RogerN
Appreciating those who build a better mousetrap!



rant_mode = on

I suspect most new stuff comes out because people are stimulated to buy
something new, irrespective of the merit of the design.
Selling useless fashion items like cast aluminum car wheels is more
profitable than useful stuff like refrigerators.
Actual improvements can be hard to spot.

Jordan

Roger_N wrote:
I often see comments about "Reinventing the wheel" on replies to questions
about making something that is manufactured. One time I asked about making
something on the knifemaking newsgroup and got a response about reinventing
the wheel. What? Them guys make knives! Like there is some kind of knife
shortage?

What about all the new aluminum flashlights? Did Mag-Lite and Brinkman
waste their time reinventing the flashlight? Why does West Coast Choppers
waste their time reinventing the motorcycle. And then there are ... wheels,
you can buy all kinds of sporty wheels for automobiles, those companies
really are reinventing the wheel!

If it wasn't for "reinventing the wheel" we'd only have stone wheels with
one choice of tire for only one make and model of automobile. So much for
building a better mousetrap, why reinvent the mousetrap?

Don't get me wrong, these replies usually inform the OP of a product like
they are wanting to make, and often very helpful. But there are new
inventions and about everything else is "reinventing the wheel".
Reinventing the wheel give opportunity for improvment and variety.

rant_mode = off

:-)

RogerN
Appreciating those who build a better mousetrap!



I remember a fellow using that expression on me.

He said CP/M already had everything a user could want.
Why reinvent the wheel...

I often see comments about "Reinventing the wheel" on replies to questions
about making something that is manufactured. One time I asked about making
something on the knifemaking newsgroup and got a response about reinventing
the wheel. What? Them guys make knives! Like there is some kind of knife
shortage?

What about all the new aluminum flashlights? Did Mag-Lite and Brinkman
waste their time reinventing the flashlight? Why does West Coast Choppers
waste their time reinventing the motorcycle. And then there are ... wheels,
you can buy all kinds of sporty wheels for automobiles, those companies
really are reinventing the wheel!

If it wasn't for "reinventing the wheel" we'd only have stone wheels with
one choice of tire for only one make and model of automobile. So much for
building a better mousetrap, why reinvent the mousetrap?

Don't get me wrong, these replies usually inform the OP of a product like
they are wanting to make, and often very helpful. But there are new
inventions and about everything else is "reinventing the wheel".
Reinventing the wheel give opportunity for improvment and variety.

rant_mode = off

:-)

RogerN
Appreciating those who build a better mousetrap!

SteveB wrote:

Some people are just meat and potatoes types of people. Dull, dull, dull.


That's me I suppose. I've been buying the same design of Swing-Away can
opener for decades, as there isn't a better one as far as I know.
(first can opener in outer space!)

"Roger_N" wrote in message
...

I often see comments about "Reinventing the wheel" on replies to questions
about making something that is manufactured. One time I asked about
making something on the knifemaking newsgroup and got a response about
reinventing the wheel. What? Them guys make knives! Like there is some
kind of knife shortage?

What about all the new aluminum flashlights? Did Mag-Lite and Brinkman
waste their time reinventing the flashlight? Why does West Coast Choppers
waste their time reinventing the motorcycle. And then there are ...
wheels, you can buy all kinds of sporty wheels for automobiles, those
companies really are reinventing the wheel!

If it wasn't for "reinventing the wheel" we'd only have stone wheels with
one choice of tire for only one make and model of automobile. So much for
building a better mousetrap, why reinvent the mousetrap?

Don't get me wrong, these replies usually inform the OP of a product like
they are wanting to make, and often very helpful. But there are new
inventions and about everything else is "reinventing the wheel".
Reinventing the wheel give opportunity for improvment and variety.

rant_mode = off

:-)

RogerN
Appreciating those who build a better mousetrap!

Some people are just meat and potatoes types of people. Dull, dull, dull.

Jordan wrote:

SteveB wrote:

Some people are just meat and potatoes types of people. Dull, dull, dull.


That's me I suppose. I've been buying the same design of Swing-Away can
opener for decades, as there isn't a better one as far as I know.
(first can opener in outer space!)


It's one of the few things worth buying at K-mart. I had to buy a
new one, after 20 years of daily use.



--
aioe.org is home to cowards and terrorists

Add this line to your news proxy nfilter.dat file
* drop Path:*aioe.org!not-for-mail to drop all aioe.org traffic.

http://improve-usenet.org/index.html

On Sun, 16 Mar 2008 20:42:41 -0600, "Roger_N"
wrote:


I often see comments about "Reinventing the wheel" on replies to questions
about making something that is manufactured. One time I asked about making
something on the knifemaking newsgroup and got a response about reinventing
the wheel. What? Them guys make knives! Like there is some kind of knife
shortage?

What about all the new aluminum flashlights? Did Mag-Lite and Brinkman
waste their time reinventing the flashlight? Why does West Coast Choppers
waste their time reinventing the motorcycle. And then there are ... wheels,
you can buy all kinds of sporty wheels for automobiles, those companies
really are reinventing the wheel!

If it wasn't for "reinventing the wheel" we'd only have stone wheels with
one choice of tire for only one make and model of automobile. So much for
building a better mousetrap, why reinvent the mousetrap?

Don't get me wrong, these replies usually inform the OP of a product like
they are wanting to make, and often very helpful. But there are new
inventions and about everything else is "reinventing the wheel".
Reinventing the wheel give opportunity for improvment and variety.

rant_mode = off

:-)

RogerN
Appreciating those who build a better mousetrap!

For every person that creates there are dozens of critics who are
unable to create but are adept snipers.

Non illigimatus carborundum -- don't let the *******s wear ya down.

Don, who spent 35 years in the R&D biz...

cavelamb himself wrote:

He said CP/M already had everything a user could want.
Why reinvent the wheel...

Then followed MP/M...

"Michael A. Terrell" wrote:

That's me I suppose. I've been buying the same design of Swing-Away can
opener for decades, as there isn't a better one as far as I know.
(first can opener in outer space!)


It's one of the few things worth buying at K-mart. I had to buy a
new one, after 20 years of daily use.

I believe it is still made in America, I've bought a few myself. (note:
don't leave out at work).

Wes

Wes wrote:

"Michael A. Terrell" wrote:

That's me I suppose. I've been buying the same design of Swing-Away can
opener for decades, as there isn't a better one as far as I know.
(first can opener in outer space!)


It's one of the few things worth buying at K-mart. I had to buy a
new one, after 20 years of daily use.

I believe it is still made in America, I've bought a few myself. (note:
don't leave out at work).

Wes


That's why I bought it. The Chinese crap didn't look like it would
last a year.


--
aioe.org is home to cowards and terrorists

Add this line to your news proxy nfilter.dat file
* drop Path:*aioe.org!not-for-mail to drop all aioe.org traffic.

http://improve-usenet.org/index.html

On Mar 16, 6:00 pm, Jordan wrote:
SteveB wrote:

Some people are just meat and potatoes types of people. Dull, dull, dull.

That's me I suppose. I've been buying the same design of Swing-Away can
opener for decades, as there isn't a better one as far as I know.
(first can opener in outer space!)

I'm on number 2. I've been known to give them to people after watching
them open cans when I've been invited over for dinner.
Karl

I teach design classes to budding engineers. There is a gray middle
ground between sticking with the old proven design and going with the
'bleeding edge' technology. Trying to help program young brain cells to
make this distinction can cause gray hair!

In real world jobs, there is a real tendency to not make changes in
"what we did on the last project". The result is 30 year old technology
and getting your product kicked in the market place.

The other side of the coin is the engineer who gets a kick out of
implementing the latest and greatest technology. Or the one that refuses
to look for good ideas from past project, the NIH syndrome.

The best engineers and designers have a knack for picking out the key
design elements from old products, looking for better ideas in the
marketplace, and add in some internal inspiration to get to a much
better end result.

One of my groups did a small pump redesign: basic design cleanup, picked
some key elements from the bigger and more expensive brothers in the
product line, and then did some serious repackaging to get it to fit in
the smaller pump. Result was 60% reduction in mfg cost and 5x increase
in field reliability. All I could do was smile.

Roger_N wrote:
I often see comments about "Reinventing the wheel" on replies to questions
about making something that is manufactured. One time I asked about making
something on the knifemaking newsgroup and got a response about reinventing
the wheel. What? Them guys make knives! Like there is some kind of knife
shortage?

What about all the new aluminum flashlights? Did Mag-Lite and Brinkman
waste their time reinventing the flashlight? Why does West Coast Choppers
waste their time reinventing the motorcycle. And then there are ... wheels,
you can buy all kinds of sporty wheels for automobiles, those companies
really are reinventing the wheel!

If it wasn't for "reinventing the wheel" we'd only have stone wheels with
one choice of tire for only one make and model of automobile. So much for
building a better mousetrap, why reinvent the mousetrap?

Don't get me wrong, these replies usually inform the OP of a product like
they are wanting to make, and often very helpful. But there are new
inventions and about everything else is "reinventing the wheel".
Reinventing the wheel give opportunity for improvment and variety.

rant_mode = off

:-)

RogerN
Appreciating those who build a better mousetrap!

cavelamb himself wrote:
Roger_N wrote:
I often see comments about "Reinventing the wheel" on replies to questions
about making something that is manufactured. One time I asked about making
something on the knifemaking newsgroup and got a response about reinventing
the wheel. What? Them guys make knives! Like there is some kind of knife
shortage?

What about all the new aluminum flashlights? Did Mag-Lite and Brinkman
waste their time reinventing the flashlight? Why does West Coast Choppers
waste their time reinventing the motorcycle. And then there are ... wheels,
you can buy all kinds of sporty wheels for automobiles, those companies
really are reinventing the wheel!

If it wasn't for "reinventing the wheel" we'd only have stone wheels with
one choice of tire for only one make and model of automobile. So much for
building a better mousetrap, why reinvent the mousetrap?

Don't get me wrong, these replies usually inform the OP of a product like
they are wanting to make, and often very helpful. But there are new
inventions and about everything else is "reinventing the wheel".
Reinventing the wheel give opportunity for improvment and variety.

rant_mode = off

:-)

RogerN
Appreciating those who build a better mousetrap!



I remember a fellow using that expression on me.

He said CP/M already had everything a user could want.
Why reinvent the wheel...

It's too bad I can't look at stupid flash ads on CP/M. I can fire up a
word processor much faster though.

RoyJ wrote:
(top posting fixed)
Roger_N wrote:
I often see comments about "Reinventing the wheel" on replies to
questions about making something that is manufactured. One time I
asked about making something on the knifemaking newsgroup and got a
response about reinventing the wheel. What? Them guys make knives!
Like there is some kind of knife shortage?

What about all the new aluminum flashlights? Did Mag-Lite and
Brinkman waste their time reinventing the flashlight? Why does West
Coast Choppers waste their time reinventing the motorcycle. And then
there are ... wheels, you can buy all kinds of sporty wheels for
automobiles, those companies really are reinventing the wheel!

If it wasn't for "reinventing the wheel" we'd only have stone wheels
with one choice of tire for only one make and model of automobile. So
much for building a better mousetrap, why reinvent the mousetrap?

Don't get me wrong, these replies usually inform the OP of a product
like they are wanting to make, and often very helpful. But there are
new inventions and about everything else is "reinventing the wheel".
Reinventing the wheel give opportunity for improvment and variety.

rant_mode = off

:-)

RogerN
Appreciating those who build a better mousetrap!


I teach design classes to budding engineers. There is a gray middle
ground between sticking with the old proven design and going with the
'bleeding edge' technology. Trying to help program young brain cells to
make this distinction can cause gray hair!

In real world jobs, there is a real tendency to not make changes in
"what we did on the last project". The result is 30 year old technology
and getting your product kicked in the market place.

The other side of the coin is the engineer who gets a kick out of
implementing the latest and greatest technology. Or the one that refuses
to look for good ideas from past project, the NIH syndrome.

The best engineers and designers have a knack for picking out the key
design elements from old products, looking for better ideas in the
marketplace, and add in some internal inspiration to get to a much
better end result.

One of my groups did a small pump redesign: basic design cleanup, picked
some key elements from the bigger and more expensive brothers in the
product line, and then did some serious repackaging to get it to fit in
the smaller pump. Result was 60% reduction in mfg cost and 5x increase
in field reliability. All I could do was smile.


Deciding which elements of a design to keep as old tried-and-true, and
which elements to advance to the bleeding edge can be one of the
toughest (and potentially most value-added) parts of a design (or major
redesign).

I always worry about designs (even my own!) that are too much 'old
stuff' or too much 'new stuff'.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

Do you need to implement control loops in software?
"Applied Control Theory for Embedded Systems" gives you just what it says.
See details at http://www.wescottdesign.com/actfes/actfes.html

"Michael A. Terrell" wrote:

That's why I bought it. The Chinese crap didn't look like it would
last a year.


one thing I find annoying with can openers in general is that cans seem to
be shrinking in metal thickness and some can openers can't deal with the
thin cans.

Wes

"Wes" wrote in message
...
"Michael A. Terrell" wrote:

That's why I bought it. The Chinese crap didn't look like it would
last a year.


one thing I find annoying with can openers in general is that cans seem to
be shrinking in metal thickness and some can openers can't deal with the
thin cans.

Wes

Yeah, that's been going on for close to 30 years now. That's how steel has
remained competitive first, with aluminum, and now with plastics.

Notice that the steel is a lot harder. Tuna cans are deep-drawn to a state
that's almost like heat-treated steel.

--
Ed Huntress

Bottom posting fixed.

Recognizing that there is an issue is a HUGE step toward getting the
right mix. I've found that if a design team actually asks the question,
they usually do a fairly good job of picking the right mix.

But I did have one team leader who "kept putting Formula parts in an off
road vehicle" (quoted from a team member), and took twice as long as
usual to get a car built.

I try to get the students to "go ask the old gray haired guy" about the
design issues and then THINK about why he says what he says. Example: U
joints and drive shafts. The old guy says "always use U joints in pairs,
they have to be synched, don't use too high an angle" Ask him why, "it
vibrates and breaks" several hours with the machine design and geometry
text books later, you discover there is a nasty 2x rotational harmonic
as well as a torque calc that has a divisor that goes to zero as the
angle increases. Well duh! Sure was glad the old guy pointed in the
right direction, didn't care if he knew why or not.

Deciding which elements of a design to keep as old tried-and-true, and
which elements to advance to the bleeding edge can be one of the
toughest (and potentially most value-added) parts of a design (or major
redesign).

I always worry about designs (even my own!) that are too much 'old
stuff' or too much 'new stuff'.




I teach design classes to budding engineers. There is a gray middle
ground between sticking with the old proven design and going with the
'bleeding edge' technology. Trying to help program young brain cells
to make this distinction can cause gray hair!

In real world jobs, there is a real tendency to not make changes in
"what we did on the last project". The result is 30 year old
technology and getting your product kicked in the market place.

The other side of the coin is the engineer who gets a kick out of
implementing the latest and greatest technology. Or the one that
refuses to look for good ideas from past project, the NIH syndrome.

The best engineers and designers have a knack for picking out the key
design elements from old products, looking for better ideas in the
marketplace, and add in some internal inspiration to get to a much
better end result.

One of my groups did a small pump redesign: basic design cleanup,
picked some key elements from the bigger and more expensive brothers
in the product line, and then did some serious repackaging to get it
to fit in the smaller pump. Result was 60% reduction in mfg cost and
5x increase in field reliability. All I could do was smile.

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 11:56:27 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, Wes
quickly quoth:

"Michael A. Terrell" wrote:

That's why I bought it. The Chinese crap didn't look like it would
last a year.


one thing I find annoying with can openers in general is that cans seem to
be shrinking in metal thickness and some can openers can't deal with the
thin cans.

If that's so, "adjust" your can opener with a hammer.

--
Death is more universal than life; everyone dies but not everyone lives.
-- A. Sachs

Larry Jaques wrote:

If that's so, "adjust" your can opener with a hammer.

I've been tempted. Didn't want to find out it was too hard to bend w/o
cracking.

Wes

"Jordan" wrote in message
u...
SteveB wrote:

Some people are just meat and potatoes types of people. Dull, dull,
dull.

That's me I suppose. I've been buying the same design of Swing-Away can
opener for decades, as there isn't a better one as far as I know.
(first can opener in outer space!)

There's no problem with sticking with a proven design. There have been
products that they quit manufacturing, or replaced with inferior imitations.
Or fancier (and more costly) imitations. Can openers, as you
mentioned.......... I like the ones I find at yard sales. Potato peelers
the same way. The old ones are the best ones.

What I was referring to were people who are just not going to try new
things. I still know some people who wouldn't consider owning a computer.
I know a guy who has a computer, but refuses to hook up to Internet. He
uses is to play solitaire. And people who refuse to consider some of the
new and better options to things that actually would do the job better and
easier.

Steve

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 09:38:53 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 11:56:27 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, Wes
quickly quoth:

"Michael A. Terrell" wrote:

That's why I bought it. The Chinese crap didn't look like it would
last a year.


one thing I find annoying with can openers in general is that cans seem to
be shrinking in metal thickness and some can openers can't deal with the
thin cans.

If that's so, "adjust" your can opener with a hammer.


I love the concept of the can opener that cuts the top off from the
side.
There are several on the market that do this, allowing you to use the
top of the can as a replaceable lid.

However..each of those Ive tried last about 5 cans then break.

Any good ones out there?

And the trend in making the rims thinner/smaller sure has played hell
with my electric can openers. Takes me about 3x as long trying to get
a large dogfood or catfood can open, fumble ****ing around.

Gunner



"Pax Americana is a philosophy. Hardly an empire.
Making sure other people play nice and dont kill each other (and us)
off in job lots is hardly empire building, particularly when you give
them self determination under "play nice" rules.

Think of it as having your older brother knock the **** out of you
for torturing the cat." Gunner

Gunner Asch wrote in
:

snip
And the trend in making the rims thinner/smaller sure has played hell
with my electric can openers. Takes me about 3x as long trying to get
a large dogfood or catfood can open, fumble ****ing around.

Gunner

snip

That's why they make bags of 'dry' cat and dog food and bags of 'moist'
treats. If I had to fumble 3 times as long with opening a can of cat food
they'd start eating me at the ankles and work their way up.

Bill

On Sun, 16 Mar 2008 20:42:41 -0600 in rec.crafts.metalworking, "Roger_N" wrote,
What about all the new aluminum flashlights? Did Mag-Lite and Brinkman
waste their time reinventing the flashlight?

No, they just copied the earlier Kel-light aluminum flashlight.

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 10:25:29 -0700, with neither quill nor qualm,
Gunner Asch quickly quoth:

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 09:38:53 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 11:56:27 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, Wes
quickly quoth:

"Michael A. Terrell" wrote:

That's why I bought it. The Chinese crap didn't look like it would
last a year.


one thing I find annoying with can openers in general is that cans seem to
be shrinking in metal thickness and some can openers can't deal with the
thin cans.

If that's so, "adjust" your can opener with a hammer.


I love the concept of the can opener that cuts the top off from the
side.
There are several on the market that do this, allowing you to use the
top of the can as a replaceable lid.

I've only seen 1 picture of one which cut the side rather than the
top, and I didn't see any reference to a replaceable lid in the ad.
It doesn't seem possible to split a can at one point and expect the
metal to stretch on one and shrink on the other. Not safely, anyway.



However..each of those Ive tried last about 5 cans then break.

Any good ones out there?

Good question.

--
Death is more universal than life; everyone dies but not everyone lives.
-- A. Sachs

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 12:41:51 -0500, with neither quill nor qualm, Bill
quickly quoth:

Gunner Asch wrote in
:

snip
And the trend in making the rims thinner/smaller sure has played hell
with my electric can openers. Takes me about 3x as long trying to get
a large dogfood or catfood can open, fumble ****ing around.

Gunner

snip

That's why they make bags of 'dry' cat and dog food and bags of 'moist'
treats. If I had to fumble 3 times as long with opening a can of cat food
they'd start eating me at the ankles and work their way up.

Flip that around. They'll be good for at least a week of meals. burp

Petorfood!

--
Death is more universal than life; everyone dies but not everyone lives.
-- A. Sachs

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 13:03:49 -0600, with neither quill nor qualm, Don
Foreman quickly quoth:

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 10:25:29 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:



I love the concept of the can opener that cuts the top off from the
side.
There are several on the market that do this, allowing you to use the
top of the can as a replaceable lid.

However..each of those Ive tried last about 5 cans then break.

Any good ones out there?

Yes. Pampered Chef.

http://www.pamperedchef.com/our_prod...ategoryCode=KW

Kinda pricey, but they work. Goin' on 5 years and hundreds of cans
with ours. Daughter has one too, same experience.

Looks interesting. I love the last line on their page.

"Made in China" (but priced for DINK yuppies!)

--
Death is more universal than life; everyone dies but not everyone lives.
-- A. Sachs

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 10:25:29 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:



I love the concept of the can opener that cuts the top off from the
side.
There are several on the market that do this, allowing you to use the
top of the can as a replaceable lid.

However..each of those Ive tried last about 5 cans then break.

Any good ones out there?

Yes. Pampered Chef.

http://www.pamperedchef.com/our_prod...ategoryCode=KW

Kinda pricey, but they work. Goin' on 5 years and hundreds of cans
with ours. Daughter has one too, same experience.

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 13:03:49 -0600, Don Foreman
wrote:

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 10:25:29 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:



I love the concept of the can opener that cuts the top off from the
side.
There are several on the market that do this, allowing you to use the
top of the can as a replaceable lid.

However..each of those Ive tried last about 5 cans then break.

Any good ones out there?

Yes. Pampered Chef.

http://www.pamperedchef.com/our_prod...ategoryCode=KW

Kinda pricey, but they work. Goin' on 5 years and hundreds of cans
with ours. Daughter has one too, same experience.

Williams-Sonoma has a good one, but they are about double "Kinda
pricey". It's nice to be able to sit the lid back on stuff like corn
and condensed milk for Vietnamese-style drip coffee.
Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 11:48:40 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 12:41:51 -0500, with neither quill nor qualm, Bill
quickly quoth:

Gunner Asch wrote in
m:

snip
And the trend in making the rims thinner/smaller sure has played hell
with my electric can openers. Takes me about 3x as long trying to get
a large dogfood or catfood can open, fumble ****ing around.

Gunner

snip

That's why they make bags of 'dry' cat and dog food and bags of 'moist'
treats. If I had to fumble 3 times as long with opening a can of cat food
they'd start eating me at the ankles and work their way up.

Flip that around. They'll be good for at least a week of meals. burp

Petorfood!


Cat, the other white meat.

People think that I keep them around as pets.
Survivalists and ranchers keep meat on the hoof..or paw as the case
may be.

Gunner



"Pax Americana is a philosophy. Hardly an empire.
Making sure other people play nice and dont kill each other (and us)
off in job lots is hardly empire building, particularly when you give
them self determination under "play nice" rules.

Think of it as having your older brother knock the **** out of you
for torturing the cat." Gunner

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 10:41:37 -0500, RoyJ
wrote:

I teach design classes to budding engineers. There is a gray middle
ground between sticking with the old proven design and going with the
'bleeding edge' technology. Trying to help program young brain cells to
make this distinction can cause gray hair!

In real world jobs, there is a real tendency to not make changes in
"what we did on the last project". The result is 30 year old technology
and getting your product kicked in the market place.

The other side of the coin is the engineer who gets a kick out of
implementing the latest and greatest technology. Or the one that refuses
to look for good ideas from past project, the NIH syndrome.

The best engineers and designers have a knack for picking out the key
design elements from old products, looking for better ideas in the
marketplace, and add in some internal inspiration to get to a much
better end result.

One of my groups did a small pump redesign: basic design cleanup, picked
some key elements from the bigger and more expensive brothers in the
product line, and then did some serious repackaging to get it to fit in
the smaller pump. Result was 60% reduction in mfg cost and 5x increase
in field reliability. All I could do was smile.

Another wrinkle to this: a design approach that didn't make sense in
the past might make sense now (and conversely) because things do
change. Change and progress is often driven by events and markets
totally unrelated to a particular focus. Use a digital computer as a
simple timer? Heresy in 1970 when CPU time was billed by the second,
absolutely when the digital computer became a chip costing less than a
buck.

I found quite a few opportunities that started with: "we studied that
in detail 10 years ago, found that it made no sense." The conclusion
has become axiom and "accepted truth" even though the bases behind
the conclusion are long forgotten.

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 11:47:32 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 10:25:29 -0700, with neither quill nor qualm,
Gunner Asch quickly quoth:

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 09:38:53 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 11:56:27 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, Wes
quickly quoth:

"Michael A. Terrell" wrote:

That's why I bought it. The Chinese crap didn't look like it would
last a year.


one thing I find annoying with can openers in general is that cans seem to
be shrinking in metal thickness and some can openers can't deal with the
thin cans.

If that's so, "adjust" your can opener with a hammer.


I love the concept of the can opener that cuts the top off from the
side.
There are several on the market that do this, allowing you to use the
top of the can as a replaceable lid.

I've only seen 1 picture of one which cut the side rather than the
top, and I didn't see any reference to a replaceable lid in the ad.
It doesn't seem possible to split a can at one point and expect the
metal to stretch on one and shrink on the other. Not safely, anyway.


The lid already fits inside the can, and is affixed and sealed by
rolling a bead. The can opener cuts the bead radially on the outside
edge. The lid stays in the can after it's opened but lifts out
easily -- and can be replaced. There's even a little pliers-like jaw
on the can opener to grab the lid part of the severed bead and lift
out the lid.

Gunner Asch wrote:

Cat, the other white meat.

People think that I keep them around as pets.
Survivalists and ranchers keep meat on the hoof..or paw as the case
may be.



Pa! Someone done went and ate all them cats!!!!!!! We's gonna all
starve!!!!!!!!


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Larry Jaques wrote:

one thing I find annoying with can openers in general is that cans seem to
be shrinking in metal thickness and some can openers can't deal with the
thin cans.

If that's so, "adjust" your can opener with a hammer.


No need - just remove the blade nut from the Swing-Away, and remove a
shim or two to reduce clearance.

If it wasn't for "reinventing the wheel" we'd only have stone wheels with
one choice of tire for only one make and model of automobile. So much for
building a better mousetrap, why reinvent the mousetrap?

I honestly haven't found a mouse trap that works better than the
second one made. The first one would be the cat I suppose.

Dan wrote:


If it wasn't for "reinventing the wheel" we'd only have stone wheels with
one choice of tire for only one make and model of automobile. So much for
building a better mousetrap, why reinvent the mousetrap?

I honestly haven't found a mouse trap that works better than the
second one made. The first one would be the cat I suppose.


That model has too many moving parts, and wears out too fast.


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On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 17:22:59 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


Gunner Asch wrote:

Cat, the other white meat.

People think that I keep them around as pets.
Survivalists and ranchers keep meat on the hoof..or paw as the case
may be.



Pa! Someone done went and ate all them cats!!!!!!! We's gonna all
starve!!!!!!!!


Not as long as one has neighbors one doesnt like.

Longpig is the other, other white meat.

G

Gunner



"Pax Americana is a philosophy. Hardly an empire.
Making sure other people play nice and dont kill each other (and us)
off in job lots is hardly empire building, particularly when you give
them self determination under "play nice" rules.

Think of it as having your older brother knock the **** out of you
for torturing the cat." Gunner

On 2008-03-17, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Dan wrote:


If it wasn't for "reinventing the wheel" we'd only have stone wheels with
one choice of tire for only one make and model of automobile. So much for
building a better mousetrap, why reinvent the mousetrap?

I honestly haven't found a mouse trap that works better than the
second one made. The first one would be the cat I suppose.

That model has too many moving parts, and wears out too fast.

But -- it is self-resetting and relocates to surprise the mice
instead of them learning where the humans set the traps. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 15:07:50 -0600, with neither quill nor qualm, Don
Foreman quickly quoth:

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 11:47:32 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

I've only seen 1 picture of one which cut the side rather than the
top, and I didn't see any reference to a replaceable lid in the ad.
It doesn't seem possible to split a can at one point and expect the
metal to stretch on one and shrink on the other. Not safely, anyway.


The lid already fits inside the can, and is affixed and sealed by
rolling a bead. The can opener cuts the bead radially on the outside
edge. The lid stays in the can after it's opened but lifts out
easily -- and can be replaced. There's even a little pliers-like jaw
on the can opener to grab the lid part of the severed bead and lift
out the lid.

Ah, consternation turns to elucidation. (Quid Mulberg in plano?)
That's a heavy-duty opener if it cuts the bead. I'll have to check
those doohickeys out.

--
Death is more universal than life; everyone dies but not everyone lives.
-- A. Sachs

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 21:44:25 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm, Dan@
(Dan ) quickly quoth:



If it wasn't for "reinventing the wheel" we'd only have stone wheels with
one choice of tire for only one make and model of automobile. So much for
building a better mousetrap, why reinvent the mousetrap?

I honestly haven't found a mouse trap that works better than the
second one made. The first one would be the cat I suppose.

Huh? After having to feed, then neuter them, putting up with loud
nights, their territory marking, pooping, and furniture/people
scratching, not to mention the fur all the eff over EVERYTHING, the
cat cannot be considered the better mousetrap. Especially at 1,500
times the price.

--
Death is more universal than life; everyone dies but not everyone lives.
-- A. Sachs

Gunner Asch wrote:

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 17:22:59 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


Gunner Asch wrote:

Cat, the other white meat.

People think that I keep them around as pets.
Survivalists and ranchers keep meat on the hoof..or paw as the case
may be.



Pa! Someone done went and ate all them cats!!!!!!! We's gonna all
starve!!!!!!!!

Not as long as one has neighbors one doesnt like.

Longpig is the other, other white meat.


Do you have any good recipes for troll? Or can't they be cleaned
enough to cook?


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