The end of our VAT quarter was 30th April, therefore I understood the
return & payment to be due on 31st of May, but since we submitted the
return and made the payment electronically by the Banco Franco Billpay
service HMRC made great play of pointing out we could hang onto our
cash for 7 extra days & save / earn interest at the Bank Yada, Yada,
Yada. We have taken advantage of this for a few years now without any
issue.

Now it all appears to have changed (ICBW). According to the HMRC
website today the Vat return is due in on 7th of June just as before,
but we have to make the payment by 31st of May. I.E. before the return
has been done and no 7 days "grace" !

So ... First we have the good news

They've given us 7 extra days grace to get the return + payment to
HMRC.

The bad news is Banco Franco & HMRC use up this 7 days grace and
sometimes more, themselves. :-(

They say (somewhere else on the website) HMRC must recieve cleared
funds by 7th of June, and the banking system takes 3 days to transmit
the funds to HMRC, & HMRC's own computer system takes *another* 3 days
to allocate the funds to our VAT account. IGWS neither Banco Franco
nor HMRC work weekends or holidays.

Surely, if I make a payment by debit card the transaction is
authorised instantaneously so how the hell does it take 6 - 9 days to
make a simple payment by debit card.

Oh, IGWS there are severe financial penalties for making the payment
minutes to microseconds late, and it's never their fault.

Maybe that's their motive.

DerekG

I just think financial organisation shall we say, take the biscuit when it
comes to creating mountains out of molehills. They just cover up how inept
and inefficient they are compared to the rest of the world. They live in a
bubble I'm sure of it.
Brian

--
--
From the sofa of Brian Gaff -

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"DerekG" wrote in message
...


The end of our VAT quarter was 30th April, therefore I understood the
return & payment to be due on 31st of May, but since we submitted the
return and made the payment electronically by the Banco Franco Billpay
service HMRC made great play of pointing out we could hang onto our
cash for 7 extra days & save / earn interest at the Bank Yada, Yada,
Yada. We have taken advantage of this for a few years now without any
issue.

Now it all appears to have changed (ICBW). According to the HMRC
website today the Vat return is due in on 7th of June just as before,
but we have to make the payment by 31st of May. I.E. before the return
has been done and no 7 days "grace" !

So ... First we have the good news

They've given us 7 extra days grace to get the return + payment to
HMRC.

The bad news is Banco Franco & HMRC use up this 7 days grace and
sometimes more, themselves. :-(

They say (somewhere else on the website) HMRC must recieve cleared
funds by 7th of June, and the banking system takes 3 days to transmit
the funds to HMRC, & HMRC's own computer system takes *another* 3 days
to allocate the funds to our VAT account. IGWS neither Banco Franco
nor HMRC work weekends or holidays.

Surely, if I make a payment by debit card the transaction is
authorised instantaneously so how the hell does it take 6 - 9 days to
make a simple payment by debit card.

Oh, IGWS there are severe financial penalties for making the payment
minutes to microseconds late, and it's never their fault.

Maybe that's their motive.

DerekG

On 26/05/2012 00:36, DerekG wrote:


The end of our VAT quarter was 30th April,


You need Dennis - our resident VAT expert.




--
Dave - The Medway Handyman www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

The Medway Handyman wrote:

On 26/05/2012 00:36, DerekG wrote:


The end of our VAT quarter was 30th April,


You need Dennis - our resident VAT expert.

On a similar subject, did you say you were thinking of changing to a
Ltd. Company?

My plasterer mate is doing it now (mainly as he never pays his bills,
and the bailiffs have been round to scare him into paying up).

I've been doing some research into it, and it can be done really cheaply
now, with no need to use an Accountant for anything (even year end
returns) for a small business.

You can set it up for less than £50, then there is a little more
paperwork, as you need to pay employee tax and NI, but there are some
good benefits - full pension and benefits, less tax overall, very little
chance of personal bankruptcy if the business fails etc.

Alan.
--
To reply by e-mail, change the ' + ' to 'plus'.

On 26/05/2012 09:57, A.Lee wrote:
The Medway wrote:

On 26/05/2012 00:36, DerekG wrote:


The end of our VAT quarter was 30th April,


You need Dennis - our resident VAT expert.

On a similar subject, did you say you were thinking of changing to a
Ltd. Company?

My plasterer mate is doing it now (mainly as he never pays his bills,
and the bailiffs have been round to scare him into paying up).

I've been doing some research into it, and it can be done really cheaply
now, with no need to use an Accountant for anything (even year end
returns) for a small business.

You can set it up for less than £50, then there is a little more
paperwork, as you need to pay employee tax and NI, but there are some
good benefits - full pension and benefits, less tax overall, very little
chance of personal bankruptcy if the business fails etc.

Alan.
I did it for tax reasons. My accountant set it up for about £60.

--
Dave - The Medway Handyman www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

The end of our VAT quarter was 30th April, therefore I understood the
return & payment to be due on 31st of May, but since we submitted the
return and made the payment electronically by the Banco Franco Billpay
service HMRC made great play of pointing out we could hang onto our
cash for 7 extra days & save / earn interest at the Bank Yada, Yada,
Yada. We have taken advantage of this for a few years now without any
issue.

Now it all appears to have changed (ICBW). According to the HMRC
website today the Vat return is due in on 7th of June just as before,
but we have to make the payment by 31st of May. I.E. before the return
has been done and no 7 days "grace" !
snip

I no longer trade nor dabble in VAT but I wonder if you may have
misremembered the past position? It was, and I think still is, the case
that electronic filing and payment means you have an extra 7 days for
HMRC to receive clear funds. (Note that what matters is not when you
send the payment but when HMRC receive it clear in their account.) So
with paper returns & payment you had to get th emoney into their hands
by the end of the month. With electronic you get the extra days. But
you may still have to send the payment sooner if, eg, you are using BACS
rather than FastPay.

There's a calculator somewhere on the HMRC site which is supposed to
give a date - ah yes, it's
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/tools/vatpaym...calculator.htm
--
Robin
reply to address is (meant to be) valid

In message , The Medway Handyman
writes
On 26/05/2012 09:57, A.Lee wrote:
The Medway wrote:

On 26/05/2012 00:36, DerekG wrote:


The end of our VAT quarter was 30th April,


You need Dennis - our resident VAT expert.

On a similar subject, did you say you were thinking of changing to a
Ltd. Company?

My plasterer mate is doing it now (mainly as he never pays his bills,
and the bailiffs have been round to scare him into paying up).

I've been doing some research into it, and it can be done really cheaply
now, with no need to use an Accountant for anything (even year end
returns) for a small business.

You can set it up for less than £50, then there is a little more
paperwork, as you need to pay employee tax and NI, but there are some
good benefits - full pension and benefits, less tax overall, very little
chance of personal bankruptcy if the business fails etc.

Alan.
I did it for tax reasons. My accountant set it up for about £60.

So, where on your website does it say that you are a limited company
trading as The Medway Handyman and where are your company registration
details?
--
Iain Freely

The Medway Handyman wrote:
On 26/05/2012 09:57, A.Lee wrote:

On a similar subject, did you say you were thinking of changing to a
Ltd. Company?

My plasterer mate is doing it now (mainly as he never pays his bills,
and the bailiffs have been round to scare him into paying up).

I've been doing some research into it, and it can be done really cheaply
now, with no need to use an Accountant for anything (even year end
returns) for a small business.

You can set it up for less than £50, then there is a little more
paperwork, as you need to pay employee tax and NI, but there are some
good benefits - full pension and benefits, less tax overall, very little
chance of personal bankruptcy if the business fails etc.

I did it for tax reasons. My accountant set it up for about £60.

Have you started trading under the Ltd. Co. yet?
If so, is the extra paperwork simple to do - say half hour a week?

Did you transfer your stock/tools/van to the Ltd Co.?
If not, did/will you have an extra tax bill when you cease trading as a
Sole trader?

I've probably got £5k of kit, so it'd cost me £1250 ish to close down
the Sole Trader I think, though maybe I'm completely wrong about it?

Ta
Alan.

--
To reply by e-mail, change the ' + ' to 'plus'.

On 26/05/2012 00:36, DerekG wrote:

So ... First we have the good news

They've given us 7 extra days grace to get the return + payment to
HMRC.

The bad news is Banco Franco & HMRC use up this 7 days grace and
sometimes more, themselves. :-(

I just let them take it by D.D. once I have submitted the VAT100 figures
through their electronic online form thing.
As far as I'm aware they still take it on the last day of the 7 days
grace... Last quarter ending last day Jan. was taken by DD on March 12th
so I reckon quarter Feb-Apr. will be taken on 11th June.

No reason it shouldn't.

Pete

In article , Robin writes

I no longer trade nor dabble in VAT but I wonder if you may have
misremembered the past position? It was, and I think still is, the case
that electronic filing and payment means you have an extra 7 days for
HMRC to receive clear funds. (Note that what matters is not when you
send the payment but when HMRC receive it clear in their account.) So
with paper returns & payment you had to get th emoney into their hands
by the end of the month. With electronic you get the extra days. But
you may still have to send the payment sooner if, eg, you are using BACS
rather than FastPay.

There's a calculator somewhere on the HMRC site which is supposed to
give a date - ah yes, it's
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/tools/vatpaym...calculator.htm

It certainly used to be the case that if you paid by direct debit and
filed online you got 7 days grace but it is now compulsory to file
online for all but the smallest companies so they might be looking to
remove that benefit of online filing.

It appears the o/p is paying by funds transfer rather than DD so that
may make a difference.

I'll certainly take a closer look on Monday but hey it's the wkend so it
can wait.

Thanks to the o/p for the heads-up tho'.
--
fred
it's a ba-na-na . . . .

It certainly used to be the case that if you paid by direct debit and
filed online you got 7 days grace but it is now compulsory to file
online for all but the smallest companies so they might be looking to
remove that benefit of online filing.

They might also be looking to castrate/inflict FGM on anyone who pays
late but I don't think they are*. See the calculator to which I posted
a link or the guidance at
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/vat/managing/.../deadlines.htm

It appears the o/p is paying by funds transfer rather than DD so that
may make a difference.

I was unclear by what means the OP was paying. If
"Banco Franco Billpay" was a reference to the Billpay
facility operated (now) by Santander then tweet, tweet. Billpay is not
and never was the swiftest (sic) method. Billpay requires payment by 31
May to get cleared funds to HMRC bvy 7 June. (I think this is affected
by the double holiday weekend. Eg Billpay on 3 July will get funds to
HMRC by 6 July.)

FWIW I also seem to recall that a lot of businesses receiving payments
also used to get a bit upset if their customers used delaying
tactics. And I well recall a big oil company which, many years ago,
pointed out how much they could have saved if they had paid their tax
due by (say) 31 May by posting a cheque using second class post in
Lerwick after the last collection of 31 May. I don't see that as fair.
But then, like Zaphod Beeblebrox, I'm just zis guy, you know.


*what some HMRC officials wish for in the privacy of their heads is of
course unknowable )
--
Robin
reply to address is (meant to be) valid

In message , DerekG
writes


The end of our VAT quarter was 30th April, therefore I understood the
return & payment to be due on 31st of May,

This last quarter, I submitted the return on the 7th April
The amount due was taken by DD from our account on the 10th (tuesday),
which at 0:00 of the 10th didn't have sufficient funds to cover the VAT

09:30 I topped up the current account, sometime in the afternoon, the
bank clawed the VAT back (******s)

I phoned HMR&C up and, yes, the money had briefly rested in their
account. I said I'd check it out on Saturday, O transferred the money
over monday and tuesday (as it was more then £20000), so they finally
got their money on the 17th April

no fines or requests for extra payments have been made


from this you can, hopefully draw a few conclusions

1/ - the return has to indeed be submitted by the 7th (as they say in
their reminder,

2/ - If you pay by DD, it does indeed go out on the 10th

3/ - If you have a problem, inform them ASAP


--
geoff

In message , A.Lee
writes
The Medway Handyman wrote:
On 26/05/2012 09:57, A.Lee wrote:

On a similar subject, did you say you were thinking of changing to a
Ltd. Company?

My plasterer mate is doing it now (mainly as he never pays his bills,
and the bailiffs have been round to scare him into paying up).

I've been doing some research into it, and it can be done really cheaply
now, with no need to use an Accountant for anything (even year end
returns) for a small business.

You can set it up for less than £50, then there is a little more
paperwork, as you need to pay employee tax and NI, but there are some
good benefits - full pension and benefits, less tax overall, very little
chance of personal bankruptcy if the business fails etc.

I did it for tax reasons. My accountant set it up for about £60.

Have you started trading under the Ltd. Co. yet?
If so, is the extra paperwork simple to do - say half hour a week?

Did you transfer your stock/tools/van to the Ltd Co.?
If not, did/will you have an extra tax bill when you cease trading as a
Sole trader?

That catches a few people out, the IR estimated one of my customers
assets to be £100,000 and sent him a bill for it when he went ltd

It was up to him to prove it incorrect

Watch out !


I've probably got £5k of kit, so it'd cost me £1250 ish to close down
the Sole Trader I think, though maybe I'm completely wrong about it?

Ta
Alan.


--
geoff

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , DerekG
writes


The end of our VAT quarter was 30th April, therefore I understood the
return & payment to be due on 31st of May,

This last quarter, I submitted the return on the 7th April
The amount due was taken by DD from our account on the 10th (tuesday),
which at 0:00 of the 10th didn't have sufficient funds to cover the VAT

09:30 I topped up the current account, sometime in the afternoon, the bank
clawed the VAT back (******s)

I phoned HMR&C up and, yes, the money had briefly rested in their account.
I said I'd check it out on Saturday, O transferred the money over monday
and tuesday (as it was more then £20000), so they finally got their money
on the 17th April

no fines or requests for extra payments have been made


from this you can, hopefully draw a few conclusions

1/ - the return has to indeed be submitted by the 7th (as they say in
their reminder,

2/ - If you pay by DD, it does indeed go out on the 10th

3/ - If you have a problem, inform them ASAP

You're gonna miss that honeypot when you retire, Geoff.

On Sat, 26 May 2012 10:31:49 +0100, Robin wrote:

With electronic you get the extra days.

The lost interest on 20k @ 2% is hardly worth worrying about. If I've
got the maths right it's less than eight quid before tax. That's
assuming you have an instant access account that pays as much as
2%...

But you may still have to send the payment sooner if, eg, you are using
BACS rather than FastPay.

FastPay? NatWest closed that on the 15th July 2005.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Mon, 28 May 2012 00:56:04 +0100, Dave Liquorice wrote:

On Sat, 26 May 2012 10:31:49 +0100, Robin wrote:

With electronic you get the extra days.

The lost interest on 20k @ 2% is hardly worth worrying about. If I've
got the maths right it's less than eight quid before tax. That's
assuming you have an instant access account that pays as much as 2%...

But you may still have to send the payment sooner if, eg, you are using
BACS rather than FastPay.

FastPay? NatWest closed that on the 15th July 2005.

Perhaps he means Faster Payments:

http://www.fasterpayments.org.uk/



--
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
http://www.mirrorservice.org

*lightning protection* - a w_tom conductor

In message , Bob Eager
writes
On Mon, 28 May 2012 00:56:04 +0100, Dave Liquorice wrote:

On Sat, 26 May 2012 10:31:49 +0100, Robin wrote:

With electronic you get the extra days.

The lost interest on 20k @ 2% is hardly worth worrying about. If I've
got the maths right it's less than eight quid before tax. That's
assuming you have an instant access account that pays as much as 2%...

But you may still have to send the payment sooner if, eg, you are using
BACS rather than FastPay.

FastPay? NatWest closed that on the 15th July 2005.

Perhaps he means Faster Payments:

http://www.fasterpayments.org.uk/

But what's the point of any other system than DD?

They're going to take the money anyway, why not leave the responsibility
to them ?



--
geoff

Perhaps he means Faster Payments:

Yes, a shameful error by me
--
Robin
reply to address is (meant to be) valid

Did you transfer your stock/tools/van to the Ltd Co.?
If not, did/will you have an extra tax bill when you cease trading
as a Sole trader?

That catches a few people out, the IR estimated one of my customers
assets to be £100,000 and sent him a bill for it when he went ltd

A sole trader and the company can elect to transfer tools and other
plant and machinery at their written down value for tax purposes so as
not to trigger balancing charges on them. They can also elect to have
trading stock and work in progress transferred so as to avoid triggering
a tax charge. And there is an "incorporation relief" for capital gains.
But there are other ways of people can get a tax bill they don't expect
on "cessation" so the general point stands.

--
Robin
reply to address is (meant to be) valid

On 26/05/2012 10:31, Robin wrote:
....
I no longer trade nor dabble in VAT but I wonder if you may have
misremembered the past position? It was, and I think still is, the case
that electronic filing and payment means you have an extra 7 days for
HMRC to receive clear funds. (Note that what matters is not when you
send the payment but when HMRC receive it clear in their account.) So
with paper returns& payment you had to get th emoney into their hands
by the end of the month. With electronic you get the extra days. But
you may still have to send the payment sooner if, eg, you are using BACS
rather than FastPay.

HMRC are not part of the fast payment scheme, so it will take several
days for any electronic transfer to reach them.

Colin Bignell

Nightjar wrote:

HMRC are not part of the fast payment scheme

They are ... but I think there are limits on the value of transactions
for FPS, so beware

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/news/hmrc-fps.htm

On Mon, 28 May 2012 02:01:14 +0100, geoff wrote:

But what's the point of any other system than DD?

They're going to take the money anyway, why not leave the responsibility
to them ?

You trust the government (of any colour) to have open access to your
bank account? With large variable amounts I like to be in charge of
when it leaves may account, otherwise it's easy to get caught by the
DD going out before a credit has arrived even if they are supposed to
be on the same day. Hum, now where have I heard that story recently?
B-)

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Mon, 28 May 2012 08:56:43 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

HMRC are not part of the fast payment scheme,

Aren't they? Bloody typical...

so it will take several days for any electronic transfer to reach them.

I like the Faster Payments scheme, being able to shuffle money
between accounts at different banks almost faster than a mouse click
is very handy. But as you never really know if a given payment for a
bill will use FP or BACS I pay bills with 4 working days clearance. I
then only have to worry about pesky bank holidays, I rarely know when
the bank holidays are as they have no significance to me.

--
Cheers
Dave.

In article , Nightjar
scribeth thus
On 26/05/2012 10:31, Robin wrote:
...
I no longer trade nor dabble in VAT but I wonder if you may have
misremembered the past position? It was, and I think still is, the case
that electronic filing and payment means you have an extra 7 days for
HMRC to receive clear funds. (Note that what matters is not when you
send the payment but when HMRC receive it clear in their account.) So
with paper returns& payment you had to get th emoney into their hands
by the end of the month. With electronic you get the extra days. But
you may still have to send the payment sooner if, eg, you are using BACS
rather than FastPay.

HMRC are not part of the fast payment scheme, so it will take several
days for any electronic transfer to reach them.

Colin Bignell

If I was running HMCE I'd be asking questions why is that happening and
where is the money in the meantime. After all its one 'puter talking to
another isn't it?.
--
Tony Sayer

In article , geoff
scribeth thus
In message , DerekG
writes


The end of our VAT quarter was 30th April, therefore I understood the
return & payment to be due on 31st of May,

This last quarter, I submitted the return on the 7th April
The amount due was taken by DD from our account on the 10th (tuesday),
which at 0:00 of the 10th didn't have sufficient funds to cover the VAT

09:30 I topped up the current account, sometime in the afternoon, the
bank clawed the VAT back (******s)

I phoned HMR&C up and, yes, the money had briefly rested in their
account. I said I'd check it out on Saturday, O transferred the money
over monday and tuesday (as it was more then £20000), so they finally
got their money on the 17th April

no fines or requests for extra payments have been made


from this you can, hopefully draw a few conclusions

1/ - the return has to indeed be submitted by the 7th (as they say in
their reminder,

2/ - If you pay by DD, it does indeed go out on the 10th

3/ - If you have a problem, inform them ASAP



The conclusion I draw Geoff is that you really ought to have words with
that bank your with or best still change to another one more business
useful one like say HSBC .....
--
Tony Sayer

On 28/05/2012 09:05, Andy Burns wrote:
Nightjar wrote:

HMRC are not part of the fast payment scheme

They are ... but I think there are limits on the value of transactions
for FPS, so beware

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/news/hmrc-fps.htm

Thanks for the update.

Colin Bignell

In article o.uk,
Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Mon, 28 May 2012 08:56:43 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

HMRC are not part of the fast payment scheme,

Aren't they? Bloody typical...

so it will take several days for any electronic transfer to reach them.

I like the Faster Payments scheme, being able to shuffle money
between accounts at different banks almost faster than a mouse click
is very handy. But as you never really know if a given payment for a
bill will use FP or BACS I pay bills with 4 working days clearance.

I'm offered the option when I make an electronic payment.

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18

In article , Robin writes
It certainly used to be the case that if you paid by direct debit and
filed online you got 7 days grace but it is now compulsory to file
online for all but the smallest companies so they might be looking to
remove that benefit of online filing.

They might also be looking to castrate/inflict FGM on anyone who pays
late but I don't think they are*. See the calculator to which I posted
a link or the guidance at
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/vat/managing/.../deadlines.htm

Thanks for the link, that's saved me a search, our team still have
7/10days on DD although I will take note of Geoff's 00:01hrs DD
experience.
--
fred
it's a ba-na-na . . . .

In article o.uk, Dave
Liquorice writes
On Mon, 28 May 2012 08:56:43 +0100, Nightjar wrote:

HMRC are not part of the fast payment scheme,

Aren't they? Bloody typical...

They adopted it about 6mths ago, see Andy's link..
--
fred
it's a ba-na-na . . . .

On Mon, 28 May 2012 10:54:09 +0100, charles wrote:

But as you never really know if a given payment for a bill will
use FP
or BACS I pay bills with 4 working days clearance.

I'm offered the option when I make an electronic payment.

Thinking about I think I can from the main "payments" screen ie where
you can choose CHAPS and couple of international methods etc but once
you have seleceted "bill payment" I don't get a FP/BACS choice. It
might tell me but with wolly words, I don't trust what banks say...

And if the FP system ever falls over and payments get delayed into
the next day who ends up with snotty letters, threats about
non-payment, automatic penalties etc then all the wasted time sorting
it out?

--
Cheers
Dave.

On May 26, 10:52*am, Iain Freely wrote:
In message , The Medway Handyman
writes







On 26/05/2012 09:57, A.Lee wrote:
The Medway *wrote:

On 26/05/2012 00:36, DerekG wrote:

The end of our VAT quarter was 30th April,

You need Dennis - our resident VAT expert.

On a similar subject, did you say you were thinking of changing to a
Ltd. Company?

My plasterer mate is doing it now (mainly as he never pays his bills,
and the bailiffs have been round to scare him into paying up).

I've been doing some research into it, and it can be done really cheaply
now, with no need to use an Accountant for anything (even year end
returns) for a small business.

You can set it up for less than £50, then there is a little more
paperwork, as you need to pay employee tax and NI, but there are some
good benefits - full pension and benefits, less tax overall, very little
chance of personal bankruptcy if the business fails etc.

Alan.
I did it for tax reasons. *My accountant set it up for about £60.

So, where on your website does it say that you are a limited company
trading as The Medway Handyman and where are your company registration
details?

He's been told about that already, but he's such a dickhead he seems
to think that he's above the law. Perhaps if he's paid more for his
accountant, web designer or busines advisor they would have been able
to give him a clue. He even has to ask this group what to charge, FFS.

MBQ

On Sat, 26 May 2012 10:52:29 +0100, Iain Freely wrote:

In message , The Medway Handyman
writes
On 26/05/2012 09:57, A.Lee wrote:
The Medway wrote:

On 26/05/2012 00:36, DerekG wrote:


The end of our VAT quarter was 30th April,


You need Dennis - our resident VAT expert.

On a similar subject, did you say you were thinking of changing to a
Ltd. Company?

My plasterer mate is doing it now (mainly as he never pays his bills,
and the bailiffs have been round to scare him into paying up).

I've been doing some research into it, and it can be done really
cheaply now, with no need to use an Accountant for anything (even year
end returns) for a small business.

You can set it up for less than £50, then there is a little more
paperwork, as you need to pay employee tax and NI, but there are some
good benefits - full pension and benefits, less tax overall, very
little chance of personal bankruptcy if the business fails etc.

Alan.
I did it for tax reasons. My accountant set it up for about £60.

So, where on your website does it say that you are a limited company
trading as The Medway Handyman and where are your company registration
details?

You're right. Isn't TMH trading illegally or something. Maybe a word to
Trading Standards. Over to you Dennis.

In message o.uk, Dave
Liquorice writes
On Mon, 28 May 2012 02:01:14 +0100, geoff wrote:

But what's the point of any other system than DD?

They're going to take the money anyway, why not leave the responsibility
to them ?

You trust the government (of any colour) to have open access to your
bank account? With large variable amounts I like to be in charge of
when it leaves may account, otherwise it's easy to get caught by the
DD going out before a credit has arrived even if they are supposed to
be on the same day. Hum, now where have I heard that story recently?

But you don't have control, insomuch as if you miss the deadline, you
get a hefty fine

You already have an extension if you pay by DD


--
geoff

In message , tony sayer
writes
In article , geoff
scribeth thus
In message , DerekG
writes


The end of our VAT quarter was 30th April, therefore I understood the
return & payment to be due on 31st of May,

This last quarter, I submitted the return on the 7th April
The amount due was taken by DD from our account on the 10th (tuesday),
which at 0:00 of the 10th didn't have sufficient funds to cover the VAT

09:30 I topped up the current account, sometime in the afternoon, the
bank clawed the VAT back (******s)

I phoned HMR&C up and, yes, the money had briefly rested in their
account. I said I'd check it out on Saturday, O transferred the money
over monday and tuesday (as it was more then £20000), so they finally
got their money on the 17th April

no fines or requests for extra payments have been made


from this you can, hopefully draw a few conclusions

1/ - the return has to indeed be submitted by the 7th (as they say in
their reminder,

2/ - If you pay by DD, it does indeed go out on the 10th

3/ - If you have a problem, inform them ASAP



The conclusion I draw Geoff is that you really ought to have words with
that bank your with or best still change to another one more business
useful one like say HSBC .....

Yes, I have had serious words, and even found out who my business banker
is... and she is in full agreement with me



--
geoff

The Medway Handyman wrote:

On 26/05/2012 09:57, A.Lee wrote:

On a similar subject, did you say you were thinking of changing to a
Ltd. Company?

I did it for tax reasons. My accountant set it up for about £60.

I did mine today. I'm now a Company Director! [1]

And, being as this is a DIY group, all done DIY, £18 total cost.

I spoke to an accountant today, she said there is little point in
changing from a Sole Trader to a Ltd. Co. if you are earning less than
£25k/yr, however, if you do the accounts/filing/tax returns yourself,
the break-even level is a lot lower.
Once you have it registered, there is no reason to use it, you can leave
it dormant, or just use it for a certain line of business you have.

There is no reason to finish as a Sole Trader, as you can run both at
the same time, so you can split earnings between the 2 to limit bad debt
exposure, or tax reasons.

[1] well, I will be when they have processed the paperwork.
--
To reply by e-mail, change the ' + ' to 'plus'.

In message , A.Lee
writes
The Medway Handyman wrote:

On 26/05/2012 09:57, A.Lee wrote:

On a similar subject, did you say you were thinking of changing to a
Ltd. Company?

I did it for tax reasons. My accountant set it up for about £60.

I did mine today. I'm now a Company Director! [1]

And, being as this is a DIY group, all done DIY, £18 total cost.

I spoke to an accountant today, she said there is little point in
changing from a Sole Trader to a Ltd. Co. if you are earning less than
£25k/yr, however, if you do the accounts/filing/tax returns yourself,
the break-even level is a lot lower.
Once you have it registered, there is no reason to use it, you can leave
it dormant, or just use it for a certain line of business you have.

There is no reason to finish as a Sole Trader, as you can run both at
the same time, so you can split earnings between the 2 to limit bad debt
exposure, or tax reasons.

[1] well, I will be when they have processed the paperwork.

Interesting.

Business use letting of agricultural barns is treated as unearned income
which is OK until there is some capital gains to account (land sale
etc.) when my total income exceeds the threshold for the next tax band.

The other issue is that for estate duty, agricultural barns are fully
relieved but not those for industrial use. I am interested in the
reliefs available as a letting business.

Can you point to a help source?

regards

--
Tim Lamb

Tim Lamb wrote:

In message , A.Lee ...

I did mine today. I'm now a Company Director! [1]

And, being as this is a DIY group, all done DIY, £18 total cost.

Business use letting of agricultural barns is treated as unearned income
which is OK until there is some capital gains to account (land sale
etc.) when my total income exceeds the threshold for the next tax band.

Can you point to a help source?

These 2 are the official sources:
http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg...&topicId=10738
58805

and

http://companieshouse.gov.uk/index.shtml

Loads of other pages if you google.

In your situation, you'd need to find if it is suitable for your needs.
A clued up Accountant would probably be better than 100 opinions on the
web/newsgroups.

I just walked into a local one today, said "how much for half an hours
advice?" and walked out 15 minutes later with all my queries answered,
and they didnt want to be paid.
the main pint they made was that the CH paperwork is easy, the Tax
return is far harder, and needs to be submitted in a standard format so
that HMRC can understand it, and not give you a penalty charge for doing
it wrongly.

HTH
Alan.

--
To reply by e-mail, change the ' + ' to 'plus'.

In message , A.Lee
writes
Tim Lamb wrote:

In message , A.Lee ...

I did mine today. I'm now a Company Director! [1]

And, being as this is a DIY group, all done DIY, £18 total cost.

Business use letting of agricultural barns is treated as unearned income
which is OK until there is some capital gains to account (land sale
etc.) when my total income exceeds the threshold for the next tax band.

Can you point to a help source?

These 2 are the official sources:
http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg...&topicId=10738
58805

and

http://companieshouse.gov.uk/index.shtml

Loads of other pages if you google.

In your situation, you'd need to find if it is suitable for your needs.
A clued up Accountant would probably be better than 100 opinions on the
web/newsgroups.

I just walked into a local one today, said "how much for half an hours
advice?" and walked out 15 minutes later with all my queries answered,
and they didnt want to be paid.
the main pint they made was that the CH paperwork is easy, the Tax
return is far harder, and needs to be submitted in a standard format so
that HMRC can understand it, and not give you a penalty charge for doing
it wrongly.

OK Alan. Thanks

regards
--
Tim Lamb

A.Lee wrote:

the main point they made was that the CH paperwork is easy

The stuff for CH and the payroll stuff (including end of year) is easy,
the VAT is straightforward too (if applicable) easiest to use cash VAT
accounting while you're small enough to be allowed to use it, and maybe
worthwhile using one of the industry specific flat rate schemes.

the Tax return is far harder

I've always done my own personal tax returns (on the grounds that their
adverts say how easy it is, so I take the position I shouldn't need an
accountant far that) but the corporation tax return I don't think I'd
fancy, it seems designed with accountants in mind.

On May 29, 6:45*pm, (A.Lee) wrote:
The Medway Handyman wrote:

On 26/05/2012 09:57, A.Lee wrote:
On a similar subject, did you say you were thinking of changing to a
Ltd. Company?
I did it for tax reasons. *My accountant set it up for about £60.

I did mine today. I'm now a Company Director! [1]

And, being as this is a DIY group, all done DIY, £18 total cost.

Just make sure you get more of a clue than TMH on the law regarding
business communications.

MBQ