I am a little baffled. I have flood lights that used to work. They stopped
working so I replaced the bulbs with indoor/outdoor type flood lights. This
did not fix the problem. I checked the sockets with my little $6 voltage
detector and there is power. In fact, there is power in the sockets whether
the switch is on or off.

Now could it not be working because I need a special 'Outdoor' bulb? Or,
since I get a power reading with the switch on or off, is there something
wrong in the wiring?

Any suggestions would be great!

Meat Plow wrote:
On Tue, 29 May 2007 12:06:52 -0400, CooSer wrote:


I am a little baffled. I have flood lights that used to work. They stopped
working so I replaced the bulbs with indoor/outdoor type flood lights. This
did not fix the problem. I checked the sockets with my little $6 voltage
detector and there is power. In fact, there is power in the sockets whether
the switch is on or off.

Now could it not be working because I need a special 'Outdoor' bulb? Or,
since I get a power reading with the switch on or off, is there something
wrong in the wiring?

Any suggestions would be great!


Find someone who can troubleshoot it from the source. I don't think you
know enough (not an insult) about it.




I'bet you are seeing a "phantom" voltage being capacitively coupled past
an open circuit.

Try this:

Screw in just ONE bulb and see if you still find "power" there with your
voltage detector. Betcha dont anymore!

Then, as a previous poster suggested, find a way to learn more about
what you need to know to diagnose and fix the problem, it sounds like
it'd be pretty hard to bring you far enough up the learning curve via a
newsgroup.

Good Luck,

Jeff

--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)
The speed of light is 1.8*10^12 furlongs per fortnight.

Use something like a pigtail tester. Touch one lead to the interior shell of
the lamp socket, and the other to the tongue at the bottom of the socket.
With the switch on you should get a light and not with the switch off. It is
possible that the neutral conductor is being broken through the switch
instead of the hot leg, and it's also possible that the switch is bad



"CooSer" wrote in message
...
I am a little baffled. I have flood lights that used to work. They
stopped working so I replaced the bulbs with indoor/outdoor type flood
lights. This did not fix the problem. I checked the sockets with my
little $6 voltage detector and there is power. In fact, there is power in
the sockets whether the switch is on or off.

Now could it not be working because I need a special 'Outdoor' bulb? Or,
since I get a power reading with the switch on or off, is there something
wrong in the wiring?

Any suggestions would be great!

"CooSer" wrote in message
...
I am a little baffled. I have flood lights that used to work. They
stopped working so I replaced the bulbs with indoor/outdoor type flood
lights. This did not fix the problem. I checked the sockets with my
little $6 voltage detector and there is power. In fact, there is power in
the sockets whether the switch is on or off.

A voltage tester is most often a high-impedance device. What that means, in
simple terms, is that it does not load the circuit. You have a circuit that
fails under load. Somewhere, there is a bad connection.

On Tue, 29 May 2007 16:49:08 -0400, "RBM" rbm2(remove
wrote:

it's also possible that the switch is bad

Or like me flipping the wrong switch off and on :-))

--
Oren

...through the use of electrical or duct tape, achieve the configuration in the photo..

On May 29, 11:06 am, "CooSer" wrote:
I am a little baffled. I have flood lights that used to work. They stopped
working so I replaced the bulbs with indoor/outdoor type flood lights. This
did not fix the problem. I checked the sockets with my little $6 voltage
detector and there is power. In fact, there is power in the sockets whether
the switch is on or off.

Now could it not be working because I need a special 'Outdoor' bulb? Or,
since I get a power reading with the switch on or off, is there something
wrong in the wiring?

What type is your tester? Is it an inexpensive volt-meter or a neon-
bulb or similar? If the former w/ a needle indicator it's quite
possible as Jeff says the voltage is phantom. If it is a indicator
light type, and the light is being lit, then the voltage is real and
the problem is twofold...

If you don't find the problem first, post the answer to the question
and I'll not start a tome on what else to look for...

Although I will ask -- is there more than one location from which to
turn the lights on/off from? It's possible the other switch is the
problem of voltage.

Also, if there is real (not phantom) voltage, and the light doesn't
light, then the problem almost certainly has to be in the base--either
dirt/corrosion or perhaps the base tab has become flattened to where
the bottom of the bulb isn't making contact.

But, I'd say first guess of reading a impressed voltage is probably
the most likely culprit...

"CooSer" wrote in message
...
I am a little baffled. I have flood lights that used to work. They
stopped working so I replaced the bulbs with indoor/outdoor type flood
lights. This did not fix the problem. I checked the sockets with my
little $6 voltage detector and there is power. In fact, there is power in
the sockets whether the switch is on or off.

Now could it not be working because I need a special 'Outdoor' bulb? Or,
since I get a power reading with the switch on or off, is there something
wrong in the wiring?

Any suggestions would be great!
BTDT, multiple times in various houses for me and relatives. IMHO, most
likely cause is that the fixture has crapped out, being out in the weather
year round and all. Postive test for that, is to remove fixture, and hang a
3-dollar pigtail socket with a bulb from the wires. The 3 bucks is well
invested- even if you only use it every couple years, a pigtail is a handy
thing to have around. Outdoor fixtures are cheap. Made cheaply and far away,
but cheap.

aem sends...

"Charles" wrote in message
. ..

"CooSer" wrote in message
...
I am a little baffled. I have flood lights that used to work. They
stopped working so I replaced the bulbs with indoor/outdoor type flood
lights. This did not fix the problem. I checked the sockets with my
little $6 voltage detector and there is power. In fact, there is power in
the sockets whether the switch is on or off.

A voltage tester is most often a high-impedance device. What that means,
in simple terms, is that it does not load the circuit. You have a circuit
that fails under load. Somewhere, there is a bad connection.

Phantom? For heavens sake, let's get real here. There is no such thing as
a phantom voltage ... there is a voltage that shows up with no load and
drops to near zero with a load ... bad connection!

Charles wrote:

Phantom? For heavens sake, let's get real here. There is no such thing as
a phantom voltage ... there is a voltage that shows up with no load and
drops to near zero with a load ... bad connection!


NO. That is not what he wrote.

"In fact, there is power in the sockets whether
the switch is on or off."

He is using a $6 pseudo-test instrument that is completely unreliable,
which can easily pick up inductive transient signals and give a false
positive.

To CooSer:

Get yourself a real mult-meter to test the actual wiring before the
fixture. Don't use inductive probes or gimmicky light bulb testers.
Use a real voltmeter to test the *wiring* first, then you can work on
diagnosing a bad fixture.

"Clancy Wiggum" wrote in message
...
Charles wrote:

Phantom? For heavens sake, let's get real here. There is no such thing
as
a phantom voltage ... there is a voltage that shows up with no load and
drops to near zero with a load ... bad connection!


NO. That is not what he wrote.

Here is brief tutorial:

1/ Voltage is constant in parallel circuits.
2./ Voltage is distributed in series circuits.
3/ A resistance or impedance will drop some voltage, proportional to current
flow.

HE/SHE might have a circuit with a bad connection ... good enough to
register normal when no load is connected and measured with a high-impedance
tester ... but not able to supply a real load.

Charles wrote:


Here is brief tutorial:

1/ Voltage is constant in parallel circuits.
2./ Voltage is distributed in series circuits.
3/ A resistance or impedance will drop some voltage, proportional to current
flow.

No ****? I guess nothing changed since I took basic DC/AC circuits in
college 20 years ago.



HE/SHE might have a circuit with a bad connection ... good enough to
register normal when no load is connected and m

He/She *might* have an elephant's trunk stuck up the anal orifice too.
Nobody knows until we can reliably test it though, eh?

So instead of spouting *what if's*, let's direct our friend to
actually test the circuit before proclaiming ' bad connection', which
is vague in itself and offers no solution to the OP's problem.

It very well be a loose or oxidized connection, but you are not
following the flow of troubleshooting, nor given any advice on how to
find or correct this "phantom" bad connection.

On Tue, 29 May 2007 12:06:52 -0400, "CooSer"
wrote:

I am a little baffled. I have flood lights that used to work. They stopped
working so I replaced the bulbs with indoor/outdoor type flood lights. This
did not fix the problem. I checked the sockets with my little $6 voltage
detector and there is power. In fact, there is power in the sockets whether
the switch is on or off.

Now could it not be working because I need a special 'Outdoor' bulb? Or,
since I get a power reading with the switch on or off, is there something
wrong in the wiring?

Any suggestions would be great!

Any lamp should work in the fixture. Try using the new lamp in
another fixture or use a known working bulb the floodlight.

You should not be reading voltage with the switch off. Try testing
with a reliable tester

On 29 May 2007 14:47:45 -0700, dpb wrote:

On May 29, 11:06 am, "CooSer" wrote:
I am a little baffled. I have flood lights that used to work. They stopped
working so I replaced the bulbs with indoor/outdoor type flood lights. This
did not fix the problem. I checked the sockets with my little $6 voltage
detector and there is power. In fact, there is power in the sockets whether
the switch is on or off.

Now could it not be working because I need a special 'Outdoor' bulb? Or,
since I get a power reading with the switch on or off, is there something
wrong in the wiring?

What type is your tester? Is it an inexpensive volt-meter or a neon-
bulb or similar? If the former w/ a needle indicator it's quite
possible as Jeff says the voltage is phantom. If it is a indicator
light type, and the light is being lit, then the voltage is real and
the problem is twofold...

If you don't find the problem first, post the answer to the question
and I'll not start a tome on what else to look for...

Although I will ask -- is there more than one location from which to
turn the lights on/off from? It's possible the other switch is the
problem of voltage.

Also, if there is real (not phantom) voltage, and the light doesn't
light, then the problem almost certainly has to be in the base--either
dirt/corrosion or perhaps the base tab has become flattened to where
the bottom of the bulb isn't making contact.

Any voltage you can measure is a real one ("phantom" doesn't make
sense here, meters measure real voltages only). What's different is
the source impedance (the effective resistance of the source, which
determines how much the voltage drops with load). When dealing with
power, you want a LOW source impedance, so the load causes very little
voltage drop. With a very high source impedance, the load causes the
voltage to drop too low to light the bulb.


But, I'd say first guess of reading a impressed voltage is probably
the most likely culprit...

Yes.
--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

On Tue, 29 May 2007 19:14:11 -0400, Terry
wrote:

On Tue, 29 May 2007 12:06:52 -0400, "CooSer"
wrote:

I am a little baffled. I have flood lights that used to work. They stopped
working so I replaced the bulbs with indoor/outdoor type flood lights. This
did not fix the problem. I checked the sockets with my little $6 voltage
detector and there is power. In fact, there is power in the sockets whether
the switch is on or off.

Now could it not be working because I need a special 'Outdoor' bulb? Or,
since I get a power reading with the switch on or off, is there something
wrong in the wiring?

Any suggestions would be great!

Any lamp should work in the fixture. Try using the new lamp in
another fixture or use a known working bulb the floodlight.

You should not be reading voltage with the switch off. Try testing
with a reliable tester

A disconnected wire (such as this one, with the switch off and no bulb
in the socket) running close to a wire carrying AC current will form a
transformer and you'll get some voltage. Circuit impedance will be
high, and any significant load will drop it to near zero.
--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

On May 30, 11:01 am, Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 29 May 2007 14:47:45 -0700, dpb wrote:

....

Any voltage you can measure is a real one ("phantom" doesn't make
sense here, ...

"Phantom" in the sense following -- which you obviously knew and
understood but just wanted to be a ...

But, I'd say first guess of reading a impressed voltage is probably
the most likely culprit...

--

Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 29 May 2007 14:47:45 -0700, dpb wrote:


On May 29, 11:06 am, "CooSer" wrote:

I am a little baffled. I have flood lights that used to work. They stopped
working so I replaced the bulbs with indoor/outdoor type flood lights. This
did not fix the problem. I checked the sockets with my little $6 voltage
detector and there is power. In fact, there is power in the sockets whether
the switch is on or off.

Now could it not be working because I need a special 'Outdoor' bulb? Or,
since I get a power reading with the switch on or off, is there something
wrong in the wiring?

What type is your tester? Is it an inexpensive volt-meter or a neon-
bulb or similar? If the former w/ a needle indicator it's quite
possible as Jeff says the voltage is phantom. If it is a indicator
light type, and the light is being lit, then the voltage is real and
the problem is twofold...

If you don't find the problem first, post the answer to the question
and I'll not start a tome on what else to look for...

Although I will ask -- is there more than one location from which to
turn the lights on/off from? It's possible the other switch is the
problem of voltage.

Also, if there is real (not phantom) voltage, and the light doesn't
light, then the problem almost certainly has to be in the base--either
dirt/corrosion or perhaps the base tab has become flattened to where
the bottom of the bulb isn't making contact.


Any voltage you can measure is a real one ("phantom" doesn't make
sense here, meters measure real voltages only). What's different is
the source impedance (the effective resistance of the source, which
determines how much the voltage drops with load). When dealing with
power, you want a LOW source impedance, so the load causes very little
voltage drop. With a very high source impedance, the load causes the
voltage to drop too low to light the bulb.


But, I'd say first guess of reading a impressed voltage is probably
the most likely culprit...


Yes.


Don't quibble with just me Mark. NEMA recognizes "phantom" as a term
too: G

http://www.nema.org/stds/eng-bulleti...ulletin-88.pdf

Jeff



--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)
The speed of light is 1.8*10^12 furlongs per fortnight.

On 30 May 2007 10:41:24 -0700, dpb wrote:

On May 30, 11:01 am, Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 29 May 2007 14:47:45 -0700, dpb wrote:

...

Any voltage you can measure is a real one ("phantom" doesn't make
sense here, ...

"Phantom" in the sense following --

At this point, you realized you had nothing to say, and felt an
uncontrollable need to say something nasty anyway.

which you obviously knew and
understood but just wanted to be a ...


Sometimes I wish there was a "maturity test" for usenet posters...

But, I'd say first guess of reading a impressed voltage is probably
the most likely culprit...

On Wed, 30 May 2007 16:00:19 -0500, Sam E
wrote:

Sometimes I wish there was a "maturity test" for usenet posters...

(How do WE fit in? Exclude, yourself!) Can I post as a graduate of
9th grade?

--
Oren

...through the use of electrical or duct tape, achieve the configuration in the photo..

"Clancy Wiggum" wrote in message
...


Get yourself a real mult-meter to test the actual wiring before the
fixture. Don't use inductive probes or gimmicky light bulb testers.
Use a real voltmeter to test the *wiring* first, then you can work on
diagnosing a bad fixture.

What will that accomplish? A real voltmeter has a very high impedance and
will give the same result.

"Clancy Wiggum" wrote in message
...
Charles wrote:


Here is brief tutorial:

1/ Voltage is constant in parallel circuits.
2./ Voltage is distributed in series circuits.
3/ A resistance or impedance will drop some voltage, proportional to
current
flow.

No ****? I guess nothing changed since I took basic DC/AC circuits in
college 20 years ago.

Wow! College. Ain't you sumpin.

HE/SHE might have a circuit with a bad connection ... good enough to
register normal when no load is connected and m

He/She *might* have an elephant's trunk stuck up the anal orifice too.

We certainly know that YOU have issues like that.

So instead of spouting *what if's*, let's direct our friend to
actually test the circuit before proclaiming ' bad connection', which
is vague in itself and offers no solution to the OP's problem.

Your directions were detailed and impecable.

It very well be a loose or oxidized connection, but you are not
following the flow of troubleshooting, nor given any advice on how to
find or correct this "phantom" bad connection.

Oh; and you of course have given sage advice.

On May 30, 4:00 pm, Sam E wrote:
On 30 May 2007 10:41:24 -0700, dpb wrote:

On May 30, 11:01 am, Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 29 May 2007 14:47:45 -0700, dpb wrote:

...

....

At this point, you realized you had nothing to say, and felt an
uncontrollable need to say something nasty anyway.
....

I'd have said nothing further had previous poster not felt obligated
to make cheapshot remark initially...at that point I indeed, had
something to say which was I didn't appreciate it nor your even
cheaper "pile-on"...

If you want to correct the rudeness, start w/ the prior poster (or
yourself), not me...

Don't quibble with just me Mark. NEMA recognizes "phantom" as a term
too: G


Jeff, in my humble opinion the term "phantom voltage" is not applicable in
this case. NEMA and others use it to refer to a capacitively induced
voltage into an open circuit and measured by a high-impedance meter. In
this case, the voltage is not a phantom but is a real voltage in a circuit
with high resistance (due to a bad connection).

Charles wrote:

No ****? I guess nothing changed since I took basic DC/AC circuits in
college 20 years ago.

Wow! College. Ain't you sumpin.

We learned how to spell fancy words like "something" too! There was
also a course that explained "ain't" is not a word. Here is some
light reading that I'm sure even you will understand.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/aint (move your mouse arrow
over the underlined text and click the left button, Corky)

"—Usage note As a substitute for am not, is not, and are not in
declarative sentences, ain't is more common in uneducated speech than
in educated"



HE/SHE might have a circuit with a bad connection ... good enough to
register normal when no load is connected and m

He/She *might* have an elephant's trunk stuck up the anal orifice too.

We certainly know that YOU have issues like that.

Not lately, I have learned to be careful around pachyderms. Oh,
sorry.. here you go -
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/pachyderms

I saw you on youtube, dude:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bi9gR_uHFG0


So instead of spouting *what if's*, let's direct our friend to
actually test the circuit before proclaiming ' bad connection', which
is vague in itself and offers no solution to the OP's problem.

Your directions were detailed and impecable.

Yes they were, thanks.


It very well be a loose or oxidized connection, but you are not
following the flow of troubleshooting, nor given any advice on how to
find or correct this "phantom" bad connection.

Oh; and you of course have given sage advice.

Thanks again.

Charles wrote:


"Clancy Wiggum" wrote in message
.. .


Get yourself a real mult-meter to test the actual wiring before the
fixture. Don't use inductive probes or gimmicky light bulb testers.
Use a real voltmeter to test the *wiring* first, then you can work on
diagnosing a bad fixture.

What will that accomplish? A real voltmeter has a very high impedance and
will give the same result.


No, Corky. A voltmeter will show the gentleman exactly what voltage
potential exists at the wiring *before* the fixture. Those stupid $6
LED testers will light up with the smallest amount of induced voltage,
telling him nothing.

On 30 May 2007 16:59:14 -0700, dpb wrote:

On May 30, 4:00 pm, Sam E wrote:
On 30 May 2007 10:41:24 -0700, dpb wrote:

On May 30, 11:01 am, Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 29 May 2007 14:47:45 -0700, dpb wrote:

...

...

At this point, you realized you had nothing to say, and felt an
uncontrollable need to say something nasty anyway.
...

I'd have said nothing further had previous poster not felt obligated
to make cheapshot remark initially...at that point I indeed, had
something to say which was I didn't appreciate it nor your even
cheaper "pile-on"...

If you want to correct the rudeness, start w/ the prior poster (or
yourself), not me...

What I put in my post was not intended as rudeness, but as honest
observation. The fact that you interpreted it that way does mean
something.

The prior post shows no evidence of rudeness whatsoever.

Charles wrote:


Don't quibble with just me Mark. NEMA recognizes "phantom" as a term
too: G


Jeff, in my humble opinion the term "phantom voltage" is not applicable in
this case. NEMA and others use it to refer to a capacitively induced
voltage into an open circuit and measured by a high-impedance meter. In
this case, the voltage is not a phantom but is a real voltage in a circuit
with high resistance (due to a bad connection).



Yet you still have not told the OP to remove the fixture and test the
actual voltage on the feed conductors.

Tell me, Corky, how is this man going to find your "bad connection"
without removing the fixture and testing the source first, eh? Seems
to me that is the very first step - so he knows whether to work on the
fixture or go back to the switch.

On May 30, 8:03 pm, Sam E wrote:
On 30 May 2007 16:59:14 -0700, dpb wrote:



On May 30, 4:00 pm, Sam E wrote:
On 30 May 2007 10:41:24 -0700, dpb wrote:

On May 30, 11:01 am, Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 29 May 2007 14:47:45 -0700, dpb wrote:

...

...

At this point, you realized you had nothing to say, and felt an
uncontrollable need to say something nasty anyway.
...

I'd have said nothing further had previous poster not felt obligated
to make cheapshot remark initially...at that point I indeed, had
something to say which was I didn't appreciate it nor your even
cheaper "pile-on"...

If you want to correct the rudeness, start w/ the prior poster (or
yourself), not me...

What I put in my post was not intended as rudeness, but as honest
observation. The fact that you interpreted it that way does mean
something.

The prior post shows no evidence of rudeness whatsoever.

Whatever...

"Clancy Wiggum" wrote in message
...
Charles wrote:

No ****? I guess nothing changed since I took basic DC/AC circuits in
college 20 years ago.

Wow! College. Ain't you sumpin.

We learned how to spell fancy words like "something" too! There was
also a course that explained "ain't" is not a word. Here is some
light reading that I'm sure even you will understand.

Subtle sarcasm just zooms right over your shrunken head.

"Clancy Wiggum" wrote in message
...
Charles wrote:


"Clancy Wiggum" wrote in message
. ..


Get yourself a real mult-meter to test the actual wiring before the
fixture. Don't use inductive probes or gimmicky light bulb testers.
Use a real voltmeter to test the *wiring* first, then you can work on
diagnosing a bad fixture.

What will that accomplish? A real voltmeter has a very high impedance and
will give the same result.


No, Corky. A voltmeter will show the gentleman exactly what voltage
potential exists at the wiring *before* the fixture. Those stupid $6
LED testers will light up with the smallest amount of induced voltage,
telling him nothing.

Yes, Porky. You obviously do not understand series circuits, Kirchhoff's
Laws, and instrument impedance. Just keep digging your hole deeper.

"Clancy Wiggum" wrote in message
...
Charles wrote:


Don't quibble with just me Mark. NEMA recognizes "phantom" as a term
too: G


Jeff, in my humble opinion the term "phantom voltage" is not applicable in
this case. NEMA and others use it to refer to a capacitively induced
voltage into an open circuit and measured by a high-impedance meter. In
this case, the voltage is not a phantom but is a real voltage in a circuit
with high resistance (due to a bad connection).



Yet you still have not told the OP to remove the fixture and test the
actual voltage on the feed conductors.

Tell me, Corky, how is this man going to find your "bad connection"
without removing the fixture and testing the source first, eh? Seems
to me that is the very first step - so he knows whether to work on the
fixture or go back to the switch.

Look, Porky. If you have useful input for the OP, tend to it. Don't take
cheap shots at others trying to help.

Charles wrote:

Tell me, Corky, how is this man going to find your "bad connection"
without removing the fixture and testing the source first, eh? Seems
to me that is the very first step - so he knows whether to work on the
fixture or go back to the switch.

Look, Porky. If you have useful input for the OP, tend to it. Don't take
cheap shots at others trying to help.


Corky, what is wrong with my advice?

Charles wrote:

No, Corky. A voltmeter will show the gentleman exactly what voltage
potential exists at the wiring *before* the fixture. Those stupid $6
LED testers will light up with the smallest amount of induced voltage,
telling him nothing.

Yes, Porky. You obviously do not understand series circuits, Kirchhoff's
Laws, and instrument impedance. Just keep digging your hole deeper.


Corky, I am familiar with all of those concepts. Please tell me why
you refuse to admit that a faulty "test instrument" as the OP
described, and used, is proof of your argument that a transient
voltage is NOT to blame, and is in fact as you claim a "bad
connection".

Charles wrote:

We learned how to spell fancy words like "something" too! There was
also a course that explained "ain't" is not a word. Here is some
light reading that I'm sure even you will understand.

Subtle sarcasm just zooms right over your shrunken head.


Nah.. I just like using you as a chew toy.

Mark Lloyd wrote:

A disconnected wire (such as this one, with the switch off and no bulb
in the socket) running close to a wire carrying AC current will form a
transformer and you'll get some voltage. Circuit impedance will be
high, and any significant load will drop it to near zero.


Yup. And if the OP is using an inductive "test instrument" he will
read a false positive, since he is testing with no-load (bulb
unscrewed).

"Clancy Wiggum" wrote in message
...
Charles wrote:

Tell me, Corky, how is this man going to find your "bad connection"
without removing the fixture and testing the source first, eh? Seems
to me that is the very first step - so he knows whether to work on the
fixture or go back to the switch.

Look, Porky. If you have useful input for the OP, tend to it. Don't take
cheap shots at others trying to help.


Corky, what is wrong with my advice?

Give some, and I'll let you know. So far, you have offered only criticism.
Respond to the OP with how he/she should proceed and then we can take pot
shots at you. Or, if you happen to offer sage advice ... then HURRAHS to
you Porky.

Charles wrote:

Corky, what is wrong with my advice?

Give some, and I'll let you know. So far, you have offered only criticism.
Respond to the OP with how he/she should proceed and then we can take pot
shots at you. Or, if you happen to offer sage advice ... then HURRAHS to
you Porky.

I did, Corky. I asked him to test the input wiring, without the
possibility of "phantom" (inductive) voltage, which a voltmeter will
provide - despite your claim to the contrary that a voltmeter is a
"high impendence device". And can not reliably differentiate, which
is bull****.


What the hell is your problem with that? You are jumping to
conclusions without any measurable data. I asked the OP to provide
measurable data, you told him he had a "bad connection" without
further steps to diagnose, nor a fix.


This was my advice to start the troubleshooting:

Message-ID:
"Get yourself a real multi-meter to test the actual wiring before the
fixture. Don't use inductive probes or gimmicky light bulb testers.
Use a real voltmeter to test the *wiring* first, then you can work on
diagnosing a bad fixture."

"Clancy Wiggum" wrote in message
...
Charles wrote:

Corky, what is wrong with my advice?

Give some, and I'll let you know. So far, you have offered only
criticism.
Respond to the OP with how he/she should proceed and then we can take pot
shots at you. Or, if you happen to offer sage advice ... then HURRAHS to
you Porky.

I did, Corky. I asked him to test the input wiring, without the
possibility of "phantom" (inductive) voltage, which a voltmeter will
provide - despite your claim to the contrary that a voltmeter is a
"high impendence device". And can not reliably differentiate, which
is bull****.

A phantom voltage is defined by NEMA as being caused by capacitive coupling
among conductors. Inducitve coupling is different (you continue to show
your ignorance on these very basic concepts and dig yourself in deeper every
time that you post). No big deal here, as neither capacitive coupling or
inductive coupling is applicable to this particular situation. This
situation is so simple, in terms of troubleshooting, that it merits little
discussion. You have promoted the discussion by making snide remarks and
very inappropriate comments. Bull**** is in the eye of the beholder and you
reek of it, from my viewpoint.

A bad connection is a bad connection. Anybody with an ounce of common sense
knows how to proceed. Outdoor, low-voltage lighting systems all have, or
eventually have, bad connections. Pull up the wires and wiggle the
connections and the lights go on and off.

What the hell is your problem with that? You are jumping to
conclusions without any measurable data. I asked the OP to provide
measurable data, you told him he had a "bad connection" without
further steps to diagnose, nor a fix.

My problem is with twits like you who have probably never fixed a broken
flashlight. You feed your ego here via distasteful remarks about things up
other's arses, which says a lot about you.

Charles wrote:

horse **** snipped



My problem is with twits like you who have probably never fixed a broken
flashlight. You feed your ego here via distasteful remarks about things up
other's arses, which says a lot about you.


HA!


Hey Corky, there is only one last thing to say before you plonk me.

-- **** YOU --

You have no skills, offer no solutions, have only vitriol to spew, and
your breath most likely stinks like crack-whore.

I hope you get infected with a really bad case of chlamydia and your
penis falls off!

Have a nice day.

"Clancy Wiggum" wrote in message
...
Charles wrote:

horse **** snipped



My problem is with twits like you who have probably never fixed a broken
flashlight. You feed your ego here via distasteful remarks about things
up
other's arses, which says a lot about you.


HA!


Hey Corky, there is only one last thing to say before you plonk me.

-- **** YOU --

You have no skills, offer no solutions, have only vitriol to spew, and
your breath most likely stinks like crack-whore.

I hope you get infected with a really bad case of chlamydia and your
penis falls off!

Have a nice day.

You too, my very sick friend.

On May 29, 2:06 pm, "CooSer" wrote:
I am a little baffled. I have flood lights that used to work. They stopped
working so I replaced the bulbs with indoor/outdoor type flood lights. This
did not fix the problem. I checked the sockets with my little $6 voltage
detector and there is power. In fact, there is power in the sockets whether
the switch is on or off.

Now could it not be working because I need a special 'Outdoor' bulb? Or,
since I get a power reading with the switch on or off, is there something
wrong in the wiring?

Any suggestions would be great!

It may not be the fact that anything is wrong with the OPs tester. It
may be picking up a voltage quite normally capacitively 'induced'
through the proximity of various wires even though the switch is
'off'.
One of the best testers is a regular lamp bulb.
Apart from something stupid like the replacement bulb/s not having a
long enough base to screw in and touch the terminals of the lamp
socket; very unlikely IMO, it is most probably a switch that has gone
defective, or something broken or corroded in the wiring or lamp
sockets.
From the question raised it appears that the OP does not have much
appreciation of how a circuit operates or what a switch does?
Accordingly it would be best from a family safety and insurance
viewpoint to get someone knowledgeable to fix or at least assist.
One problem with misunderstood repairs is that an improper one may
'seem to work'! "Hey look I fixed it".
However next time a bulb is to be replaced the switch is in the wrong
wire "How come I have a white wire connected to a black wire. That's
not what my cousin, neighbour, friend local mechanic told me?" Or
something is not properly grounded "What's this yellow/green wire
for??" and a person on a ladder gets a shock and falls. Or a wire
connected incorrectly "I thought that's where the black wire went
before I disconnected it!", gets hot within a wall or fixture or
switch box and "FIRE".
Insurance cos. many of whom are just looking for a reason NOT to pay
out, are not very sympathetic!
So be very careful you know what you are doing.
Pretty sure knowledgeable people reading this item could come up with
anywhere from 9 to 15 'possible' reasons any of which would be
plausible and simple to repair But be careful!.

Therefore mention this anecdote: The car of a non mechanically
inclined young lady driving some distance away from home had been
dripping coolant slowly on the ground, which she had ignored. It had
now lost most of it and overheated.
She called home and discussed it with her father who said "Let it cool
down for an hour or so then refill with water and drive slowly to the
nearest service station you can find. Then call me, collect, from
there and I'll speak to the mechanic for you. After waiting the young
lady lifted the hood; took off the oil filler cap and filled up the
engine crankcase etc. with water. naturally she never made to the
service station and the engine was ruined!
So the moral; like electrical wiring, know what you are doing. One
little mistake and could be costly!