015 3:52 PM, trader_4 wrote:


Depends on what is meant by wireless. If it's wireless connectivity
to the internet, I see the usage for that. If you're away on a trip,
you can have it set back and when you arrive at the airport, have it
resume so the house is warm/cool when you arrive. Or if you're coming
home early from work one day, you can get it going. Or if you leave
on a trip and aren't sure if you turned it down, you can check and
adjust. Or if you're away
and want to check to make sure the temp is OK, furnace is working.
Or if it'a a vacation rental you own. Guests are arriving at 5PM
this Fri, turn it up, etc. Next one I get will have wifi.


Same idea that Percival had. My wife is home all day so the heat is on
for her. In winter the house is seldom unoccupied for long. Not
something I'd get much use from. But if it works for you . . .

On 03/05/2015 03:37 PM, Ralph Mowery wrote:

Yes, getting a new furnace is not a bad thing, especially if the one you
have craps out or is very old. Just don't expect to get the payback that is
often listed. If that same ammout of money (the cost of the furnace, not
the savings) could be put in a stock fund that gave say 5 % each year you
would be ahead of the game to keep the old one depending on your age. I
almost put in some solar panels after hearing a good talk about them,
However at 66 years old and a 15 year or more payback, I decided against it.
Then got to thinking that after 15 years if they lasted that long Iwould
have to put in a new system.

I bought a house about 10 years ago. The origional heatpump crapped out
after about 2 years, so I installed a new one instead of repairing the old
one as it was getting close to 15 years old or older. Not sure how much if
any it saved on the power bill, but thought at 20 years old it was on the
verge of causing lots of problems. I can't complain anyway as the total
electric bill for just my wife and me goes from about $ 150 to $ 200
depending on the seasons. That is for the well pump, electric dryer and
everything else in a 4 bedroom house.







Yeah , a friend of mine invested $150,000 in solar panels and a wind
generator. I don't know if he will ever see a payback on that.

http://www.tdlelectronics.com/


As to my furnace...whatever savings I get will be nice.
To replace a broken down 23 year old furnace was a no brainier.


Fortunately I have good investments so don't have to worry about an
occasional large house-hold expense...I have a sufficient emergency fund
for that.

wrote:
On 05 Mar 2015 18:34:42 GMT, Zak W wrote:

philo wrote in :

On 03/05/2015 10:24 AM, CRNG wrote:
afford

Got my $150 energy rebate check a few days ago

Seems like a good deal. What was the total cost of the new furnace?




After the rebate it was about $3600

It's 96% efficiency. The former one (23 years ago) was 80% efficiency
and about $2900...so it was not too bad.


The contractor did not charge me extra for priority which I needed due
to the old one breaking down in winter...plus there was no charge for
them to do a follow up call a month later to confirm all was working
ok...and to fine tune the venting.


It will pay for itself in 7 or 8 years I'm guessing.


Based on your earlier posts: current bill = $210 which is 85% of you
previous bill of same month last year, so previous bill ~= $247, so saving
approx $37/month; but you wrote that this was a high-heat month, so
gestimating an average saving of $30/month your payback will be
approgimately 120 months. That's pretty good.
120 months of heating - that's 30 years at 4 months of winter per
year - Move north a bit and have 6 months of cold weather and it's
only 20 years.
90% chance the furnace doesn't last until it's paid for itself.

Sorry for the downer -----
Still a good idea to have a good current furnace.

Hi,
Some of you jealous or what? There are many reasons installing newer
any thing. Furnace blower will run in summer with A/C. New motors are
more efficient than old ones too. Most electric power consumption on
furnace is by the motor. Is it bad conserving energy for one thing?
Life is not entirely based on monetary value as far as I am concerned.

On Thu, 05 Mar 2015 22:15:47 -0700, Tony Hwang
wrote:

wrote:
On 05 Mar 2015 18:34:42 GMT, Zak W wrote:

philo wrote in :

On 03/05/2015 10:24 AM, CRNG wrote:
afford

Got my $150 energy rebate check a few days ago

Seems like a good deal. What was the total cost of the new furnace?




After the rebate it was about $3600

It's 96% efficiency. The former one (23 years ago) was 80% efficiency
and about $2900...so it was not too bad.


The contractor did not charge me extra for priority which I needed due
to the old one breaking down in winter...plus there was no charge for
them to do a follow up call a month later to confirm all was working
ok...and to fine tune the venting.


It will pay for itself in 7 or 8 years I'm guessing.


Based on your earlier posts: current bill = $210 which is 85% of you
previous bill of same month last year, so previous bill ~= $247, so saving
approx $37/month; but you wrote that this was a high-heat month, so
gestimating an average saving of $30/month your payback will be
approgimately 120 months. That's pretty good.
120 months of heating - that's 30 years at 4 months of winter per
year - Move north a bit and have 6 months of cold weather and it's
only 20 years.
90% chance the furnace doesn't last until it's paid for itself.

Sorry for the downer -----
Still a good idea to have a good current furnace.

Hi,
Some of you jealous or what? There are many reasons installing newer
any thing. Furnace blower will run in summer with A/C. New motors are
more efficient than old ones too. Most electric power consumption on
furnace is by the motor. Is it bad conserving energy for one thing?
Life is not entirely based on monetary value as far as I am concerned.
That's what I was saying. It'll never pay for itself in fuel savings
over it's lifespan, but man, the DC blower sure takes a lot less juice
than the old AC blowers did., and the peace of mind- less chance of
being stuck in the cold with a dead furnace- is worth something too.

wrote:
On Thu, 05 Mar 2015 22:15:47 -0700, Tony Hwang
wrote:

wrote:
On 05 Mar 2015 18:34:42 GMT, Zak W wrote:

philo wrote in :

On 03/05/2015 10:24 AM, CRNG wrote:
afford

Got my $150 energy rebate check a few days ago

Seems like a good deal. What was the total cost of the new furnace?




After the rebate it was about $3600

It's 96% efficiency. The former one (23 years ago) was 80% efficiency
and about $2900...so it was not too bad.


The contractor did not charge me extra for priority which I needed due
to the old one breaking down in winter...plus there was no charge for
them to do a follow up call a month later to confirm all was working
ok...and to fine tune the venting.


It will pay for itself in 7 or 8 years I'm guessing.


Based on your earlier posts: current bill = $210 which is 85% of you
previous bill of same month last year, so previous bill ~= $247, so saving
approx $37/month; but you wrote that this was a high-heat month, so
gestimating an average saving of $30/month your payback will be
approgimately 120 months. That's pretty good.
120 months of heating - that's 30 years at 4 months of winter per
year - Move north a bit and have 6 months of cold weather and it's
only 20 years.
90% chance the furnace doesn't last until it's paid for itself.

Sorry for the downer -----
Still a good idea to have a good current furnace.

Hi,
Some of you jealous or what? There are many reasons installing newer
any thing. Furnace blower will run in summer with A/C. New motors are
more efficient than old ones too. Most electric power consumption on
furnace is by the motor. Is it bad conserving energy for one thing?
Life is not entirely based on monetary value as far as I am concerned.
That's what I was saying. It'll never pay for itself in fuel savings
over it's lifespan, but man, the DC blower sure takes a lot less juice
than the old AC blowers did., and the peace of mind- less chance of
being stuck in the cold with a dead furnace- is worth something too.

Hi,
I am seeing more DC motors here and there. Our replaced vacuum power
head has tiny DC motor, light and more powerful, DW has DC motor,
GDO has DC motor, furnace has DC blower motor...

On 03/05/2015 09:48 PM, trader_4 wrote:

Believe what you want, but
numbers are numbers and the other posters math that the furnace pays
itself off in 120 months, later corrected to 180 months, isn't calendar
months, it's months of substantial usage. I used 5 months. Adjust it
to 6, 7 of substantial use. You still wind up with a payback of 25
years.


Exactly...and a draft inducer failure is pretty much guaranteed at year 15 or so and draft inducers ain't cheap.

http://www.grainger.com/product/FASC...-Blower-41H437

Woooops...there go the fuel savings.

On 3/5/2015 3:21 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

What is the advantage of a wireless thermostat? Mine are programmable
and rarely ever touch them. I see T-stats you can change using your
phone, but I've never found the need.

Nice if you're out of town or away for a few days.
I've heard of ex lovers who ran the heat up and
down on the ex's house.

-
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

On 3/5/2015 8:40 PM, wrote:
.
You are virtually always better off buying at spot price than signing
a fixed price contract for 2 or more years. (long term)


You expect fuel prices to come down? Not me.

-
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

On 3/6/2015 4:48 AM, Jack wrote:

Exactly...and a draft inducer failure is pretty much guaranteed at year
15 or so and draft inducers ain't cheap.

http://www.grainger.com/product/FASC...-Blower-41H437

Woooops...there go the fuel savings.

Mine went, about year 9 or 10. Agree, it wasn't
cheap. My parts house could get one in two days
for about $285.

-
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

On 03/05/2015 07:45 PM, wrote:



Based on your earlier posts: current bill = $210 which is 85% of you
previous bill of same month last year, so previous bill ~= $247, so saving
approx $37/month; but you wrote that this was a high-heat month, so
gestimating an average saving of $30/month your payback will be
approgimately 120 months. That's pretty good.
120 months of heating - that's 30 years at 4 months of winter per
year - Move north a bit and have 6 months of cold weather and it's
only 20 years.

Maybe you have not been to Wis. but we do have 6-7 months of
winter....no natter what the calendar says.


Anyway all a moot point as I needed a new furnace no matter what