Also, I'm told there are some where the computer runs off
the unit constantly and some where the unit only comes
"online" when needed.

I explained that in my previous posting. It's called a UPS -- an
uninterruptable power supply.

The device we commonly call a UPS is actually an SPS -- a standby power
supply.

On Tue, 17 Jul 2007 15:10:24 -0700, "Richard Crowley"
wrote:

"kony" wrote ...
You're right, "I" don't need it to run during an outtage,
but sometimes I feel I "want" at least a headamp and MP3
player running off batteries. However, some may really
"need" to keep running during an outtage. For example I
used to work as an engineer at a radiosStation and it was
certainly true then, but there were generators not $50
battery powered UPS.

The studio audio equipment is trivial compared to the power
it takes to keep the transmitter running, even at reduced output.


The transmitter wasn't on the same site, it was microwaved
back and forth. Regardless, there's still the same issue of
wherever you are, needing to survive the outtage and having
equipment which some good PSRR.


Another example would be a recording studio,

If I were a commercial recording (or video) studio reliant on
computer-based recording, I would keep at least the recording
computer on UPS (but not necessarily the audio equipment,
preamps, mixer, monitor amp/speakers, etc.) just enough to
save whatever recording was in process. If there is some
necessity to keep recording during power outages, that is
an entirely different scenario with different (and much more
expensive) possible solutions.

True, but some may aspire to the kinds of activities
recording studios do, without having the recording studio
budget for backup power.

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Jul 15, 1:22 pm, wrote:

The Kill-A-Watt will measure VA or Watts and also power factor in
addition to volts and amps.

Hard to tell that from the description. I tried to find a web site for
the original manufacturer to read more but wasn't successful. For
$20. it sounds like a handy gadget to have around.

Mostly I wanted to make it understood that watts are not necessarily
numerical to volt-amperes. Most computer equipment is specified in
watts, most UPSs are rated in V-A.


And for determining the load on the UPS, its the VA of the attached
equipment that you need to know. While its the watts that influence the
running time, if the VA rating is exceeded, then either the over current
protection will operate of the inverter transformer or its driving circuitry
may burn out.

On Jul 14, 9:05 pm, Doc wrote:
I've got two computers - a PIV and a PIII that share a monitor. I use
them primarily for doing audio/video.

I thought I'd look into a UPS. What I'm looking for is mainly
something to guard against momentary power outs that might happen in
the middle of tweaking a file or the like. When I hear the lightning
coming near, I shut down and unplug everything. But around here, it
seems like the power can flick off at any time.

How much UPS would I need to protect and keep both computers going in
the event of a short brown out or power loss or keep them running at
least long enough to shut things down if it looks like the power is
going to be off for a while.

I've seen where there are issues with the type of power that comes out
of some UPS units. Are any of the units at Best Buy/Circuit City -
such as the APC brand - any good? What are important features to look
for? These various units have charts indicating how long they should
power a computer, but I don't know how realistic they are.

On the other end, how much unit would I need to keep a computer going
for say an hour if I were doing some rendering of a DVD and didn't
want to start over. I usually turn off the monitor when rendering
video, it's my understanding the monitor is a big power hog.

Thanks for all input.

I use the one that comes in the big brown van.

Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Doc" wrote in message
oups.com

How much UPS would I need to protect and keep both
computers going in the event of a short brown out or
power loss or keep them running at least long enough to
shut things down if it looks like the power is going to
be off for a while.

What is "a while" in minutes?


It seems frequently these short outages come in clusters so a lot of this
would be on a judgement-call basis but off the cuff, I suppose I'd like it
to be able to keep them both going for 10 minutes - say if the power isn't
back on in 5, it gives me 5 minutes to close things down and shut down,
which should be plenty with time to spare. Playing the percentages, it's
more likely I would only be running one of them but you never know.

If the outage occurs when a lightning storm can be heard approaching, I'd be
shutting down and unplugging anyway. Unless I'm very sure it's going to be a
storm-free day, I typically unplug everything including the modem when
leaving for work or for a protracted period.

On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 10:42:42 -0700, "nappy" wrote:

C'mon nappy. Don't keep as all so excited!
What's on your liver?

-m-

Martin Heffels wrote:
On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 10:42:42 -0700, "nappy" wrote:

C'mon nappy. Don't keep as all so excited!
What's on your liver?


Maybe his laptop died and that's all that shows on the screen ...?


geoff

On 7/18/2007, Martin Heffels posted this:
On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 10:42:42 -0700, "nappy" wrote:

C'mon nappy. Don't keep as all so excited!
What's on your liver?

-m-

He's experimenting on a new font, white on white.

BTW, it can be very hard to debug a program that doesn't show any
output, when the problem is that the programmer (c'était moi in at
least one case!) accidentally set the output colors that way :-)

--
Gene E. Bloch (Gino)
letters617blochg3251
(replace the numbers by "at" and "dotcom")

On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 14:53:39 -0700, in 'rec.video.desktop',
in article work on a laptop.,
Gene E. Bloch wrote:

On 7/18/2007, Martin Heffels posted this:
On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 10:42:42 -0700, "nappy" wrote:

C'mon nappy. Don't keep as all so excited!
What's on your liver?

-m-

He's experimenting on a new font, white on white.

BTW, it can be very hard to debug a program that doesn't show any
output, when the problem is that the programmer (c'était moi in at
least one case!) accidentally set the output colors that way :-)

In cases where the text is selectable, just select (highlight) it with
the mouse and it usually becomes readable.

Specifying identical text and background colors is done as a trick on
some Web pages. The author includes a long list of keywords in the
hope that doing so will improve page ranking in the search engines. Of
course, over time, the search engines have gotten wise to this trick
and these days will generally rank such a page lower then it would
otherwise have been ranked, thus producing an effect opposite of that
which the author intended.

--
Frank, Independent Consultant, New York, NY
[Please remove 'nojunkmail.' from address to reply via e-mail.]
Read Frank's thoughts on HDV at http://www.humanvalues.net/hdv/

"Geoff" wrote ...
Martin Heffels wrote:
On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 10:42:42 -0700, "nappy" wrote:

C'mon nappy. Don't keep as all so excited!
What's on your liver?


Maybe his laptop died and that's all that shows on the screen ...?

Funny(?) you should mention that.
MY laptop died this morning and shows nothing on the screen.
It starts OK, with the MSwin logo on the black screen and the
"progress" bar, but as soon as it flips into the native resolution,
the screen goes dead. This may be the first time I have booted
it since one of those automatic MS "patches" or "upgrades" or
whatever.

On 7/18/2007, Frank posted this:
On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 14:53:39 -0700, in 'rec.video.desktop',
in article work on a laptop.,
Gene E. Bloch wrote:

On 7/18/2007, Martin Heffels posted this:
On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 10:42:42 -0700, "nappy" wrote:

C'mon nappy. Don't keep as all so excited!
What's on your liver?

-m-

He's experimenting on a new font, white on white.

BTW, it can be very hard to debug a program that doesn't show any
output, when the problem is that the programmer (c'était moi in at
least one case!) accidentally set the output colors that way :-)

In cases where the text is selectable, just select (highlight) it with
the mouse and it usually becomes readable.

This was not on a GUI with mouses...

I was supposed to see a message on the screen and it didn't show up. I
tried a lot of things before I noticed the foreground color .EQ. the
background color :-)

Specifying identical text and background colors is done as a trick on
some Web pages. The author includes a long list of keywords in the
hope that doing so will improve page ranking in the search engines. Of
course, over time, the search engines have gotten wise to this trick
and these days will generally rank such a page lower then it would
otherwise have been ranked, thus producing an effect opposite of that
which the author intended.

It was a trick of my own brain...Or maybe i was trying to help one of
the other programmers, who didn't know know why *her* message didn't
show up on-screen. This was ~0.25 century ago, so the details are a bit
hazy in my blobware archive.

--
Gene E. Bloch (Gino)
letters617blochg3251
(replace the numbers by "at" and "dotcom")

On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 01:29:00 +0300, Richard Crowley
wrote:


Funny(?) you should mention that.
MY laptop died this morning and shows nothing on the screen.
It starts OK, with the MSwin logo on the black screen and the
"progress" bar, but as soon as it flips into the native resolution,
the screen goes dead. This may be the first time I have booted
it since one of those automatic MS "patches" or "upgrades" or
whatever.

http://www.tech-recipes.com/windows_tips780.html

um.. guys... The message was in the subject..

Didn't mean to throw you all for a loop.

nappy wrote:
um.. guys... The message was in the subject..

Didn't mean to throw you all for a loop.

Thanks for elucidating, but sorry, we are all still at a loss ....

geoff

nappy wrote:

um.. guys... The message was in the subject..

Didn't mean to throw you all for a loop.


The devil is in the details. "Work on a laptop" doesn't MEAN
anything without details. You haven't thrown anyone for a loop, you
just made a senseless comment, and still expect help with insufficient
DETAIL.

PS, did I mention details? ;-)


--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida

"Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message
...
nappy wrote:

um.. guys... The message was in the subject..

Didn't mean to throw you all for a loop.


The devil is in the details. "Work on a laptop" doesn't MEAN
anything without details. You haven't thrown anyone for a loop, you
just made a senseless comment, and still expect help with insufficient
DETAIL.

PS, did I mention details? ;-)


D'oh.. a newbie!

Without a sense of humor even.. !

"Geoff" wrote in message
...
nappy wrote:
um.. guys... The message was in the subject..

Didn't mean to throw you all for a loop.

Thanks for elucidating, but sorry, we are all still at a loss ....

geoff


sorry to hear that geoff.

On 7/18/07 8:35 PM, in article
, "nappy"
wrote:


"Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message
...
nappy wrote:

um.. guys... The message was in the subject..

Didn't mean to throw you all for a loop.


The devil is in the details. "Work on a laptop" doesn't MEAN
anything without details. You haven't thrown anyone for a loop, you
just made a senseless comment, and still expect help with insufficient
DETAIL.

PS, did I mention details? ;-)


D'oh.. a newbie!

Without a sense of humor even.. !




What's funny about you putting this drivel on five boards? Don't bother
with a reply.

On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 15:29:00 -0700, "Richard Crowley"
wrote:

MY laptop died this morning and shows nothing on the screen.
It starts OK, with the MSwin logo on the black screen and the
"progress" bar, but as soon as it flips into the native resolution,
the screen goes dead. This may be the first time I have booted
it since one of those automatic MS "patches" or "upgrades" or
whatever.

Could be. I had this happening after updating my videodrivers one day
of my Nvidia-card (on my desktop, but that doesn't matter). Removed
them, reinstalled, and the thing worked again.
I would disconnect from the internet, do a System Restore, reboot, set
the update to just warn you, and connect to the internet and update
what _you_ want.

cheers

-martin-

On Thu, 19 Jul 2007 01:07:53 GMT, "nappy" wrote:

um.. guys... The message was in the subject..

Didn't mean to throw you all for a loop.

You ar vague in your details. We need to know more. What operating
system, software etc etc.

-m-

;-)

nappy wrote:

"Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message
...
nappy wrote:

um.. guys... The message was in the subject..

Didn't mean to throw you all for a loop.


The devil is in the details. "Work on a laptop" doesn't MEAN
anything without details. You haven't thrown anyone for a loop, you
just made a senseless comment, and still expect help with insufficient
DETAIL.

PS, did I mention details? ;-)

D'oh.. a newbie!


After ten years? I suppose you've bee on USENET since the early
'20s?


Without a sense of humor even.. !


We already know that you have no humor, but hopefully, you have
enough sense to provide enough information to help you, before everyone
just kill files you.

--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida

"Martin Heffels" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 15:29:00 -0700, "Richard Crowley"
wrote:

MY laptop died this morning and shows nothing on the screen.
It starts OK, with the MSwin logo on the black screen and the
"progress" bar, but as soon as it flips into the native resolution,
the screen goes dead. This may be the first time I have booted
it since one of those automatic MS "patches" or "upgrades" or
whatever.

NEVER get HARDWARE updates from Microsoft. They'll bugger your installation
more often than not. IF you want to update a driver, visit the manufacturers
website and download it directly.

What the above sounds like is just a settings issue. Use F8 to get to the
Windows boot menu and choose VGA mode. It should start and then you can set
the display to the proper resolution and refresh rate.

"Martin Heffels" wrote ...
"Richard Crowley" wrote:
MY laptop died this morning and shows nothing on the screen.
It starts OK, with the MSwin logo on the black screen and the
"progress" bar, but as soon as it flips into the native resolution,
the screen goes dead. This may be the first time I have booted
it since one of those automatic MS "patches" or "upgrades" or
whatever.

Could be. I had this happening after updating my videodrivers one day
of my Nvidia-card (on my desktop, but that doesn't matter). Removed
them, reinstalled, and the thing worked again.
I would disconnect from the internet, do a System Restore, reboot, set
the update to just warn you, and connect to the internet and update
what _you_ want.

I had always reviewed the patches before agreeing to install
them, but this time I forgot they were pending and when I
shut it down for the night I wasn't thinking clearly when I
selected the option to "install pending patches and shutdown"
I'll never do that again. :-(

"Noozer" wrote ...
"Martin Heffels" wrote in...
"Richard Crowley" wrote:
MY laptop died this morning and shows nothing on the screen.
It starts OK, with the MSwin logo on the black screen and the
"progress" bar, but as soon as it flips into the native resolution,
the screen goes dead. This may be the first time I have booted
it since one of those automatic MS "patches" or "upgrades" or
whatever.

NEVER get HARDWARE updates from Microsoft. They'll bugger your
installation more often than not. IF you want to update a driver, visit
the manufacturers website and download it directly.

What the above sounds like is just a settings issue. Use F8 to get to the
Windows boot menu and choose VGA mode. It should start and then you can
set the display to the proper resolution and refresh rate.

I used F8 to get to the "last known good configuration", but
then it went bonkers again and now it won't boot at all.
I was thinking about getting a new laptop anyway, anybody
have any outstanding favorites? :-)

On 7/18/2007, nappy posted this:
um.. guys... The message was in the subject..

Didn't mean to throw you all for a loop.

Sorry, nappy, but you didn't throw *me* for a loop.

loop.

loop.

loop.

OK, you know what I mean.

Meanwhile, nappy, note that not everyone notes the change of subject
inside a thread...Some people have even posted that they *never* pay
attention to the subject lines, in other threads I have seen
complaining about empty messages.

It would've been helpful to some if you had put some text inside your
post, although if you had, some others of us would have thereby been
denied an opportunity to pull your chain a little :-)

BTW, when I was discussing aspects of this thread with my girlfriend, I
even mentioned that she wouldn't need a UPS, since she uses a laptop -
and this was after reading only your subject line. I'm so proud of
myself. I had already told her as much in the past, of course (and I
still don't have a UPS myself. Hmmm.)

--
Gene E. Bloch (Gino)
letters617blochg3251
(replace the numbers by "at" and "dotcom")

Geoff wrote:

Martin Heffels wrote:

On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 10:42:42 -0700, "nappy" wrote:

C'mon nappy. Don't keep as all so excited!
What's on your liver?



Maybe his laptop died and that's all that shows on the screen ...?


geoff



MAYNARD:
'...The Castle of aaaaaagggh'.
BEDEVE
What is that?
MAYNARD:
He must have died while carving it.

--
Les Cargill

Doc wrote:
I've got two computers - a PIV and a PIII that share a monitor. I use
them primarily for doing audio/video.

I thought I'd look into a UPS. What I'm looking for is mainly
something to guard against momentary power outs that might happen in
the middle of tweaking a file or the like. When I hear the lightning
coming near, I shut down and unplug everything. But around here, it
seems like the power can flick off at any time.

How much UPS would I need to protect and keep both computers going in
the event of a short brown out or power loss or keep them running at
least long enough to shut things down if it looks like the power is
going to be off for a while.

I've seen where there are issues with the type of power that comes out
of some UPS units. Are any of the units at Best Buy/Circuit City -
such as the APC brand - any good? What are important features to look
for? These various units have charts indicating how long they should
power a computer, but I don't know how realistic they are.

On the other end, how much unit would I need to keep a computer going
for say an hour if I were doing some rendering of a DVD and didn't
want to start over. I usually turn off the monitor when rendering
video, it's my understanding the monitor is a big power hog.


Thanks for all input.


I've had a SmartUPS 700 in service since 1999 and replaced the batteries
(2 12v Gel) with generics from Zbattery for about $20 each, no problem.
Different UPS's will produce different types of waveforms and this
can cause problems with some power supplies.

Here's some graphic pictures to illustrate what I mean by waveforms (I
was happy to see the Smartups puts out a true sinewave vs the chunky
stepped wave of the cheaper models)...

http://www.jkovach.net/projects/powerquality/

In article , Richard (the
original) wrote:
Here's some graphic pictures to illustrate what I mean by waveforms (I
was happy to see the Smartups puts out a true sinewave vs the chunky
stepped wave of the cheaper models)...

http://www.jkovach.net/projects/powerquality/

Thanks for sharing that. Makes me feel a whole lot better about
my Smart-UPS 1500

--
Roger

Richard (the original) wrote:
I've had a SmartUPS 700 in service since 1999 and replaced the batteries
(2 12v Gel) with generics from Zbattery for about $20 each, no problem.
Different UPS's will produce different types of waveforms and this
can cause problems with some power supplies.

Here's some graphic pictures to illustrate what I mean by waveforms (I
was happy to see the Smartups puts out a true sinewave vs the chunky
stepped wave of the cheaper models)...

I was really unhappy with my SmartUPS 700 the morning it woke me up to
the sound of the gas alarm in my house. Thoroughly overcharged and fried
the six-month-old batteries. Trashed the gas alarm, too.

I replaced the 700 with a TrippLite that probably has a modified square
wave output, but no hydrogen or sulfuric acid fumes.

--
"Liberals used to be the ones who argued that sending U.S. troops abroad
was a small price to pay to stop genocide; now they argue that genocide
is a small price to pay to bring U.S. troops home."
-- Jonah Goldberg