I spent a fortune on Home depot topof the line Latex. I primed the bare wood with primer and the it basically too 3 or 4 coats to cover. The color is white.
I don't know what's wrong with Latex paint these days. I remember when Latex fist came out in the early 1960's. My father bought Dupont Lucite Latex and he never had a coverage problem. The crap they have today is like water.

wrote in message
...
I spent a fortune on Home depot topof the line Latex. I primed the bare
wood with primer and the it basically too 3 or 4 coats to cover. The color
is white.
I don't know what's wrong with Latex paint these days. I remember when
Latex fist came out in the early 1960's. My father bought Dupont Lucite
Latex and he never had a coverage problem. The crap they have today is
like water.


Try a good brand, HD top of line is close to bottom of line in quality
brands. I used it once and swore never again, I just could not get it to lay
flat.

On Tue, 4 Sep 2012 17:53:16 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

I spent a fortune on Home depot topof the line Latex. I primed the bare wood with primer and the it basically too 3 or 4 coats to cover. The color is white.
I don't know what's wrong with Latex paint these days. I remember when Latex fist came out in the early 1960's. My father bought Dupont Lucite Latex and he never had a coverage problem. The crap they have today is like water.

Buy better paint.

There are quite a number of factors that affect the hide of a latex paint, and I'll explain each of them:

(First off, tho, DuPont makes some vinyl acrylic resins, but so far as I know, DuPont never marketed a latex paint under their own name. The very first latex paints to be marketed in North America was Glidden's "Dulux" paint that was introduced in 1959. Glidden is a subsidiary of ICI Ltd. (Imperial Chemical Industries) of Britain.)

The gloss level of the paint is one factor in determining how well it hides an underlying colour. All other factors being equal, the glossier a paint is, the easier it is to clean with simple wiping, but the less well it will hide an underlying colour.

The reason for that is quite simple. Paints contain "extender pigments" which are huge rocks almost large enough to see with the naked eye. Were it not for extender pigments, all paints would dry to a high gloss. These extender pigments are either white, clear or transluscent, but don't have any other colour to them so as not to affect the colour of the paint. And so, the reason why flatter paints hide better is exactly the same reason why water is clear, but a cloud is opaque. The extender pigments added to lower the gloss level of the paint reflect and refract incident light, thereby scattering the light and making the paint more opaque (or more difficult to see through).

A second factor is the amount of titanium dioxide in the paint. When lead carbonate was banned as the high hiding white pigment in architectural paints in the mid-1970's, it was replaced with titanium dioxide. Unfortunately, titanium dioxide is one of the more expensive pigments used in paints, and so the more titanium dioxide you put in a gallon of paint to obtain better hide, the more you have to charge for that gallon to make a profit.

Aside: (Exterior paints will most often use zinc oxide as the white pigment because:
a) titanium dioxide acts as a catalyst by which paints chaulk when exposed to intense sunlight, and so an exterior paint with lotsa titanium dioxide will chaulk more than a paint with little to no titanium dioxide, and
b) zinc, like copper, arsenic and boron, is a natural biocide, so the zinc oxide in exterior paints helps to prevent mold and fungi growing on the paint in continuously shaded and damp areas.)

A third factor is the colour of your paint. Basically, wood stains get their colour from dyes, whereas paints get their colour from solid coloured particles called "pigments". (You will never find dye in a paint.) There are two kinds of pigments; organic and inorganic.

ORGANIC pigments are best thought of as the "colourwheel" colours. They consist of different kinds of yellows, reds, blues and greens, and all the colours you can make by mixing those primary colours, like orange, purple, magenta, etc. Organic pigments tend to have low opacity (they look like little pieces of coloured glass under a microscope) but they disperse well, and that high dispersion helps increase the opacity of the paint.

INORGANIC pigments are best thought of as coloured rocks. They're the synthetic equivalent of the coloured rocks that artists like DaVince and Michaelangelo have ground into fine powders to make their paints from for centuries. The inorganic pigments in a paint tinting machine will be:
Black - which is actually soot made by burning natural gas in special ovens with insufficient air so that copious amounts of soot are formed.
White - which nowadays is titanium dioxide, the most expensive pigment commonly used in house paints. There are two different kinds of titanium dioxide; rutile and anatase, but quality paints and primers will use the rutile form because it's refractive index is higher, providing for better hide.
Yellow Oxide - which is a mustard yellow iron oxide that is the synthetic equivalent of the rocks found in the Italian town of Sienna, from which the natural pigment "Sienna" gets it's name.
Red Oxide - which is reddish brown in colour and is the most common form of iron oxide.
Brown Oxide - which is chocolate brown in colour, and
Raw Umber - which is a very dark brown that could almost be mistaken for black.

ALL of the these inorganic pigments provide great hide, but they have a propensity to clump together, and that clumping together of these inorganic pigments acts to diminish the hide of the paint. In general tho, paints with lots of inorganic pigments tend to hide better than paints with lots of organic pigments in them. Since inorganic pigments are the synthetic equivalent of natural rocks, paints tinted with inorganic pigments fade very much less due to exposure to the Sun than paints tinted with organic pigments.

Home Depot is not the place to buy quality paints. Even if you buy a gallon of Rolf Lauren for $55 a gallon, they'll still tint it with the same colourants they use to tint their $18 per gallon Behr Eggshell "Enamel". I think that if you had purchased any paint company's top-of-the-line paint, you would have paid more, but you would have gotten a lot more titanium dioxide white pigment in your paint for better hide.

Next time try Benjamin Moore Aura or any of their "Regal" line of paints which include Aqua Velvet and Aqua Pearl. I use Pratt & Lambert Accolade paints in my building, and I've never been disappointed enough in it to go shopping for a better paint. I've heard good things about Sherwin Williams SuperPaint and their Duration exterior paints. While it's true that you get what you pay for when it comes to buying paint, it's also true that you don't always need everything you get. When I repaint one of my apartments, I'm repainting it the same colour as it was before, and so why do I need a high hiding paint?

A flatter paint that called mostly for inorganic pigments in it's tint formula would have hidden better than the one you bought. Finally, tinting your primer with a light absorbing pigment like black or Raw Umber will help a lot in hiding the underlying colour.

On Sep 4, 10:54*pm, nestork wrote:
;2922280 Wrote:

I spent a fortune on Home depot topof the line Latex. I primed the bare
wood with primer and the it basically too 3 or 4 coats to cover. The
color is white.
I don't know what's wrong with Latex paint these days. I remember when
Latex fist came out in the early 1960's. My father bought Dupont Lucite
Latex and he never had a coverage problem. The crap they have today is
like water.

There are quite a number of factors that affect the hide of a latex
paint, and I'll explain each of them:

(First off, tho, DuPont makes some vinyl acrylic resins, but so far as I
know, DuPont never marketed a latex paint under their own name. *The
very first latex paints to be marketed in North America was Glidden's
"Dulux" paint that was introduced in 1959. *Glidden is a subsidiary of
ICI Ltd. *(Imperial Chemical Industries) of Britain.)

The gloss level of the paint is one factor in determining how well it
hides an underlying colour. *All other factors being equal, the glossier
a paint is, the easier it is to clean with simple wiping, but the less
well it will hide an underlying colour.

The reason for that is quite simple. *Paints contain "extender pigments"
which are huge rocks almost large enough to see with the naked eye.
Were it not for extender pigments, all paints would dry to a high gloss.
These extender pigments are either white, clear or transluscent, but
don't have any other colour to them so as not to affect the colour of
the paint. *And so, the reason why flatter paints hide better is exactly
the same reason why water is clear, but a cloud is opaque. *The extender
pigments added to lower the gloss level of the paint reflect and refract
incident light, thereby scattering the light and making the paint more
opaque (or more difficult to see through).

A second factor is the amount of titanium dioxide in the paint. *When
lead carbonate was banned as the high hiding white pigment in
architectural paints in the mid-1970's, it was replaced with titanium
dioxide. *Unfortunately, titanium dioxide is one of the more expensive
pigments used in paints, and so the more titanium dioxide you put in a
gallon of paint to obtain better hide, the more you have to charge for
that gallon to make a profit.

Aside: (Exterior paints will most often use zinc oxide as the white
pigment because:
a) titanium dioxide acts as a catalyst by which paints chaulk when
exposed to intense sunlight, and so an exterior paint with lotsa
titanium dioxide will chaulk more than a paint with little to no
titanium dioxide, and
b) zinc, like copper, arsenic and boron, is a natural biocide, so the
zinc oxide in exterior paints helps to prevent mold and fungi growing on
the paint in continuously shaded and damp areas.)

A third factor is the colour of your paint. *Basically, wood stains get
their colour from dyes, whereas paints get their colour from solid
coloured particles called "pigments". *(You will never find dye in a
paint.) *There are two kinds of pigments; organic and inorganic.

ORGANIC pigments are best thought of as the "colourwheel" colours. *They
consist of different kinds of yellows, reds, blues and greens, and all
the colours you can make by mixing those primary colours, like orange,
purple, magenta, etc. *Organic pigments tend to have low opacity (they
look like little pieces of coloured glass under a microscope) but they
disperse well, and that high dispersion helps increase the opacity of
the paint.

INORGANIC pigments are best thought of as coloured rocks. *They're the
synthetic equivalent of the coloured rocks that artists like DaVince and
Michaelangelo have ground into fine powders to make their paints from
for centuries. *The inorganic pigments in a paint tinting machine will
be:
Black - which is actually soot made by burning natural gas in special
ovens with insufficient air so that copious amounts of soot are formed.
White - which nowadays is titanium dioxide, the most expensive pigment
commonly used in house paints. *There are two different kinds of
titanium dioxide; rutile and anatase, but quality paints and primers
will use the rutile form because it's refractive index is higher,
providing for better hide.
Yellow Oxide - which is a mustard yellow iron oxide that is the
synthetic equivalent of the rocks found in the Italian town of Sienna,
from which the natural pigment "Sienna" gets it's name.
Red Oxide - which is reddish brown in colour and is the most common form
of iron oxide.
Brown Oxide - which is chocolate brown in colour, and
Raw Umber - which is a very dark brown that could almost be mistaken for
black.

ALL of the these inorganic pigments provide great hide, but they have a
propensity to clump together, and that clumping together of these
inorganic pigments acts to diminish the hide of the paint. *In general
tho, paints with lots of inorganic pigments tend to hide better than
paints with lots of organic pigments in them. *Since inorganic pigments
are the synthetic equivalent of natural rocks, paints tinted with
inorganic pigments fade very much less due to exposure to the Sun than
paints tinted with organic pigments.

Home Depot is not the place to buy quality paints. *Even if you buy a
gallon of Rolf Lauren for $55 a gallon, they'll still tint it with the
same colourants they use to tint their $18 per gallon Behr Eggshell
"Enamel". * I think that if you had purchased any paint company's
top-of-the-line paint, you would have paid more, but you would have
gotten a lot more titanium dioxide white pigment in your paint for
better hide.

Next time try Benjamin Moore Aura or any of their "Regal" line of paints
which include Aqua Velvet and Aqua Pearl. *I use Pratt & Lambert
Accolade paints in my building, and I've never been disappointed enough
in it to go shopping for a better paint. *I've heard good things about
Sherwin Williams SuperPaint and their Duration exterior paints. *While
it's true that you get what you pay for when it comes to buying paint,
it's also true that you don't always need everything you get. *When I
repaint one of my apartments, I'm repainting it the same colour as it
was before, and so why do I need a high hiding paint?

A flatter paint that called mostly for inorganic pigments in it's tint
formula would have hidden better than the one you bought. *Finally,
tinting your primer with a light absorbing pigment like black or Raw
Umber will help a lot in hiding the underlying colour.

--
nestork

Wow - Everything I ever wanted to know about paints and more.

I thought the Behr line of paints had high ratings from Consumer
Reports.

wrote:
I spent a fortune on Home depot topof the line Latex. I primed the
bare wood with primer and the it basically too 3 or 4 coats to cover.
The color is white.
I don't know what's wrong with Latex paint these days. I remember
when Latex fist came out in the early 1960's. My father bought Dupont
Lucite Latex and he never had a coverage problem. The crap they have
today is like water.

In addition to nestork's post - an excellent, informative one, BTW - it
sounds as if you were skimpy with the paint or possibly with both primer and
paint, .

It really helps to have primer tinted toward the top color but in your case
there was no need. Is your complaint that you needed multiple coats to
cover the primer? The primer completely hid the surface?

How did you apply the paint? Brush? Roller? Spray? In any case, one
needs a liberal application but not so liberal that it runs.

With a roller, apply the paint in a 2' - 3' area in the form of a large "M"
or "W" and roll that area in all directions...updown...sideside...both
diagonals. Feather out to adjacent areas.

If spraying it may need to be rolled after spraying depending on surface
roughness.

If by brush, it needs to be applied fully but with a pressure light enough
so that the bristles don't deform the paint to the point it can't flow
together.

Finally, latex - ANY latex - sucks on wood. IMO, YMMV.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

Winters getting colder? Tired of the rat race?
Maybe just ready for a change? Check it out...
http://www.floridaloghouse.net

On Wed, 5 Sep 2012 07:02:39 -0700 (PDT), "hr(bob) "
wrote:

I thought the Behr line of paints had high ratings from Consumer
Reports.

I've painted four homes with it for myself (interior) and other jobs
(condo). Used it for exterior stucco (elastomeric) and fascia trim
(acrylic latex) over two coats of primer. All in the desert. Never a
problem, brushing, rollers or spraying.

After the store shakes the can I also mix it more with a paddle and
drill. Also it is good to stir the paints during painting. (add
floetrol paint additive for trim) Then I strain the paint through a
mesh bag. Never a problem with Behr.

wrote in message
...

I spent a fortune on Home depot topof the line Latex. I primed the bare wood
with primer and the it basically too 3 or 4 coats to cover. The color is
white.
I don't know what's wrong with Latex paint these days. I remember when Latex
fist came out in the early 1960's. My father bought Dupont Lucite Latex and
he never had a coverage problem. The crap they have today is like water.

Use Sherwin Williams best paint And you will not need to repaint again. I
have had excellent results with it. WW

On 09/04/12 11:54 pm, nestork wrote:

I spent a fortune on Home depot topof the line Latex. I primed the bare
wood with primer and the it basically too 3 or 4 coats to cover. The
color is white.
I don't know what's wrong with Latex paint these days. I remember when
Latex fist came out in the early 1960's. My father bought Dupont Lucite
Latex and he never had a coverage problem. The crap they have today is
like water.

There are quite a number of factors that affect the hide of a latex
paint, and I'll explain each of them:

Home Depot is not the place to buy quality paints. Even if you buy a
gallon of Rolf Lauren for $55 a gallon, they'll still tint it with the
same colourants they use to tint their $18 per gallon Behr Eggshell
"Enamel". I think that if you had purchased any paint company's
top-of-the-line paint, you would have paid more, but you would have
gotten a lot more titanium dioxide white pigment in your paint for
better hide.

In addition to HD and Lowe's, we have in this area the Menard's chain
(based in Wisconsin). When I was having some paint shaken up there
recently, I asked about the pigments, and they told me that the same
pigments are used for all the paints they sell -- mainly "Dutch Boy" and
a few different lines from Pittsburgh Paints.

Next time try Benjamin Moore Aura or any of their "Regal" line of paints
which include Aqua Velvet and Aqua Pearl.

A few years ago I tried to buy Benjamin Moore exterior paint around
here. According to the Web site, it is sold at Ace Hardware, but the
nearest Ace to me did not sell BM at all, and the next-nearest one had
it only in gallon cans, which was an expensive way to buy it and would
have taken a lot of boxing. In a specialist paint store I found color
cards for BM exterior paints with the store's sticker on the back, but
when I asked the price they said, "We don't sell their exterior paints."

Perce

On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 08:43:50 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Wed, 5 Sep 2012 07:02:39 -0700 (PDT), "hr(bob) "
wrote:

I thought the Behr line of paints had high ratings from Consumer
Reports.

I've painted four homes with it for myself (interior) and other jobs
(condo). Used it for exterior stucco (elastomeric) and fascia trim
(acrylic latex) over two coats of primer. All in the desert. Never a
problem, brushing, rollers or spraying.

After the store shakes the can I also mix it more with a paddle and
drill. Also it is good to stir the paints during painting. (add
floetrol paint additive for trim) Then I strain the paint through a
mesh bag. Never a problem with Behr.

I just used Behr on the inside of my garage. The only thing I didn't like
about it is that it tears easily. When I pulled off the masking tape around
the outlets and such, it wanted to tear. It's like it didn't want to stick to
the walls. I'll stick with Benjamin Moore.

On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 12:27:46 -0400, "
wrote:

On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 08:43:50 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Wed, 5 Sep 2012 07:02:39 -0700 (PDT), "hr(bob) "
wrote:

I thought the Behr line of paints had high ratings from Consumer
Reports.

I've painted four homes with it for myself (interior) and other jobs
(condo). Used it for exterior stucco (elastomeric) and fascia trim
(acrylic latex) over two coats of primer. All in the desert. Never a
problem, brushing, rollers or spraying.

After the store shakes the can I also mix it more with a paddle and
drill. Also it is good to stir the paints during painting. (add
floetrol paint additive for trim) Then I strain the paint through a
mesh bag. Never a problem with Behr.

I just used Behr on the inside of my garage. The only thing I didn't like
about it is that it tears easily. When I pulled off the masking tape around
the outlets and such, it wanted to tear. It's like it didn't want to stick to
the walls. I'll stick with Benjamin Moore.

Blue painter's tape? I've not had that problem, but I always remove
face plates to paint instead of masking around them. Seems faster to
me and cost nothing but a little effort.

My bride did paint a garage man door in the garage. It pulled away
around where the weather strip made contact. Likely not cured enough
to prevent peeling.

On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 09:43:28 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 12:27:46 -0400, "
wrote:

On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 08:43:50 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Wed, 5 Sep 2012 07:02:39 -0700 (PDT), "hr(bob) "
wrote:

I thought the Behr line of paints had high ratings from Consumer
Reports.

I've painted four homes with it for myself (interior) and other jobs
(condo). Used it for exterior stucco (elastomeric) and fascia trim
(acrylic latex) over two coats of primer. All in the desert. Never a
problem, brushing, rollers or spraying.

After the store shakes the can I also mix it more with a paddle and
drill. Also it is good to stir the paints during painting. (add
floetrol paint additive for trim) Then I strain the paint through a
mesh bag. Never a problem with Behr.

I just used Behr on the inside of my garage. The only thing I didn't like
about it is that it tears easily. When I pulled off the masking tape around
the outlets and such, it wanted to tear. It's like it didn't want to stick to
the walls. I'll stick with Benjamin Moore.

Blue painter's tape?

Yep.

I've not had that problem, but I always remove
face plates to paint instead of masking around them. Seems faster to
me and cost nothing but a little effort.

I use the tape to cover the outlets themselves, after the cover is removed. In
a few places the tape touched the paint. The other places that proved
problematic were the woodwork around the doors and windows. It was just the
garage so it didn't bother me that much but I would have been seriously ****ed
if it were the living room.

My bride did paint a garage man door in the garage. It pulled away
around where the weather strip made contact. Likely not cured enough
to prevent peeling.

I try to get making tape off the same day but some of this was a few days
later. It didn't seem to matter.

On 9/4/2012 11:54 PM, nestork wrote:
;2922280 Wrote:
I spent a fortune on Home depot topof the line Latex. I primed the bare
wood with primer and the it basically too 3 or 4 coats to cover. The
color is white.
I don't know what's wrong with Latex paint these days. I remember when
Latex fist came out in the early 1960's. My father bought Dupont Lucite
Latex and he never had a coverage problem. The crap they have today is
like water.

There are quite a number of factors that affect the hide of a latex
paint, and I'll explain each of them:

(First off, tho, DuPont makes some vinyl acrylic resins, but so far as I
know, DuPont never marketed a latex paint under their own name. The
very first latex paints to be marketed in North America was Glidden's
"Dulux" paint that was introduced in 1959. Glidden is a subsidiary of
ICI Ltd. (Imperial Chemical Industries) of Britain.)

The gloss level of the paint is one factor in determining how well it
hides an underlying colour. All other factors being equal, the glossier
a paint is, the easier it is to clean with simple wiping, but the less
well it will hide an underlying colour.

The reason for that is quite simple. Paints contain "extender pigments"
which are huge rocks almost large enough to see with the naked eye.
Were it not for extender pigments, all paints would dry to a high gloss.
These extender pigments are either white, clear or transluscent, but
don't have any other colour to them so as not to affect the colour of
the paint. And so, the reason why flatter paints hide better is exactly
the same reason why water is clear, but a cloud is opaque. The extender
pigments added to lower the gloss level of the paint reflect and refract
incident light, thereby scattering the light and making the paint more
opaque (or more difficult to see through).

A second factor is the amount of titanium dioxide in the paint. When
lead carbonate was banned as the high hiding white pigment in
architectural paints in the mid-1970's, it was replaced with titanium
dioxide. Unfortunately, titanium dioxide is one of the more expensive
pigments used in paints, and so the more titanium dioxide you put in a
gallon of paint to obtain better hide, the more you have to charge for
that gallon to make a profit.

Aside: (Exterior paints will most often use zinc oxide as the white
pigment because:
a) titanium dioxide acts as a catalyst by which paints chaulk when
exposed to intense sunlight, and so an exterior paint with lotsa
titanium dioxide will chaulk more than a paint with little to no
titanium dioxide, and
b) zinc, like copper, arsenic and boron, is a natural biocide, so the
zinc oxide in exterior paints helps to prevent mold and fungi growing on
the paint in continuously shaded and damp areas.)

A third factor is the colour of your paint. Basically, wood stains get
their colour from dyes, whereas paints get their colour from solid
coloured particles called "pigments". (You will never find dye in a
paint.) There are two kinds of pigments; organic and inorganic.

ORGANIC pigments are best thought of as the "colourwheel" colours. They
consist of different kinds of yellows, reds, blues and greens, and all
the colours you can make by mixing those primary colours, like orange,
purple, magenta, etc. Organic pigments tend to have low opacity (they
look like little pieces of coloured glass under a microscope) but they
disperse well, and that high dispersion helps increase the opacity of
the paint.

INORGANIC pigments are best thought of as coloured rocks. They're the
synthetic equivalent of the coloured rocks that artists like DaVince and
Michaelangelo have ground into fine powders to make their paints from
for centuries. The inorganic pigments in a paint tinting machine will
be:
Black - which is actually soot made by burning natural gas in special
ovens with insufficient air so that copious amounts of soot are formed.
White - which nowadays is titanium dioxide, the most expensive pigment
commonly used in house paints. There are two different kinds of
titanium dioxide; rutile and anatase, but quality paints and primers
will use the rutile form because it's refractive index is higher,
providing for better hide.
Yellow Oxide - which is a mustard yellow iron oxide that is the
synthetic equivalent of the rocks found in the Italian town of Sienna,
from which the natural pigment "Sienna" gets it's name.
Red Oxide - which is reddish brown in colour and is the most common form
of iron oxide.
Brown Oxide - which is chocolate brown in colour, and
Raw Umber - which is a very dark brown that could almost be mistaken for
black.

ALL of the these inorganic pigments provide great hide, but they have a
propensity to clump together, and that clumping together of these
inorganic pigments acts to diminish the hide of the paint. In general
tho, paints with lots of inorganic pigments tend to hide better than
paints with lots of organic pigments in them. Since inorganic pigments
are the synthetic equivalent of natural rocks, paints tinted with
inorganic pigments fade very much less due to exposure to the Sun than
paints tinted with organic pigments.

Home Depot is not the place to buy quality paints. Even if you buy a
gallon of Rolf Lauren for $55 a gallon, they'll still tint it with the
same colourants they use to tint their $18 per gallon Behr Eggshell
"Enamel". I think that if you had purchased any paint company's
top-of-the-line paint, you would have paid more, but you would have
gotten a lot more titanium dioxide white pigment in your paint for
better hide.

Next time try Benjamin Moore Aura or any of their "Regal" line of paints
which include Aqua Velvet and Aqua Pearl. I use Pratt & Lambert
Accolade paints in my building, and I've never been disappointed enough
in it to go shopping for a better paint. I've heard good things about
Sherwin Williams SuperPaint and their Duration exterior paints. While
it's true that you get what you pay for when it comes to buying paint,
it's also true that you don't always need everything you get. When I
repaint one of my apartments, I'm repainting it the same colour as it
was before, and so why do I need a high hiding paint?

A flatter paint that called mostly for inorganic pigments in it's tint
formula would have hidden better than the one you bought. Finally,
tinting your primer with a light absorbing pigment like black or Raw
Umber will help a lot in hiding the underlying colour.





DuPont made consumer paints, Duco and Dulux but sold the business
several years ago. They are now selling their automotive finishes
business and will be out of the paint business. They still make the
polymers and pigments that go into paints.

Titanium dioxide is only about a dollar a pound and there was an obvious
deficiency of it in the op's paint. Been a while since I bought a 2
gallon pail of Behr ceiling paint but it did not have this problem.
Cheap paints have less pigment in them and require more coats to cover.

On 9/4/2012 8:53 PM, wrote:
I spent a fortune on Home depot topof the line Latex. I primed the bare wood with primer and the it basically too 3 or 4 coats to cover. The color is white.
I don't know what's wrong with Latex paint these days. I remember when Latex fist came out in the early 1960's. My father bought Dupont Lucite Latex and he never had a coverage problem. The crap they have today is like water.



Sometimes it just pays to spend less at a real paint store. I have
always had good results with Sherwin Williams paints.

An example, we had some remodeling work done needed to paint new
drywall. We used Sherwin Williams promar xxx drywall primer. It covered
so well with one coat that people thought it was the finished job. We
had a little left to do and ran out so I went to HD and bought their
best quality drywall primer. The coverage was no where near as good and
it cost more than Sherwin Williams.

Consumer Reports regularily rates Behr as a "Best Buy", but that's not because it's an excellent paint, it's just because it's probably the best paint you can buy for $18 per gallon.

You'll notice that most hardware store chain paints (like Lowe's "American Tradition" paint, Ace Hardware's "Beautitone" paints and the Behr paint sold at Home Depot all tend to get high ratings on Consumer Reports, and the reason is simple:

Whan a chain of hardware stores decides to sell their own brand of in-house paints, the approach a variety of paint companies to supply them with paint.

Now, a gallon of paint can cost anywhere from $10 to $40 to make, and so someone has to decide what level of quality the paint should be. The hardware store chain looks at it's customer profile and gets customers to fill out questionaires, and in the end figures most of it's customers want a "Buick" quality paint instead of a "Cadillac" or a "Rolls Royce" or a "Lada" paint. And, they figure each of their 1700 stores across North America will sell 30 gallons of paint per day on average.

So, the hardware store chain asks a half dozen paint companies to quote them a price for a upper mid-level quality paint that'll cost $20 (say) per gallon to make, and sell for $32 (say). Each paint company sharpens it's pencils and figures out what binder resin, pigments and additives package they can put in the gallon and still meet that $20 per gallon cost to make.

But, when they start working out the cost to supply 1.5 million gallons of paint per month, all of the price breaks that arise from buying the materials in large quantities figure into the math and end up going into the paint as a better quality binder resin, better quality pigments and/or better additives to make the paint spatter less, spread more smoothly, dry harder, last longer in storage, not be damaged if it freezes, etc.

That is, the volume discount that normally goes to the store chain for buying in large quanitity ends up going into the paint as better quality materials cuz the cost of manufacture has already been established.

And, this is the reason why the in-house paints sold by the big chain stores in the USA like Home Depot, Lowes, Menards, Sears, etc. typically get high ratings from Consumer Reports.

That doesn't mean they're the best paints you can get, it means they're better than one would expect FOR WHAT THEY COST.

And, now you know why.

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 08:43:50 -0700, Oren wrote:
I just used Behr on the inside of my garage. The only thing I didn't
like
about it is that it tears easily. When I pulled off the masking tape
around
the outlets and such, it wanted to tear. It's like it didn't want to
stick to
the walls. I'll stick with Benjamin Moore.

I've always sworn to use BM, now I'm swearing at them!

BJ changed their formulas. It's more watery now, and @ $56 a gallon, I
expect better. Really disappointed in their interior line.

I did happen to find an Ace, which still happen to have 13 gallons of the
old formula latex exterior stain. I purchased every bit of it for my pad @
$14 per gallon. Feel I got a steal!

Onclipped
I try to get making tape off the same day but some of this was a few days
later. It didn't seem to matter.

I always remove tape as soon as I paint the area (before it
sets)....have to mash down on the edge so paint doesn't seep under the
edge. If tape is left on, esp. with latex paint, and the paint laps the
tape a little bit, the tape can pull of a chunk of the paint film. I
hate prep, but I am obsessive about doing it. When I do 2 coats (don't
recall the last time I tried "one coat" paint), I wait 2 or three days,
retape, repeat. The only positive is that I buy good paint and don't
paint every 2 or 3 years to change color ) I do kit. and baths, wood
trim, doors with BM alkyd semi; wouldn't use anything else.

On Wed, 5 Sep 2012 17:46:42 +0000, nestork
wrote:

And, this is the reason why the in-house paints sold by the big chain
stores in the USA like Home Depot, Lowes, Menards, Sears, etc.
typically get high ratings from Consumer Reports.

That doesn't mean they're the best paints you can get, it means they're
better than one would expect FOR WHAT THEY COST.

And, now you know why.


Those same stores will never tell the customer that 90% of a pant job
is preparation. Painting is the easy part. They sell what the
customer wants in a hurried up fashion. Even with some preparation,
less expensive paint can look good if done properly when getting ready
to paint, depending on the demand of what looks good.

We don't know what the OP did in his case or how he approached his
task.

On Sep 5, 9:43*am, Oren wrote:
On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 12:27:46 -0400, "





wrote:
On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 08:43:50 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Wed, 5 Sep 2012 07:02:39 -0700 (PDT), "hr(bob) "
wrote:

I thought the Behr line of paints had high ratings from Consumer
Reports.

I've painted four homes with it for myself (interior) and other jobs
(condo). *Used it for exterior stucco (elastomeric) and fascia trim
(acrylic latex) over two coats of primer. *All in the desert. *Never a
problem, brushing, rollers or spraying.

After the store shakes the can I also mix it more with a paddle and
drill. Also it is good to stir the paints during painting. (add
floetrol paint additive for trim) * Then I strain the paint through a
mesh bag. *Never a problem with Behr.

I just used Behr on the inside of my garage. *The only thing I didn't like
about it is that it tears easily. *When I pulled off the masking tape around
the outlets and such, it wanted to tear. *It's like it didn't want to stick to
the walls. *I'll stick with Benjamin Moore.

Blue painter's tape? *I've not had that problem, but I always remove
face plates to paint instead of masking around them. Seems faster to
me and cost nothing but a little effort.

My bride did paint a garage man door in the garage. *It pulled away
around where the weather strip made contact. *Likely not cured enough
to prevent peeling.

I used to work for a professional house painter. He said to close the
window [everything was a sash window then] don't let the paint dry,
open the window and operate it BEFORE the paint has a chance to dry,
else it sticks and you have horrible problems.

My father used to paint, then use a razor to cut a straight line THEN
open the window or door.

Of the two, the wet works seemed to make a better looking solution.

On Wed, 5 Sep 2012 14:26:46 -0700 (PDT), Robert Macy
wrote:

I used to work for a professional house painter. He said to close the
window [everything was a sash window then] don't let the paint dry,
open the window and operate it BEFORE the paint has a chance to dry,
else it sticks and you have horrible problems.

My father used to paint, then use a razor to cut a straight line THEN
open the window or door.

Of the two, the wet works seemed to make a better looking solution.

After I quit working for a living I worked for a contractor a couple
of years, from back east. He could paint without using masking tape.
It takes awhile to learn this method, but he was dang good at it. He
could lay down a straight line with his loaded brush. I still try to
practice what he taught me. It is simple when you learn it...

Yes, but the writing is on the wall.

Alkyd paints are going the way of the dinosaur. Most conventional alkyd wall and floor paints are already off the market here in Canada as of September 1, 2012. The only conventional alkyd paints still available for sale are high gloss alkyds meant for use over metals.

Yes, you can buy a high gloss alkyd and use it on a wall or ceiling, but the problems is that you then have to scuff sand the walls and ceilings to roughen the paint when it comes time to repaint, and so that takes all the fun out of cheating the Govmint.

But, I agree with you. I like alkyd paints more than latex paints. They have a much more robust film formation mechanism and they dry to harder and more protective films.

But, you should start deciding what you're going to do once your government takes alkyd paints off the market, too. If I were you, I would check out a paint called "Monamel" marketed by the Comex Group which includes:
a) Color Wheel Paint
b) Frazee Paint
c) General Paint (if you live in Canada)
d) Kwal Paint, and
e) Parker Paint

If you recognize any of those names as operating in your area, pay them a visit with a handful of Q-tips and ask them to shake up a can of Monamel. Then use the Q-tips to apply some Monamel to a few samples of your BM semigloss alkyd paint to see how well it sticks.

Monamel will dry as quick as a latex paint, but then it'll take a week or two to cure and harden up. Monamel is actually a "hybrid" paint. It consists of alkyd resins suspended in water. So when you apply the stuff to the wall, what evaporates is H2O, but what remains on the wall are alkyd resins just like you'd painted with an alkyd paint. And, cuz those alkyds come suspended in water, cleaning up Monamel is no different than cleaning up after using any latex paint. Monamel is quickly becoming my favourite paint.

If it does stick, then if I wuz you, I'd buy it in a flat or eggshell gloss instead of a semi-gloss. That way, each coat of paint dries rough enough that you don't need to do any sanding to get the new paint to stick well to the old paint. And, there's no need to purchase semi-gloss paints for easy cleaning any more since Magic Erasers (pronounced: BASF "Basotect" foam) make for easy cleaning of all paints, including flat and eggshell.

On 09/05/2012 01:29 PM, Oren wrote:
On Wed, 5 Sep 2012 17:46:42 +0000, nestork
wrote:

And, this is the reason why the in-house paints sold by the big chain
stores in the USA like Home Depot, Lowes, Menards, Sears, etc.
typically get high ratings from Consumer Reports.

That doesn't mean they're the best paints you can get, it means they're
better than one would expect FOR WHAT THEY COST.

And, now you know why.


Those same stores will never tell the customer that 90% of a pant job
is preparation. Painting is the easy part. They sell what the
customer wants in a hurried up fashion. Even with some preparation,
less expensive paint can look good if done properly when getting ready
to paint, depending on the demand of what looks good.

We don't know what the OP did in his case or how he approached his
task.

When I consider the amount of labor that goes into doing a paint job,
buying a high-quality paint doesn't seem so expensive any more.

I guess if a person is a landlord, and needs to repaint frequently, a
cheaper paint might be a better overall bargain, but not on my house.

Jon

On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 15:43:01 -0400, Norminn wrote:

Onclipped
I try to get making tape off the same day but some of this was a few days
later. It didn't seem to matter.

I always remove tape as soon as I paint the area (before it
sets)....have to mash down on the edge so paint doesn't seep under the
edge. If tape is left on, esp. with latex paint, and the paint laps the
tape a little bit, the tape can pull of a chunk of the paint film.

I generally wait until the paint is set so I don't smear it. But the Behr
acted much differently than other paints I've used. It was like a film, that
really didn't want to stick to the wall. Sorta like Scotch tape that lost
much of its sticky.

I hate prep, but I am obsessive about doing it. When I do 2 coats (don't
recall the last time I tried "one coat" paint), I wait 2 or three days,
retape, repeat. The only positive is that I buy good paint and don't
paint every 2 or 3 years to change color ) I do kit. and baths, wood
trim, doors with BM alkyd semi; wouldn't use anything else.

The second coat, when using latex, is supposed to either be applied within 24
hours, before it's really started curing, or after 30 days, when it's
completely cured. Between can cause adhesion problems.

On Wed, 05 Sep 2012 15:21:04 -0700, Jon Danniken
wrote:

On 09/05/2012 01:29 PM, Oren wrote:
On Wed, 5 Sep 2012 17:46:42 +0000, nestork
wrote:

And, this is the reason why the in-house paints sold by the big chain
stores in the USA like Home Depot, Lowes, Menards, Sears, etc.
typically get high ratings from Consumer Reports.

That doesn't mean they're the best paints you can get, it means they're
better than one would expect FOR WHAT THEY COST.

And, now you know why.


Those same stores will never tell the customer that 90% of a pant job
is preparation. Painting is the easy part. They sell what the
customer wants in a hurried up fashion. Even with some preparation,
less expensive paint can look good if done properly when getting ready
to paint, depending on the demand of what looks good.

We don't know what the OP did in his case or how he approached his
task.

When I consider the amount of labor that goes into doing a paint job,
buying a high-quality paint doesn't seem so expensive any more.

+1

I guess if a person is a landlord, and needs to repaint frequently, a
cheaper paint might be a better overall bargain, but not on my house.

Cheaper paints are more work, though. As you hint above, time is money.

On Wed, 5 Sep 2012 17:46:42 +0000, nestork
wrote:


I thought the Behr line of paints had high ratings from Consumer
Reports.

Consumer Reports regularily rates Behr as a "Best Buy", but that's not
because it's an excellent paint, it's just because it's probably the
best paint you can buy for $18 per gallon.


I've taken issue with CR recommendations too often and have not read
it for many years. Things they found problematic, I found to be
features.

Oren wrote:
On Wed, 5 Sep 2012 07:02:39 -0700 (PDT), "hr(bob) "
wrote:

I thought the Behr line of paints had high ratings from Consumer
Reports.

I've painted four homes with it for myself (interior) and other jobs
(condo). Used it for exterior stucco (elastomeric) and fascia trim
(acrylic latex) over two coats of primer. All in the desert. Never a
problem, brushing, rollers or spraying.

After the store shakes the can I also mix it more with a paddle and
drill. Also it is good to stir the paints during painting. (add
floetrol paint additive for trim) Then I strain the paint through a
mesh bag. Never a problem with Behr.

Last batch I ordered the paint with the primer included in the paint. Costs
more, but I got away with one good coat with the roller. Never did that
before on interior walls. Glidden started adding the primer and also jacked
up prices.

Greg

Repaint, and thin no more.
(punch line from a VERY old joke.)

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

"WW" wrote in message
...

Use Sherwin Williams best paint And you will not need to repaint again. I
have had excellent results with it. WW

replying to finite.guy , Albert wrote:
finite.guy wrote:

I spent a fortune on Home depot topof the line Latex. I primed the bare
wood
with primer and the it basically too 3 or 4 coats to cover. The color is
white.
I don't know what's wrong with Latex paint these days. I remember when
Latex
fist came out in the early 1960's. My father bought Dupont Lucite Latex and
he
never had a coverage problem. The crap they have today is like water.



White is a helluva color to get to cover properly . Last spring I used
three different high- end whites on one interior job trying to get
coverage in 2 coats -Behr ( Home Depot ), Private Estates from General
paints , and a Benjamin Moore product ( not Aura ) ...two of them WITH a
white latex primer first . In every case , including the primed walls , it
took 3-4 coats of product . I knew it would be an issue ...but didn't
expect it to be this much of one . Luckily I charged by the hour and
didn't quote first.


--

Yep. The whole world is going down the ********.
Includin' the goddamned paint these days.
The main problem comes by way of these nature preservin' lovers who claim
everything is poison to the environment. When will these dummies simply
accept the fact that humankind use this planet as both a breeding ground and
an outdoor splat toilet?

Discuss....................

You say it took 4 coats but you didn't say what
color was on the walls originally. I can't remember
the last time I needed more than 2 coats. I think
it was with K-Mart paint some years ago, painting
off-white over avocado.

I normally use Benjamin Moore non-Aura (and
non-"select" if I can get it) or Sherwin Williams. I
like Pratt and Lambert better, but I can no longer
get that.

Home Depot is not a paint store. Even if they carry
a name brand there's a good chance it won't be the
same product or even the same product code that
other stores sell. They'll use their clout to bargain for
a good deal.
In short, if you want good paint then go to a paint
store and don't expect it to be a cheap as Home
Depot.
Also, thinning paint for poor coverage is a good way
for paint companies to save money. More coverage means
more solids. Titanium dioxide is not cheap.

On the other hand, I used some Behr wall paint
recently because someone else bought it. It was
supposed to be eggshell but it wasn't. It was much
too glossy. It was also drippy, like oil paint. Very
odd. Yet the coverage was surprisingly good (painting
sky blue over off-white) and it settled down nicely. It
covered in two coats. Two weeks ago I repainted
that same wall with BM's Linen White matte. Again
two coats. Again total coverage. I can't imagine what
you're doing that it takes you 4 coats + primer to
cover a wall.

replying to Mayayana , Albert wrote:
mayayana wrote:

You say it took 4 coats but you didn't say what
color was on the walls originally.

The original colour was a beige /tan . And yes .......3coats WITH a latex
primer when I used Behr and Private Estates ( GP ). Aura is the only paint
I'd trust if I needed to use white again ...and even then it would be 2
coats ...not the ONE they advertise .

--

| The original colour was a beige /tan . And yes .......3coats WITH a latex
| primer when I used Behr and Private Estates ( GP ). Aura is the only paint
| I'd trust if I needed to use white again ...and even then it would be 2
| coats ...not the ONE they advertise .
|

You said you'd used non-Aura, so I'm assuming
you have used Aura in the past. Were you running an
experiment this time? Why would you use 3 different
paints -- 2 of them cheap brands -- on one project?
And why would you put primer over a beige painted
wall to cover with white? Primer is for unpainted
surfaces, or as a covering flat coat when painting
a bright color that has low opacity. White paint has
high opacity. There's no point in using primer. (In fact,
the newer BM waterborne paints claim to be "self-priming"
even over plaster or joint compound.)

I tried Aura once and now avoid it. First, it's grossly
overpriced, yet the paint stores push it because they
had to buy new, expensive tinting equipment to make
the paints with "waterborne" tint. (Presumably BM is
also pushing it. Berkshire Hathway bought BM. Maybe
Aura is Warren Buffet's bright idea to greatly increase
profits with no real change to the business.)

The one time I used Aura was in a bathroom. Blue-
green over white. Flat paint. It covered very well in
2 coats, despite going on thin. But the bathroom wall
had a couple of glossy drip marks that I couldn't get off.
With normal paint that wouldn't have been an issue, but
the Aura was so thin, and settled so flat, that the gloss
showed through when the wall was viewed at an angle
with light from the window washing across it, even after
2 coats! (So the opacity of coverage was good, but the
sheen coverage was very poor.)

If I were doing something like a museum wall, with
new, perfect plaster and very demanding lighting, then
I might use Aura. For most other uses, the subtle
stipple texture left by normal paint hides a lot of
imperfections while not being noticeable.

With coverage, in general, I've never needed to do more
than 2 coats in recent memory. Nor have I seen anything
cover in 1 coat. So opacity of coverage is simply not a
factor I consider. I always do 2 coats and that's always
sufficient. (That's assuming decent paint is used. Not Behr,
Glidden, or store brands.)

I try to go for the BM "classic" line when possible.
It's a bit cheaper, but I don't care about a dollar
here or there. I like it because it's thicker and has
more dependable coverage in terms of sheen. But
I've been gradually trying to switch over to Sherwin
Williams. After about 30 years of using BM I'm fed up
with their gradual degradation of quality while also
misleading their customers. Some of it is related to EPA
requirements, but they just haven't had the best
product for a long time. They're also very aggressive
about pushing their client stores not to sell other products.
(The BM stores that sell Cabot now hide the Cabot in
back.)

A good example of BM's dishonesty and downgrading
of product:

I used to always use BM Satin Impervo oil on interior
trim. The product code for that was 235. With EPA regulations,
BM changed the formula without telling anyone. The new
code is C235, but the label is otherwise exactly the same.
C235 doesn't settle down properly and seems to be softer
than 235, which settled down with no discernible brush
marks. Then BM made yet another change when they
came up with a formula they could sell in all states in
gallons. The newest version is Z235. Still the exact same
label. Very different paint. Z235 is sort of like the old
exterior oil-base solid stain. It spatters easily due to lack
of cohesion, has almost no settling at all, and will peel
right off if used on a radiator. (It cost me a couple of
callbacks to find that out.)

Store clerks that I've dealt with for years were adamant
in telling me that 235, C235 and Z235 were not different
formulations. Awhile back I also ran into a BM salesman
at the local lumber yard. He also insisted there was
absolutely no difference and confronted me with a challenge
that if I didn't believe him then I must be calling him a liar.
Some salesman! Simply put, of course, he was lying. They
can't sell 235 or C235 in gallons due to EPA regulations, so
it's silly to claim that those products are the same as Z235.
But the salesman was really hoping I'd ignore my own
experience, despite that being bad for my business, and
believe his lie.

With wall paint there's not so much that they can
ruin, but they did manage to do it with Aura. (As I
said above, I thought Aura's opacity was good, but
since I still can't cover in 1 coat that does me no good,
and the sheen coverage is a problem.)

I recently did a job with Sherwin Williams wall paint.
(Duration matte.) I can't say that I thought it was
noticeably better than BM, but it was good.

For trim I still don't have a solution. I could drive to VT
and buy Pratt and Lambert Red Seal. That's the only
truly good trim paint I know of for interior that's still on
the market. But that's a bit farfetched. It would cost
about $100/gallon + gas and trip time.
I can use BM Advance, but it has poor coverage, it's
drippy and it ruins brushes. (The water cleanup isn't
really water cleanup.) Currently I'm using Sherwin
Williams Pro Classic waterborne alkyd for trim. It's not
bad and settles beautifully, but it's very thin; more like
a glaze than a paint... I'm afraid the paint technology is
just not keeping up with EPA requirements.

Mayayana wrote:
The original colour was a beige /tan . And yes .......3coats WITH a
latex primer when I used Behr and Private Estates ( GP ). Aura is
the only paint I'd trust if I needed to use white again ...and even
then it would be 2 coats ...not the ONE they advertise .


You said you'd used non-Aura, so I'm assuming
you have used Aura in the past. Were you running an
experiment this time? Why would you use 3 different
paints -- 2 of them cheap brands -- on one project?
big snip
I'm afraid the paint technology is
just not keeping up with EPA requirements.

My only recent experience with paint is using Doit Best "Best Look"
exterior paint/primer . It's made by Sherwin Williams , and I was very
pleased with the results (I got a gallon of pastel base for cheap because
the can was dented) . This paint is thick , and covers well in 2 coats on
bare and previously stain/varnished wood . We'll see how it lasts , I used
it to paint my bee hives , which will be out in the weather year round .

--
Snag

On Tuesday, March 10, 2015 at 9:45:36 AM UTC-4, Mayayana wrote:
| The original colour was a beige /tan . And yes .......3coats WITH a latex
| primer when I used Behr and Private Estates ( GP ). Aura is the only paint
| I'd trust if I needed to use white again ...and even then it would be 2
| coats ...not the ONE they advertise .
|

You said you'd used non-Aura, so I'm assuming
you have used Aura in the past. Were you running an
experiment this time? Why would you use 3 different
paints -- 2 of them cheap brands -- on one project?
And why would you put primer over a beige painted
wall to cover with white? Primer is for unpainted
surfaces, or as a covering flat coat when painting
a bright color that has low opacity. White paint has
high opacity. There's no point in using primer. (In fact,
the newer BM waterborne paints claim to be "self-priming"
even over plaster or joint compound.)


I agree. I don't see the need for primer there either.
Sounds like a total waste to me.


I tried Aura once and now avoid it. First, it's grossly
overpriced, yet the paint stores push it because they
had to buy new, expensive tinting equipment to make
the paints with "waterborne" tint. (Presumably BM is
also pushing it. Berkshire Hathway bought BM. Maybe
Aura is Warren Buffet's bright idea to greatly increase
profits with no real change to the business.)


I haven't used Aura, but BM regular latex is so mighty fine
that I can't imagine the Aura is worth the additional cost.
IDK what it could do that's better.


With coverage, in general, I've never needed to do more
than 2 coats in recent memory. Nor have I seen anything
cover in 1 coat. So opacity of coverage is simply not a
factor I consider. I always do 2 coats and that's always
sufficient. (That's assuming decent paint is used. Not Behr,
Glidden, or store brands.)


I'm using some Behr right now in an off white color that
has just the smallest hint of gray in it. I'm just starting,
so don't know how it's going to turn out. But I do know that
in Consumer Reports testing, Behr has come in near the top in
their ratings. I don't remember which specific type of paint
it was though.

I'm afraid the paint technology is just not keeping up with EPA
requirements.

Well, what do you expect? When the govt limits what you can use,
in many cases it will affect the product. A good example is clear
coat for stamped concrete. In many states you can't buy the solvent
based anymore. The acrylic stuff lasts maybe half as long.

| My only recent experience with paint is using Doit Best "Best Look"
| exterior paint/primer . It's made by Sherwin Williams , and I was very
| pleased with the results (I got a gallon of pastel base for cheap because
| the can was dented) . This paint is thick , and covers well in 2 coats on
| bare and previously stain/varnished wood . We'll see how it lasts , I used
| it to paint my bee hives , which will be out in the weather year round .
|

That's a tough one. I don't know what to use
outside anymore, either. The linseed oil primer is
still pretty good. Beyond that, there's no oil house
paint. The only solid oil stain I know of is Cabot's,
which seems to attract mildew. Latex stain has
no substance to it. Sherwin Williams and BM both
have an exterior oil paint sold in quarts, but neither
one seems to have the body that exterior oil paint
used to have.

Acrylic/latex is fine for siding, but for exposed sills,
decks, fences, etc I just don't know a good product.

Someone asked me last summer about painting a
fence. I suggested BM linseed oil primer followed by
water base solid stain. I figured the primer would seal
against moisture and the stain can be re-applied
like a whitewash as it wears. But it's an experiment.
I'll be curious to see how it wears after 3-4 years.

On Tuesday, March 10, 2015 at 2:12:52 PM UTC-4, Mayayana wrote:
| My only recent experience with paint is using Doit Best "Best Look"
| exterior paint/primer . It's made by Sherwin Williams , and I was very
| pleased with the results (I got a gallon of pastel base for cheap because
| the can was dented) . This paint is thick , and covers well in 2 coats on
| bare and previously stain/varnished wood . We'll see how it lasts , I used
| it to paint my bee hives , which will be out in the weather year round .
|

That's a tough one. I don't know what to use
outside anymore, either. The linseed oil primer is
still pretty good. Beyond that, there's no oil house
paint. The only solid oil stain I know of is Cabot's,
which seems to attract mildew. Latex stain has
no substance to it. Sherwin Williams and BM both
have an exterior oil paint sold in quarts, but neither
one seems to have the body that exterior oil paint
used to have.

Acrylic/latex is fine for siding, but for exposed sills,
decks, fences, etc I just don't know a good product.

Someone asked me last summer about painting a
fence. I suggested BM linseed oil primer followed by
water base solid stain. I figured the primer would seal
against moisture and the stain can be re-applied
like a whitewash as it wears. But it's an experiment.
I'll be curious to see how it wears after 3-4 years.

I don't know what the big problem is. I painted my house
10+ years ago with MBH solid stain. It worked fine and lasted
all those years. Just did it again with BM solid stain. Seems
like it's a great product, excellent covering. The least
weathered sections got coverage with just one coat. From
everything I've seen latex products have worked well outside
for decades and have only gotten better as the years go by.

On Tue, 10 Mar 2015 14:13:49 -0400, "Mayayana"
wrote:

| My only recent experience with paint is using Doit Best "Best Look"
| exterior paint/primer . It's made by Sherwin Williams , and I was very
| pleased with the results (I got a gallon of pastel base for cheap because
| the can was dented) . This paint is thick , and covers well in 2 coats on
| bare and previously stain/varnished wood . We'll see how it lasts , I used
| it to paint my bee hives , which will be out in the weather year round .
|

That's a tough one. I don't know what to use
outside anymore, either. The linseed oil primer is
still pretty good. Beyond that, there's no oil house
paint. The only solid oil stain I know of is Cabot's,
which seems to attract mildew. Latex stain has
no substance to it. Sherwin Williams and BM both
have an exterior oil paint sold in quarts, but neither
one seems to have the body that exterior oil paint
used to have.

Acrylic/latex is fine for siding, but for exposed sills,
decks, fences, etc I just don't know a good product.

Someone asked me last summer about painting a
fence. I suggested BM linseed oil primer followed by
water base solid stain. I figured the primer would seal
against moisture and the stain can be re-applied
like a whitewash as it wears. But it's an experiment.
I'll be curious to see how it wears after 3-4 years.

Painted the aluminum siding on the house 6 years or so ago using
MooreGlo fortified acrylic. Definitely not cheap, but one coat did the
job and it looks great.

Grahams Endure/waterborne ceramic paint looks very interesting for
exterior trim. Not readily available up here so I have not tried it.
Not talking about the "insulating" paint coatings.

I've used ceramic engine enamel and it works pretty good. (on metal
engine parts - not my house!!!!)

| Grahams Endure/waterborne ceramic paint looks very interesting for
| exterior trim. Not readily available up here so I have not tried it.
| Not talking about the "insulating" paint coatings.
|
I'm not familiar with that. Benjamin Moore's matte
acrylic wall paint is said to have ceramic "micro-spheres"
to make it washable, but other than that it's just
a normal, interior, acrylic wall paint. Is exterior "ceramic"
paint also acrylic? I looked up Graham's and that seems
to be similar to the Moore paint.

On Tue, 10 Mar 2015 21:16:57 -0400, "Mayayana"
wrote:


| Grahams Endure/waterborne ceramic paint looks very interesting for
| exterior trim. Not readily available up here so I have not tried it.
| Not talking about the "insulating" paint coatings.
|
I'm not familiar with that. Benjamin Moore's matte
acrylic wall paint is said to have ceramic "micro-spheres"
to make it washable, but other than that it's just
a normal, interior, acrylic wall paint. Is exterior "ceramic"
paint also acrylic? I looked up Graham's and that seems
to be similar to the Moore paint.

Definitely a high end acrylic.