I just got a letter that says my village (Morton Grove, IL) contracted
with an electrical supplier to provide juice that ComEd was providing.
Effective rate goes from 8.5 cents per kwh to 4.42.
If I don't opt out, I'm in.
Sounds too good to be true.
Anybody else run into this?

--
Vic

On Jun 27, 6:44*pm, Vic Smith wrote:
I just got a letter that says my village (Morton Grove, IL) contracted
with an electrical supplier to provide juice that ComEd was providing.
Effective rate goes from 8.5 cents per kwh to 4.42.
If I don't opt out, I'm in.
Sounds too good to be true.
Anybody else run into this?

--
Vic

Vic - CUB in IL has gotten past the legislature an ordinance that
allows communities to aggregate all the residents of that community
into a larger buying pool and getting lower electrical cupply rates.
COM Ed is still the distributor, and they will be billing you like
always The electrical supply charge the COM Ed folks get is anywhere
from 6.2 to 8.5 C per kwh, so you will see a reduction in oeverall
charges. I am in an unincorporated area of Naperville, and I just
signed up for First Energy Solutions to become my supplier at under
5.8C per kwh, not as much of a savings as you will see, but still
enough to buy some McDonalds at the end of the month.

Vic Smith wrote:
I just got a letter that says my village (Morton Grove, IL) contracted
with an electrical supplier to provide juice that ComEd was providing.
Effective rate goes from 8.5 cents per kwh to 4.42.
If I don't opt out, I'm in.
Sounds too good to be true.
Anybody else run into this?


Hi,
For whom?

On Wed, 27 Jun 2012 18:44:43 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

I just got a letter that says my village (Morton Grove, IL) contracted
with an electrical supplier to provide juice that ComEd was providing.
Effective rate goes from 8.5 cents per kwh to 4.42.
If I don't opt out, I'm in.
Sounds too good to be true.
Anybody else run into this?


Damned good rate. I have ConEd here in CT and pay .0659. Most
suppliers are about .07 and the utility is .082. Given your location,
I'd say it could be true as power is usually lower than here.

As for buying a Volt, with that rate the payback would only be about
20 years.

On 6/27/2012 7:44 PM, Vic Smith wrote:
I just got a letter that says my village (Morton Grove, IL) contracted
with an electrical supplier to provide juice that ComEd was providing.
Effective rate goes from 8.5 cents per kwh to 4.42.
If I don't opt out, I'm in.
Sounds too good to be true.
Anybody else run into this?


Volt? Hell, no.
Get a Prius at about half the price.

IMHO, hybrids are only economical if you drive more miles than average
~12,000 yr.

On Wed, 27 Jun 2012 19:29:16 -0700 (PDT), "hr(bob) "
wrote:

On Jun 27, 6:44Â*pm, Vic Smith wrote:
I just got a letter that says my village (Morton Grove, IL) contracted
with an electrical supplier to provide juice that ComEd was providing.
Effective rate goes from 8.5 cents per kwh to 4.42.
If I don't opt out, I'm in.
Sounds too good to be true.
Anybody else run into this?

--
Vic

Vic - CUB in IL has gotten past the legislature an ordinance that
allows communities to aggregate all the residents of that community
into a larger buying pool and getting lower electrical cupply rates.
COM Ed is still the distributor, and they will be billing you like
always The electrical supply charge the COM Ed folks get is anywhere
from 6.2 to 8.5 C per kwh, so you will see a reduction in oeverall
charges. I am in an unincorporated area of Naperville, and I just
signed up for First Energy Solutions to become my supplier at under
5.8C per kwh, not as much of a savings as you will see, but still
enough to buy some McDonalds at the end of the month.

Thanks, Bob.
That's what I gleaned from the papers sent by the village.
Except they didn't mention CUB, just a referendum, allowing village
negotiation of rates, that passed here in March. Didn't even know
about that referendum, since I've generally ignored village politics.
One of my sons is in Naperville, so I'll ask him if that was all
automatic there. FES is the new provider here too.
I see half the power in IL is nuke, and half coal.
Don't know how that figures in to what seems to be low rates.

--
Vic

On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 05:45:43 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jun 2012 18:44:43 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

I just got a letter that says my village (Morton Grove, IL) contracted
with an electrical supplier to provide juice that ComEd was providing.
Effective rate goes from 8.5 cents per kwh to 4.42.
If I don't opt out, I'm in.
Sounds too good to be true.
Anybody else run into this?


Damned good rate. I have ConEd here in CT and pay .0659. Most
suppliers are about .07 and the utility is .082. Given your location,
I'd say it could be true as power is usually lower than here.


That rate is only locked for a year. We'll see how kickbacks can
affect it next year. Well, we won't actually "see" unless somebody
gets caught..

As for buying a Volt, with that rate the payback would only be about
20 years.

I figured more like 83.33 years. Based on estimated electric savings
of $40 a month and paying $40k for the Volt.
I'm going to pass on the Volt.

--
Vic

On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 07:28:48 -0400, Frank
wrote:

On 6/27/2012 7:44 PM, Vic Smith wrote:
I just got a letter that says my village (Morton Grove, IL) contracted
with an electrical supplier to provide juice that ComEd was providing.
Effective rate goes from 8.5 cents per kwh to 4.42.
If I don't opt out, I'm in.
Sounds too good to be true.
Anybody else run into this?


Volt? Hell, no.
Get a Prius at about half the price.

IMHO, hybrids are only economical if you drive more miles than average
~12,000 yr.

I*M*NHO, The current crop of hybrids are not economical for the
purchaser, though it could be argued that today's purchasers are
necessary to *ever* make them economical.

Jim

On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 11:22:25 -0400, Jim Elbrecht
wrote:

On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 07:28:48 -0400, Frank
wrote:

On 6/27/2012 7:44 PM, Vic Smith wrote:
I just got a letter that says my village (Morton Grove, IL) contracted
with an electrical supplier to provide juice that ComEd was providing.
Effective rate goes from 8.5 cents per kwh to 4.42.
If I don't opt out, I'm in.
Sounds too good to be true.
Anybody else run into this?


Volt? Hell, no.
Get a Prius at about half the price.

IMHO, hybrids are only economical if you drive more miles than average
~12,000 yr.

I*M*NHO, The current crop of hybrids are not economical for the
purchaser, though it could be argued that today's purchasers are
necessary to *ever* make them economical.


The reality is those willing to spend their bucks on the latest will
do so. It'a always been like that. Always. Nothing has changed.
Me, I keep a low profile. $2.5k on a car has been my sweet spot.
Might have to go $4-6k on my next. Inflation.
$40k for a Volt is a non-starter.
But if I was a $40k car type, the Volt would be my local commute car.
It's great for that if you have the bucks.
If you don't have the bucks, it makes a good punching bag.

--
Vic

"Vic Smith" wrote in message
...

I just got a letter that says my village (Morton Grove, IL) contracted
with an electrical supplier to provide juice that ComEd was providing.
Effective rate goes from 8.5 cents per kwh to 4.42.
If I don't opt out, I'm in.

In some states and provinces, this "negative option" sales
technique was legislated illegal by popular demand. Most
states and provinces attempt to regulate geographic monopolies.
--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)

On 6/28/2012 1:03 PM, bud-- wrote:
....

Consumers Report occasionally does comparisons. They include purchase
price, fuel cost, depreciation, maintenance, and other costs. In 2008
the payback on a Prius was 1 year. Savings over a comparable over 5
years was $2000. Some other hybrids saved significant money. Some
hybrids cost significantly more over 5 years. One of these days they
should do a comparison that includes Volt and Leaf.

I've looked at the differential cost of the difference in purchase price
at given roughly current gas prices and concluded I can buy a _lot_ of
gas for quite a long time before it breaks even. And, that doesn't
assign a penalty for driving something less than what I would otherwise
prefer.

Last time I did it, it was 5 yrs of normal driving to even come
close--that just doesn't cut it for me.

$0.01437277..., ymmv, imo, etc., etc., etc., ...

--

On 6/28/2012 6:58 AM, Vic Smith wrote:
....

I see half the power in IL is nuke, and half coal.
Don't know how that figures in to what seems to be low rates.

The don't hurt at all, certainly.

We can only hope the current Admin/EPA doesn't get it's entire way on
what they're trying to do to coal or we'll be paying way more and
probably having blackouts...

--

On 6/28/2012 6:05 AM, Vic Smith wrote:
On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 05:45:43 -0400, Ed wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jun 2012 18:44:43 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:

I just got a letter that says my village (Morton Grove, IL) contracted
with an electrical supplier to provide juice that ComEd was providing.
Effective rate goes from 8.5 cents per kwh to 4.42.
If I don't opt out, I'm in.
Sounds too good to be true.
Anybody else run into this?


Damned good rate. I have ConEd here in CT and pay .0659. Most
suppliers are about .07 and the utility is .082. Given your location,
I'd say it could be true as power is usually lower than here.


That rate is only locked for a year. We'll see how kickbacks can
affect it next year. Well, we won't actually "see" unless somebody
gets caught..


Real interesting the village is negotiating a rate based on multiple users.


As for buying a Volt, with that rate the payback would only be about
20 years.

I figured more like 83.33 years. Based on estimated electric savings
of $40 a month and paying $40k for the Volt.
I'm going to pass on the Volt.

One, of course, compares cost versus the options. The option you
compared is not having a car (which has no cost?)

Consumers Report occasionally does comparisons. They include purchase
price, fuel cost, depreciation, maintenance, and other costs. In 2008
the payback on a Prius was 1 year. Savings over a comparable over 5
years was $2000. Some other hybrids saved significant money. Some
hybrids cost significantly more over 5 years. One of these days they
should do a comparison that includes Volt and Leaf.

On 6/28/2012 1:54 PM, dpb wrote:
On 6/28/2012 1:03 PM, bud-- wrote:
...

Consumers Report occasionally does comparisons. They include purchase
price, fuel cost, depreciation, maintenance, and other costs. In 2008
the payback on a Prius was 1 year. Savings over a comparable over 5
years was $2000. Some other hybrids saved significant money. Some
hybrids cost significantly more over 5 years. One of these days they
should do a comparison that includes Volt and Leaf.

I've looked at the differential cost of the difference in purchase price
at given roughly current gas prices and concluded I can buy a _lot_ of
gas for quite a long time before it breaks even. And, that doesn't
assign a penalty for driving something less than what I would otherwise
prefer.

Last time I did it, it was 5 yrs of normal driving to even come
close--that just doesn't cut it for me.

$0.01437277..., ymmv, imo, etc., etc., etc., ...

--


There are a lot of individual factors.

Myself, retired, I only drive 6,000 miles per year and like to keep my
car until it wears out. Once the battery warranty on a hybrid is over,
it will be cheaper to throw away the car than replace the batteries.

I knew a single gal that liked to drive a lot and put 50,000 miles/year
on her Prius. She said she saved a lot of money.

I like to bring up the Fisker fiasco in Delawa

http://rncresearch.tumblr.com/post/2...clueless-biden

Their cheapest car would have been comparable to the Volt.

On Jun 28, 12:28*pm, Frank wrote:
On 6/27/2012 7:44 PM, Vic Smith wrote:

I just got a letter that says my village (Morton Grove, IL) contracted
with an electrical supplier to provide juice that ComEd was providing.
Effective rate goes from 8.5 cents per kwh to 4.42.
If I don't opt out, I'm in.
Sounds too good to be true.
Anybody else run into this?

Volt? *Hell, no.
Get a Prius at about half the price.

IMHO, hybrids are only economical if you drive more miles than average
~12,000 yr.

They are only economical if you drive in cities and get a "plug in
hybrid".

On Jun 28, 7:03*pm, bud-- wrote:
On 6/28/2012 6:05 AM, Vic Smith wrote:





On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 05:45:43 -0400, Ed *wrote:

On Wed, 27 Jun 2012 18:44:43 -0500, Vic Smith
*wrote:

I just got a letter that says my village (Morton Grove, IL) contracted
with an electrical supplier to provide juice that ComEd was providing..
Effective rate goes from 8.5 cents per kwh to 4.42.
If I don't opt out, I'm in.
Sounds too good to be true.
Anybody else run into this?

Damned good rate. *I have ConEd here in CT and pay .0659. *Most
suppliers are about .07 and the utility is .082. *Given your location,
I'd say it could be true as power is usually lower than here.

That rate is only locked for a year. *We'll see how kickbacks can
affect it next year. *Well, we won't actually "see" unless somebody
gets caught..

Real interesting the village is negotiating a rate based on multiple users.

As for buying a Volt, with that rate the payback would only be about
20 years.

I figured more like 83.33 years. *Based on estimated electric savings
of $40 a month and paying $40k for the Volt.
I'm going to pass on the Volt.

One, of course, compares cost versus the options. The option you
compared is not having a car (which has no cost?)

Consumers Report occasionally does comparisons. They include purchase
price, fuel cost, depreciation, maintenance, and other costs. In 2008
the payback on a Prius was 1 year. Savings over a comparable over 5
years was $2000. Some other hybrids saved significant money. Some
hybrids cost significantly more over 5 years. One of these days they
should do a comparison that includes Volt and Leaf.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

And the Mitsubishi I-miev

On Jun 28, 7:39*pm, Frank wrote:
On 6/28/2012 1:54 PM, dpb wrote:





On 6/28/2012 1:03 PM, bud-- wrote:
...

Consumers Report occasionally does comparisons. They include purchase
price, fuel cost, depreciation, maintenance, and other costs. In 2008
the payback on a Prius was 1 year. Savings over a comparable over 5
years was $2000. Some other hybrids saved significant money. Some
hybrids cost significantly more over 5 years. One of these days they
should do a comparison that includes Volt and Leaf.

I've looked at the differential cost of the difference in purchase price
at given roughly current gas prices and concluded I can buy a _lot_ of
gas for quite a long time before it breaks even. *And, that doesn't
assign a penalty for driving something less than what I would otherwise
prefer.

Last time I did it, it was 5 yrs of normal driving to even come
close--that just doesn't cut it for me.

$0.01437277..., ymmv, imo, etc., etc., etc., ...

--

There are a lot of individual factors.

Myself, retired, I only drive 6,000 miles per year and like to keep my
car until it wears out. *Once the battery warranty on a hybrid is over,
it will be cheaper to throw away the car than replace the batteries.

I knew a single gal that liked to drive a lot and put 50,000 miles/year
on her Prius. *She said she saved a lot of money.

I like to bring up the Fisker fiasco in Delawa

http://rncresearch.tumblr.com/post/2...clueless-biden

Didn't stop them bailing out the banks did it?

On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 07:05:24 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:



As for buying a Volt, with that rate the payback would only be about
20 years.

I figured more like 83.33 years. Based on estimated electric savings
of $40 a month and paying $40k for the Volt.
I'm going to pass on the Volt.

I was using the difference between the Volt and a comparable gasoline
sedan. You should check to see if GM is offering special financing on
the Volt. If you can get 1000 months at 0%, it would be worth it.

I did see one in the wild and it was a good looking car. I have to
wonder though, just how good is the heat on a freezing day or the AC
on a 90+ degree day. I like good climate control.

On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 22:41:46 -0400, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 07:05:24 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:



As for buying a Volt, with that rate the payback would only be about
20 years.

I figured more like 83.33 years. Based on estimated electric savings
of $40 a month and paying $40k for the Volt.
I'm going to pass on the Volt.

I was using the difference between the Volt and a comparable gasoline
sedan. You should check to see if GM is offering special financing on
the Volt. If you can get 1000 months at 0%, it would be worth it.


I didn't subtract for a comparable gasoline car because I have a
couple of them already, but I get what you're saying.
I would have only knocked off $4-6k anyway, which is what I expect to
pay for my next car, maybe a few years from now.

I did see one in the wild and it was a good looking car. I have to
wonder though, just how good is the heat on a freezing day or the AC
on a 90+ degree day. I like good climate control.

Owners seem happy with the climate control, but you might not be.
A/C or heat naturally knocks a few miles off the battery range.
Like they say, the only reason you need to divorce your wife is she
doesn't cut the salami how you like it cut.
Plenty of Volt info here.
http://gm-volt.com/forum/forumdispla...wnership-Forum
Close to 20k Volts are on the road.
It's a technological marvel, produced by an American company.
I like that.
It's really the first car out of my chosen car price range that I ever
wanted.
Never wanted a Vette, never wanted a Caddy, a Merc or a Lambo.
I always get a kick from fixing my own and driving cheaper than just
about anybody else. Different strokes.
Too bad it's still so expensive. I'll survive without it.

--
Vic

On Fri, 29 Jun 2012 07:32:47 -0500, Vic Smith
wrote:



Owners seem happy with the climate control, but you might not be.
A/C or heat naturally knocks a few miles off the battery range.
Like they say, the only reason you need to divorce your wife is she
doesn't cut the salami how you like it cut.
Plenty of Volt info here.
http://gm-volt.com/forum/forumdispla...wnership-Forum
Close to 20k Volts are on the road.
It's a technological marvel, produced by an American company.
I like that.
It's really the first car out of my chosen car price range that I ever
wanted.
Never wanted a Vette, never wanted a Caddy, a Merc or a Lambo.
I always get a kick from fixing my own and driving cheaper than just
about anybody else. Different strokes.
Too bad it's still so expensive. I'll survive without it.

Right now, the Volt is not too practical as it won't make my daily
commute and is very expensive. Unlike others, I don't really knock
that car at all. Remember the Wright Flyer? That was not all that
practical either, but is seems to have evolved into something or
practical use from what I've seen at airports.

I really hope Tesla gets going too. They seem to be ahead of the
Volt, but are also about 20k pricier.


As for heat:
At ambient temperatures of approximately 25° F (–4° C) or below, the
ICE will operate to assist in warming the coolant used to warm the
vehicle’s cabin. After the coolant temperature reaches approximately
150° F (65° C), the ICE will turn off and remain off (as long as the
battery state of charge is sufficient) until the engine coolant
temperature drops to approximately 104° F (40° C), at which time the
ICE will restart. This function will continue as long as the ambient
temperature is approximately 25° F (–4° C) or less while driving.
After the ambient temperature rises above approximately 25° F (–4° C),
the vehicle will resume normal electric operation (as long as the
battery state of charge is sufficient).

And the AC:
If the temperature gets into the mid-80s or above, the car turns on
the A/C in cycles to cool the battery (which would really rather live
in the 70s...) You will get cold air from the vents during this cycle
if the climate control is set to lower than ambient, but that's just a
side effect.

Overall, a complex system
http://gm-volt.com/2010/12/09/the-ch...ems-explained/

On Jun 29, 10:38*pm, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On Fri, 29 Jun 2012 07:32:47 -0500, Vic Smith





wrote:
Owners seem happy with the climate control, but you might not be.
A/C or heat naturally knocks a few miles off the battery range.
Like they say, the only reason you need to divorce your wife is she
doesn't cut the salami how you like it cut.
Plenty of Volt info here.
http://gm-volt.com/forum/forumdispla...wnership-Forum
Close to 20k Volts are on the road.
It's a technological marvel, produced by an American company.
I like that.
It's really the first car out of my chosen car price range that I ever
wanted.
Never wanted a Vette, never wanted a Caddy, a Merc or a Lambo.
I always get a kick from fixing my own and driving cheaper than just
about anybody else. *Different strokes.
Too bad it's still so expensive. *I'll survive without it.

Right now, the Volt is not too practical as it won't make my daily
commute and is very expensive. *Unlike others, I don't really knock
that car at all. *Remember the Wright Flyer? *That was not all that
practical either, but is seems to have evolved into something or
practical use from what I've seen at airports.

I really hope Tesla gets going too. *They seem to be ahead of the
Volt, but are also about 20k pricier.

As for heat:
At ambient temperatures of approximately 25° F (–4° C) or below, the
ICE will operate to assist in warming the coolant used to warm the
vehicle’s cabin. After the coolant temperature reaches approximately
150° F (65° C), the ICE will turn off and remain off (as long as the
battery state of charge is sufficient) until the engine coolant
temperature drops to approximately 104° F (40° C), at which time the
ICE will restart. This function will continue as long as the ambient
temperature is approximately 25° F (–4° C) or less while driving.
After the ambient temperature rises above approximately 25° F (–4° C),
the vehicle will resume normal electric operation (as long as the
battery state of charge is sufficient).

And the AC:
If the temperature gets into the mid-80s or above, the car turns on
the A/C in cycles to cool the battery (which would really rather live
in the 70s...) You will get cold air from the vents during this cycle
if the climate control is set to lower than ambient, but that's just a
side effect.

Overall, a complex systemhttp://gm-volt.com/2010/12/09/the-chevrolet-volt-coolingheating-syste...

anything that cuts us dependenmce on foreign oil is a good thing.....

On Fri, 29 Jun 2012 21:32:16 -0700 (PDT), bob haller wrote:

On Jun 29, 10:38*pm, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On Fri, 29 Jun 2012 07:32:47 -0500, Vic Smith





wrote:
Owners seem happy with the climate control, but you might not be.
A/C or heat naturally knocks a few miles off the battery range.
Like they say, the only reason you need to divorce your wife is she
doesn't cut the salami how you like it cut.
Plenty of Volt info here.
http://gm-volt.com/forum/forumdispla...wnership-Forum
Close to 20k Volts are on the road.
It's a technological marvel, produced by an American company.
I like that.
It's really the first car out of my chosen car price range that I ever
wanted.
Never wanted a Vette, never wanted a Caddy, a Merc or a Lambo.
I always get a kick from fixing my own and driving cheaper than just
about anybody else. *Different strokes.
Too bad it's still so expensive. *I'll survive without it.

Right now, the Volt is not too practical as it won't make my daily
commute and is very expensive. *Unlike others, I don't really knock
that car at all. *Remember the Wright Flyer? *That was not all that
practical either, but is seems to have evolved into something or
practical use from what I've seen at airports.

I really hope Tesla gets going too. *They seem to be ahead of the
Volt, but are also about 20k pricier.

As for heat:
At ambient temperatures of approximately 25° F (–4° C) or below, the
ICE will operate to assist in warming the coolant used to warm the
vehicle’s cabin. After the coolant temperature reaches approximately
150° F (65° C), the ICE will turn off and remain off (as long as the
battery state of charge is sufficient) until the engine coolant
temperature drops to approximately 104° F (40° C), at which time the
ICE will restart. This function will continue as long as the ambient
temperature is approximately 25° F (–4° C) or less while driving.
After the ambient temperature rises above approximately 25° F (–4° C),
the vehicle will resume normal electric operation (as long as the
battery state of charge is sufficient).

And the AC:
If the temperature gets into the mid-80s or above, the car turns on
the A/C in cycles to cool the battery (which would really rather live
in the 70s...) You will get cold air from the vents during this cycle
if the climate control is set to lower than ambient, but that's just a
side effect.

Overall, a complex systemhttp://gm-volt.com/2010/12/09/the-chevrolet-volt-coolingheating-syste...

anything that cuts us dependenmce on foreign oil is a good thing.....

You mean like drilling in ANWR, the gulf, the Atlantic Shelf, California, and
of course building the Keystone XL. Oh, and coal, and nuke, and...