Ignoramus19859 wrote:

On 2011-08-11, Pete C. wrote:

Ignoramus19859 wrote:

Guys, I am wondering about something. Tractors that haul semitrailers
are probably used until the last moment, or until they become too
unreliable? Are there any possibilities, realistically, to get a used
rig for relatively little money (compared to new), that would still
have enough life to go another 100k miles?

The big trucking companies turn over rigs at about 750k as a matter of
MTBF management. These are million mile trucks, so if you get one of
those with fresh brakes and tires you aren't likely to have a problem in
the 100k you'll ever put on them personally.

Thanks. I have to wonder, how old are they in calendar terms, by the
time they reach 750,000 miles? Assuming they go 600 miles per day, it
would be just 3.5 years old?

Yep. They get used hard and then sold before their MTBF starts to creep
in. I've heard that the trucking companies won't accept an
owner/operator with a rig more than 5 years old. A breakdown for us is
inconvenient, but for them it's a big expense. From what I've seen, you
can get what seems to be a quite nice 5yr old rig for $15k-$20k that
should have plenty of life left for our needs. There is a fair sized
community of RVers who use class 7 and 8 tow vehicles for huge 5th wheel
campers. If you check on RV.net you should find reference to them and
more info. I believe many will remove a drive axle from a tandem axle
class 8 truck to save on tolls since a single drive axle can handle
17,000#.

On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 19:01:58 -0500, the renowned "Pete C."
wrote:


Ignoramus19859 wrote:

On 2011-08-10, Pete C. wrote:

Karl Townsend wrote:

On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 11:08:01 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:


Ignoramus19859 wrote:

On 2011-08-10, Karl Townsend wrote:
On Tue, 09 Aug 2011 16:57:15 -0500, Ignoramus11295
wrote:

I am not about to become a "trucker", but I am thinking about getting
a Commercial Driver's License (CDL).

The purpose is to be able to drive a larger truck (like a 1 ton
pickup) with a larger trailer (like 15K lbs), buying and selling
larger things.
...

Didn't catch this part the first read. I run a 1 ton F350 Ford with a
24,000 lb. double dually trailer. I got one with a beaver tail so the
fork truck runs right up on it. I'm glad I got the biggest engine
made, lowest rear end ratio, and manual tranny. The unit is still WAY
under powered with a ten ton load on. I bet they'd shoot you in
Chicago land driving 30 on the Dan Ryan.

You are a "farmer", but I am not, and I would not be allowed to drive
such a rig.

i

It's questionable whether a farmer is really allowed to drive a rig that
far over GCWR...

That and I'm sure I can sell this rig, then buy a semi and have money
left over.

Karl

You'll probably get better MPG too. Certainly it will handle better and
be safer.

Guys, I am wondering about something. Tractors that haul semitrailers
are probably used until the last moment, or until they become too
unreliable? Are there any possibilities, realistically, to get a used
rig for relatively little money (compared to new), that would still
have enough life to go another 100k miles?

i

The big trucking companies turn over rigs at about 750k as a matter of
MTBF management. These are million mile trucks, so if you get one of
those with fresh brakes and tires you aren't likely to have a problem in
the 100k you'll ever put on them personally.

I was looking at a local magazine aimed at rig owner/operators (mostly
those of the South Asian persuasion) and there were some ads offering
diesel engine rebuilds.. well into 5 digits, in fact I think the kits
alone are more than $10K.

Are tractors like aircraft in that the price varies to a large degree
on how far they are from the next major engine overhaul?



Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

Spehro Pefhany wrote:

On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 19:01:58 -0500, the renowned "Pete C."
wrote:


Ignoramus19859 wrote:

On 2011-08-10, Pete C. wrote:

Karl Townsend wrote:

On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 11:08:01 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:


Ignoramus19859 wrote:

On 2011-08-10, Karl Townsend wrote:
On Tue, 09 Aug 2011 16:57:15 -0500, Ignoramus11295
wrote:

I am not about to become a "trucker", but I am thinking about getting
a Commercial Driver's License (CDL).

The purpose is to be able to drive a larger truck (like a 1 ton
pickup) with a larger trailer (like 15K lbs), buying and selling
larger things.
...

Didn't catch this part the first read. I run a 1 ton F350 Ford with a
24,000 lb. double dually trailer. I got one with a beaver tail so the
fork truck runs right up on it. I'm glad I got the biggest engine
made, lowest rear end ratio, and manual tranny. The unit is still WAY
under powered with a ten ton load on. I bet they'd shoot you in
Chicago land driving 30 on the Dan Ryan.

You are a "farmer", but I am not, and I would not be allowed to drive
such a rig.

i

It's questionable whether a farmer is really allowed to drive a rig that
far over GCWR...

That and I'm sure I can sell this rig, then buy a semi and have money
left over.

Karl

You'll probably get better MPG too. Certainly it will handle better and
be safer.

Guys, I am wondering about something. Tractors that haul semitrailers
are probably used until the last moment, or until they become too
unreliable? Are there any possibilities, realistically, to get a used
rig for relatively little money (compared to new), that would still
have enough life to go another 100k miles?

i

The big trucking companies turn over rigs at about 750k as a matter of
MTBF management. These are million mile trucks, so if you get one of
those with fresh brakes and tires you aren't likely to have a problem in
the 100k you'll ever put on them personally.

I was looking at a local magazine aimed at rig owner/operators (mostly
those of the South Asian persuasion) and there were some ads offering
diesel engine rebuilds.. well into 5 digits, in fact I think the kits
alone are more than $10K.

Are tractors like aircraft in that the price varies to a large degree
on how far they are from the next major engine overhaul?

Sort of, however those overhaul targets are based on averages and pretty
severe use, so the overhaul target for a trucking company and the
overhaul target for an RVer or personal user may be quite different.

On 2011-08-11, Pete C. wrote:

Ignoramus19859 wrote:

On 2011-08-11, Pete C. wrote:

Ignoramus19859 wrote:

Guys, I am wondering about something. Tractors that haul semitrailers
are probably used until the last moment, or until they become too
unreliable? Are there any possibilities, realistically, to get a used
rig for relatively little money (compared to new), that would still
have enough life to go another 100k miles?

The big trucking companies turn over rigs at about 750k as a matter of
MTBF management. These are million mile trucks, so if you get one of
those with fresh brakes and tires you aren't likely to have a problem in
the 100k you'll ever put on them personally.

Thanks. I have to wonder, how old are they in calendar terms, by the
time they reach 750,000 miles? Assuming they go 600 miles per day, it
would be just 3.5 years old?

Yep. They get used hard and then sold before their MTBF starts to creep
in. I've heard that the trucking companies won't accept an
owner/operator with a rig more than 5 years old. A breakdown for us is
inconvenient, but for them it's a big expense. From what I've seen, you
can get what seems to be a quite nice 5yr old rig for $15k-$20k that
should have plenty of life left for our needs. There is a fair sized
community of RVers who use class 7 and 8 tow vehicles for huge 5th wheel
campers. If you check on RV.net you should find reference to them and
more info. I believe many will remove a drive axle from a tandem axle
class 8 truck to save on tolls since a single drive axle can handle
17,000#.

This is great and exciting. Thanks Pete

i

Ignoramus11295 wrote:
I am not about to become a "trucker", but I am thinking about getting
a Commercial Driver's License (CDL).

The purpose is to be able to drive a larger truck (like a 1 ton
pickup) with a larger trailer (like 15K lbs), buying and selling
larger things.

I am curious if anyone here has a CDL and, if so, how hard it was to get.

Had mine since 1984 does that count?


I can study the study questions by myself, and I would prefer not to
go to a CDL school for a whole month.

Possible to do as long as you study the book and pay attention.


Can I somehow pass it with at-home preparation?

Sure. Just grab the book and study.

Also, can I pass that test with a vehicle that does not require a CDL?
NOPE. You MUST take the driving test on a vehicle that falls under the
class you are getting.
And make SURE that the vehicle you are testing on is legal for the class
you are testing on. It has to be licensed and registered and have
insurance as well as having all the DOT required equipment.


I will do some
finding out by myself also, but I wanted to hear if anyone has any
practical experience.

i

Be prepared when you go to the DMV. CDLs are NOT cheap.
Also you will have to have your DOT physical every two years(unless you
have certain medical problems), NOT the same as your normal physical.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/documents/s...cal-Report.pdf

Paperwork wise you will need to keep a log book if you are hauling for
hire. Make sure the vehicle has all the proper DOT required items and
that you pay VERY close attention to loading/tarping/securing the load.

Hope you don't drink or use any kind of drug. If you hold a CDL you can
be required to take a drug test at any time, and the limits and
fines/jail terms are different than non-cdl tags.


--
Steve W.

Ignoramus11295 wrote:
On 2011-08-09, Ecnerwal wrote:
In article ,
Ignoramus11295 wrote:

I am not about to become a "trucker", but I am thinking about getting
a Commercial Driver's License (CDL).

The purpose is to be able to drive a larger truck (like a 1 ton
pickup) with a larger trailer (like 15K lbs), buying and selling
larger things.
Check with your local DMV / RMV / whatever they call the drivers
licensing division in your state's web site, but in most states you can
drive quite a lot on a "car" driver's license - 26,000 lbs GVW on a
"car" license here, so long as it's not a schoolbus. You do a lot of
surplus - the duce-and-a-half is, IIRC, a classic "car license max"
truck, for instance. Kind of a high bed for loading machinery without a
dock, though.


So, I can own a Deuce and use it to haul stuff, without a CDL?

Unless your getting paid to haul the stuff.


It's a big hassle to get a CDL (especially these days - homeland
security wants to stick their oar in too.) Then you also have to
maintain logs, etc. You do need a CDL-class-suited vehicle, and a
CDL-class-suited licensed driver to supervise you - If you don't have a
buddy that's a truck driver with his own truck, that's much of the
reason for "CDL School" - access to those items.

I see. I think that in IL, CDL schools are required to teach 160
hours, which seems like a big overkill.

Depends on the school and the person in the class. I went in late 84
because of the vehicle access. There were two "students" in that class
that shouldn't have even shown up. Both had NEVER drove ANY vehicle and
decided that they wanted to be OTR drivers. Didn't have a clue what to
do or how to do it. One actually drove a yard truck right through the
shop wall because he forgot how the clutch worked!!!


IMHO, if going to school (or exploiting buddies), if you have a need to
get bigger than you can drive on a "car" license, just go for the
tractor-trailer (usually class A) license - you can drive anything else
with that one, and have a backup career, and more options in buying
trucks.

I think so too. Class A would be the way to go.

I hold an A & M with haz-mat, wrecker, Doubles/triples, metal coil and
tanker and had the passenger endorsement until last year (drove school
buses for a while)


i


--
Steve W.

On 2011-08-11, Steve W. wrote:
Ignoramus11295 wrote:
On 2011-08-09, Ecnerwal wrote:
In article ,
Ignoramus11295 wrote:

I am not about to become a "trucker", but I am thinking about getting
a Commercial Driver's License (CDL).

The purpose is to be able to drive a larger truck (like a 1 ton
pickup) with a larger trailer (like 15K lbs), buying and selling
larger things.
Check with your local DMV / RMV / whatever they call the drivers
licensing division in your state's web site, but in most states you can
drive quite a lot on a "car" driver's license - 26,000 lbs GVW on a
"car" license here, so long as it's not a schoolbus. You do a lot of
surplus - the duce-and-a-half is, IIRC, a classic "car license max"
truck, for instance. Kind of a high bed for loading machinery without a
dock, though.


So, I can own a Deuce and use it to haul stuff, without a CDL?

Unless your getting paid to haul the stuff.


It's a big hassle to get a CDL (especially these days - homeland
security wants to stick their oar in too.) Then you also have to
maintain logs, etc. You do need a CDL-class-suited vehicle, and a
CDL-class-suited licensed driver to supervise you - If you don't have a
buddy that's a truck driver with his own truck, that's much of the
reason for "CDL School" - access to those items.

I see. I think that in IL, CDL schools are required to teach 160
hours, which seems like a big overkill.

Depends on the school and the person in the class. I went in late 84
because of the vehicle access. There were two "students" in that class
that shouldn't have even shown up. Both had NEVER drove ANY vehicle and
decided that they wanted to be OTR drivers. Didn't have a clue what to
do or how to do it. One actually drove a yard truck right through the
shop wall because he forgot how the clutch worked!!!


IMHO, if going to school (or exploiting buddies), if you have a need to
get bigger than you can drive on a "car" license, just go for the
tractor-trailer (usually class A) license - you can drive anything else
with that one, and have a backup career, and more options in buying
trucks.

I think so too. Class A would be the way to go.

I hold an A & M with haz-mat, wrecker, Doubles/triples, metal coil and
tanker and had the passenger endorsement until last year (drove school
buses for a while)

What is so special about driving with metal coils?

Ignoramus11295 wrote:
On 2011-08-10, Pete C. wrote:
Ecnerwal wrote:
It's a big hassle to get a CDL
It's pretty simple really, just did it myself.

(especially these days - homeland
security wants to stick their oar in too.)
Only if you want the hazmat endorsement, they have nothing to do with
CDLs without hazmat endorsements. I go my hazmat endorsement and it was
fast and easy, and extra $60 or so, a quick appointment for fingerprints
and my updated CDL with hazmat endorsement in about two weeks.

I do not quite see the point of hazmat endorsement for me.

Then you also have to
maintain logs, etc.
Yes, if driving CMVs for commercial use. Personal use of CMVs is exempt
from logs and hours of service, but since Iggy is looking to haul stuff
for his business he will need to keep logs, which isn't that big a deal.

So, I need to keep logs only for business stuff?

"Went to Dairy Queen"

This is where it gets "fun"

The laws say you have to keep an accurate log for the hours you are in
operation as well as 7 days prior. So if you went to an auction to buy
stuff last Saturday you would have logged that. Then you decide to take
a load of stuff to another auction this Saturday. Well now you have to
log the days in between as well because those now count. Also the way
you log hours gets interesting. You basically have four hour types, Off
Duty, Sleeper Berth (must be an actual sleeper) Driving and On Duty Not
Driving. Driving is just what it says. You are actively the driver of
the vehicle.
On duty Not driving gets interesting because anything that is connected
with the business but NOT driving counts. Loading the truck, getting
fuel, even sitting at the auction house or at a shop waiting to buy/load
items gets counted.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regul...k-examples.htm




You do need a CDL-class-suited vehicle, and a
CDL-class-suited licensed driver to supervise you - If you don't have a
buddy that's a truck driver with his own truck, that's much of the
reason for "CDL School" - access to those items.
You can rent a CMV for your road test, and when you get your CDL
"learner's permit" after you pass the written test, the truck rental
place can take you out on the road to familiarize yourself with the
truck before your official road test. It's not brain surgery, if you can
drive a pickup with a trailer you can most likely drive a semi just
fine.

I can drive a truck with a trailer. The longer the trailer is in
relation to the towing vehicle, the easier it is to back up with it.

Yep. That is why practicing with the vehicles gets to be important. Oh
and FYI unless they have changed the driving test the basics are
Pre trip inspection (tires, lights, safety gear, leaks,security of the
load, HUT tag and such) Engine start, air pressure and gauges check,
Driving forward and making turns as the brownie directs. Straight line
backing, and parallel parking were in there as well. Nothing like
backing a west coast tractor with a 53 foot box in a straight line then
pulling up and dropping into the cones and having the brownie get out
and use his foot to measure the distance from each set of duals to the curb!


IMHO, if going to school (or exploiting buddies), if you have a need to
get bigger than you can drive on a "car" license, just go for the
tractor-trailer (usually class A) license - you can drive anything else
with that one, and have a backup career, and more options in buying
trucks.
Yes, certainly, get the A and the extra endorsements, it's not much more
effort. I got all endorsements except for passenger.

Thanks!

i

Both passenger and Haz-mat require background checks, and fingerprints.
If you do one you may as well do both. Gives you the option of buses and
such if you want a part time job.

--
Steve W.

"Steve W." wrote:

Ignoramus11295 wrote:
I am not about to become a "trucker", but I am thinking about getting
a Commercial Driver's License (CDL).

The purpose is to be able to drive a larger truck (like a 1 ton
pickup) with a larger trailer (like 15K lbs), buying and selling
larger things.

I am curious if anyone here has a CDL and, if so, how hard it was to get.

Had mine since 1984 does that count?

Yep.



I can study the study questions by myself, and I would prefer not to
go to a CDL school for a whole month.

Possible to do as long as you study the book and pay attention.

Absolutely. Paying attention and having the mechanical aptitude to
understand air brakes and the like is what you need.



Can I somehow pass it with at-home preparation?

Sure. Just grab the book and study.

Also, can I pass that test with a vehicle that does not require a CDL?
NOPE. You MUST take the driving test on a vehicle that falls under the
class you are getting.

Yep, at least around here there are multiple "rent our truck for your
CDL test" places that will rent you a suitable truck with a 27' trailer,
give you an hour of drive time to familiarize yourself with the truck
with your learners permit, then you do your road test and call it done.
Around here it runs ~$500 give or take depending on the distance to the
DPS office you go to.

And make SURE that the vehicle you are testing on is legal for the class
you are testing on. It has to be licensed and registered and have
insurance as well as having all the DOT required equipment.

Yep, the DPS inspector checks the truck/reg/insurance, the truck rental
place will have everything proper if the do this as a regular business.
The DPS folks usually know the truck folks since they see them
frequently.


I will do some
finding out by myself also, but I wanted to hear if anyone has any
practical experience.

i

Be prepared when you go to the DMV. CDLs are NOT cheap.

Around $750 with the cost of truck rental, license fees, TSA fees
(hazmat), and a couple books. Not cheap, but certainly not terribly
expensive.

Also you will have to have your DOT physical every two years(unless you
have certain medical problems), NOT the same as your normal physical.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/documents/s...cal-Report.pdf

CVS's Minute Clinic does DOT physicals for about $60.


Paperwork wise you will need to keep a log book if you are hauling for
hire.

Yes, and that log has to cover something like 7 hours before you go on
duty for commercial CMV driving, i.e. you need to log your personal time
as well.

Make sure the vehicle has all the proper DOT required items and
that you pay VERY close attention to loading/tarping/securing the load.

Absolutely, and this should apply to non CMVs as well. It doesn't matter
if it's a semi or a compact pickup, loosing a load and causing an
accident will not make your day.


Hope you don't drink or use any kind of drug. If you hold a CDL you can
be required to take a drug test at any time, and the limits and
fines/jail terms are different than non-cdl tags.

Absolutely, and you can't get speeding tickets or the like deferred as
you can with a non CDL license. It is also illegal to text while driving
a CMV, even stopped at a traffic light. Texting is only allowed when you
are stopped in a place where you can safely remain stopped indefinitely.
Radar detectors are also illegal in CMVs.

"Steve W." wrote:

Ignoramus11295 wrote:
On 2011-08-09, Ecnerwal wrote:
In article ,
Ignoramus11295 wrote:

I am not about to become a "trucker", but I am thinking about getting
a Commercial Driver's License (CDL).

The purpose is to be able to drive a larger truck (like a 1 ton
pickup) with a larger trailer (like 15K lbs), buying and selling
larger things.
Check with your local DMV / RMV / whatever they call the drivers
licensing division in your state's web site, but in most states you can
drive quite a lot on a "car" driver's license - 26,000 lbs GVW on a
"car" license here, so long as it's not a schoolbus. You do a lot of
surplus - the duce-and-a-half is, IIRC, a classic "car license max"
truck, for instance. Kind of a high bed for loading machinery without a
dock, though.


So, I can own a Deuce and use it to haul stuff, without a CDL?

Unless your getting paid to haul the stuff.


It's a big hassle to get a CDL (especially these days - homeland
security wants to stick their oar in too.) Then you also have to
maintain logs, etc. You do need a CDL-class-suited vehicle, and a
CDL-class-suited licensed driver to supervise you - If you don't have a
buddy that's a truck driver with his own truck, that's much of the
reason for "CDL School" - access to those items.

I see. I think that in IL, CDL schools are required to teach 160
hours, which seems like a big overkill.

Depends on the school and the person in the class. I went in late 84
because of the vehicle access. There were two "students" in that class
that shouldn't have even shown up. Both had NEVER drove ANY vehicle and
decided that they wanted to be OTR drivers. Didn't have a clue what to
do or how to do it. One actually drove a yard truck right through the
shop wall because he forgot how the clutch worked!!!


IMHO, if going to school (or exploiting buddies), if you have a need to
get bigger than you can drive on a "car" license, just go for the
tractor-trailer (usually class A) license - you can drive anything else
with that one, and have a backup career, and more options in buying
trucks.

I think so too. Class A would be the way to go.

I hold an A & M with haz-mat, wrecker, Doubles/triples, metal coil and
tanker and had the passenger endorsement until last year (drove school
buses for a while)

AM with TX here. Not interested in the passenger endorsement, I'm not a
people person and driving a passenger van/bus is about the last thing
I'd ever want to do.

Pete C. wrote:
Karl Townsend wrote:
On Tue, 09 Aug 2011 22:00:57 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:

Karl Townsend wrote:
On Tue, 09 Aug 2011 21:02:37 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:

Ignoramus11295 wrote:
I am not about to become a "trucker", but I am thinking about getting
a Commercial Driver's License (CDL).

The purpose is to be able to drive a larger truck (like a 1 ton
pickup) with a larger trailer (like 15K lbs), buying and selling
larger things.

I am curious if anyone here has a CDL and, if so, how hard it was to get.

I can study the study questions by myself, and I would prefer not to
go to a CDL school for a whole month.

Can I somehow pass it with at-home preparation? Also, can I pass that
test with a vehicle that does not require a CDL? I will do some
finding out by myself also, but I wanted to hear if anyone has any
practical experience.

i
I recently go my CDL, class AM with TX endorsements (double, triple
trailer, tanker, hazmat). It is not at all difficult if you are smart
enough to understand how air brakes work, and can handle a vehicle with
a trailer. I got a few CDL books and reviewed them over the course of a
couple weeks in my spare time, then I went to the DPS office here and
took the written (computer based) tests of which I passed all 8 or 9 I
took on the first try in a total of about 45 minutes.

After that I got in touch with one of the area "rent our truck for your
CDL test" places and rented a truck for the road test. The truck place
provided a nice Kenworth T2000 auto-shift truck and a 27' "pup" trailer
as is normally used in a tandem configuration. The truck folks met me at
the DPS office early in the morning and gave me a review of the air
brake test and an hour or so of drive time to familiarize myself with
the truck, which was on the actual route the DPS uses for the road test.

After I passed the road test I waited in line at the DPS to do the last
paperwork, then waited at the truck for the DPS tester. The actual road
test was not difficult at all and the DPS guy was very nice, the test
took perhaps 45 min. After that a quick visit back in the DPS office
where I received my paper temporary license, with the regular license in
the mail a week later.

For the hazmat endorsement which you may not care about, there was an
extra step of an appointment for fingerprints to go to the TSA for check
and approval (new post 9/11). The TSA approval came in less than two
weeks and the new license with the hazmat endorsement in the mail a few
days later.

The total cost with books, truck rental, license and TSA fees was around
$750. If you'd like I'd be happy to loan you the books, or you could
just order the best one "Bumper to Bumper the complete guide to
tractor-trailer operations" which goes for about $48 and I believe is
used by many of the schools.

The bottom line is that it's not brain surgery and you should have no
problem passing the test. You will need to get a DOT physical exam,
CVS's Minute Clinic does them for $60 or so, and you'll need a log book
for any commercial driving you do. Also note that you can't get any
traffic tickets waived or the like as you can with a non commercial
license.
Very informative, Pete.

If i was to follow in your footsteps to get the CDL and then buy a
tractor trailer unit. What else would be involved in driving my stuff
cross country?

Karl
Insurance, log book if you don't fall under the personal use exemption,
and probably a DOT number (free). Oh, and a lot of diesel at 5-6 MPG
Great! Right now its legal for me to buy and operate a semi as part of
my farm in MN. Main restriction is 150 mile limit from home. My son
wants me to get one but I'm hearing this farmer provision is going
away. So, I've been dragging my feet. I thought a CDL was far more
expensive both in time and money.

I don't think that farmer provision is really going away, but as you
note, it limits your range to in-state and near your farm.

CDL schools cost a bit, seems like $2k-$4k, and even the community
college CDL classes are overpriced. As long as you have a clue, the rent
a truck and take the test route works fine. The truck rental places
typically offer test insurance for a bit extra where if you somehow fail
the first test, you get to use the truck for retests at no extra cost.
Most people won't have a problem passing the first time, but the extra
comfort level of knowing you won't have to pay for a retest can make it
easier to pass that first time.

I've been told to watch for a '97 or older because its pre-ABS brake
and this is a huge problem on high milage tractors. Have you heard
this? OTOH, I'd own the tractor for for maybe 20 years and don't want
a friggin' antique. Anyway, where would i go for advice on what unit
to watch for?

I haven't heard of ABS issues on class 8 tractors, perhaps what was
being referred to is emissions controls (DPF) on the newer rigs. Those
DPFs are expensive to replace when they wear out, but if you get a truck
with a recently replaced one it ought to last you forever in the light
service you'd give it compared to normal trucking.

The ABS problems were mainly on the older rigs when the systems were
first being tested out. They didn't have the ability to cope with the
huge load differentials. The newer systems are pretty good.
As far as the emissions PIA I would hunt for a rig from 2000-2007, most
of those are pretty trouble free and don't have a lot of the extra crap.
The new regs are causing a lot of problems for the fire service. Due to
the way the engines get operated they have a hard time passing the regs.
Many companies went out and bought stockpiles of pre reg engines and
gliders or tagged frame rails to build on. So you can buy a brand new
custom built rig in 2011 that gets registered as an 09!

--
Steve W.

"Steve W." wrote:

Ignoramus11295 wrote:
On 2011-08-10, Pete C. wrote:
Ecnerwal wrote:
It's a big hassle to get a CDL
It's pretty simple really, just did it myself.

(especially these days - homeland
security wants to stick their oar in too.)
Only if you want the hazmat endorsement, they have nothing to do with
CDLs without hazmat endorsements. I go my hazmat endorsement and it was
fast and easy, and extra $60 or so, a quick appointment for fingerprints
and my updated CDL with hazmat endorsement in about two weeks.

I do not quite see the point of hazmat endorsement for me.

Then you also have to
maintain logs, etc.
Yes, if driving CMVs for commercial use. Personal use of CMVs is exempt
from logs and hours of service, but since Iggy is looking to haul stuff
for his business he will need to keep logs, which isn't that big a deal.

So, I need to keep logs only for business stuff?

"Went to Dairy Queen"

This is where it gets "fun"

The laws say you have to keep an accurate log for the hours you are in
operation as well as 7 days prior. So if you went to an auction to buy
stuff last Saturday you would have logged that. Then you decide to take
a load of stuff to another auction this Saturday. Well now you have to
log the days in between as well because those now count. Also the way
you log hours gets interesting. You basically have four hour types, Off
Duty, Sleeper Berth (must be an actual sleeper) Driving and On Duty Not
Driving. Driving is just what it says. You are actively the driver of
the vehicle.
On duty Not driving gets interesting because anything that is connected
with the business but NOT driving counts. Loading the truck, getting
fuel, even sitting at the auction house or at a shop waiting to buy/load
items gets counted.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regul...k-examples.htm

I knew it was 7-something Not real critical until I get a CMV myself,
and even then since I won't be running a business I'll be exempt.




You do need a CDL-class-suited vehicle, and a
CDL-class-suited licensed driver to supervise you - If you don't have a
buddy that's a truck driver with his own truck, that's much of the
reason for "CDL School" - access to those items.
You can rent a CMV for your road test, and when you get your CDL
"learner's permit" after you pass the written test, the truck rental
place can take you out on the road to familiarize yourself with the
truck before your official road test. It's not brain surgery, if you can
drive a pickup with a trailer you can most likely drive a semi just
fine.

I can drive a truck with a trailer. The longer the trailer is in
relation to the towing vehicle, the easier it is to back up with it.

Yep. That is why practicing with the vehicles gets to be important. Oh
and FYI unless they have changed the driving test the basics are
Pre trip inspection (tires, lights, safety gear, leaks,security of the
load, HUT tag and such) Engine start, air pressure and gauges check,
Driving forward and making turns as the brownie directs. Straight line
backing, and parallel parking were in there as well. Nothing like
backing a west coast tractor with a 53 foot box in a straight line then
pulling up and dropping into the cones and having the brownie get out
and use his foot to measure the distance from each set of duals to the curb!

This varies a bit from state to state and office to office. Around here
the pre-trip inspection is a written test only, and the DPS guy just
does a quick walk around to check lights and whatnot. They also do
minimal parallel parking, basically just move the rig closer to the curb
and reasonably parallel. The truck rental places also supply a 27'
trailer, not a 53' so that's a bit easier. I think they are reasonable
in looking for you to have control of the vehicle, not be perfect and
ready for the trucker's rodeo. You need to be safe on the road, but
perfect comes with experience.



IMHO, if going to school (or exploiting buddies), if you have a need to
get bigger than you can drive on a "car" license, just go for the
tractor-trailer (usually class A) license - you can drive anything else
with that one, and have a backup career, and more options in buying
trucks.
Yes, certainly, get the A and the extra endorsements, it's not much more
effort. I got all endorsements except for passenger.

Thanks!

i

Both passenger and Haz-mat require background checks, and fingerprints.
If you do one you may as well do both. Gives you the option of buses and
such if you want a part time job.

No! No passengers! runs screaming Give me a nice big vacuum truck and
let me clean sewers...

Ignoramus19859 wrote:
On 2011-08-10, Pete C. wrote:
Karl Townsend wrote:
On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 11:08:01 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:

Ignoramus19859 wrote:
On 2011-08-10, Karl Townsend wrote:
On Tue, 09 Aug 2011 16:57:15 -0500, Ignoramus11295
wrote:

I am not about to become a "trucker", but I am thinking about getting
a Commercial Driver's License (CDL).

The purpose is to be able to drive a larger truck (like a 1 ton
pickup) with a larger trailer (like 15K lbs), buying and selling
larger things.
...

Didn't catch this part the first read. I run a 1 ton F350 Ford with a
24,000 lb. double dually trailer. I got one with a beaver tail so the
fork truck runs right up on it. I'm glad I got the biggest engine
made, lowest rear end ratio, and manual tranny. The unit is still WAY
under powered with a ten ton load on. I bet they'd shoot you in
Chicago land driving 30 on the Dan Ryan.
You are a "farmer", but I am not, and I would not be allowed to drive
such a rig.

i
It's questionable whether a farmer is really allowed to drive a rig that
far over GCWR...
That and I'm sure I can sell this rig, then buy a semi and have money
left over.

Karl
You'll probably get better MPG too. Certainly it will handle better and
be safer.

Guys, I am wondering about something. Tractors that haul semitrailers
are probably used until the last moment, or until they become too
unreliable? Are there any possibilities, realistically, to get a used
rig for relatively little money (compared to new), that would still
have enough life to go another 100k miles?

i

Sure, How many would you like. There are TON's of them out there where
a guy just HAD to be a driver and then found out what it's really like.
Or ones that are off lease or brokered rigs that sleets are selling off.
Whatever you look at have them pull ALL the maintenance records, run an
oil sample from THAT rig and have a good mechanic check it over before
buying. Some parts are not that bad to replace but there are more than a
few that will eat your wallet and come back for seconds!!!

100K is child's play for most rigs today. Especially when you likely
will not come close to capacity hauling.

--
Steve W.

Ignoramus19859 wrote:

On 2011-08-11, Steve W. wrote:
Ignoramus11295 wrote:
On 2011-08-09, Ecnerwal wrote:
In article ,
Ignoramus11295 wrote:

I am not about to become a "trucker", but I am thinking about getting
a Commercial Driver's License (CDL).

The purpose is to be able to drive a larger truck (like a 1 ton
pickup) with a larger trailer (like 15K lbs), buying and selling
larger things.
Check with your local DMV / RMV / whatever they call the drivers
licensing division in your state's web site, but in most states you can
drive quite a lot on a "car" driver's license - 26,000 lbs GVW on a
"car" license here, so long as it's not a schoolbus. You do a lot of
surplus - the duce-and-a-half is, IIRC, a classic "car license max"
truck, for instance. Kind of a high bed for loading machinery without a
dock, though.


So, I can own a Deuce and use it to haul stuff, without a CDL?

Unless your getting paid to haul the stuff.


It's a big hassle to get a CDL (especially these days - homeland
security wants to stick their oar in too.) Then you also have to
maintain logs, etc. You do need a CDL-class-suited vehicle, and a
CDL-class-suited licensed driver to supervise you - If you don't have a
buddy that's a truck driver with his own truck, that's much of the
reason for "CDL School" - access to those items.

I see. I think that in IL, CDL schools are required to teach 160
hours, which seems like a big overkill.

Depends on the school and the person in the class. I went in late 84
because of the vehicle access. There were two "students" in that class
that shouldn't have even shown up. Both had NEVER drove ANY vehicle and
decided that they wanted to be OTR drivers. Didn't have a clue what to
do or how to do it. One actually drove a yard truck right through the
shop wall because he forgot how the clutch worked!!!


IMHO, if going to school (or exploiting buddies), if you have a need to
get bigger than you can drive on a "car" license, just go for the
tractor-trailer (usually class A) license - you can drive anything else
with that one, and have a backup career, and more options in buying
trucks.

I think so too. Class A would be the way to go.

I hold an A & M with haz-mat, wrecker, Doubles/triples, metal coil and
tanker and had the passenger endorsement until last year (drove school
buses for a while)

What is so special about driving with metal coils?

A bit trickier securing the load, and nasty things happening if one gets
free. I believe they actually dropped that as a separate endorsement.

Pete C. wrote:

I think so too. Class A would be the way to go.
I hold an A & M with haz-mat, wrecker, Doubles/triples, metal coil and
tanker and had the passenger endorsement until last year (drove school
buses for a while)
What is so special about driving with metal coils?

A bit trickier securing the load, and nasty things happening if one gets
free. I believe they actually dropped that as a separate endorsement.

Yeah, you really don't want to see what happens when a big roll of steel
comes loose at 60 mph. NOT pretty.

T - Double/Triple Trailers Endorsement (Knowledge Test only)
P - Passenger Endorsement (Knowledge and Skills Test)
N - Tank Vehicle Endorsement (Knowledge Test only)
H - Hazardous Materials Endorsement (Knowledge Test only)
X - Combination of Tank Vehicle and Hazardous Materials Endorsement
S - School Bus Endorsement (Knowledge and Skills Test)

are the current ones. BUT if you already had the coil tag they still
carry it over Why????

Plus if you take the test on a vehicle without air brakes you get a
restriction that you cannot drive a vehicle with them.

--
Steve W.

Pete C. wrote:
"Steve W." wrote:
Ignoramus11295 wrote:
On 2011-08-09, Ecnerwal wrote:
In article ,
Ignoramus11295 wrote:

I am not about to become a "trucker", but I am thinking about getting
a Commercial Driver's License (CDL).

The purpose is to be able to drive a larger truck (like a 1 ton
pickup) with a larger trailer (like 15K lbs), buying and selling
larger things.
Check with your local DMV / RMV / whatever they call the drivers
licensing division in your state's web site, but in most states you can
drive quite a lot on a "car" driver's license - 26,000 lbs GVW on a
"car" license here, so long as it's not a schoolbus. You do a lot of
surplus - the duce-and-a-half is, IIRC, a classic "car license max"
truck, for instance. Kind of a high bed for loading machinery without a
dock, though.

So, I can own a Deuce and use it to haul stuff, without a CDL?
Unless your getting paid to haul the stuff.

It's a big hassle to get a CDL (especially these days - homeland
security wants to stick their oar in too.) Then you also have to
maintain logs, etc. You do need a CDL-class-suited vehicle, and a
CDL-class-suited licensed driver to supervise you - If you don't have a
buddy that's a truck driver with his own truck, that's much of the
reason for "CDL School" - access to those items.
I see. I think that in IL, CDL schools are required to teach 160
hours, which seems like a big overkill.
Depends on the school and the person in the class. I went in late 84
because of the vehicle access. There were two "students" in that class
that shouldn't have even shown up. Both had NEVER drove ANY vehicle and
decided that they wanted to be OTR drivers. Didn't have a clue what to
do or how to do it. One actually drove a yard truck right through the
shop wall because he forgot how the clutch worked!!!

IMHO, if going to school (or exploiting buddies), if you have a need to
get bigger than you can drive on a "car" license, just go for the
tractor-trailer (usually class A) license - you can drive anything else
with that one, and have a backup career, and more options in buying
trucks.
I think so too. Class A would be the way to go.
I hold an A & M with haz-mat, wrecker, Doubles/triples, metal coil and
tanker and had the passenger endorsement until last year (drove school
buses for a while)

AM with TX here. Not interested in the passenger endorsement, I'm not a
people person and driving a passenger van/bus is about the last thing
I'd ever want to do.

How did you guess that I got out of that job after the first year????

ANYONE who thinks that the children of today are well mannered, pleasant
people just needs to drive a school bus for about a month. If you make
it that long without wanting to drive the entire bus off a cliff after
realizing that "these kids will be ruling the world some day" you may
want to talk to a shrink....

--
Steve W.

Pete C. wrote:
"Steve W." wrote:
Ignoramus11295 wrote:
On 2011-08-10, Pete C. wrote:
Ecnerwal wrote:
It's a big hassle to get a CDL
It's pretty simple really, just did it myself.

(especially these days - homeland
security wants to stick their oar in too.)
Only if you want the hazmat endorsement, they have nothing to do with
CDLs without hazmat endorsements. I go my hazmat endorsement and it was
fast and easy, and extra $60 or so, a quick appointment for fingerprints
and my updated CDL with hazmat endorsement in about two weeks.
I do not quite see the point of hazmat endorsement for me.

Then you also have to
maintain logs, etc.
Yes, if driving CMVs for commercial use. Personal use of CMVs is exempt
from logs and hours of service, but since Iggy is looking to haul stuff
for his business he will need to keep logs, which isn't that big a deal.
So, I need to keep logs only for business stuff?

"Went to Dairy Queen"
This is where it gets "fun"

The laws say you have to keep an accurate log for the hours you are in
operation as well as 7 days prior. So if you went to an auction to buy
stuff last Saturday you would have logged that. Then you decide to take
a load of stuff to another auction this Saturday. Well now you have to
log the days in between as well because those now count. Also the way
you log hours gets interesting. You basically have four hour types, Off
Duty, Sleeper Berth (must be an actual sleeper) Driving and On Duty Not
Driving. Driving is just what it says. You are actively the driver of
the vehicle.
On duty Not driving gets interesting because anything that is connected
with the business but NOT driving counts. Loading the truck, getting
fuel, even sitting at the auction house or at a shop waiting to buy/load
items gets counted.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regul...k-examples.htm

I knew it was 7-something Not real critical until I get a CMV myself,
and even then since I won't be running a business I'll be exempt.


You do need a CDL-class-suited vehicle, and a
CDL-class-suited licensed driver to supervise you - If you don't have a
buddy that's a truck driver with his own truck, that's much of the
reason for "CDL School" - access to those items.
You can rent a CMV for your road test, and when you get your CDL
"learner's permit" after you pass the written test, the truck rental
place can take you out on the road to familiarize yourself with the
truck before your official road test. It's not brain surgery, if you can
drive a pickup with a trailer you can most likely drive a semi just
fine.
I can drive a truck with a trailer. The longer the trailer is in
relation to the towing vehicle, the easier it is to back up with it.
Yep. That is why practicing with the vehicles gets to be important. Oh
and FYI unless they have changed the driving test the basics are
Pre trip inspection (tires, lights, safety gear, leaks,security of the
load, HUT tag and such) Engine start, air pressure and gauges check,
Driving forward and making turns as the brownie directs. Straight line
backing, and parallel parking were in there as well. Nothing like
backing a west coast tractor with a 53 foot box in a straight line then
pulling up and dropping into the cones and having the brownie get out
and use his foot to measure the distance from each set of duals to the curb!

This varies a bit from state to state and office to office. Around here
the pre-trip inspection is a written test only, and the DPS guy just
does a quick walk around to check lights and whatnot. They also do
minimal parallel parking, basically just move the rig closer to the curb
and reasonably parallel. The truck rental places also supply a 27'
trailer, not a 53' so that's a bit easier. I think they are reasonable
in looking for you to have control of the vehicle, not be perfect and
ready for the trucker's rodeo. You need to be safe on the road, but
perfect comes with experience.

I know when I did mine in NY the pre trip counted toward the points. I
took mine in downtown Syracuse on a Monday just before lunch.
LOT'S of "fun". Only thing I missed was I didn't call attention to the
brownie wearing his seat belt. I simply said that it was his choice if
he wanted the ticket.


IMHO, if going to school (or exploiting buddies), if you have a need to
get bigger than you can drive on a "car" license, just go for the
tractor-trailer (usually class A) license - you can drive anything else
with that one, and have a backup career, and more options in buying
trucks.
Yes, certainly, get the A and the extra endorsements, it's not much more
effort. I got all endorsements except for passenger.
Thanks!

i
Both passenger and Haz-mat require background checks, and fingerprints.
If you do one you may as well do both. Gives you the option of buses and
such if you want a part time job.

No! No passengers! runs screaming Give me a nice big vacuum truck and
let me clean sewers...

Well either way you may have the same cargo .....

--
Steve W.

"Steve W." wrote:

Pete C. wrote:

I think so too. Class A would be the way to go.
I hold an A & M with haz-mat, wrecker, Doubles/triples, metal coil and
tanker and had the passenger endorsement until last year (drove school
buses for a while)
What is so special about driving with metal coils?

A bit trickier securing the load, and nasty things happening if one gets
free. I believe they actually dropped that as a separate endorsement.

Yeah, you really don't want to see what happens when a big roll of steel
comes loose at 60 mph. NOT pretty.

T - Double/Triple Trailers Endorsement (Knowledge Test only)
P - Passenger Endorsement (Knowledge and Skills Test)
N - Tank Vehicle Endorsement (Knowledge Test only)
H - Hazardous Materials Endorsement (Knowledge Test only)
X - Combination of Tank Vehicle and Hazardous Materials Endorsement
S - School Bus Endorsement (Knowledge and Skills Test)

are the current ones. BUT if you already had the coil tag they still
carry it over Why????

Drivers don't like to have their letters taken away?


Plus if you take the test on a vehicle without air brakes you get a
restriction that you cannot drive a vehicle with them.

Yep. Air brakes are pretty straightforward really.

"Steve W." wrote:

Pete C. wrote:
"Steve W." wrote:
Ignoramus11295 wrote:
On 2011-08-09, Ecnerwal wrote:
In article ,
Ignoramus11295 wrote:

I am not about to become a "trucker", but I am thinking about getting
a Commercial Driver's License (CDL).

The purpose is to be able to drive a larger truck (like a 1 ton
pickup) with a larger trailer (like 15K lbs), buying and selling
larger things.
Check with your local DMV / RMV / whatever they call the drivers
licensing division in your state's web site, but in most states you can
drive quite a lot on a "car" driver's license - 26,000 lbs GVW on a
"car" license here, so long as it's not a schoolbus. You do a lot of
surplus - the duce-and-a-half is, IIRC, a classic "car license max"
truck, for instance. Kind of a high bed for loading machinery without a
dock, though.

So, I can own a Deuce and use it to haul stuff, without a CDL?
Unless your getting paid to haul the stuff.

It's a big hassle to get a CDL (especially these days - homeland
security wants to stick their oar in too.) Then you also have to
maintain logs, etc. You do need a CDL-class-suited vehicle, and a
CDL-class-suited licensed driver to supervise you - If you don't have a
buddy that's a truck driver with his own truck, that's much of the
reason for "CDL School" - access to those items.
I see. I think that in IL, CDL schools are required to teach 160
hours, which seems like a big overkill.
Depends on the school and the person in the class. I went in late 84
because of the vehicle access. There were two "students" in that class
that shouldn't have even shown up. Both had NEVER drove ANY vehicle and
decided that they wanted to be OTR drivers. Didn't have a clue what to
do or how to do it. One actually drove a yard truck right through the
shop wall because he forgot how the clutch worked!!!

IMHO, if going to school (or exploiting buddies), if you have a need to
get bigger than you can drive on a "car" license, just go for the
tractor-trailer (usually class A) license - you can drive anything else
with that one, and have a backup career, and more options in buying
trucks.
I think so too. Class A would be the way to go.
I hold an A & M with haz-mat, wrecker, Doubles/triples, metal coil and
tanker and had the passenger endorsement until last year (drove school
buses for a while)

AM with TX here. Not interested in the passenger endorsement, I'm not a
people person and driving a passenger van/bus is about the last thing
I'd ever want to do.

How did you guess that I got out of that job after the first year????

ANYONE who thinks that the children of today are well mannered, pleasant
people just needs to drive a school bus for about a month. If you make
it that long without wanting to drive the entire bus off a cliff after
realizing that "these kids will be ruling the world some day" you may
want to talk to a shrink....

I don't think the "adults" on a city bus are much better. Or tour busses
gah!.

On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:29:57 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:


Ignoramus19859 wrote:

On 2011-08-11, Steve W. wrote:

I hold an A & M with haz-mat, wrecker, Doubles/triples, metal coil and
tanker and had the passenger endorsement until last year (drove school
buses for a while)

What is so special about driving with metal coils?

A bit trickier securing the load, and nasty things happening if one gets
free. I believe they actually dropped that as a separate endorsement.

Sorta like Gunner's spare tire episode, ON STEROIDS, huh? titter

--
Fear not those who argue but those who dodge.
-- Marie Ebner von Eschenbach

On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:18:08 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:


"Steve W." wrote:

Be prepared when you go to the DMV. CDLs are NOT cheap.

Around $750 with the cost of truck rental, license fees, TSA fees
(hazmat), and a couple books. Not cheap, but certainly not terribly
expensive.

What's the actual breakdown on those costs, Pete?
Curious minds, etc.


Also you will have to have your DOT physical every two years(unless you
have certain medical problems), NOT the same as your normal physical.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/documents/s...cal-Report.pdf

CVS's Minute Clinic does DOT physicals for about $60.

Not bad.

--
Fear not those who argue but those who dodge.
-- Marie Ebner von Eschenbach

On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:28:17 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:29:57 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:


Ignoramus19859 wrote:

On 2011-08-11, Steve W. wrote:

I hold an A & M with haz-mat, wrecker, Doubles/triples, metal coil and
tanker and had the passenger endorsement until last year (drove school
buses for a while)

What is so special about driving with metal coils?

A bit trickier securing the load, and nasty things happening if one gets
free. I believe they actually dropped that as a separate endorsement.

Sorta like Gunner's spare tire episode, ON STEROIDS, huh? titter

No..fortunately. My spare tire didnt break open and lay loops and lines
of pretty much razor sharp steel over hills and dales for other vehicles
to slam into..cutting off roofs, tires, fenders...and then there are
those riding motorcycles.......think of it as...really big ginzu knives
against bikers.......


--
"The danger to America is not Barack Obama but a citizenry
capable of entrusting a man like him with the Presidency.
It will be far easier to limit and undo the follies of an
Obama presidency than to restore the necessary common sense
and good judgment to a depraved electorate willing to have
such a man for their? president.. Blaming the prince of the
fools should not blind anyone to the vast confederacy of
fools that made him their prince".

On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:28:36 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:


Both passenger and Haz-mat require background checks, and fingerprints.
If you do one you may as well do both. Gives you the option of buses and
such if you want a part time job.

No! No passengers! runs screaming Give me a nice big vacuum truck and
let me clean sewers...

"say Mister...whats it like to drive a suck truck?"




--
"The danger to America is not Barack Obama but a citizenry
capable of entrusting a man like him with the Presidency.
It will be far easier to limit and undo the follies of an
Obama presidency than to restore the necessary common sense
and good judgment to a depraved electorate willing to have
such a man for their? president.. Blaming the prince of the
fools should not blind anyone to the vast confederacy of
fools that made him their prince".

Gunner Asch wrote:
On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:28:36 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:

Both passenger and Haz-mat require background checks, and fingerprints.
If you do one you may as well do both. Gives you the option of buses and
such if you want a part time job.
No! No passengers! runs screaming Give me a nice big vacuum truck and
let me clean sewers...

"say Mister...whats it like to drive a suck truck?"


They are now making fire tankers using the same systems. VERY IMPRESSIVE
to see those in operation.
Our main tanker holds 2000 gallons, with the onboard pump from start to
finish it takes about 12 minutes to fill it.
The Water Master we looked at will fill a 3500 gallon tank start to
finish in under 7!

It also has a BIG advantage with lifting the water. most conventional
pumps can only lift water vertical about 15 feet before they run out of
vacuum. The WM rig can lift 28 feet vertical

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkz2mTN7jE4


FireoVac
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jp9vDUT_96o
crappy music though...
--
Steve W.

Ignoramus19859 on Wed, 10 Aug
2011 09:53:28 -0500 typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
On 2011-08-10, Karl Townsend wrote:
On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 00:02:01 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:

Ignoramus11295 on Tue, 09 Aug
2011 16:57:15 -0500 typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
I am not about to become a "trucker", but I am thinking about getting
a Commercial Driver's License (CDL).

The purpose is to be able to drive a larger truck (like a 1 ton
pickup) with a larger trailer (like 15K lbs), buying and selling
larger things.

I am curious if anyone here has a CDL and, if so, how hard it was to get.

I can study the study questions by myself, and I would prefer not to
go to a CDL school for a whole month.

Can I somehow pass it with at-home preparation? Also, can I pass that
test with a vehicle that does not require a CDL? I will do some
finding out by myself also, but I wanted to hear if anyone has any
practical experience.

Check your local state regulations. They will be able to tell
you if you need a CDL and what class it would be. For a one ton
pickup, I doubt you need a commercial endorsement.


tschus
pyotr

I seem to remember Iggy getting burned by the cops for driving a large
trailer without a proper licence.

I was "almost burned". I proved to them that they misread the
regulations. I am allowed to have up to 26,000 lbs GCWR on my regular
class D license.

Good for you. Like I said, check your local laws.

i
--
pyotr filipivich
We will drink no whiskey before its nine.
It's eight fifty eight. Close enough!

"Pete C." on Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:28:36 -0500
typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

Both passenger and Haz-mat require background checks, and fingerprints.
If you do one you may as well do both. Gives you the option of buses and
such if you want a part time job.

No! No passengers! runs screaming Give me a nice big vacuum truck and
let me clean sewers...

Passengers ... Haz-Mat. Haz-mat, passengers. One loads itself,
the other is easier to handle....


pyotr

--
pyotr filipivich
We will drink no whiskey before its nine.
It's eight fifty eight. Close enough!

On Thu, 11 Aug 2011 02:38:18 -0400, "Steve W."
wrote:

Gunner Asch wrote:
On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:28:36 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:

Both passenger and Haz-mat require background checks, and fingerprints.
If you do one you may as well do both. Gives you the option of buses and
such if you want a part time job.
No! No passengers! runs screaming Give me a nice big vacuum truck and
let me clean sewers...

"say Mister...whats it like to drive a suck truck?"


They are now making fire tankers using the same systems. VERY IMPRESSIVE
to see those in operation.
Our main tanker holds 2000 gallons, with the onboard pump from start to
finish it takes about 12 minutes to fill it.
The Water Master we looked at will fill a 3500 gallon tank start to
finish in under 7!

It also has a BIG advantage with lifting the water. most conventional
pumps can only lift water vertical about 15 feet before they run out of
vacuum. The WM rig can lift 28 feet vertical

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkz2mTN7jE4

The $168,000 advantage!


FireoVac
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jp9vDUT_96o

$96,554

WM has the marketing video, though.

--
Fear not those who argue but those who dodge.
-- Marie Ebner von Eschenbach

On Thu, 11 Aug 2011 00:04:58 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:

"Pete C." on Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:28:36 -0500
typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

Both passenger and Haz-mat require background checks, and fingerprints.
If you do one you may as well do both. Gives you the option of buses and
such if you want a part time job.

No! No passengers! runs screaming Give me a nice big vacuum truck and
let me clean sewers...

Passengers ... Haz-Mat. Haz-mat, passengers. One loads itself,
the other is easier to handle....

There's very little difference, as both are caustic.
Haz-Mat is much quieter, though.

--
Fear not those who argue but those who dodge.
-- Marie Ebner von Eschenbach

Larry Jaques wrote:

On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:18:08 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:


"Steve W." wrote:

Be prepared when you go to the DMV. CDLs are NOT cheap.

Around $750 with the cost of truck rental, license fees, TSA fees
(hazmat), and a couple books. Not cheap, but certainly not terribly
expensive.

What's the actual breakdown on those costs, Pete?
Curious minds, etc.

DPS Original/renewal CDL license fee $61
Hazmat fingerprint and TSA fees $78
Truck rental ~$500-$600 (varies with rental place and distance to DPS
office you go to)
CDL study book $50


Also you will have to have your DOT physical every two years(unless you
have certain medical problems), NOT the same as your normal physical.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/documents/s...cal-Report.pdf

CVS's Minute Clinic does DOT physicals for about $60.

Not bad.

Nope, some other medical clinics offer similar. Not a huge expense every
couple years anyway.

Pete C. wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:18:08 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:

"Steve W." wrote:
Be prepared when you go to the DMV. CDLs are NOT cheap.
Around $750 with the cost of truck rental, license fees, TSA fees
(hazmat), and a couple books. Not cheap, but certainly not terribly
expensive.
What's the actual breakdown on those costs, Pete?
Curious minds, etc.

DPS Original/renewal CDL license fee $61
Hazmat fingerprint and TSA fees $78
Truck rental ~$500-$600 (varies with rental place and distance to DPS
office you go to)
CDL study book $50

Also you will have to have your DOT physical every two years(unless you
have certain medical problems), NOT the same as your normal physical.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/documents/s...cal-Report.pdf
CVS's Minute Clinic does DOT physicals for about $60.
Not bad.

Nope, some other medical clinics offer similar. Not a huge expense every
couple years anyway.

No just a PIA. My biggest gripe with the physical is that I end up
having usually 3 every other year.
DOT, Fire Fighter and normal yearly.

DOT has different requirements than the FF and the yearly one doesn't
cover stuff that both of those want.

--
Steve W.

Ignoramus19859 wrote:
On 2011-08-11, Steve W. wrote:

I hold an A & M with haz-mat, wrecker, Doubles/triples, metal coil and
tanker and had the passenger endorsement until last year (drove school
buses for a while)

What is so special about driving with metal coils?

It makes the trailer top-heavy. He's not talking watch springs here, but
a 12 foot diameter roll of several-foot wide steel sheet or plate. And you
have to be exceedingly careful of front- or back-end collisions because
the coil has a tendency to roll.

Hope This Helps!
Rich

On Thu, 11 Aug 2011 17:40:14 -0400, "Steve W."
wrote:

Pete C. wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:18:08 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:

"Steve W." wrote:
Be prepared when you go to the DMV. CDLs are NOT cheap.
Around $750 with the cost of truck rental, license fees, TSA fees
(hazmat), and a couple books. Not cheap, but certainly not terribly
expensive.
What's the actual breakdown on those costs, Pete?
Curious minds, etc.

DPS Original/renewal CDL license fee $61
Hazmat fingerprint and TSA fees $78
Truck rental ~$500-$600 (varies with rental place and distance to DPS
office you go to)
CDL study book $50

Also you will have to have your DOT physical every two years(unless you
have certain medical problems), NOT the same as your normal physical.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/documents/s...cal-Report.pdf
CVS's Minute Clinic does DOT physicals for about $60.
Not bad.

Nope, some other medical clinics offer similar. Not a huge expense every
couple years anyway.

No just a PIA. My biggest gripe with the physical is that I end up
having usually 3 every other year.
DOT, Fire Fighter and normal yearly.

DOT has different requirements than the FF and the yearly one doesn't
cover stuff that both of those want.

Can't you find a doctor who'll certify you in one fell swoop?

--
Fear not those who argue but those who dodge.
-- Marie Ebner von Eschenbach

Larry Jaques wrote:

On Thu, 11 Aug 2011 17:40:14 -0400, "Steve W."
wrote:

Pete C. wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:18:08 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:

"Steve W." wrote:
Be prepared when you go to the DMV. CDLs are NOT cheap.
Around $750 with the cost of truck rental, license fees, TSA fees
(hazmat), and a couple books. Not cheap, but certainly not terribly
expensive.
What's the actual breakdown on those costs, Pete?
Curious minds, etc.

DPS Original/renewal CDL license fee $61
Hazmat fingerprint and TSA fees $78
Truck rental ~$500-$600 (varies with rental place and distance to DPS
office you go to)
CDL study book $50

Also you will have to have your DOT physical every two years(unless you
have certain medical problems), NOT the same as your normal physical.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/documents/s...cal-Report.pdf
CVS's Minute Clinic does DOT physicals for about $60.
Not bad.

Nope, some other medical clinics offer similar. Not a huge expense every
couple years anyway.

No just a PIA. My biggest gripe with the physical is that I end up
having usually 3 every other year.
DOT, Fire Fighter and normal yearly.

DOT has different requirements than the FF and the yearly one doesn't
cover stuff that both of those want.

Can't you find a doctor who'll certify you in one fell swoop?

Some PCPs will expand the normal physical to cover DOT items if you ask.
Some might even code it under your normal physical so insurance covers
it.

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Thu, 11 Aug 2011 17:40:14 -0400, "Steve W."
wrote:

Pete C. wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 10 Aug 2011 22:18:08 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:

"Steve W." wrote:
Be prepared when you go to the DMV. CDLs are NOT cheap.
Around $750 with the cost of truck rental, license fees, TSA fees
(hazmat), and a couple books. Not cheap, but certainly not terribly
expensive.
What's the actual breakdown on those costs, Pete?
Curious minds, etc.
DPS Original/renewal CDL license fee $61
Hazmat fingerprint and TSA fees $78
Truck rental ~$500-$600 (varies with rental place and distance to DPS
office you go to)
CDL study book $50

Also you will have to have your DOT physical every two years(unless you
have certain medical problems), NOT the same as your normal physical.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/documents/s...cal-Report.pdf
CVS's Minute Clinic does DOT physicals for about $60.
Not bad.
Nope, some other medical clinics offer similar. Not a huge expense every
couple years anyway.
No just a PIA. My biggest gripe with the physical is that I end up
having usually 3 every other year.
DOT, Fire Fighter and normal yearly.

DOT has different requirements than the FF and the yearly one doesn't
cover stuff that both of those want.

Can't you find a doctor who'll certify you in one fell swoop?

--
Fear not those who argue but those who dodge.
-- Marie Ebner von Eschenbach

The requirements are different and with the FF physicals they usually
don't have the equipment to do all the tests.

The mask fit test and lung capacity machines are FUN.....

--
Steve W.

On Fri, 12 Aug 2011 20:32:41 -0400, "Steve W."
wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Thu, 11 Aug 2011 17:40:14 -0400, "Steve W."
wrote:

Pete C. wrote:

DOT has different requirements than the FF and the yearly one doesn't
cover stuff that both of those want.

Can't you find a doctor who'll certify you in one fell swoop?

The requirements are different and with the FF physicals they usually
don't have the equipment to do all the tests.

Suckage.


The mask fit test and lung capacity machines are FUN.....

Yeah, I'll bet.

--
Fear not those who argue but those who dodge.
-- Marie Ebner von Eschenbach