I've just been looking at the Kreg Deck jig being advertised on Lee
Valley's website.
http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/pag...28&cat=51&ap=1

I was wondering about fastening deck boards as demonstrated by this
jig. For those of you experienced with building decks, would the
screws need to be inserted on both sides of a deck board, (assuming
there's just enough room for screws to be inserted on a 45 degree
angle both edges) or just on one edge? And if it is just one edge for
fastening down a deck board, wouldn't there be a tendency for the
opposite unfastened edge to rise or perhaps cup over time?

Thanks

Usually one edge but then there would need to be an equivalent of
tongue-in-groove hardware to hold down the other side of the plank.

I prefer my deck boards screwed down, when using real wood. Warping,
splitting and cracking will give you a mess and it probably costs more than
the decking lumber.


"Upscale" wrote in message
...

I've just been looking at the Kreg Deck jig being advertised on Lee
Valley's website.
http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/pag...28&cat=51&ap=1

I was wondering about fastening deck boards as demonstrated by this
jig. For those of you experienced with building decks, would the
screws need to be inserted on both sides of a deck board, (assuming
there's just enough room for screws to be inserted on a 45 degree
angle both edges) or just on one edge? And if it is just one edge for
fastening down a deck board, wouldn't there be a tendency for the
opposite unfastened edge to rise or perhaps cup over time?

Thanks



--- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: ---

On Jun 3, 5:26*am, Upscale wrote:
I've just been looking at the Kreg Deck jig being advertised on Lee
Valley's website.http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/pag...28&cat=51&ap=1

I was wondering about fastening deck boards as demonstrated by this
jig. For those of you experienced with building decks, would the
screws need to be inserted on both sides of a deck board, (assuming
there's just enough room for screws to be inserted on a 45 degree
angle both edges) or just on one edge? And if it is just one edge for
fastening down a deck board, wouldn't there be a tendency for the
opposite unfastened edge to rise or perhaps cup over time?

Thanks

Looking at a nice Kreg display at David Eisan's store a couple of days
ago, my hunch is that they don't sell jigs. They sell screws. The good
ol' 'sell-through' concept.
Sorta kinda like Gillette selling blades, not razors. Or the old days
of Xerox. They didn't sell copiers, they sold toners, chemicals and
paper.
Regardless, I like that Kreg bunch. Great solutions, quality tools and
a savvy management team.
Good on them.

On Thu, 03 Jun 2010 05:26:09 -0400, Upscale
wrote:


I've just been looking at the Kreg Deck jig being advertised on Lee
Valley's website.
http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/pag...28&cat=51&ap=1

I was wondering about fastening deck boards as demonstrated by this
jig. For those of you experienced with building decks, would the
screws need to be inserted on both sides of a deck board, (assuming
there's just enough room for screws to be inserted on a 45 degree
angle both edges) or just on one edge? And if it is just one edge for
fastening down a deck board, wouldn't there be a tendency for the
opposite unfastened edge to rise or perhaps cup over time?

Thanks

....I like Kreg products, but I don't know 'bout this method/tool. It
doesn't seem, by the very nature of installation of deck boards, that
there would be room to fit the jig on the other side. I'd be a bit
leary, in any case, that the screw head (and countersink hole that it
resides in) would be facing up to catch moisture. Absolute best
system of invisible fastening is a stainless bracket installed on the
joisting lengthwise, that allows the installer to screw up into the
deck board from below. Slick.

cg

I was wondering about fastening deck boards as demonstrated by this
jig.

Disclaimer: Just an opinion

This looks like a solution in search of a problem driven by the need
to grow the business. Looks like a miss rather than a hit, such as
their first great idea of bringing pocket holes to the masses. Lots of
great products are followed up by derivitves that don't deliver near
the same value.

Problems?
1. Yes, I would also assume a one sided attachment is not a good
thing. The first basic but glaring deal breaker flaw.

2. If you read the text, first drill a pilot hole, then place the jig,
then use the special screws and special driver so screw can be driven
through drill bushing. Plus plastic deck spacers. Lots of special
things to keep track of, lots of steps for somewhat less than optimal
result.

3. Yeah, side placed hole is hidden but no better than top down hole
in terms of water intrusion.

4. Competing against top down screwing and 100 different bottom and
side attach brackets.

"Maybe" they can make enough from the hobbiest market but seems like a
real market miss in terms of a good distribution channel. It needs to
be in home depot not Woodcraft and not so many folks buy $100
specialized tools for the one deck job they do per 20 years in home
depot.

The Kreg Deck Jig is used to secure both sides of the board. The Jig
appears to have a built in spacer for spacing the decking 1/4" from the
adjacent board.And the jig is available at Lowes. Not sure how well it
will work as i have no experience building decks.But if I ever give it a
shot will give a review .





On 06/03/2010 11:43 AM, SonomaProducts.com wrote:
I was wondering about fastening deck boards as demonstrated by this
jig.

Disclaimer: Just an opinion

This looks like a solution in search of a problem driven by the need
to grow the business. Looks like a miss rather than a hit, such as
their first great idea of bringing pocket holes to the masses. Lots of
great products are followed up by derivitves that don't deliver near
the same value.

Problems?
1. Yes, I would also assume a one sided attachment is not a good
thing. The first basic but glaring deal breaker flaw.

2. If you read the text, first drill a pilot hole, then place the jig,
then use the special screws and special driver so screw can be driven
through drill bushing. Plus plastic deck spacers. Lots of special
things to keep track of, lots of steps for somewhat less than optimal
result.

3. Yeah, side placed hole is hidden but no better than top down hole
in terms of water intrusion.

4. Competing against top down screwing and 100 different bottom and
side attach brackets.

"Maybe" they can make enough from the hobbiest market but seems like a
real market miss in terms of a good distribution channel. It needs to
be in home depot not Woodcraft and not so many folks buy $100
specialized tools for the one deck job they do per 20 years in home
depot.

"Upscale" wrote in message
...

I've just been looking at the Kreg Deck jig being advertised on Lee
Valley's website.
http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/pag...28&cat=51&ap=1

I was wondering about fastening deck boards as demonstrated by this
jig. For those of you experienced with building decks, would the
screws need to be inserted on both sides of a deck board, (assuming
there's just enough room for screws to be inserted on a 45 degree
angle both edges) or just on one edge? And if it is just one edge for
fastening down a deck board, wouldn't there be a tendency for the
opposite unfastened edge to rise or perhaps cup over time?

Thanks


Take a lookat this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTBG29lzKys
Not a very practical device, IMO.

On Jun 3, 5:26*am, Upscale wrote:
I've just been looking at the Kreg Deck jig being advertised on Lee
Valley's website.http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/pag...28&cat=51&ap=1


TOH demonstrated a few seasons ago, an invisible deck fastening
system called EB-TY (easy to find with Google search). This uses a
#20 biscuit slot with their proprietary hardware. Tom Silva made it
look easy. He makes most jobs look easier than they are. It does
fasten both edges of the deck board.

Joe G

On Jun 3, 1:00*pm, Jesse wrote:
The Kreg Deck Jig is used to secure both sides of the board. The Jig
appears to have a built in spacer for spacing the decking 1/4" from the
adjacent board.And the jig is available at Lowes. Not sure how well it
will work as i have no experience building decks.But if I ever give it a
shot will give a review .

On 06/03/2010 11:43 AM, SonomaProducts.com wrote:



I was wondering about fastening deck boards as demonstrated by this
jig.

Disclaimer: Just an opinion

This looks like a solution in search of a problem driven by the need
to grow the business. Looks like a miss rather than a hit, such as
their first great idea of bringing pocket holes to the masses. Lots of
great products are followed up by derivitves that don't deliver near
the same value.

Problems?
1. Yes, I would also assume a one sided attachment is not a good
thing. The first basic but glaring deal breaker flaw.

2. If you read the text, first drill a pilot hole, then place the jig,
then use the special screws and special driver so screw can be driven
through drill bushing. Plus plastic deck spacers. Lots of special
things to keep track of, lots of steps for somewhat less than optimal
result.

3. Yeah, side placed hole is hidden but no better than top down hole
in terms of water intrusion.

4. Competing against top down screwing and 100 different bottom and
side attach brackets.

"Maybe" they can make enough from the hobbiest market but seems like a
real market miss in terms of a good distribution channel. It needs to
be in home depot not Woodcraft and not so many folks buy $100
specialized tools for the one deck job they do per 20 years in home
depot.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

"a built in spacer for spacing the decking 1/4" from the adjacent
board."

If I had put 1/4" spacing between the boards when I built my deck,
combat boots, nevermind high heels, would fit through the gaps once
the boards dried out.

I left *no* gap and the boards shrunk just enough for a small gap to
open up so water runs through but heels don't.

Actually, I have one pair of stilettos that give me
trouble...whoops...wrong group. Nevermind.

On 6/3/2010 2:18 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

"a built in spacer for spacing the decking 1/4" from the adjacent
board."

If I had put 1/4" spacing between the boards when I built my deck,
combat boots, nevermind high heels, would fit through the gaps once
the boards dried out.

I left *no* gap and the boards shrunk just enough for a small gap to
open up so water runs through but heels don't.

Actually, I have one pair of stilettos that give me
trouble...whoops...wrong group. Nevermind.

LOL..

Time honored gap hereabouts for the last 100 years ... the width of the
shank of a 16d nail.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On 6/3/10 2:18 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

"a built in spacer for spacing the decking 1/4" from the adjacent
board."

If I had put 1/4" spacing between the boards when I built my deck,
combat boots, nevermind high heels, would fit through the gaps once
the boards dried out.

I left *no* gap and the boards shrunk just enough for a small gap to
open up so water runs through but heels don't.


Yeah, I never understood that.
I guess I can see it for composite, but not treated.
Pressure treated lumber has something like 30% moisture content.
Those things shrink at least 1/4". Even Cedar is going shrink some.

I use a pry bar to squeeze treated decking boards together as tight as I
can, so when they shrink, there's a small gap... as you described. I see
so many decks with 1/2"+ gaps in the decking. I immediately think, "yep,
they used a spacer to set a gap."


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

Take a lookat this:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTBG29lzKys
Not a very practical device, IMO.

I didn't listen to audio but watching it the only time they show
screwing from both sides it looks like about 1/2" gap.

On Jun 3, 4:26*am, Upscale wrote:
I've just been looking at the Kreg Deck jig being advertised on Lee
Valley's website.http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/pag...28&cat=51&ap=1

I was wondering about fastening deck boards as demonstrated by this
jig. For those of you experienced with building decks, would the
screws need to be inserted on both sides of a deck board, (assuming
there's just enough room for screws to be inserted on a 45 degree
angle both edges) or just on one edge? And if it is just one edge for
fastening down a deck board, wouldn't there be a tendency for the
opposite unfastened edge to rise or perhaps cup over time?

Thanks

My first impression, and I might be totally wrong. But it looks like
it would slow the process quite a bit.

With that said, I suspect they have thought it through. Most Kreg
products reflect a fair amount of thought and utility.

RonB

On Jun 3, 3:32*pm, -MIKE- wrote:
On 6/3/10 2:18 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:



"a built in spacer for spacing the decking 1/4" from the adjacent
board."

If I had put 1/4" spacing between the boards when I built my deck,
combat boots, nevermind high heels, would fit through the gaps once
the boards dried out.

I left *no* gap and the boards shrunk just enough for a small gap to
open up so water runs through but heels don't.

Yeah, I never understood that.
I guess I can see it for composite, but not treated.
Pressure treated lumber has something like 30% moisture content.
Those things shrink at least 1/4". * Even Cedar is going shrink some.

I use a pry bar to squeeze treated decking boards together as tight as I
can, so when they shrink, there's a small gap... as you described. *I see
so many decks with 1/2"+ gaps in the decking. I immediately think, "yep,
they used a spacer to set a gap."

I think that depends on how wet your wood is when you install it.
I've seen decks that were installed like that and they still have no
space between the boards so now water just pools up and you get green
mildew all over it in a hurry. Unless it was dead sopping I'd use
some sort of spacer.

JP

Most PT wood has not shrunk, yet, when you buy it, no matter what the
moisture, content. It typically takes a full year to shrink back but it
works very well in our climate. As well most decent lumber yards keep the PT
outside in the rain, covered up in a steam bath.

Water moisture may not be the only factor in wood shrinkage.



"Jay Pique" wrote in message
...
I think that depends on how wet your wood is when you install it.
I've seen decks that were installed like that and they still have no
space between the boards so now water just pools up and you get green
mildew all over it in a hurry. Unless it was dead sopping I'd use
some sort of spacer.

JP


On Jun 3, 3:32 pm, -MIKE- wrote:
On 6/3/10 2:18 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:



"a built in spacer for spacing the decking 1/4" from the adjacent
board."

If I had put 1/4" spacing between the boards when I built my deck,
combat boots, nevermind high heels, would fit through the gaps once
the boards dried out.

I left *no* gap and the boards shrunk just enough for a small gap to
open up so water runs through but heels don't.

Yeah, I never understood that.
I guess I can see it for composite, but not treated.
Pressure treated lumber has something like 30% moisture content.
Those things shrink at least 1/4". Even Cedar is going shrink some.

I use a pry bar to squeeze treated decking boards together as tight as I
can, so when they shrink, there's a small gap... as you described. I see
so many decks with 1/2"+ gaps in the decking. I immediately think, "yep,
they used a spacer to set a gap."





--- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: ---

On 6/3/10 5:07 PM, Jay Pique wrote:
Yeah, I never understood that.
I guess I can see it for composite, but not treated.
Pressure treated lumber has something like 30% moisture content.
Those things shrink at least 1/4". Even Cedar is going shrink some.

I use a pry bar to squeeze treated decking boards together as tight as I
can, so when they shrink, there's a small gap... as you described. I see
so many decks with 1/2"+ gaps in the decking. I immediately think, "yep,
they used a spacer to set a gap."

I think that depends on how wet your wood is when you install it.
I've seen decks that were installed like that and they still have no
space between the boards so now water just pools up and you get green
mildew all over it in a hurry. Unless it was dead sopping I'd use
some sort of spacer.

JP

I've seen dried out green wood at the home stores, but I would never by
it because it's always twisted. It probably varies with region, but
around here, the green stuff weighs 2-3 times that of dry lumber.
That's all moisture... 70-80% of which will dry out.

I've seen that there are newer techniques for treating lumber that don't
involve pumping it full of liquid. I think that's better for all of us.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 6/3/10 5:26 PM, Josepi wrote:
Most PT wood has not shrunk, yet, when you buy it, no matter what the
moisture, content. It typically takes a full year to shrink back but it
works very well in our climate. As well most decent lumber yards keep the PT
outside in the rain, covered up in a steam bath.

Water moisture may not be the only factor in wood shrinkage.


I would contend that it's the only factor, along with whatever carrier
they use to inject the insecticide into the wood, *if* it is something
other than water.

I would be eager to corrected if wrong, but it's my understanding that
H2O in liquid or vapor form is the only thing that causes the initial
shrinking of lumber and its consequent seasonal expansion and contraction.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On Thu, 03 Jun 2010 14:32:19 -0500, -MIKE-
wrote the following:

On 6/3/10 2:18 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

"a built in spacer for spacing the decking 1/4" from the adjacent
board."

If I had put 1/4" spacing between the boards when I built my deck,
combat boots, nevermind high heels, would fit through the gaps once
the boards dried out.

I left *no* gap and the boards shrunk just enough for a small gap to
open up so water runs through but heels don't.


Yeah, I never understood that.
I guess I can see it for composite, but not treated.
Pressure treated lumber has something like 30% moisture content.
Those things shrink at least 1/4". Even Cedar is going shrink some.

I use a pry bar to squeeze treated decking boards together as tight as I
can, so when they shrink, there's a small gap... as you described. I see
so many decks with 1/2"+ gaps in the decking. I immediately think, "yep,
they used a spacer to set a gap."

I use my 1/4" square drive bit to set the gap. It ensures that not
much debris will get caught between the boards to keep them wet and
continue to degrade them. Nobody I know wears stiletto pumps. I can't
even remember ever -seeing- a lady in heels on a deck, so I'm not
worried. YMMV.

P.S: Ever see what happens to a composite deck when no spacing is left
between the boards and the summer sun hits it? SPROING! Screws pop
through the deck boards as they find themselves confined and deck
boards go tilting upward.

--
It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor
the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change.
-- Charles Darwin

On 6/3/10 10:01 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
P.S: Ever see what happens to a composite deck when no spacing is left
between the boards and the summer sun hits it? SPROING! Screws pop
through the deck boards as they find themselves confined and deck
boards go tilting upward.


Yeah, any of that stuff with plastic in it expands quite a bit, doesn't
it?


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

-MIKE- wrote:



I've seen dried out green wood at the home stores, but I would never by
it because it's always twisted. It probably varies with region, but
around here, the green stuff weighs 2-3 times that of dry lumber.
That's all moisture... 70-80% of which will dry out.

I've seen that there are newer techniques for treating lumber that don't
involve pumping it full of liquid. I think that's better for all of us.



A major local lumber yard in my area actually has resorted to watering
their pressure treated lumber to prevent it from drying out and twisting
on their dime. When it's cut water sprays off the saw blade.

--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA

On 6/4/2010 8:00 AM, Nova wrote:

A major local lumber yard in my area actually has resorted to watering
their pressure treated lumber to prevent it from drying out and twisting
on their dime. When it's cut water sprays off the saw blade.

Been cutting a lot of PT wood in the shop the last few months and you're
right, some is so wet that you have to have a towel handy when cutting it.

Often the past year or so an entire pallet of HD tubafours is dripping
wet 'peel cores' from the plywood mills ... this stuff does not readily
accept the treatment and warps like crazy after it dries to around 30%
.... an entirely useless product, sold at a premium price to those who
don't care, or know the difference.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

Swingman wrote:
....

Often the past year or so an entire pallet of HD tubafours is dripping
wet 'peel cores' from the plywood mills ... this stuff does not readily
accept the treatment and warps like crazy after it dries to around 30%
... an entirely useless product, sold at a premium price to those who
don't care, or know the difference.

There are a couple of the low-price farm stores here carrying line fence
posts from them...

--

"Swingman" wrote in message
...
On 6/4/2010 8:00 AM, Nova wrote:

A major local lumber yard in my area actually has resorted to watering
their pressure treated lumber to prevent it from drying out and twisting
on their dime. When it's cut water sprays off the saw blade.

Been cutting a lot of PT wood in the shop the last few months and you're
right, some is so wet that you have to have a towel handy when cutting it.

Often the past year or so an entire pallet of HD tubafours is dripping wet
'peel cores' from the plywood mills ... this stuff does not readily accept
the treatment and warps like crazy after it dries to around 30% ... an
entirely useless product, sold at a premium price to those who don't care,
or know the difference.

peeler cores are almost always juvenile wood, it takes about 15 years
of growth before SYP starts producing strong stable wood, that's
why they get so crazy warped up.

So yeah, they're junk.

basilisk

basilisk wrote:
....

peeler cores are almost always juvenile wood, it takes about 15 years
of growth before SYP starts producing strong stable wood, that's
why they get so crazy warped up.

???

Trees add growth on the outer boundaries so the cores are the oldest
wood in the tree.

So yeah, they're junk.

True, but not for that reason...

--

"dpb" wrote in message
...
basilisk wrote:
...

peeler cores are almost always juvenile wood, it takes about 15 years
of growth before SYP starts producing strong stable wood, that's
why they get so crazy warped up.

???

Trees add growth on the outer boundaries so the cores are the oldest wood
in the tree.

So yeah, they're junk.

True, but not for that reason...


Yes, it is the oldest wood in the tree, but it was formed when the tree
was a juvenile and is referred to as such in the lumber and paper business.

Stated another way the tree had to reach a certain age before it could
produce quality wood fiber.

basilsik

On 6/4/2010 12:40 PM, basilisk wrote:
wrote in message
...
basilisk wrote:
...

peeler cores are almost always juvenile wood, it takes about 15 years
of growth before SYP starts producing strong stable wood, that's
why they get so crazy warped up.

???

Trees add growth on the outer boundaries so the cores are the oldest wood
in the tree.

So yeah, they're junk.

True, but not for that reason...


Yes, it is the oldest wood in the tree, but it was formed when the tree
was a juvenile and is referred to as such in the lumber and paper business.

Stated another way the tree had to reach a certain age before it could
produce quality wood fiber.

In other words one should avoid heartwood at all costs?

"J. Clarke" wrote in message
...
On 6/4/2010 12:40 PM, basilisk wrote:
wrote in message
...
basilisk wrote:
...

peeler cores are almost always juvenile wood, it takes about 15 years
of growth before SYP starts producing strong stable wood, that's
why they get so crazy warped up.

???

Trees add growth on the outer boundaries so the cores are the oldest
wood
in the tree.

So yeah, they're junk.

True, but not for that reason...


Yes, it is the oldest wood in the tree, but it was formed when the tree
was a juvenile and is referred to as such in the lumber and paper
business.

Stated another way the tree had to reach a certain age before it could
produce quality wood fiber.

In other words one should avoid heartwood at all costs?

not at all, heartwood in pine is another issue and may take many years to
form,
most southern pine is cut(now) before it ever gets to the heartwood stage in
its life.

The young tree wood or juvenile wood stage in a tree may be passed in as
little
as an inch in diameter or it may last to six or eight inches in diameter
in a
plantation pine. Depends entirely on the growing conditions.

basilisk

"Swingman" wrote in message
...
On 6/4/2010 8:00 AM, Nova wrote:

A major local lumber yard in my area actually has resorted to watering
their pressure treated lumber to prevent it from drying out and twisting
on their dime. When it's cut water sprays off the saw blade.

Been cutting a lot of PT wood in the shop the last few months and you're
right, some is so wet that you have to have a towel handy when cutting it.

Often the past year or so an entire pallet of HD tubafours is dripping wet
'peel cores' from the plywood mills ... this stuff does not readily accept
the treatment and warps like crazy after it dries to around 30% ... an
entirely useless product, sold at a premium price to those who don't care,
or know the difference.


IIRC Stallmans sells Kiln Dried PT lumber.

On Fri, 04 Jun 2010 09:00:09 -0400, Nova wrote
the following:

-MIKE- wrote:

I've seen dried out green wood at the home stores, but I would never by
it because it's always twisted. It probably varies with region, but
around here, the green stuff weighs 2-3 times that of dry lumber.
That's all moisture... 70-80% of which will dry out.

I've seen that there are newer techniques for treating lumber that don't
involve pumping it full of liquid. I think that's better for all of us.


A major local lumber yard in my area actually has resorted to watering
their pressure treated lumber to prevent it from drying out and twisting
on their dime. When it's cut water sprays off the saw blade.

They all do that. Since PT is made using only the -finest- in SPF,
given half a chance and a sunny day, it twists on less than a nickel.

--
It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor
the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change.
-- Charles Darwin

On Fri, 04 Jun 2010 10:53:18 -0500, dpb wrote the
following:

Swingman wrote:
...

Often the past year or so an entire pallet of HD tubafours is dripping
wet 'peel cores' from the plywood mills ... this stuff does not readily
accept the treatment and warps like crazy after it dries to around 30%
... an entirely useless product, sold at a premium price to those who
don't care, or know the difference.

There are a couple of the low-price farm stores here carrying line fence
posts from them...

That's the main reason I don't do that style of line fence. I haven't
seen any good stock in town anywhere and half the new line fences of
the peeler style are warped as hell, up to 3" off true in any given
green peeler.

I suggested that another client get her own "cherrytone" landscaping
peelers because I would have to charge her for the winnowing process
at an hourly rate. Her husband has a pickup and they bought the first
batch, so the suggestion wasn't as far out of line as it may have
sounded.

There is far too much crap wood being sold everywhere nowadays. I
asked the guys at both local lumberyards why they didn't have a
slightly better grade of PT lumber. He said that people wouldn't pay
for it. I told him that my clients and I had discussed it and all
would be happy to pay up to 50% extra to get lumber which was sound,
which wouldn't warp as it dried, and was properly dried after
treatment. They suggested my telling it to the owners, who are
seldome around. Oh well...

--
It is not the strongest of the species that survives, nor
the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change.
-- Charles Darwin

Swingman wrote:
On 6/3/2010 2:18 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

"a built in spacer for spacing the decking 1/4" from the adjacent
board."

If I had put 1/4" spacing between the boards when I built my deck,
combat boots, nevermind high heels, would fit through the gaps once
the boards dried out.

I left *no* gap and the boards shrunk just enough for a small gap to
open up so water runs through but heels don't.

Time honored gap hereabouts for the last 100 years ... the width of the
shank of a 16d nail.

That's what I did when I built my deck and after the PT decking dried
out, I have too big a gap for my tastes. If I had it to do over, I
would have butted the PT boards and let the gap for drainage develop on
it's own as the wood dried out. For this reason I would not go for the
Kreg system, not to mention a 100 bucks is too much for this tool,
particularly if you are not in the deck business. I have no complaints
about the standard screw from the top, but the EB-TY system looks good
if I wanted to eliminate visible fasteners.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8hOBhKYyzk

--
Jack

Artificial Intelligence is no match for Natural Stupidity!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpGH02DtIws

Jay Pique wrote:

I use a pry bar to squeeze treated decking boards together as tight as I
can, so when they shrink, there's a small gap... as you described. I see
so many decks with 1/2"+ gaps in the decking. I immediately think, "yep,
they used a spacer to set a gap."

I think that depends on how wet your wood is when you install it.
I've seen decks that were installed like that and they still have no
space between the boards so now water just pools up and you get green
mildew all over it in a hurry. Unless it was dead sopping I'd use
some sort of spacer.

That's what I thought when I built my deck, and used a 16d nail as a
spacer. The PT was not sopping wet, it was fairly dry for PT stuff, and
damn, I wish I had ignored my instinct. Of course, had I done that, the
damn stuff certainly would not have shrink, but expanded. Instinct is
hard to ignore....

--
Jack
Obama Care...Freedom not Included!
http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=x2G3wGVAnlQ