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Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work. |
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#1
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still work out there - MN
"Karl Townsend" wrote:
"The Kid" got laid off Thursday. Last day of work on Friday. He's got a ton o' payments - house, car, student loan, credit cards. It took him till 10:00 A.M. today to get another good job. He's lead man - programmer, setup, order tooling etc. in a five man shop. Quite a change from the large corporation. Pay is close to the same at $25 but little OT, vs. 10 - 20 hours before. Glad that your son was able to rapidly gain another job. I hope he took reflection on how his choices and obligations require a fairly constant stream of income. Ask him how long he could have lasted if the economy was totally down and he had to rely on unemployement and savings. Your son has good marketable skills but he needs to always keep in mind what would happen if... If you get hurt outside of work, most places don't keep you on for long and poof goes the health insurance unless you can make the cobra payments. He needs to have a reserve fund in liquid funds. Hopefully he has it but I bet he doesn't. Wes |
#2
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still work out there - MN
On Mar 17, 10:27*am, Wes wrote:
"Karl Townsend" wrote: "The Kid" got laid off Thursday. Last day of work on Friday. He's got a ton o' payments - house, car, student loan, credit cards. It took him till 10:00 A.M. today to get another good job. He's lead man - programmer, setup, order tooling etc. in a five man shop. Quite a change from the large corporation. Pay is close to the same at $25 but little OT, vs. 10 - 20 hours before. Glad that your son was able to rapidly gain another job. *I hope he took reflection on how his choices and obligations require a fairly constant stream of income. Ask him how long he could have lasted if the economy was totally down and he had to rely on unemployement and savings. Your son has good marketable skills but he needs to always keep in mind what would happen if... *If you get hurt outside of work, most places don't keep you on for long and poof goes the health insurance unless you can make the cobra payments. He needs to have a reserve fund in liquid funds. *Hopefully he has it but I bet he doesn't. Wes And prepare for the next layoff...the economy is tanking and has not seen the bottom. And then there is that small matter of daily bank failures... It's time to be eating beans until the debts are paid off... TMT |
#3
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still work out there - MN
On Mar 17, 10:27*am, Wes wrote:
"Karl Townsend" wrote: "The Kid" got laid off Thursday. Last day of work on Friday. He's got a ton o' payments - house, car, student loan, credit cards. It took him till 10:00 A.M. today to get another good job. He's lead man - programmer, setup, order tooling etc. in a five man shop. Quite a change from the large corporation. Pay is close to the same at $25 but little OT, vs. 10 - 20 hours before. Glad that your son was able to rapidly gain another job. *I hope he took reflection on how his choices and obligations require a fairly constant stream of income. Ask him how long he could have lasted if the economy was totally down and he had to rely on unemployement and savings. Your son has good marketable skills but he needs to always keep in mind what would happen if... *If you get hurt outside of work, most places don't keep you on for long and poof goes the health insurance unless you can make the cobra payments. He needs to have a reserve fund in liquid funds. *Hopefully he has it but I bet he doesn't. Wes I should add that Wes is giving some EXCELLENT advice. I know far too many people with similar qualifications who have been unemployed for well over a year...and their rainy day funds are long gone. TMT |
#4
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still work out there - MN
Too_Many_Tools wrote:
And prepare for the next layoff...the economy is tanking and has not seen the bottom. And then there is that small matter of daily bank failures... That Bear Sterns thing gave me the willies. Notice how fast government can move on approvals when it has to? There is something rotten in our psychic when we believe in ez money over just plain hard effort and work to get a head. Flipping properties, buying over your ability to pay and believing the road a head is bright and pothole free. The character of our citizens is declining for the most part. Mining equity for temporary pleasure has to be the most brainless acts of consumption. noun 1. the act of consuming, as by use, decay, or destruction. Wes |
#5
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still work out there - MN
Ask him how long he could have lasted if the economy was totally down and
he had to rely on unemployement and savings. He would have been in trouble by Wednesday. (day after tommorrow) Your son has good marketable skills but he needs to always keep in mind what would happen if... If you get hurt outside of work, most places don't keep you on for long and poof goes the health insurance unless you can make the cobra payments. He needs to have a reserve fund in liquid funds. Hopefully he has it but I bet he doesn't. I tells him and tells him. He don't listen. I didn't listen to my dad either when I was a young buck. What goes around comes around. Karl |
#6
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still work out there - MN
On 2008-03-17, Wes wrote:
Too_Many_Tools wrote: And prepare for the next layoff...the economy is tanking and has not seen the bottom. And then there is that small matter of daily bank failures... That Bear Sterns thing gave me the willies. Notice how fast government can move on approvals when it has to? There is something rotten in our psychic when we believe in ez money over just plain hard effort and work to get a head. Flipping properties, buying over your ability to pay and believing the road a head is bright and pothole free. The character of our citizens is declining for the most part. I agree with you, but this character decline was caused by willingness of lenders to make loans that were too risky. No doubt this was caused by mortgage securitization that allowed "dumb money" to participate in mortgage lending. Mining equity for temporary pleasure has to be the most brainless acts of consumption. noun 1. the act of consuming, as by use, decay, or destruction. |
#7
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still work out there - MN
Ignoramus22030 wrote:
I agree with you, but this character decline was caused by willingness of lenders to make loans that were too risky. No doubt this was caused by mortgage securitization that allowed "dumb money" to participate in mortgage lending. The other part is not teaching the realities of finance to those young heads of mush. Look at how schools of higher education cut deals with the credit card companies. That sure is teaching the kids something usefull. You feeling good about your gold investments atm? Wes |
#8
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still work out there - MN
On Mar 17, 11:45*am, Wes wrote:
Too_Many_Tools wrote: And prepare for the next layoff...the economy is tanking and has not seen the bottom. And then there is that small matter of daily bank failures... That Bear Sterns thing gave me the willies. *Notice how fast government can move on approvals when it has to? There is something rotten in our psychic when we believe in ez money over just plain hard effort and work to get a head. *Flipping properties, buying over your ability to pay and believing the road a head is bright and pothole free. The character of our citizens is declining for the most part. Mining equity for temporary pleasure has to be the most brainless acts of consumption. noun 1. * * *the act of consuming, as by use, decay, or destruction. Wes It should give every American taxpayer the shock of their lives...they were just signed up to pay for that default. And it is not the last one.... This is how a depression starts.... TMT |
#9
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still work out there - MN
Ignoramus22030 wrote: On 2008-03-17, Wes wrote: Too_Many_Tools wrote: And prepare for the next layoff...the economy is tanking and has not seen the bottom. And then there is that small matter of daily bank failures... That Bear Sterns thing gave me the willies. Notice how fast government can move on approvals when it has to? There is something rotten in our psychic when we believe in ez money over just plain hard effort and work to get a head. Flipping properties, buying over your ability to pay and believing the road a head is bright and pothole free. The character of our citizens is declining for the most part. I agree with you, but this character decline was caused by willingness of lenders to make loans that were too risky. No doubt this was caused by mortgage securitization that allowed "dumb money" to participate in mortgage lending. You don't think the corruption of the stock market from a long term investment where you expected to take income from the dividends to a market timing short term game to extract virtual wealth had anything to do with it? I think our economy is still in doo doo and will continue to be until this issue is addressed as well. |
#10
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still work out there - MN
"Karl Townsend" wrote:
I tells him and tells him. He don't listen. I didn't listen to my dad either when I was a young buck. What goes around comes around. We do seem to get our smarts after we tried the other way a few times first. Wes |
#11
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still work out there - MN
On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 13:45:04 -0400, Wes wrote:
Too_Many_Tools wrote: And prepare for the next layoff...the economy is tanking and has not seen the bottom. And then there is that small matter of daily bank failures... That Bear Sterns thing gave me the willies. Notice how fast government can move on approvals when it has to? The FED had been reluctant to even reconize the problem back in August, they just played around with interest rate bumps when all along this crisis screamed for major intervention, Remember Prez Bush reassuring us that government needs to leave the markets alone yada yada. And again last week he says the same,..he's an idiot. It's really a tragady of historic proportions to see BSC go under the way it did. There was a huge amount of pension money that just went poof... and this is far from over. If the fed had acted last week in the manor it did yesterday BSC would have survived IMO Stay tuned we haven't seen anything yet...ED Wes |
#12
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still work out there - MN
On 2008-03-17, Wes wrote:
Ignoramus22030 wrote: I agree with you, but this character decline was caused by willingness of lenders to make loans that were too risky. No doubt this was caused by mortgage securitization that allowed "dumb money" to participate in mortgage lending. The other part is not teaching the realities of finance to those young heads of mush. Look at how schools of higher education cut deals with the credit card companies. That sure is teaching the kids something usefull. That's true. People who borrowed too much relative to their income, definitely are responsible for their downfall. However, investors who lent money based on lax criteria, have themselves to blame for this. You feeling good about your gold investments atm? I never owned any gold, but I have Euros. I am not feeling too good about these developments, as both most of my assets and all my income and life in general is based on the US economy, so my Euro investment means that I lost somewhat less than I could. Ideally, I would much prefer my euro investment to wither due to a more responsible fiscal policy. i |
#13
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still work out there - MN
On 2008-03-17, Pete C. wrote:
Ignoramus22030 wrote: On 2008-03-17, Wes wrote: Too_Many_Tools wrote: And prepare for the next layoff...the economy is tanking and has not seen the bottom. And then there is that small matter of daily bank failures... That Bear Sterns thing gave me the willies. Notice how fast government can move on approvals when it has to? There is something rotten in our psychic when we believe in ez money over just plain hard effort and work to get a head. Flipping properties, buying over your ability to pay and believing the road a head is bright and pothole free. The character of our citizens is declining for the most part. I agree with you, but this character decline was caused by willingness of lenders to make loans that were too risky. No doubt this was caused by mortgage securitization that allowed "dumb money" to participate in mortgage lending. You don't think the corruption of the stock market from a long term investment where you expected to take income from the dividends to a market timing short term game to extract virtual wealth had anything to do with it? I think our economy is still in doo doo and will continue to be until this issue is addressed as well. If I understand you right, this issue of greed and fear periodically overtaking each other, is very hard to solve. i |
#14
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still work out there - MN
On Mar 17, 11:48*am, "Karl Townsend"
wrote: Ask him how long he could have lasted if the economy was totally down and he had to rely on unemployement and savings. He would have been in trouble by Wednesday. (day after tommorrow) Your son has good marketable skills but he needs to always keep in mind what would happen if... *If you get hurt outside of work, most places don't keep you on for long and poof goes the health insurance unless you can make the cobra payments. He needs to have a reserve fund in liquid funds. *Hopefully he has it but I bet he doesn't. I tells him and tells him. He don't listen. I didn't listen to my dad either when I was a young buck. What goes around comes around. Karl I am sorry to hear that. I know of several families who are seeing the same thing...and their kids are going through very bad financial stuff...only to get worse. As a parent you need to decide how much you will help him when IT happens...and IT will. Defining the boundaries early as to how much help you will offer is best for all involved. And don't offer to cosign any loans. TMT |
#15
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still work out there - MN
Ignoramus22030 wrote: On 2008-03-17, Pete C. wrote: Ignoramus22030 wrote: On 2008-03-17, Wes wrote: Too_Many_Tools wrote: And prepare for the next layoff...the economy is tanking and has not seen the bottom. And then there is that small matter of daily bank failures... That Bear Sterns thing gave me the willies. Notice how fast government can move on approvals when it has to? There is something rotten in our psychic when we believe in ez money over just plain hard effort and work to get a head. Flipping properties, buying over your ability to pay and believing the road a head is bright and pothole free. The character of our citizens is declining for the most part. I agree with you, but this character decline was caused by willingness of lenders to make loans that were too risky. No doubt this was caused by mortgage securitization that allowed "dumb money" to participate in mortgage lending. You don't think the corruption of the stock market from a long term investment where you expected to take income from the dividends to a market timing short term game to extract virtual wealth had anything to do with it? I think our economy is still in doo doo and will continue to be until this issue is addressed as well. If I understand you right, this issue of greed and fear periodically overtaking each other, is very hard to solve. i Ultimately I think it all comes down to a global short attention span. The knowledge gained from any particular bad event, be it a world war, genocide, great depression, etc. pretty much never sinks in to the next generations psyche and is further lost on subsequent generations so the mistakes that lead to the problem will inevitably be repeated. |
#16
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still work out there - MN
"Pete C." wrote in message et... Ignoramus22030 wrote: On 2008-03-17, Pete C. wrote: Ignoramus22030 wrote: On 2008-03-17, Wes wrote: Too_Many_Tools wrote: And prepare for the next layoff...the economy is tanking and has not seen the bottom. And then there is that small matter of daily bank failures... That Bear Sterns thing gave me the willies. Notice how fast government can move on approvals when it has to? There is something rotten in our psychic when we believe in ez money over just plain hard effort and work to get a head. Flipping properties, buying over your ability to pay and believing the road a head is bright and pothole free. The character of our citizens is declining for the most part. Belief in easy money is easy, because it's real. My son, who is an economics student at a very small, fairly conservative Southern university that turns out an exceptional number of Wall Street tycoons, attended a Morgan Stanley presentation last week. With 1,750 total students on campus, one of the largest halls was packed to standing-room only. These kids are interested because that's where the action is. It's a lively business; there's huge money floating all around you, and the action is hot. If you look good and you're personable -- and if you're good at calculus -- the analyst's jobs are not that hard to get. And they pay more to start, in some cases, than I've ever made in my life. What's not to like? Working hard is highly overrated as a way to make money. It's not a bad way to live, but its connection to money-making has grown pretty remote. Right? -- Ed Huntress |
#17
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still work out there - MN
On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 18:22:31 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote: "Pete C." wrote in message . net... Ignoramus22030 wrote: On 2008-03-17, Pete C. wrote: Ignoramus22030 wrote: e. What's not to like? Working hard is highly overrated as a way to make money. It's not a bad way to live, but its connection to money-making has grown pretty remote. Right? Getting hired in NYC in the financial district is just the first step. Most of the folks (I know a few) I know who work there put in very long hours. Seriously. 7-9 is average, that's 14 hrs 6-7 days a week the new kids really have no life other than work. And the higher you get the harder you have to work... But if you are talented, driven, well educated, and a bit lucky and like the NYC lifestyle it's great. ED |
#18
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still work out there - MN
"ED" wrote in message ... On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 18:22:31 -0400, "Ed Huntress" wrote: "Pete C." wrote in message .net... Ignoramus22030 wrote: On 2008-03-17, Pete C. wrote: Ignoramus22030 wrote: e. What's not to like? Working hard is highly overrated as a way to make money. It's not a bad way to live, but its connection to money-making has grown pretty remote. Right? Getting hired in NYC in the financial district is just the first step. Most of the folks (I know a few) I know who work there put in very long hours. Seriously. 7-9 is average, that's 14 hrs 6-7 days a week the new kids really have no life other than work. And the higher you get the harder you have to work... But if you are talented, driven, well educated, and a bit lucky and like the NYC lifestyle it's great. Yeah, I know they work like dogs, and my son does, too. I think that most of the interest from these kids is the excitement and glamour. Still, on an income/effort basis, it beats most work all to hell. -- Ed Huntress |
#19
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still work out there - MN
On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 20:21:17 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote: But if you are talented, driven, well educated, and a bit lucky and like the NYC lifestyle it's great. Yeah, I know they work like dogs, and my son does, too. I think that most of the interest from these kids is the excitement and glamour. Still, on an income/effort basis, it beats most work all to hell. Thats why it's called work, I suppose, and yep they make some serious dough. But I also have it on good authority that a life out west on a ranch or some such is not necessiarly a bad thing....I agree.. ED |
#20
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still work out there - MN
"ED" wrote in message ... On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 20:21:17 -0400, "Ed Huntress" wrote: But if you are talented, driven, well educated, and a bit lucky and like the NYC lifestyle it's great. Yeah, I know they work like dogs, and my son does, too. I think that most of the interest from these kids is the excitement and glamour. Still, on an income/effort basis, it beats most work all to hell. Thats why it's called work, I suppose, and yep they make some serious dough. But I also have it on good authority that a life out west on a ranch or some such is not necessiarly a bad thing....I agree.. We haven't seen a polished and highly public pitch for that idea for quite a while, but Bill McKibben's _Deep Economy_ comes close. You might find it interesting. -- Ed Huntress |
#21
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still work out there - MN
"Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message ... On Mar 17, 10:27 am, Wes wrote: "Karl Townsend" wrote: "The Kid" got laid off Thursday. Last day of work on Friday. He's got a ton o' payments - house, car, student loan, credit cards. It took him till 10:00 A.M. today to get another good job. He's lead man - programmer, setup, order tooling etc. in a five man shop. Quite a change from the large corporation. Pay is close to the same at $25 but little OT, vs. 10 - 20 hours before. Glad that your son was able to rapidly gain another job. I hope he took reflection on how his choices and obligations require a fairly constant stream of income. Ask him how long he could have lasted if the economy was totally down and he had to rely on unemployement and savings. Your son has good marketable skills but he needs to always keep in mind what would happen if... If you get hurt outside of work, most places don't keep you on for long and poof goes the health insurance unless you can make the cobra payments. He needs to have a reserve fund in liquid funds. Hopefully he has it but I bet he doesn't. Wes And prepare for the next layoff...the economy is tanking and has not seen the bottom. And then there is that small matter of daily bank failures... It's time to be eating beans until the debts are paid off... TMT That's one look. Another, more realistic is that this is a HUGE opportunity. If you're so doomy-gloomy you should take all your worthless money and all you can borrow and use it to buy hard goods that won't loose all their value like money will. I'd recommend wire brushes, but lead time are getting longer as I'm booked for months even running over-time and weekends, and hiring warm bodies as fast as I can. |
#22
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still work out there - MN
On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 22:30:41 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote: We haven't seen a polished and highly public pitch for that idea for quite a while, but Bill McKibben's _Deep Economy_ comes close. You might find it interesting. Thank you---It does look quite interesting--and in these times on target ..It's on my list. ED |
#23
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still work out there - MN
On Mar 17, 8:57*pm, "Tom Gardner" wrote:
"Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message ... On Mar 17, 10:27 am, Wes wrote: "Karl Townsend" wrote: "The Kid" got laid off Thursday. Last day of work on Friday. He's got a ton o' payments - house, car, student loan, credit cards. It took him till 10:00 A.M. today to get another good job. He's lead man - programmer, setup, order tooling etc. in a five man shop. Quite a change from the large corporation. Pay is close to the same at $25 but little OT, vs. 10 - 20 hours before. Glad that your son was able to rapidly gain another job. I hope he took reflection on how his choices and obligations require a fairly constant stream of income. Ask him how long he could have lasted if the economy was totally down and he had to rely on unemployement and savings. Your son has good marketable skills but he needs to always keep in mind what would happen if... If you get hurt outside of work, most places don't keep you on for long and poof goes the health insurance unless you can make the cobra payments. He needs to have a reserve fund in liquid funds. Hopefully he has it but I bet he doesn't. Wes And prepare for the next layoff...the economy is tanking and has not seen the bottom. And then there is that small matter of daily bank failures... It's time to be eating beans until the debts are paid off... TMT That's one look. *Another, more realistic is that this is a HUGE opportunity. If you're so doomy-gloomy you should take all your worthless money and all you can borrow and use it to buy hard goods that won't loose all their value like money will. *I'd recommend wire brushes, but lead time are getting longer as I'm booked for months even running over-time and weekends, and hiring warm bodies as fast as I can.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - LOL...Good to hear times are good with you...you are an exception...that is if times are actually good. Times were good at Bear Stearns last week...not so good today. A dose of reality might help correct your mispreception of what is really going on. If you feel lucky maybe you might want to use all your worthless money to buy some of Bear Stearns. TMT Deepening slump envelops factory sector By Glenn Somerville Mon Mar 17 A spreading economic malaise seeped into U.S. factories in February and March as waning demand more than offset the export benefits of a cheaper dollar, a series of reports showed on Monday. A Federal Reserve report on industrial output showed factories ran at their slowest rate in more than two years during February while a key gauge of factory business in the Northeastern U.S. slumped to a record low in March. Taken together, the reports reinforced concern that the world's largest economy stalled during the first quarter and was in an actual downturn, though Bush administration officials refuse to concede a recession has started. The New York Fed said its "Empire State" gauge of general business activity plunged in March to a record minus 22.23 from minus 11.72 in February, far worse than analysts had expected, as was the case with the broader industrial production report. The Fed report showed overall industrial production by the nation's mines, factories and utilities fell an unexpectedly steep 0.5 percent in February. That followed a slight 0.1 percent January gain and was the biggest decline in total output since last October. Market participants, transfixed by developments in the U.S. financial sector after a weekend collapse of one large firm and new Fed action to add liquidity, paid scant attention to the latest economic numbers. After see-sawing throughout the day, the Dow Jones industrial average ended up 0.18 percent at 11,972.25. The Nasdaq Composite Index posted a 1.6 percent loss to close at 2,177.01. Investors scrambled for safety into U.S. Treasury securities, driving prices up for longer maturities and yields down ahead of a Fed policy- setting meeting on Tuesday that is widely expected to deliver the central bank's next move, a hefty cut in its benchmark federal funds rate. The stress on factories showed up in the measure of manufacturing, with output down 0.2 percent in February after being flat in January. That left the manufacturing sector running at 79.3 percent of total operating capacity, the lowest rate since 79.2 percent in October 2005. "The implication for the economy is that the manufacturing sector, even though it benefits substantially by a weaker dollar, is in decline, hurt by a domestic slowdown," said economist Cary Leahey of Decision Economics Inc in New York. "This report is saying that the economy is in recession in the first quarter," Leahey added. Separately, the National Association of Home Builders said builder sentiment remained near historic lows in March. Its NAHB/Wells Fargo Housing Market Index was unchanged from February at 20 -- with any reading under 50 signaling that more builders see conditions as bleak than view them favorably. The latest signs of economic distress occur against a backdrop of mounting woe in the U.S. financial sector, where the Fed once more stepped in on Sunday night to cut a lending rate to try to keep financial markets from panicking and seizing up. That came hours after a deal was announced for a takeover of ailing investment bank Bear Stearns by JPMorgan Chase & Co for a bargain- basement price of $2 a share. That deal committed the Fed to fund up to $30 billion of Bear Stearns' less-liquid assets and highlighted a loss of investor confidence in the health of the U.S. financial system. President George W. Bush, who met his top economic advisers on Monday morning, said afterward the economy faced "challenging times" but played down fears cited by some analysts that it was confronting its worst set of conditions in decades. "In the long run our economy's going to be fine," said Bush, who leaves office next January and does not want to leave presumed Republican presidential nominee Sen. John McCain in any worse position than necessary when November elections occur. He said the United States was "on top of the situation." A Treasury Department report showing net overall capital inflows to the United States fell sharply in January underlined the skepticism that foreigners have about the direction of the U.S. economy. Inflows dropped to $37.4 billion from $72.7 billion in December -- not enough to cover the month's $58.2 billion deficit on trade with the rest of the world and therefore likely to maintain pressure on a steadily sliding U.S. dollar. The only glimmer of hope came in a report from the Commerce Department showing a modest improvement in the broadest gauge of total U.S. trade with the rest of the world. Soaring U.S. deficits are cited by academic economists as a root cause of deepening problems in the economy because they reflect the propensity of U.S. consumers to spend rather than save and to borrow endlessly from abroad to finance spending. The U.S. current account deficit narrowed in the fourth quarter to $172.9 billion from a revised $177.4 billion in the third quarter, the Commerce Department said. (Additional reporting by Burton Frierson, Pedro Nicolaci da Costa and Gertrude Chavez in New York; Editing by Dan Grebler) |
#24
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still work out there - MN
"Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message ... LOL...Good to hear times are good with you...you are an exception...that is if times are actually good. Times were good at Bear Stearns last week...not so good today. A dose of reality might help correct your mispreception of what is really going on. If you feel lucky maybe you might want to use all your worthless money to buy some of Bear Stearns. TMT I have no misconceptions, you should examine yours. Bear Stearns is/was a house of cards. Volumes will be written about this period and lessons will be learned. But, it's not the end of the world. Sorry for you to hear but EVERY one I know in business (it seems almost all of my friends are in business) is going gang-busters! It could be that we all have the same value system and have built our businesses on solid foundations and not "get rich quick" schemes. Can Bear Sterns say the same? Why do you think the housing market/sub-prime bubble was unsustainable? Gee, who didn't see THAT coming? |
#25
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still work out there - MN
Tom Gardner wrote: I have no misconceptions, you should examine yours. Bear Stearns is/was a house of cards. Volumes will be written about this period and lessons will be learned. But, it's not the end of the world. Sorry for you to hear but EVERY one I know in business (it seems almost all of my friends are in business) is going gang-busters! It could be that we all have the same value system and have built our businesses on solid foundations and not "get rich quick" schemes. Can Bear Sterns say the same? Why do you think the housing market/sub-prime bubble was unsustainable? Gee, who didn't see THAT coming? Their investors? BTW, if you get too tired of the snow, and looking for workers, you should consider Florida. Reasonable real estate, lots of willing workers, plus it's a "Right to Work" state. -- aioe.org is home to cowards and terrorists Add this line to your news proxy nfilter.dat file * drop Path:*aioe.org!not-for-mail to drop all aioe.org traffic. http://improve-usenet.org/index.html |
#26
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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still work out there - MN
"Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message ... Tom Gardner wrote: I have no misconceptions, you should examine yours. Bear Stearns is/was a house of cards. Volumes will be written about this period and lessons will be learned. But, it's not the end of the world. Sorry for you to hear but EVERY one I know in business (it seems almost all of my friends are in business) is going gang-busters! It could be that we all have the same value system and have built our businesses on solid foundations and not "get rich quick" schemes. Can Bear Sterns say the same? Why do you think the housing market/sub-prime bubble was unsustainable? Gee, who didn't see THAT coming? Their investors? BTW, if you get too tired of the snow, and looking for workers, you should consider Florida. Reasonable real estate, lots of willing workers, plus it's a "Right to Work" state. And, 365 fishing, golf, etc... But, heat, bugs, crocodiles and lots of old people. |
#27
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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still work out there - MN
"Wes" wrote in message ... Too_Many_Tools wrote: There is something rotten in our psychic when we believe in ez money over just plain hard effort and work to get a head. Flipping properties, buying over your ability to pay and believing the road a head is bright and pothole free. The character of our citizens is declining for the most part. Sounds like thermo dynamics for humans. B |
#28
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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still work out there - MN
On Tue, 18 Mar 2008 04:35:42 GMT, "Tom Gardner"
wrote: "Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message ... LOL...Good to hear times are good with you...you are an exception...that is if times are actually good. Times were good at Bear Stearns last week...not so good today. A dose of reality might help correct your mispreception of what is really going on. If you feel lucky maybe you might want to use all your worthless money to buy some of Bear Stearns. TMT I have no misconceptions, you should examine yours. Bear Stearns is/was a house of cards. Not exactly a house of cards..One of the biggest business underwriters in the world. Their losses from the two hedge funds that went under triggering the subprime crisis were more than offset by other units within their operations but to no avail.. It was the CREDIT CRUNCH that did them in---not subprime paper. It was the subprime that set off the credit crunch.. Were these guys one of your customers? http://new.savannahnow.com/node/424634 ED Volumes will be written about this period and lessons will be learned. But, it's not the end of the world. Sorry for you to hear but EVERY one I know in business (it seems almost all of my friends are in business) is going gang-busters! It could be that we all have the same value system and have built our businesses on solid foundations and not "get rich quick" schemes. Can Bear Sterns say the same? Why do you think the housing market/sub-prime bubble was unsustainable? Gee, who didn't see THAT coming? |
#29
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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still work out there - MN
"ED" wrote in message ... On Tue, 18 Mar 2008 04:35:42 GMT, "Tom Gardner" wrote: "Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message ... LOL...Good to hear times are good with you...you are an exception...that is if times are actually good. Times were good at Bear Stearns last week...not so good today. A dose of reality might help correct your mispreception of what is really going on. If you feel lucky maybe you might want to use all your worthless money to buy some of Bear Stearns. TMT I have no misconceptions, you should examine yours. Bear Stearns is/was a house of cards. Not exactly a house of cards..One of the biggest business underwriters in the world. Their losses from the two hedge funds that went under triggering the subprime crisis were more than offset by other units within their operations but to no avail.. It was the CREDIT CRUNCH that did them in---not subprime paper. It was the subprime that set off the credit crunch.. Were these guys one of your customers? http://new.savannahnow.com/node/424634 ED Not directly, but they could have been buying from a number of shipyard supply outfits in Missouri that I sell to. |
#30
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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still work out there - MN
On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 22:57:43 -0400, "Tom Gardner"
wrote: That's one look. Another, more realistic is that this is a HUGE opportunity. If you're so doomy-gloomy you should take all your worthless money and all you can borrow and use it to buy hard goods that won't loose all their value like money will. I'd recommend wire brushes, but lead time are getting longer as I'm booked for months even running over-time and weekends, and hiring warm bodies as fast as I can. So? The Kid needs a little overtime, so why isn't he coming up to the plant and putting some in? I think he knows where to find it... -- Bruce -- |
#31
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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still work out there - MN
On Tue, 18 Mar 2008 12:17:14 GMT, "Bernie" wrote:
"Wes" wrote in message ... Too_Many_Tools wrote: There is something rotten in our psychic when we believe in ez money over just plain hard effort and work to get a head. Flipping properties, buying over your ability to pay and believing the road a head is bright and pothole free. The character of our citizens is declining for the most part. Sounds like thermo dynamics for humans. B ============= IMNSHO the problem is not so much the people in general, as these tend to be a "tabula rasa" [blank slate] but rather the enormously effect "agitprop" activities are having that now bombard and assail the citizens their entire waking hours, pushing EZ credit, fast food, pill popping (for anything that ails you, and lots of things you never thought of before), and casual sex. Take one hour [the maximum that most people can stand] and really watch TV or listen to radio, paying particular attention to the ads and product placements within the shows. The amazing thing is not that the people are acting against their own best long-term self interests, but that so many do not. I have no solution for this, easy or otherwise, except to note "when things can't continue, they won't..." Unka' George [George McDuffee] ------------------------------------------- He that will not apply new remedies, must expect new evils: for Time is the greatest innovator: and if Time, of course, alter things to the worse, and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better, what shall be the end? Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman. Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625). |
#32
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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still work out there - MN
Tom Gardner wrote: "Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message ... Their investors? BTW, if you get too tired of the snow, and looking for workers, you should consider Florida. Reasonable real estate, lots of willing workers, plus it's a "Right to Work" state. And, 365 fishing, golf, etc... But, heat, bugs, crocodiles and lots of old people. Only in the tourist areas of the state. The good areas are reserved for the full time residents. -- aioe.org is home to cowards and terrorists Add this line to your news proxy nfilter.dat file * drop Path:*aioe.org!not-for-mail to drop all aioe.org traffic. http://improve-usenet.org/index.html |
#33
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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still work out there - MN
On Mar 17, 10:35*pm, "Tom Gardner"
wrote: "Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message ... LOL...Good to hear times are good with you...you are an exception...that is if times are actually good. Times were good at Bear Stearns last week...not so good today. A dose of reality might help correct your mispreception of what is really going on. If you feel lucky maybe you might want to use all your worthless money to buy some of Bear Stearns. TMT I have no misconceptions, you should examine yours. *Bear Stearns is/was a house of cards. *Volumes will be written about this period and lessons will be learned. *But, it's not the end of the world. *Sorry for you to hear but EVERY one I know in business (it seems almost all of my friends are in business) is going gang-busters! *It could be that we all have the same value system and have built our businesses on solid foundations and not "get rich quick" schemes.. *Can Bear Sterns say the same? *Why do you think the housing market/sub-prime bubble was unsustainable? *Gee, who didn't see THAT coming? Tom...read the article I posted. Most everybody is NOT going gang-busters....they are hurting. That is reality...no matter what you think is going on. If your little corner of the world is doing well...great..and I am happy for your good fortune...but realize that you are the minority at the moment. In other words, your fortunes are likely to change...so prepare for the rainy day...it is coming. TMT |
#34
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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still work out there - MN
On Mar 17, 10:55*pm, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote: Tom Gardner wrote: I have no misconceptions, you should examine yours. *Bear Stearns is/was a house of cards. *Volumes will be written about this period and lessons will be learned. *But, it's not the end of the world. *Sorry for you to hear but EVERY one I know in business (it seems almost all of my friends are in business) is going gang-busters! *It could be that we all have the same value system and have built our businesses on solid foundations and not "get rich quick" schemes. *Can Bear Sterns say the same? *Why do you think the housing market/sub-prime bubble was unsustainable? *Gee, who didn't see THAT coming? * *Their investors? * *BTW, if you get too tired of the snow, and looking for workers, you should consider Florida. Reasonable real estate, lots of willing workers, plus it's a "Right to Work" state. -- aioe.org is home to cowards and terrorists Add this line to your news proxy nfilter.dat file * drop Path:*aioe.org!not-for-mail to drop all aioe.org traffic. http://improve-usenet.org/index.html Huh...better read some FL financials...the state is hurting. I would be very hesitant to move there. TMT |
#35
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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still work out there - MN
Too_Many_Tools wrote: On Mar 17, 10:55 pm, "Michael A. Terrell" wrote: Tom Gardner wrote: I have no misconceptions, you should examine yours. Bear Stearns is/was a house of cards. Volumes will be written about this period and lessons will be learned. But, it's not the end of the world. Sorry for you to hear but EVERY one I know in business (it seems almost all of my friends are in business) is going gang-busters! It could be that we all have the same value system and have built our businesses on solid foundations and not "get rich quick" schemes. Can Bear Sterns say the same? Why do you think the housing market/sub-prime bubble was unsustainable? Gee, who didn't see THAT coming? Their investors? BTW, if you get too tired of the snow, and looking for workers, you should consider Florida. Reasonable real estate, lots of willing workers, plus it's a "Right to Work" state. -- aioe.org is home to cowards and terrorists Add this line to your news proxy nfilter.dat file * drop Path:*aioe.org!not-for-mail to drop all aioe.org traffic. http://improve-usenet.org/index.html Huh...better read some FL financials...the state is hurting. I would be very hesitant to move there. Not the whole state, idiot. -- aioe.org is home to cowards and terrorists Add this line to your news proxy nfilter.dat file * drop Path:*aioe.org!not-for-mail to drop all aioe.org traffic. http://improve-usenet.org/index.html |
#36
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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still work out there - MN
Michael A. Terrell wrote:
BTW, if you get too tired of the snow, and looking for workers, you should consider Florida. Reasonable real estate, lots of willing workers, plus it's a "Right to Work" state. AND HURRICANES!!!! ...lew... |
#37
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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still work out there - MN
Lew Hartswick wrote: Michael A. Terrell wrote: BTW, if you get too tired of the snow, and looking for workers, you should consider Florida. Reasonable real estate, lots of willing workers, plus it's a "Right to Work" state. AND HURRICANES!!!! ...lew... A few years out of the 20+ I've been here. Ohio has plenty of TORNADOS, though, and those are almost every year. -- aioe.org is home to cowards and terrorists Add this line to your news proxy nfilter.dat file * drop Path:*aioe.org!not-for-mail to drop all aioe.org traffic. http://improve-usenet.org/index.html |
#38
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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still work out there - MN
"Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message ... Huh...better read some FL financials...the state is hurting. I would be very hesitant to move there. TMT All the better! Having a responsibility to community, the idea of pumping millions into a depressed economy interests me. You might try to understand that. |
#39
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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still work out there - MN
On Mar 19, 10:45*pm, "Tom Gardner"
wrote: "Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message ... Huh...better read some FL financials...the state is hurting. I would be very hesitant to move there. TMT All the better! *Having a responsibility to community, the idea of pumping millions into a depressed economy interests me. * You might try to understand that. Well good for you Tom. I know of many crack houses that need to be fixed up for their residents...got that "responsibility to community" cash handy? TMT |
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