This is supposed to be some kind of a microdrop thing.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Accu-Lube/

It came with the mill. If I understand it right, I am supposed to use
special vegetable oil with it.

1) Would mcMaster item 10305K26 be the proper lubricant to put into it
(I will try to find out by calling the company, but I doubt that
they still exist based on some google searches).
2) Is that supposed to be used on aluminum?

I tried machining Aluminum. First without lube, promptly broke
endmill. :-(

Then I tried a bigger end mill, slower feed, and this
Accu-Lube. (there is still a tiny amount of oil left in it).

The endmill did not break, but aluminum still gummed up
completely.

The aluminum did seem machinable.

I would be perfectly open to using flood coolant for this
application. I just have not started using the flood unit yet and have
not set up guards.

Any suggestion, how would I go about machining aluminum with a 3/8"
ball carbide endmill. Speed up to 3k rpm. Open to coolant ideas.

i

On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 01:07:14 -0500, Ignoramus6705
wrote:

This is supposed to be some kind of a microdrop thing.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Accu-Lube/

It came with the mill. If I understand it right, I am supposed to use
special vegetable oil with it.

1) Would mcMaster item 10305K26 be the proper lubricant to put into it
(I will try to find out by calling the company, but I doubt that
they still exist based on some google searches).
2) Is that supposed to be used on aluminum?

I tried machining Aluminum. First without lube, promptly broke
endmill. :-(

Then I tried a bigger end mill, slower feed, and this
Accu-Lube. (there is still a tiny amount of oil left in it).

The endmill did not break, but aluminum still gummed up
completely.

The aluminum did seem machinable.

I would be perfectly open to using flood coolant for this
application. I just have not started using the flood unit yet and have
not set up guards.

Any suggestion, how would I go about machining aluminum with a 3/8"
ball carbide endmill. Speed up to 3k rpm. Open to coolant ideas.

i

http://cgi.ebay.com/Spindkool-Mist-B...-/360283530831
http://cgi.ebay.com/AMFLO-SPRAY-MIST...-/300449722867
http://cgi.ebay.com/Kool-Mist-Coolan...-/150470098639

Etc etc etc.

Now I was running my Abene tonight, using the internal coolant pump,
pumping oil over the work piece...and it wasnt big on splashing.
Now granted..the top speed of the Abene is 1300 rpm, but it wasnt
plushing oil everywhere, when directed directly into the cut/cutter
interface.

Gunner


"A conservative who doesn't believe? in God simply doesn't pray;
a godless liberal wants no one to pray. A conservative who doesn't
like guns doesn't buy one; a liberal gun-hater wants to disarm us all.
A gay conservative has sex his own way; a gay liberal requires us all
to watch and accept his perversion and have it taught to children.
A conservative who is offended by a radio show changes the station;
an offended liberal wants it banned, prosecuted and persecuted."
Bobby XD9

On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 01:07:14 -0500, Ignoramus6705
wrote:

This is supposed to be some kind of a microdrop thing.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Accu-Lube/

It came with the mill. If I understand it right, I am supposed to use
special vegetable oil with it.

1) Would mcMaster item 10305K26 be the proper lubricant to put into it
(I will try to find out by calling the company, but I doubt that
they still exist based on some google searches).
2) Is that supposed to be used on aluminum?

I tried machining Aluminum. First without lube, promptly broke
endmill. :-(

Then I tried a bigger end mill, slower feed, and this
Accu-Lube. (there is still a tiny amount of oil left in it).

The endmill did not break, but aluminum still gummed up
completely.

The aluminum did seem machinable.

I would be perfectly open to using flood coolant for this
application. I just have not started using the flood unit yet and have
not set up guards.

Any suggestion, how would I go about machining aluminum with a 3/8"
ball carbide endmill. Speed up to 3k rpm. Open to coolant ideas.

i


Oh..you may wish to read the directions on using your luber

http://www.itwfpg.com/acculube/acculube.html

And check your speeds and feeds. I rather suspect you had them
wrong........

Breaking a 3/8 endmill is easy..but not if you have your speeds and
feeds correct. Least of all in Aluminum..........


Gunner


"A conservative who doesn't believe? in God simply doesn't pray;
a godless liberal wants no one to pray. A conservative who doesn't
like guns doesn't buy one; a liberal gun-hater wants to disarm us all.
A gay conservative has sex his own way; a gay liberal requires us all
to watch and accept his perversion and have it taught to children.
A conservative who is offended by a radio show changes the station;
an offended liberal wants it banned, prosecuted and persecuted."
Bobby XD9

On Wed, 28 Jul 2010 23:34:18 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 01:07:14 -0500, Ignoramus6705
wrote:

This is supposed to be some kind of a microdrop thing.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Accu-Lube/

It came with the mill. If I understand it right, I am supposed to use
special vegetable oil with it.

1) Would mcMaster item 10305K26 be the proper lubricant to put into it
(I will try to find out by calling the company, but I doubt that
they still exist based on some google searches).
2) Is that supposed to be used on aluminum?

I tried machining Aluminum. First without lube, promptly broke
endmill. :-(

Then I tried a bigger end mill, slower feed, and this
Accu-Lube. (there is still a tiny amount of oil left in it).

The endmill did not break, but aluminum still gummed up
completely.

The aluminum did seem machinable.

I would be perfectly open to using flood coolant for this
application. I just have not started using the flood unit yet and have
not set up guards.

Any suggestion, how would I go about machining aluminum with a 3/8"
ball carbide endmill. Speed up to 3k rpm. Open to coolant ideas.

i


Oh..you may wish to read the directions on using your luber

http://www.itwfpg.com/acculube/acculube.html

And check your speeds and feeds. I rather suspect you had them
wrong........

Breaking a 3/8 endmill is easy..but not if you have your speeds and
feeds correct. Least of all in Aluminum..........



http://www.itwfpg.com/acculube/broch...structions.pdf




Gunner


"A conservative who doesn't believe? in God simply doesn't pray;
a godless liberal wants no one to pray. A conservative who doesn't
like guns doesn't buy one; a liberal gun-hater wants to disarm us all.
A gay conservative has sex his own way; a gay liberal requires us all
to watch and accept his perversion and have it taught to children.
A conservative who is offended by a radio show changes the station;
an offended liberal wants it banned, prosecuted and persecuted."
Bobby XD9


"A conservative who doesn't believe? in God simply doesn't pray;
a godless liberal wants no one to pray. A conservative who doesn't
like guns doesn't buy one; a liberal gun-hater wants to disarm us all.
A gay conservative has sex his own way; a gay liberal requires us all
to watch and accept his perversion and have it taught to children.
A conservative who is offended by a radio show changes the station;
an offended liberal wants it banned, prosecuted and persecuted."
Bobby XD9

Ignoramus6705 wrote:

This is supposed to be some kind of a microdrop thing.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Accu-Lube/

It came with the mill. If I understand it right, I am supposed to use
special vegetable oil with it.

1) Would mcMaster item 10305K26 be the proper lubricant to put into it
(I will try to find out by calling the company, but I doubt that
they still exist based on some google searches).
2) Is that supposed to be used on aluminum?

I tried machining Aluminum. First without lube, promptly broke
endmill. :-(

Then I tried a bigger end mill, slower feed, and this
Accu-Lube. (there is still a tiny amount of oil left in it).

The endmill did not break, but aluminum still gummed up
completely.

The aluminum did seem machinable.

I would be perfectly open to using flood coolant for this
application. I just have not started using the flood unit yet and have
not set up guards.

Any suggestion, how would I go about machining aluminum with a 3/8"
ball carbide endmill. Speed up to 3k rpm. Open to coolant ideas.

i

Aluminum normally machines very well dry, at least most grades do. Some
of the softer grades are gummy and don't machine well. I'd agree on
checking your speeds and feeds, that's likely where the problem is.

On 2010-07-29, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 01:07:14 -0500, Ignoramus6705
wrote:

This is supposed to be some kind of a microdrop thing.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Accu-Lube/

It came with the mill. If I understand it right, I am supposed to use
special vegetable oil with it.

1) Would mcMaster item 10305K26 be the proper lubricant to put into it
(I will try to find out by calling the company, but I doubt that
they still exist based on some google searches).
2) Is that supposed to be used on aluminum?

I tried machining Aluminum. First without lube, promptly broke
endmill. :-(

Then I tried a bigger end mill, slower feed, and this
Accu-Lube. (there is still a tiny amount of oil left in it).

The endmill did not break, but aluminum still gummed up
completely.

The aluminum did seem machinable.

I would be perfectly open to using flood coolant for this
application. I just have not started using the flood unit yet and have
not set up guards.

Any suggestion, how would I go about machining aluminum with a 3/8"
ball carbide endmill. Speed up to 3k rpm. Open to coolant ideas.

i

http://cgi.ebay.com/Spindkool-Mist-B...-/360283530831
http://cgi.ebay.com/AMFLO-SPRAY-MIST...-/300449722867
http://cgi.ebay.com/Kool-Mist-Coolan...-/150470098639

Etc etc etc.

Now I was running my Abene tonight, using the internal coolant pump,
pumping oil over the work piece...and it wasnt big on splashing.
Now granted..the top speed of the Abene is 1300 rpm, but it wasnt
plushing oil everywhere, when directed directly into the cut/cutter
interface.

Thanks. I already have this accu-lube, so I will not need to buy any
other system, at least as far as I understand. Or maybe those are
different in principle from Accu-Lube.

I tried Accu-lube very late last night (I should really get some
sleep). It blasts a stream of compressed air with oil, and blows chips
ALL OVER THE PLACE. Now I know why aluminum chips were in the most
unlikely spots on the mill. This is really messy.

I was laso warned to use vegetable formula "or else" risk my health.

I think that the better way to go is Lexan guards and flood coolant. I
still have some of that Hangsterfer S500 that Mike gave me.

i

On 2010-07-29, Pete C. wrote:

Ignoramus6705 wrote:

This is supposed to be some kind of a microdrop thing.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Accu-Lube/

It came with the mill. If I understand it right, I am supposed to use
special vegetable oil with it.

1) Would mcMaster item 10305K26 be the proper lubricant to put into it
(I will try to find out by calling the company, but I doubt that
they still exist based on some google searches).
2) Is that supposed to be used on aluminum?

I tried machining Aluminum. First without lube, promptly broke
endmill. :-(

Then I tried a bigger end mill, slower feed, and this
Accu-Lube. (there is still a tiny amount of oil left in it).

The endmill did not break, but aluminum still gummed up
completely.

The aluminum did seem machinable.

I would be perfectly open to using flood coolant for this
application. I just have not started using the flood unit yet and have
not set up guards.

Any suggestion, how would I go about machining aluminum with a 3/8"
ball carbide endmill. Speed up to 3k rpm. Open to coolant ideas.

i

Aluminum normally machines very well dry, at least most grades do. Some
of the softer grades are gummy and don't machine well. I'd agree on
checking your speeds and feeds, that's likely where the problem is.

I think that this is the softer grade aluminum, possibly not the good
kind. That's my feeling now.

i

Ignoramus6705 wrote:
This is supposed to be some kind of a microdrop thing.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Accu-Lube/

It came with the mill. If I understand it right, I am supposed to use
special vegetable oil with it.

1) Would mcMaster item 10305K26 be the proper lubricant to put into it
(I will try to find out by calling the company, but I doubt that
they still exist based on some google searches).
2) Is that supposed to be used on aluminum?

I tried machining Aluminum. First without lube, promptly broke
endmill. :-(

Then I tried a bigger end mill, slower feed, and this
Accu-Lube. (there is still a tiny amount of oil left in it).

The endmill did not break, but aluminum still gummed up
completely.

The aluminum did seem machinable.

One big trick with aluminum is to keep the tool moving, and prevent heat
from building up in one spot.
If the cutter gets filled with globs of aluminum, then the metal got
hot, not much other explanation.
I can do plenty of machining with just brushed-on thread cutting lube
from the hardware store, but for
heavy material removal, I use a water-based flood coolant. That
guarantees the work stays cool.
Heating aluminum even to where you can't hold your hand on it for 10
seconds will soften it to the point
it won't cut worth a darn. If it is hot enough to boil water, you are
in BIG trouble, and the big glob of metal
all over your end mill is within seconds of happening.

6061-T6 and 2024-T3+ (any heat treat value above T3) are eminently
machinable. 3003 is marginal, and 5052 is OK but can still be bent on a
brake after machining, so I use a fair amount of it.

So, the big trick is to take light cuts and higher feedrates, instead of
trying to take the entire cut in one pass. The combination of slow feed
and local heat buildup and lots of chip production will cause problems.

What depth of cut, RPM and feedrates were you using, what size end mill,
how many flutes? Also, plowing full width with an end mill is the worst
case for all the problems.
A general rule of thumb is that when plowing a slot in material, you
never step down more than 1/2 the end mill diameter, and then take as
many passes as needed to reach the desired slot depth. Some people just
keep plowing down the middle, others like to vary the path a little to
the side (like going back and forth .010" each pass) then take a finish
pass down each side to clean up the walls.

Another rule of thumb is to make the chip load per tooth equal to .010"
per inch of cutter diameter. So, a 1/2" end mill would get .005" chip
load per tooth. If running at 2000 RPM, and 4 flutes, that would be 40
IPM! This is all off my handy-dandy McDonnell-Douglas speed & feed
slide rule, but these sound a bit aggressive to me. I might go more
with 10 IPM in a slot application, and .050 to .1" plunge depth with a
1/2" cutter.

Many people LOVE WD-40 as their ultimate aluminum cutting lube.

Jon

Ignoramus5687 wrote:
I tried Accu-lube very late last night (I should really get some
sleep). It blasts a stream of compressed air with oil, and blows chips
ALL OVER THE PLACE. Now I know why aluminum chips were in the most
unlikely spots on the mill. This is really messy.

I was laso warned to use vegetable formula "or else" risk my health.

I think that the better way to go is Lexan guards and flood coolant. I
still have some of that Hangsterfer S500 that Mike gave me.

I agree totally. Vegetable oil won't POISON you, but it is still real
bad for your lungs.
The spray of stuff all over the machine is not good for IT, either. I
do some flood machining
with NO guards at all, all this stuff about 1/2" thick lexan is for the
high-end machining stuff, the Bridgeport can't spin fast enough to
create the really hazardous missiles, except maybe with large face
cutters or fly cutters.

I have been using something formulated mostly for aluminum by Engineered
Lubricants, and it is amazing stuff.
I've never had a problem with rust, even where it seeps under the vise
and stays there for MONTHS! I get a black
stain that wipes off with a paper towel!

Jon

Ignoramus5687 wrote:


I think that this is the softer grade aluminum, possibly not the good
kind. That's my feeling now.

Can you bend it with your hands? 1/8" sheet of 3003 or 5052 can be bent
fairly easily by bare hands, but you can still machine it.

Jon

On 2010-07-29, Jon Elson wrote:
Ignoramus5687 wrote:
I tried Accu-lube very late last night (I should really get some
sleep). It blasts a stream of compressed air with oil, and blows chips
ALL OVER THE PLACE. Now I know why aluminum chips were in the most
unlikely spots on the mill. This is really messy.

I was laso warned to use vegetable formula "or else" risk my health.

I think that the better way to go is Lexan guards and flood coolant. I
still have some of that Hangsterfer S500 that Mike gave me.

I agree totally. Vegetable oil won't POISON you, but it is still real
bad for your lungs.
The spray of stuff all over the machine is not good for IT, either. I
do some flood machining
with NO guards at all, all this stuff about 1/2" thick lexan is for the
high-end machining stuff, the Bridgeport can't spin fast enough to
create the really hazardous missiles, except maybe with large face
cutters or fly cutters.

My idea to use lexan guards is mostly to keep coolant inside. 4k RPM
is where some potentially troublesome objects could be launched, so
some shielding would be helpful. I agree that Bridgeports are not that
hazardous, unlike some of those 25k RPM machining centers.

I have been using something formulated mostly for aluminum by Engineered
Lubricants, and it is amazing stuff.

How does regular flood coolant work on Aluminum?

I've never had a problem with rust, even where it seeps under the
vise and stays there for MONTHS! I get a black stain that wipes off
with a paper towel!

Yep, flood coolants can dry into rust colored goo, but in fact they
provide a lot of rust protection.

i

On 2010-07-29, Jon Elson wrote:
Ignoramus5687 wrote:


I think that this is the softer grade aluminum, possibly not the good
kind. That's my feeling now.

Can you bend it with your hands? 1/8" sheet of 3003 or 5052 can be bent
fairly easily by bare hands, but you can still machine it.

This is a 1x4x4 piece. I do think now that it is machinable, I just
did not do it right.

i

3000 RPM? Are you trying to win a race? Try 500 RPM and you won't be melting the aluminum....you won't need carbide...you don't
need coolant....life is easy. Try to remember these are your tools, not the company's. I use m35 and m42 Cobalt HSS endmills
almost exclusively. I never wear them out.....they stay sharp forever....I use diesel fuel for lube when I need it and apply it
with a brush... when machining pockets, I use compressed air only and never have chip bind. Yes, you need chip shields with
compressed air. Also remember air by itself is a coolant. The high speed you are trying to run will work in a totally enclosed CNC
machining center with 100 psi+ flood coolant and will pay for itself in a high volume make-a-buck job shop, but is totally
unnecessary in a hobby/model making environment.
Steve

"Ignoramus6705" wrote in message ...
This is supposed to be some kind of a microdrop thing.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Accu-Lube/

It came with the mill. If I understand it right, I am supposed to use
special vegetable oil with it.

1) Would mcMaster item 10305K26 be the proper lubricant to put into it
(I will try to find out by calling the company, but I doubt that
they still exist based on some google searches).
2) Is that supposed to be used on aluminum?

I tried machining Aluminum. First without lube, promptly broke
endmill. :-(

Then I tried a bigger end mill, slower feed, and this
Accu-Lube. (there is still a tiny amount of oil left in it).

The endmill did not break, but aluminum still gummed up
completely.

The aluminum did seem machinable.

I would be perfectly open to using flood coolant for this
application. I just have not started using the flood unit yet and have
not set up guards.

Any suggestion, how would I go about machining aluminum with a 3/8"
ball carbide endmill. Speed up to 3k rpm. Open to coolant ideas.

i

On 2010-07-29, Steve Lusardi wrote:
3000 RPM? Are you trying to win a race? Try 500 RPM and you won't be melting the aluminum....you won't need carbide...you don't
need coolant....life is easy. Try to remember these are your tools, not the company's. I use m35 and m42 Cobalt HSS endmills
almost exclusively. I never wear them out.....they stay sharp forever....I use diesel fuel for lube when I need it and apply it
with a brush... when machining pockets, I use compressed air only and never have chip bind. Yes, you need chip shields with
compressed air. Also remember air by itself is a coolant. The high speed you are trying to run will work in a totally enclosed CNC
machining center with 100 psi+ flood coolant and will pay for itself in a high volume make-a-buck job shop, but is totally
unnecessary in a hobby/model making environment.

So you say, 500 RPM, 3/8" endmill, no coolant, 1 IPM?

i


"Ignoramus6705" wrote in message ...
This is supposed to be some kind of a microdrop thing.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Accu-Lube/

It came with the mill. If I understand it right, I am supposed to use
special vegetable oil with it.

1) Would mcMaster item 10305K26 be the proper lubricant to put into it
(I will try to find out by calling the company, but I doubt that
they still exist based on some google searches).
2) Is that supposed to be used on aluminum?

I tried machining Aluminum. First without lube, promptly broke
endmill. :-(

Then I tried a bigger end mill, slower feed, and this
Accu-Lube. (there is still a tiny amount of oil left in it).

The endmill did not break, but aluminum still gummed up
completely.

The aluminum did seem machinable.

I would be perfectly open to using flood coolant for this
application. I just have not started using the flood unit yet and have
not set up guards.

Any suggestion, how would I go about machining aluminum with a 3/8"
ball carbide endmill. Speed up to 3k rpm. Open to coolant ideas.

i

On 7/29/2010 2:07 AM, Ignoramus6705 wrote:
This is supposed to be some kind of a microdrop thing.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Accu-Lube/

It came with the mill. If I understand it right, I am supposed to use
special vegetable oil with it.

1) Would mcMaster item 10305K26 be the proper lubricant to put into it


Why don't you ask the manufacturer?


http://www.itwfpg.com/



Kevin Gallimore

On 2010-07-29, axolotl wrote:
On 7/29/2010 2:07 AM, Ignoramus6705 wrote:
This is supposed to be some kind of a microdrop thing.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Accu-Lube/

It came with the mill. If I understand it right, I am supposed to use
special vegetable oil with it.

1) Would mcMaster item 10305K26 be the proper lubricant to put into it


Why don't you ask the manufacturer?


http://www.itwfpg.com/

Kevin, I did get a hold of them. Bought a replacement reservoir (mine
has cracks). They sent me 3 bottles of sample oil.

i

Ignoramus5687 wrote:

On 2010-07-29, Steve Lusardi wrote:
3000 RPM? Are you trying to win a race? Try 500 RPM and you won't be melting the aluminum....you won't need carbide...you don't
need coolant....life is easy. Try to remember these are your tools, not the company's. I use m35 and m42 Cobalt HSS endmills
almost exclusively. I never wear them out.....they stay sharp forever....I use diesel fuel for lube when I need it and apply it
with a brush... when machining pockets, I use compressed air only and never have chip bind. Yes, you need chip shields with
compressed air. Also remember air by itself is a coolant. The high speed you are trying to run will work in a totally enclosed CNC
machining center with 100 psi+ flood coolant and will pay for itself in a high volume make-a-buck job shop, but is totally
unnecessary in a hobby/model making environment.

So you say, 500 RPM, 3/8" endmill, no coolant, 1 IPM?

You need to calculate the chip load per end mill flute at the desired
RPM. I know on my manual Bridgeport I frequently use a 1/2" 3 flute HSS
end mill at about 1,000 RPM, dry taking heavy cuts in I think 6061-T6 AL
at a lot more than 1 IPM.

On a manual mill you have tactile feed back and can crank the handle at
a feed rate that feels good. On a CNC mill you don't have that feedback
and need to more carefully calculate the speeds and feeds. On the CNC
you get to watch the machine start the cut and then judging mostly by
sound adjust the feed override up or down to try to optimize the cut.
It's also good to make notes of what ultimate feed rate you actually ran
the part at so you can have a cheat sheet of parameters to use for
future G-code generation.