Electronics Repair (sci.electronics.repair) Discussion of repairing electronic equipment. Topics include requests for assistance, where to obtain servicing information and parts, techniques for diagnosis and repair, and annecdotes about success, failures and problems.

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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

The weatherhead was yanked off the service entrance conduit extending from
the roof by a fallen branch. The ground / neutral conductor of the power drop
broke a few strands, and the strain relief / insulator for the ground /
neutral cable is broken.

I'm going to do this myself. I called the power company to ask about how the
disconnect/reconnect happens during the repair. The guy tried to answer my
question but ultimately didn't.

I want to replace the broken items and the conductors that go to the load
panel. I want to keep the load panel, old as it is, and all other salvageable
components because in the spring the house is going to be bulldozed to make
way for a new home, and it's not worth it to replace it.

The power guy said that power isn't turned off, per se, but that it is
disconnected from the old conductors and connected to the new ones by the
power company crew. I said that I didn't understand how this could be the
case if I want to replace the conductors in the conduit, but we couldn't seem
to get to where he understood what I was asking.

How is power disconnect / reconnect handled if one is replacing the
conductors, and not installing a new load panel / conduit, etc. From my phone
call experience, it seems like the power company hardly comes across a repair
question such as this.

This is in Maryland.

Thanks,
--
John English

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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

You're messing with something you shouldn't be touching. I built
and remodeled for 45 years and did my own wiring on all the
residential encluding running a 400A service into a couple houses.
Still, I wouldn't touch this. It needs to be pig tailed and
*dead* when you mess with something like this. (They say when a
person gets fried like that it really stinks. Don't prove it.)




"John E." wrote in message
news.net
The weatherhead was yanked off the service entrance
conduit extending from the roof by a fallen branch. The
ground / neutral conductor of the power drop broke a few
strands, and the strain relief / insulator for the ground
/ neutral cable is broken.

I'm going to do this myself. I called the power company
to ask about how the disconnect/reconnect happens during
the repair. The guy tried to answer my question but
ultimately didn't.

I want to replace the broken items and the conductors
that go to the load panel. I want to keep the load panel,
old as it is, and all other salvageable components
because in the spring the house is going to be bulldozed
to make way for a new home, and it's not worth it to
replace it.

The power guy said that power isn't turned off, per se,
but that it is disconnected from the old conductors and
connected to the new ones by the power company crew. I
said that I didn't understand how this could be the case
if I want to replace the conductors in the conduit, but
we couldn't seem to get to where he understood what I was
asking.

How is power disconnect / reconnect handled if one is
replacing the conductors, and not installing a new load
panel / conduit, etc. From my phone call experience, it
seems like the power company hardly comes across a repair
question such as this.

This is in Maryland.

Thanks,
--
John English


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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?


"John E." wrote in message
news.net...
The weatherhead was yanked off the service entrance conduit extending from
the roof by a fallen branch. The ground / neutral conductor of the power
drop
broke a few strands, and the strain relief / insulator for the ground /
neutral cable is broken.

I'm going to do this myself. I called the power company to ask about how
the
disconnect/reconnect happens during the repair. The guy tried to answer my
question but ultimately didn't.

I want to replace the broken items and the conductors that go to the load
panel. I want to keep the load panel, old as it is, and all other
salvageable
components because in the spring the house is going to be bulldozed to
make
way for a new home, and it's not worth it to replace it.

The power guy said that power isn't turned off, per se, but that it is
disconnected from the old conductors and connected to the new ones by the
power company crew. I said that I didn't understand how this could be the
case if I want to replace the conductors in the conduit, but we couldn't
seem
to get to where he understood what I was asking.

How is power disconnect / reconnect handled if one is replacing the
conductors, and not installing a new load panel / conduit, etc. From my
phone
call experience, it seems like the power company hardly comes across a
repair
question such as this.

This is in Maryland.

Thanks,
--
John English


I recently replaced the meter panel and service entrance cable on my house.
The electric co required an inspection of the meter panel install and wiring
to the existing line from the street. The inspector notified the electric co
(PECO) and an appointment was made for the change over. The change is made
while the wires are hot, nothing is shut off. I believe an electrician can
do the repair also.


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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

"John E." wrote:

The weatherhead was yanked off the service entrance conduit extending from
the roof by a fallen branch. The ground / neutral conductor of the power drop
broke a few strands, and the strain relief / insulator for the ground /
neutral cable is broken.

I'm going to do this myself. I called the power company to ask about how the
disconnect/reconnect happens during the repair. The guy tried to answer my
question but ultimately didn't.

I want to replace the broken items and the conductors that go to the load
panel. I want to keep the load panel, old as it is, and all other salvageable
components because in the spring the house is going to be bulldozed to make
way for a new home, and it's not worth it to replace it.

The power guy said that power isn't turned off, per se, but that it is
disconnected from the old conductors and connected to the new ones by the
power company crew. I said that I didn't understand how this could be the
case if I want to replace the conductors in the conduit, but we couldn't seem
to get to where he understood what I was asking.

How is power disconnect / reconnect handled if one is replacing the
conductors, and not installing a new load panel / conduit, etc. From my phone
call experience, it seems like the power company hardly comes across a repair
question such as this.

This is in Maryland.


You might want to run this question by your local building/electrical
inspector. The work you do on your residence will have to pass
inspection. Some power companies* will not reconnect until the
inspection is completed successfully, but beyond that, they aren't
concerned with the repairs done to your equipment. The inspector will
tell you what upgrades will be required to meet current code.

*In many cases, the power company and inspection authority are separate.
There are a few (municipal) utilities where these may be combined, but
it doesn't seem so from your description above.


--
Paul Hovnanian
------------------------------------------------------------------
It is not enough to succeed. Others must fail. -- Gore Vidal
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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

The power company owns all until it hits the meter. You're messing with
fire, wasting your time.

I have seen setups where a meter at the pole is prior to a weatherhead in
mobile home setup. Or, in a rural area where the meter is on the pole and
the weatherhead is at the house. Residential areas have the weatherhead
prior to the meter. But, this seems to be avoided information by your post.
--
Jonny
"John E." wrote in message
news.net...
The weatherhead was yanked off the service entrance conduit extending from
the roof by a fallen branch. The ground / neutral conductor of the power
drop
broke a few strands, and the strain relief / insulator for the ground /
neutral cable is broken.

I'm going to do this myself. I called the power company to ask about how
the
disconnect/reconnect happens during the repair. The guy tried to answer my
question but ultimately didn't.

I want to replace the broken items and the conductors that go to the load
panel. I want to keep the load panel, old as it is, and all other
salvageable
components because in the spring the house is going to be bulldozed to
make
way for a new home, and it's not worth it to replace it.

The power guy said that power isn't turned off, per se, but that it is
disconnected from the old conductors and connected to the new ones by the
power company crew. I said that I didn't understand how this could be the
case if I want to replace the conductors in the conduit, but we couldn't
seem
to get to where he understood what I was asking.

How is power disconnect / reconnect handled if one is replacing the
conductors, and not installing a new load panel / conduit, etc. From my
phone
call experience, it seems like the power company hardly comes across a
repair
question such as this.

This is in Maryland.

Thanks,
--
John English





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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

This is a matter for the truck and hard hat crowd. Describe it to them
completely and have a power co. employee look at it. If they say it's a
contractor's deal, hire a contractor. The line that goes to your feed
point is a higher voltage IIRC than comes from the distribution/meter
box end to be used (I think by a factor of about 4x).

Paint, siding, windows and haggling points. Electricity isn't.

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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

around here, the service drop on the side of the house belongs to the
homeowner.

if the building is scheduled for demolition, have the power company
take a look and decide if its a hazard, perhaps you can do nothing?

the conduit is likey rusty inside so new wire may not be successfully
pulled thru it

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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

DT:

I installed a new, taller mast and meter base a few feet over from my old
one. The power company came by in the morning and unhooked me, they work HOT.


I swapped the new setup into the main panel and got the city electrical
inspector to check it and tagged it "OK to reconnect". Then the power company


came back and rewired it.

You need to have everything scheduled with the inspector and power crew. They


*will not* hook back up without the tag from the inspector, at least in my
community.


Thank you for your reply. It seems that the answer to my question that the
power util guy didn't give is that they will disconnect HOT and reconnect HOT
after I've installed the new wire and hardware and gotten the inspection
done.

I misstated: the conductors go from the weatherhead to the meter base,
mounted on the wall below the eaves of the roof.

To the "moms" that replied: don't worry, the work is well within my skill set
(I do electrical repair of large 3-phase machines such as printing presses)
and do not want to touch any hot lines.

Thanks to all,
--
John English

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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

Jonny wrote:
The power company owns all until it hits the meter. You're messing with
fire, wasting your time.


The demarcation point between the utilities wires and the premise wiring
is not always the meter enclosure. That point is established by the
states Public Service Commission, Peoples Council, Public Utilities
Commission or a similar body. In many places the demarcation point for
an overhead residential service is the splices between the drop and the
service entry conductors. All repairs needed on the customers side of
the demarcation point is done by the customer or her/his agent.
--
Tom Horne

Well we aren't no thin blue heroes and yet we aren't no blackguards to.
We're just working men and woman most remarkable like you.


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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?


"John E." wrote in message
news.net...

To the "moms" that replied: don't worry, the work is well within my skill
set
(I do electrical repair of large 3-phase machines such as printing
presses)
and do not want to touch any hot lines.


Then you can work hot if you clearly understand the safety rules and have
the proper equipment.














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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?



If the power company won't disconnect and reconnect the power drop (within a
reasonable period, say 24 hours), I may have to have an electrician do this.
But the one estimate I got was $3000 for that small job.

Thanks again,
--
John English


around here the power company charges 400 bucks to disconnect and
reconnect.

you might consider just putting up a new drop along side the old
powered one, new meter can then pull mewter and finish connections then
have inspected and just ONE trip for power company. plus you will have
power while working.

DO CHECK IN ADVANCE WITH THE INSPECTOR SO YOU KNOW IF THEY WILL DEMAND
UPGRADING TO NEW GROUNDS AND ALL NEW EQUIPTEMENT they may not approve
reuse of old conduit etc etc......

if house burns down and people die their reputation and job is on the
line.....

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"John E." wrote in message
news.net...

My comfort / safety zone is to not work with anything hot. The closest I
come
is pulling wires to a load panel that is live, but I won't work on hot
conductors.


Well, it is doable. But live line work requires careful study of the
situation first. Electrician's Motto:

"One flash and you're ash"!




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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

GregS wrote:
In article .net, wrote:
The weatherhead was yanked off the service entrance conduit extending from
the roof by a fallen branch. The ground / neutral conductor of the power drop
broke a few strands, and the strain relief / insulator for the ground /
neutral cable is broken.

I'm going to do this myself. I called the power company to ask about how the
disconnect/reconnect happens during the repair. The guy tried to answer my
question but ultimately didn't.


I would want to search more. Normally here, the electrician connects
up the main wires, live, I guess, or at least thats how the guy installed
a new service at my old home. Disconnectiong the meter does
nothing for the stuff in front of the meter. If you dn't do this for a living, I would stay away.
By the way, a new service cost me about $1000.

greg


I put in a new service entrance this past summer. The town/inspector
let me pull the permit to do the panel but I had to get an electrician
to do the outside work. He did the new meter box, weather head, and
entrance cable. He also did the cut over. He did it live, one conductor
at a time.
The power company was notified but didn't do an inspection or anything
else. In fact the seal on the meter where we swapped it from old box to
new is still cut. Here in MA they're fairly lame.
So yes the cut over is done live. But who does what when is a very
local situation between the town/inspector, power company and home
owner. I'd start with your local inspector but if you're in the trades
you should know that.


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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?


"John E." wrote in message
news.net...
The weatherhead was yanked off the service entrance conduit extending from
the roof by a fallen branch. The ground / neutral conductor of the power
drop
broke a few strands, and the strain relief / insulator for the ground /
neutral cable is broken.

I'm going to do this myself. I called the power company to ask about how
the
disconnect/reconnect happens during the repair. The guy tried to answer my
question but ultimately didn't.

I want to replace the broken items and the conductors that go to the load
panel. I want to keep the load panel, old as it is, and all other
salvageable
components because in the spring the house is going to be bulldozed to
make
way for a new home, and it's not worth it to replace it.

The power guy said that power isn't turned off, per se, but that it is
disconnected from the old conductors and connected to the new ones by the
power company crew. I said that I didn't understand how this could be the
case if I want to replace the conductors in the conduit, but we couldn't
seem
to get to where he understood what I was asking.

How is power disconnect / reconnect handled if one is replacing the
conductors, and not installing a new load panel / conduit, etc. From my
phone
call experience, it seems like the power company hardly comes across a
repair
question such as this.

This is in Maryland.


I'd recommend against it. In most jurisdictions, the power company 'owns'
the weatherhead and drop to the meter, you own from the meter box on. You
can work on your side easy enough by having the power company come pull the
meter. But in most areas, they won't re-install until the work is inspected
and tagged. So you have to have your 'ducks in a row', ready to go.

In NY, if it was buried service, the power company is only responsible to
the transformer vault. You're responsible for maintaining the underground
feed from the vault to the meter.

In most areas, the power company is responsible for maintenance from the
pole to the meter. If there has been damage on the weatherhead or drop to
the meter base, it's quite likely they will come out and repair it for you.
Here in NY, if you're within about 100' of the road, they'll do all of it
for no charge. Beyond that, the price gets kind of steep, but *they* still
do the work.

daestrom

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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

In alt.engineering.electrical Homer J Simpson wrote:

| Then you can work hot if you clearly understand the safety rules and have
| the proper equipment.

Working hot on 120/240 is certainly not within my comfort zone. Yet I
would feel entirely comfortable having up to 600 volts coming into my
home and dropping it down to 120/240 with my own transformer, and using
it direct on some big appliances if they made versions for such voltage
as long as I had a separate main isolation disconnect for it.

But I admit I did replace a receptacle hot once. But that was when I
was stupid (i.e. in college). And I didn't even let any of the bright
blue pixies pop loose.

--
|---------------------------------------/----------------------------------|
| Phil Howard KA9WGN (ka9wgn.ham.org) / Do not send to the address below |
| first name lower case at ipal.net / |
|------------------------------------/-------------------------------------|
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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

"Thomas D. Horne, FF EMT" wrote in message
hlink.net...
Jonny wrote:
The power company owns all until it hits the meter. You're messing with
fire, wasting your time.


The demarcation point between the utilities wires and the premise wiring
is not always the meter enclosure. That point is established by the
states Public Service Commission, Peoples Council, Public Utilities
Commission or a similar body. In many places the demarcation point for an
overhead residential service is the splices between the drop and the
service entry conductors. All repairs needed on the customers side of the
demarcation point is done by the customer or her/his agent.


Agreed. But, not true for all areas of the U.S, states,
counties/villages/municipalites, electrical companies and coops. See "But,
this seems to be avoided information by your post." which you deleted in
your reply. You, nor I, don't know what applies in reference to this
individual case.
--
Jonny


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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

"John E." wrote in message
news.net...
DT:

I installed a new, taller mast and meter base a few feet over from my old
one. The power company came by in the morning and unhooked me, they work
HOT.


I swapped the new setup into the main panel and got the city electrical
inspector to check it and tagged it "OK to reconnect". Then the power
company


came back and rewired it.

You need to have everything scheduled with the inspector and power crew.
They


*will not* hook back up without the tag from the inspector, at least in
my
community.


Thank you for your reply. It seems that the answer to my question that the
power util guy didn't give is that they will disconnect HOT and reconnect
HOT
after I've installed the new wire and hardware and gotten the inspection
done.

I misstated: the conductors go from the weatherhead to the meter base,
mounted on the wall below the eaves of the roof.

To the "moms" that replied: don't worry, the work is well within my skill
set
(I do electrical repair of large 3-phase machines such as printing
presses)
and do not want to touch any hot lines.

Thanks to all,
--
John English


Please don't reply with important information regarding the question itself
if you found the solution. Its insulting.
--
Jonny


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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

Thus spake Homer J Simpson:

Then you can work hot if you clearly understand the safety rules and have the


proper equipment.


Thanks for your input.

My comfort / safety zone is to not work with anything hot. The closest I come
is pulling wires to a load panel that is live, but I won't work on hot
conductors.

If the power company won't disconnect and reconnect the power drop (within a
reasonable period, say 24 hours), I may have to have an electrician do this.
But the one estimate I got was $3000 for that small job.

Thanks again,
--
John English



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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

Some of the responses you have received are not corrent depending on
the utility where you live and I am not familiar with Maryland. Some
utilities go right to the meter socket and others only go to the point
of attachment (insulator by weather head). You should hire a licensed
electrician and he would disconect at weather head under live
conditions, repair the entrance and make connectiions to restore power.
Need to be sure he pulls a permit and notifies local wire inspector
and the inspector notifies the power company. Power company will come
out and replace electricians temp connections and use their own as they
liable for connections from their wire to yours. This is very important
because many times the electrician uses temp connections and never
takes permit and after a while connections break down and customer
could have serious problem. Best thing you can do is get a qualified
licensed electrician that knows and follows proper proceedure for you
power company. If that neutral his only hanging be a few strands you
should have it taken care of asap because if that breaks you could have
serious problems.
John E. wrote:
The weatherhead was yanked off the service entrance conduit extending from
the roof by a fallen branch. The ground / neutral conductor of the power drop
broke a few strands, and the strain relief / insulator for the ground /
neutral cable is broken.

I'm going to do this myself. I called the power company to ask about how the
disconnect/reconnect happens during the repair. The guy tried to answer my
question but ultimately didn't.

I want to replace the broken items and the conductors that go to the load
panel. I want to keep the load panel, old as it is, and all other salvageable
components because in the spring the house is going to be bulldozed to make
way for a new home, and it's not worth it to replace it.

The power guy said that power isn't turned off, per se, but that it is
disconnected from the old conductors and connected to the new ones by the
power company crew. I said that I didn't understand how this could be the
case if I want to replace the conductors in the conduit, but we couldn't seem
to get to where he understood what I was asking.

How is power disconnect / reconnect handled if one is replacing the
conductors, and not installing a new load panel / conduit, etc. From my phone
call experience, it seems like the power company hardly comes across a repair
question such as this.

This is in Maryland.

Thanks,
--
John English


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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?


"John E." wrote in message
news.net...
Dick:

If that neutral his only hanging be a few strands you should have it
taken
care of asap because if that breaks you could have serious problems.


Would you please expand on this statement (why, how, etc.)?

Thanks,
--
John English


The neutral provides a center reference of 120V between the two 240V hot
lines. If the neutral breaks, the center reference will be lost. Some
current can flow through the ground system, but often not enough,
particularly if the house isn't feed by city water with metal pipes. With
the neutral connected, the voltage can drift around. If a heavy current
draw appliance is running on one leg, it can put significant voltage on the
neutral line. This will increase the voltage on appliances connected to the
other phase, often damaging them. It's quite common to have all appliances
that have always on electronics to fail... TV, VCR, microwave, DVD, alarm
clocks, etc.


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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

Dick wrote:
Some of the responses you have received are not corrent depending on
the utility where you live and I am not familiar with Maryland. Some
utilities go right to the meter socket and others only go to the point
of attachment (insulator by weather head). You should hire a licensed
electrician and he would disconect at weather head under live
conditions, repair the entrance and make connectiions to restore power.
Need to be sure he pulls a permit and notifies local wire inspector
and the inspector notifies the power company.


That may or may not apply. If it gets called in as storm damage or an
emergency repair (since the neutral may give out at the demarc), the
Power Co. may send out an electrical contractor to repair it on their
dime. Also, some times the inspection process is waived in cases of
simple emergency repairs. As an electrician who used to do emergency
customer electric service repairs for a Power Co., I would recommend
that he call it in as an emergency repair and see how the ball rolls.
If he is a senior citizen he should mention it to the Power Co. also.

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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

Dick:

If that neutral his only hanging be a few strands you should have it taken
care of asap because if that breaks you could have serious problems.


Would you please expand on this statement (why, how, etc.)?

Thanks,
--
John English

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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

Jonny wrote:
"Thomas D. Horne, FF EMT" wrote in message
hlink.net...
Jonny wrote:
The power company owns all until it hits the meter. You're messing with
fire, wasting your time.

The demarcation point between the utilities wires and the premise wiring
is not always the meter enclosure. That point is established by the
states Public Service Commission, Peoples Council, Public Utilities
Commission or a similar body. In many places the demarcation point for an
overhead residential service is the splices between the drop and the
service entry conductors. All repairs needed on the customers side of the
demarcation point is done by the customer or her/his agent.


Agreed. But, not true for all areas of the U.S, states,
counties/villages/municipalites, electrical companies and coops. See "But,
this seems to be avoided information by your post." which you deleted in
your reply. You, nor I, don't know what applies in reference to this
individual case.


Try again. There is nothing in my post that is untrue. If your saying
the demarcation point varies from place to place I already said that.
In all areas of the US the demarcation point is set by whichever
regulatory agency sets that state's utility tariffs.
--
Tom Horne

"This alternating current stuff is just a fad. It is much too dangerous
for general use." Thomas Alva Edison


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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

On Wed, 25 Oct 2006 21:08:40 -0400, John E.
wrote:

Thus spake Homer J Simpson:

Then you can work hot if you clearly understand the safety rules and have the


proper equipment.


Thanks for your input.

My comfort / safety zone is to not work with anything hot. The closest I come
is pulling wires to a load panel that is live, but I won't work on hot
conductors.

If the power company won't disconnect and reconnect the power drop (within a
reasonable period, say 24 hours), I may have to have an electrician do this.
But the one estimate I got was $3000 for that small job.

Thanks again,


I'll do it for $2999.99 if you supply the beer.

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Default Residential service entrance power drop repair?

You probably paid your electric bill late a few times. Because of
that, your power company wants you dead. This happens quite often.
They intentionally do not answer you in a manner that makes sense so
they can electrocute you. For them, it's all fun and games, and you
wont pay your bill late ever again. This is not a "Drop Repair", it's
a DROP DEAD.

I suggest you make sure your life insurance is paid. Then pray, go to
confession, and receive holy communion before you tackle the job.
When you get to the top of the ladder, make the sign of the cross and
say these words "In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti.
Amen".

Remember, Jesus loves you. You will soon meet him.

Father James Lucas - St. Pauls Catholic Church
-------

On Tue, 24 Oct 2006 19:46:30 -0400, John E.
wrote:

The weatherhead was yanked off the service entrance conduit extending from
the roof by a fallen branch. The ground / neutral conductor of the power drop
broke a few strands, and the strain relief / insulator for the ground /
neutral cable is broken.

I'm going to do this myself. I called the power company to ask about how the
disconnect/reconnect happens during the repair. The guy tried to answer my
question but ultimately didn't.

I want to replace the broken items and the conductors that go to the load
panel. I want to keep the load panel, old as it is, and all other salvageable
components because in the spring the house is going to be bulldozed to make
way for a new home, and it's not worth it to replace it.

The power guy said that power isn't turned off, per se, but that it is
disconnected from the old conductors and connected to the new ones by the
power company crew. I said that I didn't understand how this could be the
case if I want to replace the conductors in the conduit, but we couldn't seem
to get to where he understood what I was asking.

How is power disconnect / reconnect handled if one is replacing the
conductors, and not installing a new load panel / conduit, etc. From my phone
call experience, it seems like the power company hardly comes across a repair
question such as this.

This is in Maryland.

Thanks,


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