"Davey" wrote in message ...

On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:05:45 +0100
John Rumm wrote:

I can only refer you to the suggestion offered by The Natural
Philosopher:
"Insert DVD, follow instructions."

"Simples", as they say.

Sounds like a simply way to lose all your documents, photos, and
other information. Then find you are no longer connected to your
email, newsgroups and don't recognise half your software.

We are talking about installing a different operating system, so I fail
to understand what you mean by that. Any sensible operator has any
important files backed up already, and why would installing Linux fail
to connect you to the internet?
Of course half the software would not be recognised, but any new
software required is free, in both senses. Firefox and Thunderbird, the
Mozilla programmes, are the same on either platform and will transfer
directly, importing your old profiles, and LibreOffice understands Word
and Excel and other Windows files. I see no problem.

Really? Is LibreOffice able to handle Excel VBA files without any issues?

On Thursday, 30 July 2015 20:47:43 UTC+1, newshound wrote:
On 30/07/2015 10:21, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 30/07/15 10:09, Richard wrote:
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message


It is not zealotry when your response to 'my horse is expensive to
maintain ****s everywhere and is getting slow' is 'have you tried a
motor car'?


Try getting your motor car to jump hedges while chasing a pack of
hounds, though.

True, but the majority of people upgraded from horses to cars during the 20th century, sure it's nice to see the way things were done in the before time, in the long long ago.

In article , Davey
writes
On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:05:45 +0100
John Rumm wrote:

I can only refer you to the suggestion offered by The Natural
Philosopher:
"Insert DVD, follow instructions."

"Simples", as they say.

Sounds like a simply way to lose all your documents, photos, and
other information. Then find you are no longer connected to your
email, newsgroups and don't recognise half your software.

We are talking about installing a different operating system, so I fail
to understand what you mean by that. Any sensible operator has any
important files backed up already, and why would installing Linux fail
to connect you to the internet?
Of course half the software would not be recognised, but any new
software required is free, in both senses. Firefox and Thunderbird, the
Mozilla programmes, are the same on either platform and will transfer
directly, importing your old profiles, and LibreOffice understands Word
and Excel and other Windows files. I see no problem.

I'd like to try Linux on my old laptop which currently holds a screwed
up version of XP. How do I find and implement a source copy.
--
bert

On Friday, 31 July 2015 10:24:05 UTC+1, fred wrote:
On Friday, July 31, 2015 at 10:10:27 AM UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/07/15 05:34, JHY wrote:


"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
On 30/07/15 19:28, dennis@home wrote:
Most people use windows because they can use windows.
No, the use it because it was on the computer they were sold

They can't use linux on a desktop as the support isn't there for them to
use it.

there is more support than there is for windows. unless you are a
corporate customer there is NO support for windows

That's not correct, the obvious support is from those you know.

Most people don't have a clue about computers

The first true statement in your post


and that doesn't mix with linux.

These days, it does.

Nope, even with the distros that try to look like Win.

If the linux crowd ever actually wake up to that fact they might try and
make a version of linux that most people can use but don't hold your
breath.

Its called Linux Mint.

Not for naïve users who have only ever used Win.

Actually the naive user who has only ever used - or been abused by -
win, finds it no less difficult to use than windows. He appreciates it
runs faster and better than windows however.

Which reminds me, I must pop round and see how he is getting on.


--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

Sweet J****s. Microsoft bashing. So predictable, so boring. This all reminds me about the time Michael Dell was asked by an Apple fanboy if the perceived problems with Vista had made Apple more of a threat. His reply was along the lines of 'Apple have less than 2% of the PC market so aren't even on the horizon'

but Apple have a far higher share of treh market than that, it's closer to 14% last I heard. Most PC users don;t have them by choice either they are suplied to them.


Collapse of smug Apple fanboy.

I feel the same way about Linux. In global terms its such a minority interest.

we use dual boot syatems and do use linux Fedora I think.

If it was so wonderful it would be cock of the walk by this time so why would a neophyte wish to get involved with an operating system with such a small user base.

For the same reason a person might take up runing the 100 metres very fast
few people do that too. There are lots of things few people do, but that shouldn;t restrict anyone from not thinking about doing something.
I complain about our IT guys most do, but if tehy didn't know linux or unix or Apple OS or windows they wouldn't have a job here.

In article , The Natural Philosopher
writes
On 31/07/15 11:03, John Rumm wrote:
On 7/30/2015 12:48 AM, Davey wrote:
On Thu, 30 Jul 2015 00:00:17 +0100
David Lang wrote:

On 29/07/2015 23:55, Davey wrote:
On Wed, 29 Jul 2015 23:41:34 +0100
David Lang wrote:

I only use the Win7 when I want to run the one programme that I
can't get to run on Ubuntu otherwise I would delete it to get the
extra space. If you happen to have a Humax PVR, you already have a
Linux machine.

Thank you, but I didn't understand a word of that :-)



Oh well, I tried. It's not that difficult, surely?

Hereby demonstrating one of the big difficulties with linux - the
users... while there are plenty of very helpful ones out there, there
are some that have difficulty relating to folks that don't dig
technology in the way they do.


As I said, download and burn the DVD, stick it in the drive and boot.

The *only* reason most naive users run windows is that it comes
pre-installed.

Which is how MS-Dos came to dominate the market place. It was a
condition of the dealer's licence that no other operating system would
be loaded on the same PC. At the time there was quite a good graphical
system around called Gem. Light years before Windows.
--
bert

"bert" wrote in message ...

In article , Davey
writes
On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:05:45 +0100
John Rumm wrote:

I can only refer you to the suggestion offered by The Natural
Philosopher:
"Insert DVD, follow instructions."

"Simples", as they say.

Sounds like a simply way to lose all your documents, photos, and
other information. Then find you are no longer connected to your
email, newsgroups and don't recognise half your software.

We are talking about installing a different operating system, so I fail
to understand what you mean by that. Any sensible operator has any
important files backed up already, and why would installing Linux fail
to connect you to the internet?
Of course half the software would not be recognised, but any new
software required is free, in both senses. Firefox and Thunderbird, the
Mozilla programmes, are the same on either platform and will transfer
directly, importing your old profiles, and LibreOffice understands Word
and Excel and other Windows files. I see no problem.

I'd like to try Linux on my old laptop which currently holds a screwed
up version of XP. How do I find and implement a source copy.


http://www.linuxmint.com

In article , Bill
writes
In message , Davey
writes
On Thu, 30 Jul 2015 09:17:11 +0100
Bill wrote:

And I bought a Humax PVR in a local PCWorld closing down sale.

Bad idea to start with.

Yes, but it was a very good price. I found a forum and asked, and it
appears to be working "as designed". It did have old firmware, but I've
updated to the current version.

What an amazing design.

It has the same red LED for OFF and for Recording, so there is no way
of knowing what it is doing.

The answer to this is to install the optional Firmware, which enables
all sorts of useful things on your Humax. Start he
http://wiki.hummy.tv/wiki/Main_Page

That is
a) the sort of typical response of a Linux user. "If you replace the
basic system with this one written by someone even more unknown it will
start to work". SWMBO regularly asks me "How come thick people seem to
have no trouble installing insert unit and you are making such a
fuss?". I have no answer.
b) possibly very useful, thank you. Mine is a 2000T, and that seems to
apply to a FoxT2, whatever that is.

I still wonder at the thought processes of a manufacturer who designs
something with the red light for "off" and the same red light for
"recording".

Don't worry my Toshiba is equally stupid. Bright red circle when in
standby, very small dull red light for recording virtually invisible.
Blue circle when on and blue lettering for display information again
virtually invisible.

On Dave's original problem, I would have pointed him to msconfig and
the start options as others have done, and suggested he then waits a
month or two, then looks at updating to Windows 10.

--
bert

In article , Richard
writes
"bert" wrote in message ...

In article , Davey
writes
On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:05:45 +0100
John Rumm wrote:

I can only refer you to the suggestion offered by The Natural
Philosopher:
"Insert DVD, follow instructions."

"Simples", as they say.

Sounds like a simply way to lose all your documents, photos, and
other information. Then find you are no longer connected to your
email, newsgroups and don't recognise half your software.

We are talking about installing a different operating system, so I fail
to understand what you mean by that. Any sensible operator has any
important files backed up already, and why would installing Linux fail
to connect you to the internet?
Of course half the software would not be recognised, but any new
software required is free, in both senses. Firefox and Thunderbird, the
Mozilla programmes, are the same on either platform and will transfer
directly, importing your old profiles, and LibreOffice understands Word
and Excel and other Windows files. I see no problem.

I'd like to try Linux on my old laptop which currently holds a screwed
up version of XP. How do I find and implement a source copy.


http://www.linuxmint.com
And which of the myriad versions do I require for a 32 bit with a
pentium 4 processor?
--
bert

In article , fred
writes
On Friday, July 31, 2015 at 10:10:27 AM UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/07/15 05:34, JHY wrote:


"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
On 30/07/15 19:28, dennis@home wrote:
Most people use windows because they can use windows.
No, the use it because it was on the computer they were sold

They can't use linux on a desktop as the support isn't there for them to
use it.

there is more support than there is for windows. unless you are a
corporate customer there is NO support for windows

That's not correct, the obvious support is from those you know.

Most people don't have a clue about computers

The first true statement in your post


and that doesn't mix with linux.

These days, it does.

Nope, even with the distros that try to look like Win.

If the linux crowd ever actually wake up to that fact they might try and
make a version of linux that most people can use but don't hold your
breath.

Its called Linux Mint.

Not for naïve users who have only ever used Win.

Actually the naive user who has only ever used - or been abused by -
win, finds it no less difficult to use than windows. He appreciates it
runs faster and better than windows however.

Which reminds me, I must pop round and see how he is getting on.


--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

Sweet J****s. Microsoft bashing. So predictable, so boring. This all
reminds me about the time Michael Dell was asked by an Apple fanboy if
the perceived problems with Vista had made Apple more of a threat. His
reply was along the lines of 'Apple have less than 2% of the PC market
so aren't even on the horizon'

Collapse of smug Apple fanboy.

I feel the same way about Linux. In global terms its such a minority
interest. If it was so wonderful it would be cock of the walk by this
time so why would a neophyte wish to get involved with an operating
system with such a small user base.
It's all down to applications. Most of the world uses MS Office and has
a lot of investment in documents. They didn't got o Office because it
was the best product but because everyone else did.
They used to say no-one got fired for buying IBM. We have been through
an era where you could equally say no-one got fired for buying MS.
The risk of incompatibility is major deterrent to change.

Even if the Linux advocates were right, the only thing you get from
****ing in the wind is a wet leg.
--
bert

In article , The Natural Philosopher
writes
On 31/07/15 10:24, fred wrote:

I feel the same way about Linux. In global terms its such a minority
interest. If it was so wonderful it would be cock of the walk by this
time so why would a neophyte wish to get involved with an operating
system with such a small user base.

Dunno. Not much of a user base for a Lamborghini either, but I'd take
one for free...

Wasn't much of a user base for DOS either till IBM built their PC.

Incidentally the whole desktop PC thing is in a state of collapse.

Of course since most mobiles, routers and servers are based on Linux,
you could argue that its got a higher user base than windows.

The big plus about UNIX (where every command looks like a mis-type) is
that the operating system is essentially invisible to the end user. Well
it was designed by a telephone company.
--
bert

In article , The Natural Philosopher
writes
On 31/07/15 11:18, John Rumm wrote:
(iii) In the server space, Unix won overwhelmingly.

True, but not really relevant to the consumer.

very relevant. It demonstrates that where stability and speed matter,
you don't pick windows


Don't most bank's cash machines run on XP?
--
bert

On Friday, 31 July 2015 12:17:42 UTC+1, J.B.Treadstone wrote:
On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:28:05 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 31/07/15 10:24, fred wrote:

I feel the same way about Linux. In global terms its such a minority
interest. If it was so wonderful it would be cock of the walk by this
time so why would a neophyte wish to get involved with an operating
system with such a small user base.

Dunno. Not much of a user base for a Lamborghini either, but I'd take one
for free...

Wasn't much of a user base for DOS either till IBM built their PC.

Incidentally the whole desktop PC thing is in a state of collapse.

Of course since most mobiles, routers and servers are based on Linux, you
could argue that its got a higher user base than windows.

Yes. When you take into consideration /all/ aspects of computing, Linux is
by far the most used OS.
It runs 68% of the Internet servers, runs routers, runs onboard automobile
computers, Smart TVs, smart phones, supercomputers (95%), avionics, etc.

I thought it was ARM by a british company that was used most or leader in mobile devices anyway.

In article ,
newshound writes
On 29/07/2015 23:02, David Lang wrote:
Hi

New laptop is already starting to run slowly. Piggin Windows 8.


I used to have Norton 360 which had various function to do disc clean
up, defrag etc.

Not sure if Norton 360 still has those functions? Don't like the price
of it either.

Anyone recommend a download that will clean up & improve speed?


I gave up reading all the posts half way through the "Linus" thread so
someone else may have already said this.

The newsreader I use (Turnpike) has a split thread facility so you can
put OT branches into a separate thread.
Unfortunately thanks to MS failing to support 32 bit explorer after
encouraging developers to use it, it won't run on 64 bit Windows so I
run W732 bit just to keep it.
I would suggest running ccleaner, particularly the "cleaner" and the
"registry cleaner" options, and malwarebytes.

Both free, both reliable IMHO. The usual caveat applies when
downloading to watch that you don't inadvertently click to download
other stuff, and you don't agree to use Ask or to change your default
search engine.

--
bert

In article , The Natural Philosopher
scribeth thus
On 31/07/15 10:24, fred wrote:

I feel the same way about Linux. In global terms its such a minority
interest. If it was so wonderful it would be cock of the walk by this
time so why would a neophyte wish to get involved with an operating
system with such a small user base.

Dunno. Not much of a user base for a Lamborghini either, but I'd take
one for free...

Wasn't much of a user base for DOS either till IBM built their PC.

Incidentally the whole desktop PC thing is in a state of collapse.

Have noticed these days that the desktop has been replaced with a
portable laptop especially with sales staff at quite a few firms we
visit....

Most all running WIN 8 ....

Of course since most mobiles, routers and servers are based on Linux,
you could argue that its got a higher user base than windows.


--
Tony Sayer

In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
On Friday, 31 July 2015 12:17:42 UTC+1, J.B.Treadstone wrote:
On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:28:05 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 31/07/15 10:24, fred wrote:

I feel the same way about Linux. In global terms its such a minority
interest. If it was so wonderful it would be cock of the walk by
this time so why would a neophyte wish to get involved with an
operating system with such a small user base.

Dunno. Not much of a user base for a Lamborghini either, but I'd take
one for free...

Wasn't much of a user base for DOS either till IBM built their PC.

Incidentally the whole desktop PC thing is in a state of collapse.

Of course since most mobiles, routers and servers are based on Linux,
you could argue that its got a higher user base than windows.

Yes. When you take into consideration /all/ aspects of computing, Linux
is by far the most used OS. It runs 68% of the Internet servers, runs
routers, runs onboard automobile computers, Smart TVs, smart phones,
supercomputers (95%), avionics, etc.

I thought it was ARM by a british company that was used most or leader in
mobile devices anyway.

ARM isn't an operating system. The company make (or at least design)
processors.

--
Please note new email address:

"bert" wrote in message ...

In article , Richard
writes
"bert" wrote in message ...

In article , Davey
writes
On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:05:45 +0100
John Rumm wrote:

I can only refer you to the suggestion offered by The Natural
Philosopher:
"Insert DVD, follow instructions."

"Simples", as they say.

Sounds like a simply way to lose all your documents, photos, and
other information. Then find you are no longer connected to your
email, newsgroups and don't recognise half your software.

We are talking about installing a different operating system, so I fail
to understand what you mean by that. Any sensible operator has any
important files backed up already, and why would installing Linux fail
to connect you to the internet?
Of course half the software would not be recognised, but any new
software required is free, in both senses. Firefox and Thunderbird, the
Mozilla programmes, are the same on either platform and will transfer
directly, importing your old profiles, and LibreOffice understands Word
and Excel and other Windows files. I see no problem.

I'd like to try Linux on my old laptop which currently holds a screwed up
version of XP. How do I find and implement a source copy.


http://www.linuxmint.com
And which of the myriad versions do I require for a 32 bit with a pentium 4
processor?

F*cked if I know. I was led to believe that linux was a piece of ****.
Seems like it's a tad more complicated, but someone will be along shortly to
inform you that it is you who is the problem.

On 31/07/15 12:42, bert wrote:
In article , David Lang
writes
Hi

New laptop is already starting to run slowly. Piggin Windows 8.


I used to have Norton 360 which had various function to do disc clean
up, defrag etc.

Not sure if Norton 360 still has those functions? Don't like the price
of it either.

Anyone recommend a download that will clean up & improve speed?


One of the things that slows it down is all the crap software that
insists on setting up scheduled tasks to check for updates at system
start up or user log on and then every hour afterwards.
Defrag software is contained within Windows.

which is only needed because of fundamental design flaws in windows. as
is the 'reboot on upgrade of anything'


--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On 31/07/15 11:30, Tim Streater wrote:
In article , Davey
wrote:

I mentioned earlier about the Linux fanatics, and yes they are out
there, and I'm not one of them. I have said that I keep Windows as
there is one programme that I need it for. But I also love the ease and
simplicity of updates with Linux, none of the huge time-consuming
sessions while Redmond downloads another load of Patches and fixes.
Linux updates take a few minutes, and installing from scratchmaybe half
an hour. The last time I installed Windows anywhere, it took about e
hours, after several update/reboot/update/reboot etc sessions.

Every time I fire up my Mint VM (about once a month) it spends 20-30
minutes downloading stuff.

indeed. but it doesn't reboot your computer while it does it.


--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On 31/07/15 11:38, Bod wrote:
On 31/07/2015 11:30, Tim Streater wrote:
In article , Davey
wrote:

I mentioned earlier about the Linux fanatics, and yes they are out
there, and I'm not one of them. I have said that I keep Windows as
there is one programme that I need it for. But I also love the ease and
simplicity of updates with Linux, none of the huge time-consuming
sessions while Redmond downloads another load of Patches and fixes.
Linux updates take a few minutes, and installing from scratchmaybe half
an hour. The last time I installed Windows anywhere, it took about e
hours, after several update/reboot/update/reboot etc sessions.

Every time I fire up my Mint VM (about once a month) it spends 20-30
minutes downloading stuff.

You must have a very low download speed then....yes?

or a huge installed base of software.



--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On 31/07/15 11:50, John Rumm wrote:
On 7/31/2015 10:24 AM, fred wrote:

Sweet J****s. Microsoft bashing. So predictable, so boring. This all

Indeed... its almost laughable how many times this thread repeats
itself, with the fanboys failing to understand that *they* are
frequently one of the reasons their pet technology it not currently
ruling the roost. All that technical nouse, and yet they can't answer a
simple question, but instead decide that berating the asker for not
doing it their favoured way.



has anyone actually asked a technical question?

Those that highlighted that MS are a great marketing organisation
actually hit the nail on the head. They make sure that they sell a
consistent product and message, and that all the manufacturers pre-load it.


No, the message is consistent, the product is simply not.

Designed to sell, but not to work.


If it is not pre-loaded on your new hardware then its not relevant -
game over.

Google have demonstrated how you get a non MS OS in to the hands of jo
public with Android, an Apple with IOS.





--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On 31/07/15 12:43, Richard wrote:
"Davey" wrote in message ...

On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:05:45 +0100
John Rumm wrote:

I can only refer you to the suggestion offered by The Natural
Philosopher:
"Insert DVD, follow instructions."

"Simples", as they say.
Sounds like a simply way to lose all your documents, photos, and
other information. Then find you are no longer connected to your
email, newsgroups and don't recognise half your software.

We are talking about installing a different operating system, so I fail
to understand what you mean by that. Any sensible operator has any
important files backed up already, and why would installing Linux fail
to connect you to the internet?
Of course half the software would not be recognised, but any new
software required is free, in both senses. Firefox and Thunderbird, the
Mozilla programmes, are the same on either platform and will transfer
directly, importing your old profiles, and LibreOffice understands Word
and Excel and other Windows files. I see no problem.

Really? Is LibreOffice able to handle Excel VBA files without any issues?

depends on what's in em ;-)


--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On 31/07/2015 02:54, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
8

Most people can't use linux mint, they need help but there isn't any.

what a stupendously ridiculous thing to say.

If there were decent help for windows, the OP wouldn't have posted here.

Hpw many people here asking how to fix linux then?



More than post about fixing windows.
How many windows people even know about usenet?
Where are they going to get linux help when they don't know about usenet
and they can't ask in the local shop or a friend?

You live in the clouds like most linux zealots, you use linux and know
where to get help so you expect everyone else to know how.
Its thinking like that that stops linux beig more wide spread especially
when the ones that do ask questions get told they are too stupid to run
linux which happens far too often.

On 31/07/15 12:52, bert wrote:
In article , Davey
writes
On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:05:45 +0100
John Rumm wrote:

I can only refer you to the suggestion offered by The Natural
Philosopher:
"Insert DVD, follow instructions."

"Simples", as they say.

Sounds like a simply way to lose all your documents, photos, and
other information. Then find you are no longer connected to your
email, newsgroups and don't recognise half your software.

We are talking about installing a different operating system, so I fail
to understand what you mean by that. Any sensible operator has any
important files backed up already, and why would installing Linux fail
to connect you to the internet?
Of course half the software would not be recognised, but any new
software required is free, in both senses. Firefox and Thunderbird, the
Mozilla programmes, are the same on either platform and will transfer
directly, importing your old profiles, and LibreOffice understands Word
and Excel and other Windows files. I see no problem.

I'd like to try Linux on my old laptop which currently holds a screwed
up version of XP. How do I find and implement a source copy.

http://www.linuxmint.com/download.php

download .iso, burn DVD, insert in usual orifice, and boot

--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On 31/07/15 13:01, Tim Streater wrote:
In article , John
Rumm wrote:

On 31/7/2015 10:24, fred wrote:

Sweet J****s. Microsoft bashing. So predictable, so boring. This all

Indeed... its almost laughable how many times this thread repeats
itself, with the fanboys failing to understand that *they* are
frequently one of the reasons their pet technology it not currently
ruling the roost. All that technical nouse, and yet they can't answer
a simple question, but instead decide that berating the asker for not
doing it their favoured way.

Course I can't answer a "simple" Q about Windows. I have no intention
of *ever* being able to do so, either. At least, not someone else's
question, at ant rate. I had to delve into some of it to port my
software to Win7 and was less than impressed.

Those that highlighted that MS are a great marketing organisation
actually hit the nail on the head. They make sure that they sell a
consistent product and message, and that all the manufacturers
pre-load it.

If it is not pre-loaded on your new hardware then its not relevant -
game over.

It's certainly never been preloaded on any machine I've ever bought.

Its not been necessarily pre-loaded on any machine I have nought in te
past 20 years

Except the S/H stuff.


Google have demonstrated how you get a non MS OS in to the hands of jo
public with Android, an Apple with IOS.

And, in Apple's case, with OS X. They sell about 15 million Macs a
year, which is not peanuts.



--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On 31/07/15 13:09, bert wrote:
In article , Richard
writes
"bert" wrote in message ...

In article , Davey
writes
On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:05:45 +0100
John Rumm wrote:

I can only refer you to the suggestion offered by The Natural
Philosopher:
"Insert DVD, follow instructions."

"Simples", as they say.

Sounds like a simply way to lose all your documents, photos, and
other information. Then find you are no longer connected to your
email, newsgroups and don't recognise half your software.

We are talking about installing a different operating system, so I fail
to understand what you mean by that. Any sensible operator has any
important files backed up already, and why would installing Linux fail
to connect you to the internet?
Of course half the software would not be recognised, but any new
software required is free, in both senses. Firefox and Thunderbird, the
Mozilla programmes, are the same on either platform and will transfer
directly, importing your old profiles, and LibreOffice understands Word
and Excel and other Windows files. I see no problem.

I'd like to try Linux on my old laptop which currently holds a
screwed up version of XP. How do I find and implement a source copy.


http://www.linuxmint.com
And which of the myriad versions do I require for a 32 bit with a
pentium 4 processor?

mint mate 32 bit is the moist stable and easiest to use.

http://www.linuxmint.com/edition.php?id=191


--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On 31/07/15 13:14, bert wrote:
In article , fred
writes
On Friday, July 31, 2015 at 10:10:27 AM UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
On 31/07/15 05:34, JHY wrote:


"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
On 30/07/15 19:28, dennis@home wrote:
Most people use windows because they can use windows.
No, the use it because it was on the computer they were sold

They can't use linux on a desktop as the support isn't there for
them to
use it.

there is more support than there is for windows. unless you are a
corporate customer there is NO support for windows

That's not correct, the obvious support is from those you know.

Most people don't have a clue about computers

The first true statement in your post


and that doesn't mix with linux.

These days, it does.

Nope, even with the distros that try to look like Win.

If the linux crowd ever actually wake up to that fact they might
try and
make a version of linux that most people can use but don't hold your
breath.

Its called Linux Mint.

Not for naïve users who have only ever used Win.

Actually the naive user who has only ever used - or been abused by -
win, finds it no less difficult to use than windows. He appreciates it
runs faster and better than windows however.

Which reminds me, I must pop round and see how he is getting on.


--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

Sweet J****s. Microsoft bashing. So predictable, so boring. This all
reminds me about the time Michael Dell was asked by an Apple fanboy if
the perceived problems with Vista had made Apple more of a threat. His
reply was along the lines of 'Apple have less than 2% of the PC market
so aren't even on the horizon'

Collapse of smug Apple fanboy.

I feel the same way about Linux. In global terms its such a minority
interest. If it was so wonderful it would be cock of the walk by this
time so why would a neophyte wish to get involved with an operating
system with such a small user base.
It's all down to applications. Most of the world uses MS Office and has
a lot of investment in documents. They didn't got o Office because it
was the best product but because everyone else did.
They used to say no-one got fired for buying IBM. We have been through
an era where you could equally say no-one got fired for buying MS.
The risk of incompatibility is major deterrent to change.

Even if the Linux advocates were right, the only thing you get from
****ing in the wind is a wet leg.

I've been able tpo read MSword docs ion libre office that MS office
couldn't read ;-)



--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On 31/07/2015 11:28, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/07/15 10:24, fred wrote:

I feel the same way about Linux. In global terms its such a minority
interest. If it was so wonderful it would be cock of the walk by this
time so why would a neophyte wish to get involved with an operating
system with such a small user base.

Dunno. Not much of a user base for a Lamborghini either, but I'd take
one for free...

I'd sell it and buy something else.

Wasn't much of a user base for DOS either till IBM built their PC.

Incidentally the whole desktop PC thing is in a state of collapse.

Of course since most mobiles, routers and servers are based on Linux,
you could argue that its got a higher user base than windows.


So which apps do you run on your router/nas/mobile that don't run on
windows anyway?

On 31/07/15 13:18, bert wrote:
In article , The Natural Philosopher
writes
On 31/07/15 11:18, John Rumm wrote:
(iii) In the server space, Unix won overwhelmingly.

True, but not really relevant to the consumer.

very relevant. It demonstrates that where stability and speed matter,
you don't pick windows


Don't most bank's cash machines run on XP?

Well exactly.

Stasbility and speed wasn't seen as a primary requirement


--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On 31/07/15 13:32, charles wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
On Friday, 31 July 2015 12:17:42 UTC+1, J.B.Treadstone wrote:
On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:28:05 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 31/07/15 10:24, fred wrote:

I feel the same way about Linux. In global terms its such a minority
interest. If it was so wonderful it would be cock of the walk by
this time so why would a neophyte wish to get involved with an
operating system with such a small user base.

Dunno. Not much of a user base for a Lamborghini either, but I'd take
one for free...

Wasn't much of a user base for DOS either till IBM built their PC.

Incidentally the whole desktop PC thing is in a state of collapse.

Of course since most mobiles, routers and servers are based on Linux,
you could argue that its got a higher user base than windows.

Yes. When you take into consideration /all/ aspects of computing, Linux
is by far the most used OS. It runs 68% of the Internet servers, runs
routers, runs onboard automobile computers, Smart TVs, smart phones,
supercomputers (95%), avionics, etc.

I thought it was ARM by a british company that was used most or leader in
mobile devices anyway.

ARM isn't an operating system. The company make (or at least design)
processors.

and almost everything that runs on an ARM runs a linux or derivcative
thereof



--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...

On 31/07/15 11:50, John Rumm wrote:
On 7/31/2015 10:24 AM, fred wrote:

Sweet J****s. Microsoft bashing. So predictable, so boring. This all

Indeed... its almost laughable how many times this thread repeats
itself, with the fanboys failing to understand that *they* are
frequently one of the reasons their pet technology it not currently
ruling the roost. All that technical nouse, and yet they can't answer a
simple question, but instead decide that berating the asker for not
doing it their favoured way.



has anyone actually asked a technical question?

Those that highlighted that MS are a great marketing organisation
actually hit the nail on the head. They make sure that they sell a
consistent product and message, and that all the manufacturers pre-load
it.


No, the message is consistent, the product is simply not.

Designed to sell, but not to work.

Do grow up.
It does work. Has done for some time and will continue to do so. So will
linux and other varieties of operating systems.
I guess the plus side is that you're not an Islamic fundamentalist - yet.



If it is not pre-loaded on your new hardware then its not relevant -
game over.

Google have demonstrated how you get a non MS OS in to the hands of jo
public with Android, an Apple with IOS.






--
Windows Live Mail?
Use this to make it behave itself:
WLMail QuoteFix - http://www.dusko-lolic.from.hr/

On 31/07/15 13:34, Richard wrote:
"bert" wrote in message ...

In article , Richard
writes
"bert" wrote in message ...

In article , Davey
writes
On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:05:45 +0100
John Rumm wrote:

I can only refer you to the suggestion offered by The Natural
Philosopher:
"Insert DVD, follow instructions."

"Simples", as they say.

Sounds like a simply way to lose all your documents, photos, and
other information. Then find you are no longer connected to your
email, newsgroups and don't recognise half your software.

We are talking about installing a different operating system, so I
fail
to understand what you mean by that. Any sensible operator has any
important files backed up already, and why would installing Linux fail
to connect you to the internet?
Of course half the software would not be recognised, but any new
software required is free, in both senses. Firefox and Thunderbird,
the
Mozilla programmes, are the same on either platform and will transfer
directly, importing your old profiles, and LibreOffice understands
Word
and Excel and other Windows files. I see no problem.

I'd like to try Linux on my old laptop which currently holds a
screwed up version of XP. How do I find and implement a source copy.


http://www.linuxmint.com
And which of the myriad versions do I require for a 32 bit with a
pentium 4 processor?

F*cked if I know. I was led to believe that linux was a piece of ****.
Seems like it's a tad more complicated, but someone will be along
shortly to inform you that it is you who is the problem.

in fact two resposne have been givcen neither of which are of that flavour.

32 bit means you need a 32 bit release, and that leaves just the choice
of desktop manager. I recommend MATE as being a reasonably good
approximation to XP .

Ergo the 32 bit MATE version is the one to go for.

How many versions of Windows are there now?

Vista/7/8/9/10 serve home home pro?
32 and 64 bit..




--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On 31/07/15 13:46, dennis@home wrote:
On 31/07/2015 02:54, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
8

Most people can't use linux mint, they need help but there isn't any.

what a stupendously ridiculous thing to say.

If there were decent help for windows, the OP wouldn't have posted here.

Hpw many people here asking how to fix linux then?



More than post about fixing windows.
How many windows people even know about usenet?
Where are they going to get linux help when they don't know about usenet
and they can't ask in the local shop or a friend?


all over the interweb you dick. Flippin eck the help forums come as the
default browser home page...


You live in the clouds like most linux zealots, you use linux and know
where to get help so you expect everyone else to know how.

I domt. just know its a darned sight easier than getting windows or OS/X
help

Its thinking like that that stops linux beig more wide spread especially
when the ones that do ask questions get told they are too stupid to run
linux which happens far too often.

Total myth.



--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On 31/07/15 13:49, dennis@home wrote:
On 31/07/2015 11:28, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/07/15 10:24, fred wrote:

I feel the same way about Linux. In global terms its such a minority
interest. If it was so wonderful it would be cock of the walk by this
time so why would a neophyte wish to get involved with an operating
system with such a small user base.

Dunno. Not much of a user base for a Lamborghini either, but I'd take
one for free...

I'd sell it and buy something else.

Wasn't much of a user base for DOS either till IBM built their PC.

Incidentally the whole desktop PC thing is in a state of collapse.

Of course since most mobiles, routers and servers are based on Linux,
you could argue that its got a higher user base than windows.


So which apps do you run on your router/nas/mobile that don't run on
windows anyway?


network address translation Ethernet over ATM, ATM over ADSL, routing of
thee RIP OSPF or BGP flavours, hardware firewall..need I go on?

But even if that weren't true, since when is the fact that a horse and
cart will get you to London a reason not to drive a car or take the
train or a coach?


--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On 31/07/15 13:56, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/07/15 13:46, dennis@home wrote:
On 31/07/2015 02:54, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
8

Most people can't use linux mint, they need help but there isn't any.

what a stupendously ridiculous thing to say.

If there were decent help for windows, the OP wouldn't have posted here.

Hpw many people here asking how to fix linux then?



More than post about fixing windows.
How many windows people even know about usenet?
Where are they going to get linux help when they don't know about usenet
and they can't ask in the local shop or a friend?


all over the interweb you dick. Flippin eck the help forums come as the
default browser home page...


You live in the clouds like most linux zealots, you use linux and know
where to get help so you expect everyone else to know how.

I domt. just know its a darned sight easier than getting windows or OS/X
help

Its thinking like that that stops linux beig more wide spread especially
when the ones that do ask questions get told they are too stupid to run
linux which happens far too often.

Total myth.




Does windows actually produce anything as helpful as this? Free?

http://www.linuxmint.com/documentati...glish_17.2.pdf


--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 12:43:41 +0100
"Richard" wrote:

"Davey" wrote in message ...

On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:05:45 +0100
John Rumm wrote:

I can only refer you to the suggestion offered by The Natural
Philosopher:
"Insert DVD, follow instructions."

"Simples", as they say.

Sounds like a simply way to lose all your documents, photos, and
other information. Then find you are no longer connected to your
email, newsgroups and don't recognise half your software.

We are talking about installing a different operating system, so I
fail to understand what you mean by that. Any sensible operator has
any important files backed up already, and why would installing
Linux fail to connect you to the internet?
Of course half the software would not be recognised, but any new
software required is free, in both senses. Firefox and Thunderbird,
the Mozilla programmes, are the same on either platform and will
transfer directly, importing your old profiles, and LibreOffice
understands Word and Excel and other Windows files. I see no problem.

Really? Is LibreOffice able to handle Excel VBA files without any
issues?


I haven't used Virtual Basic, but a quick Search finds this:
http://www.debugpoint.com/category/p...g/libreoffice/

Any help?

--
Davey.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...

On 31/07/15 12:43, Richard wrote:
"Davey" wrote in message ...

On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:05:45 +0100
John Rumm wrote:

I can only refer you to the suggestion offered by The Natural
Philosopher:
"Insert DVD, follow instructions."

"Simples", as they say.
Sounds like a simply way to lose all your documents, photos, and
other information. Then find you are no longer connected to your
email, newsgroups and don't recognise half your software.

We are talking about installing a different operating system, so I fail
to understand what you mean by that. Any sensible operator has any
important files backed up already, and why would installing Linux fail
to connect you to the internet?
Of course half the software would not be recognised, but any new
software required is free, in both senses. Firefox and Thunderbird, the
Mozilla programmes, are the same on either platform and will transfer
directly, importing your old profiles, and LibreOffice understands Word
and Excel and other Windows files. I see no problem.

Really? Is LibreOffice able to handle Excel VBA files without any issues?

depends on what's in em ;-)

Well, will LibreOffice handle Excel VBA files and run the code?
Second thoughts, I need a sensible answer...
OK. I've downloaded windows version...
installing...
will try to use my Excel files when install finished...

Oh well, couldn't run my VBA enabled files using LibreOffice...
Uninstalling.

"Davey" wrote in message ...

On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 12:43:41 +0100
"Richard" wrote:

"Davey" wrote in message ...

On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:05:45 +0100
John Rumm wrote:

I can only refer you to the suggestion offered by The Natural
Philosopher:
"Insert DVD, follow instructions."

"Simples", as they say.

Sounds like a simply way to lose all your documents, photos, and
other information. Then find you are no longer connected to your
email, newsgroups and don't recognise half your software.

We are talking about installing a different operating system, so I
fail to understand what you mean by that. Any sensible operator has
any important files backed up already, and why would installing
Linux fail to connect you to the internet?
Of course half the software would not be recognised, but any new
software required is free, in both senses. Firefox and Thunderbird,
the Mozilla programmes, are the same on either platform and will
transfer directly, importing your old profiles, and LibreOffice
understands Word and Excel and other Windows files. I see no problem.

Really? Is LibreOffice able to handle Excel VBA files without any
issues?


I haven't used Virtual Basic, but a quick Search finds this:
http://www.debugpoint.com/category/p...g/libreoffice/

Any help?

Thanks for that. LibreOffice can't handle my Excel files code. No doubt I
could rewrite the stuff to suit the package, but that is not what I call an
improvement over Windows software.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...

On 31/07/15 13:34, Richard wrote:
"bert" wrote in message ...

In article , Richard
writes
"bert" wrote in message ...

In article , Davey
writes
On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:05:45 +0100
John Rumm wrote:

I can only refer you to the suggestion offered by The Natural
Philosopher:
"Insert DVD, follow instructions."

"Simples", as they say.

Sounds like a simply way to lose all your documents, photos, and
other information. Then find you are no longer connected to your
email, newsgroups and don't recognise half your software.

We are talking about installing a different operating system, so I
fail
to understand what you mean by that. Any sensible operator has any
important files backed up already, and why would installing Linux
fail
to connect you to the internet?
Of course half the software would not be recognised, but any new
software required is free, in both senses. Firefox and Thunderbird,
the
Mozilla programmes, are the same on either platform and will transfer
directly, importing your old profiles, and LibreOffice understands
Word
and Excel and other Windows files. I see no problem.

I'd like to try Linux on my old laptop which currently holds a
screwed up version of XP. How do I find and implement a source copy.


http://www.linuxmint.com
And which of the myriad versions do I require for a 32 bit with a
pentium 4 processor?

F*cked if I know. I was led to believe that linux was a piece of ****.
Seems like it's a tad more complicated, but someone will be along
shortly to inform you that it is you who is the problem.

in fact two resposne have been givcen neither of which are of that
flavour.

*AFTER* my post.


32 bit means you need a 32 bit release, and that leaves just the choice of
desktop manager. I recommend MATE as being a reasonably good approximation
to XP .

Ergo the 32 bit MATE version is the one to go for.

How many versions of Windows are there now?

Vista/7/8/9/10 serve home home pro?
32 and 64 bit..

FFS, get a grip. The poster wants to know about Linux, not hear you whine on
about Windows.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...

On 31/07/15 13:56, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 31/07/15 13:46, dennis@home wrote:
On 31/07/2015 02:54, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
8

Most people can't use linux mint, they need help but there isn't any.

what a stupendously ridiculous thing to say.

If there were decent help for windows, the OP wouldn't have posted
here.

Hpw many people here asking how to fix linux then?



More than post about fixing windows.
How many windows people even know about usenet?
Where are they going to get linux help when they don't know about usenet
and they can't ask in the local shop or a friend?


all over the interweb you dick. Flippin eck the help forums come as the
default browser home page...


You live in the clouds like most linux zealots, you use linux and know
where to get help so you expect everyone else to know how.

I domt. just know its a darned sight easier than getting windows or OS/X
help

Its thinking like that that stops linux beig more wide spread especially
when the ones that do ask questions get told they are too stupid to run
linux which happens far too often.

Total myth.




Does windows actually produce anything as helpful as this? Free?

http://www.linuxmint.com/documentati...glish_17.2.pdf

Dunno. Never needed anything like that, bearing in mind that I haven't
bothered to read the entire thing.

On 31/07/15 14:22, Richard wrote:
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...

On 31/07/15 12:43, Richard wrote:
"Davey" wrote in message ...

On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 11:05:45 +0100
John Rumm wrote:

I can only refer you to the suggestion offered by The Natural
Philosopher:
"Insert DVD, follow instructions."

"Simples", as they say.
Sounds like a simply way to lose all your documents, photos, and
other information. Then find you are no longer connected to your
email, newsgroups and don't recognise half your software.

We are talking about installing a different operating system, so I fail
to understand what you mean by that. Any sensible operator has any
important files backed up already, and why would installing Linux fail
to connect you to the internet?
Of course half the software would not be recognised, but any new
software required is free, in both senses. Firefox and Thunderbird, the
Mozilla programmes, are the same on either platform and will transfer
directly, importing your old profiles, and LibreOffice understands Word
and Excel and other Windows files. I see no problem.

Really? Is LibreOffice able to handle Excel VBA files without any
issues?

depends on what's in em ;-)

Well, will LibreOffice handle Excel VBA files and run the code?
Second thoughts, I need a sensible answer...
OK. I've downloaded windows version...
installing...
will try to use my Excel files when install finished...

Oh well, couldn't run my VBA enabled files using LibreOffice...
Uninstalling.

How long did you have to search to find the one command that wasn't
exactly duplicated

I am not even sure you did install libre office.

--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.