Can anyone recommend (through personal use and not hearsay/web hype) a
good rust killer plus primer to use on a small awkwardly located rust
spot on a car please. Awkward in that its on the crease of a panel and
under the rear light cluster which I'll need to take out to properly cure
it.

The top coat will be a silver grey metallic fwiw.

Ta

I would only use a rust killer in desperation. If it has not gone through the metal I would clean back to bare metal with a wire brush, file or wet 'n' dry then use body filler to build up any lost material before painting using a zinc based primer.

Richard

On 10/04/15 13:56, Mark Allread wrote:
Can anyone recommend (through personal use and not hearsay/web hype) a
good rust killer plus primer to use on a small awkwardly located rust
spot on a car please. Awkward in that its on the crease of a panel and
under the rear light cluster which I'll need to take out to properly cure
it.

The top coat will be a silver grey metallic fwiw.

Ta


If you can clean it fairly well (70% bare metal) it's hard IME to beat
red oxide primer. Them work up as you wish with other paints.

Years of my father battling a crappy rustbucket Fiat when I was a kid
taught me none on the magic remedies work, with the possible exception
of phosphoric acid which almost seemed to do some good. Jenolite was
crap. Zinc preparations were useless.

In article ,
Mark Allread wrote:
Can anyone recommend (through personal use and not hearsay/web hype) a
good rust killer plus primer to use on a small awkwardly located rust
spot on a car please. Awkward in that its on the crease of a panel and
under the rear light cluster which I'll need to take out to properly
cure it.

Sand (or grind) it down to bare clean steel then repaint. No such thing as
a rust killer that works for this sort of thing. It would need to get
under the surrounding paint, and none do.

--
*No radio - Already stolen.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 10/04/2015 14:34, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Mark Allread wrote:
Can anyone recommend (through personal use and not hearsay/web hype) a
good rust killer plus primer to use on a small awkwardly located rust
spot on a car please. Awkward in that its on the crease of a panel and
under the rear light cluster which I'll need to take out to properly
cure it.

Sand (or grind) it down to bare clean steel then repaint. No such thing as
a rust killer that works for this sort of thing. It would need to get
under the surrounding paint, and none do.


Capillary action would probably get phosphoric acid into more difficult
spots.

I've successfully used the following on garden furniture and gates
http://tinyurl.com/lxftnmx

--
mailto: news {at} admac {dot] myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On 10/04/15 14:34, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Mark Allread wrote:
Can anyone recommend (through personal use and not hearsay/web hype) a
good rust killer plus primer to use on a small awkwardly located rust
spot on a car please. Awkward in that its on the crease of a panel and
under the rear light cluster which I'll need to take out to properly
cure it.

Sand (or grind) it down to bare clean steel then repaint. No such thing as
a rust killer that works for this sort of thing. It would need to get
under the surrounding paint, and none do.


The correct thing is to remove all loose rust first, then use phosphoric
acid that turns any small bits of rust to iron phosphate which is stable
and takes paint well, then fill and paint.

The acid doesn't stop the rust, but it turns loose pitted rust that can
get water under paint, into good stable phosphate that is more resistant
to water creep


--
Everything you read in newspapers is absolutely true, except for the
rare story of which you happen to have first-hand knowledge. €“ Erwin Knoll

alan_m wrote:
On 10/04/2015 14:34, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Mark Allread wrote:
Can anyone recommend (through personal use and not hearsay/web hype) a
good rust killer plus primer to use on a small awkwardly located rust
spot on a car please. Awkward in that its on the crease of a panel and
under the rear light cluster which I'll need to take out to properly
cure it.

Sand (or grind) it down to bare clean steel then repaint. No such thing as
a rust killer that works for this sort of thing. It would need to get
under the surrounding paint, and none do.


Capillary action would probably get phosphoric acid into more difficult
spots.

I've successfully used the following on garden furniture and gates
http://tinyurl.com/lxftnmx

I use this on our boat in France and have also used it on various bits
of outdoor steel back here in the UK. I seems to work very well.
Much, much better than anything I have ever managed to buy in the UK.

http://www.ebay.fr/itm/Vernis-pour-r...-/150963433901

It's available at the major French 'bricolage' stores as well, I just
used eBay as it was the first hit I found.

--
Chris Green
·

On 10/04/15 14:56, Jethro_uk wrote:
On Fri, 10 Apr 2015 14:26:45 +0100, Tim Watts wrote:

On 10/04/15 13:56, Mark Allread wrote:
Can anyone recommend (through personal use and not hearsay/web hype) a
good rust killer plus primer to use on a small awkwardly located rust
spot on a car please. Awkward in that its on the crease of a panel and
under the rear light cluster which I'll need to take out to properly
cure it.

The top coat will be a silver grey metallic fwiw.

Ta


If you can clean it fairly well (70% bare metal) it's hard IME to beat
red oxide primer. Them work up as you wish with other paints.

Years of my father battling a crappy rustbucket Fiat when I was a kid
taught me none on the magic remedies work, with the possible exception
of phosphoric acid which almost seemed to do some good. Jenolite was
crap. Zinc preparations were useless.

Best thing is engine oil. Bugger to paint over though.


What, pour on and set light to it? Yes, probably the best for a Fiat...

In article ,
alan_m wrote:
Sand (or grind) it down to bare clean steel then repaint. No such thing as
a rust killer that works for this sort of thing. It would need to get
under the surrounding paint, and none do.


Capillary action would probably get phosphoric acid into more difficult
spots.

If you're not interested in a lasting repair it 'probably' would. But then
just slapping some paint on top of the rust will last a while too.

--
*If at first you don't succeed, then skydiving definitely isn't for you *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

If you're not interested in a lasting repair it 'probably' would. But then
just slapping some paint on top of the rust will last a while too.

I 'repaired' the motorhome body by sticking gaffa tape over the rust
then spraying it. It got me through the year.

Bill

In article ,
Bill Wright wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

If you're not interested in a lasting repair it 'probably' would. But
then just slapping some paint on top of the rust will last a while too.

I 'repaired' the motorhome body by sticking gaffa tape over the rust
then spraying it. It got me through the year.

Does tend to put your pictures of aerial bodges into perspective. ;-)

--
*What am I? Flypaper for freaks!?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 10/04/2015 14:26, Tim Watts wrote:
On 10/04/15 13:56, Mark Allread wrote:
Can anyone recommend (through personal use and not hearsay/web hype) a
good rust killer plus primer to use on a small awkwardly located rust
spot on a car please. Awkward in that its on the crease of a panel and
under the rear light cluster which I'll need to take out to properly cure
it.

The top coat will be a silver grey metallic fwiw.

Ta


If you can clean it fairly well (70% bare metal) it's hard IME to beat
red oxide primer. Them work up as you wish with other paints.

Red oxide paint is no longer made with lead oxide. So is red through
pigment and purely for marketing purposes.

Years of my father battling a crappy rustbucket Fiat when I was a kid
taught me none on the magic remedies work, with the possible exception
of phosphoric acid which almost seemed to do some good. Jenolite was
crap. Zinc preparations were useless.

I think Jenolite has moved on since your father's day. It now contains
your phosphoric acid.
http://jenolite.net/what.html

Perhaps a local sacrificial zinc anode might help? :-)

In article ,
Fredxxx wrote:
Years of my father battling a crappy rustbucket Fiat when I was a kid
taught me none on the magic remedies work, with the possible exception
of phosphoric acid which almost seemed to do some good. Jenolite was
crap. Zinc preparations were useless.

I think Jenolite has moved on since your father's day. It now contains
your phosphoric acid.
http://jenolite.net/what.html

I think it always has done.

The snag with any of these preparations is they just treat the surface
rust. Just sand it down after it has dried to see what I mean. You'll get
back to rust. It might well work ok on fresh thin rust - but not on that
which has been there for some time. Hence the instructions telling you to
wire brush it. So with a spot on a car bodywork, you'd do more damage
attacking it with a wire brush than simply sanding down the effected area
to bare bright steel.

--
*When it rains, why don't sheep shrink? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 11/04/2015 15:11, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Fredxxx wrote:
Years of my father battling a crappy rustbucket Fiat when I was a kid
taught me none on the magic remedies work, with the possible exception
of phosphoric acid which almost seemed to do some good. Jenolite was
crap. Zinc preparations were useless.

I think Jenolite has moved on since your father's day. It now contains
your phosphoric acid.
http://jenolite.net/what.html

I think it always has done.

The snag with any of these preparations is they just treat the surface
rust. Just sand it down after it has dried to see what I mean. You'll get
back to rust. It might well work ok on fresh thin rust - but not on that
which has been there for some time. Hence the instructions telling you to
wire brush it. So with a spot on a car bodywork, you'd do more damage
attacking it with a wire brush than simply sanding down the effected area
to bare bright steel.

That argument would be true for any steel surface. The advantage of
using phosphoric acid is that it reacts with iron oxide to form a stable
and paintable surface. Removing more steel by sanding/grinding seems an
unnecessary way of reducing what good metal you ought to retain.

In article ,
Fredxxx wrote:
The snag with any of these preparations is they just treat the surface
rust. Just sand it down after it has dried to see what I mean. You'll
get back to rust. It might well work ok on fresh thin rust - but not
on that which has been there for some time. Hence the instructions
telling you to wire brush it. So with a spot on a car bodywork, you'd
do more damage attacking it with a wire brush than simply sanding down
the effected area to bare bright steel.

That argument would be true for any steel surface. The advantage of
using phosphoric acid is that it reacts with iron oxide to form a stable
and paintable surface. Removing more steel by sanding/grinding seems an
unnecessary way of reducing what good metal you ought to retain.

Thing about rust is it carries on growing. Especially under car paint once
it has started. And no surface treatment will removed it properly from a
stone chip.

--
*Don't worry about avoiding temptation. As you grow older, it will avoid you.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:
In article ,
Fredxxx wrote:
The snag with any of these preparations is they just treat the surface
rust. Just sand it down after it has dried to see what I mean. You'll
get back to rust. It might well work ok on fresh thin rust - but not
on that which has been there for some time. Hence the instructions
telling you to wire brush it. So with a spot on a car bodywork, you'd
do more damage attacking it with a wire brush than simply sanding down
the effected area to bare bright steel.

That argument would be true for any steel surface. The advantage of
using phosphoric acid is that it reacts with iron oxide to form a stable
and paintable surface. Removing more steel by sanding/grinding seems an
unnecessary way of reducing what good metal you ought to retain.

Thing about rust is it carries on growing. Especially under car paint once
it has started. And no surface treatment will removed it properly from a
stone chip.

It doesn't necessarily "keep on growing". I have some bits of steel
in my garden (South Suffolk) which I have painted with the "Vernis
pour Rouille" that I mentioned earlier in this thread and the rust
colour under the varnish just remains ast it was when I originally
painted them. Vernis pour Rouille is actually advertised as a way of
preserving the rust coloured look of bare iron and steel.

Admittedly when there's adjacent paint you always have the difficulty
of getting whatever you're using to coat the unprotected metal under
the edges of the broken paint coating. Vernis pour Rouille is very
runny so does quite well at this.

--
Chris Green
·

In article ,
wrote:
Thing about rust is it carries on growing. Especially under car paint
once it has started. And no surface treatment will removed it properly
from a stone chip.

It doesn't necessarily "keep on growing". I have some bits of steel
in my garden (South Suffolk) which I have painted with the "Vernis
pour Rouille" that I mentioned earlier in this thread and the rust
colour under the varnish just remains ast it was when I originally
painted them. Vernis pour Rouille is actually advertised as a way of
preserving the rust coloured look of bare iron and steel.

We're talking car bodywork here. The steel and paint used is rather
different to the sort of steel you'll find in a garden.

--
*Corduroy pillows are making headlines.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:
In article ,
wrote:
Thing about rust is it carries on growing. Especially under car paint
once it has started. And no surface treatment will removed it properly
from a stone chip.

It doesn't necessarily "keep on growing". I have some bits of steel
in my garden (South Suffolk) which I have painted with the "Vernis
pour Rouille" that I mentioned earlier in this thread and the rust
colour under the varnish just remains ast it was when I originally
painted them. Vernis pour Rouille is actually advertised as a way of
preserving the rust coloured look of bare iron and steel.

We're talking car bodywork here. The steel and paint used is rather
different to the sort of steel you'll find in a garden.

I have actually used Vernis pour Rouille on a little patch of rust on
our Citroën C5, it seems to be working there as well. I also use it
on our steel boat in France (that's where I first discovered and used
it).

--
Chris Green
·

Tim Watts Wrote in message:
On 10/04/15 13:56, Mark Allread wrote:
Can anyone recommend (through personal use and not hearsay/web hype) a
good rust killer plus primer to use on a small awkwardly located rust
spot on a car please. Awkward in that its on the crease of a panel and
under the rear light cluster which I'll need to take out to properly cure
it.

The top coat will be a silver grey metallic fwiw.

Ta


If you can clean it fairly well (70% bare metal) it's hard IME to beat
red oxide primer. Them work up as you wish with other paints.

Years of my father battling a crappy rustbucket Fiat when I was a kid
taught me none on the magic remedies work, with the possible exception
of phosphoric acid which almost seemed to do some good. Jenolite was
crap. Zinc preparations were useless.

That's strange because Jenolite is basically phosphoric acid. I
have found the red Jenolite liquid (not gel) to be very effective
but only after removing loose rust I.e. to prepare a surface with
traces of rust.

--

Biggles