This has been going around. Although it is not considered to be the actual
sniper event, it is a good portrayal. And it shows some navy humor as well.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com:80/33...752c73.jpg?v=0

"Charlie Self" wrote

Mike Marlow wrote

While not claiming the 1911 to be the most accurate gun ever developed,
or even a highly accurate gun, the vast majority of problems hitting the
broad
side of a barn with a 1911 is really the hand holding the gun, and not
the gun.

--

-Mike-


/You never got one straight out of the box, still in cosmoline, to make
/a statement like that. After 20-25 hours of work, they're fine. Before
/that, they quality as semi-assembled and semi-accurate.


Kind of like buying cheap tools? After lots of fussing and tuning, you
get really good results.

--
If you're going to be dumb, you better be tough

"Morris Dovey" wrote in message ...
Mike Marlow wrote:

While not claiming the 1911 to be the most accurate gun ever developed, or
even a highly accurate gun, the vast majority of problems hitting the broad
side of a barn with a 1911 is really the hand holding the gun, and not the
gun.

That's probably why this was the .45 I was issued:

http://thunderbirdarmory.webs.com/Grease%20Gun.bmp

It helps if you're /inside/ the barn. :-)

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/


Just what I always wanted!!!!!

A shoulder-mounted grease gun.

Sure wish I had one of these when I had a car that had fittings.

P D Q - Laughing all the way.

Charlie Self wrote:
On Apr 20, 9:11 am, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:
"Charlie Self" wrote in message

...
On Apr 19, 5:12 pm, "MikeWhy" wrote:



"Tom Watson" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 17 Apr 2009 18:40:31 -0500, "MikeWhy"
wrote:
At the end of the 80' tow rope? I think I could do that with a target
pistol, sitting on a gyro stabilized gun mount. Gyro stabilized sniper
rifles my shaven behind.
Y'all must be one hell of a better pistol shot than me.
I don't think I can hit anything at 80' with my 1911.
I was very careful to write "target pistol".
True. And the 1911s we were stuck with in the Marines were far better
up close where you could whap someone on the head with the thing, or
throw it like a rock.



While not claiming the 1911 to be the most accurate gun ever developed, or
even a highly accurate gun, the vast majority of problems hitting the broad
side of a barn with a 1911 is really the hand holding the gun, and not the
gun.

--

-Mike-


You never got one straight out of the box, still in cosmoline, to make
a statement like that. After 20-25 hours of work, they're fine. Before
that, they quality as semi-assembled and semi-accurate.
I never saw a DI or Plt Sgt that would let you have a weapon that was
anything other than pristine. Even after shooting it was field stripped
and CLEANED. When you got a new one the first thing before cleaning it
you CLEANED it.

Dave

"notbob" wrote in message
...
On 2009-04-20, CW wrote:

shot with a pistol takes more than the amount of training given to the
average soldier.

Yep. The good pistol shots are averaging 50K rounds per year. That's
about
500 rnds per weekend, every weekend.

nb

Well - the good match shooters would probably go through that number of
rounds, but it does not take anywhere near that to become a good shot with a
pistol - 1911 or not.

--

-Mike-

"Charlie Self" wrote in message
...


While not claiming the 1911 to be the most accurate gun ever developed, or
even a highly accurate gun, the vast majority of problems hitting the
broad
side of a barn with a 1911 is really the hand holding the gun, and not the
gun.

--

-Mike-


You never got one straight out of the box, still in cosmoline, to make
a statement like that. After 20-25 hours of work, they're fine. Before
that, they quality as semi-assembled and semi-accurate.



I'd have to ask what kind of work you did to make it accurate. I can see
making it feed better, but I'm really wondering what you did to improve
accuracy.

--

-Mike-

-MIKE- writes:

notbob wrote:
Ok, let me get this straight.
You call a 500ft. Navy Destroyer with a 9000 ton displacement a boat?

I can see this is pointless. Toodles.

nb

I take it by your juvenile reply, that you either didn't read any of the
accounts of the event or sobered up and realized you were spewing BS. :-)

Agreed.

When the arguments get tough, the bull****ters retreat......

On Apr 21, 4:41*am, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:
"Charlie Self" wrote in message

...



While not claiming the 1911 to be the most accurate gun ever developed, or
even a highly accurate gun, the vast majority of problems hitting the
broad
side of a barn with a 1911 is really the hand holding the gun, and not the
gun.

--

-Mike-


You never got one straight out of the box, still in cosmoline, to make
a statement like that. After 20-25 hours of work, they're fine. Before
that, they quality as semi-assembled and semi-accurate.



I'd have to ask what kind of work you did to make it accurate. *I can see
making it feed better, but I'm really wondering what you did to improve
accuracy.


I didn't do ****. It was an issue weapon that I got to use for maybe
two weeks. If you have to ask...how about lightening the trigger pull,
while also making sure the trigger pull was more consistent?

Certainly the feed can be improved, generally by using a non-G.I.
magazine. Add adjustable sights, usually a high viz combat style.
Various combat grips improve holding. Front strap checkering, or other
form of grip adding at that point. Add target barrel bushings and a
target grade barrel.

There are plenty more. If you want a good treatise, pick up The
Combat .45 Automatic by Bill Wilson, publishing by Wilson's Gun Shop
in 1984.

On Sun, 26 Apr 2009 12:05:46 -0700 (PDT), Charlie Self
wrote:


Thought this might be of some interest:
The FBI negotiators arrived on scene, and talked the pirates into sending their
wounded man over for treatment Saturday morning. Later that afternoon, the
SEAL's sent over their RHIB with food and water to recon the life boat but the
pirates shot at it. They could have taken them out then (from being fired upon)
but were denied again being told that the captain was not in "imminent danger."
The FBI negotiators calmed the situation by informing the pirates of threatening
weather as they could see storm clouds closing from the horizon, and offered to
tow the life boat. The pirates agreed, and BAINBRIDGE took them under tow in
their wake at 30 meters-- exactly 30 meters, which is exactly the distance the
SEALs practice their shooting skills.

With the lifeboat under tow, riding comfortably bow-down on BAINBRIDGE's
wake-wave ("rooster tail"), had a 17-second period of harmonic motion, and at
the end of every half-period (8.5 seconds) was steady on. The light-enhanced
(infra-red heat) monocular scopes on the SEAL's .308 caliber Mark 11 Mod 0 H&K
suppressor-fitted sniper rifles easily imaged their target very clearly. Pirates
in a life boat at 30-meters could be compared to fish in a barrel.

All that was necessary was to take out the plexiglass window so that it would
not deflect the trajectory of the high velocity .308 round. So, a sniper (one of
four) with a wad-cutter round (a flaxen sabot) would take out the window a split
second before the kill-shot-- no change in sight-picture, just the window
blowing out, clean.

After medically attending to the wounded pirated, and feeding him, come first
light (from the east) on Easter Sunday morning and the pirates saw they were
being towed further out to sea (instead of westward toward land), the wounded
pirate demanded to be returned to the lifeboat. There would BE NO more
negotiations-- and, the four Navy SEAL snipers "in the bubble" went "Unlock."

The pirate holding Captain Philips raised the gun to his head, and IMMINENT
DANGER was so observed and noted in the Log as CO BAINBRIDGE gave the classic
order: WEAPONS RELEASED! I can hear the echo in my earpiece now, "On my count
(from 8.5 seconds), 3, 2, 1, !" POP, BANG! Out went the window, followed by
three simultaneous shots. The scoreboard flashed: "GAME OVER, GAME OVER-- NAVY
3, PIRATES 0!"


I didn't do ****. It was an issue weapon that I got to use for maybe
two weeks. If you have to ask...how about lightening the trigger pull,
while also making sure the trigger pull was more consistent?

Certainly the feed can be improved, generally by using a non-G.I.
magazine. Add adjustable sights, usually a high viz combat style.
Various combat grips improve holding. Front strap checkering, or other
form of grip adding at that point. Add target barrel bushings and a
target grade barrel.

There are plenty more. If you want a good treatise, pick up The
Combat .45 Automatic by Bill Wilson, publishing by Wilson's Gun Shop
in 1984.


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

mac davis wrote:
On Sun, 26 Apr 2009 12:05:46 -0700 (PDT), Charlie Self
wrote:


Thought this might be of some interest:
The FBI negotiators arrived on scene, and talked the pirates into sending their
wounded man over for treatment Saturday morning. Later that afternoon, the
SEAL's sent over their RHIB with food and water to recon the life boat but the
pirates shot at it. They could have taken them out then (from being fired upon)
but were denied again being told that the captain was not in "imminent danger."
The FBI negotiators calmed the situation by informing the pirates of threatening
weather as they could see storm clouds closing from the horizon, and offered to
tow the life boat. The pirates agreed, and BAINBRIDGE took them under tow in
their wake at 30 meters-- exactly 30 meters, which is exactly the distance the
SEALs practice their shooting skills.

With the lifeboat under tow, riding comfortably bow-down on BAINBRIDGE's
wake-wave ("rooster tail"), had a 17-second period of harmonic motion, and at
the end of every half-period (8.5 seconds) was steady on. The light-enhanced
(infra-red heat) monocular scopes on the SEAL's .308 caliber Mark 11 Mod 0 H&K
suppressor-fitted sniper rifles easily imaged their target very clearly. Pirates
in a life boat at 30-meters could be compared to fish in a barrel.

All that was necessary was to take out the plexiglass window so that it would
not deflect the trajectory of the high velocity .308 round. So, a sniper (one of
four) with a wad-cutter round (a flaxen sabot) would take out the window a split
second before the kill-shot-- no change in sight-picture, just the window
blowing out, clean.

After medically attending to the wounded pirated, and feeding him, come first
light (from the east) on Easter Sunday morning and the pirates saw they were
being towed further out to sea (instead of westward toward land), the wounded
pirate demanded to be returned to the lifeboat. There would BE NO more
negotiations-- and, the four Navy SEAL snipers "in the bubble" went "Unlock."

The pirate holding Captain Philips raised the gun to his head, and IMMINENT
DANGER was so observed and noted in the Log as CO BAINBRIDGE gave the classic
order: WEAPONS RELEASED! I can hear the echo in my earpiece now, "On my count
(from 8.5 seconds), 3, 2, 1, !" POP, BANG! Out went the window, followed by
three simultaneous shots. The scoreboard flashed: "GAME OVER, GAME OVER-- NAVY
3, PIRATES 0!"


Do you have a source for this?


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

"Charlie Self" wrote in message
...
On Apr 21, 4:41 am, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:
"Charlie Self" wrote in message

...



While not claiming the 1911 to be the most accurate gun ever developed,
or
even a highly accurate gun, the vast majority of problems hitting the
broad
side of a barn with a 1911 is really the hand holding the gun, and not
the
gun.

--

-Mike-


You never got one straight out of the box, still in cosmoline, to make
a statement like that. After 20-25 hours of work, they're fine. Before
that, they quality as semi-assembled and semi-accurate.



I'd have to ask what kind of work you did to make it accurate. I can see
making it feed better, but I'm really wondering what you did to improve
accuracy.


I didn't do ****. It was an issue weapon that I got to use for maybe
two weeks. If you have to ask...how about lightening the trigger pull,
while also making sure the trigger pull was more consistent?

Certainly the feed can be improved, generally by using a non-G.I.
magazine. Add adjustable sights, usually a high viz combat style.
Various combat grips improve holding. Front strap checkering, or other
form of grip adding at that point. Add target barrel bushings and a
target grade barrel.

There are plenty more. If you want a good treatise, pick up The
Combat .45 Automatic by Bill Wilson, publishing by Wilson's Gun Shop
in 1984.

************************************************** *******************************


Those are certainly improvements that can be made to a service issue 1911,
but I'll stand by my original statement - having shot plenty of rounds
through guns like these.

--

-Mike-

On Sun, 26 Apr 2009 20:48:25 -0500, -MIKE- wrote:


Do you have a source for this?

Mike.. This is the entire email..
I think it was originally a post on a forum, for the look of it, but that's just
a guess..
It appears to be stepped on and forwarded several times before I got it:



Subject: FW: MORE ON PIRATES
Would appear our Navy is rather capable when permitted to do it's job.

From recently retired VADM JG Cotton, former Chief of Navy Reserve/ Commander
Navy Reserve Force, USNA 73:

From the net...courtesy of Henry...

This event is long over, but the repercussions from it are not. I have not read
a better description of the saga of the Alabama Mersk; nor a better and more
interesting sea story in a long while. I bemoan the fact that our press is so
poor that they rank below 17% in a poll defining job approval, only slightly
below the Congress. So thank God for the internet and those who shine a light
out there. H

All: I second the remarks of previous pass-throughs (more than a few Naval
Academy alumni, including a classmate whom I thank) and add that the well
written and readable summary including geographic orientation and subsequent
events should earn that author public favorable recognition for the timeliness
of his report. I only hope that it gets the recognition it deserves.and that it
be made promptly. JRP

Subject: Fw: US Navy vs. Pirates, Version Number 3
Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2009 19:44:52 GMT

For what it is worth ALL of my back door msg traffic and info indicates that
this is the most accurate summary of all. Sure compliment the Captain who made
the decision to get on with it,-----i.e. cleared to FIRE, with great results.

Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2009 05:59:28 -0400
Subject: Pirate Saga Details

Forwarded FYI. This sounds like the real story as it fits with other accounts
but makes more sense.
Your "Real" story is not exactly the way I heard it, and probably has a few
political twists thrown in to stir the pot. Rather than me trying to correct it,
I'll just tell you what I found out from my contacts at NSWC Norfolk and at
SOCOM Tampa.


First though, let me orient you to familiarize you with the "terrain."

In Africa from Djibouti at the southern end of the Red Sea eastward through the
Gulf of Aden to round Cape Guardafui at the easternmost tip of Africa (also
known as "The Horn of Africa") is about a 600 nm transit before you stand out
into the Indian Ocean. That transit is comparable in distance to that from the
mouth of the Mississippi at New Orleans to the tip of Florida at Key West--
except that 600 nm over there is infested with Somalia pirates.

Ships turning southward at the Horn of Africa transit the SLOC (Sea Lane of
Commerce) along the east coast of Somalia because of the prevailing southerly
currents there. It's about 1,500 nm on to Mombassa, which is just south of the
equator in Kenya. Comparably, that's about the transit distance from Portland
Maine down the east coast of the US to Miami Florida. In other words, the ocean
area being patrolled by our naval forces off the coast of Somalia is comparable
to that in the Gulf of Mexico from the Mississippi River east to Miami then up
the eastern seaboard to Maine.

Second, let me globally orient you from our Naval Operating Base in Norfolk, VA,
east across the Atlantic to North Africa, thence across the Med to Suez in
Egypt, thence southward down the Red Sea to Djibouti at the Gulf of Aden, thence
eastward to round Cape Guardafui at the easternmost tip of Africa, and thence
southerly some 300 miles down the east cost of Somali out into the high seas of
the Indian Ocean to the position of MV ALABAMA is a little more than 7,000 nm,
and plus-nine time-zones ahead of EST.

Hold that thought, in that, a C-17 transport averaging a little better than 400
kts (SOG) takes the best part of 18 hours to make that trip. In the evening
darkness late Thursday night, a team of Navy SEALs from NSWC (Naval Surface
Warfare Center) Norfolk parachuted from such a C-17 into the black waters (no
refraction of light) of the Indian Ocean-- close-aboard to our 40,000 ton
amphibious assault ship, USS BOXER (LHD 4), the flagship of our ESG
(Expeditionary Strike Group) in the AOR (Area Of Responsibility, the Gulf of
Aden). They not only parachuted in with all of their "equipment," they had their
own inflatable boats, RHIB's (Rigid Hull, Inflatable Boats) with them for
over-water transport. They went into BOXER's landing dock, debarked, and staged
for the rescue-- Thursday night.

And, let me comment on time-late: In that the SEAL's quick response-- departing
ready-alert in less than 4 hours from Norfolk-- supposedly surprised POTUS's
staff, whereas President Obama was miffed not to get his "cops" there before the
Navy. He reportedly questioned his staff, "Will 'my' FBI people get there before
the Navy does?" It took the FBI almost 12 hours to put together a team and get
them packed-up-- for an "at sea" rescue. The FBI was trying to tell him that
they are not practiced to do this-- Navy SEALs are. But, BHO wanted the FBI
there "to help," that is, carry out the Attorney General's (his) orders to
negotiate the release of Captain Phillips peacefully-- because apparently he
doesn't trust GW's military to carry out his "political guidance."

The flight of the FBI's passenger jet took a little less than 14 hours at
500-some knots to get to Djibouti. BOXER'S helos picked them up and transported
them out to the ship. The Navy SEALs were already there, staged, and ready to
act by the time POTUS's FBI arrived on board latter that evening. Notably, the
first request by the OSC (On Scene Commander) that early Friday morning to take
them out and save Captain Phillips was denied, to wit: "No, wait until 'my' FBI
people get there."

Third, please consider a candid assessment of ability that finds that the FBI
snipers had never practiced shooting from a rolling, pitching, yawing, surging,
swaying, heaving platform-- and, target-- such as a ship and a lifeboat on the
high seas. Navies have been doing since Admiral Nelson who had trained "Marines"
to shoot muskets from the ship's rigging-- ironically, he was killed at sea in
HMS VICTORY at the Battle of Trafalgar by a French Marine rifleman that shot him
from the rigging of the French ship that they were grappling alongside.

Notably, when I was first training at USNA in 1955, the Navy was doing it with a
SATU, Small Arms Training Unit, based at our Little Creek amphib base. Now, Navy
SEAL's, in particular SEAL Team SIX (The "DevGru") based at NSWC (Naval Surface
Warfare Center) at Little Creek do that training now, and hone their skills
professionally-- daily. Shooting small arms from a ship is more of an
accomplished "Art Form" than it is a practiced skill. When you are "in the
bubble" and "in tune" with the harmonic motion you find, through practice, that
you are "able to put three .308 slugs inside the head of a quarter at 100
meters, in day or night-- or, behind a camouflaged net or a thin enclosure, such
as a superstructure bulkhead. Yes, we have the monocular scopes that can "see"
heat-- and, draw a bead on it. SEALs are absolutely expert at it-- with the
movie clips to prove it.

Okay, now try to imagine patrolling among the boats fishing everyday out on the
Grand Banks off our New England coast, and then responding to a distress call
from down around the waters between Florida and the Bahamas. Three points for
you to consider he (1) Time-Distance-Speed relationships for ships on the
high seas, for instance, at a 25-knot SOA (Speed Of Advance) it takes 24 hours
to make good 600 nm-- BAINBRIDGE did. (2) Fishermen work on the high seas, and
(3) The best place to hide as a "fisherman" pirate is among other fishermen

Early Wednesday morning, 4/8/2009, MV ALABAMA is at sea in the IO about 300
miles off the (east) coast of Somalia en route to Mombassa Kenya. Pirates in
small boat start harassing her, and threatening her with weapons. MV ALABAMA's
captain sent out the distress call by radio, and ordered his Engineer to shut
down the engines as well as the ship-service electrical generators-- in our
lingo, "Go dark and cold." He informed his crew by radio what was happening, and
ordered them to go to an out-of-the-way compartment and lock themselves in it--
from the inside. He would stay in the pilot house to "negotiate" with the
pirates.

The pirates boarded, captured the Captain, and ordered him to start the engines.
He said he would order his Engineer to do so, and he called down to Engine
Control on the internal communication system, but got no answer. The lead pirate
ordered two of his four men to go down and find him and get the engines started.

Inside a ship without any lights is like the definition of dark. The advantage
goes to the people who work and live there. They jumped the two pirates in a
dark passageway. Both pirates lost their weapons, but one managed to scramble
and get away. The other they tied up, put tape over his mouth and a knife at his
throat.

Other members of the crew opened the drain cocks on the pirates boat and cast it
adrift. It foundered and sunk. The scrambling pirate made it back to the pilot
house and told of his demise. The pirates took the Captain at gun point, and
told him to launch one of his rescue boats (not a life boat, per se). As he was
lowering the boat for them, the crew appeared with the other pirate to negotiate
a trade. The crew let their hostage go to soon, and the pirates kept the
captain. But, he purposefully had lowered the boat so it would jam.

With the rescue boat jammed, the pirates jumped over to a lifeboat and released
it as the captain jumped in the water. They fired at him, made him stop, and
grabbed him out of the water. Now, as night falls in the vastness of the Indian
Ocean, we have the classic "Mexican" standoff, to wit: A life-boat that is just
that, a life-boat adrift without any means of propulsion except oars and
paddles; and, a huge (by comparison) Motor Vessel Container Ship adrift with a
crew that is not going to leave their captain behind. The pirates are enclosed
under its shelter-covering, holding the captain as their hostage. The crew is
hunkered down in their ship waiting for the "posse" to arrive.

After receiving MV ALABAMA'S distress call, USS BAINBRIDGE (DDG 96) was
dispatched by the ESG commander to respond to ALABAMA's distress call. At best
sustainable speed, she arrived on scene the day after-- that is, in the dark of
that early Thursday morning. As BAINBRIDGE quietly and slowly, at darkened-ship
without any lights to give her away, arrived on scene, please consider a
recorded interview with the Chief Engineer of MV ALABAMA describing BAINBRIDGE's
arrival. He said it was something else "... to see the Navy slide in there like
a greyhound!" He then said as she slipped in closer he could see the "Stars and
Stripes" flying from her masthead. He got choked up saying it was the
"...proudest moment of my life."

Phew! Let that sink in.
Earlier in the day, one of the U.S. Navy's Maritime Patrol Aircraft, a fixed
wing P3C, flew over to recon the scene. They dropped a buoy with a radio to the
pirates so that the Navy's interpreter could talk with the pirates. When
BAINBRIDGE arrived, the pirates thought the radio to be a beaconing device, and
threw it overboard. They wanted a satellite telephone so that they could call
home for help. Remember now, they are fishermen, not "Rocket Scientists," in
that, they don't know that we can intercept the phone transmission also.

MV ALABAMA provided them with a satellite phone. They called home back to
"somebody" in Eyl Somalia (so that we now know where you live) to come out and
get them. The "somebody" in Eyl said they would be out right away with other
hostages, like 54 of them from other countries, and that they would be coming
out in two of their pirated ships. Right-- and, the tooth fairy will let you
have sex with her. Yea, in paradise. The "somebody" in Eyl just chalked up four
more expendables as overhead for "the cost of operation." Next page.

Anyway, ESG will continue to "watch" Eyl for any ships standing out.

The Navy SEAL team, SEAL TEAM SIX, from NSWC briefed the OSC (Commander
Castellano, CO BAINBRIDGE) on how they could rescue the captain from the life
boat with swimmers-- "Combat Swimmers," per se. That plan was denied by POTUS
because it put the captain in danger-- and, involved killing the pirates.

The FBI negotiators arrived on scene, and talked the pirates into sending their
wounded man over for treatment Saturday morning. Later that afternoon, the
SEAL's sent over their RHIB with food and water to recon the life boat but the
pirates shot at it. They could have taken them out then (from being fired upon)
but were denied again being told that the captain was not in "imminent danger."
The FBI negotiators calmed the situation by informing the pirates of threatening
weather as they could see storm clouds closing from the horizon, and offered to
tow the life boat. The pirates agreed, and BAINBRIDGE took them under tow in
their wake at 30 meters-- exactly 30 meters, which is exactly the distance the
SEALs practice their shooting skills.

With the lifeboat under tow, riding comfortably bow-down on BAINBRIDGE's
wake-wave ("rooster tail"), had a 17-second period of harmonic motion, and at
the end of every half-period (8.5 seconds) was steady on. The light-enhanced
(infra-red heat) monocular scopes on the SEAL's .308 caliber Mark 11 Mod 0 H&K
suppressor-fitted sniper rifles easily imaged their target very clearly. Pirates
in a life boat at 30-meters could be compared to fish in a barrel. All that was
necessary was to take out the plexiglass window so that it would not deflect the
trajectory of the high velocity .308 round. So, a sniper (one of four) with a
wad-cutter round (a flaxen sabot) would take out the window a split second
before the kill-shot-- no change in sight-picture, just the window blowing out,
clean.

Now, here's the part BHO's "whiz kids" knew as well as the Navy hierarchy,
including CO BAINBRIDGE and CO SEAL TEAM SIX. It's the law in Article 19 of
Appendix L in the "Convention of the High Seas" that the Commanding Officer of a
US Ship on the high seas is obligated to respond to distress signals from any
flagged ship (US or otherwise), and protect the life and property thereof when
deemed to be in IMMINENT DANGER. So, in the final analysis, it would be Captain
Castellano call as to "Imminent Danger," and that he alone was obligated (duty
bound) to act accordingly.

Got the picture?

After medically attending to the wounded pirated, and feeding him, come first
light (from the east) on Easter Sunday morning and the pirates saw they were
being towed further out to sea (instead of westward toward land), the wounded
pirate demanded to be returned to the lifeboat. There would BE NO more
negotiations-- and, the four Navy SEAL snipers "in the bubble" went "Unlock."
The pirate holding Captain Philips raised the gun to his head, and IMMINENT
DANGER was so observed and noted in the Log as CO BAINBRIDGE gave the classic
order: WEAPONS RELEASED! I can hear the echo in my earpiece now, "On my count
(from 8.5 seconds), 3, 2, 1, !" POP, BANG! Out went the window, followed by
three simultaneous shots. The scoreboard flashed: "GAME OVER, GAME OVER-- NAVY
3, PIRATES 0!"

I hope you found the above informative as best I know it-- and, please excuse me
in that after more than 50 years the Navy is still in me. I submit that AMERICA
is going to make a comeback, and more than likely it'll be on the back of our
cherished youth serving with honor in Our military. So, let's Look Up, Get Up --
and, Never Give Up!



mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

Do you have a source for this?

Mike.. This is the entire email..
I think it was originally a post on a forum, for the look of it, but that's just
a guess..
It appears to be stepped on and forwarded several times before I got it:



I googled a snippet and found it online, probably the same forum you
referenced.
Thanks.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On Apr 20, 10:07*pm, "David G. Nagel"
wrote:
Charlie Self wrote:
On Apr 20, 9:11 am, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:
"Charlie Self" wrote in message

....
On Apr 19, 5:12 pm, "MikeWhy" wrote:

"Tom Watson" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 17 Apr 2009 18:40:31 -0500, "MikeWhy"
wrote:
At the end of the 80' tow rope? I think I could do that with a target
pistol, sitting on a gyro stabilized gun mount. Gyro stabilized sniper
rifles my shaven behind.
Y'all must be one hell of a better pistol shot than me.
I don't think I can hit anything at 80' with my 1911.
I was very careful to write "target pistol".
True. And the 1911s we were stuck with in the Marines were far better
up close where you could whap someone on the head with the thing, or
throw it like a rock.

While not claiming the 1911 to be the most accurate gun ever developed, or
even a highly accurate gun, the vast majority of problems hitting the broad
side of a barn with a 1911 is really the hand holding the gun, and not the
gun.

--

-Mike-


You never got one straight out of the box, still in cosmoline, to make
a statement like that. After 20-25 hours of work, they're fine. Before
that, they quality as semi-assembled and semi-accurate.

I never saw a DI or Plt Sgt that would let you have a weapon that was
anything other than pristine. Even after shooting it was field stripped
and CLEANED. When you got a new one the first thing before cleaning it
you CLEANED it.

Dave

Oh, really? I must have been hallucinating, then.

"Charlie Self" wrote in message
...
On Apr 20, 10:07 pm, "David G. Nagel"
wrote:
Charlie Self wrote:
On Apr 20, 9:11 am, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:
"Charlie Self" wrote in message

...
On Apr 19, 5:12 pm, "MikeWhy" wrote:

"Tom Watson" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 17 Apr 2009 18:40:31 -0500, "MikeWhy"
wrote:
At the end of the 80' tow rope? I think I could do that with a
target
pistol, sitting on a gyro stabilized gun mount. Gyro stabilized
sniper
rifles my shaven behind.
Y'all must be one hell of a better pistol shot than me.
I don't think I can hit anything at 80' with my 1911.
I was very careful to write "target pistol".
True. And the 1911s we were stuck with in the Marines were far better
up close where you could whap someone on the head with the thing, or
throw it like a rock.

While not claiming the 1911 to be the most accurate gun ever developed,
or
even a highly accurate gun, the vast majority of problems hitting the
broad
side of a barn with a 1911 is really the hand holding the gun, and not
the
gun.

--

-Mike-


You never got one straight out of the box, still in cosmoline, to make
a statement like that. After 20-25 hours of work, they're fine. Before
that, they quality as semi-assembled and semi-accurate.

I never saw a DI or Plt Sgt that would let you have a weapon that was
anything other than pristine. Even after shooting it was field stripped
and CLEANED. When you got a new one the first thing before cleaning it
you CLEANED it.

Dave

Oh, really? I must have been hallucinating, then.

************************************************** *************************

Well hell - that explains it all...

--

-Mike-

On Apr 28, 8:30*am, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:
"Charlie Self" wrote in message

...
On Apr 20, 10:07 pm, "David G. Nagel"
wrote:



Charlie Self wrote:
On Apr 20, 9:11 am, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:
"Charlie Self" wrote in message

...
On Apr 19, 5:12 pm, "MikeWhy" wrote:

"Tom Watson" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 17 Apr 2009 18:40:31 -0500, "MikeWhy"
wrote:
At the end of the 80' tow rope? I think I could do that with a
target
pistol, sitting on a gyro stabilized gun mount. Gyro stabilized
sniper
rifles my shaven behind.
Y'all must be one hell of a better pistol shot than me.
I don't think I can hit anything at 80' with my 1911.
I was very careful to write "target pistol".
True. And the 1911s we were stuck with in the Marines were far better
up close where you could whap someone on the head with the thing, or
throw it like a rock.

While not claiming the 1911 to be the most accurate gun ever developed,
or
even a highly accurate gun, the vast majority of problems hitting the
broad
side of a barn with a 1911 is really the hand holding the gun, and not
the
gun.

--

-Mike-


You never got one straight out of the box, still in cosmoline, to make
a statement like that. After 20-25 hours of work, they're fine. Before
that, they quality as semi-assembled and semi-accurate.

I never saw a DI or Plt Sgt that would let you have a weapon that was
anything other than pristine. Even after shooting it was field stripped
and CLEANED. When you got a new one the first thing before cleaning it
you CLEANED it.

Dave

Oh, really? I must have been hallucinating, then.

************************************************** *************************

Well hell - that explains it all...

--

-Mike-


Anyone who thought 51 years ago that a Drill Instructor or armorer was
going to clean up a weapon for a Marine boot WAS hallucinating.
Whether or not that works that way now, I don't know. Anyone who
called a Drill Instructor a DI 51 years ago would find a boot stuck up
his ass, so what the hell. I know that Jack Webb started that
changeover a year or two after I got out of Parris Island. These days,
I'd almost be willing to accept Marines wearing pants instead of
trousers.

"Charlie Self" wrote in message
...
On Apr 28, 8:30 am, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:
"Charlie Self" wrote in message

...
On Apr 20, 10:07 pm, "David G. Nagel"
wrote:



Charlie Self wrote:
On Apr 20, 9:11 am, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:
"Charlie Self" wrote in message

...
On Apr 19, 5:12 pm, "MikeWhy" wrote:

"Tom Watson" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 17 Apr 2009 18:40:31 -0500, "MikeWhy"
wrote:
At the end of the 80' tow rope? I think I could do that with a
target
pistol, sitting on a gyro stabilized gun mount. Gyro stabilized
sniper
rifles my shaven behind.
Y'all must be one hell of a better pistol shot than me.
I don't think I can hit anything at 80' with my 1911.
I was very careful to write "target pistol".
True. And the 1911s we were stuck with in the Marines were far better
up close where you could whap someone on the head with the thing, or
throw it like a rock.

While not claiming the 1911 to be the most accurate gun ever
developed,
or
even a highly accurate gun, the vast majority of problems hitting the
broad
side of a barn with a 1911 is really the hand holding the gun, and
not
the
gun.

--

-Mike-


You never got one straight out of the box, still in cosmoline, to make
a statement like that. After 20-25 hours of work, they're fine. Before
that, they quality as semi-assembled and semi-accurate.

I never saw a DI or Plt Sgt that would let you have a weapon that was
anything other than pristine. Even after shooting it was field stripped
and CLEANED. When you got a new one the first thing before cleaning it
you CLEANED it.

Dave

Oh, really? I must have been hallucinating, then.

************************************************** *************************

Well hell - that explains it all...

--

-Mike-


Anyone who thought 51 years ago that a Drill Instructor or armorer was
going to clean up a weapon for a Marine boot WAS hallucinating.
Whether or not that works that way now, I don't know. Anyone who
called a Drill Instructor a DI 51 years ago would find a boot stuck up
his ass, so what the hell. I know that Jack Webb started that
changeover a year or two after I got out of Parris Island. These days,
I'd almost be willing to accept Marines wearing pants instead of
trousers.

=======
I'm very sure that's not what he meant, and it definitely isn't what he
wrote. I'd try to translate, but it reads fine and doesn't need
clarification.

On 2009-04-27, mac davis wrote:

It appears to be stepped on......

The understatement of the century!

you are "able to put three .308 slugs inside the head of a quarter at 100
meters, in day or night-- or, behind a camouflaged net or a thin enclosure, such
as a superstructure bulkhead. Yes, we have the monocular scopes that can "see"
heat-- and, draw a bead on it. SEALs are absolutely expert at it-- with the
movie clips to prove it.

Chrystonacrutch! The entire population of Ireland Riverdanced on this one.
Anyone got the Youtube link? eyeroll

nb

On Mon, 20 Apr 2009 06:01:23 -0700 (PDT), Charlie Self
wrote:

On Apr 19, 5:12*pm, "MikeWhy" wrote:
"Tom Watson" wrote in message

...

On Fri, 17 Apr 2009 18:40:31 -0500, "MikeWhy"
wrote:

At the end of the 80' tow rope? I think I could do that with a target
pistol, sitting on a gyro stabilized gun mount. Gyro stabilized sniper
rifles my shaven behind.

Y'all must be one hell of a better pistol shot than me.

I don't think I can hit anything at 80' with my 1911.

I was very careful to write "target pistol".

True. And the 1911s we were stuck with in the Marines were far better
up close where you could whap someone on the head with the thing, or
throw it like a rock.

....I managed to wangle a 1911 as a sidearm in VN, seeing as how we
flew around with virtually no armor I figured a good place for a large
hunk of metal would be between my legs. I even shot it a few
times...once at a 55 gallon drum not 25 feet away; the round clanked
out and missed by 5 feet...I *swear* on my expert rating with a .38
that I was aiming true (come on, it was a 55 gallon drum!). Which led
me to believe that that particular hunk of steel was one Sgt York had
contact with...

cg

On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 10:20:15 -0700, Charlie Groh
wrote:

...I managed to wangle a 1911 as a sidearm in VN, seeing as how we
flew around with virtually no armor I figured a good place for a large
hunk of metal would be between my legs. I even shot it a few
times...once at a 55 gallon drum not 25 feet away; the round clanked
out and missed by 5 feet...I *swear* on my expert rating with a .38
that I was aiming true (come on, it was a 55 gallon drum!). Which led
me to believe that that particular hunk of steel was one Sgt York had
contact with...

cg

I was issued one in Nam and carried it for a month, until the time came to use
it.. YUK..
I've heard good things about "sporterized" 45's, but the one the gave me was a
POS..

Used it one time.. At a backlit target about 10 or 12 yards away, laying prone
with the 45 on a sandbag..
Emptied the sucker and when the "target" was recovered the next morning, I'd
only hit it 3 times..
Went to the airbase the next time we were in base camp and bought a .38 and
never regretted the change.. YMWV


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 10:31:36 -0700, mac davis
wrote:

On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 10:20:15 -0700, Charlie Groh
wrote:

...I managed to wangle a 1911 as a sidearm in VN, seeing as how we
flew around with virtually no armor I figured a good place for a large
hunk of metal would be between my legs. I even shot it a few
times...once at a 55 gallon drum not 25 feet away; the round clanked
out and missed by 5 feet...I *swear* on my expert rating with a .38
that I was aiming true (come on, it was a 55 gallon drum!). Which led
me to believe that that particular hunk of steel was one Sgt York had
contact with...

cg

I was issued one in Nam and carried it for a month, until the time came to use
it.. YUK..
I've heard good things about "sporterized" 45's, but the one the gave me was a
POS..

Used it one time.. At a backlit target about 10 or 12 yards away, laying prone
with the 45 on a sandbag..
Emptied the sucker and when the "target" was recovered the next morning, I'd
only hit it 3 times..
Went to the airbase the next time we were in base camp and bought a .38 and
never regretted the change.. YMWV


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing


....heh...well, as far as accuracy you're right on the money, but *my*
needs were satisfied with the added "armor"...I was a Barney
Fife-type...after finding out how it fired, I only carried one round
chambered, that one was for me (the VC didn't like scout
pilots...)...we had lots of other ordinance and different firearms,
plus I was invulnerable. ;0)
cg

On 2009-04-29, mac davis wrote:

...I managed to wangle a 1911 as a sidearm in VN, seeing as how we
flew around with virtually no armor I figured a good place for a large
hunk of metal would be between my legs. I even shot it a few
times...once at a 55 gallon drum not 25 feet away; the round clanked
out and missed by 5 feet...I *swear* on my expert rating with a .38
that I was aiming true (come on, it was a 55 gallon drum!). Which led
me to believe that that particular hunk of steel was one Sgt York had
contact with...

The military issue .45 auto was designed to do two things. One, deliver a
lethal pill to the enemy's body. Two, do it every single time the trigger
is pulled. Failure on either point is almost always a case of operator
error. In short, ya' gotta be smarter than the tool.

nb

On Thu, 30 Apr 2009 12:53:50 GMT, notbob wrote:

On 2009-04-29, mac davis wrote:

...I managed to wangle a 1911 as a sidearm in VN, seeing as how we
flew around with virtually no armor I figured a good place for a large
hunk of metal would be between my legs. I even shot it a few
times...once at a 55 gallon drum not 25 feet away; the round clanked
out and missed by 5 feet...I *swear* on my expert rating with a .38
that I was aiming true (come on, it was a 55 gallon drum!). Which led
me to believe that that particular hunk of steel was one Sgt York had
contact with...

The military issue .45 auto was designed to do two things. One, deliver a
lethal pill to the enemy's body. Two, do it every single time the trigger
is pulled. Failure on either point is almost always a case of operator
error. In short, ya' gotta be smarter than the tool.

nb

....uh, yeah? That's exactly what a mentor of mine once said as I was
cursing at a door I couldn't make work right. Difference is, I had
the tools and time to make that door work (and realize I was truly
smarter than *it*...after all) and in the case of the weapon no
amount of skill on my part was going to make it shoot better...luck,
maybe so. My intent in my post was a little humor, nothing more.

....are you sounding condescending on purpose?

cg

On 2009-04-30, Charlie Groh wrote:

...are you sounding condescending on purpose?

Yes. I'm a dick.

nb

On Apr 30, 8:53*am, notbob wrote:
On 2009-04-29, mac davis wrote:

...I managed to wangle a 1911 as a sidearm in VN, seeing as how we
flew around with virtually no armor I figured a good place for a large
hunk of metal would be between my legs. *I even shot it a few
times...once at a 55 gallon drum not 25 feet away; *the round clanked
out and missed by 5 feet...I *swear* on my expert rating with a .38
that I was aiming true (come on, it was a 55 gallon drum!). *Which led
me to believe that that particular hunk of steel was one Sgt York had
contact with...

The military issue .45 auto was designed to do two things. *One, deliver a
lethal pill to the enemy's body. *Two, do it every single time the trigger
is pulled. *Failure on either point is almost always a case of operator
error. *In short, ya' gotta be smarter than the tool.

nb

Design and execution are often quite far apart.

Even a simple tool knows that.