I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not actually
about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about the decision to
get a table saw in the first place.

You see, I am a newbie. I asked around and most advice given was that the
table saw is the major workhorse in woodworking. So, I got one as my xmas
gift.

Problem is that I spent every cent I had to get a good one (well, the best I
could get for the money that I had). And, although it came with a wobble
dado blade (yeah, I know "you'll put your eye out kid"), I now (and for the
foreseeable future with a new kid coming soon) cannot afford a good blade
for a good dado set.

So I am thinking that I should have gotten a really good router combo and a
bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

codepath

wrote:
I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not
actually about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about
the decision to get a table saw in the first place.

snip
Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

Read "Cutting-Edge Table Saw Tips & Tricks" by Kenneth Burton. (Check your
local library.) He does amazing things with the table saw.

-- Mark

I bought my first table saw when I was a freshman in high school 45
years ago. I bought a Unisaw and 8" long-bed jointer 20 years after
that. My table saw gets used all the time; my router occasionally.
It depends on what kind of work you're doing.

As for a kid on the way, my wife and I raised nine, and have ten
grandkids, and I'm not 60 yet. And six of our kids haven't been
married yet, so there are a lot more to come, no doubt. It didn't
keep us from making use of the tools -- we needed the tools in order
to have the things we could make but couldn't afford to buy. :-)

Hang in there, and remember that if you try to make a good deal,
you'll always be wondering if you could have made a better deal.
Instead, make the deal, then make it good. Fewer regrets that
way.

CE

wrote:

I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not actually
about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about the decision to
get a table saw in the first place.

You see, I am a newbie. I asked around and most advice given was that the
table saw is the major workhorse in woodworking. So, I got one as my xmas
gift.

Problem is that I spent every cent I had to get a good one (well, the best I
could get for the money that I had). And, although it came with a wobble
dado blade (yeah, I know "you'll put your eye out kid"), I now (and for the
foreseeable future with a new kid coming soon) cannot afford a good blade
for a good dado set.

So I am thinking that I should have gotten a really good router combo and a
bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

codepath

Good grief.
Watch Norm...M&T joints, raised panels, etc. made weekly with a TS.
Watch yard sales and pawn shops for a cheap router and get a couple of bits
from Woodline, or even some HSS bits from Sears or the like. You can get a
perfectly usable router for $10-20! I've made many doors/drawers with such
a rig...no prob.

We tend to be seduced by catalogs and TV shows, but look what your ancestors
had! If you aren't raising panels, you will never need a 3HP router! My
little sears from about 1970 edges doors and makes rabbets just fine.

Get some pine and start cutting. You'll be happier when making dust!
Wilson

I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not actually
about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about the decision
to
get a table saw in the first place.

You see, I am a newbie. I asked around and most advice given was that the
table saw is the major workhorse in woodworking. So, I got one as my xmas
gift.

Problem is that I spent every cent I had to get a good one (well, the best
I
could get for the money that I had). And, although it came with a wobble
dado blade (yeah, I know "you'll put your eye out kid"), I now (and for
the
foreseeable future with a new kid coming soon) cannot afford a good blade
for a good dado set.

So I am thinking that I should have gotten a really good router combo and
a
bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

codepath

I can't recall hearing a practicing woodworker say he makes do with a
router table but NOT a table saw. The TS is the heart of a WW shop.
You can rabbet and dado to your hearts content on it. With the right
blade you don't need to "finish" up on the router table, anyway. I get
glass smooth cuts with a Freud or Forrest blade. Granted the Forrest is
about $100, but the Freuds are excellent for much less dinero. Pick up
a book devoted to the table saw and you may reconsider your "problem" as
a blessing.

dave

wrote:

I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not actually
about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about the decision to
get a table saw in the first place.

You see, I am a newbie. I asked around and most advice given was that the
table saw is the major workhorse in woodworking. So, I got one as my xmas
gift.

Problem is that I spent every cent I had to get a good one (well, the best I
could get for the money that I had). And, although it came with a wobble
dado blade (yeah, I know "you'll put your eye out kid"), I now (and for the
foreseeable future with a new kid coming soon) cannot afford a good blade
for a good dado set.

So I am thinking that I should have gotten a really good router combo and a
bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

codepath

Hmm...

Been there. Tried to get away with minimal power tools, and by many
standards I still have the bare minimum, and discovered that I spent most of
my time hand planing boards. I learned a lot about planing and planes that
way, but it was damn tedious work after a while. I now own a Delta planer
and a General tablesaw---HALLELUJAH!--- and was finally able to complete a
small bench. So, I am so damn motivated right now that my wife kicked in
some loot and we got some Kentucky Coffeetree for new end tables. Life is
good.
Here is the basic challenge--you have to be able to make four square
boards before you can make decent furniture. There is no way around that. A
router ain't gonna get you there very quick, but a table saw will allow you
to square your stock when ripping and cross-cutting. Planing/Jointing can be
done at the mill if needed.
It's tough being a newbie, but I have to admit I'm really lovin' this
woodworking stuff. Just stick with it. Maybe you can find some projects that
are specifically geared to the tabel saw?
And DAMN IT, if you have a table saw gloat, I wanna hear it!

Semper Fi

Kevin

wrote in message ...
I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not actually
about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about the decision
to
get a table saw in the first place.

You see, I am a newbie. I asked around and most advice given was that the
table saw is the major workhorse in woodworking. So, I got one as my xmas
gift.

Problem is that I spent every cent I had to get a good one (well, the best
I
could get for the money that I had). And, although it came with a wobble
dado blade (yeah, I know "you'll put your eye out kid"), I now (and for
the
foreseeable future with a new kid coming soon) cannot afford a good blade
for a good dado set.

So I am thinking that I should have gotten a really good router combo and
a
bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

codepath

Sorry, I think that my original post was unclear.

The saw that I got has the original steel (no carbide) Craftsman blade on
it. It also came with a Craftsman wobble dado blade. As I have no more money
(and won't for a very long time), getting a better blade (Forrest, Freud or
other) or any other dado set isn't gonna happen.

So, the only way that I would be able to do a rabbet or dado would be to use
the wobble (that everyone tells me is unsafe and not to mention looking at
it a PITA for accuracy and no flat bottom cuts) or make multiple passes with
the regular blade (again difficult to be accurate and time-consuming).

As I have not yet tried either, I am probably completely wrong of course. I
hope so as it is now too late to do anything about it.

Of course, if money were no object, I would get a Forrest Dado King or a
Freud SD608 or something better, but are wobbles really as bad (unsafe) as I
have heard? Looking at where the setting gets dialed in, hitting 23/32"
would be nearly impossible.

Even if I could come up with a better blade (I thought about stealing the
DeWalt crosscut blade out of my miter saw which has to be better the
Craftsman blade in the table saw now), is making rabbets/dadoes using a
standard blade as big of a PITA as it sounds?

Anyway, it seems to me that using a circular saw to do a rough-cut and then
easing up on the final dimension using a router and straight bit (or
straight edge and a flush-trim bit) would be easier than the options that I
stated above.

Please feel free to correct me. That's why I am here.


codepath



"Bay Area Dave" wrote in message
...
I can't recall hearing a practicing woodworker say he makes do with a
router table but NOT a table saw. The TS is the heart of a WW shop.
You can rabbet and dado to your hearts content on it. With the right
blade you don't need to "finish" up on the router table, anyway. I get
glass smooth cuts with a Freud or Forrest blade. Granted the Forrest is
about $100, but the Freuds are excellent for much less dinero. Pick up
a book devoted to the table saw and you may reconsider your "problem" as
a blessing.

dave

wrote:

I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not
actually
about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about the
decision to
get a table saw in the first place.

You see, I am a newbie. I asked around and most advice given was that
the
table saw is the major workhorse in woodworking. So, I got one as my
xmas
gift.

Problem is that I spent every cent I had to get a good one (well, the
best I
could get for the money that I had). And, although it came with a wobble
dado blade (yeah, I know "you'll put your eye out kid"), I now (and for
the
foreseeable future with a new kid coming soon) cannot afford a good
blade
for a good dado set.

So I am thinking that I should have gotten a really good router combo
and a
bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

codepath

Well, it's not the best gloat on the road (although I feel pretty good about
the deal) but here goes:

Craftsman model #113.298750 (early 1990's Emerson-built)
10" Left-tilt Contractor table saw
15 Amp, 110 Volt (220V capable)
machined pulleys
red PowerTwist link belt
all metal hand-wheels
Jet Xacta Fence 30" (Beisemeyer-style)
2 original webbed cast iron ext. wings
one MDF ext. table
standard and dado throat plates
mobile base
Woodstock clamping miter gauge
34" total right-of-blade ripping capacity
24" total left-of-blade ripping capacity
crappy Craftsman blade
crappy Craftsman wobble dado blade (yeah, I know, wobble sucks)
new condition (no rust at all)

$325 Delivered!

I also got a Incra V27 miter gauge with fence and stop for Xmas.


codepath



"Kevin" wrote in message
news:%8pKb.71882$xX.489947@attbi_s02...
Hmm...

Been there. Tried to get away with minimal power tools, and by many
standards I still have the bare minimum, and discovered that I spent most
of
my time hand planing boards. I learned a lot about planing and planes that
way, but it was damn tedious work after a while. I now own a Delta planer
and a General tablesaw---HALLELUJAH!--- and was finally able to complete a
small bench. So, I am so damn motivated right now that my wife kicked in
some loot and we got some Kentucky Coffeetree for new end tables. Life is
good.
Here is the basic challenge--you have to be able to make four square
boards before you can make decent furniture. There is no way around that.
A
router ain't gonna get you there very quick, but a table saw will allow
you
to square your stock when ripping and cross-cutting. Planing/Jointing can
be
done at the mill if needed.
It's tough being a newbie, but I have to admit I'm really lovin' this
woodworking stuff. Just stick with it. Maybe you can find some projects
that
are specifically geared to the tabel saw?
And DAMN IT, if you have a table saw gloat, I wanna hear it!

Semper Fi

Kevin

wrote in message ...
I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not
actually
about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about the
decision
to
get a table saw in the first place.

You see, I am a newbie. I asked around and most advice given was that
the
table saw is the major workhorse in woodworking. So, I got one as my
xmas
gift.

Problem is that I spent every cent I had to get a good one (well, the
best
I
could get for the money that I had). And, although it came with a wobble
dado blade (yeah, I know "you'll put your eye out kid"), I now (and for
the
foreseeable future with a new kid coming soon) cannot afford a good
blade
for a good dado set.

So I am thinking that I should have gotten a really good router combo
and
a
bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

codepath

I could take most of what is in all the previous post and say DITTO

Then saw is the heart of WW the router can do a lot of thing but cannot cut
your stock.
When you get one you will be delighted but first learn how to use that table
saw, it makes sweet music and when you can get it to play a symphony then
get the router nad other things.

Good luck on your upcoming fatherhood.

George
wrote in message ...
I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not actually
about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about the decision
to
get a table saw in the first place.

You see, I am a newbie. I asked around and most advice given was that the
table saw is the major workhorse in woodworking. So, I got one as my xmas
gift.

Problem is that I spent every cent I had to get a good one (well, the best
I
could get for the money that I had). And, although it came with a wobble
dado blade (yeah, I know "you'll put your eye out kid"), I now (and for
the
foreseeable future with a new kid coming soon) cannot afford a good blade
for a good dado set.

So I am thinking that I should have gotten a really good router combo and
a
bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

codepath

wrote in message ...

So, the only way that I would be able to do a rabbet or dado would be to
use
the wobble (that everyone tells me is unsafe and not to mention looking at
it a PITA for accuracy and no flat bottom cuts) or make multiple passes
with
the regular blade (again difficult to be accurate and time-consuming).


You made the right choice in buying the tablesaw first. Now go to the
library and check out some books to learn the many ways to skin a cat with
this tool.

I have a wobble dado blade and they are not that big of a pain in the ass.
Don't worry about it. I don't believe they are any more dangerous than
anything else you do with a tablesaw. What is it that is supposed to be
dangerous about these?

You can use your regular blade to make dados too. Just move the fence and
make several passes. Flatten the bottom with a sharp chisel and you're good
to go. Forget the Dado King

Frank

wrote in message ...
Well, it's not the best gloat on the road (although I feel pretty good
about
the deal) but here goes:

Craftsman model #113.298750 (early 1990's Emerson-built)
10" Left-tilt Contractor table saw
15 Amp, 110 Volt (220V capable)
machined pulleys
red PowerTwist link belt
all metal hand-wheels
Jet Xacta Fence 30" (Beisemeyer-style)
2 original webbed cast iron ext. wings
one MDF ext. table
standard and dado throat plates
mobile base
Woodstock clamping miter gauge
34" total right-of-blade ripping capacity
24" total left-of-blade ripping capacity
crappy Craftsman blade
crappy Craftsman wobble dado blade (yeah, I know, wobble sucks)
new condition (no rust at all)

$325 Delivered!

I also got a Incra V27 miter gauge with fence and stop for Xmas.


I have that same saw (bought it new) and it is a good saw (and it is far
better than what they are selling now) and should work well for you. If
money is a little tight, go to Sears and get one of their carbide tipped
blades for it. There mid line blades are easily affordable and do a good
job (better than I expected). I also used their wobble dado blade for a
while and it did the job. The bottom is not as flat as a stacked dado blade
would do but they get the job done. Good luck with your new toy.

--
If at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving

In article , wrote:
Sorry, I think that my original post was unclear.

The saw that I got has the original steel (no carbide) Craftsman blade on
it. It also came with a Craftsman wobble dado blade. As I have no more money
(and won't for a very long time), getting a better blade (Forrest, Freud or
other) or any other dado set isn't gonna happen.

A 'budget' carbide blade (which can be found in the $15 range) will be a
significant improvement.

A good Freud is only around $50, and would make a major difference.

"Finding the money" is just a matter of "finding the money". grin

Seriously, it's the price of a *few* pieces of lumber.

A dado set is a *luxury*. *Anything* you can do with a dado set, you can do
with a straight blade, albeit in multiple passes.


The wobble dado _is_ "ok" for casual work. If you're doing high-precision
"heirloom quality" stuff, take the extra time, and do multiple cuts with
the straight blade.

So, the only way that I would be able to do a rabbet or dado would be to use
the wobble (that everyone tells me is unsafe and not to mention looking at
it a PITA for accuracy and no flat bottom cuts) or make multiple passes with
the regular blade (again difficult to be accurate and time-consuming).

As I have not yet tried either, I am probably completely wrong of course. I
hope so as it is now too late to do anything about it.

It is _NOT_ that 'difficult' and/or time-consuming, to cut dados or rabbets
with a regular blade. *ONLY* the 'edge' cuts have to be 'accurate', so you
take your time, and do those first. Then you remove the 'middle' stuff.

Of course, if money were no object, I would get a Forrest Dado King or a
Freud SD608 or something better, but are wobbles really as bad (unsafe) as I
have heard? Looking at where the setting gets dialed in, hitting 23/32"
would be nearly impossible.

Even if I could come up with a better blade (I thought about stealing the
DeWalt crosscut blade out of my miter saw which has to be better the
Craftsman blade in the table saw now), is making rabbets/dadoes using a
standard blade as big of a PITA as it sounds?

NAH. I did it for *MANY* years, It's _slower_ than using a dado blade, but
that is the -only- down-side. *AND*, by the time you add in changing the
blade (and changing _back_ after you're done), cutting with a standard blade
may actually be _faster_ overall.

I've purchased a Freud SD208 -- their good stacked dado set -- and have *yet*
to put it on the saw. For only 1 or 2 (comparatively short) cuts, the time
and trouble of changing blades makes for no net savings.

If you're making _long_ dados/rabbets, it may make sense to do -only- the
edge cuts on the table-saw, and then 'finish' the job with a *hand* chisel.

Anyway, it seems to me that using a circular saw to do a rough-cut and then
easing up on the final dimension using a router and straight bit (or
straight edge and a flush-trim bit) would be easier than the options that I
stated above.

Please feel free to correct me. That's why I am here.

*EVERYTHING* depends on _what_you_are_doing_.

The *BIG* advantage of the table-saw is that when you cut multiple pieces,
against a fence, or a 'stop' on a miter, or cross-cut sled, they come out
*exactly* the same size. And _consistent_ with each other.

With a router/straight-edge set-up, you don't have anywhere near the same
degree of short-term 'repeatability'. Now, if you're building a box, and
"don't care" if the opposite sides are 1/16" (or more) mis-matched, then
this is probably not a problem for you.

Don't misunderstand me, you _can_ get the pieces the same dimension, using
the router set-up. It is just a whole lot more time-consuming, and a real
PITA.

When you're living on a budget, there is a downside to _everything_. It is
always a question of what you have to suffer with, to avoid those "other
things" that you -don't- want to suffer with.

wrote:

Sorry, I think that my original post was unclear.

The saw that I got has the original steel (no carbide) Craftsman blade on
it. It also came with a Craftsman wobble dado blade. As I have no more money
(and won't for a very long time), getting a better blade (Forrest, Freud or
other) or any other dado set isn't gonna happen.



If you can't swing a better blade how are you going to swing the wood?
What about measuring devices?

Do I detect buyers remorse? Get over it.

About the time you have had to straighten up a long run of wood using a
router you would wish you had gotten the saw first.


--

Mark

N.E. Ohio


Never argue with a fool, a bystander can't tell you apart. (S. Clemens,
A.K.A. Mark Twain)

When in doubt hit the throttle. It may not help but it sure ends the
suspense. (Gaz, r.moto)

On Mon, 5 Jan 2004 19:15:53 -0800, wrote:

After reading all the posts to your original question I think you've
recieved your answer. A tablesaw is a must in any woodshop and with
"shop made" jigs you can do almost anything. Did you know that it's
possible to flute a tapered column on a tablesaw??? Try routing a
23/32" dado....won't happen with one pass.

GL with the new family addition...

Trees take time to grow...so should woodworkers...

TJB

On Mon, 5 Jan 2004 17:45:17 -0800, wrote:

I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not actually
about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about the decision to
get a table saw in the first place.

You see, I am a newbie. I asked around and most advice given was that the
table saw is the major workhorse in woodworking. So, I got one as my xmas
gift.

Problem is that I spent every cent I had to get a good one (well, the best I
could get for the money that I had). And, although it came with a wobble
dado blade (yeah, I know "you'll put your eye out kid"), I now (and for the
foreseeable future with a new kid coming soon) cannot afford a good blade
for a good dado set.

So I am thinking that I should have gotten a really good router combo and a
bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

codepath



Whether you did the right thing or not ... I don't know. What are
you trying to do? Boxes? Bookshelfs? Tables? Pukey ducks? House
signs?

I started out with a router first. I was living in an apartment and
got a good deal on a Hitachi TR-12 at Costco. I managed to build a
bookshelf with it, starting S4S material.

It was slow going. I would have been better off with a table saw.
These guys who are telling you that you can't cut wood to dimension
with a router must not have used a half-inch straight bit and a
straightedge before. :-)

If you can't come up with the $60 to $80 for a good blade, i.e. about
two sheets of plywood, where were you going to get your wood? BTW, I
have a general purpose CMT blade that I like. Something like the
Systimatic 1035 at http://right-tools.com/budcomblad.html at $50 plus
shipping would be a big step up from an all steel blade. You might be
able to find a used blade at a garage sale. Sharpening it should be
less than $20.

I've never heard that wobble dados were unsafe before, they don't
make great dados but AFAIK, they are as safe as a stacked dado. If
you don't like the way it cuts dados, you can make dados by cutting
two parallel slots with a regular saw blade and chisel out the
material in the center or nibble it out with a regular
saw blade. You can use cheap chisels, you'll just spend a lot of
time sharpening.

Bob S

There is nothing wrong with a steel blade. They work fine, they just don't
last as long. The upside to that is that they can be sharpened with a file.
wrote in message ...
I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not actually
about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about the decision
to
get a table saw in the first place.

You see, I am a newbie. I asked around and most advice given was that the
table saw is the major workhorse in woodworking. So, I got one as my xmas
gift.

Problem is that I spent every cent I had to get a good one (well, the best
I
could get for the money that I had). And, although it came with a wobble
dado blade (yeah, I know "you'll put your eye out kid"), I now (and for
the
foreseeable future with a new kid coming soon) cannot afford a good blade
for a good dado set.

So I am thinking that I should have gotten a really good router combo and
a
bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

codepath

terry boivin wrote:

snip

Try routing a 23/32" dado....won't happen with one pass.

Why not? Many manufactures make 23/32" router bits specifically for the
"undersized" plywood. See:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&i...F32+router+bit

--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA
(Remove "SPAM" from email address to reply)

wrote:

a bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

Depends on what you want to do. I use my router a couple, three times a
year. I use my table saw almost daily.

You don't *need* a dado blade to do dadoes (or grooves, or certain types of
rabbets). I don't have one. I make multiple passes, and clean up the cuts
with a chisel. Now, I'll grant you, I'm looking forward to getting one
some day. I'd even like to have a shop some day with *two* saws, so I can
leave one set up with a dado. But until then, I get by just fine.

As for a good blade, I presume you're thinking something like a WWII? I
don't have one of those yet either. Buying a decent Freud blade for $35
made a world of difference on my saw. Yeah, $35 isn't free, and there are
weeks when I couldn't come up with that kind of cash myself, but you're
more likely to scrounge $35 than $100 for a WWII.

Also, dollar for dollar, routers are useless without bits, and decent router
bits are *not* cheap. I expect you'll get a hell of a lot more mileage out
of a $35 saw blade than a $35 in router bits.

Anyway, sounds like you need to pick up a good table saw book and see the
myriad things you can do with that critter. Seems to me you don't realize
what you have there. Especially if you're lucky enough to be starting with
a gloatable one. Mine is a complete POS.

Pat yourself on the back for doing the right thing, and enjoy!

--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/

wrote:

it. It also came with a Craftsman wobble dado blade. As I have no more
money (and won't for a very long time), getting a better blade (Forrest,
Freud or other) or any other dado set isn't gonna happen.

How broke are you? Are you REALLY broke, or just feeling sorry for yourself
because you know what a money sucking poop factory that new rugrat is going
to be?

If you're interested, I have a saw blade for you. It's a Freud TK960 (thin
kerf) that's close to new. I accidentally cut into a piece of angle iron
with it. (Don't ask.) I figured it was ruined, so I bought a new one. I
subsequently compared cuts from the two blades, and there's no discernable
difference. I can't find any broken, chipped or missing teeth, and the
blade seems absolutely fine. I expect the only thing wrong with it is that
it might be slightly more dull than its age would indicate, but I don't
judge that it needs sharpening yet.

Email me (just hit the reply button... no hidden tricks or gimmicks) if
you're interested.

--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/

I use my router every day because I don't have a table saw. In fact I use
it the same way most people use a table saw. I have it set up right now
with a 2.5" long Amana straight bit, for ripping. Sure the kerf is 3/4"
wide,
wasting a bit more material than a table saw, but it does the job. Normally
I do use a clamped 2x4 as a fence to keep the rip going straight. Otherwise
it just wouldn't be safe, I realize that after trying to make free hand
rips.

One bad thing is the router bit gums up occasionally. I know its time to
clean it when the bit spins up and sap spatters on my helmet - visor.
I wear a helmet now because I've had some bad kickbacks on the
router ripper (what I affectionately call my "router saw"). One time I
was ripping a huge sheet of heavy plywood on the wrong side of the
bit, and it pulled it (and me) through, and I came to rest with my forearms
on either side of the spinning bit. Luckily I landed the way I did or I'd be
looking at getting some new bone and muscle grafts, I hear the router
don't leave much when you get intimate with it.


--
The software said it ran under Windows 98/NT/2000, or better.
So I installed it on Linux...
"Silvan" wrote in message
...
wrote:

a bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with
my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

Depends on what you want to do. I use my router a couple, three times a
year. I use my table saw almost daily.

You don't *need* a dado blade to do dadoes (or grooves, or certain types
of
rabbets). I don't have one. I make multiple passes, and clean up the
cuts
with a chisel. Now, I'll grant you, I'm looking forward to getting one
some day. I'd even like to have a shop some day with *two* saws, so I can
leave one set up with a dado. But until then, I get by just fine.

As for a good blade, I presume you're thinking something like a WWII? I
don't have one of those yet either. Buying a decent Freud blade for $35
made a world of difference on my saw. Yeah, $35 isn't free, and there are
weeks when I couldn't come up with that kind of cash myself, but you're
more likely to scrounge $35 than $100 for a WWII.

Also, dollar for dollar, routers are useless without bits, and decent
router
bits are *not* cheap. I expect you'll get a hell of a lot more mileage
out
of a $35 saw blade than a $35 in router bits.

Anyway, sounds like you need to pick up a good table saw book and see the
myriad things you can do with that critter. Seems to me you don't realize
what you have there. Especially if you're lucky enough to be starting
with
a gloatable one. Mine is a complete POS.

Pat yourself on the back for doing the right thing, and enjoy!

--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/

On Tue, 06 Jan 2004 20:55:09 GMT, Nova
wrote:
I stand corrected Jack. I never saw a 23/32" router bit. Thank you.
I've always used the old tonge and groove method for carcass
construction. Variations in plywood thickness becomes a non-issue
with T&G joints
terry boivin wrote:

snip

Try routing a 23/32" dado....won't happen with one pass.

Why not? Many manufactures make 23/32" router bits specifically for the
"undersized" plywood. See:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&i...F32+router+bit

On Wed, 07 Jan 2004 05:00:57 GMT, "David Binkowski"
wrote:
Holy Moly!!! That story would scare any newbie out of a router
purchase I think. BTW, I like your Linux line...very clever.

I use my router every day because I don't have a table saw. In fact I use
it the same way most people use a table saw. I have it set up right now
with a 2.5" long Amana straight bit, for ripping. Sure the kerf is 3/4"
wide,
wasting a bit more material than a table saw, but it does the job. Normally
I do use a clamped 2x4 as a fence to keep the rip going straight. Otherwise
it just wouldn't be safe, I realize that after trying to make free hand
rips.

One bad thing is the router bit gums up occasionally. I know its time to
clean it when the bit spins up and sap spatters on my helmet - visor.
I wear a helmet now because I've had some bad kickbacks on the
router ripper (what I affectionately call my "router saw"). One time I
was ripping a huge sheet of heavy plywood on the wrong side of the
bit, and it pulled it (and me) through, and I came to rest with my forearms
on either side of the spinning bit. Luckily I landed the way I did or I'd be
looking at getting some new bone and muscle grafts, I hear the router
don't leave much when you get intimate with it.

Well, the answer to your question is, well, both. I am really broke and (as
this is my second kid) I do know what a "money-sucking poop factory the
rugrat is going to be" (that made me LOL).

And thank you for your offer. It just proves that this group has a great
bunch of folks.

Thanks again.


codepath




"Silvan" wrote in message
...
wrote:

it. It also came with a Craftsman wobble dado blade. As I have no more
money (and won't for a very long time), getting a better blade (Forrest,
Freud or other) or any other dado set isn't gonna happen.

How broke are you? Are you REALLY broke, or just feeling sorry for
yourself
because you know what a money sucking poop factory that new rugrat is
going
to be?

If you're interested, I have a saw blade for you. It's a Freud TK960
(thin
kerf) that's close to new. I accidentally cut into a piece of angle iron
with it. (Don't ask.) I figured it was ruined, so I bought a new one. I
subsequently compared cuts from the two blades, and there's no discernable
difference. I can't find any broken, chipped or missing teeth, and the
blade seems absolutely fine. I expect the only thing wrong with it is
that
it might be slightly more dull than its age would indicate, but I don't
judge that it needs sharpening yet.

Email me (just hit the reply button... no hidden tricks or gimmicks) if
you're interested.

--
Michael McIntyre ---- Silvan
Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621
http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/

Thanks to all! I appreciate all of your advice and opinions. I am now sure
that I made a good choice. I was looking for comments to let me know that I
did the right thing and you folks have given me plenty.

I will check out the book that was suggested and probably skim a little cash
off of my paycheck for a cheap carbide blade (just don't tell SWMBO).

This is the best community I have seen (and I spend about 60 hours a week
online in my day job).

I didn't really have buyer's remorse per se, but was afraid that I may have
followed the wrong path to jumpstarting myself into woodworking. I am very
excited and can't wait to dive into my first project.

I know that I have a lot of skill-building to do before I can tackle
something like a bedroom set, so I made a list of projects to take be from
newbie to, well, not-so-newbie (I'll layout my skill-building plan in a new
thread for opinions).


Thanks again everyone,

codepath



wrote in message ...
I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not actually
about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about the decision
to
get a table saw in the first place.

You see, I am a newbie. I asked around and most advice given was that the
table saw is the major workhorse in woodworking. So, I got one as my xmas
gift.

Problem is that I spent every cent I had to get a good one (well, the best
I
could get for the money that I had). And, although it came with a wobble
dado blade (yeah, I know "you'll put your eye out kid"), I now (and for
the
foreseeable future with a new kid coming soon) cannot afford a good blade
for a good dado set.

So I am thinking that I should have gotten a really good router combo and
a
bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

codepath

On Mon, 05 Jan 2004 17:45:17 -0800, nolove wrote:

I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not actually
about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about the decision to
get a table saw in the first place.

You see, I am a newbie. I asked around and most advice given was that the
table saw is the major workhorse in woodworking. So, I got one as my xmas
gift.

Problem is that I spent every cent I had to get a good one (well, the best I
could get for the money that I had). And, although it came with a wobble
dado blade (yeah, I know "you'll put your eye out kid"), I now (and for the
foreseeable future with a new kid coming soon) cannot afford a good blade
for a good dado set.

So I am thinking that I should have gotten a really good router combo and a
bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

codepath


You did just fine. Go make a few things and then add to the collection of
toys as your budget allows. Some of the finest pieces have been made with
the simplest of tools and devices. Tools are extras. It's imagination
which counts.

I feel compelled to relate a story from the holidays.

I went to visit my brother-in-law. I offered to put up some moulding
for him. I figured I'd just borrow my other brother-in-law's compound
miter saw. Oops! He said it got stolen. Bummer. Okay, I'll go rent
one. The blade on the one at the local shop looked terrible. Too
expensive to buy a blade. My brother-in-law offered a yellow PLASTIC
miter box that comes with a saw made by BUCK BROS. I figure that will
never work, so I go search the wreck. "You need a compound miter
saw." "You need a Lion Miter Trimmer." "At the very least, you need
a Nobex miter saw." "The Craftsman hand miter box isn't too bad."
All of these options are expensive enough that I can't imagine buying
the tool just for 8 cuts.

Okay, so I ask my BIL if we can paint the moulding. That way, if
there are gaps in the corners, I can fill them with caulk. Nope. He
wants to stain it. This is going to be a disaster.

It gets down to the wire and I try the yellow plastic miter box. I
cut and measured carefully, doing the best I could. I hammered
carefully to not dent the moulding. (No pnuematic nailer, of course.)

In the end, it all turned out great. The joints were tight and
everybody said it looked great.

The moral to the story: Take the wreck with a grain of salt. All
this talk of "only cry once" and "crapsman" makes it sound like you
can't do ANYTHING without the most expensive tools. Just work
carefully and be innovative. If you can't easily cut dados, then
don't use dados. Maybe you can use splines instead.

(Now if I could just pay attention to this story myself...)

Mark

(Mark Wells) wrote in
om:

It gets down to the wire and I try the yellow plastic miter box. I

Did a few door mouldings with it. It probably isn't
too bad if you accept +- 1-2 degree accuracy. But
by the time we were done, we had yellow dust all over
the bottom of it, so you have to wonder how long it's
supposed to last :-)

How many cuts did you survive with it?


ken

C wrote in message omREMOVE...
On Mon, 05 Jan 2004 17:45:17 -0800, nolove wrote:

I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not actually
about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about the decision to
get a table saw in the first place.

You see, I am a newbie. I asked around and most advice given was that the
table saw is the major workhorse in woodworking. So, I got one as my xmas
gift.

Problem is that I spent every cent I had to get a good one (well, the best I
could get for the money that I had). And, although it came with a wobble
dado blade (yeah, I know "you'll put your eye out kid"), I now (and for the
foreseeable future with a new kid coming soon) cannot afford a good blade
for a good dado set.

So I am thinking that I should have gotten a really good router combo and a
bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

codepath


You did just fine. Go make a few things and then add to the collection of
toys as your budget allows. Some of the finest pieces have been made with
the simplest of tools and devices. Tools are extras. It's imagination
which counts.

I agree. Also IMHO the router is highly over-rated. It is pressed into
use for many things but does all of them badly. It is quite possible
to manage without one.
Wobble saw is highly under-rated. A good quality modern unit (NOT an
ordinary saw blade with added wobble washers) used for cutting slots
along the grain e.g. in frames for holding panels, is fast, clean,
accurate, quiet, highly adjustable and vastly more effective than
slotting with a router.

cheers

Jacob

Don't know how to use a router, huh?

"jacob" wrote in message
Also IMHO the router is highly over-rated. It is pressed into
use for many things but does all of them badly.

"jacob" wrote in message

I agree. Also IMHO the router is highly over-rated. It is pressed into
use for many things but does all of them badly. It is quite possible
to manage without one.
Jacob

I agree. I think all the stuff at www.patwarner.com is retouched photos and
animation from Dreamworks. Routers should be banned, or at least taxed like
tobacco and alcohol to keep them out of the hands of children.
Ed

perhaps you've not enough experience with a router to effectively use
one? Ever done rails and stiles without one?

dave

jacob wrote:

C wrote in message omREMOVE...

On Mon, 05 Jan 2004 17:45:17 -0800, nolove wrote:


I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not actually
about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about the decision to
get a table saw in the first place.

You see, I am a newbie. I asked around and most advice given was that the
table saw is the major workhorse in woodworking. So, I got one as my xmas
gift.

Problem is that I spent every cent I had to get a good one (well, the best I
could get for the money that I had). And, although it came with a wobble
dado blade (yeah, I know "you'll put your eye out kid"), I now (and for the
foreseeable future with a new kid coming soon) cannot afford a good blade
for a good dado set.

So I am thinking that I should have gotten a really good router combo and a
bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

codepath


You did just fine. Go make a few things and then add to the collection of
toys as your budget allows. Some of the finest pieces have been made with
the simplest of tools and devices. Tools are extras. It's imagination
which counts.


I agree. Also IMHO the router is highly over-rated. It is pressed into
use for many things but does all of them badly. It is quite possible
to manage without one.
Wobble saw is highly under-rated. A good quality modern unit (NOT an
ordinary saw blade with added wobble washers) used for cutting slots
along the grain e.g. in frames for holding panels, is fast, clean,
accurate, quiet, highly adjustable and vastly more effective than
slotting with a router.

cheers

Jacob

Well yes have done thousands of rails and stiles without a router -
planer/thicknesser to size, rebate with rebate head on spindle
moulder, mouldings with spindlemoulder, slots with wobble saw,
mortices with morticer, tenons with band saw or table saw.
All much faster, more accurate, less noisy, less dusty, than a router.

Jacob


perhaps you've not enough experience with a router to effectively use
one? Ever done rails and stiles without one?

dave

jacob wrote:

C wrote in message omREMOVE...

On Mon, 05 Jan 2004 17:45:17 -0800, nolove wrote:


I am having doubts about my recent table saw purchase. Well, not actually
about the saw. I got a great (gloat-worthy) deal. But, about the decision to
get a table saw in the first place.

You see, I am a newbie. I asked around and most advice given was that the
table saw is the major workhorse in woodworking. So, I got one as my xmas
gift.

Problem is that I spent every cent I had to get a good one (well, the best I
could get for the money that I had). And, although it came with a wobble
dado blade (yeah, I know "you'll put your eye out kid"), I now (and for the
foreseeable future with a new kid coming soon) cannot afford a good blade
for a good dado set.

So I am thinking that I should have gotten a really good router combo and a
bit set with the money instead. At least then I could rough cut with my
circular saw and finish with the router. Plus, then I could do rabbets,
dadoes, etc.

Agree, disagree, head up my ass, other opinions?

codepath


You did just fine. Go make a few things and then add to the collection of
toys as your budget allows. Some of the finest pieces have been made with
the simplest of tools and devices. Tools are extras. It's imagination
which counts.


I agree. Also IMHO the router is highly over-rated. It is pressed into
use for many things but does all of them badly. It is quite possible
to manage without one.
Wobble saw is highly under-rated. A good quality modern unit (NOT an
ordinary saw blade with added wobble washers) used for cutting slots
along the grain e.g. in frames for holding panels, is fast, clean,
accurate, quiet, highly adjustable and vastly more effective than
slotting with a router.

cheers

Jacob