CW wrote:


"Bill" wrote in message ...

CW wrote:


"Leon" wrote in message
...


What Doug said in most cases but these just might have hardened edges as
they are being demonstrated with use ofwhat appears to be an Exacto
knife.
================================================== ======================
They are actually hardened all over. That is the nature of anodizing.
The coating is extremely thin however and is easy to get under with a
sharp tool. Using it with a marking knife is possible but one slip and
it's (the rule) marked for life.


Are the Starrett combination squares rules better in this regard since
the metal is "forged/hardened"? I have a 12" one. I noticed that a
Starrett 36" Steel rule is about $125, so that is not under
consideration. A 6" combination square is coveted however--still around
$80.
================================================== ========================
The Starrett combination squares are ideal for marking out with scriber
or rule. As a matter of fact, this is what they were designed for. At
one time, a high quality (Starrett, Brown and sharp, Lufkin ect) combo
square was a must have for any apprentice machinist, sheet metal worker
or cabinet maker. I hear you about the 6" combo square. Been wanting one
for years.

Thanks for your intersting reply. I got the (12") Model: C33H-12-4R
comb. sq. at Amazon.com a few years ago for $80-90. I see prices have
gone up a bit. Evidently, it's good to be Starrett...

I thought I might save some money and buy just the corresponding 6" rule
and share the comb. sq. head between the 6" and 12" rules. Can anyone
here advise me how to order just the rule for C33H-6-4R? So far, my
efforts to locate it have failed.

"Bill" wrote in message ...

CW wrote:


"Bill" wrote in message ...

CW wrote:


"Leon" wrote in message
...


What Doug said in most cases but these just might have hardened edges as
they are being demonstrated with use ofwhat appears to be an Exacto
knife.
================================================== ======================
They are actually hardened all over. That is the nature of anodizing.
The coating is extremely thin however and is easy to get under with a
sharp tool. Using it with a marking knife is possible but one slip and
it's (the rule) marked for life.


Are the Starrett combination squares rules better in this regard since
the metal is "forged/hardened"? I have a 12" one. I noticed that a
Starrett 36" Steel rule is about $125, so that is not under
consideration. A 6" combination square is coveted however--still around
$80.
================================================== ========================
The Starrett combination squares are ideal for marking out with scriber
or rule. As a matter of fact, this is what they were designed for. At
one time, a high quality (Starrett, Brown and sharp, Lufkin ect) combo
square was a must have for any apprentice machinist, sheet metal worker
or cabinet maker. I hear you about the 6" combo square. Been wanting one
for years.

Thanks for your intersting reply. I got the (12") Model: C33H-12-4R
comb. sq. at Amazon.com a few years ago for $80-90. I see prices have
gone up a bit. Evidently, it's good to be Starrett...

I thought I might save some money and buy just the corresponding 6" rule
and share the comb. sq. head between the 6" and 12" rules. Can anyone
here advise me how to order just the rule for C33H-6-4R? So far, my
efforts to locate it have failed.
================================================== ===============
The 6" rule is narrower than the 12". They won't fit the same head.

Bill wrote:
CW wrote:


"Bill" wrote in message ...

CW wrote:


"Leon" wrote in message
...


What Doug said in most cases but these just might have hardened edges as
they are being demonstrated with use ofwhat appears to be an Exacto
knife.
================================================== ======================
They are actually hardened all over. That is the nature of anodizing.
The coating is extremely thin however and is easy to get under with a
sharp tool. Using it with a marking knife is possible but one slip and
it's (the rule) marked for life.


Are the Starrett combination squares rules better in this regard since
the metal is "forged/hardened"? I have a 12" one. I noticed that a
Starrett 36" Steel rule is about $125, so that is not under
consideration. A 6" combination square is coveted however--still around
$80.
================================================== ========================

The Starrett combination squares are ideal for marking out with scriber
or rule. As a matter of fact, this is what they were designed for. At
one time, a high quality (Starrett, Brown and sharp, Lufkin ect) combo
square was a must have for any apprentice machinist, sheet metal worker
or cabinet maker. I hear you about the 6" combo square. Been wanting one
for years.

Thanks for your intersting reply. I got the (12") Model: C33H-12-4R
comb. sq. at Amazon.com a few years ago for $80-90. I see prices have
gone up a bit. Evidently, it's good to be Starrett...

I thought I might save some money and buy just the corresponding 6" rule
and share the comb. sq. head between the 6" and 12" rules. Can anyone
here advise me how to order just the rule for C33H-6-4R? So far, my
efforts to locate it have failed.

I think I found it:
http://www.amazon.com/Starrett-CB6-4...ref=pd_cp_hi_0
$34 in case you're curious.

So CW, for $118 + 34 = $152, you could have *2* Starrett combination
squares, sort of. Or $118 + 88 = $206 for two whole ones. Maybe saving
25% this way will get you closer? I confess I got my first one for
Christmas.

When you buy a "whole combination square", it comes certified. I'm
curious whether their matched parts should be expected to perform to the
same high standard. My guess is yes, but what do I know.

CW wrote:


"Bill" wrote in message ...

CW wrote:


"Bill" wrote in message ...

CW wrote:


"Leon" wrote in message
...


What Doug said in most cases but these just might have hardened edges as
they are being demonstrated with use ofwhat appears to be an Exacto
knife.
================================================== ======================
They are actually hardened all over. That is the nature of anodizing.
The coating is extremely thin however and is easy to get under with a
sharp tool. Using it with a marking knife is possible but one slip and
it's (the rule) marked for life.


Are the Starrett combination squares rules better in this regard since
the metal is "forged/hardened"? I have a 12" one. I noticed that a
Starrett 36" Steel rule is about $125, so that is not under
consideration. A 6" combination square is coveted however--still around
$80.
================================================== ========================

The Starrett combination squares are ideal for marking out with scriber
or rule. As a matter of fact, this is what they were designed for. At
one time, a high quality (Starrett, Brown and sharp, Lufkin ect) combo
square was a must have for any apprentice machinist, sheet metal worker
or cabinet maker. I hear you about the 6" combo square. Been wanting one
for years.

Thanks for your intersting reply. I got the (12") Model: C33H-12-4R
comb. sq. at Amazon.com a few years ago for $80-90. I see prices have
gone up a bit. Evidently, it's good to be Starrett...

I thought I might save some money and buy just the corresponding 6" rule
and share the comb. sq. head between the 6" and 12" rules. Can anyone
here advise me how to order just the rule for C33H-6-4R? So far, my
efforts to locate it have failed.
================================================== ===============
The 6" rule is narrower than the 12". They won't fit the same head.


Ratts! But thanks!

On 2/9/2012 9:55 PM, Dave wrote:
On Thu, 09 Feb 2012 14:59:59 -0600, Leonlcb11211@swbelldotnet
I am not saying Dave is wrong using a business card but I would think
that would be too loose. Test a few different shim methods and see
which works best for you. I think you will find the jig to be quite
good at what it does once you have it calibrated the way you like it.

Definitely some testing should be done. As far as thickness goes,
there's business cards that are more the thickness of cardboard and
there's business cards that are thin like paper, just stiffer
material. Mine are the latter.

Ohhhhhh.. I buy the cheap ones that have the raised lettering on card
stock so they would not be good for me.

On Thu, 9 Feb 2012 21:24:11 -0800, "CW" wrote:



"Bill" wrote in message ...

CW wrote:


"Bill" wrote in message ...

CW wrote:


"Leon" wrote in message
...


What Doug said in most cases but these just might have hardened edges as
they are being demonstrated with use ofwhat appears to be an Exacto
knife.
================================================== ======================
They are actually hardened all over. That is the nature of anodizing.
The coating is extremely thin however and is easy to get under with a
sharp tool. Using it with a marking knife is possible but one slip and
it's (the rule) marked for life.


Are the Starrett combination squares rules better in this regard since
the metal is "forged/hardened"? I have a 12" one. I noticed that a
Starrett 36" Steel rule is about $125, so that is not under
consideration. A 6" combination square is coveted however--still around
$80.
================================================== ========================
The Starrett combination squares are ideal for marking out with scriber
or rule. As a matter of fact, this is what they were designed for. At
one time, a high quality (Starrett, Brown and sharp, Lufkin ect) combo
square was a must have for any apprentice machinist, sheet metal worker
or cabinet maker. I hear you about the 6" combo square. Been wanting one
for years.

Thanks for your intersting reply. I got the (12") Model: C33H-12-4R
comb. sq. at Amazon.com a few years ago for $80-90. I see prices have
gone up a bit. Evidently, it's good to be Starrett...

I thought I might save some money and buy just the corresponding 6" rule
and share the comb. sq. head between the 6" and 12" rules. Can anyone
here advise me how to order just the rule for C33H-6-4R? So far, my
efforts to locate it have failed.
================================================= ================
The 6" rule is narrower than the 12". They won't fit the same head.

Got a cold saw? Make two! (Okay, 1.93)

--
Energy and persistence alter all things.
--Benjamin Franklin

On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 06:38:31 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
I buy the cheap ones that have the raised lettering on card
stock so they would not be good for me.

I buy good quality card stock and print them myself as needed a few
hundred at time. The raised lettering type are nice, but I prefer the
convenience factor of printing my own.

CW wrote:


"Leon" wrote in message
...


What Doug said in most cases but these just might have hardened edges as
they are being demonstrated with use ofwhat appears to be an Exacto
knife.
================================================== ======================
They are actually hardened all over. That is the nature of anodizing.
The coating is extremely thin however and is easy to get under with a
sharp tool. Using it with a marking knife is possible but one slip and
it's (the rule) marked for life.


It occurred to me that the tools I have been using for "measuring and
marking with a knife" most of the time are my my two trusty framing
squares! I have a big one (18") and a handy little one (6").

I'm almost afraid to hazzard a guess where those fit in with you expert
measurers. Is the answer accurate enough for carpentry, but not
furniture, or something like that? What do you think?

When I bought them both for about $22 one day, I thought was making an
investment in quality measurin'! At that time, I would have guessed a
starrett was something in the sky! Now I know I wouldn't have been far
off!
; )

Bill

Bill wrote in :

It occurred to me that the tools I have been using for "measuring and
marking with a knife" most of the time are my my two trusty framing
squares! I have a big one (18") and a handy little one (6").

I'm almost afraid to hazzard a guess where those fit in with you
expert measurers. Is the answer accurate enough for carpentry, but
not furniture, or something like that? What do you think?

I'd agree with that description.

When I bought them both for about $22 one day, I thought was making an
investment in quality measurin'! At that time, I would have guessed
a starrett was something in the sky! Now I know I wouldn't have been
far off!

If you want accuracy, you have to pay for it. Good tools are worth the money.

Doug Miller wrote:
wrote in :

It occurred to me that the tools I have been using for "measuring and
marking with a knife" most of the time are my my two trusty framing
squares! I have a big one (18") and a handy little one (6").

I'm almost afraid to hazzard a guess where those fit in with you
expert measurers. Is the answer accurate enough for carpentry, but
not furniture, or something like that? What do you think?

I'd agree with that description.

When I bought them both for about $22 one day, I thought was making an
investment in quality measurin'! At that time, I would have guessed
a starrett was something in the sky! Now I know I wouldn't have been
far off!

If you want accuracy, you have to pay for it. Good tools are worth the money.

No one is disputing your last point. I already "invested" in a 12"
Starrett combination square. I was just thinking through what I need to
have in order to have my bases covered. Even with my combination
square, the line I mark is only as good as edge of the board I use for
reference--so maybe I need a jointer! Of course, I plan to try sticking
with hand tools for a while. I understand those plastic engineer's
triangles are pretty accurate--cheap too! : ) I noticed Starrett has a
$95 8" compass, but I figure I can improvise!

Bill wrote:


No one is disputing your last point. I already "invested" in a 12"
Starrett combination square. I was just thinking through what I need
to have in order to have my bases covered. Even with my combination
square, the line I mark is only as good as edge of the board I use for
reference--so maybe I need a jointer! Of course, I plan to try
sticking with hand tools for a while. I understand those plastic
engineer's triangles are pretty accurate--cheap too! : ) I noticed
Starrett has a $95 8" compass, but I figure I can improvise!

Starrett is for those who want to feel good about themselves Bill. Think
about it - how much more "accurrate" can it be? Over what distance (which
is where inaccuracy really becomes important...)? Cool tools are indeed
neat things, but you can do all of the woodworking that you are going to do
with a $1.98 speed square from the dollar store - with plenty enough
accuracy.

--

-Mike-

Mike Marlow wrote:
Bill wrote:


No one is disputing your last point. I already "invested" in a 12"
Starrett combination square. I was just thinking through what I need
to have in order to have my bases covered. Even with my combination
square, the line I mark is only as good as edge of the board I use for
reference--so maybe I need a jointer! Of course, I plan to try
sticking with hand tools for a while. I understand those plastic
engineer's triangles are pretty accurate--cheap too! : ) I noticed
Starrett has a $95 8" compass, but I figure I can improvise!

Starrett is for those who want to feel good about themselves Bill. Think
about it - how much more "accurrate" can it be? Over what distance (which
is where inaccuracy really becomes important...)? Cool tools are indeed
neat things, but you can do all of the woodworking that you are going to do
with a $1.98 speed square from the dollar store - with plenty enough
accuracy.


I think I understand what you are saying. I expect making things the
*same" length is usally far more important than making them a certain
length. Whether they are an 1/8" longer or shorter isn't going to be a
problem as long as they are the same. Of course, a "straight-edge"
needs to be straight. I'll have to "test" my framing square for
straightness so I know what I've got. It has worked fine for drywall. I
have a few projects in front of me before I try furniture for the house.
Who knows, maybe "furniture for the garage" will be my specialty? : )

On 2/12/2012 11:38 PM, Bill wrote:
Mike Marlow wrote:
Bill wrote:

I have a few projects in front of me before I try furniture for the house. Who knows,
maybe "furniture for the garage" will be my specialty? : )

Don't forget the deck...

I've always felt a good way to learn how to make stuff was to make stuff
for your shop, like workbenches, tool benches, stools, cabinets. Then
go for deck furniture, benches, chairs, tables, flower boxes and so on.
Once you do all that and accumulate some tools, learn how to use them
and so on, if still interested, go for the house furniture. Same
stuff, just more expensive materials. I still enjoy making "furniture
for the garage"

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

Jack wrote:
On 2/12/2012 11:38 PM, Bill wrote:
:

I have a few projects in front of me before I try furniture for the
house. Who knows, maybe "furniture for the garage" will be my
specialty? : )

Don't forget the deck...

I've always felt a good way to learn how to make stuff was to make
stuff for your shop, like workbenches, tool benches, stools,
cabinets. Then go for deck furniture, benches, chairs, tables,
flower boxes and so on. Once you do all that and accumulate some
tools, learn how to use them and so on, if still interested, go for
the house furniture. Same stuff, just more expensive materials. I
still enjoy making "furniture for the garage"

How in the heck do you paint cars in your garage with furniture in there?...

--

-Mike-

Jack wrote:
On 2/12/2012 11:38 PM, Bill wrote:
Mike Marlow wrote:
Bill wrote:

I have a few projects in front of me before I try furniture for the
house. Who knows,
maybe "furniture for the garage" will be my specialty? : )

Don't forget the deck...

I've always felt a good way to learn how to make stuff was to make stuff
for your shop, like workbenches, tool benches, stools, cabinets. Then go
for deck furniture, benches, chairs, tables, flower boxes and so on.
Once you do all that and accumulate some tools, learn how to use them
and so on, if still interested, go for the house furniture. Same stuff,
just more expensive materials. I still enjoy making "furniture for the
garage"


Half of the people living around me put out those "deer" on their lawns
at Christmas time. I was thinking of making some of my own "stick deer"
to put out there--either to keep up with the Jones' or to laugh with
them, I'm not sure which! Making a stick deer is not as simple of a
project as it might seem--it won't require any expensive rulers though.
I'll put plenty of "doe-in-heat" on it to passify the nee-sayers!

On Thu, 16 Feb 2012 19:33:19 -0500, Bill wrote:

Jack wrote:
On 2/12/2012 11:38 PM, Bill wrote:
Mike Marlow wrote:
Bill wrote:

I have a few projects in front of me before I try furniture for the
house. Who knows,
maybe "furniture for the garage" will be my specialty? : )

Don't forget the deck...

I've always felt a good way to learn how to make stuff was to make stuff
for your shop, like workbenches, tool benches, stools, cabinets. Then go
for deck furniture, benches, chairs, tables, flower boxes and so on.
Once you do all that and accumulate some tools, learn how to use them
and so on, if still interested, go for the house furniture. Same stuff,
just more expensive materials. I still enjoy making "furniture for the
garage"


Half of the people living around me put out those "deer" on their lawns
at Christmas time. I was thinking of making some of my own "stick deer"
to put out there--either to keep up with the Jones' or to laugh with
them, I'm not sure which! Making a stick deer is not as simple of a
project as it might seem--it won't require any expensive rulers though.
I'll put plenty of "doe-in-heat" on it to passify the nee-sayers!

I love this deer: http://tinyurl.com/6p3hl2z

--
The ultimate result of shielding men from folly
is to fill the world with fools.
-- Herbert Spencer

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Thu, 16 Feb 2012 19:33:19 -0500, wrote:

Jack wrote:
On 2/12/2012 11:38 PM, Bill wrote:
Mike Marlow wrote:
Bill wrote:

I have a few projects in front of me before I try furniture for the
house. Who knows,
maybe "furniture for the garage" will be my specialty? : )

Don't forget the deck...

I've always felt a good way to learn how to make stuff was to make stuff
for your shop, like workbenches, tool benches, stools, cabinets. Then go
for deck furniture, benches, chairs, tables, flower boxes and so on.
Once you do all that and accumulate some tools, learn how to use them
and so on, if still interested, go for the house furniture. Same stuff,
just more expensive materials. I still enjoy making "furniture for the
garage"


Half of the people living around me put out those "deer" on their lawns
at Christmas time. I was thinking of making some of my own "stick deer"
to put out there--either to keep up with the Jones' or to laugh with
them, I'm not sure which! Making a stick deer is not as simple of a
project as it might seem--it won't require any expensive rulers though.
I'll put plenty of "doe-in-heat" on it to passify the nee-sayers!

I love this deer: http://tinyurl.com/6p3hl2z

I got a genuine LOL out of that one!


--
The ultimate result of shielding men from folly
is to fill the world with fools.
-- Herbert Spencer

Larry Jaques wrote:


I love this deer: http://tinyurl.com/6p3hl2z

I have seen that before and that is the greatest!

--

-Mike-

On 2/16/2012 11:40 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote:


I love this deer: http://tinyurl.com/6p3hl2z

I have seen that before and that is the greatest!


it kind of makes me hungry!

On Fri, 17 Feb 2012 08:53:02 -0500, Bill
wrote:

On 2/16/2012 11:40 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote:


I love this deer: http://tinyurl.com/6p3hl2z

I have seen that before and that is the greatest!


it kind of makes me hungry!

The hanging portion or the pile portion? (Ewwwww!)

--
The ultimate result of shielding men from folly
is to fill the world with fools.
-- Herbert Spencer

On 2/16/2012 1:45 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jack wrote:
On 2/12/2012 11:38 PM, Bill wrote:
:

I have a few projects in front of me before I try furniture for the
house. Who knows, maybe "furniture for the garage" will be my
specialty? : )

Don't forget the deck...

I've always felt a good way to learn how to make stuff was to make
stuff for your shop, like workbenches, tool benches, stools,
cabinets. Then go for deck furniture, benches, chairs, tables,
flower boxes and so on. Once you do all that and accumulate some
tools, learn how to use them and so on, if still interested, go for
the house furniture. Same stuff, just more expensive materials. I
still enjoy making "furniture for the garage"

How in the heck do you paint cars in your garage with furniture in there?...

I quit painting cars 40 years ago, but, I spray furniture with both my
tools and my garage "furniture" in there.

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On 2/16/2012 7:33 PM, Bill wrote:
Jack wrote:
On 2/12/2012 11:38 PM, Bill wrote:
Mike Marlow wrote:
Bill wrote:

I have a few projects in front of me before I try furniture for the
house. Who knows,
maybe "furniture for the garage" will be my specialty? : )

Don't forget the deck...

I've always felt a good way to learn how to make stuff was to make stuff
for your shop, like workbenches, tool benches, stools, cabinets. Then go
for deck furniture, benches, chairs, tables, flower boxes and so on.
Once you do all that and accumulate some tools, learn how to use them
and so on, if still interested, go for the house furniture. Same stuff,
just more expensive materials. I still enjoy making "furniture for the
garage"


Half of the people living around me put out those "deer" on their lawns
at Christmas time. I was thinking of making some of my own "stick deer"
to put out there--either to keep up with the Jones' or to laugh with
them, I'm not sure which! Making a stick deer is not as simple of a
project as it might seem--it won't require any expensive rulers though.
I'll put plenty of "doe-in-heat" on it to passify the nee-sayers!

Yeah, they were all the rage around here about 15-20 years ago. The
wife forced me into to making her a set then. They might still be in
the shed? I didn't like that project much, and they were not
"furniture" in the least:-)

A lathe bench with 8 drawers and a cabinet is "furniture" A TS bench
with 4 doors is "furniture" A workbench with a butcher block top 13
drawers and a cabinet is "furniture" A painted white, fake deer is
something else. The best things I ever made are my shop stuff, because
I look at it and use it every day and it gives me extreme pleasure doing so.

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

Jack wrote:


I quit painting cars 40 years ago, but, I spray furniture with both my
tools and my garage "furniture" in there.

That just ain't right Jack. Painting ain't really painting if it don't
include at least a fender here and there...

--

-Mike-

On 2/21/2012 11:00 AM, Jack wrote:
On 2/16/2012 7:33 PM, Bill wrote:
Jack wrote:
On 2/12/2012 11:38 PM, Bill wrote:
Mike Marlow wrote:
Bill wrote:

I have a few projects in front of me before I try furniture for the
house. Who knows,
maybe "furniture for the garage" will be my specialty? : )

Don't forget the deck...

I've always felt a good way to learn how to make stuff was to make stuff
for your shop, like workbenches, tool benches, stools, cabinets. Then go
for deck furniture, benches, chairs, tables, flower boxes and so on.
Once you do all that and accumulate some tools, learn how to use them
and so on, if still interested, go for the house furniture. Same stuff,
just more expensive materials. I still enjoy making "furniture for the
garage"


Half of the people living around me put out those "deer" on their lawns
at Christmas time. I was thinking of making some of my own "stick deer"
to put out there--either to keep up with the Jones' or to laugh with
them, I'm not sure which! Making a stick deer is not as simple of a
project as it might seem--it won't require any expensive rulers though.
I'll put plenty of "doe-in-heat" on it to passify the nee-sayers!

Yeah, they were all the rage around here about 15-20 years ago. The wife
forced me into to making her a set then. They might still be in the
shed? I didn't like that project much, and they were not "furniture" in
the least:-)

A lathe bench with 8 drawers and a cabinet is "furniture" A TS bench
with 4 doors is "furniture" A workbench with a butcher block top 13
drawers and a cabinet is "furniture" A painted white, fake deer is
something else. The best things I ever made are my shop stuff, because I
look at it and use it every day and it gives me extreme pleasure doing so.


Sounds like you've done some fine "garage furniture" projects! My first
"significant" one was my mobile DP baseboard I made last summer.
It rolls across the floor (with 250# DP) smoother than any one I could
have bought. I haven't seen any albino deer, but I've heard about
them. Apparently you herds of them near you! : )

On 2/21/2012 11:10 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jack wrote:

I quit painting cars 40 years ago, but, I spray furniture with both my
tools and my garage "furniture" in there.

That just ain't right Jack. Painting ain't really painting if it don't
include at least a fender here and there...

I always enjoyed painting cars but hated the sanding. Feel pretty much
the same with wood. I heard a super over priced Festering sander makes
sanding enjoyable... If my damn kid would have bought me a festering
sander instead of an Ipad, I'd know by now. As it is, I'm still not a
fan of sanding. I'm not even sure I'm a fan of woodwork any more.
Still at it, but only because I love my shop, and tools, and people keep
talking me into making stuff.

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

Jack wrote:
On 2/21/2012 11:10 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jack wrote:

I quit painting cars 40 years ago, but, I spray furniture with both my
tools and my garage "furniture" in there.

That just ain't right Jack. Painting ain't really painting if it don't
include at least a fender here and there...

I always enjoyed painting cars but hated the sanding. Feel pretty much
the same with wood. I heard a super over priced Festering sander makes
sanding enjoyable... If my damn kid would have bought me a festering
sander instead of an Ipad, I'd know by now. As it is, I'm still not a
fan of sanding. I'm not even sure I'm a fan of woodwork any more. Still
at it, but only because I love my shop, and tools, and people keep
talking me into making stuff.


Maybe you might wanna build a banjo, or equivalent?
I saw the following book at Rockler this weekend (but I didn't buy it,
at least not yet).

http://www.amazon.com/Handmade-Music...=2VMX7XEQ4VJA4

If you don't like that, maybe you wanna try wood carving?

I've hated sanding since 10 minutes after I learned how to do it!

On Wed, 22 Feb 2012 01:19:33 -0500, Jack wrote:
I heard a super over priced Festering sander makes
sanding enjoyable... If my damn kid would have bought me a festering
sander instead of an Ipad, I'd know by now. As it is, I'm still not a
fan of sanding. I'm not even sure I'm a fan of woodwork any more.

Well Jack, you should attend a Festool demo day then so you can find
out how good these tools really are. Admit it. You're afraid to go to
one for fear that you'll end up buying one or more of their tools.

Jack wrote:
On 2/21/2012 11:10 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jack wrote:

I quit painting cars 40 years ago, but, I spray furniture with both
my tools and my garage "furniture" in there.

That just ain't right Jack. Painting ain't really painting if it
don't include at least a fender here and there...

I always enjoyed painting cars but hated the sanding. Feel pretty
much the same with wood. I heard a super over priced Festering
sander makes sanding enjoyable... If my damn kid would have bought
me a festering sander instead of an Ipad, I'd know by now. As it is,
I'm still not a fan of sanding. I'm not even sure I'm a fan of
woodwork any more. Still at it, but only because I love my shop, and
tools, and people keep talking me into making stuff.

I hear you Jack, on the sanding stuff. I am no fan of sanding either. I
used to hate masking more than any other aspect of the task, but now I don't
really mind it as much. Body drapes go a long way to reducing the amount of
masking I used to do, and I don't mind that part much at all now.

As far as the Festering sander goes - perhaps we could get Leon to send his
up this way and we could both try it out for a bit to see if it brings a
certain joy to the task. We could send it back to him once we've given it a
try...

--

-Mike-

On 2/22/2012 6:32 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jack wrote:
On 2/21/2012 11:10 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jack wrote:

I quit painting cars 40 years ago, but, I spray furniture with both
my tools and my garage "furniture" in there.

That just ain't right Jack. Painting ain't really painting if it
don't include at least a fender here and there...

I always enjoyed painting cars but hated the sanding. Feel pretty
much the same with wood. I heard a super over priced Festering
sander makes sanding enjoyable... If my damn kid would have bought
me a festering sander instead of an Ipad, I'd know by now. As it is,
I'm still not a fan of sanding. I'm not even sure I'm a fan of
woodwork any more. Still at it, but only because I love my shop, and
tools, and people keep talking me into making stuff.

I hear you Jack, on the sanding stuff. I am no fan of sanding either. I
used to hate masking more than any other aspect of the task, but now I don't
really mind it as much. Body drapes go a long way to reducing the amount of
masking I used to do, and I don't mind that part much at all now.

As far as the Festering sander goes - perhaps we could get Leon to send his
up this way and we could both try it out for a bit to see if it brings a
certain joy to the task. We could send it back to him once we've given it a
try...



Go to your local store and try one out. Sanding is not fun. But when
sanding is accomplished much more quickly and with out dust it is not a
task to hate any more.

PLUS Festool offers many types of sand paper. I recently discovered
their "Crystal" sand paper, very aggressive and glue does not gum up or
load the paper at all.
Yesterday I was sanding 10 face frames front and back after glue up. 6
joints on each side, 12 per face frame. One piece of Crystal 80 grit
paper to sand 120 sides at the joints with glue. 2 pieces of 120 grit
Rubin for both sides of the 10 face frames, 1 piece of 150 grit Rubin,
and two pieces of 180 grit Rubin for all sides plus inside edges. I
hand sanded all the corner edges with foam backed Mirka 180 grip paper.
4 hours.

I only got dust when I hand sanded so I finish sanded after hand sanding
the corners to get rid of the dust.

Leon wrote:


PLUS Festool offers many types of sand paper. I recently discovered
their "Crystal" sand paper, very aggressive and glue does not gum up
or load the paper at all.
Yesterday I was sanding 10 face frames front and back after glue up. 6
joints on each side, 12 per face frame. One piece of Crystal 80
grit paper to sand 120 sides at the joints with glue. 2 pieces of
120 grit Rubin for both sides of the 10 face frames, 1 piece of 150
grit Rubin, and two pieces of 180 grit Rubin for all sides plus
inside edges. I hand sanded all the corner edges with foam backed
Mirka 180 grip paper. 4 hours.


Good sandpaper is most of the battle. That's something I don't scrimp on
anymore.

--

-Mike-

On 2/22/2012 1:49 AM, Bill wrote:

Maybe you might wanna build a banjo, or equivalent?
I saw the following book at Rockler this weekend (but I didn't buy it,
at least not yet).

Only instrument I'd ever considered making would be drums, ala Mike the
drummer. Being an ex-drummer, that would be my interest. A few guys
tried to talk me into making electric guitars for them, but I resisted.

If you don't like that, maybe you wanna try wood carving?

Tool dangerous. All my nicks and scratches have come from hand tools. A
CNC machine is not in my playbook:-)

I've hated sanding since 10 minutes after I learned how to do it!

I knew a girl once that was a "professional sander" for Earl Schribe...
Wow, she said she enjoyed it, and I'll bet money she wasn't u
--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On 2/21/2012 11:28 AM, Bill wrote:

Sounds like you've done some fine "garage furniture" projects! My first
"significant" one was my mobile DP baseboard I made last summer.
It rolls across the floor (with 250# DP) smoother than any one I could
have bought. I haven't seen any albino deer, but I've heard about them.
Apparently you herds of them near you! : )

When you do woodwork for a hobby, you can afford to spend lots of time
on shop "furniture". Time is money is not the same as time is fun:-)

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On 2/22/2012 7:59 AM, Leon wrote:

I only got dust when I hand sanded so I finish sanded after hand sanding
the corners to get rid of the dust.

Did the same thing yesterday ... ran through the grits with the Festool
setup on the bottom part of a desk.

The final, light hand pass and breaking the edges with Norton 220 caused
the only dust I'd seen/breathed all day. And, I had to blow it off with
the air compressor, for the first time.

--
www.eWoodShop.com
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)
http://gplus.to/eWoodShop

On 2/22/2012 7:59 AM, Leon wrote:
On 2/22/2012 6:32 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jack wrote:
On 2/21/2012 11:10 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jack wrote:

I quit painting cars 40 years ago, but, I spray furniture with both
my tools and my garage "furniture" in there.

That just ain't right Jack. Painting ain't really painting if it
don't include at least a fender here and there...

I always enjoyed painting cars but hated the sanding. Feel pretty
much the same with wood. I heard a super over priced Festering
sander makes sanding enjoyable... If my damn kid would have bought
me a festering sander instead of an Ipad, I'd know by now. As it is,
I'm still not a fan of sanding. I'm not even sure I'm a fan of
woodwork any more. Still at it, but only because I love my shop, and
tools, and people keep talking me into making stuff.

I hear you Jack, on the sanding stuff. I am no fan of sanding either. I
used to hate masking more than any other aspect of the task, but now I
don't
really mind it as much. Body drapes go a long way to reducing the
amount of
masking I used to do, and I don't mind that part much at all now.

As far as the Festering sander goes - perhaps we could get Leon to
send his
up this way and we could both try it out for a bit to see if it brings a
certain joy to the task. We could send it back to him once we've given
it a
try...



Go to your local store and try one out. Sanding is not fun. But when
sanding is accomplished much more quickly and with out dust it is not a
task to hate any more.

PLUS Festool offers many types of sand paper. I recently discovered
their "Crystal" sand paper, very aggressive and glue does not gum up or
load the paper at all.
Yesterday I was sanding 10 face frames front and back after glue up. 6
joints on each side, 12 per face frame. One piece of Crystal 80 grit
paper to sand 120 sides at the joints with glue. 2 pieces of 120 grit
Rubin for both sides of the 10 face frames, 1 piece of 150 grit Rubin,
and two pieces of 180 grit Rubin for all sides plus inside edges. I hand
sanded all the corner edges with foam backed Mirka 180 grip paper. 4 hours.

I only got dust when I hand sanded so I finish sanded after hand sanding
the corners to get rid of the dust.

where does one purchase the aforementioned sandpapers?



--
Steve Barker
remove the "not" from my address to email

On 2/22/2012 8:43 AM, Steve Barker wrote:
On 2/22/2012 7:59 AM, Leon wrote:
On 2/22/2012 6:32 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jack wrote:
On 2/21/2012 11:10 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jack wrote:

I quit painting cars 40 years ago, but, I spray furniture with both
my tools and my garage "furniture" in there.

That just ain't right Jack. Painting ain't really painting if it
don't include at least a fender here and there...

I always enjoyed painting cars but hated the sanding. Feel pretty
much the same with wood. I heard a super over priced Festering
sander makes sanding enjoyable... If my damn kid would have bought
me a festering sander instead of an Ipad, I'd know by now. As it is,
I'm still not a fan of sanding. I'm not even sure I'm a fan of
woodwork any more. Still at it, but only because I love my shop, and
tools, and people keep talking me into making stuff.

I hear you Jack, on the sanding stuff. I am no fan of sanding either. I
used to hate masking more than any other aspect of the task, but now I
don't
really mind it as much. Body drapes go a long way to reducing the
amount of
masking I used to do, and I don't mind that part much at all now.

As far as the Festering sander goes - perhaps we could get Leon to
send his
up this way and we could both try it out for a bit to see if it brings a
certain joy to the task. We could send it back to him once we've given
it a
try...



Go to your local store and try one out. Sanding is not fun. But when
sanding is accomplished much more quickly and with out dust it is not a
task to hate any more.

PLUS Festool offers many types of sand paper. I recently discovered
their "Crystal" sand paper, very aggressive and glue does not gum up or
load the paper at all.
Yesterday I was sanding 10 face frames front and back after glue up. 6
joints on each side, 12 per face frame. One piece of Crystal 80 grit
paper to sand 120 sides at the joints with glue. 2 pieces of 120 grit
Rubin for both sides of the 10 face frames, 1 piece of 150 grit Rubin,
and two pieces of 180 grit Rubin for all sides plus inside edges. I hand
sanded all the corner edges with foam backed Mirka 180 grip paper. 4
hours.

I only got dust when I hand sanded so I finish sanded after hand sanding
the corners to get rid of the dust.

where does one purchase the aforementioned sandpapers?



Woodcraft, Rockler

Jack wrote:
On 2/22/2012 1:49 AM, Bill wrote:

I've hated sanding since 10 minutes after I learned how to do it!

I knew a girl once that was a "professional sander" for Earl Schribe...
Wow, she said she enjoyed it, and I'll bet money she wasn't u


Well, I'm not a "she", so I'm not her, but I feel like I'm missing
something subtle? My first car did have a Earl Schribe paint job--$50!
Maybe you took her out to dinner with an extra $50? : )

I have been taught, and accept, that "In anything worth doing, there
will be at least 10% of it that won't be any fun...". I'm willing to
put sanding in the latter category, although I might warm up to it if I
had better equipment for it.

My dad used to like to sand Petoske stones by hand, especialy while on
vacation. The Petoske stone just happens to be the Michigan "State
Stone", in case you didn't already know that. : ) It take a lot of
sanding to get all of the small "white dots" off of one! That was my
"introduction to sanding". If you lick the stone, you can see where you
need to sand. We all find our own paths & passions, huh? : )

On Wed, 22 Feb 2012 16:59:03 -0500, Bill wrote:

Jack wrote:
On 2/22/2012 1:49 AM, Bill wrote:

I've hated sanding since 10 minutes after I learned how to do it!

I knew a girl once that was a "professional sander" for Earl Schribe...
Wow, she said she enjoyed it, and I'll bet money she wasn't u


Well, I'm not a "she", so I'm not her, but I feel like I'm missing
something subtle? My first car did have a Earl Schribe paint job--$50!
Maybe you took her out to dinner with an extra $50? : )

You must be a young fart, Bill. I remember the ads on TV for Ol' Earl.
"I'm Earl Scheib and I'll paint any car any color for only $29.95!"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earl_Scheib


I have been taught, and accept, that "In anything worth doing, there
will be at least 10% of it that won't be any fun...". I'm willing to
put sanding in the latter category, although I might warm up to it if I
had better equipment for it.

Sanding was made soooo much easier by pneumatic and electric sanders.
But I prefer to scrape wood, then to finishing touches with sandpaper.
That cuts my sanding down by 90%.


My dad used to like to sand Petoske stones by hand, especialy while on
vacation. The Petoske stone just happens to be the Michigan "State
Stone", in case you didn't already know that. : ) It take a lot of
sanding to get all of the small "white dots" off of one! That was my
"introduction to sanding". If you lick the stone, you can see where you
need to sand. We all find our own paths & passions, huh? : )

The bad news is that those white spots were--seagull crap. Ick!

--
Every day I remind myself that my inner and outer life are
based on the labors of other men, living and dead, and that
I must exert myself in order to give in the same measure as
I have received and am still receiving.
-- Albert Einstein

Larry Jaques wrote:

Sanding was made soooo much easier by pneumatic and electric sanders.
But I prefer to scrape wood, then to finishing touches with sandpaper.
That cuts my sanding down by 90%.

Rockler has a (Crown brand) burnisher on sale now for $14.99. I picked
one up last weekend so I can get the "full experience".

I take it, you scrape entire surfaces and not just tough spots. It
occurred to me that if you just scraped one spot that this might stand
out after finishing.

On 2/22/2012 12:39 PM, Leon wrote:
On 2/22/2012 8:43 AM, Steve Barker wrote:
On 2/22/2012 7:59 AM, Leon wrote:
On 2/22/2012 6:32 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jack wrote:
On 2/21/2012 11:10 AM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Jack wrote:

I quit painting cars 40 years ago, but, I spray furniture with both
my tools and my garage "furniture" in there.

That just ain't right Jack. Painting ain't really painting if it
don't include at least a fender here and there...

I always enjoyed painting cars but hated the sanding. Feel pretty
much the same with wood. I heard a super over priced Festering
sander makes sanding enjoyable... If my damn kid would have bought
me a festering sander instead of an Ipad, I'd know by now. As it is,
I'm still not a fan of sanding. I'm not even sure I'm a fan of
woodwork any more. Still at it, but only because I love my shop, and
tools, and people keep talking me into making stuff.

I hear you Jack, on the sanding stuff. I am no fan of sanding either. I
used to hate masking more than any other aspect of the task, but now I
don't
really mind it as much. Body drapes go a long way to reducing the
amount of
masking I used to do, and I don't mind that part much at all now.

As far as the Festering sander goes - perhaps we could get Leon to
send his
up this way and we could both try it out for a bit to see if it
brings a
certain joy to the task. We could send it back to him once we've given
it a
try...



Go to your local store and try one out. Sanding is not fun. But when
sanding is accomplished much more quickly and with out dust it is not a
task to hate any more.

PLUS Festool offers many types of sand paper. I recently discovered
their "Crystal" sand paper, very aggressive and glue does not gum up or
load the paper at all.
Yesterday I was sanding 10 face frames front and back after glue up. 6
joints on each side, 12 per face frame. One piece of Crystal 80 grit
paper to sand 120 sides at the joints with glue. 2 pieces of 120 grit
Rubin for both sides of the 10 face frames, 1 piece of 150 grit Rubin,
and two pieces of 180 grit Rubin for all sides plus inside edges. I hand
sanded all the corner edges with foam backed Mirka 180 grip paper. 4
hours.

I only got dust when I hand sanded so I finish sanded after hand sanding
the corners to get rid of the dust.

where does one purchase the aforementioned sandpapers?



Woodcraft, Rockler


thanks

--
Steve Barker
remove the "not" from my address to email

On Wed, 22 Feb 2012 20:35:13 -0500, Bill wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:

Sanding was made soooo much easier by pneumatic and electric sanders.
But I prefer to scrape wood, then to finishing touches with sandpaper.
That cuts my sanding down by 90%.

Rockler has a (Crown brand) burnisher on sale now for $14.99. I picked
one up last weekend so I can get the "full experience".

Bueno, Bwana Bill.


I take it, you scrape entire surfaces and not just tough spots. It
occurred to me that if you just scraped one spot that this might stand
out after finishing.

Yes, indeedy. It leaves a better-than-sanded appearance.

--
Every day I remind myself that my inner and outer life are
based on the labors of other men, living and dead, and that
I must exert myself in order to give in the same measure as
I have received and am still receiving.
-- Albert Einstein