I am unlurking to ask a serious question. Has Biesemeyer gone completely
to hell?

I've been intending to upgrade my TS fence to a Biesemeyer for a few
years. Every time I use someone's saw with a Bies fence, I'm reminded
that my fence is not strong enough. I love their old fences.

So it was natural that I'd try Biesemeyer first when I decided to build
a quickie, small miter saw station. I know I should have built the whole
thing from scratch, but when I was tempted by "78-802 Biesemeyer Miter
Saw Table System" I decided it would be nice to have a ready made set of
tables. Plus they have a really (!) nice (but expensive) stop system. So
I got two of their miter saw tables and they looked great until I put
them on a flat surface. The little SOBs are both twisted - the worst one
has one leg a quarter inch off (high). That much twist on such a short
(24") table is terrible. I should send them back, but there seems to be
no point in having them replaced, since more than one was twisted. So I
clamped them to my old bench and tweaked until everything was straight
and true (one fence need a bit of untwisting, too). And now they work
great; it's a nice design if they would just put them together right.

So the question is is Delta making Biesemeyer fences more carefully
than their miter saw tables? I am not interested in doing any more of
the factory's work, and I'm not sure I am capable of tweaking a table
saw fence into good enough alignment. Plus I just don't want to start
bending and twisting on something that expensive.

If Biesemeyer has gone to hell, who makes the best Bies-clone fence
these days? By best I mean strong, straight, square, able to hold
alignment. Maybe General has kept up the Biesemeyer tradition. Anyone
have recent experience with Bies clones?

TIA
PDX David

"Jane & David" wrote in message
...
I am unlurking to ask a serious question. Has Biesemeyer gone completely
to hell?

If Biesemeyer has gone to hell, who makes the best Bies-clone fence
these days? By best I mean strong, straight, square, able to hold
alignment. Maybe General has kept up the Biesemeyer tradition. Anyone
have recent experience with Bies clones?

TIA
PDX David

Try WWW.mulecab.com I had one of the TS fences and was pleased with it.
Takes a little longer to take of and put on but unless your changing 50
times a day....
Jim

In article RTVVg.110117$R63.8366@pd7urf1no,
"Jim Northey" wrote:

"Jane & David" wrote in message
...
I am unlurking to ask a serious question. Has Biesemeyer gone completely
to hell?

If Biesemeyer has gone to hell, who makes the best Bies-clone fence
these days? By best I mean strong, straight, square, able to hold
alignment. Maybe General has kept up the Biesemeyer tradition. Anyone
have recent experience with Bies clones?

TIA
PDX David

Try WWW.mulecab.com I had one of the TS fences and was pleased with it.
Takes a little longer to take of and put on but unless your changing 50
times a day....
Jim



Thanks, Jim. The reason I intended to get a Bies is that I've worked in
several shops where they threw full sheets of plywood against their Bies
all day and the things stayed square and straight. But these were older
Biesemeyers and were made well. I seldom abuse my tools (but accidents
happen), and I am impressed by tools that can take it. Will the Mule
keep its alignment after hard use? If so, I'm interested. I've had
other people recommend the Mule, but I don't thiink I've ever seen one
anywhere. And it sounds like you don't use a Mule any more - did it stop
pleasing you? :-)

Thanks, PDX David

"Jane & David" wrote in message
...
In article RTVVg.110117$R63.8366@pd7urf1no,
"Jim Northey" wrote:

"Jane & David" wrote in message
...
Thanks, Jim. The reason I intended to get a Bies is that I've worked in
several shops where they threw full sheets of plywood against their Bies
all day and the things stayed square and straight. But these were older
Biesemeyers and were made well. I seldom abuse my tools (but accidents
happen), and I am impressed by tools that can take it. Will the Mule
keep its alignment after hard use? If so, I'm interested. I've had
other people recommend the Mule, but I don't thiink I've ever seen one
anywhere. And it sounds like you don't use a Mule any more - did it stop
pleasing you? :-)

Thanks, PDX David

It's a kind of yes and no answer to your question. Yes I stopped using it
an no it didn't stop pleasing me. The mule was an upgrade to an old Rockwell
TS with a jet style (I think) fence . It was a stop gap solution,but a
thousand fold improvement for that saw. A year or so after getting the fence
I upgraded to a 5HP Unisaw with a Unisaw fence, and I'm very pleased with
that setup. I still have the mule fence but not the rails. After checking
the mule web site to see if it still worked before posting it, it got me to
thinking that when I get all my tools out of storage( in an apt now ), it
would be a great addition to the back side of my extension table for a
router. As to the beating it will take. I've not used the beis fence for any
length of time. Just 4 or 5 months at a cabinet shop. But I think from my
use of the mule it's just about as strong.As you said your the one that will
have paid for it so you'll be more careful with it that someone working for
wages and not a cent invested it the tools. If you have looked at the site
you must have noticed the T slots in the thing, a good way to attach all
sorts of aux things to it. :-) .
Good luck with whatever fence you go with.
Jim

In article azXVg.105907$1T2.18144@pd7urf2no,
"Jim Northey" wrote:

"Jane & David" wrote in message
...
In article RTVVg.110117$R63.8366@pd7urf1no,
"Jim Northey" wrote:

"Jane & David" wrote in message
...
Thanks, Jim. The reason I intended to get a Bies is that I've worked in
several shops where they threw full sheets of plywood against their Bies
all day and the things stayed square and straight. But these were older
Biesemeyers and were made well. I seldom abuse my tools (but accidents
happen), and I am impressed by tools that can take it. Will the Mule
keep its alignment after hard use? If so, I'm interested. I've had
other people recommend the Mule, but I don't thiink I've ever seen one
anywhere. And it sounds like you don't use a Mule any more - did it stop
pleasing you? :-)

Thanks, PDX David

It's a kind of yes and no answer to your question. Yes I stopped using it
an no it didn't stop pleasing me. The mule was an upgrade to an old Rockwell
TS with a jet style (I think) fence . It was a stop gap solution,but a
thousand fold improvement for that saw. A year or so after getting the fence
I upgraded to a 5HP Unisaw with a Unisaw fence, and I'm very pleased with
that setup. I still have the mule fence but not the rails. After checking
the mule web site to see if it still worked before posting it, it got me to
thinking that when I get all my tools out of storage( in an apt now ), it
would be a great addition to the back side of my extension table for a
router. As to the beating it will take. I've not used the beis fence for any
length of time. Just 4 or 5 months at a cabinet shop. But I think from my
use of the mule it's just about as strong.As you said your the one that will
have paid for it so you'll be more careful with it that someone working for
wages and not a cent invested it the tools. If you have looked at the site
you must have noticed the T slots in the thing, a good way to attach all
sorts of aux things to it. :-) .
Good luck with whatever fence you go with.
Jim

I think you have answered my question well. You have some real
experience with the Bies and still compare the Mule favorably - that is
a positive, knowledgeable recommendation as far as I'm concerned. And
the Mule doesn't even cost and arm and a leg. Could be what I'm looking
for.
Thanks again!
PDX David

I am totally satisfied with the General (not International) fence which
looks a lot like a Biesmeyer.

"Jane & David" wrote in message
...
I am unlurking to ask a serious question. Has Biesemeyer gone completely
to hell?

snip

So the question is is Delta making Biesemeyer fences more carefully
than their miter saw tables? I am not interested in doing any more of
the factory's work, and I'm not sure I am capable of tweaking a table
saw fence into good enough alignment. Plus I just don't want to start
bending and twisting on something that expensive.

If Biesemeyer has gone to hell, who makes the best Bies-clone fence
these days? By best I mean strong, straight, square, able to hold
alignment. Maybe General has kept up the Biesemeyer tradition. Anyone
have recent experience with Bies clones?

TIA
PDX David

Remember,

Delta is now a Black & Decker company. I sadly remember that in the 60's,
B&D was the standard. Next the standard was Rockwell and Milwaukee. I like
the Dewalt routers and drills, but . . . . . .

A Delta rep addressed a local woodworking club a few months ago. He said the
Dewalt line would feature tools for the jobsite and Delta would favor the
woodworker. I've bought two Jet tools since then, a bandsaw and a jointer.
:-)

Jane & David wrote:

If Biesemeyer has gone to hell, who makes the best Bies-clone fence
these days? By best I mean strong, straight, square, able to hold
alignment. Maybe General has kept up the Biesemeyer tradition. Anyone
have recent experience with Bies clones?

I've got the General version (came on my saw).

Like the Bies, there are two sizes, the "home" and the "commercial". As
you can imagine, the home version is a little smaller (this is what
comes on their contractor and hybrid saws). I have the commercial version.

The fence locks solidly. When sliding it back and forth it can angle
slightly--some of the other clones have plastic spacers between them and
the saw so they slide a bit easier. The other thing that might be nice
is a red hairline on the cursor--as it is, it's just a raised line on
the plastic. Works fine, but a red line might be a bit easier to see.

Chris