I'm just a hobbyist, make little organizers, odds and ends. Very much budget
constrained.

For 10+ years I've been running with:

Freud 10" Carbide Finishing 40 Tooth
Advanced Anti-Kickback Design

and haven't done too badly.

Rockler currently has:
Freud 2-pack of 10" Rip and Fine Crosscut ... $40 #47943

How much of an improvement (if any) might the new blades make? Speculation
is encouraged.

Thx,
Will

Wilfred Xavier Pickles wrote in
:


I'm just a hobbyist, make little organizers, odds and ends. Very much
budget constrained.

For 10+ years I've been running with:

Freud 10" Carbide Finishing 40 Tooth
Advanced Anti-Kickback Design

and haven't done too badly.

Rockler currently has:
Freud 2-pack of 10" Rip and Fine Crosscut ... $40 #47943

How much of an improvement (if any) might the new blades make?
Speculation is encouraged.

Thx,
Will


If you haven't had your blade sharpened, it'll make a huge difference.
If you've had it sharpened every now and again, maybe not so much.

Puckdropper
--
Make it to fit, don't make it fit.

On 10/10/2012 6:54 PM, Wilfred Xavier Pickles wrote:

I'm just a hobbyist, make little organizers, odds and ends. Very much budget
constrained.

For 10+ years I've been running with:

Freud 10" Carbide Finishing 40 Tooth
Advanced Anti-Kickback Design

and haven't done too badly.

Rockler currently has:
Freud 2-pack of 10" Rip and Fine Crosscut ... $40 #47943

How much of an improvement (if any) might the new blades make? Speculation
is encouraged.

Thx,
Will



If you keep this up one day you will buy a Forrest. With it be sooner
or later?

Wilfred Xavier Pickles wrote:


I'm just a hobbyist, make little organizers, odds and ends. Very
much budget
constrained.

For 10+ years I've been running with:

Freud 10" Carbide Finishing 40 Tooth
Advanced Anti-Kickback Design

and haven't done too badly.

Rockler currently has:
Freud 2-pack of 10" Rip and Fine Crosscut ... $40 #47943

How much of an improvement (if any) might the new blades make?
Speculation
is encouraged.
------------------------------------------------------------
If funds are tight, consider getting existing blade sharpened.

$20 a blade doesn't get you much of a blade, IMHO.

Lew

On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 4:54:36 PM UTC-7, Wilfred Xavier Pickles wrote:
I'm just a hobbyist, make little organizers, odds and ends. Very much budget constrained. For 10+ years I've been running with: Freud 10" Carbide Finishing 40 Tooth Advanced Anti-Kickback Design and haven't done too badly. Rockler currently has: Freud 2-pack of 10" Rip and Fine Crosscut ... $40 #47943 How much of an improvement (if any) might the new blades make? Speculation is encouraged. Thx, Will

You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade. Any serious WWkr with a TS should at least have a rip and cross cut blade. I use Freud blades quite a bit. I think maybe a more expensive version, that sounds like a heck of a deal.

For A long time I used thin kerf but have gravitated towards full kerf and find I get less chatter on rips so less sanding of edges.

On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 22:34:10 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com"
You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade.

Never went the ripping blade route. I've always used a 60 tooth
combination blade. Did fine for ripping and crosscut nicely on the
veneered plywood.

SonomaProducts.com wrote:


You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be
much better with a rip blade. Any serious WWkr with a TS should at
least have a rip and cross cut blade.


I find that a good rip blade is all that is necessary. Use it for the rips
and the cutting torches for the cross cuts. I'd use the oxy/acetalene for
rips too, but it's too hard to hold the torch at the exact right angle to
get a nice clean edge on a long run...

--

-Mike-

Wilfred Xavier Pickles wrote:
I'm just a hobbyist, make little organizers, odds and ends. Very much
budget constrained.

For 10+ years I've been running with:

Freud 10" Carbide Finishing 40 Tooth
Advanced Anti-Kickback Design

and haven't done too badly.

Rockler currently has:
Freud 2-pack of 10" Rip and Fine Crosscut ... $40 #47943

How much of an improvement (if any) might the new blades make?
Speculation is encouraged.

Speculation would be "little to none" with the info you gave. If you had
said how many teeth and what grind, it would have helped (I looked, couldn't
find the special at Rockler).

If the crosscut blade has more teeth than your current one, it will probably
make a smoother crosscut.

If the rip blade has 24 or 30 flat top teeth (not ATB or TCG) it will
probably rip better.

Of course, you either have to change blades for different cuts or accept
less than optimal results. I like to use a rip blade on my table saw and a
crosscut blade on the RAS. I do crosscuts on the TS too when I don't
want/need the slightly improved cross cut results from the RAS.



--

dadiOH
____________________________

Winters getting colder? Tired of the rat race?
Maybe just ready for a change? Check it out...
http://www.floridaloghouse.net

On 10/11/2012 1:24 AM, Dave wrote:
On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 22:34:10 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com"
You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade.

Never went the ripping blade route. I've always used a 60 tooth
combination blade. Did fine for ripping and crosscut nicely on the
veneered plywood.



Kinda agree, using a cabinet saw I used a decent brand rip blade long
enough to dull it and never saw/realized the point of switching blades
from a WWII.

On 10/11/2012 12:34 AM, SonomaProducts.com wrote:
On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 4:54:36 PM UTC-7, Wilfred Xavier Pickles wrote:
I'm just a hobbyist, make little organizers, odds and ends. Very much budget constrained. For 10+ years I've been running with: Freud 10" Carbide Finishing 40 Tooth Advanced Anti-Kickback Design and haven't done too badly. Rockler currently has: Freud 2-pack of 10" Rip and Fine Crosscut ... $40 #47943 How much of an improvement (if any) might the new blades make? Speculation is encouraged. Thx, Will

You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade. Any serious WWkr with a TS should at least have a rip and cross cut blade. I use Freud blades quite a bit. I think maybe a more expensive version, that sounds like a heck of a deal.

+1

I use a Forrest WWII for all critical projects crosscuts (combination
blade, but still cuts sterling crosscuts), and a Freud Glue-Line-Rip for
all critical project rips to dimension after jointing.

--
www.eWoodShop.com
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)
http://gplus.to/eWoodShop

On 10/11/12 12:00 AM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
Wilfred Xavier Pickles wrote:


I'm just a hobbyist, make little organizers, odds and ends. Very
much budget
constrained.

For 10+ years I've been running with:

Freud 10" Carbide Finishing 40 Tooth
Advanced Anti-Kickback Design

and haven't done too badly.

Rockler currently has:
Freud 2-pack of 10" Rip and Fine Crosscut ... $40 #47943

How much of an improvement (if any) might the new blades make?
Speculation
is encouraged.
------------------------------------------------------------
If funds are tight, consider getting existing blade sharpened.

$20 a blade doesn't get you much of a blade, IMHO.

Lew


They are marked down quite a bit... a whole lot of a bit. :-)
I couldn't see the model numbers in that Rockler ad, nor if they were
thin kerf/thin plate blade. But the rip blade looks like it might be
their glue line rip blade without the fancy paint job. Same with the
cross cut blade. Both of those would be very good blade, if the same as
their high end.

When I called Freud a while back when researching blades, one of their
tech guys told me that they often have these large runs of "plain"
blades to sell in bulk for many different reasons. Some are for
industrial use, some are for huge retailers so they can have a unique
sku number, and other reasons.

He said some are thinner kerf versions, some are smaller tooth versions
(less sharpening), but many are the exact same blade as their marquee
lines except with different printing and no "slippery red"paint job.

If the ones in this pack are the latter, it is an exceptional deal. If
they are thinner kerf, even "Diablo" blades, they are still pretty good
for the price. The plate thickness is the real issue on those blade,
because the teeth with be great. But if they have a thin plate, they
will wobble too much and have a less that perfect cut.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 11:13:29 -0500, -MIKE- wrote:

He said some are thinner kerf versions, some are smaller tooth versions
(less sharpening), but many are the exact same blade as their marquee
lines except with different printing and no "slippery red"paint job.

If the ones in this pack are the latter, it is an exceptional deal. If
they are thinner kerf, even "Diablo" blades, they are still pretty good
for the price. The plate thickness is the real issue on those blade,
because the teeth with be great. But if they have a thin plate, they
will wobble too much and have a less that perfect cut.

Do you know about what plate thickness the "good" blades are?
I can pack a caliper, maybe make an actual measurement at Rockler.

Thx,
Will

"Law Without Equity Is No Law At All. It Is A Form Of Jungle Rule."

On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 11:24:44 PM UTC-7, Upscale wrote:
On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 22:34:10 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com" You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade. Never went the ripping blade route. I've always used a 60 tooth combination blade. Did fine for ripping and crosscut nicely on the veneered plywood.

To each his own I guess. I might leave in a cross cut blade if I have one rip. Rarely use a rip for cross cuts, unless they are not so important. Rip blades do cut about twice as fast. Takes me less than a minute to change blades and just kind of do it without thinking. I doubt you can rip cherry with a cross cut very often without some burn. But as I said, to each his own..

On Thursday, October 11, 2012 7:18:28 AM UTC-7, Swingman wrote:
On 10/11/2012 12:34 AM, SonomaProducts.com wrote: On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 4:54:36 PM UTC-7, Wilfred Xavier Pickles wrote: I'm just a hobbyist, make little organizers, odds and ends. Very much budget constrained. For 10+ years I've been running with: Freud 10" Carbide Finishing 40 Tooth Advanced Anti-Kickback Design and haven't done too badly. Rockler currently has: Freud 2-pack of 10" Rip and Fine Crosscut ... $40 #47943 How much of an improvement (if any) might the new blades make? Speculation is encouraged. Thx, Will You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade. Any serious WWkr with a TS should at least have a rip and cross cut blade. I use Freud blades quite a bit. I think maybe a more expensive version, that sounds like a heck of a deal. +1 I use a Forrest WWII for all critical projects crosscuts (combination blade, but still cuts sterling crosscuts), and a Freud Glue-Line-Rip for all critical project rips to dimension after jointing. -- www.eWoodShop.com Last update: 4/15/2010 KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious) http://gplus.to/eWoodShop

When those glue line rips first came out I did seem to have some success. With my saw stop I have that fence dialed in with just a few thou lean out on and I still get teeth marks on my rips with that blade or any thin kerf actually. I checked for run out and there is esentially none. I actually returned a glue line saying it was flawed and was just going to get my money back but the sad looking Woodcraft owner got me to agree to swap for another one. I went back the next day and bought a full kerf ripper and have glass like rips ever since. I guess I am just a softee. Still have the glue line but it has worked its way to the back of the stack on the blade nail next to the saw.

On 10/11/12 12:49 PM, Puddin' Man wrote:

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 11:13:29 -0500, -MIKE- wrote:

He said some are thinner kerf versions, some are smaller tooth versions
(less sharpening), but many are the exact same blade as their marquee
lines except with different printing and no "slippery red"paint job.

If the ones in this pack are the latter, it is an exceptional deal. If
they are thinner kerf, even "Diablo" blades, they are still pretty good
for the price. The plate thickness is the real issue on those blade,
because the teeth with be great. But if they have a thin plate, they
will wobble too much and have a less that perfect cut.

Do you know about what plate thickness the "good" blades are?
I can pack a caliper, maybe make an actual measurement at Rockler.

Thx,
Will

"Law Without Equity Is No Law At All. It Is A Form Of Jungle Rule."


You won't need a caliper. :-)
Just go look at the expensive full kerf blades and take note of how
thick their plates are. There are about 3 thicknesses in general... much
thinner than the kerf, by about 1/2; a bit thinner than kerf; and darn
near the same thickness as kerf.

The latter two will be much heavier than the thinner plate blades. They
will have no flex if you try to bend them. They will be much heavier.
They will have a high, long, bell-like tone if you hold them by the hole
and strike them with your knuckle.

The thinner plate blade will have a bit of flex when you try to bend it.
It will feel much lighter than you think it should. When struck with the
knuckle, the sound will be a lower pitched and shorter tone.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 13:42:36 -0500, -MIKE- wrote:
You won't need a caliper. :-)
Just go look at the expensive full kerf blades and take note of how
thick their plates are. There are about 3 thicknesses in general... much
thinner than the kerf, by about 1/2; a bit thinner than kerf; and darn
near the same thickness as kerf.

The latter two will be much heavier than the thinner plate blades. They
will have no flex if you try to bend them. They will be much heavier.
They will have a high, long, bell-like tone if you hold them by the hole
and strike them with your knuckle.

The thinner plate blade will have a bit of flex when you try to bend it.
It will feel much lighter than you think it should. When struck with the
knuckle, the sound will be a lower pitched and shorter tone.

I'll check 'em out.

Many Thanks

"Law Without Equity Is No Law At All. It Is A Form Of Jungle Rule."

On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 21:51:29 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:

If you keep this up one day you will buy a Forrest. With it be sooner
or later?

Much later. Would first require a new and better TS. And I'm now too
old/decrepit to lug/setup. So, much, Much, MUCH later. :-)

Will

On 10/11/2012 2:29 PM, Wilfred Xavier Pickles wrote:
On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 21:51:29 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:

If you keep this up one day you will buy a Forrest. With it be sooner
or later?

Much later. Would first require a new and better TS. And I'm now too
old/decrepit to lug/setup. So, much, Much, MUCH later. :-)

Will


Seriously I put a new Forrest "REGULAR KERF 40 tooth WWII on my saw
just under 2 years ago, the job paid for it. Since I have mounted that
blade I have built over 100 drawers, 40+ MDF kitchen door and drawer
blanks, several components to that kitchen re-do, A Murphy bed with
matching tower cabinets on both sides, a queen side bed with drawers
underneath, a quilters cutting table, an 8'x8' wall pantry, a corner
curio cabinet, three double cabinet book cases, an additional full wall
of book cases, and a bedroom TV chest with drawers and 7 or 8 picture
frames. The blade is still cutting quite well without having been
sharpened yet.

I know you feel you need a better saw for this blade but you really do
not. Prior to buying a cabinet saw 13 or so years ago I used a good
quality Systematic regular kerf blade on my 1hp Craftsman TS. It cut
better than any think kerf blade I had used.

A Forrest could be the last blade you ever buy, maybe. ;~) I keep 2
Forrest blades on hand. When one goes to Forrest for resharpening I
mount the other for the next 3~4 years of use. You will save money on
the long run and never be able to blame the blade for poor results.

On 10/11/2012 1:18 PM, SonomaProducts.com wrote:
On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 11:24:44 PM UTC-7, Upscale wrote:
On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 22:34:10 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com" You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade. Never went the ripping blade route. I've always used a 60 tooth combination blade. Did fine for ripping and crosscut nicely on the veneered plywood.

To each his own I guess. I might leave in a cross cut blade if I have one rip. Rarely use a rip for cross cuts, unless they are not so important. Rip blades do cut about twice as fast. Takes me less than a minute to change blades and just kind of do it without thinking. I doubt you can rip cherry with a cross cut very often without some burn. But as I said, to each his own.



The trick to not changing blades is to use a combination or general
purpose blade. I would not recommend cross cutting with a rip nor
ripping with a cross cut blade.

Now if you have 2 table saw, that might change considerations.

On 10/11/2012 1:23 PM, SonomaProducts.com wrote:
On Thursday, October 11, 2012 7:18:28 AM UTC-7, Swingman wrote:
On 10/11/2012 12:34 AM, SonomaProducts.com wrote: On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 4:54:36 PM UTC-7, Wilfred Xavier Pickles wrote: I'm just a hobbyist, make little organizers, odds and ends. Very much budget constrained. For 10+ years I've been running with: Freud 10" Carbide Finishing 40 Tooth Advanced Anti-Kickback Design and haven't done too badly. Rockler currently has: Freud 2-pack of 10" Rip and Fine Crosscut ... $40 #47943 How much of an improvement (if any) might the new blades make? Speculation is encouraged. Thx, Will You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade. Any serious WWkr with a TS should at least have a rip and cross cut blade. I use Freud blades quite a bit. I think maybe a more expensive version, that sounds like a heck of a deal. +1 I use a Forrest WWII for all critical projects crosscuts (combination blade, but still cuts sterling crosscuts), and a Freud Glue-Line-Rip for all critical project rips
to dimension after jointing. -- www.eWoodShop.com Last update: 4/15/2010 KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious) http://gplus.to/eWoodShop

When those glue line rips first came out I did seem to have some success. With my saw stop I have that fence dialed in with just a few thou lean out on and I still get teeth marks on my rips with that blade or any thin kerf actually. I checked for run out and there is esentially none. I actually returned a glue line saying it was flawed and was just going to get my money back but the sad looking Woodcraft owner got me to agree to swap for another one. I went back the next day and bought a full kerf ripper and have glass like rips ever since. I guess I am just a softee. Still have the glue line but it has worked its way to the back of the stack on the blade nail next to the saw.



The problem with the thin kerf is that they may measure out fine, they
are not spinning, but once spinning they may no longer run true.
Additionally unless you are working with perfect lumber that is equal in
hardness all the way through, is there such a thing, the thin kerf
blades will flex to some degree often to a great degree when they go to
the hard and soft spots.

On Thursday, October 11, 2012 12:51:21 PM UTC-7, Leon wrote:
On 10/11/2012 1:18 PM, SonomaProducts.com wrote: On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 11:24:44 PM UTC-7, Upscale wrote: On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 22:34:10 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com" You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade. Never went the ripping blade route. I've always used a 60 tooth combination blade. Did fine for ripping and crosscut nicely on the veneered plywood. To each his own I guess. I might leave in a cross cut blade if I have one rip. Rarely use a rip for cross cuts, unless they are not so important. Rip blades do cut about twice as fast. Takes me less than a minute to change blades and just kind of do it without thinking. I doubt you can rip cherry with a cross cut very often without some burn. But as I said, to each his own. The trick to not changing blades is to use a combination or general purpose blade. I would not recommend cross cutting with a rip nor ripping with a cross cut blade. Now if you have 2 table saw, that might change considerations.

IMNSHO combo blades are only approriate for basic cabinet work or other similar (good enough is OK) jobs and not the typical furniture pieces I am usually building. And even then only because the cabinet guys usually oversize their face frame rips and clean up the edges in bundles ganged up in the planer.

I have one I throw on when making plywood boxes, etc. for around the shop or sets and stage furniture for my daughters school, etc.

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 14:47:54 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:

On 10/11/2012 2:29 PM, Wilfred Xavier Pickles wrote:
On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 21:51:29 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:

If you keep this up one day you will buy a Forrest. With it be sooner
or later?

Much later. Would first require a new and better TS. And I'm now too
old/decrepit to lug/setup. So, much, Much, MUCH later. :-)

Will


Seriously I put a new Forrest "REGULAR KERF 40 tooth WWII on my saw
just under 2 years ago, the job paid for it. Since I have mounted that
blade I have built over 100 drawers, 40+ MDF kitchen door and drawer
blanks, several components to that kitchen re-do, A Murphy bed with
matching tower cabinets on both sides, a queen side bed with drawers
underneath, a quilters cutting table, an 8'x8' wall pantry, a corner
curio cabinet, three double cabinet book cases, an additional full wall
of book cases, and a bedroom TV chest with drawers and 7 or 8 picture
frames. The blade is still cutting quite well without having been
sharpened yet.

WHAT? You mean that one blade did your entire Bridge of Sighs Bedroom
Suite without being sharpened? That's a good blade.


I know you feel you need a better saw for this blade but you really do
not. Prior to buying a cabinet saw 13 or so years ago I used a good
quality Systematic regular kerf blade on my 1hp Craftsman TS. It cut
better than any think kerf blade I had used.

I finally upgraded from HF to a Freud blade for my circ saw and it
really is an improvement. Well, was, until the blade height
adjustment loosened and it started cutting the blacktop. She cuts a
mite slower nowadays. I'll replace it some day soon.

--
Energy and persistence alter all things.
--Benjamin Franklin

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 14:51:11 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
Now if you have 2 table saw, that might change considerations.

We should all be so lucky to be able to afford two table saws *and*
have a large enough shop to be able to use them.

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 20:28:39 -0400, Dave wrote:

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 14:51:11 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
Now if you have 2 table saw, that might change considerations.

We should all be so lucky to be able to afford two table saws *and*
have a large enough shop to be able to use them.

We just moved into a house with a 2000 ft^2 basement but there are a *lot* of
toys I want to buy before even thinking about another table saw. Changing
blades isn't all that tough. ;-)

"SonomaProducts.com" wrote in message
...

On Thursday, October 11, 2012 7:18:28 AM UTC-7, Swingman wrote:
On 10/11/2012 12:34 AM, SonomaProducts.com wrote: On Wednesday, October
10, 2012 4:54:36 PM UTC-7, Wilfred Xavier Pickles wrote: I'm just a
hobbyist, make little organizers, odds and ends. Very much budget
constrained. For 10+ years I've been running with: Freud 10" Carbide
Finishing 40 Tooth Advanced Anti-Kickback Design and haven't done too
badly. Rockler currently has: Freud 2-pack of 10" Rip and Fine Crosscut
... $40 #47943 How much of an improvement (if any) might the new blades
make? Speculation is encouraged. Thx, Will You will find that ripping
(cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade.
Any serious WWkr with a TS should at least have a rip and cross cut blade.
I use Freud blades quite a bit. I think maybe a more expensive version,
that sounds like a heck of a deal. +1 I use a Forrest WWII for all
critical projects crosscuts (combination blade, but still cuts sterling
crosscuts), and a Freud Glue-Line-Rip for all critical project rips to
dimension after jointing. -- www.eWoodShop.com Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious) http://gplus.to/eWoodShop

When those glue line rips first came out I did seem to have some success.
With my saw stop I have that fence dialed in with just a few thou lean out
on and I still get teeth marks on my rips with that blade or any thin kerf
actually. I checked for run out and there is esentially none. I actually
returned a glue line saying it was flawed and was just going to get my money
back but the sad looking Woodcraft owner got me to agree to swap for another
one. I went back the next day and bought a full kerf ripper and have glass
like rips ever since. I guess I am just a softee. Still have the glue line
but it has worked its way to the back of the stack on the blade nail next to
the saw.
================================================== ================================================== ===============================
I have been using a full kerf glue line rip for some time. Works great. They
do make that blade in two thicknesses.

On 10/11/2012 3:53 PM, SonomaProducts.com wrote:
On Thursday, October 11, 2012 12:51:21 PM UTC-7, Leon wrote:
On 10/11/2012 1:18 PM, SonomaProducts.com wrote: On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 11:24:44 PM UTC-7, Upscale wrote: On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 22:34:10 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com" You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade. Never went the ripping blade route. I've always used a 60 tooth combination blade. Did fine for ripping and crosscut nicely on the veneered plywood. To each his own I guess. I might leave in a cross cut blade if I have one rip. Rarely use a rip for cross cuts, unless they are not so important. Rip blades do cut about twice as fast. Takes me less than a minute to change blades and just kind of do it without thinking. I doubt you can rip cherry with a cross cut very often without some burn. But as I said, to each his own. The trick to not changing blades is to use a combination or general purpose blade. I would not recommend cross cutting with a rip nor ripping with a cross cut blade. Now if you hav
e 2 table saw, that might change considerations.

IMNSHO combo blades are only approriate for basic cabinet work or other similar (good enough is OK) jobs and not the typical furniture pieces I am usually building. And even then only because the cabinet guys usually oversize their face frame rips and clean up the edges in bundles ganged up in the planer.
If you believe that a "good" combo blade is only appropriate for basic
cabinet work something was/is not right. I no longer own a jointer as I
never used the one I had and I never over size a cut. I get what might
be considered perfect cuts 98% of the time and sanding is most often not
necessary other than to prep the cut surface to be consistent with the
face surface for a consistent application of a stain or finish. Any
tooth marks are pretty much non existent.

I sell my work too and it is pretty intricate. I don't tolerate sub par
results from my equipment and don't use another machine to clean up what
another has not left done properly.

On 10/11/2012 7:45 PM, zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 20:28:39 -0400, Dave wrote:

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 14:51:11 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
Now if you have 2 table saw, that might change considerations.

We should all be so lucky to be able to afford two table saws *and*
have a large enough shop to be able to use them.

We just moved into a house with a 2000 ft^2 basement but there are a *lot* of
toys I want to buy before even thinking about another table saw. Changing
blades isn't all that tough. ;-)



Changing blade is not tough but changing set ups can be a PIA.

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 13:53:11 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com"
wrote:

On Thursday, October 11, 2012 12:51:21 PM UTC-7, Leon wrote:
On 10/11/2012 1:18 PM, SonomaProducts.com wrote: On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 11:24:44 PM UTC-7, Upscale wrote: On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 22:34:10 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com" You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade. Never went the ripping blade route. I've always used a 60 tooth combination blade. Did fine for ripping and crosscut nicely on the veneered plywood. To each his own I guess. I might leave in a cross cut blade if I have one rip. Rarely use a rip for cross cuts, unless they are not so important. Rip blades do cut about twice as fast. Takes me less than a minute to change blades and just kind of do it without thinking. I doubt you can rip cherry with a cross cut very often without some burn. But as I said, to each his own. The trick to not changing blades is to use a combination or general purpose blade. I would not recommend cross cutting with a rip nor ripping with a cross cut blade. Now if you have
2 table saw, that might change considerations.

IMNSHO combo blades are only approriate for basic cabinet work or other similar (good enough is OK) jobs and not the typical furniture pieces I am usually building. And even then only because the cabinet guys usually oversize their face frame rips and clean up the edges in bundles ganged up in the planer.

I have one I throw on when making plywood boxes, etc. for around the shop or sets and stage furniture for my daughters school, etc.

Out of curiousity have you ever tried a WWII Blade. Just curious if
you've felt you were doing better with the other blades.

Mike M

On 10/11/2012 11:41 PM, Mike M wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 13:53:11 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com"
wrote:

On Thursday, October 11, 2012 12:51:21 PM UTC-7, Leon wrote:
On 10/11/2012 1:18 PM, SonomaProducts.com wrote: On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 11:24:44 PM UTC-7, Upscale wrote: On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 22:34:10 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com" You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade. Never went the ripping blade route. I've always used a 60 tooth combination blade. Did fine for ripping and crosscut nicely on the veneered plywood. To each his own I guess. I might leave in a cross cut blade if I have one rip. Rarely use a rip for cross cuts, unless they are not so important. Rip blades do cut about twice as fast. Takes me less than a minute to change blades and just kind of do it without thinking. I doubt you can rip cherry with a cross cut very often without some burn. But as I said, to each his own. The trick to not changing blades is to use a combination or general purpose blade. I would not recommend cross cutting with a rip nor ripping with a cross cut blade. Now if you ha
ve
2 table saw, that might change considerations.

IMNSHO combo blades are only approriate for basic cabinet work or other similar (good enough is OK) jobs and not the typical furniture pieces I am usually building. And even then only because the cabinet guys usually oversize their face frame rips and clean up the edges in bundles ganged up in the planer.

I have one I throw on when making plywood boxes, etc. for around the shop or sets and stage furniture for my daughters school, etc.

Out of curiousity have you ever tried a WWII Blade. Just curious if
you've felt you were doing better with the other blades.

Mike M



IIRC he mentioned using a Forrest blade and IIRC Forrest does not make a
rip blade. So my "guess" is that he has used a Forrest General cut
blade, maybe not. If he was not happy with the results of a WWII
"something" was not right.

On Thursday, October 11, 2012 9:26:03 PM UTC-7, Leon wrote:
On 10/11/2012 3:53 PM, SonomaProducts.com wrote: On Thursday, October 11, 2012 12:51:21 PM UTC-7, Leon wrote: On 10/11/2012 1:18 PM, SonomaProducts.com wrote: On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 11:24:44 PM UTC-7, Upscale wrote: On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 22:34:10 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com" You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade. Never went the ripping blade route. I've always used a 60 tooth combination blade. Did fine for ripping and crosscut nicely on the veneered plywood. To each his own I guess. I might leave in a cross cut blade if I have one rip. Rarely use a rip for cross cuts, unless they are not so important. Rip blades do cut about twice as fast. Takes me less than a minute to change blades and just kind of do it without thinking. I doubt you can rip cherry with a cross cut very often without some burn. But as I said, to each his own. The trick to not changing blades is to use a combination or general purpose blade. I would not recommend cross cutting with a rip nor ripping with a cross cut blade. Now if you hav e 2 table saw, that might change considerations. IMNSHO combo blades are only approriate for basic cabinet work or other similar (good enough is OK) jobs and not the typical furniture pieces I am usually building. And even then only because the cabinet guys usually oversize their face frame rips and clean up the edges in bundles ganged up in the planer. If you believe that a "good" combo blade is only appropriate for basic cabinet work something was/is not right. I no longer own a jointer as I never used the one I had and I never over size a cut. I get what might be considered perfect cuts 98% of the time and sanding is most often not necessary other than to prep the cut surface to be consistent with the face surface for a consistent application of a stain or finish. Any tooth marks are pretty much non existent. I sell my work too and it is pretty intricate. I don't tolerate sub par results from my equipment and don't use another machine to clean up what another has not left done properly.

I don't dispute your claim. Sounds like you have a well tuned instrument (saw) and good technique.

On Thursday, October 11, 2012 9:41:09 PM UTC-7, Mike M wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 13:53:11 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com" wrote: On Thursday, October 11, 2012 12:51:21 PM UTC-7, Leon wrote: On 10/11/2012 1:18 PM, SonomaProducts.com wrote: On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 11:24:44 PM UTC-7, Upscale wrote: On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 22:34:10 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com" You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade. Never went the ripping blade route. I've always used a 60 tooth combination blade. Did fine for ripping and crosscut nicely on the veneered plywood. To each his own I guess. I might leave in a cross cut blade if I have one rip. Rarely use a rip for cross cuts, unless they are not so important. Rip blades do cut about twice as fast. Takes me less than a minute to change blades and just kind of do it without thinking. I doubt you can rip cherry with a cross cut very often without some burn. But as I said, to each his own. The trick to not changing blades is to use a combination or general purpose blade. I would not recommend cross cutting with a rip nor ripping with a cross cut blade. Now if you have 2 table saw, that might change considerations. IMNSHO combo blades are only approriate for basic cabinet work or other similar (good enough is OK) jobs and not the typical furniture pieces I am usually building. And even then only because the cabinet guys usually oversize their face frame rips and clean up the edges in bundles ganged up in the planer. I have one I throw on when making plywood boxes, etc. for around the shop or sets and stage furniture for my daughters school, etc. Out of curiousity have you ever tried a WWII Blade. Just curious if you've felt you were doing better with the other blades. Mike M

Yes I have used Forests. Mostly loved them. I get pretty much the same results from full kerf Freuds but I do recall some fricking glass like smooth cross cuts with a Woodworker cross cut (maybe 60 tooth) blade. I have never done side-by-side. I keep my blades sharp. Probably feels like Forests hold an edge longer but I am usually buying a few blades at a time and like to save a few bucks.

On 10/11/2012 09:41 PM, Mike M wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 13:53:11 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com"
wrote:

On Thursday, October 11, 2012 12:51:21 PM UTC-7, Leon wrote:
On 10/11/2012 1:18 PM, SonomaProducts.com wrote: On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 11:24:44 PM UTC-7, Upscale wrote: On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 22:34:10 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com" You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade. Never went the ripping blade route. I've always used a 60 tooth combination blade. Did fine for ripping and crosscut nicely on the veneered plywood. To each his own I guess. I might leave in a cross cut blade if I have one rip. Rarely use a rip for cross cuts, unless they are not so important. Rip blades do cut about twice as fast. Takes me less than a minute to change blades and just kind of do it without thinking. I doubt you can rip cherry with a cross cut very often without some burn. But as I said, to each his own. The trick to not changing blades is to use a combination or general purpose blade. I would not recommend cross cutting with a rip nor ripping with a cross cut blade. Now if you have

2 table saw, that might change considerations.

IMNSHO combo blades are only approriate for basic cabinet work or other similar (good enough is OK) jobs and not the typical furniture pieces I am usually building. And even then only because the cabinet guys usually oversize their face frame rips and clean up the edges in bundles ganged up in the planer.

I have one I throw on when making plywood boxes, etc. for around the shop or sets and stage furniture for my daughters school, etc.

Out of curiousity have you ever tried a WWII Blade. Just curious if
you've felt you were doing better with the other blades.

Mike M



I have a WW and a WWII for the RAS and the TS. I love 'em both, but I
have found that a good rip blade on the TS helps immensely when ripping
redwood. It is much faster and doesn't build up resin nearly as fast as
the WWII.

I rip a load of 8' 2x6 redwood and plough out a 1" x 7/8" centered
groove (with a dado stack) on 8' 2.5" wide lengths every month to supply
hand railings for metal RV deck/stairs for a RV accessory manufacturer.
I route a 1/2" radius on all four edges. He cuts to length and finishes
as orders come in.

Pays green fees...

http://www.hofmannccr.com/rvproducts/decks.htm





--
"Socialism is a philosophy of failure,the creed of ignorance, and the
gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery"
-Winston Churchill

On Thursday, October 11, 2012 7:01:27 PM UTC-7, CW wrote:
"SonomaProducts.com" wrote in message ... On Thursday, October 11, 2012 7:18:28 AM UTC-7, Swingman wrote: On 10/11/2012 12:34 AM, SonomaProducts.com wrote: On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 4:54:36 PM UTC-7, Wilfred Xavier Pickles wrote: I'm just a hobbyist, make little organizers, odds and ends. Very much budget constrained. For 10+ years I've been running with: Freud 10" Carbide Finishing 40 Tooth Advanced Anti-Kickback Design and haven't done too badly. Rockler currently has: Freud 2-pack of 10" Rip and Fine Crosscut ... $40 #47943 How much of an improvement (if any) might the new blades make? Speculation is encouraged. Thx, Will You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade. Any serious WWkr with a TS should at least have a rip and cross cut blade. I use Freud blades quite a bit. I think maybe a more expensive version, that sounds like a heck of a deal. +1 I use a Forrest WWII for all critical projects crosscuts (combination blade, but still cuts sterling crosscuts), and a Freud Glue-Line-Rip for all critical project rips to dimension after jointing. -- www.eWoodShop.com Last update: 4/15/2010 KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious) http://gplus.to/eWoodShop When those glue line rips first came out I did seem to have some success. With my saw stop I have that fence dialed in with just a few thou lean out on and I still get teeth marks on my rips with that blade or any thin kerf actually. I checked for run out and there is esentially none. I actually returned a glue line saying it was flawed and was just going to get my money back but the sad looking Woodcraft owner got me to agree to swap for another one. I went back the next day and bought a full kerf ripper and have glass like rips ever since. I guess I am just a softee. Still have the glue line but it has worked its way to the back of the stack on the blade nail next to the saw. ================================================== ================================================== =============================== I have been using a full kerf glue line rip for some time. Works great. They do make that blade in two thicknesses.

I should try that. I usually pick up blades at local Woodcraft. I like to support the guy but his inventory is pretty weak. Usually never has the blades I want. Offers to order them but why bother. I just go home and order it myself online if it is something O can wait for. Never saw the full kerf glue line there.

in 1539868 20121011 121315 "Mike Marlow" wrote:
SonomaProducts.com wrote:


You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be
much better with a rip blade. Any serious WWkr with a TS should at
least have a rip and cross cut blade.


I find that a good rip blade is all that is necessary. Use it for the rips
and the cutting torches for the cross cuts. I'd use the oxy/acetalene for
rips too, but it's too hard to hold the torch at the exact right angle to
get a nice clean edge on a long run...

Angle grinder.

On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 20:45:51 -0400, "
We just moved into a house with a 2000 ft^2 basement but there are a *lot* of
toys I want to buy before even thinking about another table saw. Changing
blades isn't all that tough. ;-)

Given (reasonable) aspirations for a workshop, I'd want a shop big
enough to house several machines the size of a decent Felder table
saw. It would have to be capable of handing entire 8' sheets of ply
and completely outfitted with a power feeder.

Punch a couple of numbers into a computer screen and then watch it
happen.

This one would do.
http://www.format-4.ca/products_feat...0&region=ca-us

On 10/11/2012 1:23 PM, SonomaProducts.com wrote:
When those glue line rips first came out I did seem to have some success. With my saw stop I have that fence dialed in with just a few thou lean out on and I still get teeth marks on my rips with that blade or any thin kerf actually.

Although I do own one special purpose thin kerf, as a general rule I
don't use thin kerf blades ... the Freud blade I was referring to is
1/8" kerf, Glue-Line-Rip.

--
www.eWoodShop.com
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)
http://gplus.to/eWoodShop

On 10/12/2012 2:42 AM, Dave wrote:
On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 20:45:51 -0400, "
We just moved into a house with a 2000 ft^2 basement but there are a *lot* of
toys I want to buy before even thinking about another table saw. Changing
blades isn't all that tough. ;-)

Given (reasonable) aspirations for a workshop, I'd want a shop big
enough to house several machines the size of a decent Felder table
saw. It would have to be capable of handing entire 8' sheets of ply
and completely outfitted with a power feeder.

Punch a couple of numbers into a computer screen and then watch it
happen.

This one would do.
http://www.format-4.ca/products_feat...0&region=ca-us





I think I would opt for going totally CNC if room were not a factor, I
think less waste might be a plus factor.

On 10/12/2012 12:01 AM, SonomaProducts.com wrote:
On Thursday, October 11, 2012 9:26:03 PM UTC-7, Leon wrote:
On 10/11/2012 3:53 PM, SonomaProducts.com wrote: On Thursday, October 11, 2012 12:51:21 PM UTC-7, Leon wrote: On 10/11/2012 1:18 PM, SonomaProducts.com wrote: On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 11:24:44 PM UTC-7, Upscale wrote: On Wed, 10 Oct 2012 22:34:10 -0700 (PDT), "SonomaProducts.com" You will find that ripping (cutting with te grain direction) will be much better with a rip blade. Never went the ripping blade route. I've always used a 60 tooth combination blade. Did fine for ripping and crosscut nicely on the veneered plywood. To each his own I guess. I might leave in a cross cut blade if I have one rip. Rarely use a rip for cross cuts, unless they are not so important. Rip blades do cut about twice as fast. Takes me less than a minute to change blades and just kind of do it without thinking. I doubt you can rip cherry with a cross cut very often without some burn. But as I said, to each his own. The trick to not changing blades is to use a combination or gener
al purpose blade. I would not recommend cross cutting with a rip nor ripping with a cross cut blade. Now if you hav e 2 table saw, that might change considerations. IMNSHO combo blades are only approriate for basic cabinet work or other similar (good enough is OK) jobs and not the typical furniture pieces I am usually building. And even then only because the cabinet guys usually oversize their face frame rips and clean up the edges in bundles ganged up in the planer. If you believe that a "good" combo blade is only appropriate for basic cabinet work something was/is not right. I no longer own a jointer as I never used the one I had and I never over size a cut. I get what might be considered perfect cuts 98% of the time and sanding is most often not necessary other than to prep the cut surface to be consistent with the face surface for a consistent application of a stain or finish. Any tooth marks are pretty much non existent. I sell my work too and it is pretty intricate. I don't
tolerate sub par results from my equipment and don't use another machine to clean up what another has not left done properly.

I don't dispute your claim. Sounds like you have a well tuned instrument (saw) and good technique.


Well I do only use a 40 tooth general blade which might make the big
difference and I seldom rip material thicker than 3/4" thick, another
big factor.

On Fri, 12 Oct 2012 08:38:24 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
I think I would opt for going totally CNC if room were not a factor, I
think less waste might be a plus factor.

I (think) I know what CNC can do, but my main woodworking desire is
the easiest way to slice up veneered plywood. Cabinet making is my
main focus with woodworking.

CNC is a whole other ball game.

On 10/12/12 8:07 AM, Swingman wrote:
On 10/11/2012 1:23 PM, SonomaProducts.com wrote:
When those glue line rips first came out I did seem to have some
success. With my saw stop I have that fence dialed in with just a few
thou lean out on and I still get teeth marks on my rips with that
blade or any thin kerf actually.

Although I do own one special purpose thin kerf, as a general rule I
don't use thin kerf blades ... the Freud blade I was referring to is
1/8" kerf, Glue-Line-Rip.


I have the same blade, the LM74R010. They do make a thin kerf version,
LM75R010, but with the thinner plate, I would not want to use it and I
really doubt it would yield the same results no matter how perfect the
table saw was set up.

I have noticed that you can still get burn marks on the fence side of
the cut with the full kerf blade if you stall the feed rate anywhere in
the cut. I think that's probably just the nature of the beast, however.
I try to make sure I can get an uninterrupted feed for anything on which
I need a "finished" surface.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply