I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal down
and the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the foot-brake
and the engine restarts - what a pointless system for anyone who drives
properly and uses the handbrake.

Jim K... presented the following explanation :
Hillstarts?

No, normal stops in traffic and at the lights.

Harry Bloomfield wrote:

I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal down
and the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the foot-brake and
the engine restarts - what a pointless system for anyone who drives
properly and uses the handbrake.

They don't all work like that ...

Harry Bloomfield, Esq. Wrote in
message:
I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal down
and the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the foot-brake
and the engine restarts - what a pointless system for anyone who drives
properly and uses the handbrake.


Hillstarts?

--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

On 14/09/2019 18:57, Andy Burns wrote:
Harry Bloomfield wrote:

I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal
down and the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the
foot-brake and the engine restarts - what a pointless system for
anyone who drives properly and uses the handbrake.

They don't all work like that ...

Mine stops when not in gear and my foot is not on the clutch. Depressing
the clutch again restarts that engine. In town I find it to be somewhat
of a PITA and I turn the system off. Unfortunately the system is always
enabled again when initially starting the car with the key. Once
automatically stopped the engine will randomly restart again if there is
a heavy load draining the battery (such as the AC or lights being on).
This unexpected random restart can be unnerving at times.

My car is also fitted with a hill start assist function. I encountered
it for the first time when attempting to reverse park into a space on a
fairly steep hill which required a tiny bit of additional
forward/backward maneuvering to get the car closer to the curb and leave
enough space back and front to allow others to get out of their parking
spot. The hill assist detects the incline and automatically holds on the
brakes for a time which made a fairly simple maneuver a lot more
difficult. I found the menu item to turn off the function and I've never
missed it since.




--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

It happens that alan_m formulated :
Mine stops when not in gear and my foot is not on the clutch.

Sorry, I forgot to mention - it was an, rather than a manual.

Harry Bloomfield, Esq. wrote :
I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal down and
the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the foot-brake and the
engine restarts - what a pointless system for anyone who drives properly and
uses the handbrake.

We have a Lexus RX450h hybrid and if I drive like I was taught to 44
years ago, ie, stop at red traffic lights, handbrake on and select
neutral, the hybrid system doesn't work because it takes a signal from
the brake pedal switch.

So, when approaching a red light I have to brake the car to a stop,
leave it in D rather than shifting to N, and keep my foot on the
brakes. You don't use the handbrake at all unless you're going to be
stopped for a while.

The engine stops as the car comes to rest and restarts either when you
press the accelerator or if still stopped but the hybrid battery is
getting low, but if the car is in N then the engine would not restart
to recharge the hybrid battery.

"alan_m" wrote in message
...
On 14/09/2019 18:57, Andy Burns wrote:
Harry Bloomfield wrote:

I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal down
and the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the foot-brake and
the engine restarts - what a pointless system for anyone who drives
properly and uses the handbrake.

They don't all work like that ...

Mine stops when not in gear and my foot is not on the clutch. Depressing
the clutch again restarts that engine. In town I find it to be somewhat of
a PITA and I turn the system off. Unfortunately the system is always
enabled again when initially starting the car with the key. Once
automatically stopped the engine will randomly restart again if there is a
heavy load draining the battery (such as the AC or lights being on). This
unexpected random restart can be unnerving at times.

My wife's Honda CR-V has auto-stop, though it's controlled by a switch
switch remembers its state when you turn off the ignition. It works
remarkably well: I don't think I've ever been wrong-footed by finding the
the engine doesn't restart in time for setting off from lights.

I've not found any perverse interaction with the handbrake: it works if you
brake to a halt with the footbrake, put the car in neutral, release the
clutch (that's what triggers the engine to stop), apply the handbrake and
release the footbrake - as I always have done and always will do (in a
manual or an auto). It doesn't require you to keep your foot on the
footbrake all the time you are stopped: that would be very inconsiderate to
the drivers of cars behind you at night which would be dazzled by the brake
lights.

If releasing the footbrake with the handbrake on had restarted the engine,
I'd have soon picked that up on a test drive and chosen another car - or
decided to disable auto-stop - because it is encouraging you to drive
without thought for the car behind. My instructor was adamant on the point:
"footbrake to make you stop; handbrake to stay stopped". In practice, the
only exception is if I think I'll only be stopped for a couple of seconds.

The only quirk is that if I happen to knock the steering wheel, which
probably lowers the pressure in the power-steering system, the engine
restarts to replenish that pressure.



My car is also fitted with a hill start assist function. I encountered it
for the first time when attempting to reverse park into a space on a
fairly steep hill which required a tiny bit of additional forward/backward
maneuvering to get the car closer to the curb and leave enough space back
and front to allow others to get out of their parking spot. The hill
assist detects the incline and automatically holds on the brakes for a
time which made a fairly simple maneuver a lot more difficult. I found the
menu item to turn off the function and I've never missed it since.

The Honda has this, but either it's disabled by default or else it is less
obtrusive because I've never found it getting in the way of proper driving
as taught for the normal test or the IAM advanced test.

In my own car, a Peugeot, I've had to do hill starts on a 1:3 hill near me.
I usually allow plenty of space from the car in front in case he stalls or
muffs a gearchange, but even so I've sometimes unexpectedly had to stop on
the hill. With a diesel it's easy enough to restart because the engine will
keep going even without your foot on the accelerator, which allows me to use
my foot for the footbrake (in case the handbrake alone won't hold the car
from rolling back on such a steep hill) and then once the car is rolling
forward I can quickly move my foot across to the accelerator to start moving
more quickly. Thankfully my car has a pretty good handbrake so I don't
usually need to rely on the footbrake. My mum's old Renault, which I learned
on, with a handbrake lever as an "umbrella handle" under the dashboard, had
a lousy handbrake which wouldn't hold the car on even a slight uphill when
doing a hill start.

On Sat, 14 Sep 2019 19:36:03 +0100, Paddy Dzell wrote:
We have a Lexus RX450h hybrid and if I drive like I was taught to 44
years ago, ie, stop at red traffic lights, handbrake on and select
neutral, the hybrid system doesn't work because it takes a signal from
the brake pedal switch.

So, when approaching a red light I have to brake the car to a stop,
leave it in D rather than shifting to N, and keep my foot on the
brakes. You don't use the handbrake at all unless you're going to be
stopped for a while.

The engine stops as the car comes to rest and restarts either when you
press the accelerator or if still stopped but the hybrid battery is
getting low, but if the car is in N then the engine would not restart
to recharge the hybrid battery.

The RX450h will operate the hybrid system normally if you put the
gearbox in park instead of neutral.

On 14/09/19 18:53, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal down
and the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the foot-brake
and the engine restarts - what a pointless system for anyone who drives
properly and uses the handbrake.

Oh, there's even greater stupidity than that. In my car. with the engine
stopped when I have my foot on the brake, if I then unclip my seatbelt
(such as when I'm just about to drive into my garage) the engine restarts!

--

Jeff

On 14/09/2019 18:53, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal down
and the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the foot-brake and
the engine restarts - what a pointless system for anyone who drives
properly and uses the handbrake.


We have it on our Smart Car, although you can turn it off. I don't care
for it and turn it off.

The hybrid also has it but that also has auto hold, part of the electric
handbrake. Basically, it applies and removes a pseudo handbrake as you
take you foot off the accel or apply it. When you are running on petrol,
the auto stop feature also works. All very smoothly. You really don't
notice it.

I am curious how they test hill starts in driving tests in cars with
electric handbrakes, but that isn't something I need to worry about.

On Saturday, 14 September 2019 19:36:08 UTC+1, Paddy Dzell wrote:
Harry Bloomfield, Esq. wrote :
I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal down and
the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the foot-brake and the
engine restarts - what a pointless system for anyone who drives properly and
uses the handbrake.

We have a Lexus RX450h hybrid and if I drive like I was taught to 44
years ago, ie, stop at red traffic lights, handbrake on and select
neutral, the hybrid system doesn't work because it takes a signal from
the brake pedal switch.

So, when approaching a red light I have to brake the car to a stop,
leave it in D rather than shifting to N, and keep my foot on the
brakes. You don't use the handbrake at all unless you're going to be
stopped for a while.

The engine stops as the car comes to rest and restarts either when you
press the accelerator or if still stopped but the hybrid battery is
getting low, but if the car is in N then the engine would not restart
to recharge the hybrid battery.

I think you can get done for keeping your foot on the brake & not using the handbrake. Even if that's not correct, it's not good practice. If an accidental shunt happens, drivers are prone to taking heir foot off the brake, resulting in more damage & hazard to pedestrians etc, and worse at T junctions.

There was a generation of cars that had hopeless handbrakes. Those are fun to start on steep hills.


NT

wrote in message
...
On Saturday, 14 September 2019 19:36:08 UTC+1, Paddy Dzell wrote:
Harry Bloomfield, Esq. wrote :
I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal down
and
the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the foot-brake and
the
engine restarts - what a pointless system for anyone who drives
properly and
uses the handbrake.

We have a Lexus RX450h hybrid and if I drive like I was taught to 44
years ago, ie, stop at red traffic lights, handbrake on and select
neutral, the hybrid system doesn't work because it takes a signal from
the brake pedal switch.

So, when approaching a red light I have to brake the car to a stop,
leave it in D rather than shifting to N, and keep my foot on the
brakes. You don't use the handbrake at all unless you're going to be
stopped for a while.

The engine stops as the car comes to rest and restarts either when you
press the accelerator or if still stopped but the hybrid battery is
getting low, but if the car is in N then the engine would not restart
to recharge the hybrid battery.

I think you can get done for keeping your foot on the brake & not using
the handbrake.

Nope.

Even if that's not correct, it's not good practice.

Bull****.

If an accidental shunt happens, drivers are prone to taking heir foot off
the brake,

Bull****.

resulting in more damage & hazard to pedestrians etc, and worse at T
junctions.

There was a generation of cars that had hopeless handbrakes. Those are fun
to start on steep hills.

On Sunday, 15 September 2019 00:45:41 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:

Nope.

Bull****.

Bull****.

as usual then

wrote in message
...
On Sunday, 15 September 2019 00:45:41 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:

Nope.

Bull****.

Bull****.

as usual then

You never could bull**** your way out of a wet paper bag, gutless.

Paddy Dzell wrote:
Harry Bloomfield, Esq. wrote :
I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal down and
the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the foot-brake and the
engine restarts - what a pointless system for anyone who drives properly and
uses the handbrake.

We have a Lexus RX450h hybrid and if I drive like I was taught to 44
years ago, ie, stop at red traffic lights, handbrake on and select
neutral, the hybrid system doesn't work because it takes a signal from
the brake pedal switch.

So, when approaching a red light I have to brake the car to a stop,
leave it in D rather than shifting to N, and keep my foot on the
brakes. You don't use the handbrake at all unless you're going to be
stopped for a while.

The engine stops as the car comes to rest and restarts either when you
press the accelerator or if still stopped but the hybrid battery is
getting low, but if the car is in N then the engine would not restart
to recharge the hybrid battery.


Doesnt your hybrid have a €˜hold function- almost like and automatic
handbrake?

When you stop, it comes on. Put your foot on the accel. and it releases.
You have to select to use it each journey but then it is automatic. If the
car is running on petrol, the stop start system still works etc. All quite
seamless, at least on the Outlander- you really dont notice it.

I was never keen on automatics until we got the Outlander. The Smart Car is
ok, although we ended up with an automatic due to availability. When we
replace it, I havent decided whether to go for a manual - the new ones are
mainly manual.

On Sun, 15 Sep 2019 09:38:57 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH more of the 85-year-old trolling senile asshole's troll****

--
Website (from 2007) dedicated to the 85-year-old trolling senile
cretin from Oz:
https://www.pcreview.co.uk/threads/r...d-faq.2973853/

On Sun, 15 Sep 2019 10:28:28 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

Nope.

Bull****.

Bull****.

as usual then

You never could bull**** your way out of a wet paper bag, gutless.

You certainly KEEP bull****ting your way FAST into your grave, you abnormal
85-year-old trolling senile pest!

--
Kerr-Mudd,John addressing senile Rot:
"Auto-contradictor Rod is back! (in the KF)"
MID:

On 14/09/2019 23:30, wrote:

I think you can get done for keeping your foot on the brake & not using the handbrake. Even if that's not correct, it's not good practice. If an accidental shunt happens, drivers are prone to taking heir foot off the brake, resulting in more damage & hazard to pedestrians etc, and worse at T junctions.

Highway code rule 114

You MUST NOT

use any lights in a way which would dazzle or cause discomfort to other
road users, including pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders

use front or rear fog lights unless visibility is seriously reduced. You
MUST switch them off when visibility improves to avoid dazzling other
road users (see Rule 226).

In stationary queues of traffic, drivers should apply the parking brake
and, once the following traffic has stopped, take their foot off the
footbrake to deactivate the vehicle brake lights. This will minimise
glare to road users behind until the traffic moves again.



--
Adam

"ARW" wrote in message
...
On 14/09/2019 23:30, wrote:

I think you can get done for keeping your foot on the brake & not using
the handbrake. Even if that's not correct, it's not good practice. If an
accidental shunt happens, drivers are prone to taking heir foot off the
brake, resulting in more damage & hazard to pedestrians etc, and worse at
T junctions.

Highway code rule 114

You MUST NOT

use any lights in a way which would dazzle or cause discomfort to other
road users, including pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders

use front or rear fog lights unless visibility is seriously reduced. You
MUST switch them off when visibility improves to avoid dazzling other road
users (see Rule 226).

In stationary queues of traffic, drivers should apply the parking brake
and, once the following traffic has stopped, take their foot off the
footbrake to deactivate the vehicle brake lights. This will minimise glare
to road users behind until the traffic moves again.

But they dont in fact ever fine people for not doing the stuff in that last
para.

I would have also thought it puts a lot of stress on parts from cycling
through, like the starter motor and the actual linkages in the engine
itself.
Brian

--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
Harry Bloomfield; "Esq." wrote in
message ...
I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal down and
the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the foot-brake and the
engine restarts - what a pointless system for anyone who drives properly
and uses the handbrake.

Brian Gaff wrote:

I would have also thought it puts a lot of stress on parts from cycling
through, like the starter motor and the actual linkages in the engine
itself.

The mounting bracket on the combined starter motor and alternator has
partly broken, waiting for spare parts on back order ...

On 15/09/2019 09:51, Rod Speed wrote:


"ARW" wrote in message
...

[snip]

Highway code rule 114

[snip]

In stationary queues of traffic, drivers should apply the parking
brake and, once the following traffic has stopped, take their foot off
the footbrake to deactivate the vehicle brake lights. This will
minimise glare to road users behind until the traffic moves again.

But they dont in fact ever fine people for not doing the stuff in that
last para.

Note that it says 'should apply the parking brake' i.e. not 'must'. So
unlike the previous two paragraphs it's advisory, not mandatory, and
there's no offence to be fined for.

"Brian Gaff" wrote in message
...
I would have also thought it puts a lot of stress on parts from cycling
through, like the starter motor and the actual linkages in the engine
itself.

If you are driving in stop-start traffic, so the engine is stopping and then
having to be restarted every few seconds, it will eventually flatten the
battery because the time that the engine is running is not enough to put
back the charge that restarting has taken out of it. Cars with auto-stop
usually have batteries with larger amp-hour ratings (*) so they can store
more charge to compensate for the increased use of the starter motor.

Usually I find that the engine stops once when I join a queue of traffic at
lights, and then restarts when I'm ready to start moving through the lights.
But in a long queue, it may have to stop and start several times to get me
right through to the head of the queue where I can then drive at a normal
speed.


(*) Just as diesels have a larger Ahr rating battery that petrols because
the higher compression makes it more difficult for the starter to turn the
engine over.

On 14/09/2019 18:53, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal down
and the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the foot-brake and
the engine restarts - what a pointless system for anyone who drives
properly and uses the handbrake.

Apart from hill starts, who uses the handbrake these days ?.
I just leave it parked in 1st gear hand brake OFF, unless
I happen to be parked (rarely) on more than a slight gradient.

On 14/09/2019 19:36, Paddy Dzell wrote:
We have a Lexus RX450h hybrid a

If that is the one with a V6 petrol engine, then be
aware that changing the spark plugs takes about 3
hours on some models. Involves removing the inlet
manifolds according to me ex-MOT tester neighbour.

On 15/09/2019 01:14, wrote:
On Sunday, 15 September 2019 00:45:41 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:

Nope.

Bull****.

Bull****.

as usual then


The problem was the handbrake on some cars was offset
towards the left hand side of the car, so easier to
heave on correctly in an LHD car but the UK RHD
conversion left it offset to the left. People with
limited wrist and arm strength, like females, could
not then apply with anough force.

Then the hot disks cooled and shrunk slightly
releasing what limited grip had been applied.

On 15/09/2019 10:35, Andrew wrote:
On 14/09/2019 18:53, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal
down and the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the
foot-brake and the engine restarts - what a pointless system for
anyone who drives properly and uses the handbrake.

Apart from hill starts, who uses the handbrake these days ?.

Dont even use it for that. hold the car on the foot brake


I just leave it parked in 1st gear hand brake OFF, unless
I happen to be parked (rarely) on more than a slight gradient.

I just leave it parked in PARK...

--
"I am inclined to tell the truth and dislike people who lie consistently.
This makes me unfit for the company of people of a Left persuasion, and
all women"

On 15/09/2019 09:21, ARW wrote:
Highway code rule 114

You MUST NOT

use any lights in a way which would dazzle or cause discomfort to other
road users, including pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders

Have all modern cars with daytime running lamps been exempted
from this then ?.

On 15/09/2019 10:29, Mike Clarke wrote:
On 15/09/2019 09:51, Rod Speed wrote:


"ARW" wrote in message
...

[snip]

Highway code rule 114

[snip]

In stationary queues of traffic, drivers should apply the parking
brake and, once the following traffic has stopped, take their foot
off the footbrake to deactivate the vehicle brake lights. This will
minimise glare to road users behind until the traffic moves again.

But they dont in fact ever fine people for not doing the stuff in
that last para.

Note that it says 'should apply the parking brake' i.e. not 'must'. So
unlike the previous two paragraphs it's advisory, not mandatory, and
there's no offence to be fined for.


I think you would be very unlucky to get fined for not displaying your
brake lights and were rear ended whilst waiting at a T junction.

Although I do keep them on when traffic comes to an unexpected
standstill [1] on Motorways and dual carriageways.

[1] or a slowdown that I could manage just by letting off the
accelerator as I might be able to see what someone behind my van cannot
see due to the fact they cannot see through the van and are not sat up
as high as I am.


--
Adam

On 15/09/2019 10:47, Andrew wrote:
On 15/09/2019 09:21, ARW wrote:
Highway code rule 114

You MUST NOT

use any lights in a way which would dazzle or cause discomfort to
other road users, including pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders

Have all modern cars with daytime running lamps been exempted
from this then ?.



vbg

--
Adam

On 15/09/2019 10:45, Andrew wrote:
On 15/09/2019 01:14, wrote:
On Sunday, 15 September 2019 00:45:41 UTC+1, Rod SpeedÂ* wrote:

Nope.

Bull****.

Bull****.

as usual then


The problem was the handbrake on some cars was offset
towards the left hand side of the car, so easier to
heave on correctly in an LHD car but the UK RHD
conversion left it offset to the left. People with
limited wrist and arm strength, like females, could
not then apply with anough force.


I was expecting a homophobic comment there.

Then the hot disks cooled and shrunk slightly
releasing what limited grip had been applied.

That would be an overnight parking problem not a waiting at a junction
for a minute problem.

--
Adam

On 15/09/2019 10:46, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 15/09/2019 10:35, Andrew wrote:
On 14/09/2019 18:53, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal
down and the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the
foot-brake and the engine restarts - what a pointless system for
anyone who drives properly and uses the handbrake.

Apart from hill starts, who uses the handbrake these days ?.

Dont even use it for that. hold the car on the foot brake


I just leave it parked in 1st gear hand brake OFF, unless
I happen to be parked (rarely) on more than a slight gradient.

I just leave it parked in PARK...


And if anyone bumps into the back of your car, even at low
speed, the parking pawl inside the gearbox just snaps off,
according to my ex-MOT tester neighbour, whereas a manual
car will just move slightly as the transmission takes up
the impact and turns the engine slightly.

In article ,
NY wrote:
"Brian Gaff" wrote in message
...
I would have also thought it puts a lot of stress on parts from cycling
through, like the starter motor and the actual linkages in the engine
itself.

If you are driving in stop-start traffic, so the engine is stopping and
then having to be restarted every few seconds, it will eventually
flatten the battery because the time that the engine is running is not
enough to put back the charge that restarting has taken out of it. Cars
with auto-stop usually have batteries with larger amp-hour ratings (*)
so they can store more charge to compensate for the increased use of the
starter motor.

apparently my Mazda stores braking energy in a super-capacitor. If there
isn't enough in there to restart the engine, it won't stop.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

"Andrew" wrote in message
...
On 14/09/2019 18:53, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal down
and the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the foot-brake and
the engine restarts - what a pointless system for anyone who drives
properly and uses the handbrake.

Apart from hill starts, who uses the handbrake these days ?.
I just leave it parked in 1st gear hand brake OFF, unless
I happen to be parked (rarely) on more than a slight gradient.

I apply my handbrake whenever I come to a halt and anticipate being stopped
for more than a couple of seconds - but then I had

Highway code rule 114

"In stationary queues of traffic, drivers should apply the parking brake
and, once the following traffic has stopped, take their foot off the
footbrake to deactivate the vehicle brake lights. This will minimise glare
to road users behind until the traffic moves again."

drummed into me. I also put an automatic (on the rare occasions I drive one)
into neutral when I come to a halt, to avoid having to keep my foot on the
footbrake to prevent the car creeping forwards.


On a hill I always leave the car in gear - first if I'm facing uphill or
reverse if I'm facing downhill, so that if I accidentally start the car
without checking whether it's in gear, the starter motor will propel it
uphill rather than downhill into the adjacent car. That's as a supplement to
the handbrake, just in case the cable happens to stretch over time.

"Andrew" wrote in message
...
The problem was the handbrake on some cars was offset
towards the left hand side of the car, so easier to
heave on correctly in an LHD car but the UK RHD
conversion left it offset to the left. People with
limited wrist and arm strength, like females, could
not then apply with anough force.

Then the hot disks cooled and shrunk slightly
releasing what limited grip had been applied.


My Peugeot 308 has the handbrake lever offset to the left, with some drinks
holders etc between the lever and the driver. I presume this is because the
car is designed to be LHD and modified for RHD: I doubt whether the lever
and drinks containers are reversed for LHD cars. I've never had any problem
pulling the handbrake on hard enough. What matters more is the mechanical
advantage of the handbrake lever: is it "high-geared" so there's only a
small amount of travel between fully off and fully on, or is it "low-geared"
so there's a large amount of lever travel but less force needed on the lever
to exert the same pull on the brake cable? Some cars (my dad's old Ford
Sierra) had very little travel and very "high-geared" so you had to really
tug on the lever to get the handbrake fully on.

"Andrew" wrote in message
...
On 15/09/2019 09:21, ARW wrote:
Highway code rule 114

You MUST NOT

use any lights in a way which would dazzle or cause discomfort to other
road users, including pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders

Have all modern cars with daytime running lamps been exempted
from this then ?.

It's less of a problem for DLRs because they are at the front of the car so
an oncoming driver only sees them for a few seconds as they pass the car
with DRLs. Brake lights are more of a problem because once you are behind a
car in traffic, you will see his brake lights all the time they are on. If
I'm stuck in traffic at night, inching forwards in a traffic jam, I find I
have to shut my eyes as soon as I've stopped, to give me some night vision
for when the car in front starts moving again.

DRLs also have the advantage that they dim at night (eg when the
side/headlights are on) so they are only as bright as they need to be for
the ambient lighting. Brake lights, on the other hand, have to be bright to
be seen during the day and remain at that brightness at night. I imagine now
that cars are starting to use LEDs rather than filament bulbs, we will see
brake lights being dimmed at night, though it will need to be based on
measuring ambient light rather than controlled by the light switch because
you still want the brake lights to be bright if you are driving with lights
on in rain/fog during the day.

On Sun, 15 Sep 2019 18:51:49 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:


In stationary queues of traffic, drivers should apply the parking brake
and, once the following traffic has stopped, take their foot off the
footbrake to deactivate the vehicle brake lights. This will minimise glare
to road users behind until the traffic moves again.

But they don¢t in fact ever fine people for not doing the stuff in that last
para.

LOL In auto-contradicting mode again, senile cretin?

--
Kerr-Mudd,John addressing senile Rot:
"Auto-contradictor Rod is back! (in the KF)"
MID:

On 15/09/2019 10:55, Andrew wrote:
On 15/09/2019 10:46, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 15/09/2019 10:35, Andrew wrote:
On 14/09/2019 18:53, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
I drove my first 'stop/start' vehicle today. Press the brake pedal
down and the engine stops, apply the handbrake and release the
foot-brake and the engine restarts - what a pointless system for
anyone who drives properly and uses the handbrake.

Apart from hill starts, who uses the handbrake these days ?.

Dont even use it for that. hold the car on the foot brake


I just leave it parked in 1st gear hand brake OFF, unless
I happen to be parked (rarely) on more than a slight gradient.

I just leave it parked in PARK...


And if anyone bumps into the back of your car, even at low
speed, the parking pawl inside the gearbox just snaps off,
according to my ex-MOT tester neighbour, whereas a manual
car will just move slightly as the transmission takes up
the impact and turns the engine slightly.

Nothing I can do about that. Automatics are parked in park and that's
it. Whether or not you apply the handbrake.

I dont use PARK at traffic lights

--
€œProgress is precisely that which rules and regulations did not foresee,€�

€“ Ludwig von Mises

On 15/09/2019 11:13, NY wrote:
DRLs also have the advantage that they dim at night (eg when the
side/headlights are on) so they are only as bright as they need to be
for the ambient lighting.

That's bizarre. Why bother to have 'side lamps' at the front of
a vehicle that also has permanent DRLs ?.