"BlueDude" wrote in message
...

However, if for example I need to finish a heavy use, long-lasting
cabinet door knob, shall I first varnish it, sanded and finished it
with as many coats of tung oil?

Oil finishes and heavy use do not go together in the same sentence. Oil is
pretty and "natural", but offers virtually no protection.

Bob

I have never use tung oil (mainly due cost) on all my projects,
instead I use varnish than finished it with as many coats (sanded
between each coating) of polyurethane as needed to get good finished.
However, if for example I need to finish a heavy use, long-lasting
cabinet door knob, shall I first varnish it, sanded and finished it
with as many coats of tung oil?

Please advice and thanking all in advance for replying.

In article ,
says...

I have never use tung oil (mainly due cost) on all my projects,
instead I use varnish than finished it with as many coats (sanded
between each coating) of polyurethane as needed to get good finished.
However, if for example I need to finish a heavy use, long-lasting
cabinet door knob, shall I first varnish it, sanded and finished it
with as many coats of tung oil?

Please advice and thanking all in advance for replying.



I suspect a troll, no one can accidently get that many things turned
around, but, just in case.

1 - polyurethane is a varnish. Coating with a non poly varnish then
following with a poly varnish is redundant and unnecessary

2 - Tung oil is an oil finish. It is not meant to build but to soak into
the wood and form a low luster natural look to the wood.

3 - Since tung oil is meant to soak into the wood and varnish seals the
wood and forms a film finish over the wood putting the oil on top of the
varnish would be an exercise in futility.

4 - Oil is an inappropriate finish for a surface that is going to have
heavy use.


--
MikeG
Heirloom Woods
www.heirloom-woods.net

On Mon, 18 Oct 2004 20:21:57 GMT, (BlueDude)
wrote:


I have never use tung oil (mainly due cost) on all my projects,
instead I use varnish than finished it with as many coats (sanded
between each coating) of polyurethane as needed to get good finished.
However, if for example I need to finish a heavy use, long-lasting
cabinet door knob, shall I first varnish it, sanded and finished it
with as many coats of tung oil?

Please advice and thanking all in advance for replying.

I'd use the poly for a door handle, myself. Tung oil looks really
nice, but I guess it's not all that tough according to the finishing
book I just got.

I do appreciate your explanation, thank you. I'm not a troll. I did
say I have never used Tung oil cuz it's rather expensive. Most
magazines say use Tung oil first, than apply polyurethane or something
of that sort. Last night I read Kingspor's Woodworking Shop catalog
(old copy) page52 ..."The advantage is a consistent quality finished
that will built up to be extremely hard and durable." Further, David
Mark's always praises Tung oil in his Woodworking show on TV, without
elaborate further...

If you don't know or don't understand "ASK" and I am here doing just
that from the good people here. :-) Thanks.

I suspect a troll, no one can accidently get that many things turned
around, but, just in case.

1 - polyurethane is a varnish. Coating with a non poly varnish then
following with a poly varnish is redundant and unnecessary

2 - Tung oil is an oil finish. It is not meant to build but to soak into
the wood and form a low luster natural look to the wood.

3 - Since tung oil is meant to soak into the wood and varnish seals the
wood and forms a film finish over the wood putting the oil on top of the
varnish would be an exercise in futility.

4 - Oil is an inappropriate finish for a surface that is going to have
heavy use.


--
MikeG
Heirloom Woods
www.heirloom-woods.net

In article , BlueDude
wrote:

I do appreciate your explanation, thank you. I'm not a troll. I did
say I have never used Tung oil cuz it's rather expensive. Most
magazines say use Tung oil first, than apply polyurethane or something
of that sort. Last night I read Kingspor's Woodworking Shop catalog
(old copy) page52 ..."The advantage is a consistent quality finished
that will built up to be extremely hard and durable." Further, David
Mark's always praises Tung oil in his Woodworking show on TV, without
elaborate further...

Marks does favor tung oil, because it enhances the natural wood. But he
doesn't use it exclusively (despite what Mrs. Craig thinks). For
high-wear applications, I've seen him use a Maloof mix (tung/poly/BLO).
Same for a bath cabinet (a high humidity application).

To help emphasize what others said about your proposed finish: it would
be like dipping the wood in plastic, then rubbing it with baby oil. The
baby oil might make it look "wet" and shiny, but it wouldn't affect
the wood at all.

Keep asking questions. That's why we're here. :-)

Kevin

In article ,
says...
Last night I read Kingspor's Woodworking Shop catalog
(old copy) page52 ..."The advantage is a consistent quality finished
that will built up to be extremely hard and durable." Further, David
Mark's always praises Tung oil i


I'd recommend you obtain a copy of Bob Flexner's "Understanding Wood
Finishes". It's a good and easy read and will give you a great
foundation on various finishes.

Yes, tung oil is a nice finish when it provides the protection required
by a piece. That is the primary purpose for applying a finish. To
protect the wood from reasonably expected daily use. Looking good is
entirely secondary since, if the finish doesn't provide the needed
protection, the finish will not remain looking good for long.

I don't have a copy of a Klingspore catalog handy so I don't know
exactly what it may or may not say but tung oil is NOT a highly
protective finish. It is not meant to build. If you do manage to apply
enough to get a build it will be neither comparatively hard or
protective.

Use whatever you feel comfortable with but, however I don't care what
the catalog says, if you want a hard really protective finish tung oil
makes no sense and varnish, which contains chemically linking resins
that an oil doesn't, would be the way to go for both protection and
economy of labor and materials used.






--
MikeG
Heirloom Woods
www.heirloom-woods.net

MikeG wrote in message news.com...


1 - polyurethane is a varnish. Coating with a non poly varnish then
following with a poly varnish is redundant and unnecessary

There are polyurethane varnishes and there are water-based polyurethane
finishes that some prefer to NOT call varnishes becuase they are so
different from traditional varnishes.

That said, I don't argue with your conclusion.

3 - Since tung oil is meant to soak into the wood and varnish seals the
wood and forms a film finish over the wood putting the oil on top of the
varnish would be an exercise in futility.

Oddly enough I've been told some folks use oil over shellac and like the
results. I haven't tried it myself.


4 - Oil is an inappropriate finish for a surface that is going to have
heavy use.

Yes. The wood will get dirty from handling and be hard to clean.

--

FF

(Fred the Red Shirt) wrote in
om:

MikeG wrote in message
news.com...

snip

3 - Since tung oil is meant to soak into the wood and varnish seals
the wood and forms a film finish over the wood putting the oil on top
of the varnish would be an exercise in futility.

Oddly enough I've been told some folks use oil over shellac and like
the results. I haven't tried it myself.


But shellac AFTER oil can be a nice treatment. Rubbed out with a nice wax,
after curing, and you get a pleasing finish. Not 'poly-tough', but nice
for many applications not subject to heavy use.

Patriarch

Now you guys have me doubting myself...

I'm finishing up a small (~30"x24") cabinet for a bathroom. It has a maple
case with cherry trim with a frosted glass door framed in cherry. The
shelves will be maple. I was going to finish this with tung oil. It will
be used to hold toiletry type stuff in the bathroom so it might get
occasional water sprayed or splashed on it. Do you think I would be better
off with a poly? I want to retain the original "look" of the wood, just
bring out the grain and give it a bit of a polish. If I do the tung oil and
want to change later to another finish, is that possible?

I want it to look somewhat impressive, it's really my first project, so I
need to impress somebody...;+}
--
-Jim
©¿©¬

If you want to reply by email its -- ryan at jimryan dot com
Please use BCC and lets all avoid spam
"patriarch astDOTnet" patriarch wrote in message
.17...
(Fred the Red Shirt) wrote in
om:

MikeG wrote in message
news.com...

snip

3 - Since tung oil is meant to soak into the wood and varnish seals
the wood and forms a film finish over the wood putting the oil on top
of the varnish would be an exercise in futility.

Oddly enough I've been told some folks use oil over shellac and like
the results. I haven't tried it myself.


But shellac AFTER oil can be a nice treatment. Rubbed out with a nice
wax,
after curing, and you get a pleasing finish. Not 'poly-tough', but nice
for many applications not subject to heavy use.

Patriarch

In article , says...
It will
be used to hold toiletry type stuff in the bathroom so it might get
occasional water sprayed or splashed on it. Do you think I would be better



Hi Jim

Add a coat or three of a good quality paste wax and a very rigorous
schedule of inspection and renewal you could probably be able to get
away with it.

Your real problem would come from standing water left from wet items put
into the closed cabinet. All in all it would probably be more of a
hassle then it would be worth.

However should you decide the oil finish was worth the effort I'd
suggest a Danish oil rather then a straight oil. Danish oils don't have
the resin content of a true varnish but they do have some which will
afford a bit more protection then straight oil would.

What you can do is use a coat or two of oil to enhance the grain then
varnish the piece or go with an oil/wax and see how it stands up. You
can, after removing the wax, always apply a varnish later if the
conditions in the bath prove, as I suspect they will, too much for the
oil only finish.

Good luck

--
MikeG
Heirloom Woods
www.heirloom-woods.net

Since so many varnishes and "Danish" oils also have a tung oil component,
you are in no way limiting yourself by using only tung now. A solvent
clean and varnish application is possible anytime in the future.

That said, I think that there are two components to finish penetration or
adhesion, one for polar, one for nonpolar. The fibers are made to _hold_
water by adsorption, but allow oil to fill the spaces. You may get some
unwelcome effects from not using a barrier finish in such a wet environment.

"jtpr" wrote in message
...
Now you guys have me doubting myself...

I'm finishing up a small (~30"x24") cabinet for a bathroom. It has a
maple
case with cherry trim with a frosted glass door framed in cherry. The
shelves will be maple. I was going to finish this with tung oil. It will
be used to hold toiletry type stuff in the bathroom so it might get
occasional water sprayed or splashed on it. Do you think I would be better
off with a poly? I want to retain the original "look" of the wood, just
bring out the grain and give it a bit of a polish. If I do the tung oil
and
want to change later to another finish, is that possible?

I want it to look somewhat impressive, it's really my first project, so I
need to impress somebody...;+}
--
-Jim
©¿©¬

If you want to reply by email its -- ryan at jimryan dot com
Please use BCC and lets all avoid spam
"patriarch astDOTnet" patriarch wrote in message
.17...
(Fred the Red Shirt) wrote in
om:

MikeG wrote in message
news.com...

snip

3 - Since tung oil is meant to soak into the wood and varnish seals
the wood and forms a film finish over the wood putting the oil on top
of the varnish would be an exercise in futility.

Oddly enough I've been told some folks use oil over shellac and like
the results. I haven't tried it myself.


But shellac AFTER oil can be a nice treatment. Rubbed out with a nice
wax,
after curing, and you get a pleasing finish. Not 'poly-tough', but nice
for many applications not subject to heavy use.

Patriarch

On Tue, 19 Oct 2004 14:53:06 GMT, patriarch
wrote:


But shellac AFTER oil can be a nice treatment. Rubbed out with a nice wax,
after curing, and you get a pleasing finish. Not 'poly-tough', but nice
for many applications not subject to heavy use.

Patriarch


Yeah mon!

The oil pops the figure and the shellac adds some protection.

A really nice finish combo.

Barry

"jtpr" wrote in :

Now you guys have me doubting myself...

I'm finishing up a small (~30"x24") cabinet for a bathroom. It has a
maple case with cherry trim with a frosted glass door framed in
cherry. The shelves will be maple. I was going to finish this with
tung oil. It will be used to hold toiletry type stuff in the bathroom
so it might get occasional water sprayed or splashed on it. Do you
think I would be better off with a poly? I want to retain the
original "look" of the wood, just bring out the grain and give it a
bit of a polish. If I do the tung oil and want to change later to
another finish, is that possible?


Some folks are really happy with Waterlox Original for these types of
things. Higher solids content, some surface build, still looks and feels
close to the wood. Maybe you can find a sample somewhere, without spending
$15....

Patriarch

On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 02:13:43 GMT, patriarch
calmly ranted:

"jtpr" wrote in :

Now you guys have me doubting myself...

I'm finishing up a small (~30"x24") cabinet for a bathroom. It has a
maple case with cherry trim with a frosted glass door framed in
cherry. The shelves will be maple. I was going to finish this with
tung oil. It will be used to hold toiletry type stuff in the bathroom
so it might get occasional water sprayed or splashed on it. Do you
think I would be better off with a poly? I want to retain the
original "look" of the wood, just bring out the grain and give it a
bit of a polish. If I do the tung oil and want to change later to
another finish, is that possible?


Some folks are really happy with Waterlox Original for these types of
things. Higher solids content, some surface build, still looks and feels
close to the wood. Maybe you can find a sample somewhere, without spending
$15....

Yes, straight from www.Waterlox.com, but once he has tried it, he'll
instantly kick himself in the arse and wish he'd ordered a quart or
gallon can size instead.

And, yes. Waterlox is much more easily removed than poly, JT.
The question is "why would you ever do so?"


================================================== ============
Like peace and quiet? Buy a phoneless cord.
http://www/diversify.com/stees.html Hilarious T-shirts online
================================================== ============

OK, OK, I'm sold....

I looked at their website, what product would you recommend?

Tung oil based:
Sealer
Satin
High Gloss

Urethane Based:
Gloss
Satin
Semi-Gloss

Thanks,

--
-Jim
©¿©¬

If you want to reply by email its -- ryan at jimryan dot com
Please use BCC and lets all avoid spam
"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 02:13:43 GMT, patriarch
calmly ranted:

"jtpr" wrote in :

Now you guys have me doubting myself...

I'm finishing up a small (~30"x24") cabinet for a bathroom. It has a
maple case with cherry trim with a frosted glass door framed in
cherry. The shelves will be maple. I was going to finish this with
tung oil. It will be used to hold toiletry type stuff in the bathroom
so it might get occasional water sprayed or splashed on it. Do you
think I would be better off with a poly? I want to retain the
original "look" of the wood, just bring out the grain and give it a
bit of a polish. If I do the tung oil and want to change later to
another finish, is that possible?


Some folks are really happy with Waterlox Original for these types of
things. Higher solids content, some surface build, still looks and feels
close to the wood. Maybe you can find a sample somewhere, without
spending
$15....

Yes, straight from www.Waterlox.com, but once he has tried it, he'll
instantly kick himself in the arse and wish he'd ordered a quart or
gallon can size instead.

And, yes. Waterlox is much more easily removed than poly, JT.
The question is "why would you ever do so?"


================================================== ============
Like peace and quiet? Buy a phoneless cord.
http://www/diversify.com/stees.html Hilarious T-shirts online
================================================== ============

On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 14:48:48 -0400, "jtpr" calmly
ranted:

OK, OK, I'm sold....

I looked at their website, what product would you recommend?

Tung oil based:
Sealer
Satin
High Gloss

http://www.waterlox.com/product.cfm?productid=6
I prefer their Original Satin product. YMMV because
I degloss it every time. They state that you don't have
to sand between coats but I always denib each coat with
scotchbrite anyway.

I thought they had free samples but it appears that you'll
have to pay shipping even for the 2 oz. samples. If SWMBO
is sensitive to finish smells, the citrus might work. It's
new to me and I haven't yet smelled it.


Urethane Based:
Gloss
Satin
Semi-Gloss

Er, NO times 3. I'm not a fan of polyurinestain.


--

From time to time, we have been tempted to believe that society has
become too complex to be managed by self-rule, that government by
an elite group is superior to government for, by, and of the people.
But if no one among us is capable of governing himself, then who
among us has the capacity to govern someone else?
All of us together, in and out of government, must bear the
burden. The solutions we seek must be equitable, with no one
group singled out to pay a higher price.

-President Ronald Reagan
First Inaugural Address
Tuesday, January 20, 1981

Lately I've been using a lot of Tung Oil - for some natural looking shelves,
boxes, etc. I'm really happy with the result - looks great. Expecially on
some figured wood.

Now - I have quite a load of cherry - I plan on making a dining room table
with it. Is it feasible to start with Tung Oil, and finish off with 2 or 3
coats of a Polly?


Brian


"BlueDude" wrote in message
...

I have never use tung oil (mainly due cost) on all my projects,
instead I use varnish than finished it with as many coats (sanded
between each coating) of polyurethane as needed to get good finished.
However, if for example I need to finish a heavy use, long-lasting
cabinet door knob, shall I first varnish it, sanded and finished it
with as many coats of tung oil?

Please advice and thanking all in advance for replying.

On Thu, 21 Oct 2004 14:24:26 -0400, "B Man" wrote:


Now - I have quite a load of cherry - I plan on making a dining room table
with it. Is it feasible to start with Tung Oil, and finish off with 2 or 3
coats of a Polly?

Yes.

One could also use a product like McCloskey's Gymseal, which is a
urethane / tung oil blend right from the can.

Other choices after the oil might include Waterlox Original, Waterlox
Urethane, or Behlen's Rock Hard Table Top Varnish.

Barry

In article ,
says...
Now - I have quite a load of cherry - I plan on making a dining room table
with it. Is it feasible to start with Tung Oil, and finish off with 2 or 3
coats of a Polly?




Yes


--
MikeG
Heirloom Woods
www.heirloom-woods.net

On Thu, 21 Oct 2004 14:24:26 -0400, "B Man" calmly
ranted:

Lately I've been using a lot of Tung Oil - for some natural looking shelves,
boxes, etc. I'm really happy with the result - looks great. Expecially on
some figured wood.

Now - I have quite a load of cherry - I plan on making a dining room table
with it. Is it feasible to start with Tung Oil, and finish off with 2 or 3
coats of a Polly?

Give Waterlox Original a try. It combines tung oil and varnish in
a nice hand-applied finish. The look on cherry is stunning.

I am of the opinion that it would be tough enough for a dining room
table, but if you simply must saran-wrap it (heresy on cherry), you
could always add it over the Waterlox.

--
Like they say, 99% of lawyers give the rest a bad name.
------------------------------------------------------
http://diversify.com Lawyer-free Website Development