The latest issue of Fine Woodworking had a good evaluation article
called "CAD on a budget". It reviewed CAD packages for under $100.
Based on the reviews I decided to get a copy of Design CAD 3D Max. Boy
was I chagrined to find they have DOUBLED the price of the software.
Its now $199. It seems more than slightly coincidental that the price
jumped so much right after a good review in a magazine. I think that
practice stinks and I'll pass on the purchase.

Bob

I stand corrected on my post and I am sorry for misinformation. The
web page for DesignCad has a BUY NOW link that takes you directly to a
page with price listed at $199. However, this is for bundle package
with several products. This is their so-called Platinum bundle and its
very misleading. There is a fine print link at the bottom of the page
that says "No thanks, proceed with original order" where I find out the
CAD package alone is available for $89.95.

Bob

On 9 Sep 2004 20:29:15 -0700, "Bob" wrote:

I stand corrected on my post and I am sorry for misinformation. The
web page for DesignCad has a BUY NOW link that takes you directly to a
page with price listed at $199. However, this is for bundle package
with several products. This is their so-called Platinum bundle and its
very misleading. There is a fine print link at the bottom of the page
that says "No thanks, proceed with original order" where I find out the
CAD package alone is available for $89.95.

Bob


Seems a strange business practice.

Here is a FREE 2D program http://www.cadstd.com/binaries/dlfrom.html

This is a FREE 3D Modeler http://www.ppmodeler.com/ppmodeler/download.php


"Bob" wrote in message
...
The latest issue of Fine Woodworking had a good evaluation article
called "CAD on a budget". It reviewed CAD packages for under $100.
Based on the reviews I decided to get a copy of Design CAD 3D Max. Boy
was I chagrined to find they have DOUBLED the price of the software.
Its now $199. It seems more than slightly coincidental that the price
jumped so much right after a good review in a magazine. I think that
practice stinks and I'll pass on the purchase.

Bob

You normally get what you pay for. :-)
Design Cad has been around for quite some time. IINM, it was once called
Prodesign, the first cad package I taught myself to use.

"oldsalt" wrote in message
...
Here is a FREE 2D program http://www.cadstd.com/binaries/dlfrom.html

This is a FREE 3D Modeler http://www.ppmodeler.com/ppmodeler/download.php


"Bob" wrote in message
...
The latest issue of Fine Woodworking had a good evaluation article
called "CAD on a budget". It reviewed CAD packages for under $100.
Based on the reviews I decided to get a copy of Design CAD 3D Max. Boy
was I chagrined to find they have DOUBLED the price of the software.
Its now $199. It seems more than slightly coincidental that the price
jumped so much right after a good review in a magazine. I think that
practice stinks and I'll pass on the purchase.

Bob

Mark & Juanita wrote in
:

On 9 Sep 2004 20:29:15 -0700, "Bob" wrote:

I stand corrected on my post and I am sorry for misinformation. The
web page for DesignCad has a BUY NOW link that takes you directly to a
page with price listed at $199. However, this is for bundle package
with several products. This is their so-called Platinum bundle and its
very misleading. There is a fine print link at the bottom of the page
that says "No thanks, proceed with original order" where I find out
the
CAD package alone is available for $89.95.

Bob


Seems a strange business practice.




Add on sales are a strange business practice? All that happened is he
said I'd like to purchase product X and they said, in essence, "would
you like to buy the super deluxe bundle which includes product X and
well as products Y,Z and Q? " No, well thank you for your purchase of
product X then. Every retailer on the planet has done this in some form
or another.

In article ,
Mark & Juanita wrote:
On 9 Sep 2004 20:29:15 -0700, "Bob" wrote:

I stand corrected on my post and I am sorry for misinformation. The
web page for DesignCad has a BUY NOW link that takes you directly to a
page with price listed at $199. However, this is for bundle package
with several products. This is their so-called Platinum bundle and its
very misleading. There is a fine print link at the bottom of the page
that says "No thanks, proceed with original order" where I find out the
CAD package alone is available for $89.95.

Bob

Seems a strange business practice.


Maybe somebody should point out to them the legal ramafications of such
'bait and switch' advertising.

On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 10:06:36 -0500, Secret Squirrel
wrote:

Mark & Juanita wrote in
:

On 9 Sep 2004 20:29:15 -0700, "Bob" wrote:

I stand corrected on my post and I am sorry for misinformation. The
web page for DesignCad has a BUY NOW link that takes you directly to a
page with price listed at $199. However, this is for bundle package
with several products. This is their so-called Platinum bundle and its
very misleading. There is a fine print link at the bottom of the page
that says "No thanks, proceed with original order" where I find out
the
CAD package alone is available for $89.95.

Bob


Seems a strange business practice.




Add on sales are a strange business practice?

Not at all. However, in most cases, the add-on is very clearly marked
and is a selectable option, not the default. I haven't verified the OP's
claims vis a vis the cited web site; however, if you read his description,
the add-on is the prominent display and the purchaser's initial intent is a
small, hidden option.

All that happened is he
said I'd like to purchase product X and they said, in essence, "would
you like to buy the super deluxe bundle which includes product X and
well as products Y,Z and Q? " No, well thank you for your purchase of
product X then. Every retailer on the planet has done this in some form
or another.

What is strange is that the prominent display (according to the OP, I
haven't checked this out myself) defaults to the add-on, and it is only
through a small, fine-print option at that bottom of the page that the
purchaser's initial desired purchase is selected.

This is what I referred to as a strange business practice -- what is
likely to happen when a purchaser runs into a larger than expected cost is
for the purchaser to clear the window and leave the site. I suspect the
site designer is hoping the purchaser will simply click through and wind up
spending more money than intended. Most sites that have add-ons clearly
mark the add-ons as such and provide *them* as the option.

(Robert Bonomi) wrote in news:f0f9e$4141cab2
:

In article ,
Mark & Juanita wrote:
On 9 Sep 2004 20:29:15 -0700, "Bob" wrote:

I stand corrected on my post and I am sorry for misinformation. The
web page for DesignCad has a BUY NOW link that takes you directly to
a
page with price listed at $199. However, this is for bundle package
with several products. This is their so-called Platinum bundle and
its
very misleading. There is a fine print link at the bottom of the
page
that says "No thanks, proceed with original order" where I find out
the
CAD package alone is available for $89.95.

Bob

Seems a strange business practice.


Maybe somebody should point out to them the legal ramafications of
such
'bait and switch' advertising.


There aren't any. In order for it to be bait and switch they'd have to
advertise something and not offer it for sale. They're offering
something and it's available. They've just made the website confusing.
It's not really all that unusual, take a look at some major software
company sites when there is a free version available like for example
Acrobat reader. The option for the free one is well hidden and only
obvious after scanning the page containing the ad copy for the
commercial version. While I agree that this is poor marketing, and
probably results in lost sales.. It is not, by any definition, bait and
switch.

On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 15:39:30 +0000,
(Robert Bonomi) calmly ranted:

In article ,
Mark & Juanita wrote:
On 9 Sep 2004 20:29:15 -0700, "Bob" wrote:

I stand corrected on my post and I am sorry for misinformation. The
web page for DesignCad has a BUY NOW link that takes you directly to a
page with price listed at $199. However, this is for bundle package
with several products. This is their so-called Platinum bundle and its
very misleading. There is a fine print link at the bottom of the page
that says "No thanks, proceed with original order" where I find out the
CAD package alone is available for $89.95.

Bob

Sorry, other Bob, but it's only $79.95 here.
http://store.yahoo.com/cadandgraphics/dcad15.html


Seems a strange business practice.

It's called "upselling", but the way they do it is pushing
the envelope. Amazon.com uses a similar method called "cross-
selling". When you add an item to your basket, they take you
to a page full of similar goodies in the hope that you add
some to your basket before returning to shop or check out.


Maybe somebody should point out to them the legal ramafications of such
'bait and switch' advertising.

It's legal. The way it's handled just isn't very tasteful. At the top,
it says "Upgrade Your Order". The bottom text line is "No thanks,
proceed to checkout with the original order.


-------------------------------------------------------------
give me The Luxuries Of Life * http://www.diversify.com
i can live without the necessities * 2 Tee collections online
-------------------------------------------------------------

Well, yes and no. The FWW articles mentioned how good the tutorials were.
Apparently they've seen broken them out and while the base program is under
100, the price about doubles if you want the tutorials. Do you need them? I've
used other CAD packages so took a look at this one. IMO, the included Help is
virtually useless, and you're not going to make much headway unless you also
buy the tutorials. Don't know if FWW missed on that one, or the company
changed it, but the article is no longer correct.
GerryG

On 9 Sep 2004 20:16:25 -0700, "Bob" wrote:

The latest issue of Fine Woodworking had a good evaluation article
called "CAD on a budget". It reviewed CAD packages for under $100.
Based on the reviews I decided to get a copy of Design CAD 3D Max. Boy
was I chagrined to find they have DOUBLED the price of the software.
Its now $199. It seems more than slightly coincidental that the price
jumped so much right after a good review in a magazine. I think that
practice stinks and I'll pass on the purchase.

Bob

GerryG wrote in
:

Well, yes and no. The FWW articles mentioned how good the tutorials
were. Apparently they've seen broken them out and while the base
program is under 100, the price about doubles if you want the
tutorials. Do you need them? I've used other CAD packages so took a
look at this one. IMO, the included Help is virtually useless, and
you're not going to make much headway unless you also buy the
tutorials. Don't know if FWW missed on that one, or the company
changed it, but the article is no longer correct. GerryG

I have version 14. It came with a tutorial disk. Price - $80.00.

On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 18:23:15 GMT, GerryG calmly
ranted:

Well, yes and no. The FWW articles mentioned how good the tutorials were.
Apparently they've seen broken them out and while the base program is under
100, the price about doubles if you want the tutorials. Do you need them? I've
used other CAD packages so took a look at this one. IMO, the included Help is
virtually useless, and you're not going to make much headway unless you also
buy the tutorials. Don't know if FWW missed on that one, or the company
changed it, but the article is no longer correct.

Gerry, it's only $79.95 here and they still have (while they
last) tutorial CDs. http://store.yahoo.com/cadandgraphics/dcad15.html

I'm still ****ed that FWW didn't include HF clamps in their
testing. There must be 30% of us (if not more) here on the
Wreck who use 'em.


-------------------------------------------------------------
give me The Luxuries Of Life * http://www.diversify.com
i can live without the necessities * 2 Tee collections online
-------------------------------------------------------------

On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 12:02:23 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

I'm still ****ed that FWW didn't include HF clamps in their
testing. There must be 30% of us (if not more) here on the
Wreck who use 'em.

they only tested 48" clamps. the HF ones only go up to 36". however,
they missed bessey tradesman, a serious omission. (hmm, maybe
tradesmans only go to 40". shoulda altered the test. tradesman clamps
are too good a contender to ignore.)

they also neglected to comment on a design element that to me is a
major factor in the decision of what clamps to buy- that on all but
what they called "parallel jaw" bar clamps (the cabinet master type)
the gross and fine adjustments are at opposite ends of the clamp. to
compound the aggravation, the sliding head on bar clamps like to
rotate around the pipe out of alignment with the screw head. (can you
tell I'm not a big fan of pipe clamps?)

Bridger

This was maybe a month ago, and suspect I only checked at the IMSI site for
their prices, and they don't offer that. Don't have the FWW handy, but seem to
recall they mentioned multiple CDs, and my impression is that only the
Introduction CD comes with that Yahoo store offer.

If anybody has this, I'd be interested in how far that one training CD takes
you.

Guess I should have known better than to just check the manufacturer for a
price:-)

GerryG

On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 12:02:23 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 18:23:15 GMT, GerryG calmly
ranted:

Well, yes and no. The FWW articles mentioned how good the tutorials were.
Apparently they've seen broken them out and while the base program is under
100, the price about doubles if you want the tutorials. Do you need them? I've
used other CAD packages so took a look at this one. IMO, the included Help is
virtually useless, and you're not going to make much headway unless you also
buy the tutorials. Don't know if FWW missed on that one, or the company
changed it, but the article is no longer correct.

Gerry, it's only $79.95 here and they still have (while they
last) tutorial CDs. http://store.yahoo.com/cadandgraphics/dcad15.html

I'm still ****ed that FWW didn't include HF clamps in their
testing. There must be 30% of us (if not more) here on the
Wreck who use 'em.


-------------------------------------------------------------
give me The Luxuries Of Life * http://www.diversify.com
i can live without the necessities * 2 Tee collections online
-------------------------------------------------------------

Clicking the "all to cart" button takes you to a page reading "bonus special
offer". To get past that page, you have to click either "yes, change my
order" or "no thanks, proceed to checkout with my original order". Seems
pretty clear to me, however, one might be confused if he had not read the
options and tried to actually place the order.

"Mark & Juanita" wrote in message Not at all.
However, in most cases, the add-on is very clearly marked
and is a selectable option, not the default. I haven't verified the OP's
claims vis a vis the cited web site; however, if you read his description,
the add-on is the prominent display and the purchaser's initial intent is
a
small, hidden option.

Designcad was recently bought by IMSI. It's very likely that they sell the
tutorials separately as that is what they do with their top of the line cad
program, Turbocad. For 2D only work, I think probably the best deal going is
Intellicad. It is an AutoCAD clone and as such, is a bit more difficult to
learn than some programs but there are two distinct upsides to it. Since it
is so AutoCAD like, tutorials meant for AutoCAD will get you where you want
to go. The price is also great at less than $60.00 through CMS for the
standard version.

"Lobby Dosser" wrote in message
newsOm0d.19$xH1.15@trnddc03...
GerryG wrote in
:

Well, yes and no. The FWW articles mentioned how good the tutorials
were. Apparently they've seen broken them out and while the base
program is under 100, the price about doubles if you want the
tutorials. Do you need them? I've used other CAD packages so took a
look at this one. IMO, the included Help is virtually useless, and
you're not going to make much headway unless you also buy the
tutorials. Don't know if FWW missed on that one, or the company
changed it, but the article is no longer correct. GerryG

I have version 14. It came with a tutorial disk. Price - $80.00.

What is an HF clamp? Can you provide a URL?

While I'm here, anybody like the Bessey Supergrip? Seems expensive but
very useful.

Bessey's "Jig and Fixture clamp" and their "Legendary sliding arm
clamp" under the industrial and welding clamps section seem useful to
woodworkers, too.

http://www.americanclamping.com/prod...tal/SQ_STB.php

Even their c-clamps seem to be a notch above the competition.

What say y'all?

wrote in message . ..
On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 12:02:23 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

I'm still ****ed that FWW didn't include HF clamps in their
testing. There must be 30% of us (if not more) here on the
Wreck who use 'em.

they only tested 48" clamps. the HF ones only go up to 36". however,
they missed bessey tradesman, a serious omission. (hmm, maybe
tradesmans only go to 40". shoulda altered the test. tradesman clamps
are too good a contender to ignore.)

they also neglected to comment on a design element that to me is a
major factor in the decision of what clamps to buy- that on all but
what they called "parallel jaw" bar clamps (the cabinet master type)
the gross and fine adjustments are at opposite ends of the clamp. to
compound the aggravation, the sliding head on bar clamps like to
rotate around the pipe out of alignment with the screw head. (can you
tell I'm not a big fan of pipe clamps?)

Bridger

Hi - I figured I should respond to this post - I might have a little
intimate knowledge of the subject.

I'll give you a little back ground here - The article was actually written
in January and February of '04. At the time, the software reviewed was the
latest version, and the prices were all correct. Between the time I
reviewed the software, and the article was actually printed, DesignCAD was
fully purchased by IMSI software, and a newer version of designCAD was
released: Version 15. Apparently Version 15 can still be purchased for $99,
but only comes with 1 training CD.

In all honesty, I don't believe that DesignCAD or IMSI knew how I evaluated
either of their software products until the Magazine hit the News Stands -
Never the Less, I wish they still kept the pricing the same.

I'm not Familiar at all with Version 15 of their software, but what I can
say is if Version 15 is anything like 14, then it's still a decent buy -

Hope this answers some questions - Thanks for reading!

Gregory Paolini - Roycroft Renaissance Artisan
Handcrafted Custom Furniture & Cabinetry

www.GregoryPaolini.com


"Bob" wrote in message
...
The latest issue of Fine Woodworking had a good evaluation article
called "CAD on a budget". It reviewed CAD packages for under $100.
Based on the reviews I decided to get a copy of Design CAD 3D Max. Boy
was I chagrined to find they have DOUBLED the price of the software.
Its now $199. It seems more than slightly coincidental that the price
jumped so much right after a good review in a magazine. I think that
practice stinks and I'll pass on the purchase.

Bob

For what its worth - Half of my Pipe Clamps are Pony's, the other half are
Harbor Freight. Pony's are nice, but I bought Just as many HF's for 1/3rd
the price.

Besides - I grab my "K" Bodies anytime I need to do a critical glue up

--
Gregory Paolini - Roycroft Renaissance Artisan
Handcrafted Custom Furniture & Cabinetry

www.GregoryPaolini.com
"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 18:23:15 GMT, GerryG calmly
ranted:

Well, yes and no. The FWW articles mentioned how good the tutorials were.
Apparently they've seen broken them out and while the base program is
under
100, the price about doubles if you want the tutorials. Do you need them?
I've
used other CAD packages so took a look at this one. IMO, the included
Help is
virtually useless, and you're not going to make much headway unless you
also
buy the tutorials. Don't know if FWW missed on that one, or the company
changed it, but the article is no longer correct.

Gerry, it's only $79.95 here and they still have (while they
last) tutorial CDs. http://store.yahoo.com/cadandgraphics/dcad15.html

I'm still ****ed that FWW didn't include HF clamps in their
testing. There must be 30% of us (if not more) here on the
Wreck who use 'em.


-------------------------------------------------------------
give me The Luxuries Of Life * http://www.diversify.com
i can live without the necessities * 2 Tee collections online
-------------------------------------------------------------

Well, after some web searching, it seems te Bessy supergrip is not as
good for woodworking as I imagined. The jaws are not wood friendly and
putting protectection between them and the thing to be clamped seems
like a lot of trouble.

Also, I can't find any dealer that sells the "Jig and fixture" clamp
-- I can only find it on the Bessey page...must be too new.

[snip]

Found a short review of the supergrip (although it's not called that in Britain):

http://sawdustalley.co.uk/tools/revi...0&keyword=&s=0

Apparently Norm uses it -- not that that mans much to me....


(Never Enough Money) wrote in message . com...
Well, after some web searching, it seems te Bessy supergrip is not as
good for woodworking as I imagined. The jaws are not wood friendly and
putting protectection between them and the thing to be clamped seems
like a lot of trouble.

Also, I can't find any dealer that sells the "Jig and fixture" clamp
-- I can only find it on the Bessey page...must be too new.

[snip]

Apparently Norm uses it -- not that that mans much to me....

Norm = God

I am still trying to achieve his level of craft.

Once I do (if ever) I intend to become very cynical!

:-)

Lou

On Sat, 11 Sep 2004 17:55:57 -0400, "Gregory Paolini"
calmly ranted:

For what its worth - Half of my Pipe Clamps are Pony's, the other half are
Harbor Freight. Pony's are nice, but I bought Just as many HF's for 1/3rd
the price.

The HF pipe clamps aren't much worse than the Pony crap.
I thought I had bought the HF clamps until I looked closely
one day and found a PONY on the end of one. I have a feeling
that they're all made in the same factory in China anyway.


Besides - I grab my "K" Bodies anytime I need to do a critical glue up

What glueup is ever non-critical?


-------------------------------------------------------------
give me The Luxuries Of Life * http://www.diversify.com
i can live without the necessities * 2 Tee collections online
-------------------------------------------------------------

eI must be obsessing on this clamp thing...sorry.

For those that might be interested, I called Bessey today (actually
their New York distributor) to ask about the "jig and fixture" clamp.
First they said few people carry it because it's such a niche market
but any could order it...

Second, she said suggested retail was between $120 and $140. Ouch.
That's getting close to the cost of a new router, or a new hand plane!

They don't sell pads to prevent wood bruising. Also, it is probably
overkill as a hold down clamp - over 200 pounds of pressure possible.
There is a Jorgenson competitor but after I account for the 3 inch
thickness of my bench, there's only 1.5 inches left. Bummer.


(Never Enough Money) wrote in message . com...
Well, after some web searching, it seems te Bessy supergrip is not as
good for woodworking as I imagined. The jaws are not wood friendly and
putting protectection between them and the thing to be clamped seems
like a lot of trouble.

Also, I can't find any dealer that sells the "Jig and fixture" clamp
-- I can only find it on the Bessey page...must be too new.

[snip]

On 11 Sep 2004 06:32:07 -0700, (Never Enough
Money) wrote:

What is an HF clamp? Can you provide a URL?

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=34388

they're a clone of the jorgensen 3700 bar clamp:
http://www.adjustableclamp.com/bl-3700.htm

"Bob" wrote in message
...
The latest issue of Fine Woodworking had a good evaluation article
called "CAD on a budget". It reviewed CAD packages for under $100.
Based on the reviews I decided to get a copy of Design CAD 3D Max. Boy
was I chagrined to find they have DOUBLED the price of the software.
Its now $199. It seems more than slightly coincidental that the price
jumped so much right after a good review in a magazine. I think that
practice stinks and I'll pass on the purchase.

Bob


Based on the FWW article, I downloaded the trial version of this program;
DesignCAD 3D Max 15. I have absolutely no knowledge of CAD. When I found
that the help was no help at all, I contacted the company. They tried to
sell me the "Platinum version" but provided a link for free online
tutorials. Unfotunately, the tutorials were set up for version 14, so they
didn't work quite right for the newer version and even then, there was no
explanation of how everything worked. I didn't buy the program although if
I do buy it later, I'll likely spring for the platinum version so that I can
actually learn what all the included functions mean and do.

Ed

I agree, Ed. It's really a shame they didn't do some work on their help
system. After giving up on them with the same experience as you, I brought up
another CAD program I haven't used for years. With just their normal help
menus I was productive inside an hour.

Before going for their platinum version, it might be good to hear from a few
people on how far that tutorial actually takes you, since they also sell more
advanced ones and, if you end up needing them, the price goes up a bit.
GerryG

On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 01:57:02 GMT, "Ed" wrote:


"Bob" wrote in message
...
The latest issue of Fine Woodworking had a good evaluation article
called "CAD on a budget". It reviewed CAD packages for under $100.
Based on the reviews I decided to get a copy of Design CAD 3D Max. Boy
was I chagrined to find they have DOUBLED the price of the software.
Its now $199. It seems more than slightly coincidental that the price
jumped so much right after a good review in a magazine. I think that
practice stinks and I'll pass on the purchase.

Bob


Based on the FWW article, I downloaded the trial version of this program;
DesignCAD 3D Max 15. I have absolutely no knowledge of CAD. When I found
that the help was no help at all, I contacted the company. They tried to
sell me the "Platinum version" but provided a link for free online
tutorials. Unfotunately, the tutorials were set up for version 14, so they
didn't work quite right for the newer version and even then, there was no
explanation of how everything worked. I didn't buy the program although if
I do buy it later, I'll likely spring for the platinum version so that I can
actually learn what all the included functions mean and do.

Ed

Doh! I get it now, "HF" for "Harbor Freight" -- I was thinking it was
a style of clamp. I was dreaming up things like "Handy Fastener" or
"Heavy Fastener" or "Hands Free" (Hah!).....

Thanks!

wrote in message . ..
On 11 Sep 2004 06:32:07 -0700, (Never Enough
Money) wrote:

What is an HF clamp? Can you provide a URL?

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=34388

they're a clone of the jorgensen 3700 bar clamp:
http://www.adjustableclamp.com/bl-3700.htm

wrote in message . ..
On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 12:02:23 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

I'm still ****ed that FWW didn't include HF clamps in their
testing. There must be 30% of us (if not more) here on the
Wreck who use 'em.

they only tested 48" clamps. the HF ones only go up to 36".

HF has had 48" clamps for years:

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=38185

H.

On 14 Sep 2004 15:25:34 -0700, (Hylourgos) wrote:

wrote in message . ..
On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 12:02:23 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

I'm still ****ed that FWW didn't include HF clamps in their
testing. There must be 30% of us (if not more) here on the
Wreck who use 'em.

they only tested 48" clamps. the HF ones only go up to 36".

HF has had 48" clamps for years:

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=38185

H.



true. they could have reviewed those. they sort of did, in that they
reviewed the jet version of that clamp. it was rated as the worst of
the lot, IIRC. it failed after a few rounds of testing...

On 14 Sep 2004 15:25:34 -0700, (Hylourgos) wrote:

wrote in message . ..
On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 12:02:23 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

I'm still ****ed that FWW didn't include HF clamps in their
testing. There must be 30% of us (if not more) here on the
Wreck who use 'em.

they only tested 48" clamps. the HF ones only go up to 36".

HF has had 48" clamps for years:

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=38185

H.



true. they could have reviewed those. they sort of did, in that they
reviewed the jet version of that clamp. it was rated as the worst of
the lot, IIRC. it failed after a few rounds of testing...

wrote in message . ..
On 14 Sep 2004 15:25:34 -0700, (Hylourgos) wrote:

wrote in message . ..
On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 12:02:23 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

I'm still ****ed that FWW didn't include HF clamps in their
testing. There must be 30% of us (if not more) here on the
Wreck who use 'em.

they only tested 48" clamps. the HF ones only go up to 36".

HF has had 48" clamps for years:

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=38185

H.

true. they could have reviewed those. they sort of did, in that they
reviewed the jet version of that clamp. it was rated as the worst of
the lot, IIRC. it failed after a few rounds of testing...

I don't doubt that. I had two or three of them at one time (the HF
version), and they worked OK for a few projects, but always felt a bit
flimsy, so I migrated to pipe clamps and have been satisfied with them
ever since. For "budget" clamps, the pipe is mightier than than the
HFbar.

H.