I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to help
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one
seems to care.

It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that isn't
all stores, but most.

I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about
out of patience with the Despot.


Jeff

On Sep 3, 6:23*am, Jeff Thies wrote:
* *I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

* *Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to help
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one
seems to care.

* *It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that isn't
all stores, but most.

* *I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

* *At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

* *I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about
out of patience with the Despot.

* *Jeff

It's hard to be cheerful when your job's in jeopardy...............

"Jeff Thies" wrote in message
...
I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to help
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one
seems to care.

I've got one up the street, closer than any other lumber/tool source. That
means they have to be pretty bad to not be the place I go to get something.
If I am driving the gas gulping van, any other store starts serious gas
dollars evaporating. I've got a friend whose son works in a remodeling
center, and he's talked about "it" a lot. "It" is the tremendous slowdown
in real estate. Home Depot (and every other "home" related industry)
followed the real estate market into the crapper. People are terrified of
losing their job, and the best way to do that is to have no negative
customer interactions, or at least that's what some workers believe. So
they hide from customers. There's also no advancement except through
attrition and no one's retiring the way they used to. HD has always had
lower margins than Lowe's, so they probably have less money lying around to
weather the storm.

It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that isn't
all stores, but most.

I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

I'll ask my friend. Policies are not nationwide or even statewide, IIRC.

At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about
out of patience with the Despot.

Since my nearest Lowe's is 15 miles away through nasty traffic and the HD
three block and next to the pharmacy AND the grocery store, it's still going
to be where I do most shopping for home stuff. I agree wholeheartedly about
the look and feel, though.

In Lowe's, I can get a handicapped scooter almost every visit, without
question. When my foot was in a cast, it was a big deal for them to find
the scooter and deploy it, and it was never fully charged. The last time I
used a scooter in HD, it only worked in reverse! So yes, there's been so
obvious and distressing deterioration. I think they've also been giving away
35 million dollar severance packages to their failed CEO's in a process
known in financial circles as a "Loot n' Scoot."

In HD, I bring my own small scooter (much more of a hassle and far less load
capacity both on the scooter and in the van). When I have a big list, a
scooter is a godsend and HD loses out on those $400-600 trips where I get
all the things I need before a major project starts. Plus the items that I
really didn't need that were on sale and I could stock up on. It's HD's
loss. Even WallyWorld's got a fleet of scooters and mostly no waiting for
mostly functioning units. Mostly. Great fun can be had by asking a greeter
to find one. "I can't leave my post!!!!!" Wally's like the Army. They
offer employment for people with certain distinct characteristics who might
not find jobs elsewhere in the economy.

The counterbalance is that HD's sale price on the refrigerator I just bought
was lower than Lowe's non-sale price. I tend to shop HD when I am looking
to save a buck on big ticket items but it's very likely I just think HD is
better because they are closer and I can get to their sales incidentally,
not via special trip.

I did have to ask 4 associates to find someone to *sell* me the
refrigerator, but I didn't mind because it gave me more time to look over
the unit before I bought. The Internet had the box even cheaper, but I've
been (badly) surprised by a big ticket net item so I'm back to insisting on
touching and feeling what I buy. Sure, I could go *back* to the internet
and buy it after kicking the tires at HD, but the person who sold the unit
really looked like she needed that job.

--
Bobby G.

On 9/3/2010 1:23 AM, Jeff Thies wrote:
I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to help
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one
seems to care.

It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that isn't
all stores, but most.

I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about out
of patience with the Despot.


Jeff

Home Depot, and other retailers, would do a great service for their
customers if they simply were able to stop their employees chatting with
one another causing them to ignore the customer.

Jeff Thies wrote:
I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to
help customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no
one seems to care.

It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that
isn't all stores, but most.

I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

Nope, quite the opposite, actually. I was looking at light bulbs last week,
and I got accosted by no less than three orange vests trying to interact
with me. Such a monumental purchasing decision, looking at light bulbs, I'm
surprised they didn't have to call up Bob Vila himself to come and give me a
helping hand.

Now I know I'm an incredibly good-looking guy, and people tend to always
want to bask in the glow of my beauty, but sheesh, *light bulbs*?

Jon

On 9/3/2010 1:23 AM, Jeff Thies wrote:
I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to help
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one
seems to care.

It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that isn't
all stores, but most.

I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about out
of patience with the Despot.


Jeff


I was complaining last year. It cost them a lawn mower sale as I could
not find help.

On Sep 3, 2:14*am, harry wrote:
On Sep 3, 6:23*am, Jeff Thies wrote:



* *I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

* *Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to help
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one
seems to care.

* *It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that isn't
all stores, but most.

* *I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

* *At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

* *I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about
out of patience with the Despot.

* *Jeff

It's hard to be cheerful when your job's in jeopardy...............

Is that why you Europeons are such an ugly lot these days?

harry wrote in news:e0fa9442-b0d9-46ab-b13f-
:

On Sep 3, 6:23*am, Jeff Thies wrote:
* *I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

* *Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to h
elp
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one
seems to care.

* *It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that is
n't
all stores, but most.

* *I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

* *At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone el
se
notice this?

* *I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just abou
t
out of patience with the Despot.

* *Jeff

It's hard to be cheerful when your job's in jeopardy...............


job's in jeopardy.

aka virtually any business these days.

Jeff Thies wrote the following:
I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to
help customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no
one seems to care.

It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that
isn't all stores, but most.

Unlike you, who apparently has shopped at 'most' HD stores in the US and
therefore can make an informed assessment of the quality of service, I
only shop at 2 in my area. I also shop at 2 Lowes in my area. I find the
quality of service to be basically the same at all 4.


I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about
out of patience with the Despot.

Maybe you 'felt better' because the AC was set a little cooler at Lowes?


Jeff



--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

On Sep 3, 7:41*am, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:
Jeff Thies wrote:
* I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

* Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to
help customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no
one seems to care.

* It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that
isn't all stores, but most.

* I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

* At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

Nope, quite the opposite, actually. *I was looking at light bulbs last week,
and I got accosted by no less than three orange vests trying to interact
with me. *Such a monumental purchasing decision, looking at light bulbs, I'm
surprised they didn't have to call up Bob Vila himself to come and give me a
helping hand.

Now I know I'm an incredibly good-looking guy, and people tend to always
want to bask in the glow of my beauty, but sheesh, *light bulbs*?

Jon- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I have spent a lot of time recently at several Home Depot stores in
the area and my experience has been very similar to yours. It seems
that the moment I walk in the door they are like a swarm of ants,
crawling all over me. While I appreciate the service I am very
concerned that it stems from a fear that each of them have over
loosing their job and they are trying to make sure they are not the
next on the chopping block. From what I could see, their fears my
very well be justified by the small number of customers compared to
employees at any given time. I sometimes take my lunch hour to pickup
supplies from a Home Depot near my office, other times I stop at one
on the way home and on weekends alternate between two Home Depot
stores almost equal distance from my house. I frequent a fifth store
next door to the nearest Rockler woodworkers store. All of the stores
seem to be in the same situation, more employees than customers at any
given time and that includes during the week and on weekends.

On the opposite end of the scale, the local Lowes's stores seem to
operate at times without any employees and getting help with anything
can seem almost impossible. They didn't have any more customers than
the Home Depot stores with very few employees and those employees
didn't seem to care if they helped you or not...if you could find one.

"Jeff Thies" wrote in message
...
I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to help
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one seems
to care.

It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that isn't
all stores, but most.

I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the employees
had.

At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about out
of patience with the Despot.


Jeff

Small town here. Maybe that makes a difference. Local employees. Meet you at
the entrance and ask if they can help. All very pleasent to talk to. When I
buy 4x8 sheets of plywood they cut to size no charge. Totally different that
when I go to a large town and happened to buy and item there. But I do most
of my buying at the local Ace Hardware (for past 30 years) WW

"Jeff Thies" wrote in message
...
I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to help
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one seems
to care.

It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that isn't
all stores, but most.

I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the employees
had.

At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about out
of patience with the Despot.


Jeff

I live in Utah.

The ones here are very helpful, have plenty of help, they know where stuff
is at least, and some are very knowledgeable, or will radio to get someone
over there who has the answers. I think it has a lot to do where you live.
The ones I go to in Las Vegas are entirely different. Fewer staff that seem
to always be doing circles with you staying on the other side of the
display, know nothing people, empty bins, that kind of stuff.
Steve

Heart surgery pending?
Read up and prepare.
Learn how to care for a friend.
http://cabgbypasssurgery.com

On Sep 3, 12:23*am, Jeff Thies wrote:
* *I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

* *Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to help
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one
seems to care.

* *It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that isn't
all stores, but most.

* *I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

* *At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

* *I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about
out of patience with the Despot.

* *Jeff

I live 1 mile from a Menards and HD right next to each other. Except
in February they bulldozed Menards to build a bigger/better version,
leaving me at the mercy of HD (the next closest is alternative is
about 15 miles away). Here are some of the things I have observed
about HD:

1 Returned product - three times now I have bought power tools at
full price, only to get home and find out that someone has already
"borrowed" them (used them for a project, returned them - missing
parts of course). This really irritates me, and I now open everything
before leaving the store. The worst case was a pneumatic flooring
nailer. They argued with me at first, denying that it was a return.
But when I showed them the papaerwork in the box with the "borrower's"
personal details etc, they accepted it (no apology of course). The
fact that the thing was scuffed up (must have been used for a pretty
big project) and missing the hammer should have been a clue. As far
as I'm aware, many stores have a policy of not selling open box stuff
unless identified as such and marked down. Don't know why they do
this at HD but it really ****es me off.

2 When I first went to this store several years ago, most of the
staff seemed to be very knowledgeable, ex-trades in some cases. Now
they have changed there policy and favor attractive young females who
really don't seem to know much about anything. It's quite a blatant
strategy - they're everywhere. I'm all for equality, but product
knowledge should come first. The ones I have spoken to don't seem to
know anything more than basic store layout. And I echo what someone
else said about them standing around chatting - infuriating, and often
they ignore you if you go stand by them (you have to actually jump in
and say hey).

3 Damned self-checkout. Often it's the only lane open. And the
stupid scale that flips out if it thinks you haven't put something in
the bagging area. I almost always need an intervention from an actual
human.

4 Pricing is generally high, but on some things that contractors
would buy a lot they are competitive. Basically they are out to rip
off the DIYer. Best example is drywall - 8x4 sheets are the same
price as closest Menards, but they also sell these stupid 2x2 squares
(for small repairs) for about 80% of the price of an 8x4 sheet!
Hilarious.

March 2011 will be opening of the new Menards, and I can't wait to say
bye bye BORG

On Sep 3, 9:05*am, keith wrote:
On Sep 3, 2:14*am, harry wrote:





On Sep 3, 6:23*am, Jeff Thies wrote:

* *I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

* *Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to help
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one
seems to care.

* *It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that isn't
all stores, but most.

* *I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

* *At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

* *I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about
out of patience with the Despot.

* *Jeff

It's hard to be cheerful when your job's in jeopardy...............

Is that why you Europeons are such an ugly lot these days?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Not true. Those on the main land look OK.

On Sep 3, 11:58*am, Frank wrote:
On Sep 3, 9:05*am, keith wrote:





On Sep 3, 2:14*am, harry wrote:

On Sep 3, 6:23*am, Jeff Thies wrote:

* *I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

* *Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to help
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one
seems to care.

* *It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that isn't
all stores, but most.

* *I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

* *At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

* *I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about
out of patience with the Despot.

* *Jeff

It's hard to be cheerful when your job's in jeopardy...............

Is that why you Europeons are such an ugly lot these days?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Not true. *Those on the main land look OK.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I've used both lowes and hd for many years. They are what they are.
I did notice that hd was doing a bit more of that "greeter" strategy
for a while and that seems to have dropped off a bit. I'm in Raleigh
NC and we have not been hit real hard by the house market collapse.
Ours didn't go up like crazy before it either. So that might be why I
have not noticed much different.

As to the 4x8 verses 2x2 drywall you need to keep in mind that drywall
prices are practically all material handling costs. The raw
components probably don't add up to 50c a sheet. If you are an
infrequent diy'r and need a small piece of drywall then paying $6 for
a 2x2 instead of $8 for a 4x8 that you will have to fool around with
to get home and then throw most of it away anyway looks pretty
attractive. Bottom line prices are market driven.

On Sep 3, 2:05*pm, keith wrote:
On Sep 3, 2:14*am, harry wrote:





On Sep 3, 6:23*am, Jeff Thies wrote:

* *I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

* *Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to help
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one
seems to care.

* *It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that isn't
all stores, but most.

* *I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

* *At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

* *I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about
out of patience with the Despot.

* *Jeff

It's hard to be cheerful when your job's in jeopardy...............

Is that why you Europeons are such an ugly lot these days?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

There's nobody fatter and more ugly than USAians. That's how we all
know over here that CSI is fiction. Not a fat ugly git in sight. ;-)

On Sep 3, 2:31*pm, Red Green wrote:
harry wrote in news:e0fa9442-b0d9-46ab-b13f-
:





On Sep 3, 6:23*am, Jeff Thies wrote:
* *I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time..

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

* *Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to h
elp
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one
seems to care.

* *It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that is
n't
all stores, but most.

* *I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

* *At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone el
se
notice this?

* *I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just abou
t
out of patience with the Despot.

* *Jeff

It's hard to be cheerful when your job's in jeopardy...............
job's in jeopardy.

aka virtually any business these days.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

It's the same over here. You walk down the high street, it's a row of
to let & for sale signs. Only the charity shops and £ stores seem to
be booming.

On Sep 3, 4:58*pm, Frank wrote:
On Sep 3, 9:05*am, keith wrote:





On Sep 3, 2:14*am, harry wrote:

On Sep 3, 6:23*am, Jeff Thies wrote:

* *I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

* *Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to help
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one
seems to care.

* *It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that isn't
all stores, but most.

* *I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

* *At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

* *I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about
out of patience with the Despot.

* *Jeff

It's hard to be cheerful when your job's in jeopardy...............

Is that why you Europeons are such an ugly lot these days?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Not true. *Those on the main land look OK.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Heh! Heh!

On Fri, 03 Sep 2010 08:45:50 -0600, WW wrote:
Small town here. Maybe that makes a difference. Local employees. Meet
you at the entrance and ask if they can help. All very pleasent to talk
to. When I buy 4x8 sheets of plywood they cut to size no charge. Totally
different that when I go to a large town and happened to buy and item
there. But I do most of my buying at the local Ace Hardware (for past 30
years) WW

Yeah, I think it's a regional thing. Small town here too, and the staff
are polite and helpful. I don't like the greeters on the door - they just
exist to get in the way, but it's easy to find someone to help if needed
once inside. No charge for them cutting lumber either (do other HD's
really charge for that??).

We've got a big Menards being built in town at the moment, too - it'll be
interesting to see what happens to HD prices after that opens (and
whether HD will stick around at all).

Personally I fear for the local farm supply place, though. They supply a
little bit of everything, usually cheaper than HD, with nicer staff and a
more trusting attitude toward customers; I'm worried that they might
disappear once there's another big competitor in the area. Plus they sell
chickens, which keeps the kids amused while I'm looking around :-)

cheers

Jules

BobR wrote:

I have spent a lot of time recently at several Home Depot stores in
the area and my experience has been very similar to yours. It seems
that the moment I walk in the door they are like a swarm of ants,
crawling all over me. While I appreciate the service I am very
concerned that it stems from a fear that each of them have over
loosing their job and they are trying to make sure they are not the
next on the chopping block. From what I could see, their fears my
very well be justified by the small number of customers compared to
employees at any given time. I sometimes take my lunch hour to pickup
supplies from a Home Depot near my office, other times I stop at one
on the way home and on weekends alternate between two Home Depot
stores almost equal distance from my house. I frequent a fifth store
next door to the nearest Rockler woodworkers store. All of the stores
seem to be in the same situation, more employees than customers at any
given time and that includes during the week and on weekends.

On the opposite end of the scale, the local Lowes's stores seem to
operate at times without any employees and getting help with anything
can seem almost impossible. They didn't have any more customers than
the Home Depot stores with very few employees and those employees
didn't seem to care if they helped you or not...if you could find one.

lol, "swarm of ants" describes exactly what happens sometimes. Personally,
I am of the opinion that customers should be left to their own devices
unless and until they actually ask for help. Tidy the shelves, look busy,
but stay out of people's business unless they need you.

This was the way a trip to the hardware store has always been, and while I
do realize that bored housewives/househusbands might appreciate the
handholding, it shouldn't be all that hard to train the help to recognize
the difference.

Jon

On Sep 3, 12:20*pm, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:
BobR wrote:

I have spent a lot of time recently at several Home Depot stores in
the area and my experience has been very similar to yours. *It seems
that the moment I walk in the door they are like a swarm of ants,
crawling all over me. *While I appreciate the service I am very
concerned that it stems from a fear that each of them have over
loosing their job and they are trying to make sure they are not the
next on the chopping block. *From what I could see, their fears my
very well be justified by the small number of customers compared to
employees at any given time. *I sometimes take my lunch hour to pickup
supplies from a Home Depot near my office, other times I stop at one
on the way home and on weekends alternate between two Home Depot
stores almost equal distance from my house. *I frequent a fifth store
next door to the nearest Rockler woodworkers store. *All of the stores
seem to be in the same situation, more employees than customers at any
given time and that includes during the week and on weekends.

On the opposite end of the scale, the local Lowes's stores seem to
operate at times without any employees and getting help with anything
can seem almost impossible. *They didn't have any more customers than
the Home Depot stores with very few employees and those employees
didn't seem to care if they helped you or not...if you could find one.

lol, "swarm of ants" describes exactly what happens sometimes. *Personally,
I am of the opinion that customers should be left to their own devices
unless and until they actually ask for help. *Tidy the shelves, look busy,
but stay out of people's business unless they need you.

This was the way a trip to the hardware store has always been, and while I
do realize that bored housewives/househusbands might appreciate the
handholding, it shouldn't be all that hard to train the help to recognize
the difference.

Jon- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

What I love is the place that mobs you at the door when you come in
but can't be found anywhere when you really need something.

On Fri, 03 Sep 2010 10:20:23 -0700, Jon Danniken wrote:

BobR wrote:

I have spent a lot of time recently at several Home Depot stores in the
area and my experience has been very similar to yours. It seems that
the moment I walk in the door they are like a swarm of ants, crawling
all over me. While I appreciate the service I am very concerned that
it stems from a fear that each of them have over loosing their job and
they are trying to make sure they are not the next on the chopping
block. From what I could see, their fears my very well be justified by
the small number of customers compared to employees at any given time.
I sometimes take my lunch hour to pickup supplies from a Home Depot
near my office, other times I stop at one on the way home and on
weekends alternate between two Home Depot stores almost equal distance
from my house. I frequent a fifth store next door to the nearest
Rockler woodworkers store. All of the stores seem to be in the same
situation, more employees than customers at any given time and that
includes during the week and on weekends.

On the opposite end of the scale, the local Lowes's stores seem to
operate at times without any employees and getting help with anything
can seem almost impossible. They didn't have any more customers than
the Home Depot stores with very few employees and those employees
didn't seem to care if they helped you or not...if you could find one.

lol, "swarm of ants" describes exactly what happens sometimes.
Personally, I am of the opinion that customers should be left to their
own devices unless and until they actually ask for help. Tidy the
shelves, look busy, but stay out of people's business unless they need
you.

Most of the time I go into a store, I'm either just looking around or can
find what I want easier than I can explain it. In either of those cases,
I'd rather not be bothered with "can I help you?". Of course, it's nice
to have someone you can ask when you need to.

BTW, that's even you know just what you want but don't know what to CALL
it, such as "where are those bent metal things with screws you can use to
stop hose leaks?" (hose clamps).

This was the way a trip to the hardware store has always been, and while
I do realize that bored housewives/househusbands might appreciate the
handholding, it shouldn't be all that hard to train the help to
recognize the difference.

Jon



--
113 days until The winter celebration (Saturday December 25, 2010
12:00:00 AM).

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us

"Not one man in ten thousand has goodness of heart or strength of mind
to be an atheist." -- Samuel Taylor Coleridge (1772-1834), to Thomas
Allsop, ca. 1820

[snip]

Small town here. Maybe that makes a difference. Local employees. Meet
you at the entrance and ask if they can help. All very pleasent to talk
to. When I buy 4x8 sheets of plywood they cut to size no charge. Totally
different that when I go to a large town and happened to buy and item
there. But I do most of my buying at the local Ace Hardware (for past 30
years) WW

There used to be a couple of small, old hardware stores around here. One
was an Ace and the other a True Value. Both had helpful employees who
knew about the products they sell. I would go to one of those stores when
I needed help deciding just what part to get. Both stores are out of
business now, after Lowes opened.

--
113 days until The winter celebration (Saturday December 25, 2010
12:00:00 AM).

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us

"Not one man in ten thousand has goodness of heart or strength of mind
to be an atheist." -- Samuel Taylor Coleridge (1772-1834), to Thomas
Allsop, ca. 1820

Mark Lloyd wrote the following:
[snip]


Small town here. Maybe that makes a difference. Local employees. Meet
you at the entrance and ask if they can help. All very pleasent to talk
to. When I buy 4x8 sheets of plywood they cut to size no charge. Totally
different that when I go to a large town and happened to buy and item
there. But I do most of my buying at the local Ace Hardware (for past 30
years) WW


There used to be a couple of small, old hardware stores around here. One
was an Ace and the other a True Value. Both had helpful employees who
knew about the products they sell. I would go to one of those stores when
I needed help deciding just what part to get. Both stores are out of
business now, after Lowes opened.

Don't use True Value and Ace Hardware stores as examples of 'local
businesses". They are both franchise stores, doncha know?
Maybe local people 'owned' them and they employed local residents, so do
the HD and Lowes stores, and they employ more people than those small
franchise stores.


--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

In article ,
willshak wrote:



Don't use True Value and Ace Hardware stores as examples of 'local
businesses". They are both franchise stores, doncha know?
Maybe local people 'owned' them and they employed local residents, so do
the HD and Lowes stores, and they employ more people than those small
franchise stores.

Gee, HD and Lowes locally owned. Who knew?

On 9/3/2010 3:57 PM, willshak wrote:
Mark Lloyd wrote the following:
[snip]

Small town here. Maybe that makes a difference. Local employees. Meet
you at the entrance and ask if they can help. All very pleasent to talk
to. When I buy 4x8 sheets of plywood they cut to size no charge. Totally
different that when I go to a large town and happened to buy and item
there. But I do most of my buying at the local Ace Hardware (for past 30
years) WW

There used to be a couple of small, old hardware stores around here.
One was an Ace and the other a True Value. Both had helpful employees
who knew about the products they sell. I would go to one of those
stores when I needed help deciding just what part to get. Both stores
are out of business now, after Lowes opened.

Don't use True Value and Ace Hardware stores as examples of 'local
businesses". They are both franchise stores, doncha know?
Maybe local people 'owned' them and they employed local residents, so do
the HD and Lowes stores, and they employ more people than those small
franchise stores.


Big box Home Depot and Lowes are not owned by local folks.

Kurt Ullman wrote the following:
In article ,
willshak wrote:


Don't use True Value and Ace Hardware stores as examples of 'local
businesses". They are both franchise stores, doncha know?
Maybe local people 'owned' them and they employed local residents, so do
the HD and Lowes stores, and they employ more people than those small
franchise stores.


Gee, HD and Lowes locally owned. Who knew?


The word 'owned' was meant to include managers.

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

In article ,
willshak wrote:

Kurt Ullman wrote the following:
In article ,
willshak wrote:


Don't use True Value and Ace Hardware stores as examples of 'local
businesses". They are both franchise stores, doncha know?
Maybe local people 'owned' them and they employed local residents, so do
the HD and Lowes stores, and they employ more people than those small
franchise stores.


Gee, HD and Lowes locally owned. Who knew?


The word 'owned' was meant to include managers.

Not usually, that is what confused me. Managers are usually
employees, drones like the rest of them at HD and Lowes. Also, are TV
and Ace franchises? I thought they were like HWI (now the Do-It Centers)
and were purchasing co-operatives.

On Fri, 03 Sep 2010 15:57:38 -0400, willshak
wrote:

Mark Lloyd wrote the following:
[snip]


Small town here. Maybe that makes a difference. Local employees. Meet
you at the entrance and ask if they can help. All very pleasent to talk
to. When I buy 4x8 sheets of plywood they cut to size no charge. Totally
different that when I go to a large town and happened to buy and item
there. But I do most of my buying at the local Ace Hardware (for past 30
years) WW


There used to be a couple of small, old hardware stores around here. One
was an Ace and the other a True Value. Both had helpful employees who
knew about the products they sell. I would go to one of those stores when
I needed help deciding just what part to get. Both stores are out of
business now, after Lowes opened.

Don't use True Value and Ace Hardware stores as examples of 'local
businesses". They are both franchise stores, doncha know?
Maybe local people 'owned' them and they employed local residents, so do
the HD and Lowes stores, and they employ more people than those small
franchise stores.
Home depot is NOT a Franchise store - at least in Canada. They are
ALL Corporate stores. I believe that is true in the USA as well.

There is no "local ownership" involved - while Home Hardware, as an
example, is TOTALLY DEALER OWNED.

In article ,
wrote:

And the "walmartization" of retail has meant that some 80%+ of retail
jobs are PART TIME, with NO BENEFITS. - and close to minimum wage.

The walmartization of the retail, indeed many other forms of commerce,
is a direct result of what the market wants. We don't want to pay the
extra money for quality or service, so we don't get it. I think Pogo got
it right: "We have met the enemy and he is us".

Kurt Ullman wrote the following:
In article ,
willshak wrote:


Kurt Ullman wrote the following:

In article ,
willshak wrote:



Don't use True Value and Ace Hardware stores as examples of 'local
businesses". They are both franchise stores, doncha know?
Maybe local people 'owned' them and they employed local residents, so do
the HD and Lowes stores, and they employ more people than those small
franchise stores.


Gee, HD and Lowes locally owned. Who knew?


The word 'owned' was meant to include managers.


Not usually, that is what confused me. Managers are usually
employees, drones like the rest of them at HD and Lowes. Also, are TV
and Ace franchises? I thought they were like HWI (now the Do-It Centers)
and were purchasing co-operatives.


Google - "Ace Hardware franchise" or "True Value franchise".
Franchises are wholly dependent on the franchise provider for their
goods. They can't buy from other providers.
I knew someone who once 'owned', or 'managed', if you will, a Carvel Ice
cream store. They were not even allowed to buy their milk from other
than the Carvel company. If they ran out of Carvel milk, they wouldn't
be allowed to get it from the local grocery store, they would have to
close down until they received a Carvel delivery.
Every sale that Carvel advertised in the media had to be adhered to in
the local franchises, at the expense of those franchise owners.
Yeah, Tom was a real f**k.


--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

wrote the following:
On Fri, 03 Sep 2010 15:57:38 -0400, willshak
wrote:


Mark Lloyd wrote the following:

[snip]



Small town here. Maybe that makes a difference. Local employees. Meet
you at the entrance and ask if they can help. All very pleasent to talk
to. When I buy 4x8 sheets of plywood they cut to size no charge. Totally
different that when I go to a large town and happened to buy and item
there. But I do most of my buying at the local Ace Hardware (for past 30
years) WW


There used to be a couple of small, old hardware stores around here. One
was an Ace and the other a True Value. Both had helpful employees who
knew about the products they sell. I would go to one of those stores when
I needed help deciding just what part to get. Both stores are out of
business now, after Lowes opened.

Don't use True Value and Ace Hardware stores as examples of 'local
businesses". They are both franchise stores, doncha know?
Maybe local people 'owned' them and they employed local residents, so do
the HD and Lowes stores, and they employ more people than those small
franchise stores.

Home depot is NOT a Franchise store - at least in Canada. They are
ALL Corporate stores. I believe that is true in the USA as well.


I didn't say HD or L was a franchise store. I said AH and TV were
franchise stores.

There is no "local ownership" involved - while Home Hardware, as an
example, is TOTALLY DEALER OWNED.



--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

On Sep 3, 3:51*pm, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article ,

wrote:
And the "walmartization" of retail has meant that some 80%+ of retail
jobs are PART TIME, with NO BENEFITS. - and close to minimum wage.

The walmartization of the retail, indeed many other forms of commerce,
is a direct result of what the market wants. We don't want to pay the
extra money for quality or service, so we don't get it. I think Pogo got
it right: "We have met the enemy and he is us".

WalMart has, for better or worse depending on your point of view,
provided what the public wanted at a price they wanted to pay. They
have been successful at what they do which is play on the economies of
scale along with the maximum in automation and the minimum in pay. As
long as we, the consumer, is happy with the outcome and continue to
shop there they will continue to be successful. The same holds for
the loss of US manufacturing. The consumer has spoken and they aren't
willing to pay additional for US made goods when there is no price or
quality benefit to be seen. From the Corporations standpoint, its all
about survival and they will do what they have to do in order to
survive.

On 9/3/2010 10:26 AM, willshak wrote:
snip

I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about
out of patience with the Despot.

Maybe you 'felt better' because the AC was set a little cooler at Lowes?


No.

I felt better because I knew I could get help if I needed it. I knew
the return I had would be no problem.

I only come to expect problems from the Despot anymore, and they
don't disappoint.

Jeff

Mark Lloyd wrote:

Most of the time I go into a store, I'm either just looking around or
can find what I want easier than I can explain it. In either of those
cases, I'd rather not be bothered with "can I help you?". Of course,
it's nice to have someone you can ask when you need to.

BTW, that's even you know just what you want but don't know what to
CALL it, such as "where are those bent metal things with screws you
can use to stop hose leaks?" (hose clamps).

And 'ya know, sometimes you don't know what those thingamajigs are until you
just "hang out" for a few minutes, quietly, and take stock of what kind of
parts they have. I wouldn't know half of what I know if I didn't have the
opportunity to just look at things and make a mental note of their
construction and/or purpose.

Maybe it's just me, but I used to find a lot of entertainment as a boy
perusing the shelves of the local (wooden floored) hardware store.

Jon

On Sep 3, 6:20*pm, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:
BobR wrote:

I have spent a lot of time recently at several Home Depot stores in
the area and my experience has been very similar to yours. *It seems
that the moment I walk in the door they are like a swarm of ants,
crawling all over me. *While I appreciate the service I am very
concerned that it stems from a fear that each of them have over
loosing their job and they are trying to make sure they are not the
next on the chopping block. *From what I could see, their fears my
very well be justified by the small number of customers compared to
employees at any given time. *I sometimes take my lunch hour to pickup
supplies from a Home Depot near my office, other times I stop at one
on the way home and on weekends alternate between two Home Depot
stores almost equal distance from my house. *I frequent a fifth store
next door to the nearest Rockler woodworkers store. *All of the stores
seem to be in the same situation, more employees than customers at any
given time and that includes during the week and on weekends.

On the opposite end of the scale, the local Lowes's stores seem to
operate at times without any employees and getting help with anything
can seem almost impossible. *They didn't have any more customers than
the Home Depot stores with very few employees and those employees
didn't seem to care if they helped you or not...if you could find one.

lol, "swarm of ants" describes exactly what happens sometimes. *Personally,
I am of the opinion that customers should be left to their own devices
unless and until they actually ask for help. *Tidy the shelves, look busy,
but stay out of people's business unless they need you.

This was the way a trip to the hardware store has always been, and while I
do realize that bored housewives/househusbands might appreciate the
handholding, it shouldn't be all that hard to train the help to recognize
the difference.

Jon- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

They are competing for their jobs. The one who sells least, the one
who finishes his coffee break last, the one who is least pro-active,
loses his/her job. You should feel sorry for them. Where's your
christian goodwill?

On 9/4/2010 12:18 AM, Jon Danniken wrote:
Mark Lloyd wrote:

Most of the time I go into a store, I'm either just looking around or
can find what I want easier than I can explain it. In either of those
cases, I'd rather not be bothered with "can I help you?". Of course,
it's nice to have someone you can ask when you need to.

BTW, that's even you know just what you want but don't know what to
CALL it, such as "where are those bent metal things with screws you
can use to stop hose leaks?" (hose clamps).

And 'ya know, sometimes you don't know what those thingamajigs are until you
just "hang out" for a few minutes, quietly, and take stock of what kind of
parts they have. I wouldn't know half of what I know if I didn't have the
opportunity to just look at things and make a mental note of their
construction and/or purpose.

Maybe it's just me, but I used to find a lot of entertainment as a boy
perusing the shelves of the local (wooden floored) hardware store.

Jon



It ain't just you- it runs in my family as well, and probably for most
of the regulars on here too. Even now as a grownup, I can waste way too
much time hanging out in hardware/tool aisles, like a kid in a toy store.

--
aem sends...

On 9/3/2010 8:47 AM, cubby wrote:
On Sep 3, 12:23 am, Jeff wrote:
I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to help
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one
seems to care.

It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that isn't
all stores, but most.

I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about
out of patience with the Despot.

Jeff

I live 1 mile from a Menards and HD right next to each other. Except
in February they bulldozed Menards to build a bigger/better version,
leaving me at the mercy of HD (the next closest is alternative is
about 15 miles away). Here are some of the things I have observed
about HD:

1 Returned product - three times now I have bought power tools at
full price, only to get home and find out that someone has already
"borrowed" them (used them for a project, returned them - missing
parts of course). This really irritates me, and I now open everything
before leaving the store. The worst case was a pneumatic flooring
nailer. They argued with me at first, denying that it was a return.
But when I showed them the papaerwork in the box with the "borrower's"
personal details etc, they accepted it (no apology of course). The
fact that the thing was scuffed up (must have been used for a pretty
big project) and missing the hammer should have been a clue. As far
as I'm aware, many stores have a policy of not selling open box stuff
unless identified as such and marked down. Don't know why they do
this at HD but it really ****es me off.

2 When I first went to this store several years ago, most of the
staff seemed to be very knowledgeable, ex-trades in some cases. Now
they have changed there policy and favor attractive young females who
really don't seem to know much about anything. It's quite a blatant
strategy - they're everywhere. I'm all for equality, but product
knowledge should come first. The ones I have spoken to don't seem to
know anything more than basic store layout. And I echo what someone
else said about them standing around chatting - infuriating, and often
they ignore you if you go stand by them (you have to actually jump in
and say hey).

3 Damned self-checkout. Often it's the only lane open. And the
stupid scale that flips out if it thinks you haven't put something in
the bagging area. I almost always need an intervention from an actual
human.

I like stores with this.

4 Pricing is generally high, but on some things that contractors
would buy a lot they are competitive. Basically they are out to rip
off the DIYer. Best example is drywall - 8x4 sheets are the same
price as closest Menards, but they also sell these stupid 2x2 squares
(for small repairs) for about 80% of the price of an 8x4 sheet!
Hilarious.

March 2011 will be opening of the new Menards, and I can't wait to say
bye bye BORG


I used to like Menard's just fine. For me, it's lowe's v. HD. Since I
have to price against something, I usually have to look at things twice.
This doesn't make me the quickest cat.
--
Uno

aemeijers wrote:
On 9/4/2010 12:18 AM, Jon Danniken wrote:

Maybe it's just me, but I used to find a lot of entertainment as a
boy perusing the shelves of the local (wooden floored) hardware
store.

It ain't just you- it runs in my family as well, and probably for most
of the regulars on here too. Even now as a grownup, I can waste way
too much time hanging out in hardware/tool aisles, like a kid in a
toy store.

I live near a hardware store like that. Same wide planked creaky
wooden floors. They even have a counter where you can bring
your knives/tools/whatever to be sharpened. Bins of nails and screws.
All kinds of stuff, I could hang out for quite a while. I buy what I can
there because I don't want to see the place go, not that they're
hurting for customers.

nancy

On Fri, 3 Sep 2010 09:08:13 -0700 (PDT), harry wrote:

On Sep 3, 2:05*pm, keith wrote:
On Sep 3, 2:14*am, harry wrote:





On Sep 3, 6:23*am, Jeff Thies wrote:

* *I'm in HD's home town and have watched them for quite some time.

I've noticed that HD is going through a new phase. They had been going
through one of being more friendly but not any better otherwise.

* *Now they seem indifferent, event resentful of taking time out to help
customers. Department Managers would rather not be bothered, no one
seems to care.

* *It's gotten intolerable to get anything done in a HD. Now, that isn't
all stores, but most.

* *I think they are subcontracting out some kind of customer service
management and this has destroyed what little company spirit the
employees had.

* *At any rate, from my view, it looks like a death spiral. Anyone else
notice this?

* *I went to a Lowes today and immediately felt better. I'm just about
out of patience with the Despot.

* *Jeff

It's hard to be cheerful when your job's in jeopardy...............

Is that why you Europeons are such an ugly lot these days?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

There's nobody fatter and more ugly than USAians. That's how we all
know over here that CSI is fiction. Not a fat ugly git in sight. ;-)

Not a tooth in sight, either.