Our 14 year old Ruud with an SEER of 12 has rusted out and is leakng
freon. We contacted the a/c company which installed the unit when the
house was built and they are recommending replacing the old unit with a
Rheem 3.5 ton SEER 13 RAND042JAZ.
My concerns a
1- SEER is kinda low. Wouldn't a 14 or higher SEER be better?
2-I don't know if this is a scroll or reciprocating compressor. I've
read on-line that scroll is better. Is this correct?
3-I don't know of the motor is one or two speed. Two would be more
efficient, right?
4-I am of the opinion that this unit would use Freon. Wouldn't a
Puron-using unit be better in the long run?
Any suggestions or comments would be appreciated.
BoJo

wrote in message
oups.com...
Our 14 year old Ruud with an SEER of 12 has rusted out and is leakng
freon. We contacted the a/c company which installed the unit when the
house was built and they are recommending replacing the old unit with a
Rheem 3.5 ton SEER 13 RAND042JAZ.
My concerns a
1- SEER is kinda low. Wouldn't a 14 or higher SEER be better?

Depends..where are you located?
If the installing company does not know how to size duct and units correctly
with the higher seer units, you can ..thats CAN have a moisture problem.

2-I don't know if this is a scroll or reciprocating compressor. I've
read on-line that scroll is better. Is this correct?

Scroll.

3-I don't know of the motor is one or two speed. Two would be more
efficient, right?
4-I am of the opinion that this unit would use Freon. Wouldn't a
Puron-using unit be better in the long run?


You mean, you dont know if you want a R22 or a R410a unit...
R22 is gonna be around for a while....look at the price difference if they
can get you a R22 unit, and see what you think..
Most makes 13SEER or higher are now R410 and its fine, provided that the
installers replace the line sets..

Any suggestions or comments would be appreciated.
BoJo

They go alot higher than 14 seer, up to 19? and so do costs but
efficiency increase is not linear, it declines with each seer up. Tranes
site has a seer sheet showing seer increase and $ saved. You have to
run your numbers and get other bidders to help you better. A load
calculation in writing is also a good idea incase you are oversized,
higher seer units ive heard don`t pull out as much humidity so sizing is
important. 13 seer might soon the new minimum you can buy.

Hi, CBHVAC,
We live in south Florida, where high humidity is a daily occurrence.
The old unit is Ruud Achiever 12, 3.5 ton, which is leaking
refrigerant, aka R22.
The quote for the new 3.5 ton 13 SEER Rheem says, "connected to
existing refrigerant and electrical lines". So, I assume the new one
will use R22, too.
Isn't R22 being phased out and gone after 2010? What'll happen in
2011, when we run low on refrigerant?
BoJo

Hi, m Ransley,
I checked out the Trane web site, but didn't find the page you referred
to (a seer sheet showing seer increase and $ saved), but I found some
phone numbers for local dealers, so on Monday I'll call and ask for a
bid.
Thx,
BoJo

wrote in message
ups.com...
Hi, CBHVAC,
We live in south Florida, where high humidity is a daily occurrence.
The old unit is Ruud Achiever 12, 3.5 ton, which is leaking
refrigerant, aka R22.
The quote for the new 3.5 ton 13 SEER Rheem says, "connected to
existing refrigerant and electrical lines". So, I assume the new one
will use R22, too.

Never assume...ASK.
If they are using R410a (Puron) and reusing your old lines, they are
screwing you.

Isn't R22 being phased out and gone after 2010?

The phase out started this year.

What'll happen in
2011, when we run low on refrigerant?

Wont happen..how much R12 you want? It was gone years ago, yet I can still
go order a pallet of it if I want.

2025 is the magic year, and THEN you might have to worry...but its
doubtful..and even then...given that the life expectancy of your unit is
12-15 years, depending on your area, you still have time to use the proven
cheaper refrigerant.
Dont get me wrong...I am certified in R410a, and given the right install,
its fine. The units look alike, but they are totally different animals. You
get some putz that has no clue about the stuff, and the most expensive Puron
unit will suck.

Big suggestion here, and you will see me talk about it alot over the next
few months...if you DO go with a 13+ unit, INSIST that the installing
contractor do a manual D and PROVE to you that the existing duct will work
100% with it...Sometimes it will, more often it wont.
Higher SEER units require more airflow. Some of the 14SEER units 2.5 tons
and up take a 5 ton capacity air handler...thats ALOT more air to cram down
the ducts that were originally sized for a lower SEER unit with less air
flow.
Expect it to run longer...thats ok...longer run times wont equate to higher
bills if its sized right. You are in a high humidity area, and higher SEER
units have to be installed right to control that...and that will result
normally, not always, but normally in a system that when its put in right,
(system, meaning, both units, and duct...the duct system is part of the
entire system ) they will tend to run longer, and believe it or not, with
the fewer stops and start, it will last a bit longer too.
Another hint...unless you trust the installer 150%, get another couple of
quotes. You might have to pay for them, since a couple of hours of time will
be used running the numbers to make sure you are getttng what you pay for,
but in the long run, its the cheapest way to go.

BoJo

wrote in message
oups.com...
Our 14 year old Ruud with an SEER of 12 has
rusted out and is leakng
freon. We contacted the a/c company which
installed the unit when the
house was built and they are recommending
replacing the old unit with a
Rheem 3.5 ton SEER 13 RAND042JAZ.
My concerns a
1- SEER is kinda low. Wouldn't a 14 or higher
SEER be better?
2-I don't know if this is a scroll or
reciprocating compressor. I've
read on-line that scroll is better. Is this
correct?
3-I don't know of the motor is one or two speed.
Two would be more
efficient, right?
4-I am of the opinion that this unit would use
Freon. Wouldn't a
Puron-using unit be better in the long run?
Any suggestions or comments would be appreciated.
BoJo


http://www.trane.com/residential/pro...ers/xl19i.aspx

On 3 Dec 2005 18:50:52 -0800, "
wrote:

Hi, m Ransley,
I checked out the Trane web site, but didn't find the page you referred
to (a seer sheet showing seer increase and $ saved), but I found some
phone numbers for local dealers, so on Monday I'll call and ask for a
bid.


Apparently one should be real careful with the Trane site. I just
nosed around there and found the following:

I used the "customizer" and it spit out data for three packaged heat
pump units: XE1200, XL1200 and XL1400. (I would think it would try
giving me a XL1600 option too, but I digress)

The HSPF for these are given as: 12.8, 13.75 and 15.6 respectively.
The SEER a 12, 12.5 and 14.4. Yet when I look up the data for
these, for example:

http://www.trane.com/Residential/Pro...HP_XL1400.aspx

I see something like "14.00 SEER Range with up to 7.95 HSPF" for the
XL1400.

Then when I used the "comparison" feature, the XL1400 SEER is given as
"up to 13.75."

So the SEER seems to between 0 and 14.4 and the HSPF is between 7.95
and 15.6.

1- SEER is kinda low. Wouldn't a 14 or higher SEER be better?
CY: Higher efficiency costs more up front. But can cost less in the long
run. Did you ask if they had more efficient models to choose?

2-I don't know if this is a scroll or reciprocating compressor. I've
read on-line that scroll is better. Is this correct?
CY: Scrolls tend to be quieter, and more energy efficient. The other thing
you can do for more efficiency is to use a TXV instead of an orifice (or
"piston") for the evaporator. Ask your HVAC company about that.


3-I don't know of the motor is one or two speed. Two would be more
efficient, right?
CY: As I understand, the two speed allows the outdoor fan to run slower when
there is less demand for air flow.


4-I am of the opinion that this unit would use Freon. Wouldn't a
Puron-using unit be better in the long run?
CY: Puron is fairly new technology. It also has problems with absorbing
moisture from the air. If it were my house, I would choose the proven R-22.
It will be available for a couple years after the phase out, as many guys
will stock up.


Any suggestions or comments would be appreciated.
CY: Ask if the company's techs have haircuts, and if they wear earrings (for
men this is a concern). Avoid companies whose techs have long hair (for men)
or earrings. Also avoid companies where they use a lot of crude language, or
where they try to pressure you into making a rapid decision. Might also want
to ask if the techs they use are legal citizens of the country of residence,
and if all the techs have EPA cards. Also ask if the techs have green
cards -- avoid companies who use techs with green cards.


BoJo

When they did away with R-12 in 1993, there was a supply around for a couple
years. People stocked up, and then there was reclaimed gas. And then the
substitutes came out.

Not a serious issue.

If you get a Puron unit, it will probably require new lines and evaporator.
Don't know for certain, I've never worked with puron. But I do know that
puron has different pressures. Probably also different flow rates and such.

--

Christopher A. Young
Do good work.
It's longer in the short run
but shorter in the long run.
..
..


wrote in message
ups.com...
Hi, CBHVAC,
We live in south Florida, where high humidity is a daily occurrence.
The old unit is Ruud Achiever 12, 3.5 ton, which is leaking
refrigerant, aka R22.
The quote for the new 3.5 ton 13 SEER Rheem says, "connected to
existing refrigerant and electrical lines". So, I assume the new one
will use R22, too.
Isn't R22 being phased out and gone after 2010? What'll happen in
2011, when we run low on refrigerant?
BoJo

Right Wes, apparently one should be carefull nosing around the Trane
site.

Look at the Trane XL 19i 19.5 seer

Look at their Seer sheet, it shows operating costs of apx 8 seer and
up.

"m Ransley" wrote in message
...
Right Wes, apparently one should be carefull nosing around the Trane
site.

Look at the Trane XL 19i 19.5 seer

Yea...that POS is only 19.5 SEER in ONE tonnage.
ONE.
So...if you want a 5 ton 19.5 SEER unit, there aint one.

I havent looked at the site, but I probably need to compare what they list
there, with the dealer sheets I have here.


Look at their Seer sheet, it shows operating costs of apx 8 seer and
up.

Hi, CBHVAC,
You said, "...if you DO go with a 13+ unit, INSIST that the installing
contractor do a manual D and PROVE to you that the existing duct will
work
100% with it...Sometimes it will, more often it wont"
I don't know what you mean when you say manual D. Could you elaborate,
please?
BoJo

Not quite CB the XL 19i is available in 2.5, 3, 4 and 5 seer.

That was 2.5, 3, 4 and 5 ton in 19i model , sorry I said seer

"m Ransley" wrote in message
...
Not quite CB the XL 19i is available in 2.5, 3, 4 and 5 seer.


Hummm....not according to what I have from Trane here...
The XL19i IS indeed available in 2.5, 3, 4, and 5 ton...
But ONLY ONE is rated at 19.5SEER.
ONE
the 2.5 ton model.
Its more American Standard marketing that the public eats up..they fail, as
you did, to see the UP TO comments.

Its like Carrier and their 96.7% furnace, only one is 96.7% efficient,
the smallest unit a 38000 btu unit, which few need such a small size,
they acheive it by adding 20 lb or so of metal than the next higher
output size.

Ok so 19.5 is the highest in that line but the real point was Wes
thought 14 seer was Tranes most efficient line up when in fact there are
several better than 14 seer

I'm not CBHVAC.

wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi, CBHVAC,
You said, "...if you DO go with a 13+ unit, INSIST that the installing
contractor do a manual D and PROVE to you that the existing duct will
work
100% with it...Sometimes it will, more often it wont"
I don't know what you mean when you say manual D. Could you elaborate,
please?

Manual D is the duct design guidelines put out by ACCA, Air Conditioning
Contractors of America.

"HeatMan" wrote in message
. ..
I'm not CBHVAC.

Aint ya glad? LOL


wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi, CBHVAC,
You said, "...if you DO go with a 13+ unit, INSIST that the installing
contractor do a manual D and PROVE to you that the existing duct will
work
100% with it...Sometimes it will, more often it wont"
I don't know what you mean when you say manual D. Could you elaborate,
please?

Manual D is the duct design guidelines put out by ACCA, Air Conditioning
Contractors of America.



Yup..didnt see this one...musta cleared the server and missed it.

Hi, all,

Just spoke to a Trane contractor. He recommended replacing the entire
unit, inside and out, because both parts are 14 years old and because
we could increase the SEER to 15 if the parts were properly matched.
He also noted that our current air handler lacks a plenum for mixing
the cool air prior to sending it out into the duct!
He recommended the R22 system because 410 is still "beta" (not all the
bugs have been worked out yet).
Any thoughts?
BoJo

Got quotes on Trane
1- 3.5 ton 15 SEER 2TTX5042 Condenser with TWE040E Air Handler, 10
years parts AND labor
2- 3.5 ton 14.75 SEER 2TTX4042 Condenser with TWE049E Air Handler, 10
years parts, 2 years labor

Option 1 costs $700 more.

Suggestions? Ideas?

BoJo

Grandeloquent reply.
BTW, option 2 contains a mis-matched pair; a 3.5 ton compressor with a
4 ton air handler. I suppose that's inconsequential.

Grandiloquent reply.
BTW, option 2 contains a mis-matched pair; a 3.5 ton compressor with a
4 ton air handler. I suppose that's inconsequential.

wrote in message
ups.com...
Grandiloquent reply.
BTW, option 2 contains a mis-matched pair; a 3.5 ton compressor with a
4 ton air handler. I suppose that's inconsequential.

..
Actually, that IS a matched pair.

No one seems to get the part about how higher SEERs require more air flow...
Hope hes running a manual D on the duct too, cause most of the time, go too
high in SEER over what you had and your duct is worthless.

http://www.energystar.gov/index.cfm?...pr_tax_credits
Tax Credits for Homeowners:
There are different levels of credit depending on the type of
improvement made, but the maximum amount of homeowner credit for all
improvements combined cannot exceed $500 during the two year period of
the tax credit. This tax credit applies to improvements made from
January 1, 2006 through December 31, 2007.

Eligible measures a

Added insulation to walls, ceilings, or other part
of the building envelope

Replacement windows

High-efficiency gas, oil, and propane furnaces and
boilers

High-efficiency central air conditioning units,
including air-source and ground-source heat pumps

High-efficiency fans for heating and cooling
systems

High-efficiency water heaters, including heat pump
water heaters

Incentive amounts a

Added insulation: 10% of cost up to $500

Replacement windows: 10% of cost up to $200

Furnaces and boilers: $150 for qualifying units

Central air conditioning units: $300 for
qualifying units

Fans for heating and cooling systems: $50 for
qualifying units

Water heaters: $300 for qualifying units

ENERGY POLICY ACT OF 2005
DRAFT SUMMARY OF TAX CREDITS FOR HOMEOWNERS¹
(US Treasury has not yet provided final interpretation for IRS use)