Had to do an emergency repair of an elbow last week that leads to my hot
kitchen sink anhot d dishwasher. Since I'm a new homeowner I didn't have a
propane torch or spare copper pipe parts or solder (never soldered pipe
before) so I invested in a $6 sharkbite elbow instead. snapped on easy, no
leaks, handles the pressure and the quick on and off that the faucet and
dishwasher demand.

The elbow is under the floor joist, for hot water, in an unfinished
basement. Easy to check up on and easy to re-repair. Curious to people's
opinions on whether this type of repair is considered permanent or not.

On Apr 24, 8:10*pm, "The Henchman" wrote:
Had to do an emergency repair of an elbow last week that leads to my hot
kitchen sink anhot d dishwasher. *Since I'm a new homeowner I didn't have a
propane torch or spare copper pipe parts or solder (never soldered pipe
before) so I invested in a $6 sharkbite elbow instead. *snapped on easy, no
leaks, handles the pressure and the quick on and off that the faucet and
dishwasher demand.

The elbow is under the floor joist, for hot water, in an unfinished
basement. *Easy to check up on and easy to re-repair. *Curious to people's
opinions on whether this type of repair is considered permanent or not.

Product is selling well, no negatives that I am aware of in this NG.
Only quibbles are the price, but the convenience is hard to beat.
Definitely on my list for future emergencies or impossible situations.

Joe

"Joe" wrote
before) so I invested in a $6 sharkbite elbow instead.

Product is selling well, no negatives that I am aware of in this NG.
Only quibbles are the price, but the convenience is hard to beat.
Definitely on my list for future emergencies or impossible situations.

Joe

It is expensive compared to a regular fitting, but for those that cannot
solder, $6 is most likely cheaper than a $1 elbow installed by a plumber.
If the plumber only charged $4 to make a house call, that would be a better
way to go.

On Apr 25, 6:24*am, wrote:
On Sun, 24 Apr 2011 21:10:30 -0400, "The Henchman"
wrote:

Had to do an emergency repair of an elbow last week that leads to my hot
kitchen sink anhot d dishwasher. *Since I'm a new homeowner I didn't have a
propane torch or spare copper pipe parts or solder (never soldered pipe
before) so I invested in a $6 sharkbite elbow instead. *snapped on easy, no
leaks, handles the pressure and the quick on and off that the faucet and
dishwasher demand.

The elbow is under the floor joist, for hot water, in an unfinished
basement. *Easy to check up on and easy to re-repair. *Curious to people's
opinions on whether this type of repair is considered permanent or not.

I had a rental house with copper pipes but someone had installed some
PEX pipe for the bathtub. *They used these sharkbite fittings one all
the PEX. *Some of them were inside the bathroom wall. *The elbow up at
the shower head pipe, where it comes out of the wall was one of them.
Apparently the moving of the shower head caused it to come loose, and
I could see the sleeve which is compressed to install the pipe was
hitting a 2x4 which the pipe was strapped to. *I found that whenever
someone took a shower there was water coming out of the wall and into
the basement. *I had to rip out the wall to find the problem. *

I suspect because this pipe was not under constant pressure, plus the
movement of that shower head when people adjust it, not to mention the
prior owners or tenants may have used that pipe to hang a soap &
shampoo rack (whatever those things are called), but the pipe was not
in the fitting, and it was a major leak inside the wall, which ruined
the wallboard, and caused mold and even some rotting of the floor. *

From this, I personally would not use them as a permanent repair.
They're great for a quickie fix, but I just dont trust them. *If this
was on a pipe where there was always pressure, it could have been a
real mess.

Soldering copper pipe (sweating) is not all that difficult. *Get
yourself a DIY home repair book, or search the web for sweating copper
pipe.

I replaced that pipe with copper, I intended to replace all of them
and get rid of all that PEX, but I sold the house. *(Not because of
the pipes, because of asshole tenants).

PEX expands and contracts with changes in water temperature a lot more
than copper. I installed an eight or nine foot run of PEX going to a
washing machine that runs along above the machines and countertop and
was installed in a straight line mounted to a board. The hot water
line expands ~3/8" when the machine fills with hot water.

If allowance isn't made for that movement then it's reasonable to
expect problems. Anytime someone installs something and doesn't allow
for its normal movement it's reasonable to expect problems.

R

I just installed a couple of elbows and straight connectors with PEX for a
newly positioned sillcock (outdoor faucet). The old faucet was mounted on
the side of the house with the driveway. That was a stupid idea which was
proven when the wife hit it driving out and broke the copper pipe. I cut the
copper pipe down to the shut off valve and connected the PEX with the elbow
Sharkbite, rerouting the PEX to the front of the house above the drop
ceiling in the basement. Being it's only cold water, the expansion, if any,
will be minimal. So far, it's doing well and if any leaks prevail, I'll see
wet spots on a ceiling tile.

"SBH" wrote in message
...
I just installed a couple of elbows and straight connectors with PEX for a
newly positioned sillcock (outdoor faucet). The old faucet was mounted on
the side of the house with the driveway. That was a stupid idea which was
proven when the wife hit it driving out and broke the copper pipe. I cut
the copper pipe down to the shut off valve and connected the PEX with the
elbow Sharkbite, rerouting the PEX to the front of the house above the drop
ceiling in the basement. Being it's only cold water, the expansion, if any,
will be minimal. So far, it's doing well and if any leaks prevail, I'll see
wet spots on a ceiling tile.
Oops...what I also wanted to add was a basic test I did prior to the
install. I put both a piece of copper and PEX into the end of the Sharkbites
and tried to pull. Not to brag, but I'm no weakling and I couldn't pull
these suckers out without the tool to remove them. I know it's not under
water pressure, but it made me have confidence they won't simply slide out
easily.

On Mon, 25 Apr 2011 15:02:56 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Sun, 24 Apr 2011 21:10:30 -0400, "The Henchman"
wrote:

The elbow is under the floor joist, for hot water, in an unfinished
basement. Easy to check up on and easy to re-repair. Curious to people's
opinions on whether this type of repair is considered permanent or not.

I've yet to use a SB fitting. They are on my options list.

In your case, you can observe and monitor the fitting from the
basement. I'd not worry and consider it permanent -- until it fails.
I'm hoping they are permanent - one is under 6 inches of concrete,
and another above and behind furnace duct and finished basement wall
and ceiling.

On Apr 25, 7:54*pm, "SBH" wrote:
"SBH" wrote in message

I just installed a couple of elbows and straight connectors with PEX for a
newly positioned sillcock (outdoor faucet). The old faucet was mounted on
the side of the house with the driveway. That was a stupid idea which was
proven when the wife hit it driving out and broke the copper pipe. I cut
the copper pipe down to the shut off valve and connected the PEX with the
elbow Sharkbite, rerouting the PEX to the front of the house above the drop
ceiling in the basement. Being it's only cold water, the expansion, if any,
will be minimal. So far, it's doing well and if any leaks prevail, I'll see
wet spots on a ceiling tile.

Oops...what I also wanted to add was a basic test I did prior to the
install. I put both a piece of copper and PEX into the end of the Sharkbites
and tried to pull. Not to brag, but I'm no weakling and I couldn't pull
these suckers out without the tool to remove them. I know it's not under
water pressure, but it made me have confidence they won't simply slide out
easily.

I remember reading somewhere that the Sharkbite fittings can take
something like 1000 pounds in tension. If you could pull one out, I
would have started this reply with 'Sir.'

R

"The Henchman" wrote in message
...
Had to do an emergency repair of an elbow last week that leads to my hot
kitchen sink anhot d dishwasher. Since I'm a new homeowner I didn't have
a propane torch or spare copper pipe parts or solder (never soldered pipe
before) so I invested in a $6 sharkbite elbow instead. snapped on easy,
no leaks, handles the pressure and the quick on and off that the faucet
and dishwasher demand.

The elbow is under the floor joist, for hot water, in an unfinished
basement. Easy to check up on and easy to re-repair. Curious to people's
opinions on whether this type of repair is considered permanent or not.

Like you, I used them for the first time ever this year. I only used them
in exposed locations and will admit my error if it turns out they don't work
long term.

Colbyt

"The Henchman" wrote in message
...
Had to do an emergency repair of an elbow last week that leads to my hot
kitchen sink anhot d dishwasher. Since I'm a new homeowner I didn't have
a propane torch or spare copper pipe parts or solder (never soldered pipe
before) so I invested in a $6 sharkbite elbow instead. snapped on easy,
no leaks, handles the pressure and the quick on and off that the faucet
and dishwasher demand.

The elbow is under the floor joist, for hot water, in an unfinished
basement. Easy to check up on and easy to re-repair. Curious to people's
opinions on whether this type of repair is considered permanent or not.

The last one I put on was three years ago at my cabin. Haven't made it up
there yet because of the snow, but so far so good. It was much easier than
cutting out the burst pipe under the frame of a wood cabin, then torch
welding a new piece in. I like them, although they may not be the best
choice in every situation.

Steve

"Ed Pawlowski" wrote in message
...

"Joe" wrote
before) so I invested in a $6 sharkbite elbow instead.

Product is selling well, no negatives that I am aware of in this NG.
Only quibbles are the price, but the convenience is hard to beat.
Definitely on my list for future emergencies or impossible situations.

Joe

It is expensive compared to a regular fitting, but for those that cannot
solder, $6 is most likely cheaper than a $1 elbow installed by a plumber.
If the plumber only charged $4 to make a house call, that would be a
better way to go.

I think the safety and convenience factor of replacing them in tight spots
is worth the few extra bucks. It sure was for the one I replaced that was
under a cabin. It was far less labor intensive than I thought it would be.
In stud walls and places where there is a fire hazard, like under a cabin,
there's no comparison.

Steve

"SBH" wrote in message
news

"SBH" wrote in message
...
I just installed a couple of elbows and straight connectors with PEX for a
newly positioned sillcock (outdoor faucet). The old faucet was mounted on
the side of the house with the driveway. That was a stupid idea which was
proven when the wife hit it driving out and broke the copper pipe. I cut
the copper pipe down to the shut off valve and connected the PEX with the
elbow Sharkbite, rerouting the PEX to the front of the house above the
drop ceiling in the basement. Being it's only cold water, the expansion,
if any, will be minimal. So far, it's doing well and if any leaks prevail,
I'll see wet spots on a ceiling tile.
Oops...what I also wanted to add was a basic test I did prior to the
install. I put both a piece of copper and PEX into the end of the
Sharkbites and tried to pull. Not to brag, but I'm no weakling and I
couldn't pull these suckers out without the tool to remove them. I know
it's not under water pressure, but it made me have confidence they won't
simply slide out easily.

The geek at HD had SWMBO put together and take apart a joint using the
little wrench thingus. She said it seemed a little flimsy. So he asked her
to put it back together and pull it apart. She was convinced.

Steve

On Apr 26, 12:30*am, "Steve B" wrote:

I think the safety and convenience factor of replacing them in tight spots
is worth the few extra bucks. *It sure was for the one I replaced that was
under a cabin. *It was far less labor intensive than I thought it would be.
In stud walls and places where there is a fire hazard, like under a cabin,
there's no comparison.

They're also great in the repair fittings box since you can use them
with copper, PVC, and PEX. Very versatile. Another nifty use is for
temp runs, like when you're trying to get the water back on at the end
of the day and you know you're going to have to undo some stuff the
next day. Makes it trivial.

R

If the little shark teeth corrode and the fitting comes
lose, it could mean a lot of water damage. I don't trust
them, at this point. I'm expecting about ten years from now,
a recall like the grey tubing that sprung leaks.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Colbyt" wrote in message
m...

Like you, I used them for the first time ever this year. I
only used them
in exposed locations and will admit my error if it turns out
they don't work
long term.

Colbyt

At least, not until the metal tips corrode.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"SBH" wrote in message
news
Oops...what I also wanted to add was a basic test I did
prior to the
install. I put both a piece of copper and PEX into the end
of the Sharkbites
and tried to pull. Not to brag, but I'm no weakling and I
couldn't pull
these suckers out without the tool to remove them. I know
it's not under
water pressure, but it made me have confidence they won't
simply slide out
easily.

That sounds like the one specialized moment, I'd be tempted
to try one.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Steve B" wrote in message
.. .

I think the safety and convenience factor of replacing them
in tight spots
is worth the few extra bucks. It sure was for the one I
replaced that was
under a cabin. It was far less labor intensive than I
thought it would be.
In stud walls and places where there is a fire hazard, like
under a cabin,
there's no comparison.

Steve

In some parts of the world, people steal copper pipe. One
fellow I used to know, some one, or more than one, stole the
copper pipe out of their cellar while the family was
sleeping upstairs. In that case, Pex or CPVC has the
advantage of being there in the morning. Galvanized is good,
but tends to rust and close up, over the years. In my
parents last house, they had to replace all the galvanized.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


wrote in message
...

While PEX seems to be the new fad, I personally would not
use it in my
home, and particularly not with sharkbite fittings. They
clain PEX
will last many years, but like all plastics, it will degrade
with time
and fail. 10 or 20 years from now, they will probably ban
the stuff
after many failures due to age. Besides that. I feel that
plumbing
should be SOLID PIPE, not a hose, which is what PEX is.
Maybe I'm old
fashioned, but I'll stick with rigid pipe. Copper is
preferred, but
even galvanized steel has always been reliable, and is
sturdy. Solid
pipe looks better too. PEX and any other plastic pipes like
CPVC sag
and look cheap. However I have found CPVC to be pretty
reliable as
long as enough hangers are used to keep it from sagging.

On Apr 26, 7:15*am, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

If the little shark teeth corrode and the fitting comes
lose, it could mean a lot of water damage. I don't trust
them, at this point. I'm expecting about ten years from now,
a recall like the grey tubing that sprung leaks.

Those little shark teeth are stainless. Have you ever picked up one
of their fittings and examined it? Technically there's a lot more
brass in the things than there needs to be - they could have easily
cut down on the amount of brass, and cut a much bigger cost savings
corner. But they didn't.

Pex fittings such as Zurn makes don't have stainless teeth - the whole
thing is plastic, and they've been used in Europe for decades. I
understand you're an old dog and a new trick _is_ something to be wary
of, but in this instance you're just being an old dog.

R

On Apr 26, 2:52*am, wrote:

While PEX seems to be the new fad, I personally would not use it in my
home, and particularly not with sharkbite fittings. *They clain PEX
will last many years, but like all plastics, it will degrade with time
and fail. *10 or 20 years from now, they will probably ban the stuff
after many failures due to age. *Besides that. I feel that plumbing
should be SOLID PIPE, not a hose, which is what PEX is. *

I feel all roofs should be slate or tile.

Maybe I'm old
fashioned, but I'll stick with rigid pipe. *Copper is preferred, but
even galvanized steel has always been reliable, and is sturdy. *Solid
pipe looks better too. *PEX and any other plastic pipes like CPVC sag
and look cheap. *However I have found CPVC to be pretty reliable as
long as enough hangers are used to keep it from sagging. *

Looks better? Huh? You're choosing what is a purely functional item
based on aesthetics? The only place you see exposed PEX is in a
basement, and if there's exposed PEX in a basement there's probably a
lot of other things that offend your refined sensibilities.

R

On Apr 24, 9:10*pm, "The Henchman" wrote:
Had to do an emergency repair of an elbow last week that leads to my hot
kitchen sink anhot d dishwasher. *Since I'm a new homeowner I didn't have a
propane torch or spare copper pipe parts or solder (never soldered pipe
before) so I invested in a $6 sharkbite elbow instead. *snapped on easy, no
leaks, handles the pressure and the quick on and off that the faucet and
dishwasher demand.

The elbow is under the floor joist, for hot water, in an unfinished
basement. *Easy to check up on and easy to re-repair. *Curious to people's
opinions on whether this type of repair is considered permanent or not.

I've used SharlBites twice and have no complaints so far.

One time I turned off the water, cut a pipe, capped it and turned the
water back on before the commercial was over. I didn't miss a second
of the football game and my wife, who was in the kitchen making dinner
at the time, never even knew that I had turned the water off.

Another time I used a SharkBite Tee to tap into a copper pipe at the
front of the house (which was at street pressure) then ran a length of
PEX across the basement ceiling and used a SharkBite straight
connector to connect the PEX to the copper pipe at the backyard hose
spigot. Less than an hour's work to get street pressure to the
backyard hose.

Both of these connections were made in the tight quarters near the
basement ceiling above storage cabinets - not a location where I would
have wanted to sweat copper.

One of the many advantages of the SharkBites is their ability to
swivel even after installation. With copper, you need to "aim" each
fitting to get the pipe to run in the direction you need. With
SharkBites, you just pop them on and swivel them in any direction you
want.

Costly yes, but damn convenient. In my case, I feel the cost was
justified based solely on the fact that I didn't have to sweat
fittings in locations where access was severely limited.

On Apr 26, 12:33*am, "Steve B" wrote:
"SBH" wrote in message

news










"SBH" wrote in message
.. .
I just installed a couple of elbows and straight connectors with PEX for a
newly positioned sillcock (outdoor faucet). The old faucet was mounted on
the side of the house with the driveway. That was a stupid idea which was
proven when the wife hit it driving out and broke the copper pipe. I cut
the copper pipe down to the shut off valve and connected the PEX with the
elbow Sharkbite, rerouting the PEX to the front of the house above the
drop ceiling in the basement. Being it's only cold water, the expansion,
if any, will be minimal. So far, it's doing well and if any leaks prevail,
I'll see wet spots on a ceiling tile.
Oops...what I also wanted to add was a basic test I did prior to the
install. I put both a piece of copper and PEX into the end of the
Sharkbites and tried to pull. Not to brag, but I'm no weakling and I
couldn't pull these suckers out without the tool to remove them. I know
it's not under water pressure, but it made me have confidence they won't
simply slide out easily.

The geek at HD had SWMBO put together and take apart a joint using the
little wrench thingus. *She said it seemed a little flimsy. *So he asked her
to put it back together and pull it apart. *She was convinced.

Steve

I didnt care much for the tool, not saying it is bad but I have
arthritis in my hands and need something a little easier to hang on to
so I made my own oversized one cut from 1/8 inch aluminum. Mine has a
slot for 1/2" on one end and 3/4" on the other. Also a piece of cake
to use the end of a piece of pipe a template to DIY it.
Mine is about 7 inches long and I dont tend to lose tools like this
while I will quickly misplace the little doer they sell at HD. Would
really like something designed more like an open end wrench. Hmmm that
might work in a pinch.


Jimmie

On Tue, 26 Apr 2011 07:21:16 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

In some parts of the world, people steal copper pipe. One
fellow I used to know, some one, or more than one, stole the
copper pipe out of their cellar while the family was
sleeping upstairs. In that case, Pex or CPVC has the
advantage of being there in the morning. Galvanized is good,
but tends to rust and close up, over the years. In my
parents last house, they had to replace all the galvanized.
If I bought a house with galvanized pipe I'd plan on replacing it
ALL as soon as possible

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
...
On Apr 24, 9:10 pm, "The Henchman" wrote:
Had to do an emergency repair of an elbow last week that leads to my hot
kitchen sink anhot d dishwasher. Since I'm a new homeowner I didn't have a
propane torch or spare copper pipe parts or solder (never soldered pipe
before) so I invested in a $6 sharkbite elbow instead. snapped on easy, no
leaks, handles the pressure and the quick on and off that the faucet and
dishwasher demand.

The elbow is under the floor joist, for hot water, in an unfinished
basement. Easy to check up on and easy to re-repair. Curious to people's
opinions on whether this type of repair is considered permanent or not.

I've used SharlBites twice and have no complaints so far.

One time I turned off the water, cut a pipe, capped it and turned the
water back on before the commercial was over. I didn't miss a second
of the football game and my wife, who was in the kitchen making dinner
at the time, never even knew that I had turned the water off.

Another time I used a SharkBite Tee to tap into a copper pipe at the
front of the house (which was at street pressure) then ran a length of
PEX across the basement ceiling and used a SharkBite straight
connector to connect the PEX to the copper pipe at the backyard hose
spigot. Less than an hour's work to get street pressure to the
backyard hose.

Both of these connections were made in the tight quarters near the
basement ceiling above storage cabinets - not a location where I would
have wanted to sweat copper.

One of the many advantages of the SharkBites is their ability to
swivel even after installation. With copper, you need to "aim" each
fitting to get the pipe to run in the direction you need. With
SharkBites, you just pop them on and swivel them in any direction you
want.

Costly yes, but damn convenient. In my case, I feel the cost was
justified based solely on the fact that I didn't have to sweat
fittings in locations where access was severely limited.

reply:

what he said ................

wrote

And how the hell can someone sleep while someone is hacking away the
pipes in the cellar? That's retarded.

I bet I could get every exposed copper pipe out of your house while you are
awake in the next room. Tubing cutter is virtually silent.

On Tue, 26 Apr 2011 17:43:32 -0700, "Steve B"
wrote:


"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
...
On Apr 24, 9:10 pm, "The Henchman" wrote:
Had to do an emergency repair of an elbow last week that leads to my hot
kitchen sink anhot d dishwasher. Since I'm a new homeowner I didn't have a
propane torch or spare copper pipe parts or solder (never soldered pipe
before) so I invested in a $6 sharkbite elbow instead. snapped on easy, no
leaks, handles the pressure and the quick on and off that the faucet and
dishwasher demand.

The elbow is under the floor joist, for hot water, in an unfinished
basement. Easy to check up on and easy to re-repair. Curious to people's
opinions on whether this type of repair is considered permanent or not.

I've used SharlBites twice and have no complaints so far.

One time I turned off the water, cut a pipe, capped it and turned the
water back on before the commercial was over. I didn't miss a second
of the football game and my wife, who was in the kitchen making dinner
at the time, never even knew that I had turned the water off.

Another time I used a SharkBite Tee to tap into a copper pipe at the
front of the house (which was at street pressure) then ran a length of
PEX across the basement ceiling and used a SharkBite straight
connector to connect the PEX to the copper pipe at the backyard hose
spigot. Less than an hour's work to get street pressure to the
backyard hose.

Both of these connections were made in the tight quarters near the
basement ceiling above storage cabinets - not a location where I would
have wanted to sweat copper.

One of the many advantages of the SharkBites is their ability to
swivel even after installation. With copper, you need to "aim" each
fitting to get the pipe to run in the direction you need. With
SharkBites, you just pop them on and swivel them in any direction you
want.

Costly yes, but damn convenient. In my case, I feel the cost was
justified based solely on the fact that I didn't have to sweat
fittings in locations where access was severely limited.

reply:

what he said ................



Same situation for me. Putting in a bathroom in daughter's basement, I
needed to get the water to the toilet - I had the concrete cut out for
the drain but didn't want to remove any more concrete than necessary,
so I drilled the concrete and put a plastic pipe in as a "sleave" and
the copper pipe inside that -kinda hard to solder down under the
concrete, but the shark-bite worked beautifully. - packed with sand
after. Then I needed to bring water down the end wall for the basin -
but the furnace duct was 2 inches from the wall, and against the
joists - and was to be boxed in with drywall. Virtually impossible to
get to with torch to solder it, so again a shark-bite was used.

At $8+ each, vs $0.37 for a solder LB, I thought long and hard about
it (I'm a cheap guy) - but there will be no question if I ever get
into that kind of situation again.

On Tue, 26 Apr 2011 20:19:53 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 26 Apr 2011 07:21:16 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

In some parts of the world, people steal copper pipe. One
fellow I used to know, some one, or more than one, stole the
copper pipe out of their cellar while the family was
sleeping upstairs. In that case, Pex or CPVC has the
advantage of being there in the morning. Galvanized is good,
but tends to rust and close up, over the years. In my
parents last house, they had to replace all the galvanized.
If I bought a house with galvanized pipe I'd plan on replacing it
ALL as soon as possible

That make no sense unless you know the pipes need replacing, or
galvanized commonly fails in your area due to water chemistry.
Scaling up and corrosion depends on the water where you live.
Same with copper pinholing and corrosion.
I don't want to beat a dead horse, but here near Chicago where we use
Lake Michigan water, galvanized works well.
My last house has 90 year old galvanized in the wall vertical runs and
never leaked. Do you have a 90 year old copper or PEX example?
I replaced the basement horizonal runs due to reduced hot water flow.
That pipe was 60 years old, and the mineral scale clogging was mostly
around the water heater joints.
There was no serious corrosion, and nothing ever leaked.
My current house has 50 year old galvanized, and no leaks.
It seems the hot water flow is a bit low.
I could just replace the fittings and short runs around the water
heater to fix that, but if it wouldn't be much more work to replace
it all from the service entrance up to the verticals.
If the verticals look bad I would just open the 2 plumbing walls and
replace them too.
The more I read of copper pinholing, the less suitable it seems.
Despite what I read here, wider reading has led me to the conclusion
not to replace with copper when I do it, but to use new galvanized.
If PEX meets code here, I'd use it before copper.
But I can't see a reason to use PEX instead of galvanized here.
I don't know why copper even got started here.
Plumber chic?
Anyway, pipe selection is like real estate.
Location, location, location.

--Vic

I can't remember, but they likely got a dog shortly after
that. Not sure if this family has ever owned a gun. If Jesus
was to hate any family, these would be on the list some
where.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


wrote in message
...
On Tue, 26 Apr 2011 07:21:16 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

In some parts of the world, people steal copper pipe. One
fellow I used to know, some one, or more than one, stole
the
copper pipe out of their cellar while the family was
sleeping upstairs. In that case, Pex or CPVC has the


That's why man invented the GUN !!!!!!

And how the hell can someone sleep while someone is hacking
away the
pipes in the cellar? That's retarded.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

Jesus HATES you (and everyone else).

I'm not sure how many people were there, but they must have
been deep sleepers. It was a couple decades ago, and I'm no
longer in contact with these folks.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Ed Pawlowski" wrote in message
...

wrote

And how the hell can someone sleep while someone is
hacking away the
pipes in the cellar? That's retarded.

I bet I could get every exposed copper pipe out of your
house while you are
awake in the next room. Tubing cutter is virtually silent.

I'll admit, I've not seen one of these shark bite things in
person. And, yes, I'm an old dog. Grrr.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"RicodJour" wrote in message
...
On Apr 26, 7:15 am, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

If the little shark teeth corrode and the fitting comes
lose, it could mean a lot of water damage. I don't trust
them, at this point. I'm expecting about ten years from
now,
a recall like the grey tubing that sprung leaks.

Those little shark teeth are stainless. Have you ever
picked up one
of their fittings and examined it? Technically there's a
lot more
brass in the things than there needs to be - they could have
easily
cut down on the amount of brass, and cut a much bigger cost
savings
corner. But they didn't.

Pex fittings such as Zurn makes don't have stainless teeth -
the whole
thing is plastic, and they've been used in Europe for
decades. I
understand you're an old dog and a new trick _is_ something
to be wary
of, but in this instance you're just being an old dog.

R

On Apr 27, 8:14*am, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:
I'll admit, I've not seen one of these shark bite things in
person. And, yes, I'm an old dog. Grrr.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
*www.lds.org
.

"RicodJour" wrote in message

...
On Apr 26, 7:15 am, "Stormin Mormon"

wrote:

If the little shark teeth corrode and the fitting comes
lose, it could mean a lot of water damage. I don't trust
them, at this point. I'm expecting about ten years from
now,
a recall like the grey tubing that sprung leaks.

Those little shark teeth are stainless. *Have you ever
picked up one
of their fittings and examined it? *Technically there's a
lot more
brass in the things than there needs to be - they could have
easily
cut down on the amount of brass, and cut a much bigger cost
savings
corner. *But they didn't.

Pex fittings such as Zurn makes don't have stainless teeth -
the whole
thing is plastic, and they've been used in Europe for
decades. *I
understand you're an old dog and a new trick _is_ something
to be wary
of, but in this instance you're just being an old dog. *

R

Our Home Depot has a display where you can play with the SharkBites.
Put them together, take them apart, PEX to Copper, etc.

When I bought the ones I used, I didn't bother spending the $3 (?) on
the disassembly tool. All you really need is anything that will push
the release ring evenly back into the fitting.

I don't recall what I used, but I took one apart at home just as a
test and had no problem using some tool or object that was just laying
around the shop.

Declines to spend three dollars on a tool that might save a
plumbing job, or a six dollar fitting? Now, THAT is an old
dog. Well done!

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
...

Our Home Depot has a display where you can play with the
SharkBites.
Put them together, take them apart, PEX to Copper, etc.

When I bought the ones I used, I didn't bother spending the
$3 (?) on
the disassembly tool. All you really need is anything that
will push
the release ring evenly back into the fitting.

I don't recall what I used, but I took one apart at home
just as a
test and had no problem using some tool or object that was
just laying
around the shop.

On Apr 27, 8:59*am, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:
Declines to spend three dollars on a tool that might save a
plumbing job, or a six dollar fitting? Now, THAT is an old
dog. Well done!

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
*www.lds.org
.

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message

...

Our Home Depot has a display where you can play with the
SharkBites.
Put them together, take them apart, PEX to Copper, etc.

When I bought the ones I used, I didn't bother spending the
$3 (?) on
the disassembly tool. All you really need is anything that
will push
the release ring evenly back into the fitting.

I don't recall what I used, but I took one apart at home
just as a
test and had no problem using some tool or object that was
just laying
around the shop.

I can actually see not buying one. It takes all of 5 minutes to make.
I can imagine SBs used in some tight locations may be near impossible
to disconnect without a specially fabricated tool.

Jimmie

On Apr 26, 6:31*pm, wrote:
On Tue, 26 Apr 2011, RicodJour wrote:
On Apr 26, 2:52*am, wrote:

While PEX seems to be the new fad, I personally would not use it in my
home, and particularly not with sharkbite fittings. *They clain PEX
will last many years, but like all plastics, it will degrade with time
and fail. *10 or 20 years from now, they will probably ban the stuff
after many failures due to age. *Besides that. I feel that plumbing
should be SOLID PIPE, not a hose, which is what PEX is. *

I feel all roofs should be slate or tile.

What did you do, lose the topic? *This is about PLUMBING, not
roofs....

You wrote, "I feel that plumbing should be SOLID PIPE..."
I wrote, "I feel all roofs should be slate or tile."

I will walk you though it.
SOLID PIPE is a stupid term, because pipe is hollow.
SOLID PIPE is a stupid term as all pipe is solid - that is, there is
no such thing as lattice-work plumbing pipe.
SOLID PIPE is stupid because typing in all caps is for nimrods.
Solid pipe...assuming you mean something like copper or galvanized, is
expensive to install and quite durable - just like a slate roof.

Your feelings are ever so important to me, but when it comes right
down to it I, like most people, will be making my decision based on a
risk vs. reward analysis. Sad to say your feelings don't enter into
it but dollars do. Sorry.

Maybe I'm old
fashioned, but I'll stick with rigid pipe. *Copper is preferred, but
even galvanized steel has always been reliable, and is sturdy. *Solid
pipe looks better too. *PEX and any other plastic pipes like CPVC sag
and look cheap. *However I have found CPVC to be pretty reliable as
long as enough hangers are used to keep it from sagging. *

Looks better? *Huh? *You're choosing what is a purely functional item
based on aesthetics? *The only place you see exposed PEX is in a
basement, and if there's exposed PEX in a basement there's probably a
lot of other things that offend your refined sensibilities.

If you had read what I wrote, which had nothing to do with roofs, I
said that plastic pipe is not durable and I would not use it for that
reason. *I followed up with the aesthetics, which are not nearly as
important.

LEARN HOW TO READ ....

Learn to think.
Thank you for finally seeing that the aesthetics have nothing at all
to do with choosing plumbing pipe material.

How durable is copper when the pipes freeze? PEX expands and when it
thaws out, the PEX will shrink back down to its original size without
damage. There are tradeoffs in everything. Yours is trading off
logic so you can hang on to your opinion.

It's highly entertaining that you believe CPVC (plastic) to be "pretty
reliable" but another plastic, which you have obviously never used or
even read up on, you believe to be crap. Willful ignorance is a
pretty much bulletproof armor, eh?

R

"Ed Pawlowski" wrote in message
...

wrote

And how the hell can someone sleep while someone is hacking away the
pipes in the cellar? That's retarded.

I bet I could get every exposed copper pipe out of your house while you
are awake in the next room. Tubing cutter is virtually silent.

JW is a SNERT. (Snot Nosed Egotistical Rude Teen) Don't pay him any
attention.

He poses spew, and seriously doubt he's ever done any home repairs. His
vocabulary is adolescent, and his responses do not address any context being
discussed.

HTH

Steve

Heart surgery pending?
www.cabgbypasssurgery.com
Heart Surgery Survival Guide

wrote in message
...
On Tue, 26 Apr 2011 17:43:32 -0700, "Steve B"
wrote:


"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
...
On Apr 24, 9:10 pm, "The Henchman" wrote:
Had to do an emergency repair of an elbow last week that leads to my hot
kitchen sink anhot d dishwasher. Since I'm a new homeowner I didn't have
a
propane torch or spare copper pipe parts or solder (never soldered pipe
before) so I invested in a $6 sharkbite elbow instead. snapped on easy,
no
leaks, handles the pressure and the quick on and off that the faucet and
dishwasher demand.

The elbow is under the floor joist, for hot water, in an unfinished
basement. Easy to check up on and easy to re-repair. Curious to people's
opinions on whether this type of repair is considered permanent or not.

I've used SharlBites twice and have no complaints so far.

One time I turned off the water, cut a pipe, capped it and turned the
water back on before the commercial was over. I didn't miss a second
of the football game and my wife, who was in the kitchen making dinner
at the time, never even knew that I had turned the water off.

Another time I used a SharkBite Tee to tap into a copper pipe at the
front of the house (which was at street pressure) then ran a length of
PEX across the basement ceiling and used a SharkBite straight
connector to connect the PEX to the copper pipe at the backyard hose
spigot. Less than an hour's work to get street pressure to the
backyard hose.

Both of these connections were made in the tight quarters near the
basement ceiling above storage cabinets - not a location where I would
have wanted to sweat copper.

One of the many advantages of the SharkBites is their ability to
swivel even after installation. With copper, you need to "aim" each
fitting to get the pipe to run in the direction you need. With
SharkBites, you just pop them on and swivel them in any direction you
want.

Costly yes, but damn convenient. In my case, I feel the cost was
justified based solely on the fact that I didn't have to sweat
fittings in locations where access was severely limited.

reply:

what he said ................



Same situation for me. Putting in a bathroom in daughter's basement, I
needed to get the water to the toilet - I had the concrete cut out for
the drain but didn't want to remove any more concrete than necessary,
so I drilled the concrete and put a plastic pipe in as a "sleave" and
the copper pipe inside that -kinda hard to solder down under the
concrete, but the shark-bite worked beautifully. - packed with sand
after. Then I needed to bring water down the end wall for the basin -
but the furnace duct was 2 inches from the wall, and against the
joists - and was to be boxed in with drywall. Virtually impossible to
get to with torch to solder it, so again a shark-bite was used.

At $8+ each, vs $0.37 for a solder LB, I thought long and hard about
it (I'm a cheap guy) - but there will be no question if I ever get
into that kind of situation again.

This stuff is like Velcro, Super Glue, and other things that we didn't have
in our childhood, but are common now. Now that they are common as leaves,
we wonder how we ever lived without them, and recall all the repair
nightmares that would have gone a lot better with such simple fixits. I'll
still sweat pipes during new construction, and in places that are not tight
or fire sensitive. But for a slam dunk git'r'done and go watch the game, or
rescue SWMBO from an emergency water situation, they are the best. For all
the time and risk saved, they are well worth the extra bucks, IMHO.

Steve

Heart surgery pending?
www.cabgbypasssurgery.com
Heart Surgery Survival Guide

Steve B wrote the following:
"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
...
On Apr 24, 9:10 pm, "The Henchman" wrote:

Had to do an emergency repair of an elbow last week that leads to my hot
kitchen sink anhot d dishwasher. Since I'm a new homeowner I didn't have a
propane torch or spare copper pipe parts or solder (never soldered pipe
before) so I invested in a $6 sharkbite elbow instead. snapped on easy, no
leaks, handles the pressure and the quick on and off that the faucet and
dishwasher demand.

The elbow is under the floor joist, for hot water, in an unfinished
basement. Easy to check up on and easy to re-repair. Curious to people's
opinions on whether this type of repair is considered permanent or not.


I've used SharlBites twice and have no complaints so far.

One time I turned off the water, cut a pipe, capped it and turned the
water back on before the commercial was over. I didn't miss a second
of the football game and my wife, who was in the kitchen making dinner
at the time, never even knew that I had turned the water off.

Another time I used a SharkBite Tee to tap into a copper pipe at the
front of the house (which was at street pressure) then ran a length of
PEX across the basement ceiling and used a SharkBite straight
connector to connect the PEX to the copper pipe at the backyard hose
spigot. Less than an hour's work to get street pressure to the
backyard hose.

Both of these connections were made in the tight quarters near the
basement ceiling above storage cabinets - not a location where I would
have wanted to sweat copper.

One of the many advantages of the SharkBites is their ability to
swivel even after installation. With copper, you need to "aim" each
fitting to get the pipe to run in the direction you need. With
SharkBites, you just pop them on and swivel them in any direction you
want.

Costly yes, but damn convenient. In my case, I feel the cost was
justified based solely on the fact that I didn't have to sweat
fittings in locations where access was severely limited.


....and you didn't burn the house down.

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

On Apr 27, 1:12*pm, "Steve B" wrote:
wrote in message

...





On Tue, 26 Apr 2011 17:43:32 -0700, "Steve B"
wrote:

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
....
On Apr 24, 9:10 pm, "The Henchman" wrote:
Had to do an emergency repair of an elbow last week that leads to my hot
kitchen sink anhot d dishwasher. Since I'm a new homeowner I didn't have
a
propane torch or spare copper pipe parts or solder (never soldered pipe
before) so I invested in a $6 sharkbite elbow instead. snapped on easy,
no
leaks, handles the pressure and the quick on and off that the faucet and
dishwasher demand.

The elbow is under the floor joist, for hot water, in an unfinished
basement. Easy to check up on and easy to re-repair. Curious to people's
opinions on whether this type of repair is considered permanent or not.

On Apr 27, 2:13*pm, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Apr 27, 1:12*pm, "Steve B" wrote:









wrote in message

.. .

On Tue, 26 Apr 2011 17:43:32 -0700, "Steve B"
wrote:

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
...
On Apr 24, 9:10 pm, "The Henchman" wrote:
Had to do an emergency repair of an elbow last week that leads to my hot
kitchen sink anhot d dishwasher. Since I'm a new homeowner I didn't have
a
propane torch or spare copper pipe parts or solder (never soldered pipe
before) so I invested in a $6 sharkbite elbow instead. snapped on easy,
no
leaks, handles the pressure and the quick on and off that the faucet and
dishwasher demand.

The elbow is under the floor joist, for hot water, in an unfinished
basement. Easy to check up on and easy to re-repair. Curious to people's
opinions on whether this type of repair is considered permanent or not.

I've used SharlBites twice and have no complaints so far.

One time I turned off the water, cut a pipe, capped it and turned the
water back on before the commercial was over. I didn't miss a second
of the football game and my wife, who was in the kitchen making dinner
at the time, never even knew that I had turned the water off.

Another time I used a SharkBite Tee to tap into a copper pipe at the
front of the house (which was at street pressure) then ran a length of
PEX across the basement ceiling and used a SharkBite straight
connector to connect the PEX to the copper pipe at the backyard hose
spigot. Less than an hour's work to get street pressure to the
backyard hose.

Both of these connections were made in the tight quarters near the
basement ceiling above storage cabinets - not a location where I would
have wanted to sweat copper.

One of the many advantages of the SharkBites is their ability to
swivel even after installation. With copper, you need to "aim" each
fitting to get the pipe to run in the direction you need. With
SharkBites, you just pop them on and swivel them in any direction you
want.

Costly yes, but damn convenient. In my case, I feel the cost was
justified based solely on the fact that I didn't have to sweat
fittings in locations where access was severely limited.

reply:

what he said ................

Same situation for me. Putting in a bathroom in daughter's basement, I
needed to get the water to the toilet - I had the concrete cut out for
the drain but didn't want to remove any more concrete than necessary,
so I drilled the concrete and put a plastic pipe in as a "sleave" and
the copper pipe inside that -kinda hard to solder down under the
concrete, but the shark-bite worked beautifully. - packed with sand
after. Then I needed to bring water down the end wall for the basin -
but the furnace duct was 2 inches from the wall, and against the
joists - and was to be boxed in with drywall. Virtually impossible to
get to with torch to solder it, so again a shark-bite was used.

At $8+ each, vs $0.37 for a solder LB, I thought long and hard about
it (I'm a cheap guy) - but there will be no question if I ever get
into that kind of situation again.

This stuff is like Velcro, Super Glue, and other things that we didn't have
in our childhood, but are common now. *Now that they are common as leaves,
we wonder how we ever lived without them, and recall all the repair
nightmares that would have gone a lot better with such simple fixits. *I'll
still sweat pipes during new construction, and in places that are not tight
or fire sensitive. *But for a slam dunk git'r'done and go watch the game, or
rescue SWMBO from an emergency water situation, they are the best. *For all
the time and risk saved, they are well worth the extra bucks, IMHO.

Steve

Heart surgery pending?www.cabgbypasssurgery.com
Heart Surgery Survival Guide- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

...what he said, especially about the use of sweat fittings whenever
possible.

When I did my "tap into the street pressure pipe" project, the run
from the PEX at the ceiling down to the pipe which ran through the
wall to the hose spigot involved a number of twists and turns to keep
it neat along the block wall.

I sweating up a zig-zagged section with about 6 fittings on the
workbench, attached it to the wall, and then used a single SharkBite
up near the ceiling to tie it into the PEX.

Using SharkBites for the entire project would have been rather
expensive, using all PEX would have looked out of place along the back
wall, so I mixed and matched and ended up with a cost-effective
outcome that looks good.

Thats the way I did a manifold in a house I flipped. Worked well.
Looks good too especially if you polish it up. One of the things the
buyer mentioned.

Jimmie

On Wed, 27 Apr 2011 07:19:42 -0700 (PDT), JIMMIE
wrote:

On Apr 27, 8:59Â*am, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:
Declines to spend three dollars on a tool that might save a
plumbing job, or a six dollar fitting? Now, THAT is an old
dog. Well done!

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
Â*www.lds.org
.

"DerbyDad03" wrote in message

...

Our Home Depot has a display where you can play with the
SharkBites.
Put them together, take them apart, PEX to Copper, etc.

When I bought the ones I used, I didn't bother spending the
$3 (?) on
the disassembly tool. All you really need is anything that
will push
the release ring evenly back into the fitting.

I don't recall what I used, but I took one apart at home
just as a
test and had no problem using some tool or object that was
just laying
around the shop.

I can actually see not buying one. It takes all of 5 minutes to make.
I can imagine SBs used in some tight locations may be near impossible
to disconnect without a specially fabricated tool.

Jimmie
IIRC I used an open end wrench - the thin "tappet" type